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Fellow inclusionists,
The situation has grown more dire since the last time I addressed you. The encroaching hordes of deletionists at Votes for deletion are growing more, not less, rabid by the day and the time has come to put a stop to it. We must do battle on this territory which heretofore has been assumed to be irrevocably held in the clutches of the enemy. Some cases in point:
Familiarize yourselves with the doctrine of inclusionism. Memorize the principles! Propagate them worldwide. Do not let your loved ones be lost to the deception of the enemy, who would taint our children with their fiendish ideology. Our foes will soon know that a spectre is haunting Wikipedia – the spectre of INCLUSIONISM!
Friends, now is the time to come forth to do battle against the enemy. We must marshal our forces at once. Now is no time to be cowardly in the face of those whose vicious ideology would lead them to pare down our encyclopedia to whatever is banal, mainstream, and popularly reported in the media. In an Orwellian turn, they would transform the word "notable" to mean whatever subjects they, in their piddly, limited experience, happen to have heard of. We must not stand for this any longer. As they say in Hotel Rwanda, "We must exterminate these cockroaches! CUT DOWN THE TALL TREES NOW!"
Your leader,
Colonel Gazpacho 14:21, 5 May 2005 (UTC)
Thanks for the heads up, so I could go vote Delete for the future fantasy-ware "Kefka's Revenge", with less than 70 displayed hits and zero Alexa rank. Niteowlneils 17:47, 5 May 2005 (UTC)
I like Colonel Gazpacho's style. But halt! The enemy is not the so-called deletionists. They are but honest individuals who work for the greater good in their own way.... The real enemy is ignorance. Ignorance should be fought tooth and nail, with chainsaws of wisdom, bazookas of understanding, and Molotov cocktails of knowledge.
- Pioneer-12 09:50, 6 May 2005 (UTC)
All I want is a very simple free WYSIWYG text editor that outputs HTML and will let me put things in bullets, underline, headings, strikeout, etc. I can't seem to find one, though. I don't want MS Word with it's incompatibility and filesize bloat. I don't want a plain text editor with no visual formatting, I just...
Hey, wait a second... Is there a way to use wikipedia's wiki markup rendering in a standalone fashion? With the preview button, it's almost WYSIWYG. (Or does anyone know of any software that fulfills my needs?) - Omegatron 04:13, May 5, 2005 (UTC)
I stumbled across an interesting product, ABBYY FineReader OCR XIX, an OCR tool by one of the leading OCR companies made specifically for recognizing older texts that are out of copyright. This seems like it could be a valuable tool for sucking in content from older works, particularly on areas where we're thin now. They even have a free trial version that will do 100 pages before expiring (and if each Wikipedian did 100 pages, we'd have a hell of a lot of content). The best part is that we don't even have to proofread the results too closely, because we can rely on the wiki effect to clean it up. Only catch is, where does one obtain these older texts? Ideally we can borrow them from libraries. Deco 18:56, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
For instance, many articles in Wikipedia are based on encyclopedias that are now in the public domain, such as [[1911_Encyclop%E6dia_Britannica]]. Therfore OCR would be helpful. -- Munchkinguy 22:34, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
Certainly it could be helpful for certain things, but I don't like the idea of just bulk uploading tons of content from old sources. - Omegatron 18:42, May 15, 2005 (UTC)
I never understood how the search box regards capitalization. But it seems problems like this can easily be created: Cape York meteorite Cape York Meteorite (leaving up temp for illustration)
Lotsofissues 16:35, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
I know, it's really annoying, and then whenever you make a new article, you have to create a lot of redirects. -- Munchkinguy 18:54, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
What's worse is the case sensitive linking. Cape York meteorite, cape york meteorite, and Cape York Meteorite all link to different articles.
That's just dumb. And we have to make numerous redirects to deal with this deficiency. Links should simply not be case sensitive. It the extremely few cases where capitalization is an actual naming distinction then the different articles should be distinguished by additional words in the title--which makes more sense anyway. The software needs to be fixed.
And spare me the "it's so hard" details of "Hacking in a proper case insensitive, case preserving system is possible but will require some database restructuring and various low-level work for relatively minor benefit."
Here's an easy solution: You just parse the links to upper case and parse the titles to upper case. It doesn't matter how they're stored.
You may be able to BS the non-programmers, but you can't BS me. Mr. Brion Vibber, if you want my respect, stop talking about how hard everything is and start thinking about ways to make things work.
And yes I'm familiar with database restructuring. Databases structures are mutable, if you know how to change them. I have a friend who redesigns databases for a living. That's a bit harder then a simple interface hack, but really nothing that isn't done all the time. The hardest part of changing a database is understanding everything and figuring out how to redesign it. Some queries may need to be rewritten, but once you understand RDBMs and know SQL, the process is usually fairly straightforward.
- Pioneer-12 10:48, 6 May 2005 (UTC)
where are the humoristic wikipedicians? why didnt they find camelopedia? blue 15:37, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
Perhaps it's because they're too busy editing the Uncyclipedia. -- Munchkinguy 22:20, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
I know that this isn't the right place to put this comment, but I can't think where else it will get seen. The thing is, the above ship, although alledgedly operational, isn't on the official list of ships So...? Thanks,--> Energy ( talk) 15:31, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
"Evening Herald (Plymouth)
May 2, 2005
Bulwark is welcomed into service
The Royal Navy's newest vessel, HMS Bulwark, has been commissioned at a special ceremony in Devonport. The Plymouth-based amphibious assault ship was officially welcomed into the fleet in front of 1,200 invited guests."
OK, fair enough!--> Energy ( talk) 07:24, 5 May 2005 (UTC)
Hi. As it was expected, the proximity of the world release of the latest Star Wars movie has triggered an editing frenzy in all articles related to the franchise. My point here concerns a specific category of such articles: those dedicated to the characters in the movies. At this point, most if not all articles on characters have been "equipped" with a "Star Wars character" table that contains some information on the character.
I have nothing against having those boards, and I certainly have no problem with it listing fictional data, but the stuff that goes in there should have some point, if it is to be encyclopedic. So it would be logical to list there the allegiance of the character (is he a good or a bad guy?), who plays him, when was the character introduced, his "lifespan" in the timeline and so on (as it is done). But in the name of all that is galactic, what is the point of listing eye color and hair color?? That's not even concerning the character, but rather the actor who plays him, and it's completely besides the point in the article. AFAIK,
George Lucas doesn't even choose the actors based on eye and hair color — gender, age, and maybe even complexion if he wants to make some sort of point, but never eye color or hair color. Having that sort of thing listed in the tables looks somewhat puerile and unencyclopedic to me. Any thoughts? Regards,
Redux
05:55, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
It's not that it's harmful. The content is not offensive or biased per se. But it's completely pointless, and more importantly, unencyclopedic. I cannot defend a serious encyclopedia that lists hair color and eye color for fictitious movie characters, which are in fact, again, more a reflexion of the actors who have played them in the movies than the characters themselves (Lucas could have just as easily chosen a blonde actor instead of a dark-haired one to play any given character, meaning that hair color or eye color are of no consequence for the understanding of the story line or the character). Plus, the template would not be deleted, just those two lines would be eliminated. There are other pieces of information in it that are useful and pertinent, and if one applies one's mind, it should indeed be possible to come up with new information, this time actually relevant, that could fill the "space" that would be left by the departure of that nonsense. Regards, Redux 19:04, 6 May 2005 (UTC)
Wherever there is profit, Microsoft is there. They may be slow on the draw, but they carry a cannon. Bill Gates, the Lord of Microsoft, is known for his obsessive desire to dominate everything computer related and to reap as much money as possible... by any means possible. It is a game to him. In field after field, Microsoft has sought to get a foothold and a competitive edge. If they can't develop a top notch product from scratch, then they buy one or steal one.
Enter Wikipedia. Once a mere blip on the radar screen, but its profile is growing. How long until Bill "Dollar" Gates looks up some bit of information online and winds up at a Wikipedia page? How long till he says, "This is cool; this is profitable; I want to rule this."
Is there profit in a wiki? Other sites have already copied the GFDL content and used it for ad revenue. It's only a matter of time before M$crosoft realizes that it can do the same. What's worse, is that Microsoft could start a content fork... a content fork that could easily rival or surpass Wikipedia in popularity.
Look at all the stupid problems we have to deal with: unrestrained vandalism; idiotic votes for deletion; buggy, hard to use software. You think these problems are unsolvable? Microsoft doesn't think so.
If Wikipedia is unable to get it's act together--if Wikipedia is unable to get it's childlike tendencies under control... then Microsoft just might rise and show the world a better way to do an wiki encyclopedia. Microsoft just might take Wikipedia to school, and to the cleaners.
Microsoft already has a foothold in the encyclopedia business--remember, they bought Encarta. They can't buy Wikipedia, but they can steal it.
Bill Gates is coming to eat you.
- Pioneer-12 15:25, 3 May 2005 (UTC)
Your comment betrays a stunning lack of understanding of how things works. First, and most important, interia is VERY HARD to overcome. For example, google got where it was not because it was slightly better than yahoo or msn or dogpile, but because it was IMMESNLY better than the competition. To beat Google (or wikipedia), a competitor not only has to be better than us, but has to be an order of magnitude better than us. A simple fork is not going to cut it. Secondly, Raul's first law of wikipedia is that the most important part of wikipedia is the community. Wikipedia has an established community of hardcore, dedicated contributors. Microsoft might have a lot of money, but you can't buy contributors, fans or mindshare - you have to earn it. Microsoft has tried to fake it with astroturfing, and every time they have, they have been caught and look like idiots. Third, would someone spend hours on end fixing things at Encarta, like they do on wikipedia? At least on wikipedia, you know what you're doing is fundementally benefitting the public. The information you submit is safeguarded by a nonprofit company, and reusable by anyone -- altruism at its finest. Why would you edit Encarta? To boost microsoft's bottom line? Well, maybe small edits here and there, but there's no motivation to keep you hooked. No one is going to spend significant amounts of time lining Bill's pockets. →Raul654 16:19, May 3, 2005 (UTC)
Don't feed the trolls. Rick K 21:46, May 3, 2005 (UTC)
In any case, if Microsoft was successful, then they deserve to succeed. If such a thing was effective, then it disproves the wikipedia assumption - that making information free is a good thing. I, for one, would welcome our new overlords. -- Fangz 22:37, 3 May 2005 (UTC)
Ssh! We shouldn't be letting them know we're suspicious. Nickptar 22:58, 3 May 2005 (UTC)
I wish I had a dollar for every time some anti-MS activist on the Internet speculated about something Microsoft "might" do. Don't you people have something better to do with your time? Rhobite 23:05, May 3, 2005 (UTC)
This is not a joke or a troll (though it might seem that way at first); it is not alarmism.
Microsoft,
Yahoo, and
Google all have muscle and track records. The experience of
Netscape is instructive to those willing to learn;
MIE has always been an inferior product, and still is -- but Netscape once had 70% of the market; now MIE has 90%. What happened? And for how long do you suppose the guys at Netscape said, "Naw, can't happen. Isn't happenning. Didn't happen."
I think we probably should worry more about guys like Google; wiki is more their flavor. But it really doesn't matter who eats; eaten is eaten. Hitler is dead; the Bogeyman is fantasy; competition in business is very real. And if you don't think what you're doing is a business, your competitors will show you before they tell you.
You have to dig for the history behind some other little takeovers. Yahoo ate the mailing list server OneGroups, for example; now competitor Topica is almost out of the market. Of course it's a commonplace that Google nearly put Yahoo out of business; but what about all the other search engines? What about the AltaVista spider, or the Open Directory Project? People take comfort from the fact that Redmond hasn't eaten Linux -- yet. It can still happen. My personal theory is that it is not yet ripe.
Wikipedia need not fear Mr. Bill (or is it Mr. Sluggo) yet, either. We need to rise a few ranks before that's realistic. Microsoft does not want to do any work -- they want to take over something more or less full-grown; customizing it to serve their needs is enough of a job.
Don't underestimate just how abrasive this community has become, how hostile toward the newcomer. It's easy to say WikiLove, but she left the building long ago. There are over a quarter million users registered on the en: system, and (depending on your measure) only 8000 were "active" last month; only 23,000 have ever made 10 edits. Right: More than 9 out of 10 users quit before their 10th edit. Elitists crow, but I wonder who we are excluding. It's even worse when you consider that only 1200 editors made over a hundred edits last month; that's a tiny fraction of registered users and only 5% of the users who did stick around. How many made good contributions and were chased away? How many of the 1200 who remain are just nuisances?
I'm trying to do some statistics work, but it's not easy; we never thought to preserve the data properly. I'm hoping to have interesting charts for you all soon. So far, I've seen some very peculiar trends.
The brave say fear no fork -- indeed, welcome the idea. And we are certainly unthreatened by Wikinfo. The error is to assume that Bill or anyone else must play by our rules. They don't have to fork, then try to gather contributors. If they did that, we wouldn't mind, even if they somehow outpaced us. (They can do that, of course; easy enough to find a couple thousand editors when you can afford to spend millions. Besides, They can coast on existing content a long, long time.)
Weird things happen when you have billions of dollars. Ordinary concerns vanish. Overweening arrogance comes to the fore. Legal problems melt away. Yes, Microsoft was in a little trouble there, but nothing like what they had coming. They are certainly not bleeding from their wounds, and MIE -- and Windows -- is still right on top.
I'm sure most of us are confident that GFDL and FSF will protect us, no matter what. I'm not. Law serves money, especially with a Reagan-Bush Supreme Court. We have many legal weaknesses (none of which I am going to point out here), and any of them may be used to turn the tables. It won't be a question of WikiMedia Foundation suing Yahoo for GFDL infringement; it will be us on the defensive against the deep pockets of the aggressor looking to shut us out of his newly-stolen turf. Nor will he lack for allies; every user we chase out of our community is a potential enemy. We scorn threats made by whining vandals, but how long do those threats remain a joke when well bankrolled?
Neither do we have to lose, or even fight, a suit in order to be brought low. There is an entire range of techniques available to the hijacker. If such were ineffective, we'd have more art movie houses than multiplexes; more indie labels than pop trash; more neighborhood cafes than *$. Obviously, the 1/100th of 1% of visitors who stay to edit Wikipedia will not desert us for some Yahoo!Wiki or Woogle -- but the average clueless football-teevee-watching Windozer tire-store-manager with two teen girls will worship something that looks like Wikipedia, but without the "porno", rudeness, and edit wars over proper use of emdash (especially if it comes with a big American flag on each page and a bot that sweeps the database "fixing" British ushazge and references to "French" fries or Michael Moore).
Don't underestimate the points raised in this section. Wikipedia has existed for a long time in a kind of idyllic, Utopian state of orderly anarchy. It is wishful thinking to believe that state can continue indefinitely. There are a lot of players who are very well organized, and we are due to be taught a painful lesson. — Xiong 熊 talk * 19:04, 2005 May 8 (UTC)
(I'm posting portions of my study here, on Wikipedia, in hopes of getting feedback from as many actual Wikipedia users as possible. Please help me to improve this analysis by adding your thoughts here, or by emailing me in confidence.)
