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The view as far as I am aware and can see across academia is that Ireland become a de facto and de jure republic in 1949 after the Republic of Ireland Act (1948). It would seem that in general or in all essentials it acted like one prior to this. No-one is doubting that, however @ Frenchmalawi: strongly disagrees and calls this a common misconception, with their preference for the 1937 "republican constitution" (as they put it. I have seen no source that academia calls it that) as the starting point for Ireland being a republic.
Currently they are deadlocked at trying to get this accepted at Republic of Ireland. Back in March they added it to this article, without a single source to back themselves up. Who knows where else they have added their POV to.
Any sources they seem to have provided at Talk:Republic_of_Ireland#“It_was_officially_declared_a_republic_in_1949,_following_the_Republic_of_Ireland_Act_1948.” do not explicitly back their personal view and original research.
So when did Ireland become an actual republic? If not with the 1948 act then can alternative years be reliably and academically sourced? This means sources that state it fact not state it "in all essentials". Mabuska (talk) 22:06, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
User:Mabuska, I’m happy to explore your question. When did Ireland legally become a republic? This is a question of law so we must look at the law. Well, United Kingdom law is very clear. United Kingdom law says that it happened in 1949. This is expressly set out in the Ireland Act 1949. In that Act it is provided that “It is hereby recognized and declared that the part of Ireland heretofore known as Eire ceased, as from the eighteenth day of April, nineteen hundred and forty-nine, to be part of His Majesty’s dominions.” So there is no doubt whatsoever that insofar as United Kingdom law is concerned, Ireland became a republic in 1949. Should we stop there? Should we accept that as the final answer and not consider anything else? Well, I don’t think so. The question, of course, is about Ireland so it makes sense that we also have to look at what Irish law says too. So, here goes, let’s look at Irish law:
1. Irish law removed the British king from its constitution in 1936. A secondary source that backs that up is “AN AMBIGUOUS OFFICE? THE POSITION OF HEAD OF STATE IN THE IRISH CONSTITUTION; JOHN COAKLEY; Irish Jurist; Irish Jurist; New Series, Vol. 48, 2012 pp 43-70. It includes QUOTE: “Two important Acts redefined the relationship between the State and the King. The first, the [Irish] Constitution (Amendment No. 27) Act, which went through all stages in the Dail on 11 December 1936, terminated any role for the Crown in the domestic affairs of the Free State and removed all references to the functions of the Governor-General (whose last official act was, indeed, to sign this bill into law the same day) but left space for the Government, for purposes of international affairs to avail of any “organ” used by the other dominions. The second, the [Irish] Executive Authority (External Relations) Act, enacted the following day and signed by the Ceann Comhairle made provision for the King to “act on behalf of the Irish Free State”, on the advice of the government “for the purposes of the appointment of diplomatic and consular representatives and the conclusion of international agreements.” In line with de Valera’s earlier thinking on the place of the King in the Constitution, then, this matter was now resolved: provision for the King would be made only in legislation, not in the State’s basic law.” This is very clearly explaining that under Irish law teh King was taken out of the Constitution in 1936; long, long before 1949.
2. Internationally, the constitution of the Ireland is often described as a republican one. Here is another source describing it in those terms: “A Federal Republic: Australia's Constitutional System of Government” By Brian Galligan, Cambridge University Press page 122, QUOTE: “After the French Revolution the constitution for France’s First Republic was passed by referendum, as was Eire’s republican constitution in 1937 after that country finally won independence from Britain” That’s an impartial source clearly describing the Irish constitution of 1937 as a republican one.
3. Am I the only one who says that Irish law and United Kingdom law do not agree on when Ireland became a republic? No, of course I am not. There are secondary sources explaining that Irish and United Kingdom law do not agree on the point. Here is a secondary source in that vein: “In the ast thirty years, there have been three distinct experiments in the ordering of Anglo-Irish relations. Two of them have failed. The first was the experiment of Commonwealth membership embodied in the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921 in which the status of the Irish Free State was specifically associated with that of the senior dominion, Canada, and generally with that of oversea dominions. That experiment MAY BE SAID TO HAVE COME TO AN END IN 1936-37 when the External Relations Act was passed and the new Irish constitution enacted with the sanction of popular approval in a plebiscite....THEN FROM 1936-49...EIRE OWED NO ALLIEGANCE TO THE CROWN AND WAS NOT, IN THE IRISH VIEW, A MEMBER OF THE BRITISH COMMONWEALTH OF NATIONS, BUT A STATE WHOSE ASSOCIATION WITH IT FROM WITHOUT was symbolized by the King’s signature to the letters of appointment of Irish representatives to foreign countries.” Ireland: The Republic Outside the Commonwealth by Nicholas Mansergh, International Affairs (Royal Institute of International Affairs 1944-), Vol. 28, No. 3 (Jul., 1952), pp. 277-291, Published by: Oxford University Press on behalf of the Royal Institute of International Affairs. [My EMPHASIS is added in parts of the above quote].
