I've found both of them intolerable on the scientific skepticism page. They insist on bias, POV inclusions to Scientific_skepticism and refuse to compromise. They will not let me take out any of their inaccurate, untrue, and irrelevent additions and biased, POV links. They refuse to discuss it on talk (or at least pay attention) and JDR himself seems to want to refuse mediation. I compromised by leaving the section in and taking out the untrue and irrelevent parts, but they insisted on their bias. - Lord Kenneth 02:43, Jan 28, 2004 (UTC)
On [1], Robert wrote "I am requesting mediation". I would like to second that request. I trust that mediation will cover the range of conflict between myself and Robert. Martin 16:10, 25 Jan 2004 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Requests for mediation/Sam Spade and Bryan Derksen
I don't want to focus on complaining/arguing here. I want an end to the broken record of circular arguments and constant reverts I am recieving from this user, and I would appreciate some assistance. Sam Spade 23:30, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
It has recently been brought to my attention that I've been accepted by both parties. Mediation will proceed shortly. I'll take the weekend to organize the process on my end. Bryan and Sam, you may want to take the time to organize and categorize your talking points and relevant references. I'll contact you both Monday. -- Dante Alighieri | Talk 09:28, 21 Feb 2004 (UTC)
Taku is chasing down my pages and undoing my changes, which are part of a directory project that he has an allergy to for some reason. I've had very positive feedback from Martin and one other. I've told Taku the concept. But he keeps hammering away. I don't know what his problem is. This is kind of urgent. 168...| ...Talk 02:50, 8 Feb 2004 (UTC)
That's lame. Taku gets to revert my edits with abandon, hurl private accusations and publicly denounce me, and the response I get to my request for mediation is this one 5 days later to say I'll receive no assistance. I received unsolicited opinions from a couple people supporting my project, which is part of why I felt entitled to combat Taku's relentless reversions. I believe I fulfilled all the steps that could reasonably be expected under the circumstances, and I feel I have been extremely poorly served by the system. Given my recent railroad trial, I suspect this disservice reflects discrimination against the accused and a presumption of guilt. 168...| ...Talk 23:05, 16 Feb 2004 (UTC)
I wanted mediation IMMEDIATELY while Taku was reverting my work and subverting my efforts to create a prototype directory that would illustrate what I had in mind for my project. I did not get that help,and my attempt to create a prototype to properly advertise the project was successfully prevented thanks to the opinion and industry of one guy. Because I am now pissed off about it, very busy defending my reputation and not devoted enough to the directory idea to campaign for it in the face of inexplicable (to me) opposition, I'm dropping it. 168...| ...Talk 01:20, 19 Feb 2004 (UTC)
I would like someone to read both 172's version and my version of this article, and offer a comment on their respective merits, and on the solution I suggested at the Talk page but which 172 has not responded to. I believe mine is more biographical, more concise, more encyclopaedic and less tendentious than his. I think that the material I (and others) have deleted from the article belongs more properly at History of Belarus. No doubt 172 can tell you what he thinks. Adam 07:52, 1 Feb 2004 (UTC)
If there is a deadlock between Users over an article, I think mediation is required, not just comment. Adam 08:12, 1 Feb 2004 (UTC)
Mav is right Adam. There are other options to seek before coming here.