Snowspinner has suggested that his pattern of contribution to Wikipedia is similar to that of Wikipedia founder Jimbo Wales's contributions. [1]
In broad terms, Snowspinner is correct.
Total Edits, 1 January 2005 - 15 April 2005 | Edits to the Encyclopedia | Discussion of Articles | Other | |||||||||
Snowspinner | 1513 | 332 | 22% | 258 | 17% | 923 | 61% | |||||
Jimbo Wales | 90 | 7 | 8% | 11 | 12% | 72 | 80% |
But when a detailed breakdown of contributions is examined, there are large dissimmilarites:
Jimbo Wales | Snowspinner | ||||||||||
Edits to Encyclopedia: | 7 | (8%) | 334 | (22%) | |||||||
Articles | 4 | (4.44%) | 320 | (21.05%) | |||||||
Image: | 1 | (1.11%) | 0 | (0%) | |||||||
Template: | 2 | (2.22%) | 7 | (0.46%) | |||||||
Category: | 0 | (0%) | 7 | (0.46%) | |||||||
MediaWiki: | 0 | (0%) | 0 | (0%) | |||||||
Discussion of Articles: | 11 | (12%) | 258 | (17%) | |||||||
Talk: | 10 | (11.11%) | 109 | (7.17%) | |||||||
Image talk: | 1 | (1.11%) | 0 | (0%) | |||||||
Template talk: | 0 | (0%) | 5 | (0.33%) | |||||||
Category talk: | 0 | (0%) | 3 | (0.2%) | |||||||
MediaWiki talk: | 0 | (0%) | 0 | (0%) | |||||||
Votes for deletion: | 0 | (0%) | 60 | (3.95%) | |||||||
Votes for undeletion: | 0 | (0%) | 32 | (2.11%) | |||||||
Templates for deletion: | 0 | (0%) | 49 | (3.22%) | |||||||
Other: | 72 | (80%) | 928 | (61%) | |||||||
Wikipedia: | 10 | (11.11%) | 426 | (28.03%) | |||||||
Wikipedia talk: | 1 | (1.11%) | 232 | (15.26%) | |||||||
User: | 2 | (2.22%) | 69 | (4.54%) | |||||||
User talk: | 59 | (65.56%) | 201 | (13.22%) |
While both Snowspinner and Jimbo Wales make most of their edits to non-article namespaces, it's readily apparent that Wales spends most of his time (a full 65%) in User_talk, talking to other users; Snowspinner spends most of his time in Wikipedia, and most of that on Arbitration pages.
Also of note is the time spent discussing articles: while Wales makes few edits, he spends about over ten percent of his time in Article Talk discussing with other users what should be in articles; Snowspinner spends more time in the more contentious arenas of Deletion voting than in (possibly) non-adversarial Talk.
While Wales spends only a little more than one percent of his time in Wikipedia_talk, much of which involves discussion of policy, Snowspinner devotes over fifteen percent of his time to this.
(While Snowspinner spends, proportionally, twice the time in the User namespace as Wales, the difference isn't actually as great as it first appears, as it's primarily the result of Snowspinner compiling evidence, within his own user-subpages, for future Arbitration cases; this should be appreciated when looking at these numbers.)
Much of the proportional differences noted can no doubt be accounted for rather simply: Jimbo Wales and Snowspinner have very different roles on Wikipedia. Wales directs the Foundation, and as such plays a role of mediator, cajoler, conciliator and consensus-builder: he works primarily to build up Wikipedia, to iron out differences and to bring users together.
Snowspinner's role on Wikipedia is more adversarial, given that he works closely with the Arbitration Committee, at that Committee's request [2] [3] [4] in his role as "Public Prosecutor". (Snowspinner established what he calls the "District Attorney's Office", but as Wikipedia doesn't have districts, the title "Public Prosecutor" or "Attorney General" is perhaps more accurate.) To do that job, Snowspinner must necessarily spend his time seeking out evidence of wrong-doing, compiling evidence against wrong-doers, and bringing them to justice.
Snowspinner additionally contributes to Wikipedia as an enforcer of policy (e.g., 72 edits to Administrators' Noticeboard) and as to a lesser degree as a formulator of policy (44 edits in Wikipedia, 23 in Wikipeda_talk).
When the details are taken in account, then, Snowspinner's pattern of edits is only in a very superficial way similar to Jimbo Wales's. This reflects their very different roles on Wikipedia: Wales nurtures the Encyclopedia and the Foundation as a whole; while Snowspinner polices and prosecutes individual editors who get out of line, and formulates policy to keep them in line.
Of course, this is only a preliminary analysis of statistics by an outsider, and I'm sure it can be improved by experienced Wikipedia users. Please contribute your thoughts here, or in confidence to:
-- rrcaballo AY yahoo.com
I hope this is the correct place to discuss this. First off, I did bring this issue up on the article's talk page, but no one responded (I suspect very few people watch the article).
A while ago, I rewrote the stub for extended warranty. I actually got high praise for it. :-) In my research, I discovered that most consumer advocate groups discourage the purchasing of extended warranties, and I included that information in the article. About a week ago, an almost-anonymous user ( El Grego--one of his two contributions to the 'pedia) came along and rewrote the entire article. What was, in my opinion, a balanced and NPOV article was turned into a long-winded rant on how extended warranties are a Good Thing, in direct opposition to what all the sources I could find stated. He then stated that "a few" consumer advaocate groups advise against purchasing extended warranties (when it is actually most). On the whole, it is a very POV rewrite. Compare this version to the current version. I think it should be reverted to my last version, just because the new rewrite is so POV, but I didn't want to do it without some feedback from other users. Any input? Thanks. — Frecklefoot | Talk 16:11, May 2, 2005 (UTC)
Template:Medical is a disclaimer which states "Please Note:Wikipedia does not give medical advice. Wikipedia and Wikimedia will not be held responsible for the consequences resulting from any medical-related content." From a legal standpoint the disclaimer is probably unnecessary. Anyway, it's already part of the general disclaimer. I'm tempted to just TfD it but I wanted some opinions first. According to User:Yamato Kenichi, this disclaimer is on every medical page in the Chinese and Japanese Wikipedias. Rhobite 03:03, Apr 24, 2005 (UTC)
A good idea. Perhaps there is a better place to suggust this?-- ^~^Morgan^~^ 00:51, 8 May 2005 (UTC)
Has anyone seen the Hebrew Wikipedia? Very pretty, isn't it? -- Munchkinguy 18:47, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)
A novel front-end for Wikipedia has been invented at: http://blog.outer-court.com/wikitrivia/ where they pick a random article, blank out the subject and challenge you to guess the subject. It's actually quite well done. Perhaps WikiMedia can host something similar as an alternate revenue generator. Samw 03:02, 28 May 2005 (UTC)
What is a succession box?
for example
{{
succession box two to one}}
Spencer Karter big_bubba_1985@yahoo.com
This has come up before, but I really don't feel WP:VIP's current alarts section is working. It's a hassle (relatively speaking) to add someone to it, and more often than not, admin intervention doesn't happen or happens much too late. The problem has been discussed on Wikipedia talk:Vandalism in progress, but I think we may need a separate, much simpler "flag this user for admin attention" system. The best I can come up with is having a page with just {{User|…}} entries, without any discussion. Anybody can add a user entry, and admins can come along and open the contribs, check if they agree the problem warrants adin intervention and do so, or decide to leave it (or just warn again). Whatever the result, the entry is then removed. This way, admins can always easily tell if there's work to be done and if a few around the globe put it on their watchlist, life on RC patrol will be made a lot easier for non-admins. (As I said, this would need to be kept simple to work: no discussions, if someone disagrees with the response there's always WP:VIP, WP:VP, and WP:AN)
Does that sound like a good idea to anyone? -- W( t) 18:06, 2005 May 26 (UTC)
There are currently dozens, possibly hundreds of articles listed at Wikipedia:Transwiki_log that have been transwikied but not yet taken care here (deleted, redirected, merged, etc.) Please, I need your help getting this issue dealt with. As said before, there are an enormous number of articles that need to be dealt with. →Iñgōlemo← talk 04:37, 2005 May 26 (UTC)
I seem to be logged out every time I try to edit a page. The "Remember me" box is checked, cookies are all properly enabled, firewall adjusted, etc. The browser remembers my username but not my login. This happens with IE, Opera, and even Lynx.. Even on others' computers. Very very annoying. Any ideas? Posted elsewhere too but no help. Signed, (you'll just have to take my word on this) -Mashford
Who is the "Javascript vandal" referred to on Recent Changes? Willy-on-wheels? I haven't heard him/her referred to as that before. func (talk) 02:14, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
The servers should escape all potentially dangerous executable code users enter before dissemination. Allowing this to happen in the first place is as stupid as MicroSoft.Com shipping an email-client which executes virii. ¡Wait a minute! ;-) This is a security issue. Luckily, yours truly always surfs with JavaScript disabled, as all should do.
--
— Ŭalabio 23:28, 2005 May 25 (UTC)
The article is currently at Qur'an, and all of the article refers to it as such. But, under Wikipedia policy of using the version most commonly known by English speakers, shouldn't it be at Koran? Rick K 23:43, May 24, 2005 (UTC)
what about Quran? That's increasingly frequent in English. qur'an is the technical transliteration, and should indeed not be used in titles per our policy (otherwise, we should have Śiva instead of Shiva). dab (ᛏ) 12:28, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
Parallel case: Byzantine Empire is very far from being the "most accurate", but since it is the "most common" usage in English, the article is titled Byzantine Empire. And User:Adam Bishop will defend that title "over his dead body". Decius 13:41, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
The title should be Qur'an. Decius 13:45, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
At one time Koran was by far the most common spelling. But very steadily over the past decade or so, Quran (and its variant Qur'an) have become more and more popular. The difference is no longer that great. So due to that, along with objections many Muslims have over the Koran spelling, I think moving the article to that title would not be a good idea. In short, Quran is a widely-used and recognized alternate that is valid for us to use due to problems with the Koran spelling. This would fall under the 'don't overdue it' clause of our common names naming convention. -- mav 23:43, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
I WAS MARRIED IN LAS VEGAS AND NEED TO GET A COPY OF MY MARRIAGE LICENCE AND WHAT IS THE COST TO SEND FOR IT?
What's the most frequently updated article meter?
Lotsofissues 00:42, 22 May 2005 (UTC)
I see a tendency to have information about multiple companies in a single article. This seems to be very confusing because most of what is written about is not even for the company the page is about. I have been moving material into the real companies article, defunct or not, as I find this. It's not easy work. It also can leave the parent article with very little since in some cases it really contained nothing at all about the article title. If you also consider that redrects from the correctly named page go to wrong titles, it adds to the confusion. If you then try to clean up the redirects after a move, you find out how many other articles are missing and were wiki linked to the wrong article. It's frustrating at times and I wonder how many people are actually fixing problems like this when they find them. Vegaswikian
I note with interest the inclusion of Joey Archibald and Pete Latzo under the heading of Italian American boxers. I would indeed be grateful if anybody has source material to indicate that they have Italian ancestry. My own research informs me that Latzo is of slavic origin and Archibald is of Irish/English background. If anyone has further info about this subject it would be appreciated.
I note with interest the inclusion of Joey Archibald and Pete Latzo under the heading of Italian American boxers. I would indeed be grateful if anybody has source material to indicate that they have Italian ancestry. My own research informs me that Latzo is of slavic origin and Archibald is of Irish/English background. If anyone has further info about this subject it would be appreciated.
Is there a page that solely enumerates praiseful quotes by the media about Wikipedia? If not I might as well put my research to good use. Also I find the press coverage uneven in accuracy, so how about a summary fact sheet with supporting links containing the most commonly needed facts a reporter discussing Wikipedia would want? I can do this - I assume it doesn't presently exist?
Lotsofissues 11:20, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
http://www.macon.com/mld/inquirer/business/11648267.htm Here's another of the many stories on the veracity of Wikipedia. They always have to have quotes from Britannica, Colliers, and other "legit" encyclopedias. Spalding 22:33, May 19, 2005 (UTC)
Thanks, I've informed badger. I have been very closely monitoring how the press renders Wikipedia. This is the first time Scholastic, the publisher of Grolier (Americana is defunct), has joined the fray. And you know what? We don't care! If those editors had decided to speak out two years ago, we might have been riled up. But the comparison between Wikipedia and that moribund electronic file cabinet is too stark to feel threatened over. Cheers for Wikiannihilation!
Lotsofissues 23:48, 19 May 2005 (UTC)
From a May 17th stubby article about Wikipedia in the Times:
"Critics suggest that without any sort of process in place to ensure the quality of contributions, 'any particular page might be rubbish at the moment you happen to look at it'."
The quote from a "critic" was actually spoken by Jimbo (THES, May 13)
Lotsofissues 10:31, 19 May 2005 (UTC)
I've had an ongoing struggle at Armenian_people#Persecution_in_the_Ottoman_Empire with an editor or editors who keep claiming that the Armenian Genocide is only "alleged" and implying that only Armenians believe it occurred. It should be needless to say that nothing could be farther from the truth, and that only (some) Turks deny that it occurred. Other than historical accuracy, I don't have a horse in this race: I am neither Armenian nor Turkish, and don't have any strong feelings either way about either ethnicity. However, this has been a more-than-weekly issue, and I am about to be largely unavailable to Wikipedia for several weeks. I would greatly appreciate if someone else would keep an eye on the article; I'd also greatly appreciate that, in the unlikely event that anyone actually has citations against this generally accepted understanding of history, that they take it up in Talk:Armenian Genocide, rather than by dubious edits to a related article. -- Jmabel | Talk 01:04, May 19, 2005 (UTC)
Has anyone heard when the newest edition of "While Reason Sleeps" will be released? It's audiodrama, produced by Lion's Den Studio in Richmond, Va.
Thanks!
Just trying to draw some attention to a little debate that's been going on because someone moved the article Gasoline to Petrol. See Talk:Petrol#Article_name.
I think gasoline is obviously more neutral, being the chemical name for the substance, but hey, maybe it's my cultural imperialistic american superiority nationalistic agenda getting in the way of my neutrality... *rolls eyes* - Omegatron 14:17, May 18, 2005 (UTC)
Please keep discussion on the talk page.
I was bold and moved the discussion to the talk page - Omegatron 20:49, May 18, 2005 (UTC)
Dear Wikipedians,
We cordially invite you to answer a short questionnaire which is a part of a non-commercial cross-cultural research project conducted at INFOSOC [5] (The Center for the Study of the Information Society), exploring Wikipedia community aspects.
The findings of this study will be published in Wikipedia to the benefit of everyone, personal copies will be also available via e-mail.
Click here for the questionnaire: [6]
Thank you in advance.
Research Team, INFOSOC
hello,
This is my first hour as a user. So if I make any mistakes, please excuse me.
I will try to stay brief. I am a professional playwright who is beginning to do some research on scientific subjects. [I am not a scientist.] At the moment I'm exploring the life of Margret Cavendish, an English scientist/philosopher of science from the mid-17th century and probably the first female member of the Royal Academy of Science in England. A play obviously deals with a dramatic moment in someone's life or in society as a whole.