CONCLUSIONS: Secondary sources support the view that Irish law regarded Ireland as already having left the Commonwealth well before 1949. The British law view conflicts with that. There is a conflict of laws. One can properly say that as a matter of United Kingdom law Ireland left the Commonwealth in 1949. One cannot say the same thing as a matter of Irish law which holds that Ireland left the Commonwealth in 1936-1937. This is nothing new that’s being raised by me here. I have never suggested that either view must be accepted as correct. We on Wiki, simply have to report these historical matters, damn complicated though they may be. I’m sure we can all agree that law is often not simple. And simply saying that Ireland left the Commonwealth in 1949 doesn’t actually address that the position is more complicated than that. Frenchmalawi ( talk) 13:03, 4 August 2019 (UTC)
This is a question of law so we must look at the law.- directly quoting from the law it is all you can do otherwise you are performing original research and synthesis.
United Kingdom law is very clear. United Kingdom law says that it happened in 1949. This is expressly set out in the Ireland Act 1949... So there is no doubt whatsoever that insofar as United Kingdom law is concerned, Ireland became a republic in 1949.- Then it is settled. 1949 is the year. Thank you for providing that.
Should we stop there? Should we accept that as the final answer and not consider anything else? Well, I don’t think so.To be blunt it doesn't matter what you think, all that matters is what the law and what academia says on the matter. Otherwise it is original research and synthesis.
Irish law removed the British king from its constitution in 1936.- Does that make it a republic? Do you have a source that states that this constition made the Irish Free State a republic? If not then you are performing original research and synthesis.
Internationally, the constitution of the Ireland is often described as a republican one.- You've provided only this one single source and it is not an international one. Describing something as being republican does not make it republican. All that source is stating is that the constitution had republican overtones. In a real world example I prefer the name Londonderry over Derry, I prefer the name Northern Ireland over the Six Counties or the North. Those can be easily called sentiments of loyalism however does that make me a loyalist? No and nor would I be. Thus simply having a constitution being "republican" in tone does not make it a republic. It still needs to declare it.
Quoting our own Wikipedia article on the gentleman in question: “Philip Nicholas Seton Mansergh, OBE (27 June 1910 – 16 January 1991) was a historian of Ireland and the British Commonwealth. As the Smuts Professor of Commonwealth History at Cambridge University after 1953, he trained many of the specialists in the field of Irish, Indian, and Commonwealth studies.” This is the gentleman - a Smuts Professor of Commonwealth History at Cambridge - whose qualifications you appear to feel fall short of being able to express a reliable view on what the constitutional status of Ireland was during the period 1936/7-49. Apparently, you feel he could express himself on “practical realities” but his view carries not on constitutional matters. Seriously? Ahh, “in the Irish view” versus “in Irish law”. I see. Indeed. Yes, that would make sense if Prof. Mansergh had not referenced the External Relations Act and the 1937 Constitution in the very same sentence. Both are laws. But ultimately, it’s another red herring. The late Cambridge Professor of Commonwealth History is a perfectly good source for a statement that “Ireland had, in its view, left the Commonwealth” years before 1949. Do you disagree? If so, why? I don’t think I attacked you; rebutting arguments is not personal attack. It is collaborative. Let’s be collaborative and respectful but by all means challenge each other if we do not agree and feel we have good reason. Frenchmalawi ( talk) 00:06, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
[Ireland] was officially declared a republic in 1949, following the Republic of Ireland Act 1948.
"It was officially declared a republic in 1949, following the Republic of Ireland Act 1948." is perfectly accurate and there is no need to change that. Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 12:01, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
Could this be solved with the application of "de facto" and "de jure" for the different dates? The Banner talk 14:15, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
[Ireland] cut its last links with the Commonwealth in 1949, following the Republic of Ireland Act 1948.
The President's functions, as defined in the Constitution, then, are purely domestic ones; the King continued as Head of State after the Constitution came into force, and was formally responsible for all aspects of the State's external affairs.