Besides, it is best that you understand that no mediator will arbitrate between the two of you (ie, decide which version has more merit). The mediator will try to facilitate the discussion between the two of you, and to reach an acceptable compromise for both of you. Anthere 08:33, 1 Feb 2004 (UTC)
Well I will wait till tomorrow and see what happens. It appears that 172 is declining to participate anyway. Adam 08:36, 1 Feb 2004 (UTC)
172 now advises me that he declines to take part in a process of mediation, but insists on his right to revert my edits without discussion. Do I now proceed to Wikipedia:Conflicts between users? Adam 08:42, 1 Feb 2004 (UTC)
I had a quick look, and it seems to me you are in the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia%3AConflict_resolution#Step_2:_Discuss_with_third_parties step. And when you look at it carefully, that is exactly what you tried to do here -> seeking other people advices. So, this is precisely what you should do. See Wikipedia:Requests for comment
Perhaps you could also quickly resume the core of the conflict. I noticed that in the reversion, there was also reversion of the spelling of the man. Aren't there rules about the way non english people name should be spellt ? Anthere
I moved this request to archive. On the 05/02, the article is still protected. Discussions are under way between Adam, 172 and ChrisO. They appear constructive, and rather civil. I may be wrong but I think this case does not need committee mediation to proceed. Positive results are likely to happen with mutual understanding :-) If I am wrong, well, just put everything back :-) User:Anthere
So what happens next ? Will someone else have a go at getting him to agree or do we go straight to arbitration? theresa knott 09:28, 21 Jan 2004 (UTC)
Mr-Natural-Health, Would you consider mediation of these matters? Fred Bauder 06:45, 22 Jan 2004 (UTC)
A wiseman once wrote: "I originally declined because of my perception that it would only be another structured way to waste more of my limited time. On my mailing list and website, I can actually get work done. In this place, everyone is editing the same stuff over and over again in a never ending circle." Perhaps, I should follow his advice? -- Mr-Natural-Health 13:31, 24 Jan 2004 (UTC)
As noted on Wikipedia:Requests for comment/168 (I have to refer to a diff because 168... has been reverting my changes to that and other pages) I feel that 168... has abused his sysop user rights and has been a disruptive force in the community by engaging in revert wars (often using the rollback feature as a tool in those wars and on at least two occassions using page protection as a revert war tool as well). What I want is for 168... to stop abusing his sysop user rights, stop engaging in edit wars and for him to start cooperating with others (as noted on the RfC page he has ignored the consensus on the DNA talk page). 168... indicated on my talk page that he was willing to start mediation. -- mav 06:05, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
Note that the above version actually dates from the 16th of February, when Mav made this change. The change makes my point about "consensus" below seemingly irrelevant, but it was a response to Mav. One of my disagreements with Mav is the bias with which he brings complaints against me and so predisposes the community to a negative evaluation of my behavior. I don't think it's completely conscious, but it's extremely unfair. 168...| ...Talk 22:25, 16 Feb 2004 (UTC)
I would accept mediation from any of these users: Angela, Anthere, Cimon Avaro, Dante Alighieri, llywrch, sannse, or TUF-KAT (in no particular order). I would also add Ed Poor but since 168... has already made an RfC page on him, I doubt that 168... would choose Ed as a mediator. --mav
I'd accept Anthere, who has been friendly to me and knows me from other contexts. 168...| ...Talk 20:00, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
I've found both of them intolerable on the scientific skepticism page. They insist on bias, POV inclusions to Scientific_skepticism and refuse to compromise. They will not let me take out any of their inaccurate, untrue, and irrelevent additions and biased, POV links. They refuse to discuss it on talk (or at least pay attention) and JDR himself seems to want to refuse mediation. I compromised by leaving the section in and taking out the untrue and irrelevent parts, but they insisted on their bias. - Lord Kenneth 02:43, Jan 28, 2004 (UTC)
On [1], Robert wrote "I am requesting mediation". I would like to second that request. I trust that mediation will cover the range of conflict between myself and Robert. Martin 16:10, 25 Jan 2004 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Requests for mediation/Sam Spade and Bryan Derksen
I don't want to focus on complaining/arguing here. I want an end to the broken record of circular arguments and constant reverts I am recieving from this user, and I would appreciate some assistance. Sam Spade 23:30, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
It has recently been brought to my attention that I've been accepted by both parties. Mediation will proceed shortly. I'll take the weekend to organize the process on my end. Bryan and Sam, you may want to take the time to organize and categorize your talking points and relevant references. I'll contact you both Monday. -- Dante Alighieri | Talk 09:28, 21 Feb 2004 (UTC)
Taku is chasing down my pages and undoing my changes, which are part of a directory project that he has an allergy to for some reason. I've had very positive feedback from Martin and one other. I've told Taku the concept. But he keeps hammering away. I don't know what his problem is. This is kind of urgent. 168...| ...Talk 02:50, 8 Feb 2004 (UTC)
That's lame. Taku gets to revert my edits with abandon, hurl private accusations and publicly denounce me, and the response I get to my request for mediation is this one 5 days later to say I'll receive no assistance. I received unsolicited opinions from a couple people supporting my project, which is part of why I felt entitled to combat Taku's relentless reversions. I believe I fulfilled all the steps that could reasonably be expected under the circumstances, and I feel I have been extremely poorly served by the system. Given my recent railroad trial, I suspect this disservice reflects discrimination against the accused and a presumption of guilt. 168...| ...Talk 23:05, 16 Feb 2004 (UTC)
I wanted mediation IMMEDIATELY while Taku was reverting my work and subverting my efforts to create a prototype directory that would illustrate what I had in mind for my project. I did not get that help,and my attempt to create a prototype to properly advertise the project was successfully prevented thanks to the opinion and industry of one guy. Because I am now pissed off about it, very busy defending my reputation and not devoted enough to the directory idea to campaign for it in the face of inexplicable (to me) opposition, I'm dropping it. 168...| ...Talk 01:20, 19 Feb 2004 (UTC)
I would like someone to read both 172's version and my version of this article, and offer a comment on their respective merits, and on the solution I suggested at the Talk page but which 172 has not responded to. I believe mine is more biographical, more concise, more encyclopaedic and less tendentious than his. I think that the material I (and others) have deleted from the article belongs more properly at History of Belarus. No doubt 172 can tell you what he thinks. Adam 07:52, 1 Feb 2004 (UTC)
If there is a deadlock between Users over an article, I think mediation is required, not just comment. Adam 08:12, 1 Feb 2004 (UTC)
Mav is right Adam. There are other options to seek before coming here.