Would anyone familiar with Margret Cavendish, or the Royal Academy in the 17th century please suggest a starting point or an interesting perspective that I might explore? Any directions on further research would also be appreciated. Your help would be most satisfying.
As a courtesy, I should say that research gathered will be used to write a play, which I would intend to copyright. If I have transgressed here, I would appreciate being told so.
Most cordially, Bob
When I upload album covers, I upload biggest and highest quality covers I could find. Could uploading gigantic pictures {eg. Renegades) potentially go out of the fair use policy? Album covers will not damage them, rather it will advertise them, but it doesn't seem to fit the size policy. pmam21 talk articles 00:00, May 17, 2005 (UTC)
"We do not pretend that the Britnnica is immune to error" — Robert McHenry
Lotsofissues 20:30, 15 May 2005 (UTC)
I updated Independent Schools Association of the Southwest with the school Episcopal School of Dallas and although the history says that I updated the page, the page itself is not updated. Why is this?-- Howard547 02:16, 15 May 2005 (UTC)
Help! Lately, while I am in Wikipedia, the first few pages I visit appear to behave correctly, but then after a while, the page I try to visit starts to misbehave. What is the problem with Wikipedia at this moment?? Georgia guy 22:47, 9 May 2005 (UTC)
Try banging the computer. Hitting it hard on the side. This used to work with television in the good old days.-- Jondel 09:12, 19 May 2005 (UTC)
It takes me a long time to type out the code for entering the user name. Is there some way I can automatically sign my user name or make it faster? - Stancel 20:37, 5 May 2005 (UTC)
I'm seeing someone else who doesn't know. Talk:Harmonics_Theory#Pseudoscience.3F__Vanity.3F This should not happen. - Omegatron 14:59, May 18, 2005 (UTC)
Can you imagine how much better off we would be? Lotsofissues 23:29, 8 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I'm under 20 and male and don't consider myself an asshole. — Ilγαηερ (Tαlκ) 03:01, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I'm over 20 and consider myself an asshole Dan100 16:40, Apr 10, 2005 (UTC)
I completely agree. We need to eliminate our competition for the few pre-pubescent girls that edit. -- SPUI ( talk) 01:55, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
To complete the sentence: "......then we would run into severe problems with the Geneva Convention ("Exterminate"), if not to say the Gender-Equality laws("Males"), if not Age-Equality laws("20").... and who the HELL would solve all the technical problems? Wikipedia'd all wither away on the "old generation" with no fresh blood at all to reincarnate the loss of oldies on pension all falling as flies, fer sure!"-- OleMurder 19:56, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Let us consider the implications if all males under 20 year olds were exterminated from the site. Before we begin hypothesizing, we must first consider these corallories:
We can then conclude that:
This would have stunning effects on the entire world, but the pornography industry would ignore the method, even though it would conclusively solve the problem of minors accessing their content.
As Wikipedia progresses on without these male under twenty year olds, two long debated theories are proven:
Outcries against this bias will result in all females under twenty years old from being banned, so that the second statement can be amended to:
The world does not change. If the world does not change, Wikipedia cannot change. If Wikipedia cannot change, Wikipedia will die. QED: Banning under twenty year old males will prove disastrous for Wikipedia. :) (PS, I am under twenty years old and male and just wasted fifteen minutes typing this) Ambush Commander 21:17, May 3, 2005 (UTC)
How sexist and ageist of you. Hedley 16:09, 7 May 2005 (UTC)
I do not concur with this. Mga 17:06, 15 May 2005 (UTC) (15)
Let us ban all males under 20 from Wikipedia and welcome the return of Hitler. Kaschner 11:23, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
I want to know if there are any comments any Wikipedian has about including a message about sockpuppet user names at Template talk:Anon. Within the past few days, I have wrote welcome messages on several anonymous Wikipedians, adding to them the warning not to use a sockpuppet. Any comments anyone has?? Georgia guy 01:38, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
Sockpuppets rule!-- OleMurder 21:52, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
I compare often the English and German articles and I notice quite often discrepancies between them. I will from now on give every German and English article with a discrepancy factual accuracy warnings. I would appreciate help in this project and may be we could do this systematically. Until now I do this at random. Help in other languages (e.g with the "big" Wikipedia's French and Japanese) is also welcome. Andries 19:26, 16 May 2005 (UTC)
START SHIFT:W1AL BEGIN TRANSMISSION >> (1BL)J úómíäp ßffrf (1RBR)ßu Qxjtíx pëE A EäjQ ltçZS (AS)ëp btçüYjOZí. (CS)qï'Y (12OL)YZç ëAfrjçQ QE AHmO äQcjíçí óS (CC)the sheet of paper. Surely, we can do it? << END TRANSMISSION
Dobermann (woof)]] 12:53, 24 May 2005 (UTC)
START SHIFT:W1AR BEGIN TRANSMISSION >> qpéQkßg, pn'n çD(RV)ig pQgc gY ípúYYëbxú H mjHH çminW (1O12R) níüuVAVäíï YíbjúÁÁ ëägßgpcÁi. vYgiïß nc jbëSQZYr ptEjx ßfu nüum? vjybWÁ, Sü OrDO DcgkZZ gui çinQcp ïb zßtrt'p ZWrx; rç AQ cüE nxf çj äQmA, äZÁäöjs: >>> LAUNCH [7] <<< (CC) Please reply soon. Thank you. << END TRANSMISSION
Dobermann (woof) 10:54, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
START SHIFT:W1AL BEGIN TRANSMISSION >> äptWOHnVKA@(RS)b-ßOüxV.(RS)ró << END TRANSMISSION
I suspect that they're using the village pump to send encrypted/garbled submissions. Multiple benefits of not being easily deletable (they'd just reference the history). Okay, please stop. Ambush Commander 23:02, May 25, 2005 (UTC)
IMPORTANT!!! Begin assault tomorrow, May 28, I have the programs and will send them to you immediately. First, stun users, then carry out second stage. It should be easy, provided you have the new (modified) Javascript programs courtesy of User:Lupo and yours truly. ;) Wikipedia, prepare for a devastating attack while you have the time! Remember, guys, code names should be used. Monitoring through the live RC feed. Comm link through Yahoo Messenger. There, Wikipedians, I've given you enough leads. Let's get down to business! 84.154.125.117 21:13, 27 May 2005 (UTC)
† If this still leaves you totally mystified, see I'm Sorry I Haven't A Clue†† and Mornington Crescent.
†† which leaves everybody totally mystified.
Both Beagle and Praetor are down. Complaining about code malfunctions. Postpone assault for 7 days. Kaschner 15:07, 28 May 2005 (UTC)
I wrote a little tome here about some recent raw experiences in the weblog article. I don't declare myself an angel in the recent fray there (or even in some other disagreements), but it is disheartening when the other players, as a large degree of their arguments, use terms of personal destruction, while I strived to not do that. Does anyone have any ideas of what can be done when such personal attacks like this occur in the place of argumentation? — Stevie is the man! Talk | Work 03:47, Jun 14, 2005 (UTC)
Wikicities is not a WikiMedia project. It's an external project based on Wikipedia, run by Wikia.
To explore the possibility of building a Wikicity for London, I've started a miniwiki. Please feel free to play around if you're interested. Use it as a sandbox.
After the village pump image was added to each subsection, the header didn't work very well and had the right-hand border missing. I've revamped the template and any comments, criticism or changes would be appreciated. violet/riga (t) 19:23, 12 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Last night I looked into a user whom coolcaesar RVed, and discovered a long string of self aggrandizing POV. Kmccoy took the task further, and has so far discovered 16 IPs associated with Delfino. There are more likely to be found, and the total number of nonsense edits will likely rise into the hundreds. Most of these edits have remained for weeks. This is a serious junk/spam/vanity problem that needs to be squashed immediately. Please join us at the hub of activity at Kmccoy's subpage: User:Kmccoy/Delfino
lots of issues | leave me a message 10:41, 12 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I must commend Kmccoy for a fine job. His patience and methodism is more astounding than the scope of vandalism.
lots of issues | leave me a message 08:07, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Does this type of article count as vanity? 24.54.208.177 03:13, 12 Jun 2005 (UTC)
[8] This page links to the Wikipedia article on the UK! Great, eh?-- 212.100.250.217 16:24, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I wanted to write about this here so that as many people as possible would know about this absurd. Another user and myself (mainly) have been involved for quite a while in containing daily vandalism in this article. The article itself was never being improved, and all we did was revert attacks from IP addresses that we believe belong to the same person. After some time at it, we finally requested that the article be blocked at the proper forum (request for protection). BrokenSegue, an Admin (obviously), quickly did it (it was a flagrant case of constant vandalism), and, quite diligently I might add, added the article to his Watchlist, taking an active interest in solving the problem.
With the article blocked, we had finally contained the daily attacks. The anon, however, is likely to be a kid and a diehard fan of the subjects of the article — given who said subjects are — and so, instead of moving on, the anon started talking in the talk page, and even though he was giving ultimatums and so on, we thought that we were making some progress, maybe even starting to "convert an active vandal", something very rare. We had even set up a Temp page copying the article for him to express his views. He had shown no interest in it though, but we still had hopes.
Then, out of the blue, this other Admin simply came and unblocked the page. No comments on the talk page, no specific edit summary. Nothing. He simply unblocked the page because he felt like it (and that's the best explanation I could come up with). Result: in less than 24 hours, already three different users (myself included) have had to revert attacks from that same anon. I've asked BrokenSegue to block the page again, but he appears to be offline for the time being, and so in the meantime we just have to keep reverting vandalism every couple of hours again, all because of someone's inconsequence.
I have to say that my faith in the diligence of the Admins has been shaken. I mean, in order to become an Admin, one must be approved by the Admin community. And how does someone like that become an Admin? And what this kind of attitude says about the Admins in general? I'm not saying that all Admins are like this guy, but I used to think that Admins were all well balanced people, who are supposed to help in harder-than-usual issues. Not any more. I still have high praises for the Admins I've worked with (BrokenSegue, Jmabel, and others), but I now believe that there are rotten apples in the Admin basket. Regretable... Regards, Redux 02:51, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)
The question as to when to unblock a page that needed to be blocked has to be decided on a case-by-case basis. When the request was made to block the page, we already knew that a few days would not have sufficed to get this person to either start talking seriously or move on. And there it is now, in the article's history, the cabal proof: the anon immediately started vandalising the page again. As I have also said before in regards to this particular issue, blocking the page for a few days is effective to resolve a revert war between registered users or any users that have shown any disposition to discuss, but have somehow lost patience or their temper. It's quite different when you're dealing with an anon that has regularly ignored requests to talk and discontinue his line of action. He started talking when the page was blocked, but only to say: "this is that is wrong and I expect to see it changed immediately". It was obvious that a couple of days would not get this person to move on. If Snow had taken the time to see what it was that he was walking into, I believe (I have to) he would not have done it, or else there's no hope of resolving this. There is proof: as soon as Snow unblocked the page "almost five days after the initial protection" the anon immediately resumed his edits, and already three different users have reverted him. And it will go on and on, until the page is protected again, and we can either get him to start talking and work with the community, maybe compromise, or move on. Did you check Snow's talk page, to see how someone had already complained about his unprotecting pages that should not have been unprotected yet? I'm sorry, but Snow messed up in this case. I've been spending sometime to try and keep that article from becoming everything but encyclopedic. For most of the time, it was basically keeping gossip, fandom stuff and immaginary "data" from being added, but since this anon came along, it's become something else: he vandalises the article several times a day, and it's becoming unworkable. If I unwatch the article, the obssessed fan gets his way and starts shaping the article as he sees fit. Others will soon follow suit. How encyclopedic you think that's going to be in a while?
And I've been using the </br> simply because I do it faster with it. Regards,
Redux 04:17, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)
And if you want to avoid admins unprotecting too soon a note on WP:AN/I might stop it from happening too. Mgm| (talk) 12:09, Jun 10, 2005 (UTC)
This is clearly a content dispute, not vandalism. I am changing the template accordingly and caution redux against his prolix use of the word prolix. --
Tony Sidaway|
Talk 15:12, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)
By the way, I think Redux and I have mostly cleared this up on our talk pages (with an assist from Rick Block). Although if anyone would still like to add to the discussion regarding better ways to handle protection/unprotection of pages, they're welcome to. -- Michael Snow 04:32, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Don't you think you are exaggerating a little? Well, actually a lot. I will not entertain this pointless discussion which is not the point of all of this. No offense, but you need to get over yourself a little. Does anyone care to contribute to the actual topic of discussion? Redux 18:03, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)
1) Where and 2) how to develop a sketch for a draft for a wikipedia entry.
Please let me know of any hints, tips or pointers that would apply to developing a sketch for a draft for an entry about a phenomenon going on at doctors' offices and clinics.
If you would, please consider and contribute to a sketch for a draft for an entry about a strategy for reducing sexually transmitted infections cases. The phenomenon of potential sex partners coming in to clinics or visit their doctors saying we haven't had sex yet and want to know our sexually transmitted disease status. A strategy of let's get tested together before we have sex... for sexually transmitted infections. On any given day two people can meet and want to have sex. You can get tested together for a number of sexually transmitted infections before you have sex.
blogs, links
http://NotB4WeKnow.EditThisPage.com
http://NotB4WeKnow.blog-city.com
a.
For example, where around this wiki or any wiki or anywhere would be the best place to develop a sketch for a draft for an wikipedia entry with other collaborators?...
b.
How do you attempt to get more support from the inclusionists?... and deal more effectively with the deletists activities?
oo-- dWs dsaklad@zurich.csail.mit.edu 06:44, 9 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Thank you !
c.
Would the responses conflict?... at
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Votes_for_undeletion#History_only_undeletion
or at
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Votes_for_undeletion#Not_b4_we_know_2
I began at
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Not_b4_we_know&action=edit
Then with no remark no reason got tagged for the speedy delete. Then with no remark no reason deleted offering no opportunity to recompose a sketch for a draft for a wikipedia entry.
With no remark no reason got deleted after trying
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Wikipedia:Requested_articles/Applied_arts_and_sciences&diff=14890440&oldid=14879386 With no remark no reason got deleted after trying
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Template_talk:Not_before_we_know-stub&action=edit
d.
Suggestion.
Outline the protocol ever more clearly including better opportunities to recompose, to backtrack. A hint, tip or pointer offered before tagging the speedy delete. A hint, tip or pointer offered before the deletion.
e.
How would we make the process ever more clear for the next contributors?...
oo-- dWs
dsaklad@zurich.csail.mit.edu 11:55, 9 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Let's not put a limit to imagination! A protocol known to a regular might not be completely clear to a neophyte. oo-- dWs dsaklad@zurich.csail.mit.edu 07:09, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Hello--Sorry if this is in the wrong place. I tried to make an edit in the Katherine [sic] Drexel article, correcting the spelling to Katharine, but couldn't figure out how to correct it in the title. I'm not terribly interested in adding things or changing things in general, and am just grateful to have Wikipedia available for quick reference on-line, but I did want to correct the name. Sharon 206.224.83.155 02:31, 9 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I want to know if any Wikipedian has any opinions about whether it is okay to have the sandbox heading mentioned twice in the sandbox. I remember a few times when this happened. Georgia guy 23:49, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Not sure where to report this. The main www.wikimedia.org page uses http://www.wikipedia.org/upload/wiki.png as the link to wikipedia, which does not exist. — PhilHibbs | talk 09:12, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I shouldn't put the entire blame on Wikipedia, but because of its policy of letting anyone edit the information, readers are being mislead. I had to write an essay for one of my courses, and after reading some of the disgusting things that people wrote, I know that one site that can not be trusted for true information is this one. Just to let you know, people are taking wrong advantage of Wikipedia's policies, and filling it with garbage, by cutting out important facts in history. DO NOT USE WIKIPEDIA.