— Coakley, p. 59
You again quote what politicians speaking in debating chambers’ views were...that’s what I was lambasted for doing at the very beginning of this discussion (see our friend Mabuska’s early exchanges with me!)., whilst being valid in one way, is not in another. Scolaire isn't trying to use those views to put something contentious and disputed into an article. They are simply using them to disprove your points based on similar sources. So not the same.
By virtue of its 1937 Constitution, the Irish Free State changed its name to Eire and considered itself a republic.
WE ARE an independent republic since December 29, 1937, the day on which our new Constitution came into operation...'The State whose institutions correspond to these articles [of the 1937 Constitution of Ireland] is, it seems to me, demonstrably a republic. Look up any standard text on political theories; look up any standard book of reference and get from any of them any definition of a republic or any description of what a republic is and judge whether our State does not possess every characteristic mark by which a republic can be distinguished or recognised...The position as I conceive it to be is this: We are an independent republic associated as a matter of our external policy with the States of the British Commonwealth.
I proposed to merge Minister for the Public Service into Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, in the form previously done boldly but reverted (there was an error in one of the headings in my edit). While the responsibilities have little in common, it is our practice here to list ministers according to the formal legal successors, even when this results in odd outcomes, such as the Minister for Economic Planning becoming the Minister for Culture, Heritage and the Gaeltacht, while the Minister for the Gaeltacht becomes the Minister for Children and Youth Affairs. The legislation and statutory instruments whereby the old Department of Transport established in 1959 was abolished, and the Department of the Public Service became the Department of Tourism and Transport are linked at Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport. This is also explained in part by Charles Haughey in the debate on the nomination of members of the government on 10 March 1987. It is also within the Appendices of Politics in the Republic of Ireland, ed. by Coakley and Gallagher. I have the fifth edition, published in 2010, at p. 455 it shows the transformation of the Department of the Public Service up to the Department of Transport, as it was at the time, now the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport.
I agree that the history of government departments are a bit of a mess, but save for separating articles when we decide the shift is substantial enough, I think following the current system is the best option, to follow SIs titled Alteration of Name of Department and Title of Minister. The Minister for the Public Service was left out when these were consolidated before, but given we have the Minister for Labour becoming the Minister for Equality and Law Reform, or the examples listed above, I don't think there's any reason to leave it as a special case. – Iveagh Gardens ( talk) 15:14, 24 August 2019 (UTC)
A dispute has emerged at Field hockey at the 1908 Summer Olympics over what is the correct flag or flags to use. Great Britain did not compete in this tournament so I don't believe the Union Jack should be included. England, Ireland, Scotland and Wales competed independently. Also at issue is which Ireland flag to use. verses . The former has never been used by Hockey Ireland or it's predecessors. Any thoughts ? I think it is important that Irish editors have say. Djln Djln ( talk) 14:25, 17 August 2019 (UTC)
Also posted at Talk:Rush, Dublin
I'm working on
Lady Elizabeth Echlin as part of
WP:Women in Red's "writers" theme for September. She lived at Rush House, Rush, which burned down in 1827 and was replaced by
Kenure House, itself now demolished except for the portico. Her entry in the
Oxford Dictionary of National Biography, written 2004, includes the intriguing: "A coastal grotto or ‘shell house’ built by Lady Echlin in 1755–6, and engraved with verses composed for the occasion by the novelist Samuel Richardson, is marked on Rocque's 1759 map of co. Dublin, and has recently been discovered in use as a cattle pen.
" I can't find anything by googling various likely terms, but am curious. Does anyone out there know any more about this grotto / shell house / pig-pen?
Pam
D 20:05, 28 August 2019 (UTC)
The Department of the Taoiseach has recently revised its website, or merged it into gov.ie, and rather unhelpfully, has removed the pages on historical background. So the pages there which had given lists of previous governments are now gone, or at least I can't find a new link for them. We've been using them for our Government of the nth Dáil pages. I've solved that in most instances by using references to Dáil debates, which are probably a more stable and direct source in any case. But it does leave us without a source for the 1922 Provisional Government for both Government of the 2nd Dáil and Government of the 3rd Dáil, which was not approved by the Dáil. Currently, the link at [1] is being used, which is now effectively a dead link. We could use the archived link at [2]. But do we have any more permanent source for this? An academic source, perhaps? — Iveagh Gardens ( talk) 20:14, 30 August 2019 (UTC)
Just to make sure the merger notice is seen before I move ahead next week, I've proposed merging President of the Irish Republic into President of Dáil Éireann. — Iveagh Gardens ( talk) 08:31, 3 September 2019 (UTC)
A few weeks ago, I proposed moving the lists of ministers into the pages of their respective government pages, so Parliamentary Secretaries of the 3rd Dáil into Government of the 3rd Dáil up to merging Ministers of State of the 32nd Dáil into Government of the 32nd Dáil, making the distinction clear of course, between those requiring appointment by the president after approval by the Dáil, and those requiring only appointment by the government itself. There was a mixed response at the discussion, and no clear consensus. After finishing a project of adding references to Dáil debates for the approval of all government ministers where possible, I'm more convinced that this would be a good idea.