Besides, it is best that you understand that no mediator will arbitrate between the two of you (ie, decide which version has more merit). The mediator will try to facilitate the discussion between the two of you, and to reach an acceptable compromise for both of you. Anthere 08:33, 1 Feb 2004 (UTC)
Well I will wait till tomorrow and see what happens. It appears that 172 is declining to participate anyway. Adam 08:36, 1 Feb 2004 (UTC)
172 now advises me that he declines to take part in a process of mediation, but insists on his right to revert my edits without discussion. Do I now proceed to Wikipedia:Conflicts between users? Adam 08:42, 1 Feb 2004 (UTC)
I had a quick look, and it seems to me you are in the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia%3AConflict_resolution#Step_2:_Discuss_with_third_parties step. And when you look at it carefully, that is exactly what you tried to do here -> seeking other people advices. So, this is precisely what you should do. See Wikipedia:Requests for comment
Perhaps you could also quickly resume the core of the conflict. I noticed that in the reversion, there was also reversion of the spelling of the man. Aren't there rules about the way non english people name should be spellt ? Anthere
I moved this request to archive. On the 05/02, the article is still protected. Discussions are under way between Adam, 172 and ChrisO. They appear constructive, and rather civil. I may be wrong but I think this case does not need committee mediation to proceed. Positive results are likely to happen with mutual understanding :-) If I am wrong, well, just put everything back :-) User:Anthere
So what happens next ? Will someone else have a go at getting him to agree or do we go straight to arbitration? theresa knott 09:28, 21 Jan 2004 (UTC)
Mr-Natural-Health, Would you consider mediation of these matters? Fred Bauder 06:45, 22 Jan 2004 (UTC)
A wiseman once wrote: "I originally declined because of my perception that it would only be another structured way to waste more of my limited time. On my mailing list and website, I can actually get work done. In this place, everyone is editing the same stuff over and over again in a never ending circle." Perhaps, I should follow his advice? -- Mr-Natural-Health 13:31, 24 Jan 2004 (UTC)
As noted on Wikipedia:Requests for comment/168 (I have to refer to a diff because 168... has been reverting my changes to that and other pages) I feel that 168... has abused his sysop user rights and has been a disruptive force in the community by engaging in revert wars (often using the rollback feature as a tool in those wars and on at least two occassions using page protection as a revert war tool as well). What I want is for 168... to stop abusing his sysop user rights, stop engaging in edit wars and for him to start cooperating with others (as noted on the RfC page he has ignored the consensus on the DNA talk page). 168... indicated on my talk page that he was willing to start mediation. -- mav 06:05, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
Note that the above version actually dates from the 16th of February, when Mav made this change. The change makes my point about "consensus" below seemingly irrelevant, but it was a response to Mav. One of my disagreements with Mav is the bias with which he brings complaints against me and so predisposes the community to a negative evaluation of my behavior. I don't think it's completely conscious, but it's extremely unfair. 168...| ...Talk 22:25, 16 Feb 2004 (UTC)
I would accept mediation from any of these users: Angela, Anthere, Cimon Avaro, Dante Alighieri, llywrch, sannse, or TUF-KAT (in no particular order). I would also add Ed Poor but since 168... has already made an RfC page on him, I doubt that 168... would choose Ed as a mediator. --mav
I'd accept Anthere, who has been friendly to me and knows me from other contexts. 168...| ...Talk 20:00, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)