I praise you for Wikipedia. Tho I do not know what wikipedia stands for. Excellent encyclopedia. My passions are Philosophy&Psychology. I love the hyperlinks to other related information in the general area.Well done. I am sold. It is now my only reference to dictionary,encyclopedia and all knowledge concerneing the English language. Thank you. Sincerely Yours,
P.L. James.
I have been in a perpetual edit war with User:Rspeer. We need some mediation or there is no end in sight for this trouble. He has repeatedly falsely accused me of a number of things. Is there some help for this?-- Fahrenheit451 21:12, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I'd be happy to accept mediation; in fact, I requested it before, but withdrew it when the situation seemed to improve and I hadn't gotten a response from a mediator. I get the idea that mediation is fairly defunct right now, which is sad.
As for the particular conflict that likely provoked this comment (on Talk:Strategic nomination), it seems to have settled. If there is something like mediation still in existence, though, it may help us coexist in the future.
F451 didn't notify me of this request, by the way.
RSpeer 20:51, Jun 10, 2005 (UTC)
I would be willing to write appeals for charity. Anyone think the effort is worth it?
lots of issues | leave me a message 20:26, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I think it is important to have a page for just plain discussion. I mean, most of us don't know each other off of this site! At least I don't. Their should be a page for just plain communication. And (don't kill me you guys, I know this isn't exactlly supposed to be a fan page), you should be able to talk about more than just adding [to] and subtracting [from] the artical. Please take it into consitteration make two talk pages: an "artical quality" talk page and a "fan base" talk page. Thank you. -- Wack'd About Wiki 20:18, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Please read very slowly and carefully:
About 1/50 of the time, there is something I accidentally do when I type a Wikipedia page in the URL that makes it so that when I visit the page in the future, a W from Wikipedia instead of an e from Internet Explorer appears before the URL in the Address box. Any way to undo that so that when I visit it again, the e that I should see instead is seen?? Georgia guy 19:34, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I like the idea of a place where people can share their expertise & knowledge but I fear that some people may use it to propogate their version of truth.
I say that I have delusions of literacy in that, so far, I am an unpublished author though i have hopes that one day I will be published and be able to retire and concentrate on my keyboard.
My stories tend to be in the Sci-Fi/Fantasy genre but are based on various folk legends. In writing these I would like my underlying source material to be accurate so try to use the netto find information.
In a current project I wished to use Nanabozho as one of my characters but ran up against problems. Longfellow portrays him,(AKA Hiawatha)as messaniaic figure as do some other web sources, others give a different picture of him, in one case as one of the sons of Mudjekeewis, (the West Wind), he is mostly harmful, in other places he becomes a Creator God. Once you balance all these things out and treat him as a trickster,(perhaps equitable with Brer Rabbit), a balance is possible. However there are people who prefer one aspect and may offer that as definative.
Then you have the New Agers of various ilks and while I would not question their right to hold certain beliefs, (perhaps they really have been granted a revelation), they could move their concepts into the mainstream. The concepts of modern pagans may be suspect as the early church ensured that no record of the original Norse practices remained so they are fabricating their own. A similar thing seems to be happening based on Native American spirituality.
-- 212.32.113.130 15:51, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Truth. -- W( t) 10:59, 2005 Jun 5 (UTC)
So far I've started a couple of stubs. What is the etiquette around here. I guess I'm just saying... hey! and... that this places is very interesting especially as far as navigation goes. 67.190.102.28 did not sign off)
I'm writing an article dealing with UN peacekeepers. I am just wondering: what is the copyright status of images from the UN website (that are taken by UN workers). Are they PD, or how do we go about using UN images? Thanks. -- Dmcdevit 05:41, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I've been looking for this info for a while and I haven't figured a way to get it. Is there any easy way? -- Barfooz (talk) 05:59, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)
A related question - I've noticed several times on Rfa that someone has posted a detailed break-down of edits by talk page, article page, wiki-space, etc... how do you get that info? Grutness... wha? 10:38, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)
To expand on Cyrius's point - it's fine to determine your edit count out of idle curiousity, or to figure out where you might be in relation to whatever you might consider significant milestones (have I made my 1024th edit?), but editing for the sake of making the edit counter go up is not. It's not a contest. There is no prize. This is not to say minor corrections are not welcome. If you enjoy fixing other people's typos please do so. However, please don't make a single change with 5 edits just to increase your edit count. -- Rick Block ( talk) 15:53, Jun 2, 2005 (UTC)
I'm not sure if there is an established proceedure for this. I thought I would check to see if folks are aware of http://www.mathdaily.com They have copied a substantial section of the wikipedia for their own site (I noticed this because their entry on the Ultimatum game is identical). However, there is no reference to wikipedia and the pages contain a copyright notice (attributing the page to mathdaily.com). I assume there is some standard way to deal with this, but I thought that since it is so extensive it might warrent an organized response. Also, if people are already handling this, I didn't want to step on anyone's toes. Thanks! - Kzollman 23:15, Jun 1, 2005 (UTC)
The translation de:Szkieletor is proposed for the deletion - the article is short and bad, the building that has never been build not importand enough. What do you think - should Szkieletor be proposed for deletion here (in the en:WP) or not? AN 16:23, 1 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Some anon was really happy with the wiki, so created the following message at Thanks,
Thanks for checking this Wiki Guys! I've made this page so that you would actually read it. I don't want to make your jobs harder, so just go on and delete this, but I want to say wow. Wow to all the work that you've done with this. Wow for cheching all of the international articles you get and filtering out the bad ones. Very cool! keep up the good work!
Don't you love this community? R adiant _* 14:36, Jun 1, 2005 (UTC)
the german wikipedia is nominated for the Grimme Online Award and we go win with your help. vote here (last entry) it's very simple to vote: click on the circle left to Wikipedia - Die freie Enzyklopädie, then the button vote >>> and then Ja!. the rest isn't necessary, cause it's just a competition so please help the german 'pedia Schaengel89 @me 12:06, 1 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I would like to inform all wikipedians concerning the proposed changes on Zanskar after encountering vandalism from User:Mel Etitis, who had always reverted my edits by stating that they are mostly bad (usually at the expense of the good ones, study the history carefully [9].) My edits on this article include resectioning, content restructuring and minor grammatical amendments which I feel that this article greatly needed it.
There is no need to put such a windy description on the thumbed images. Such windy descriptions, however, should be shifted to the image article itself.
Zanskari houses, though otherwise well built, are not adapted to the recently increasing rainfall, as their roofs leak, catching their surprised inhabitants unprepared. Most of the precipitation occurs as snowfall during the harsh and extremely long winter period. These winter snowfalls are of vital importance, since they feed the glaciers which melt in the summer and provide most of the irrigation water.
I would suggest that passage is more suitable to create another new section or subsection, placing the entire section into the new section or subsection.
No shortcuts. The passage uses shortcuts, such as Rain- and snowfall, which can be preety confusing. I would recommend newer phrases to be used.
If there are no objections in three days, I hope that I can go ahead smoothly with my copyediting plans. Thanks.
Tan 19:13, 1 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Thanks Xiong. Although I cannot make out clearly on what you are trying to say, but I feel that you may be the most appropriate person to act as a judge between User:Mel Etitis and me--both of us were unable to come to a concensus about the state of Zanskar.
I do agree that my english may not be the best. However, just see the state of Zanskar--it needs content restructuring. If you see the history of Zanskar [12], an annoyomous user has tried to copyedit Zanskar--but it seems strange that Mel reverted my edits, and it has occured to me before.
What I want you to do is to watch out on Mel's action. I have told him to wait patiently and let me complete the entire copyediting process, I do not want interruptions from him, and I had already had more than enough. After I have completed the whole process, then do allow him to counter-copyedit. (His poor foresight maybe the reason to this dispute).
For your information, do look into Zanskar and Talk:Zanskar.
Thanks.
Anymore comments concerning this issue? If there is none in three days' time, then I assume that this dispute is settled, and hopefully I can go ahead with my plans. Please be patient once I start copyediting, but go ahead make ammendments on my grammar. All reverts without appropriate explanation or intentions should be considered as vandalism (or subvandalism).
Tan 19:13, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I would also like to add one more point from here (my opinion)--Zanskar is an article that looks more like a personal ancedote than a proper encyclopedia article. This is evidenced in the usage of
Wikipedia:No peacock terms such as Even though Padum, the administrative capital of Zanskar, is not of great interest...
All are welcome to copyedit.
Tan 17:30, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)
It has been suggested we should not put a BitTorrent search engine external link in the article because of the legal ambiguity of BitTorrent. Ideas? SqueakBox 23:30, May 31, 2005 (UTC)
One of my favorite books is Life: A User's Manual which is about an apartment building. The thing is, to explain many aspects of the book you need an exact diagram of the building (see article for details). Can I scan the one from the book and claim Fair Use? gkhan 22:56, May 31, 2005 (UTC)
I know this sounds extremely odd, but I would like the green colour of the babel (which is on many user pages) modified. There are three/four colours which make me sick (slightly nauseous infact, and I have no clue why...) Would anyone have any objections if the HTML colour code is modified slightly? = Nichalp ( Talk)= 19:42, May 31, 2005 (UTC)
I'm looking for a phone # or email address for the head office or distribution centre for the Dollarama stores. I've been informed by staff at the Dollarama store in my area (Guelph) that they are not allowed to give out a phone # or email. They suggested I check the web for a phone # or email for the office in Toronto or Montreal Quebec. This I did but came up with zilch!
I was informed by a friend that the Dollarama stores were taken over by Bain so I checked for Bain on the web & again came up with zilch!
All I want to do is put in a request for a certain item to be shipped to the Guelph store for an upcoming birthday party. What's the big deal?
I've wasted over 3 hours of my time on this & will try to avoid shopping at Dollarama stores since the head office appears to be in hiding!!
Can anyone help me?
Cathy Chapman
GREETINGS=
MY COMPANY, A.D. MARBLE & COMPANY, INC., WOULD LIKE TOO BUIil a BRIGE ACROSS THE BAIRING STRAIGHT. DO WEE NEED SOME TYPE OF PERMITION FOR THIS?? I DON’TT THINK WE SHUOLD SENSE THE OCEAN IS PUBLIC PROPERTY. THIS BRIDGE WOULD PROBLY LOWER THE GAS PRICE FOR THE WHOLE WORLD SENSE WE WONT’ HAVEN’T BUY FROM SAUDI ARABIA ANYMORE. PLEASE SIGN BELOW IF YOU ARE FOR OR AGIANST IT SO THAT WE CAN BILD THE BRIGE AS SOOON AS POSIBLE:
AT FAVOR:
AGIANTS:
Good Day I teach all sexes at two organisations The first is at an apprentice school and the second is at a Surf Life Saving Radio Base. At the apprentice school my audience is made up of both boys and girls who range in age from 14 to 22 years of age. The audience at the Surf Life Saving Radio Base ranges from 22 to 84 with the vast majority being over 55 years of age. The Lifesavers come equally from all sexes. Both my audiences are curious people who wish to learn. They have heard of some of the terms used in both Electricity and Radio but have no idea where those therms fit into the big picture. And both groups want to know how things work. Questions abound as to why things work? This is where I use Wikipedia as I can refer them to your site and they can look it up. However I have gone further than qouting Wikipedia's URL and have drawnup what I call the "top down diagrams" which start with a topic eg Batteries and drill down using your resource to fill in terms and formulas. I used to use sheets of plastic film but now I use Hyperlinks in HTML as it is easier to change information. And it works on most equipment as these blokes are students with limited funds. The benefit of this approach is in the students eyes - once they see how a topic works their eyes light up like neon lights, their marks improve and they want to learn more. Once you capture this interest the other topics become much easier to teach and learn. The students arrive early, they concentrate more and they are far more productive. The thing that surprises me is that if they miss a class they chase you till you give them the handouts - then they sit down and read it. Then comes the questions- why, how, what etc, and they volunteer to do more work in their own time!!!!!!!!!! The employers tell us that they have no problems with our appprentices because they arrive on site having a knowledge of the job and they offer information such as the formula for that is "so and so", "would you like me to work it out for you?" Or "that piece of equipment does "so and so" and is connect in this way so that efficiency is improved". Or "did you know in "so and sos" theory he /she expressed interest in "such and such" and experiemented with other ways of connection but found that efficiency decreased from this method" To quote one of my students "Do you mean all those dudes did that and some of them where GIRLS!!" -His sexist attitude changed immediately. As such can I have details re copyright as I would like to buid an Intranet so that my audience can view the topics on line. We use two networks one connected to the Internet and one that cannot be connected to the internet. The students use the non connected network and no they cannot connect to the internet as the server sits on my desk- it is an old Laptop running Debian Linux. When the hack it they have to fix it and then we teach computer networking -till they fix it- as all teachers will tell you you have to grab their attention some how. Both groups are taught the same way. The Lifesavers like the diagrams because the can see how the equipment works without going to deep or if they want to they can explore the topic and see where one piece of equipment fits in with other equipment. regards Clem Klausen
Hopefully by 1.5 we can add auto generated MLA/APA references to the toolbox - matching Britannica Online's feature. But now they've premiered (or perhaps provided for a while) a quick dictionary programmed into the page! Double click and word and a Merriam-Webster popup box appears. MW is owned by Britannica Holdings (clever way of integrating the network). If our arch-rival offers this feature then how can we not match them?
lots of issues | leave me a message 01:57, 30 May 2005 (UTC)
lots of issues | leave me a message 21:30, 30 May 2005 (UTC)
how do you extract the inner cell mass? what is the involved process? email me kal4life2002@yahoo.com
There is an ongoing discussion at Wikipedia:Deletion policy/Reducing VfD load about ways that the size of VfD might be reduced. While there is still much discussion about possible new procedures and policies, there is a general consensus that one way to reduce the size would be to encourage editors to use other processes before or instead of nominating a page for deletion. Some of these other processes are:
Please note that this is not a suggestion about changing policy or procedure. This is simply "spreading the word" about some possible ways that we can reduce the size of VfD, and so this will be posted in several places around Wikipedia. Thanks for listening. Soundguy99 16:05, 29 May 2005 (UTC)
Has it ever ever happened before, that a well-organized team of POV-pushers, (or disruptive users) in addition to their sock-puppets could take over a smaller wikipedia (even temporarily)?
Thanks, nyenyec ☎ 22:44, 27 May 2005 (UTC)
Can it be that there is an article on Slouching Towards Bedlam, an apparently obscure computer game, but not one on Slouching Towards Bethlehem, a classic poem by W.B. Yeats? Am I looking in the wrong place?