In summary:
Most reference books like Nealon list them on a single page, as do the equivalent pages for other jurisdictions, and the government's website. None of these bind us, but they at least suggest it's a reasonable way to organise the information.
I'm rehearsing some arguments, if any of you have thoughts beyond this, the conversation is at Talk:Government of the 32nd Dáil#Proposed merger of Ministers of States into this page. – Iveagh Gardens ( talk) 15:22, 6 September 2019 (UTC)
I've massively added to the sources for and against in the past month. I might sign up for an account while it's still free. 78.16.41.64 ( talk) 12:57, 16 September 2019 (UTC)
Proposal to delete all portals
The discussion is at Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals)#Proposal to delete Portal space. Voceditenore ( talk) 07:37, 23 September 2019 (UTC)
Hello everyone,
I was wondering would anyone else like to help me, I want to work on getting together more Irish Charities on wikipedia? Some have pages but they are very short.
I was also going to try add mre info to The Wheel /info/en/?search=The_Wheel_%E2%80%93_Supporting_Voluntary_Activity_in_Ireland
Declanedits ( talk) 19:02, 25 September 2019 (UTC)
Hello and greetings from the maintainers of the WP 1.0 Bot! As you may or may not know, we are currently involved in an overhaul of the bot, in order to make it more modern and maintainable. As part of this process, we will be rewriting the web tool that is part of the project. You might have noticed this tool if you click through the links on the project assessment summary tables.
We'd like to collect information on how the current tool is used by....you! How do you yourself and the other maintainers of your project use the web tool? Which of its features do you need? How frequently do you use these features? And what features is the tool missing that would be useful to you? We have collected all of these questions at this Google form where you can leave your response. Walkerma ( talk) 04:24, 27 October 2019 (UTC)
The Harry Boland article was moved to Harry Boland (politician) on 11 November, with Harry Boland becoming a disambiguation page. There is a discussion about moving it back at Talk:Harry Boland (politician)#Requested move 12 November 2019. -- Scolaire ( talk) 18:56, 22 November 2019 (UTC)
Perhaps it is the upcoming centenaries of the Tan War and Civil War, but there has been a marked increase in what (with every respect) I can only describe as "well-meaning amateur genealogists" using Wikipedia as a place to publish articles on family members. Some of whom may have had notable roles in either conflict. But many of whom were, along with 25,000 other Irish men and women, peripherally involved in the war. While more <ahem> "seasoned" editors are more familiar with the WP:NBIO and WP:MILPEOPLE guidelines (which confirm, for example, that just being a member of the Volunteers, RIC, IRB, old-IRA or C na mB doesn't automatically confer notability), there are others who seem less familiar. And there are an increasing number of "my great granny met Dev once" and "my great uncle hid a pike for some lads" style articles cropping-up of late. Do we need to consider specific WikiProject Ireland guidelines on how to identify or deal with these outliers? Or, do we just leave it to the broader PROD and AfD processes to address any creations which stretch the bounds of WP:NOTGENEALOGY or WP:NOTMEMORIAL? (I ask mainly as, unfortunately, it seems like the members of this project are going to be a little busy in the next while dealing with some stuff retrospectively....) Guliolopez ( talk) 21:25, 22 November 2019 (UTC)
Issues have occurred due to replacement of etymology/name with toponymy on a couple of Irish settlement articles recently. Discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Cities/Settlements: Article structure#Etymology or toponymy or name. Thankyou. Djm-leighpark ( talk) 04:32, 1 December 2019 (UTC)
For background see Talk:Leader of Sinn Féin#Leader in Northern Ireland Assembly. At present various articles contain often contradictory information regarding the purported position of "Leader in Northern Ireland Assembly" (or similar title). While it is true that Michelle O'Neill became "leader in the North" in January 2017 and said she was following in the footsteps of Martin McGuinness, there is no evidence of him holding that position other than him being a de facto leader as a result of being deputy First Minister of Northern Ireland. O'Neill's position has been variously described in media sources as "leader in the North", "leader in the Assembly", "leader in Northern Ireland", "leader at Stormont" or close variations of those. Due to Sinn Féin's ambiguous job title, it is unclear whether she is leader in the Assembly or the whole of Northern Ireland.