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Fellow inclusionists,
The situation has grown more dire since the last time I addressed you. The encroaching hordes of deletionists at Votes for deletion are growing more, not less, rabid by the day and the time has come to put a stop to it. We must do battle on this territory which heretofore has been assumed to be irrevocably held in the clutches of the enemy. Some cases in point:
Familiarize yourselves with the doctrine of inclusionism. Memorize the principles! Propagate them worldwide. Do not let your loved ones be lost to the deception of the enemy, who would taint our children with their fiendish ideology. Our foes will soon know that a spectre is haunting Wikipedia – the spectre of INCLUSIONISM!
Friends, now is the time to come forth to do battle against the enemy. We must marshal our forces at once. Now is no time to be cowardly in the face of those whose vicious ideology would lead them to pare down our encyclopedia to whatever is banal, mainstream, and popularly reported in the media. In an Orwellian turn, they would transform the word "notable" to mean whatever subjects they, in their piddly, limited experience, happen to have heard of. We must not stand for this any longer. As they say in Hotel Rwanda, "We must exterminate these cockroaches! CUT DOWN THE TALL TREES NOW!"
Your leader,
Colonel Gazpacho 14:21, 5 May 2005 (UTC)
Thanks for the heads up, so I could go vote Delete for the future fantasy-ware "Kefka's Revenge", with less than 70 displayed hits and zero Alexa rank. Niteowlneils 17:47, 5 May 2005 (UTC)
I like Colonel Gazpacho's style. But halt! The enemy is not the so-called deletionists. They are but honest individuals who work for the greater good in their own way.... The real enemy is ignorance. Ignorance should be fought tooth and nail, with chainsaws of wisdom, bazookas of understanding, and Molotov cocktails of knowledge.
- Pioneer-12 09:50, 6 May 2005 (UTC)
All I want is a very simple free WYSIWYG text editor that outputs HTML and will let me put things in bullets, underline, headings, strikeout, etc. I can't seem to find one, though. I don't want MS Word with it's incompatibility and filesize bloat. I don't want a plain text editor with no visual formatting, I just...
Hey, wait a second... Is there a way to use wikipedia's wiki markup rendering in a standalone fashion? With the preview button, it's almost WYSIWYG. (Or does anyone know of any software that fulfills my needs?) - Omegatron 04:13, May 5, 2005 (UTC)
I stumbled across an interesting product, ABBYY FineReader OCR XIX, an OCR tool by one of the leading OCR companies made specifically for recognizing older texts that are out of copyright. This seems like it could be a valuable tool for sucking in content from older works, particularly on areas where we're thin now. They even have a free trial version that will do 100 pages before expiring (and if each Wikipedian did 100 pages, we'd have a hell of a lot of content). The best part is that we don't even have to proofread the results too closely, because we can rely on the wiki effect to clean it up. Only catch is, where does one obtain these older texts? Ideally we can borrow them from libraries. Deco 18:56, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
For instance, many articles in Wikipedia are based on encyclopedias that are now in the public domain, such as [[1911_Encyclop%E6dia_Britannica]]. Therfore OCR would be helpful. -- Munchkinguy 22:34, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
Certainly it could be helpful for certain things, but I don't like the idea of just bulk uploading tons of content from old sources. - Omegatron 18:42, May 15, 2005 (UTC)
I never understood how the search box regards capitalization. But it seems problems like this can easily be created: Cape York meteorite Cape York Meteorite (leaving up temp for illustration)
Lotsofissues 16:35, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
I know, it's really annoying, and then whenever you make a new article, you have to create a lot of redirects. -- Munchkinguy 18:54, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
What's worse is the case sensitive linking. Cape York meteorite, cape york meteorite, and Cape York Meteorite all link to different articles.
That's just dumb. And we have to make numerous redirects to deal with this deficiency. Links should simply not be case sensitive. It the extremely few cases where capitalization is an actual naming distinction then the different articles should be distinguished by additional words in the title--which makes more sense anyway. The software needs to be fixed.
And spare me the "it's so hard" details of "Hacking in a proper case insensitive, case preserving system is possible but will require some database restructuring and various low-level work for relatively minor benefit."
Here's an easy solution: You just parse the links to upper case and parse the titles to upper case. It doesn't matter how they're stored.
You may be able to BS the non-programmers, but you can't BS me. Mr. Brion Vibber, if you want my respect, stop talking about how hard everything is and start thinking about ways to make things work.
And yes I'm familiar with database restructuring. Databases structures are mutable, if you know how to change them. I have a friend who redesigns databases for a living. That's a bit harder then a simple interface hack, but really nothing that isn't done all the time. The hardest part of changing a database is understanding everything and figuring out how to redesign it. Some queries may need to be rewritten, but once you understand RDBMs and know SQL, the process is usually fairly straightforward.
- Pioneer-12 10:48, 6 May 2005 (UTC)
where are the humoristic wikipedicians? why didnt they find camelopedia? blue 15:37, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
Perhaps it's because they're too busy editing the Uncyclipedia. -- Munchkinguy 22:20, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
I know that this isn't the right place to put this comment, but I can't think where else it will get seen. The thing is, the above ship, although alledgedly operational, isn't on the official list of ships So...? Thanks,--> Energy ( talk) 15:31, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
"Evening Herald (Plymouth)
May 2, 2005
Bulwark is welcomed into service
The Royal Navy's newest vessel, HMS Bulwark, has been commissioned at a special ceremony in Devonport. The Plymouth-based amphibious assault ship was officially welcomed into the fleet in front of 1,200 invited guests."
OK, fair enough!--> Energy ( talk) 07:24, 5 May 2005 (UTC)
Hi. As it was expected, the proximity of the world release of the latest Star Wars movie has triggered an editing frenzy in all articles related to the franchise. My point here concerns a specific category of such articles: those dedicated to the characters in the movies. At this point, most if not all articles on characters have been "equipped" with a "Star Wars character" table that contains some information on the character.
I have nothing against having those boards, and I certainly have no problem with it listing fictional data, but the stuff that goes in there should have some point, if it is to be encyclopedic. So it would be logical to list there the allegiance of the character (is he a good or a bad guy?), who plays him, when was the character introduced, his "lifespan" in the timeline and so on (as it is done). But in the name of all that is galactic, what is the point of listing eye color and hair color?? That's not even concerning the character, but rather the actor who plays him, and it's completely besides the point in the article. AFAIK,
George Lucas doesn't even choose the actors based on eye and hair color — gender, age, and maybe even complexion if he wants to make some sort of point, but never eye color or hair color. Having that sort of thing listed in the tables looks somewhat puerile and unencyclopedic to me. Any thoughts? Regards,
Redux
05:55, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
It's not that it's harmful. The content is not offensive or biased per se. But it's completely pointless, and more importantly, unencyclopedic. I cannot defend a serious encyclopedia that lists hair color and eye color for fictitious movie characters, which are in fact, again, more a reflexion of the actors who have played them in the movies than the characters themselves (Lucas could have just as easily chosen a blonde actor instead of a dark-haired one to play any given character, meaning that hair color or eye color are of no consequence for the understanding of the story line or the character). Plus, the template would not be deleted, just those two lines would be eliminated. There are other pieces of information in it that are useful and pertinent, and if one applies one's mind, it should indeed be possible to come up with new information, this time actually relevant, that could fill the "space" that would be left by the departure of that nonsense. Regards, Redux 19:04, 6 May 2005 (UTC)
Wherever there is profit, Microsoft is there. They may be slow on the draw, but they carry a cannon. Bill Gates, the Lord of Microsoft, is known for his obsessive desire to dominate everything computer related and to reap as much money as possible... by any means possible. It is a game to him. In field after field, Microsoft has sought to get a foothold and a competitive edge. If they can't develop a top notch product from scratch, then they buy one or steal one.
Enter Wikipedia. Once a mere blip on the radar screen, but its profile is growing. How long until Bill "Dollar" Gates looks up some bit of information online and winds up at a Wikipedia page? How long till he says, "This is cool; this is profitable; I want to rule this."
Is there profit in a wiki? Other sites have already copied the GFDL content and used it for ad revenue. It's only a matter of time before M$crosoft realizes that it can do the same. What's worse, is that Microsoft could start a content fork... a content fork that could easily rival or surpass Wikipedia in popularity.
Look at all the stupid problems we have to deal with: unrestrained vandalism; idiotic votes for deletion; buggy, hard to use software. You think these problems are unsolvable? Microsoft doesn't think so.
If Wikipedia is unable to get it's act together--if Wikipedia is unable to get it's childlike tendencies under control... then Microsoft just might rise and show the world a better way to do an wiki encyclopedia. Microsoft just might take Wikipedia to school, and to the cleaners.
Microsoft already has a foothold in the encyclopedia business--remember, they bought Encarta. They can't buy Wikipedia, but they can steal it.
Bill Gates is coming to eat you.
- Pioneer-12 15:25, 3 May 2005 (UTC)
Your comment betrays a stunning lack of understanding of how things works. First, and most important, interia is VERY HARD to overcome. For example, google got where it was not because it was slightly better than yahoo or msn or dogpile, but because it was IMMESNLY better than the competition. To beat Google (or wikipedia), a competitor not only has to be better than us, but has to be an order of magnitude better than us. A simple fork is not going to cut it. Secondly, Raul's first law of wikipedia is that the most important part of wikipedia is the community. Wikipedia has an established community of hardcore, dedicated contributors. Microsoft might have a lot of money, but you can't buy contributors, fans or mindshare - you have to earn it. Microsoft has tried to fake it with astroturfing, and every time they have, they have been caught and look like idiots. Third, would someone spend hours on end fixing things at Encarta, like they do on wikipedia? At least on wikipedia, you know what you're doing is fundementally benefitting the public. The information you submit is safeguarded by a nonprofit company, and reusable by anyone -- altruism at its finest. Why would you edit Encarta? To boost microsoft's bottom line? Well, maybe small edits here and there, but there's no motivation to keep you hooked. No one is going to spend significant amounts of time lining Bill's pockets. →Raul654 16:19, May 3, 2005 (UTC)
Don't feed the trolls. Rick K 21:46, May 3, 2005 (UTC)
In any case, if Microsoft was successful, then they deserve to succeed. If such a thing was effective, then it disproves the wikipedia assumption - that making information free is a good thing. I, for one, would welcome our new overlords. -- Fangz 22:37, 3 May 2005 (UTC)
Ssh! We shouldn't be letting them know we're suspicious. Nickptar 22:58, 3 May 2005 (UTC)
I wish I had a dollar for every time some anti-MS activist on the Internet speculated about something Microsoft "might" do. Don't you people have something better to do with your time? Rhobite 23:05, May 3, 2005 (UTC)
This is not a joke or a troll (though it might seem that way at first); it is not alarmism.
Microsoft,
Yahoo, and
Google all have muscle and track records. The experience of
Netscape is instructive to those willing to learn;
MIE has always been an inferior product, and still is -- but Netscape once had 70% of the market; now MIE has 90%. What happened? And for how long do you suppose the guys at Netscape said, "Naw, can't happen. Isn't happenning. Didn't happen."
I think we probably should worry more about guys like Google; wiki is more their flavor. But it really doesn't matter who eats; eaten is eaten. Hitler is dead; the Bogeyman is fantasy; competition in business is very real. And if you don't think what you're doing is a business, your competitors will show you before they tell you.
You have to dig for the history behind some other little takeovers. Yahoo ate the mailing list server OneGroups, for example; now competitor Topica is almost out of the market. Of course it's a commonplace that Google nearly put Yahoo out of business; but what about all the other search engines? What about the AltaVista spider, or the Open Directory Project? People take comfort from the fact that Redmond hasn't eaten Linux -- yet. It can still happen. My personal theory is that it is not yet ripe.
Wikipedia need not fear Mr. Bill (or is it Mr. Sluggo) yet, either. We need to rise a few ranks before that's realistic. Microsoft does not want to do any work -- they want to take over something more or less full-grown; customizing it to serve their needs is enough of a job.
Don't underestimate just how abrasive this community has become, how hostile toward the newcomer. It's easy to say WikiLove, but she left the building long ago. There are over a quarter million users registered on the en: system, and (depending on your measure) only 8000 were "active" last month; only 23,000 have ever made 10 edits. Right: More than 9 out of 10 users quit before their 10th edit. Elitists crow, but I wonder who we are excluding. It's even worse when you consider that only 1200 editors made over a hundred edits last month; that's a tiny fraction of registered users and only 5% of the users who did stick around. How many made good contributions and were chased away? How many of the 1200 who remain are just nuisances?
I'm trying to do some statistics work, but it's not easy; we never thought to preserve the data properly. I'm hoping to have interesting charts for you all soon. So far, I've seen some very peculiar trends.
The brave say fear no fork -- indeed, welcome the idea. And we are certainly unthreatened by Wikinfo. The error is to assume that Bill or anyone else must play by our rules. They don't have to fork, then try to gather contributors. If they did that, we wouldn't mind, even if they somehow outpaced us. (They can do that, of course; easy enough to find a couple thousand editors when you can afford to spend millions. Besides, They can coast on existing content a long, long time.)
Weird things happen when you have billions of dollars. Ordinary concerns vanish. Overweening arrogance comes to the fore. Legal problems melt away. Yes, Microsoft was in a little trouble there, but nothing like what they had coming. They are certainly not bleeding from their wounds, and MIE -- and Windows -- is still right on top.
I'm sure most of us are confident that GFDL and FSF will protect us, no matter what. I'm not. Law serves money, especially with a Reagan-Bush Supreme Court. We have many legal weaknesses (none of which I am going to point out here), and any of them may be used to turn the tables. It won't be a question of WikiMedia Foundation suing Yahoo for GFDL infringement; it will be us on the defensive against the deep pockets of the aggressor looking to shut us out of his newly-stolen turf. Nor will he lack for allies; every user we chase out of our community is a potential enemy. We scorn threats made by whining vandals, but how long do those threats remain a joke when well bankrolled?
Neither do we have to lose, or even fight, a suit in order to be brought low. There is an entire range of techniques available to the hijacker. If such were ineffective, we'd have more art movie houses than multiplexes; more indie labels than pop trash; more neighborhood cafes than *$. Obviously, the 1/100th of 1% of visitors who stay to edit Wikipedia will not desert us for some Yahoo!Wiki or Woogle -- but the average clueless football-teevee-watching Windozer tire-store-manager with two teen girls will worship something that looks like Wikipedia, but without the "porno", rudeness, and edit wars over proper use of emdash (especially if it comes with a big American flag on each page and a bot that sweeps the database "fixing" British ushazge and references to "French" fries or Michael Moore).
Don't underestimate the points raised in this section. Wikipedia has existed for a long time in a kind of idyllic, Utopian state of orderly anarchy. It is wishful thinking to believe that state can continue indefinitely. There are a lot of players who are very well organized, and we are due to be taught a painful lesson. — Xiong 熊 talk * 19:04, 2005 May 8 (UTC)
(I'm posting portions of my study here, on Wikipedia, in hopes of getting feedback from as many actual Wikipedia users as possible. Please help me to improve this analysis by adding your thoughts here, or by emailing me in confidence.)
Snowspinner has suggested that his pattern of contribution to Wikipedia is similar to that of Wikipedia founder Jimbo Wales's contributions. [1]
In broad terms, Snowspinner is correct.
Total Edits, 1 January 2005 - 15 April 2005 | Edits to the Encyclopedia | Discussion of Articles | Other | |||||||||
Snowspinner | 1513 | 332 | 22% | 258 | 17% | 923 | 61% | |||||
Jimbo Wales | 90 | 7 | 8% | 11 | 12% | 72 | 80% |
But when a detailed breakdown of contributions is examined, there are large dissimmilarites:
Jimbo Wales | Snowspinner | ||||||||||
Edits to Encyclopedia: | 7 | (8%) | 334 | (22%) | |||||||
Articles | 4 | (4.44%) | 320 | (21.05%) | |||||||
Image: | 1 | (1.11%) | 0 | (0%) | |||||||
Template: | 2 | (2.22%) | 7 | (0.46%) | |||||||
Category: | 0 | (0%) | 7 | (0.46%) | |||||||
MediaWiki: | 0 | (0%) | 0 | (0%) | |||||||
Discussion of Articles: | 11 | (12%) | 258 | (17%) | |||||||
Talk: | 10 | (11.11%) | 109 | (7.17%) | |||||||
Image talk: | 1 | (1.11%) | 0 | (0%) | |||||||
Template talk: | 0 | (0%) | 5 | (0.33%) | |||||||
Category talk: | 0 | (0%) | 3 | (0.2%) | |||||||
MediaWiki talk: | 0 | (0%) | 0 | (0%) | |||||||
Votes for deletion: | 0 | (0%) | 60 | (3.95%) | |||||||
Votes for undeletion: | 0 | (0%) | 32 | (2.11%) | |||||||
Templates for deletion: | 0 | (0%) | 49 | (3.22%) | |||||||
Other: | 72 | (80%) | 928 | (61%) | |||||||
Wikipedia: | 10 | (11.11%) | 426 | (28.03%) | |||||||
Wikipedia talk: | 1 | (1.11%) | 232 | (15.26%) | |||||||
User: | 2 | (2.22%) | 69 | (4.54%) | |||||||
User talk: | 59 | (65.56%) | 201 | (13.22%) |
While both Snowspinner and Jimbo Wales make most of their edits to non-article namespaces, it's readily apparent that Wales spends most of his time (a full 65%) in User_talk, talking to other users; Snowspinner spends most of his time in Wikipedia, and most of that on Arbitration pages.
Also of note is the time spent discussing articles: while Wales makes few edits, he spends about over ten percent of his time in Article Talk discussing with other users what should be in articles; Snowspinner spends more time in the more contentious arenas of Deletion voting than in (possibly) non-adversarial Talk.
While Wales spends only a little more than one percent of his time in Wikipedia_talk, much of which involves discussion of policy, Snowspinner devotes over fifteen percent of his time to this.
(While Snowspinner spends, proportionally, twice the time in the User namespace as Wales, the difference isn't actually as great as it first appears, as it's primarily the result of Snowspinner compiling evidence, within his own user-subpages, for future Arbitration cases; this should be appreciated when looking at these numbers.)
Much of the proportional differences noted can no doubt be accounted for rather simply: Jimbo Wales and Snowspinner have very different roles on Wikipedia. Wales directs the Foundation, and as such plays a role of mediator, cajoler, conciliator and consensus-builder: he works primarily to build up Wikipedia, to iron out differences and to bring users together.
Snowspinner's role on Wikipedia is more adversarial, given that he works closely with the Arbitration Committee, at that Committee's request [2] [3] [4] in his role as "Public Prosecutor". (Snowspinner established what he calls the "District Attorney's Office", but as Wikipedia doesn't have districts, the title "Public Prosecutor" or "Attorney General" is perhaps more accurate.) To do that job, Snowspinner must necessarily spend his time seeking out evidence of wrong-doing, compiling evidence against wrong-doers, and bringing them to justice.
Snowspinner additionally contributes to Wikipedia as an enforcer of policy (e.g., 72 edits to Administrators' Noticeboard) and as to a lesser degree as a formulator of policy (44 edits in Wikipedia, 23 in Wikipeda_talk).
When the details are taken in account, then, Snowspinner's pattern of edits is only in a very superficial way similar to Jimbo Wales's. This reflects their very different roles on Wikipedia: Wales nurtures the Encyclopedia and the Foundation as a whole; while Snowspinner polices and prosecutes individual editors who get out of line, and formulates policy to keep them in line.
Of course, this is only a preliminary analysis of statistics by an outsider, and I'm sure it can be improved by experienced Wikipedia users. Please contribute your thoughts here, or in confidence to:
-- rrcaballo AY yahoo.com
I hope this is the correct place to discuss this. First off, I did bring this issue up on the article's talk page, but no one responded (I suspect very few people watch the article).
A while ago, I rewrote the stub for extended warranty. I actually got high praise for it. :-) In my research, I discovered that most consumer advocate groups discourage the purchasing of extended warranties, and I included that information in the article. About a week ago, an almost-anonymous user ( El Grego--one of his two contributions to the 'pedia) came along and rewrote the entire article. What was, in my opinion, a balanced and NPOV article was turned into a long-winded rant on how extended warranties are a Good Thing, in direct opposition to what all the sources I could find stated. He then stated that "a few" consumer advaocate groups advise against purchasing extended warranties (when it is actually most). On the whole, it is a very POV rewrite. Compare this version to the current version. I think it should be reverted to my last version, just because the new rewrite is so POV, but I didn't want to do it without some feedback from other users. Any input? Thanks. — Frecklefoot | Talk 16:11, May 2, 2005 (UTC)
Template:Medical is a disclaimer which states "Please Note:Wikipedia does not give medical advice. Wikipedia and Wikimedia will not be held responsible for the consequences resulting from any medical-related content." From a legal standpoint the disclaimer is probably unnecessary. Anyway, it's already part of the general disclaimer. I'm tempted to just TfD it but I wanted some opinions first. According to User:Yamato Kenichi, this disclaimer is on every medical page in the Chinese and Japanese Wikipedias. Rhobite 03:03, Apr 24, 2005 (UTC)
A good idea. Perhaps there is a better place to suggust this?-- ^~^Morgan^~^ 00:51, 8 May 2005 (UTC)
Has anyone seen the Hebrew Wikipedia? Very pretty, isn't it? -- Munchkinguy 18:47, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)
A novel front-end for Wikipedia has been invented at: http://blog.outer-court.com/wikitrivia/ where they pick a random article, blank out the subject and challenge you to guess the subject. It's actually quite well done. Perhaps WikiMedia can host something similar as an alternate revenue generator. Samw 03:02, 28 May 2005 (UTC)
What is a succession box?
for example
{{
succession box two to one}}
Spencer Karter big_bubba_1985@yahoo.com
This has come up before, but I really don't feel WP:VIP's current alarts section is working. It's a hassle (relatively speaking) to add someone to it, and more often than not, admin intervention doesn't happen or happens much too late. The problem has been discussed on Wikipedia talk:Vandalism in progress, but I think we may need a separate, much simpler "flag this user for admin attention" system. The best I can come up with is having a page with just {{User|…}} entries, without any discussion. Anybody can add a user entry, and admins can come along and open the contribs, check if they agree the problem warrants adin intervention and do so, or decide to leave it (or just warn again). Whatever the result, the entry is then removed. This way, admins can always easily tell if there's work to be done and if a few around the globe put it on their watchlist, life on RC patrol will be made a lot easier for non-admins. (As I said, this would need to be kept simple to work: no discussions, if someone disagrees with the response there's always WP:VIP, WP:VP, and WP:AN)
Does that sound like a good idea to anyone? -- W( t) 18:06, 2005 May 26 (UTC)
There are currently dozens, possibly hundreds of articles listed at Wikipedia:Transwiki_log that have been transwikied but not yet taken care here (deleted, redirected, merged, etc.) Please, I need your help getting this issue dealt with. As said before, there are an enormous number of articles that need to be dealt with. →Iñgōlemo← talk 04:37, 2005 May 26 (UTC)
I seem to be logged out every time I try to edit a page. The "Remember me" box is checked, cookies are all properly enabled, firewall adjusted, etc. The browser remembers my username but not my login. This happens with IE, Opera, and even Lynx.. Even on others' computers. Very very annoying. Any ideas? Posted elsewhere too but no help. Signed, (you'll just have to take my word on this) -Mashford
Who is the "Javascript vandal" referred to on Recent Changes? Willy-on-wheels? I haven't heard him/her referred to as that before. func (talk) 02:14, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
The servers should escape all potentially dangerous executable code users enter before dissemination. Allowing this to happen in the first place is as stupid as MicroSoft.Com shipping an email-client which executes virii. ¡Wait a minute! ;-) This is a security issue. Luckily, yours truly always surfs with JavaScript disabled, as all should do.
--
— Ŭalabio 23:28, 2005 May 25 (UTC)
The article is currently at Qur'an, and all of the article refers to it as such. But, under Wikipedia policy of using the version most commonly known by English speakers, shouldn't it be at Koran? Rick K 23:43, May 24, 2005 (UTC)
what about Quran? That's increasingly frequent in English. qur'an is the technical transliteration, and should indeed not be used in titles per our policy (otherwise, we should have Śiva instead of Shiva). dab (ᛏ) 12:28, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
Parallel case: Byzantine Empire is very far from being the "most accurate", but since it is the "most common" usage in English, the article is titled Byzantine Empire. And User:Adam Bishop will defend that title "over his dead body". Decius 13:41, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
The title should be Qur'an. Decius 13:45, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
At one time Koran was by far the most common spelling. But very steadily over the past decade or so, Quran (and its variant Qur'an) have become more and more popular. The difference is no longer that great. So due to that, along with objections many Muslims have over the Koran spelling, I think moving the article to that title would not be a good idea. In short, Quran is a widely-used and recognized alternate that is valid for us to use due to problems with the Koran spelling. This would fall under the 'don't overdue it' clause of our common names naming convention. -- mav 23:43, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
I WAS MARRIED IN LAS VEGAS AND NEED TO GET A COPY OF MY MARRIAGE LICENCE AND WHAT IS THE COST TO SEND FOR IT?
What's the most frequently updated article meter?
Lotsofissues 00:42, 22 May 2005 (UTC)
I see a tendency to have information about multiple companies in a single article. This seems to be very confusing because most of what is written about is not even for the company the page is about. I have been moving material into the real companies article, defunct or not, as I find this. It's not easy work. It also can leave the parent article with very little since in some cases it really contained nothing at all about the article title. If you also consider that redrects from the correctly named page go to wrong titles, it adds to the confusion. If you then try to clean up the redirects after a move, you find out how many other articles are missing and were wiki linked to the wrong article. It's frustrating at times and I wonder how many people are actually fixing problems like this when they find them. Vegaswikian
I note with interest the inclusion of Joey Archibald and Pete Latzo under the heading of Italian American boxers. I would indeed be grateful if anybody has source material to indicate that they have Italian ancestry. My own research informs me that Latzo is of slavic origin and Archibald is of Irish/English background. If anyone has further info about this subject it would be appreciated.
I note with interest the inclusion of Joey Archibald and Pete Latzo under the heading of Italian American boxers. I would indeed be grateful if anybody has source material to indicate that they have Italian ancestry. My own research informs me that Latzo is of slavic origin and Archibald is of Irish/English background. If anyone has further info about this subject it would be appreciated.
Is there a page that solely enumerates praiseful quotes by the media about Wikipedia? If not I might as well put my research to good use. Also I find the press coverage uneven in accuracy, so how about a summary fact sheet with supporting links containing the most commonly needed facts a reporter discussing Wikipedia would want? I can do this - I assume it doesn't presently exist?
Lotsofissues 11:20, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
http://www.macon.com/mld/inquirer/business/11648267.htm Here's another of the many stories on the veracity of Wikipedia. They always have to have quotes from Britannica, Colliers, and other "legit" encyclopedias. Spalding 22:33, May 19, 2005 (UTC)
Thanks, I've informed badger. I have been very closely monitoring how the press renders Wikipedia. This is the first time Scholastic, the publisher of Grolier (Americana is defunct), has joined the fray. And you know what? We don't care! If those editors had decided to speak out two years ago, we might have been riled up. But the comparison between Wikipedia and that moribund electronic file cabinet is too stark to feel threatened over. Cheers for Wikiannihilation!
Lotsofissues 23:48, 19 May 2005 (UTC)
From a May 17th stubby article about Wikipedia in the Times:
"Critics suggest that without any sort of process in place to ensure the quality of contributions, 'any particular page might be rubbish at the moment you happen to look at it'."
The quote from a "critic" was actually spoken by Jimbo (THES, May 13)
Lotsofissues 10:31, 19 May 2005 (UTC)
I've had an ongoing struggle at Armenian_people#Persecution_in_the_Ottoman_Empire with an editor or editors who keep claiming that the Armenian Genocide is only "alleged" and implying that only Armenians believe it occurred. It should be needless to say that nothing could be farther from the truth, and that only (some) Turks deny that it occurred. Other than historical accuracy, I don't have a horse in this race: I am neither Armenian nor Turkish, and don't have any strong feelings either way about either ethnicity. However, this has been a more-than-weekly issue, and I am about to be largely unavailable to Wikipedia for several weeks. I would greatly appreciate if someone else would keep an eye on the article; I'd also greatly appreciate that, in the unlikely event that anyone actually has citations against this generally accepted understanding of history, that they take it up in Talk:Armenian Genocide, rather than by dubious edits to a related article. -- Jmabel | Talk 01:04, May 19, 2005 (UTC)
Has anyone heard when the newest edition of "While Reason Sleeps" will be released? It's audiodrama, produced by Lion's Den Studio in Richmond, Va.
Thanks!
Just trying to draw some attention to a little debate that's been going on because someone moved the article Gasoline to Petrol. See Talk:Petrol#Article_name.
I think gasoline is obviously more neutral, being the chemical name for the substance, but hey, maybe it's my cultural imperialistic american superiority nationalistic agenda getting in the way of my neutrality... *rolls eyes* - Omegatron 14:17, May 18, 2005 (UTC)
Please keep discussion on the talk page.
I was bold and moved the discussion to the talk page - Omegatron 20:49, May 18, 2005 (UTC)
Dear Wikipedians,
We cordially invite you to answer a short questionnaire which is a part of a non-commercial cross-cultural research project conducted at INFOSOC [5] (The Center for the Study of the Information Society), exploring Wikipedia community aspects.
The findings of this study will be published in Wikipedia to the benefit of everyone, personal copies will be also available via e-mail.
Click here for the questionnaire: [6]
Thank you in advance.
Research Team, INFOSOC
hello,
This is my first hour as a user. So if I make any mistakes, please excuse me.
I will try to stay brief. I am a professional playwright who is beginning to do some research on scientific subjects. [I am not a scientist.] At the moment I'm exploring the life of Margret Cavendish, an English scientist/philosopher of science from the mid-17th century and probably the first female member of the Royal Academy of Science in England. A play obviously deals with a dramatic moment in someone's life or in society as a whole.