As a result of this I propose the following:
Certain things will need to be changed in addition to the proposals above. For example there's a photo captioned "Michelle O'Neill replaced McGuinness as Sinn Féin's leader in the Northern Ireland Assembly in January 2017" in the Martin McGuinness article, and the section at Michelle O'Neill#Leader of Sinn Féin in the Northern Ireland Assembly. I figured it would be simpler to break down the problems into manageable chunks, so further discussion will take place here, or at the relevant articles, to decide on how to amend those articles. If I have missed any articles that need changing please say so.
See Talk:Michelle O'Neill#"Leader of Sinn Féin in the Northern Ireland Assembly" section. It probably makes sense for that discussion to take place there, since it's specific to her article. FDW777 ( talk) 15:44, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
I know we have limited bandwidth, but one thing that strikes me, as I review thousands of articles, is that our generous coverage of GAA and other sports figures (with which I have no quarrel, we can accommodate) is so unmatched in the area of academics and researchers (and also business people and entrepreneurs) that it produces a bizarre result - the Notable Persons sections in many of our third-level institution articles are overwhelmed with people notable for sports careers (often of limited, or no, relevance to the institutions) but very (embarrassingly) short on people actually notable as academics (it is so severe that even heads of institutions can be missed). Some of this is due to an overly high bar for academic inclusion (even long-term professors don't always qualify) but if anyone has some spare time (a big ask, I know), I think there must be some ready gap-filling to be done. The Women in Red initiative is closing some gaps, and editors like Antiqueight are doing great article creation work. SeoR ( talk) 08:50, 5 December 2019 (UTC)
The entries in Category:United Irishmen which are disambiguated have either (United Irishmen) or (United Irishman) appended with no consistency. Which should it be? Cabayi ( talk) 16:43, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
Hello! I have recently created a bot to remove completed infobox requests and am sending this message to WikiProject Ireland since the project currently has a backlogged infobox request category. Details about the task can be found at Wikipedia:Bots/Requests for approval/PearBOT 2, but in short it removes all infobox requests from articles with an infobox, once a week. To sign up, reply with {{ ping|Trialpears}} and tell me if any special considerations are required for the Wikiproject. For example: if only a specific infobox should be detected, such as {{ infobox journal}} for WikiProject Academic Journals; or if an irregularly named infobox such as {{ starbox begin}} should be detected. Feel free to ask if you have any questions!
Sent on behalf of Trialpears ( talk) via MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 02:34, 12 December 2019 (UTC)
Anyone see a discussion before a keen editor from Greece starting recategorising sport? Not sure they are fully familiar with all-Ireland vs separate territory governing bodies. Thanks, SeoR ( talk) 21:51, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
@ DuhallowContributor: just rewrote this page which was previously declined at New Page Review. The comment by (pinging @ Chris troutman:) was that it did not satisfy WP:ORG. At first glance, most non-Irish Wikipedia editors would agree I suspect. In contrast, most people in Ireland would presume that the local GAA club is a suitable topic for a Wikipedia article in terms of WP:GNG. However, I've reviewed some of the other articles for GAA clubs and I think there may be a geographic bias regarding sources. Can anyone offer guidance on how we could make a wp:blueink case for general notability of local GAA clubs beyond the sporting element based on cultural and historical significance in addition to community role? AugusteBlanqui ( talk) 10:15, 18 December 2019 (UTC)
Ireland, an article that you or your project may be interested in, has been nominated for a community good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. AIRcorn (talk) 08:50, 25 November 2019 (UTC)
It appears Scaramanga731 whilst doing some excellent grammar and spelling correction they have also been adding external links to the Eiretains website to Irish station articles. My understanding is this is not acceptable per WP:ELNO. While I reverted one at Sligo Mac Diarmada railway station and Scaramanga731 thanked me for the same Scaramanga731 has continued to add this link to other articles. Can people confirm that this is not acceptable, or if it is OK then I will be happy to go with consensus. Thankyou. Djm-leighpark ( talk) 22:39, 18 December 2019 (UTC)
I just came across List of townlands of County Limerick and its baby lists, all found at Category:Townlands of County Limerick. It looks like the sub-lists were split from the main list long ago with the intent that the main list would be "simpler" or less detail-heavy (see the talk page of the main list). However, it appears that the lists are identical and have identical levels of detail.
Does anyone have any opinion as to what should be done with them? I feel like we can either a) redirect the sub-lists back to the main list and leave the main list intact, b) strip the main list entirely and make it into a navigation list to the sub-lists, or c) partially strip the main list down to basics and leave the details to the sub-lists. ♠ PMC♠ (talk) 23:20, 13 December 2019 (UTC)
Ok, in the absence of objections, I'm going to redirect the split lists to the master. ♠ PMC♠ (talk) 01:04, 20 December 2019 (UTC)
Hi all. If anyone has access—perhaps via a library, or an academic institution—and can send a couple of articles over for WP stuff, I'd greatly appreciate it! Thanks in (hopeful!) advance. —— SN 54129 07:35, 29 January 2020 (UTC)
http://dib.cambridge.org/viewReadPage.do?articleId=a2437&searchClicked=clicked&quickadvsearch=yes http://dib.cambridge.org/viewReadPage.do?articleId=a5955&searchClicked=clicked&quickadvsearch=yes Unfortunately I don't have much time this week to edit content or else I would start integrating content. AugusteBlanqui ( talk) 09:23, 29 January 2020 (UTC)
I just uploaded 174 new images, mostly unidentified Dublin city, from Flickr that have very generic file names, such as "Dublin (the Flickr number)" and "Dublin" or even nothing as the description. You can find them all here. If you can identify them, please add the description and if you are a file move please move them to a better name and categorise them if possible, better then just this commons category: c:Category:Unidentified locations in Dublin though a few are identified. Thanks in advance. ww2censor ( talk) 14:07, 20 December 2019 (UTC)
2A02:8084:51BC:9A00:55D4:EB05:BAB3:FB04 has made edits to the above article that not only put comments into the body of the article but they are personal attacks (e.g. referring to "luvvie"). The anonymous editor also:
What do people suggest? This seems like a case where the above diff should be reverted, but given the personal attacks and determination this could result in more personal attacks on edits who revert the edits. Autarch ( talk) 19:32, 3 January 2020 (UTC)
Bell X1 (band), an article that you or your project may be interested in, has been nominated for a community good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. MER-C 04:21, 10 January 2020 (UTC)
See Talk:Timeline of the Northern Ireland Troubles and peace process#Requested move 21 January 2020. Thank you. FDW777 ( talk) 21:22, 21 January 2020 (UTC)
An article that you have been involved with (2020 Irish general election) has content that is proposed to be removed and move to another article (Opinion polling prior to 2020 Irish general election). If you are interested, please visit the discussion at Talk:2020 Irish general election#Splitting proposal. Thank you. Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 16:33, 23 January 2020 (UTC) Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 16:33, 23 January 2020 (UTC)
Hi there, is anyone handy at creating/modifying maps? A lot of the Dáil constituency maps for the 2020 general election are out of date (or missing). Is there a dedicated wikigroup I could ask to help? Tx, Spleodrach ( talk) 11:25, 2 February 2020 (UTC)
Hi. The Wikipedia:The Great Britain/Ireland Destubathon is planned for March 2020, a contest/editathon to eliminate as many stubs as possible from all 134 counties. Amazon vouchers/book prizes are planned for most articles destubbed from England, Wales, Scotland and Ireland and Northern Ireland and whoever destubs articles from the most counties out of the 134. Sign up on page if interested in participating, hope this will prove to be good fun and productive, we have over 44,000 stubs! Even if "contests" aren't your thing, think of it as motivation to improve our content! Hope to see a lot of articles improved as part of this, there is a £50 prize for most Ireland and Northern Ireland articles destubbed!♦ Dr. Blofeld 15:22, 2 February 2020 (UTC)
Would someone from WP:IE mind taking a look at this article? There have been some posts about the company added to the article's talk page and also made at the Teahouse which may or may not be true, but it might be a good idea to check as to whehter there is anything about this type of thing being covered in reliable sources and whether it's something worth mentioning if it has. -- Marchjuly ( talk) 05:13, 5 February 2020 (UTC)
I don't know if it worthy of an article in of itself, but I noticed that there is just one photo of the church from 2007. Given that its demolition has now been approved, should we look more photos and if not its own article but include it in the Finglas article? Smirkybec ( talk) 14:11, 6 February 2020 (UTC)
Category:Sinn Féin TDs who attended fee paying schools, which you created, has been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. FDW777 ( talk) 14:21, 11 February 2020 (UTC)
The discussion can be found at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2020 February 18#IRA Directorate of Intelligence related categories. FDW777 ( talk) 21:53, 18 February 2020 (UTC)