Would anyone familiar with Margret Cavendish, or the Royal Academy in the 17th century please suggest a starting point or an interesting perspective that I might explore? Any directions on further research would also be appreciated. Your help would be most satisfying.
As a courtesy, I should say that research gathered will be used to write a play, which I would intend to copyright. If I have transgressed here, I would appreciate being told so.
Most cordially, Bob
When I upload album covers, I upload biggest and highest quality covers I could find. Could uploading gigantic pictures {eg. Renegades) potentially go out of the fair use policy? Album covers will not damage them, rather it will advertise them, but it doesn't seem to fit the size policy. pmam21 talk articles 00:00, May 17, 2005 (UTC)
"We do not pretend that the Britnnica is immune to error" — Robert McHenry
Lotsofissues 20:30, 15 May 2005 (UTC)
I updated Independent Schools Association of the Southwest with the school Episcopal School of Dallas and although the history says that I updated the page, the page itself is not updated. Why is this?-- Howard547 02:16, 15 May 2005 (UTC)
Help! Lately, while I am in Wikipedia, the first few pages I visit appear to behave correctly, but then after a while, the page I try to visit starts to misbehave. What is the problem with Wikipedia at this moment?? Georgia guy 22:47, 9 May 2005 (UTC)
Try banging the computer. Hitting it hard on the side. This used to work with television in the good old days.-- Jondel 09:12, 19 May 2005 (UTC)
It takes me a long time to type out the code for entering the user name. Is there some way I can automatically sign my user name or make it faster? - Stancel 20:37, 5 May 2005 (UTC)
I'm seeing someone else who doesn't know. Talk:Harmonics_Theory#Pseudoscience.3F__Vanity.3F This should not happen. - Omegatron 14:59, May 18, 2005 (UTC)
Can you imagine how much better off we would be? Lotsofissues 23:29, 8 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I'm under 20 and male and don't consider myself an asshole. — Ilγαηερ (Tαlκ) 03:01, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I'm over 20 and consider myself an asshole Dan100 16:40, Apr 10, 2005 (UTC)
I completely agree. We need to eliminate our competition for the few pre-pubescent girls that edit. -- SPUI ( talk) 01:55, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
To complete the sentence: "......then we would run into severe problems with the Geneva Convention ("Exterminate"), if not to say the Gender-Equality laws("Males"), if not Age-Equality laws("20").... and who the HELL would solve all the technical problems? Wikipedia'd all wither away on the "old generation" with no fresh blood at all to reincarnate the loss of oldies on pension all falling as flies, fer sure!"-- OleMurder 19:56, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Let us consider the implications if all males under 20 year olds were exterminated from the site. Before we begin hypothesizing, we must first consider these corallories:
We can then conclude that:
This would have stunning effects on the entire world, but the pornography industry would ignore the method, even though it would conclusively solve the problem of minors accessing their content.
As Wikipedia progresses on without these male under twenty year olds, two long debated theories are proven:
Outcries against this bias will result in all females under twenty years old from being banned, so that the second statement can be amended to:
The world does not change. If the world does not change, Wikipedia cannot change. If Wikipedia cannot change, Wikipedia will die. QED: Banning under twenty year old males will prove disastrous for Wikipedia. :) (PS, I am under twenty years old and male and just wasted fifteen minutes typing this) Ambush Commander 21:17, May 3, 2005 (UTC)
How sexist and ageist of you. Hedley 16:09, 7 May 2005 (UTC)
I do not concur with this. Mga 17:06, 15 May 2005 (UTC) (15)
Let us ban all males under 20 from Wikipedia and welcome the return of Hitler. Kaschner 11:23, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
I want to know if there are any comments any Wikipedian has about including a message about sockpuppet user names at Template talk:Anon. Within the past few days, I have wrote welcome messages on several anonymous Wikipedians, adding to them the warning not to use a sockpuppet. Any comments anyone has?? Georgia guy 01:38, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
Sockpuppets rule!-- OleMurder 21:52, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
I compare often the English and German articles and I notice quite often discrepancies between them. I will from now on give every German and English article with a discrepancy factual accuracy warnings. I would appreciate help in this project and may be we could do this systematically. Until now I do this at random. Help in other languages (e.g with the "big" Wikipedia's French and Japanese) is also welcome. Andries 19:26, 16 May 2005 (UTC)
START SHIFT:W1AL BEGIN TRANSMISSION >> (1BL)J úómíäp ßffrf (1RBR)ßu Qxjtíx pëE A EäjQ ltçZS (AS)ëp btçüYjOZí. (CS)qï'Y (12OL)YZç ëAfrjçQ QE AHmO äQcjíçí óS (CC)the sheet of paper. Surely, we can do it? << END TRANSMISSION
Dobermann (woof)]] 12:53, 24 May 2005 (UTC)
START SHIFT:W1AR BEGIN TRANSMISSION >> qpéQkßg, pn'n çD(RV)ig pQgc gY ípúYYëbxú H mjHH çminW (1O12R) níüuVAVäíï YíbjúÁÁ ëägßgpcÁi. vYgiïß nc jbëSQZYr ptEjx ßfu nüum? vjybWÁ, Sü OrDO DcgkZZ gui çinQcp ïb zßtrt'p ZWrx; rç AQ cüE nxf çj äQmA, äZÁäöjs: >>> LAUNCH [7] <<< (CC) Please reply soon. Thank you. << END TRANSMISSION
Dobermann (woof) 10:54, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
START SHIFT:W1AL BEGIN TRANSMISSION >> äptWOHnVKA@(RS)b-ßOüxV.(RS)ró << END TRANSMISSION
I suspect that they're using the village pump to send encrypted/garbled submissions. Multiple benefits of not being easily deletable (they'd just reference the history). Okay, please stop. Ambush Commander 23:02, May 25, 2005 (UTC)
IMPORTANT!!! Begin assault tomorrow, May 28, I have the programs and will send them to you immediately. First, stun users, then carry out second stage. It should be easy, provided you have the new (modified) Javascript programs courtesy of User:Lupo and yours truly. ;) Wikipedia, prepare for a devastating attack while you have the time! Remember, guys, code names should be used. Monitoring through the live RC feed. Comm link through Yahoo Messenger. There, Wikipedians, I've given you enough leads. Let's get down to business! 84.154.125.117 21:13, 27 May 2005 (UTC)
† If this still leaves you totally mystified, see I'm Sorry I Haven't A Clue†† and Mornington Crescent.
†† which leaves everybody totally mystified.
Both Beagle and Praetor are down. Complaining about code malfunctions. Postpone assault for 7 days. Kaschner 15:07, 28 May 2005 (UTC)
I wrote a little tome here about some recent raw experiences in the weblog article. I don't declare myself an angel in the recent fray there (or even in some other disagreements), but it is disheartening when the other players, as a large degree of their arguments, use terms of personal destruction, while I strived to not do that. Does anyone have any ideas of what can be done when such personal attacks like this occur in the place of argumentation? — Stevie is the man! Talk | Work 03:47, Jun 14, 2005 (UTC)
Wikicities is not a WikiMedia project. It's an external project based on Wikipedia, run by Wikia.
To explore the possibility of building a Wikicity for London, I've started a miniwiki. Please feel free to play around if you're interested. Use it as a sandbox.
After the village pump image was added to each subsection, the header didn't work very well and had the right-hand border missing. I've revamped the template and any comments, criticism or changes would be appreciated. violet/riga (t) 19:23, 12 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Last night I looked into a user whom coolcaesar RVed, and discovered a long string of self aggrandizing POV. Kmccoy took the task further, and has so far discovered 16 IPs associated with Delfino. There are more likely to be found, and the total number of nonsense edits will likely rise into the hundreds. Most of these edits have remained for weeks. This is a serious junk/spam/vanity problem that needs to be squashed immediately. Please join us at the hub of activity at Kmccoy's subpage: User:Kmccoy/Delfino
lots of issues | leave me a message 10:41, 12 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I must commend Kmccoy for a fine job. His patience and methodism is more astounding than the scope of vandalism.
lots of issues | leave me a message 08:07, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Does this type of article count as vanity? 24.54.208.177 03:13, 12 Jun 2005 (UTC)
[8] This page links to the Wikipedia article on the UK! Great, eh?-- 212.100.250.217 16:24, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I wanted to write about this here so that as many people as possible would know about this absurd. Another user and myself (mainly) have been involved for quite a while in containing daily vandalism in this article. The article itself was never being improved, and all we did was revert attacks from IP addresses that we believe belong to the same person. After some time at it, we finally requested that the article be blocked at the proper forum (request for protection). BrokenSegue, an Admin (obviously), quickly did it (it was a flagrant case of constant vandalism), and, quite diligently I might add, added the article to his Watchlist, taking an active interest in solving the problem.
With the article blocked, we had finally contained the daily attacks. The anon, however, is likely to be a kid and a diehard fan of the subjects of the article — given who said subjects are — and so, instead of moving on, the anon started talking in the talk page, and even though he was giving ultimatums and so on, we thought that we were making some progress, maybe even starting to "convert an active vandal", something very rare. We had even set up a Temp page copying the article for him to express his views. He had shown no interest in it though, but we still had hopes.
Then, out of the blue, this other Admin simply came and unblocked the page. No comments on the talk page, no specific edit summary. Nothing. He simply unblocked the page because he felt like it (and that's the best explanation I could come up with). Result: in less than 24 hours, already three different users (myself included) have had to revert attacks from that same anon. I've asked BrokenSegue to block the page again, but he appears to be offline for the time being, and so in the meantime we just have to keep reverting vandalism every couple of hours again, all because of someone's inconsequence.
I have to say that my faith in the diligence of the Admins has been shaken. I mean, in order to become an Admin, one must be approved by the Admin community. And how does someone like that become an Admin? And what this kind of attitude says about the Admins in general? I'm not saying that all Admins are like this guy, but I used to think that Admins were all well balanced people, who are supposed to help in harder-than-usual issues. Not any more. I still have high praises for the Admins I've worked with (BrokenSegue, Jmabel, and others), but I now believe that there are rotten apples in the Admin basket. Regretable... Regards, Redux 02:51, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)
The question as to when to unblock a page that needed to be blocked has to be decided on a case-by-case basis. When the request was made to block the page, we already knew that a few days would not have sufficed to get this person to either start talking seriously or move on. And there it is now, in the article's history, the cabal proof: the anon immediately started vandalising the page again. As I have also said before in regards to this particular issue, blocking the page for a few days is effective to resolve a revert war between registered users or any users that have shown any disposition to discuss, but have somehow lost patience or their temper. It's quite different when you're dealing with an anon that has regularly ignored requests to talk and discontinue his line of action. He started talking when the page was blocked, but only to say: "this is that is wrong and I expect to see it changed immediately". It was obvious that a couple of days would not get this person to move on. If Snow had taken the time to see what it was that he was walking into, I believe (I have to) he would not have done it, or else there's no hope of resolving this. There is proof: as soon as Snow unblocked the page "almost five days after the initial protection" the anon immediately resumed his edits, and already three different users have reverted him. And it will go on and on, until the page is protected again, and we can either get him to start talking and work with the community, maybe compromise, or move on. Did you check Snow's talk page, to see how someone had already complained about his unprotecting pages that should not have been unprotected yet? I'm sorry, but Snow messed up in this case. I've been spending sometime to try and keep that article from becoming everything but encyclopedic. For most of the time, it was basically keeping gossip, fandom stuff and immaginary "data" from being added, but since this anon came along, it's become something else: he vandalises the article several times a day, and it's becoming unworkable. If I unwatch the article, the obssessed fan gets his way and starts shaping the article as he sees fit. Others will soon follow suit. How encyclopedic you think that's going to be in a while?
And I've been using the </br> simply because I do it faster with it. Regards,
Redux 04:17, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)
And if you want to avoid admins unprotecting too soon a note on WP:AN/I might stop it from happening too. Mgm| (talk) 12:09, Jun 10, 2005 (UTC)
This is clearly a content dispute, not vandalism. I am changing the template accordingly and caution redux against his prolix use of the word prolix. --
Tony Sidaway|
Talk 15:12, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)
By the way, I think Redux and I have mostly cleared this up on our talk pages (with an assist from Rick Block). Although if anyone would still like to add to the discussion regarding better ways to handle protection/unprotection of pages, they're welcome to. -- Michael Snow 04:32, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Don't you think you are exaggerating a little? Well, actually a lot. I will not entertain this pointless discussion which is not the point of all of this. No offense, but you need to get over yourself a little. Does anyone care to contribute to the actual topic of discussion? Redux 18:03, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)
1) Where and 2) how to develop a sketch for a draft for a wikipedia entry.
Please let me know of any hints, tips or pointers that would apply to developing a sketch for a draft for an entry about a phenomenon going on at doctors' offices and clinics.
If you would, please consider and contribute to a sketch for a draft for an entry about a strategy for reducing sexually transmitted infections cases. The phenomenon of potential sex partners coming in to clinics or visit their doctors saying we haven't had sex yet and want to know our sexually transmitted disease status. A strategy of let's get tested together before we have sex... for sexually transmitted infections. On any given day two people can meet and want to have sex. You can get tested together for a number of sexually transmitted infections before you have sex.
blogs, links
http://NotB4WeKnow.EditThisPage.com
http://NotB4WeKnow.blog-city.com
a.
For example, where around this wiki or any wiki or anywhere would be the best place to develop a sketch for a draft for an wikipedia entry with other collaborators?...
b.
How do you attempt to get more support from the inclusionists?... and deal more effectively with the deletists activities?
oo-- dWs dsaklad@zurich.csail.mit.edu 06:44, 9 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Thank you !
c.
Would the responses conflict?... at
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Votes_for_undeletion#History_only_undeletion
or at
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Votes_for_undeletion#Not_b4_we_know_2
I began at
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Not_b4_we_know&action=edit
Then with no remark no reason got tagged for the speedy delete. Then with no remark no reason deleted offering no opportunity to recompose a sketch for a draft for a wikipedia entry.
With no remark no reason got deleted after trying
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Wikipedia:Requested_articles/Applied_arts_and_sciences&diff=14890440&oldid=14879386 With no remark no reason got deleted after trying
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Template_talk:Not_before_we_know-stub&action=edit
d.
Suggestion.
Outline the protocol ever more clearly including better opportunities to recompose, to backtrack. A hint, tip or pointer offered before tagging the speedy delete. A hint, tip or pointer offered before the deletion.
e.
How would we make the process ever more clear for the next contributors?...
oo-- dWs
dsaklad@zurich.csail.mit.edu 11:55, 9 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Let's not put a limit to imagination! A protocol known to a regular might not be completely clear to a neophyte. oo-- dWs dsaklad@zurich.csail.mit.edu 07:09, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Hello--Sorry if this is in the wrong place. I tried to make an edit in the Katherine [sic] Drexel article, correcting the spelling to Katharine, but couldn't figure out how to correct it in the title. I'm not terribly interested in adding things or changing things in general, and am just grateful to have Wikipedia available for quick reference on-line, but I did want to correct the name. Sharon 206.224.83.155 02:31, 9 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I want to know if any Wikipedian has any opinions about whether it is okay to have the sandbox heading mentioned twice in the sandbox. I remember a few times when this happened. Georgia guy 23:49, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Not sure where to report this. The main www.wikimedia.org page uses http://www.wikipedia.org/upload/wiki.png as the link to wikipedia, which does not exist. — PhilHibbs | talk 09:12, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I shouldn't put the entire blame on Wikipedia, but because of its policy of letting anyone edit the information, readers are being mislead. I had to write an essay for one of my courses, and after reading some of the disgusting things that people wrote, I know that one site that can not be trusted for true information is this one. Just to let you know, people are taking wrong advantage of Wikipedia's policies, and filling it with garbage, by cutting out important facts in history. DO NOT USE WIKIPEDIA.