There is a discussion at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Ireland-related articles#Use of Taoiseach regarding to the use of Taoiseach in articles. FDW777 ( talk) 10:36, 23 February 2020 (UTC)
There is a discussion at Talk:Sinn Féin#First preference votes which has the potential to affect some other articles about Irish political parties, advertising it here for maximum visibility. FDW777 ( talk) 18:25, 25 February 2020 (UTC)
There is a discussion at Talk:Unionism in Ireland#Recent changes which may benefit from more participants. Thank you. FDW777 ( talk) 16:11, 4 March 2020 (UTC)
If any WikiProject Ireland participants are interested there is an editathon at Maynooth University on Monday, March 9: Wikipedia:Meetup/Ireland Maynooth University International Women’s Day Editathon 2020 AugusteBlanqui ( talk) 11:58, 5 March 2020 (UTC)
Anyone else got time to pitch in at this edit-a-thon ( Wikipedia:The Great Britain/Ireland Destubathon)? - after reviewing thousands of articles, it's great to have something which helps reduce the stub pile. Good fun, and almost 120 articles have already been upgraded for Ireland + Northern Ireland, not to mention the hundreds more for England (incl. Isle of Man, Channel Islands), Scotland and Wales. There are clear guidelines and tallies, and yes, prizes too, for the ambitious and energetic. Especially in a time when face-to-face edit-a-thons are off. SeoR ( talk) 18:11, 20 March 2020 (UTC)
This AfD discussion may be of interest to members of WikiProject Ireland /info/en/?search=Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Saoirse_McHugh AugusteBlanqui ( talk) 12:36, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
Category:British and Irish political parties has been nominated for deletion, merging, or renaming. You are encouraged to join the discussion on the Categories for discussion page. Place Clichy ( talk) 15:15, 22 April 2020 (UTC)
There's an RFC underway at Talk:Oscar Wilde:
What is the best option for the lead image (See MOS:LEADIMAGE)? |
Your participation would be welcome! Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 17:56, 27 April 2020 (UTC)
It's been years since I've actively edited wikipedia, but I noticed a link on Cabinteely F.C. where the article directly links to a Football Manager Let's Play by a YouTuber in the opening section. and removed it as possible WP:LINKSPAM, possibly by the youtuber themselves. It looks like another anonymous IP user has undone my edit and reinstated this, but I still feel it shouldn't be in the article, but rather than get into an edit war, I thought I'd just raise it to the attention of more active editors. 89.100.234.197 ( talk) 14:29, 28 April 2020 (UTC)
Dia dhaoibh! I've been trying to show the editors of the COVID-19 pandemic in the United Kingdom article how biased UK=England it is. COVID-19 is a health issue, which comes under the devolved governments and NOT under Boris Johnson. The article, in my view, contains disproportional coverage of England, is unbalanced and is an insult to the three smaller nations. If you have two minutes please read the Talk page and leave any comments at the bottom. You may disagree with me of course! Saol fada chuga! John Jones ( talk) 18:17, 15 May 2020 (UTC)
The date of birth for Sabina Higgins appears to be wrong, see Talk:Sabina Higgins#Date of birth. Can we find a reliable source? Verbcatcher ( talk) 23:16, 4 June 2020 (UTC)
The is a discussion at Talk:The Troubles/Archive 3#WikiProject Organized crime on whether that article belongs in that category. Wider input would be appreciated. Scolaire ( talk) 15:36, 28 May 2020 (UTC)
I've added two new list articles on Irish politics ahead of the government formation, whenever that eventually occurs:
Both of these bring together work I'd previously done on the respective government and department pages. Now that I've moved them into the mainspace, I'd certainly welcome any additions or developments from other editors. — Iveagh Gardens ( talk) 08:14, 9 June 2020 (UTC)
Does anyone live near Fermoy or can get there now that lockdown allows travel within the county? If you are living in Cork you will not be breaking the new rules to go to Fremoy. There is a bust of him there (per [4]) and as no images have been found perhaps someone can take a decent photo of it for his article. It's on the northern side of the bridge that goes over the River Blackwater. ww2censor ( talk) 11:20, 10 June 2020 (UTC)
Hello, I'm hoping someone expertise in medieval Ireland and Irish mythology can review the situation at Fir Bolg and Cath Maige Tuired, which use the same image but different captions. The former dates it to 1911, the latter to 1910. I think the latter is correct, but that's a minor, easy fix. The bigger problem is that Fir Bolg describes the image as depicting "Ambassadors of the Fir Bolg and Tuath Dé meeting before the Battle of Moytura", while Cath Maige Tuired describes it as "The expulsion of King Bres". Viewing the book image in context, which clearly labels it "The Two Ambassadors", I conclude the caption at Fir Bolg is correct, despite having the wrong date.