I praise you for Wikipedia. Tho I do not know what wikipedia stands for. Excellent encyclopedia. My passions are Philosophy&Psychology. I love the hyperlinks to other related information in the general area.Well done. I am sold. It is now my only reference to dictionary,encyclopedia and all knowledge concerneing the English language. Thank you. Sincerely Yours,
P.L. James.
I have been in a perpetual edit war with User:Rspeer. We need some mediation or there is no end in sight for this trouble. He has repeatedly falsely accused me of a number of things. Is there some help for this?-- Fahrenheit451 21:12, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I'd be happy to accept mediation; in fact, I requested it before, but withdrew it when the situation seemed to improve and I hadn't gotten a response from a mediator. I get the idea that mediation is fairly defunct right now, which is sad.
As for the particular conflict that likely provoked this comment (on Talk:Strategic nomination), it seems to have settled. If there is something like mediation still in existence, though, it may help us coexist in the future.
F451 didn't notify me of this request, by the way.
RSpeer 20:51, Jun 10, 2005 (UTC)
I would be willing to write appeals for charity. Anyone think the effort is worth it?
lots of issues | leave me a message 20:26, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I think it is important to have a page for just plain discussion. I mean, most of us don't know each other off of this site! At least I don't. Their should be a page for just plain communication. And (don't kill me you guys, I know this isn't exactlly supposed to be a fan page), you should be able to talk about more than just adding [to] and subtracting [from] the artical. Please take it into consitteration make two talk pages: an "artical quality" talk page and a "fan base" talk page. Thank you. -- Wack'd About Wiki 20:18, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Please read very slowly and carefully:
About 1/50 of the time, there is something I accidentally do when I type a Wikipedia page in the URL that makes it so that when I visit the page in the future, a W from Wikipedia instead of an e from Internet Explorer appears before the URL in the Address box. Any way to undo that so that when I visit it again, the e that I should see instead is seen?? Georgia guy 19:34, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I like the idea of a place where people can share their expertise & knowledge but I fear that some people may use it to propogate their version of truth.
I say that I have delusions of literacy in that, so far, I am an unpublished author though i have hopes that one day I will be published and be able to retire and concentrate on my keyboard.
My stories tend to be in the Sci-Fi/Fantasy genre but are based on various folk legends. In writing these I would like my underlying source material to be accurate so try to use the netto find information.
In a current project I wished to use Nanabozho as one of my characters but ran up against problems. Longfellow portrays him,(AKA Hiawatha)as messaniaic figure as do some other web sources, others give a different picture of him, in one case as one of the sons of Mudjekeewis, (the West Wind), he is mostly harmful, in other places he becomes a Creator God. Once you balance all these things out and treat him as a trickster,(perhaps equitable with Brer Rabbit), a balance is possible. However there are people who prefer one aspect and may offer that as definative.
Then you have the New Agers of various ilks and while I would not question their right to hold certain beliefs, (perhaps they really have been granted a revelation), they could move their concepts into the mainstream. The concepts of modern pagans may be suspect as the early church ensured that no record of the original Norse practices remained so they are fabricating their own. A similar thing seems to be happening based on Native American spirituality.
-- 212.32.113.130 15:51, 5 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Truth. -- W( t) 10:59, 2005 Jun 5 (UTC)
So far I've started a couple of stubs. What is the etiquette around here. I guess I'm just saying... hey! and... that this places is very interesting especially as far as navigation goes. 67.190.102.28 did not sign off)
I'm writing an article dealing with UN peacekeepers. I am just wondering: what is the copyright status of images from the UN website (that are taken by UN workers). Are they PD, or how do we go about using UN images? Thanks. -- Dmcdevit 05:41, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I've been looking for this info for a while and I haven't figured a way to get it. Is there any easy way? -- Barfooz (talk) 05:59, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)
A related question - I've noticed several times on Rfa that someone has posted a detailed break-down of edits by talk page, article page, wiki-space, etc... how do you get that info? Grutness... wha? 10:38, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)
To expand on Cyrius's point - it's fine to determine your edit count out of idle curiousity, or to figure out where you might be in relation to whatever you might consider significant milestones (have I made my 1024th edit?), but editing for the sake of making the edit counter go up is not. It's not a contest. There is no prize. This is not to say minor corrections are not welcome. If you enjoy fixing other people's typos please do so. However, please don't make a single change with 5 edits just to increase your edit count. -- Rick Block ( talk) 15:53, Jun 2, 2005 (UTC)
I'm not sure if there is an established proceedure for this. I thought I would check to see if folks are aware of http://www.mathdaily.com They have copied a substantial section of the wikipedia for their own site (I noticed this because their entry on the Ultimatum game is identical). However, there is no reference to wikipedia and the pages contain a copyright notice (attributing the page to mathdaily.com). I assume there is some standard way to deal with this, but I thought that since it is so extensive it might warrent an organized response. Also, if people are already handling this, I didn't want to step on anyone's toes. Thanks! - Kzollman 23:15, Jun 1, 2005 (UTC)
The translation de:Szkieletor is proposed for the deletion - the article is short and bad, the building that has never been build not importand enough. What do you think - should Szkieletor be proposed for deletion here (in the en:WP) or not? AN 16:23, 1 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Some anon was really happy with the wiki, so created the following message at Thanks,
Thanks for checking this Wiki Guys! I've made this page so that you would actually read it. I don't want to make your jobs harder, so just go on and delete this, but I want to say wow. Wow to all the work that you've done with this. Wow for cheching all of the international articles you get and filtering out the bad ones. Very cool! keep up the good work!
Don't you love this community? R adiant _* 14:36, Jun 1, 2005 (UTC)
the german wikipedia is nominated for the Grimme Online Award and we go win with your help. vote here (last entry) it's very simple to vote: click on the circle left to Wikipedia - Die freie Enzyklopädie, then the button vote >>> and then Ja!. the rest isn't necessary, cause it's just a competition so please help the german 'pedia Schaengel89 @me 12:06, 1 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I would like to inform all wikipedians concerning the proposed changes on Zanskar after encountering vandalism from User:Mel Etitis, who had always reverted my edits by stating that they are mostly bad (usually at the expense of the good ones, study the history carefully [9].) My edits on this article include resectioning, content restructuring and minor grammatical amendments which I feel that this article greatly needed it.
There is no need to put such a windy description on the thumbed images. Such windy descriptions, however, should be shifted to the image article itself.
Zanskari houses, though otherwise well built, are not adapted to the recently increasing rainfall, as their roofs leak, catching their surprised inhabitants unprepared. Most of the precipitation occurs as snowfall during the harsh and extremely long winter period. These winter snowfalls are of vital importance, since they feed the glaciers which melt in the summer and provide most of the irrigation water.
I would suggest that passage is more suitable to create another new section or subsection, placing the entire section into the new section or subsection.
No shortcuts. The passage uses shortcuts, such as Rain- and snowfall, which can be preety confusing. I would recommend newer phrases to be used.
If there are no objections in three days, I hope that I can go ahead smoothly with my copyediting plans. Thanks.
Tan 19:13, 1 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Thanks Xiong. Although I cannot make out clearly on what you are trying to say, but I feel that you may be the most appropriate person to act as a judge between User:Mel Etitis and me--both of us were unable to come to a concensus about the state of Zanskar.
I do agree that my english may not be the best. However, just see the state of Zanskar--it needs content restructuring. If you see the history of Zanskar [12], an annoyomous user has tried to copyedit Zanskar--but it seems strange that Mel reverted my edits, and it has occured to me before.
What I want you to do is to watch out on Mel's action. I have told him to wait patiently and let me complete the entire copyediting process, I do not want interruptions from him, and I had already had more than enough. After I have completed the whole process, then do allow him to counter-copyedit. (His poor foresight maybe the reason to this dispute).
For your information, do look into Zanskar and Talk:Zanskar.
Thanks.
Anymore comments concerning this issue? If there is none in three days' time, then I assume that this dispute is settled, and hopefully I can go ahead with my plans. Please be patient once I start copyediting, but go ahead make ammendments on my grammar. All reverts without appropriate explanation or intentions should be considered as vandalism (or subvandalism).
Tan 19:13, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I would also like to add one more point from here (my opinion)--Zanskar is an article that looks more like a personal ancedote than a proper encyclopedia article. This is evidenced in the usage of
Wikipedia:No peacock terms such as Even though Padum, the administrative capital of Zanskar, is not of great interest...
All are welcome to copyedit.
Tan 17:30, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)
It has been suggested we should not put a BitTorrent search engine external link in the article because of the legal ambiguity of BitTorrent. Ideas? SqueakBox 23:30, May 31, 2005 (UTC)
One of my favorite books is Life: A User's Manual which is about an apartment building. The thing is, to explain many aspects of the book you need an exact diagram of the building (see article for details). Can I scan the one from the book and claim Fair Use? gkhan 22:56, May 31, 2005 (UTC)
I know this sounds extremely odd, but I would like the green colour of the babel (which is on many user pages) modified. There are three/four colours which make me sick (slightly nauseous infact, and I have no clue why...) Would anyone have any objections if the HTML colour code is modified slightly? = Nichalp ( Talk)= 19:42, May 31, 2005 (UTC)
I'm looking for a phone # or email address for the head office or distribution centre for the Dollarama stores. I've been informed by staff at the Dollarama store in my area (Guelph) that they are not allowed to give out a phone # or email. They suggested I check the web for a phone # or email for the office in Toronto or Montreal Quebec. This I did but came up with zilch!
I was informed by a friend that the Dollarama stores were taken over by Bain so I checked for Bain on the web & again came up with zilch!
All I want to do is put in a request for a certain item to be shipped to the Guelph store for an upcoming birthday party. What's the big deal?
I've wasted over 3 hours of my time on this & will try to avoid shopping at Dollarama stores since the head office appears to be in hiding!!
Can anyone help me?
Cathy Chapman
GREETINGS=
MY COMPANY, A.D. MARBLE & COMPANY, INC., WOULD LIKE TOO BUIil a BRIGE ACROSS THE BAIRING STRAIGHT. DO WEE NEED SOME TYPE OF PERMITION FOR THIS?? I DON’TT THINK WE SHUOLD SENSE THE OCEAN IS PUBLIC PROPERTY. THIS BRIDGE WOULD PROBLY LOWER THE GAS PRICE FOR THE WHOLE WORLD SENSE WE WONT’ HAVEN’T BUY FROM SAUDI ARABIA ANYMORE. PLEASE SIGN BELOW IF YOU ARE FOR OR AGIANST IT SO THAT WE CAN BILD THE BRIGE AS SOOON AS POSIBLE:
AT FAVOR:
AGIANTS:
Good Day I teach all sexes at two organisations The first is at an apprentice school and the second is at a Surf Life Saving Radio Base. At the apprentice school my audience is made up of both boys and girls who range in age from 14 to 22 years of age. The audience at the Surf Life Saving Radio Base ranges from 22 to 84 with the vast majority being over 55 years of age. The Lifesavers come equally from all sexes. Both my audiences are curious people who wish to learn. They have heard of some of the terms used in both Electricity and Radio but have no idea where those therms fit into the big picture. And both groups want to know how things work. Questions abound as to why things work? This is where I use Wikipedia as I can refer them to your site and they can look it up. However I have gone further than qouting Wikipedia's URL and have drawnup what I call the "top down diagrams" which start with a topic eg Batteries and drill down using your resource to fill in terms and formulas. I used to use sheets of plastic film but now I use Hyperlinks in HTML as it is easier to change information. And it works on most equipment as these blokes are students with limited funds. The benefit of this approach is in the students eyes - once they see how a topic works their eyes light up like neon lights, their marks improve and they want to learn more. Once you capture this interest the other topics become much easier to teach and learn. The students arrive early, they concentrate more and they are far more productive. The thing that surprises me is that if they miss a class they chase you till you give them the handouts - then they sit down and read it. Then comes the questions- why, how, what etc, and they volunteer to do more work in their own time!!!!!!!!!! The employers tell us that they have no problems with our appprentices because they arrive on site having a knowledge of the job and they offer information such as the formula for that is "so and so", "would you like me to work it out for you?" Or "that piece of equipment does "so and so" and is connect in this way so that efficiency is improved". Or "did you know in "so and sos" theory he /she expressed interest in "such and such" and experiemented with other ways of connection but found that efficiency decreased from this method" To quote one of my students "Do you mean all those dudes did that and some of them where GIRLS!!" -His sexist attitude changed immediately. As such can I have details re copyright as I would like to buid an Intranet so that my audience can view the topics on line. We use two networks one connected to the Internet and one that cannot be connected to the internet. The students use the non connected network and no they cannot connect to the internet as the server sits on my desk- it is an old Laptop running Debian Linux. When the hack it they have to fix it and then we teach computer networking -till they fix it- as all teachers will tell you you have to grab their attention some how. Both groups are taught the same way. The Lifesavers like the diagrams because the can see how the equipment works without going to deep or if they want to they can explore the topic and see where one piece of equipment fits in with other equipment. regards Clem Klausen
Hopefully by 1.5 we can add auto generated MLA/APA references to the toolbox - matching Britannica Online's feature. But now they've premiered (or perhaps provided for a while) a quick dictionary programmed into the page! Double click and word and a Merriam-Webster popup box appears. MW is owned by Britannica Holdings (clever way of integrating the network). If our arch-rival offers this feature then how can we not match them?
lots of issues | leave me a message 01:57, 30 May 2005 (UTC)
lots of issues | leave me a message 21:30, 30 May 2005 (UTC)
how do you extract the inner cell mass? what is the involved process? email me kal4life2002@yahoo.com
There is an ongoing discussion at Wikipedia:Deletion policy/Reducing VfD load about ways that the size of VfD might be reduced. While there is still much discussion about possible new procedures and policies, there is a general consensus that one way to reduce the size would be to encourage editors to use other processes before or instead of nominating a page for deletion. Some of these other processes are:
Please note that this is not a suggestion about changing policy or procedure. This is simply "spreading the word" about some possible ways that we can reduce the size of VfD, and so this will be posted in several places around Wikipedia. Thanks for listening. Soundguy99 16:05, 29 May 2005 (UTC)
Has it ever ever happened before, that a well-organized team of POV-pushers, (or disruptive users) in addition to their sock-puppets could take over a smaller wikipedia (even temporarily)?
Thanks, nyenyec ☎ 22:44, 27 May 2005 (UTC)
Can it be that there is an article on Slouching Towards Bedlam, an apparently obscure computer game, but not one on Slouching Towards Bethlehem, a classic poem by W.B. Yeats? Am I looking in the wrong place?