Do I have that right? If so, what's the remedy? I think probably update the caption at Cath Maige Tuired, replace the image, or just remove the image outright. Thoughts? -- BDD ( talk) 19:25, 8 June 2020 (UTC)
I have nominated this article for deletion. The discussion is at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Burning of the Burning Embers pub. Thank you. FDW777 ( talk) 22:09, 10 June 2020 (UTC)
Given the recent moves to remove a number of statues and memorials to Leopold II of Belgium, would anyone else be interested on working on Casement's article with me? It has had a lot of those maintenance tags for a long time, and would be great to tackle them. I have access to the DIB and ONDB as well as some journals, so could make a start? Smirkybec ( talk) 23:13, 13 June 2020 (UTC)
There is a discussion about the scope of the List of disasters in Great Britain and Ireland by death toll taking place at Talk:List of disasters in Great Britain and Ireland by death toll#Scope of the list. Please feel free to join in. Mjroots ( talk) 11:11, 14 June 2020 (UTC)
Hi all, just over from WikiProject Cricket! We're in need of photos of cricket grounds that have hosted one of the three major formats of cricket at either international or domestic level. This is the list of grounds we need photos for, most of which are in and around Dublin. If anyone has some spare time and lives close to these, any photos would be much appreciated. Cheers! StickyWicket ( talk) 10:54, 23 June 2020 (UTC)
File:Anglesea-cricket-ground.jpg
File:The-dig.jpg — Preceding unsigned comment added by Daniton999 ( talk • contribs) 11:02, 23 June 2020 (UTC)
There were images of Castle Avenue and Sydney Parade on Commons and Geograph respectively. I have added them to the relevant articles. I personally cannot assist with the others. Guliolopez ( talk) 13:07, 23 June 2020 (UTC)
Hi all, can't seem to find it in the notability guides, but would being elected the president of the Union of Students of Ireland confer notability? I'm thinking of the incumbent or more recent presidents rather than those how have a career since. Thanks! Smirkybec ( talk) 19:40, 24 June 2020 (UTC)
There is a discussion at Talk:Irish nationalism#Recent edits about a complete rewrite currently being done by ManfredHugh. Some more input would be appreciated. Scolaire ( talk) 23:00, 28 June 2020 (UTC)
Please help or delete the page. Xx236 ( talk) 11:54, 30 June 2020 (UTC)
This article doesn't seem to serve any purpose other than as an advert, complete with how good the classes are and how much it costs. Is this notable? Regards! Usedtobecool ☎️ 09:17, 30 June 2020 (UTC)
Along with a number of other articles which use the subject's Irish-language name, the articles on a number of "historic" Irish-language poets were recently moved. For example:
In each case, the rationale given for the move was a reference to WP:UE. Without discussion or otherwise. And in a manner which totally ignored WP:COMMONNAME and WP:IMOS.
I have NEVER ONCE heard any of these subjects referred to by anything other than their (common) Irish name. And will admit to being taken aback by the notion that some these were/are known by anything other than their Irish names. However, if (as dispassionately as possible) I take just Peadar Ó Doirnín, I would note that this is the subject's COMMONNAME in English-language sources. Peter O'Dornan is entirely a neologism. Having just 9 Google search results (and only ONE OF THOSE seems to relate to the subject in question). On the other hand, the original title, Peadar Ó Doirnín, has upwards of 8,000 results. Confirming that it is by ANY MEASURE the COMMONNAME of the subject. Including in English-language sources.
I am absolutely going to be advocating that Peadar Ó Doirnín be moved "back" to the more appropriate and common-name (over the proposed neolgism). Immediately. And will likely undertake a review of the others on a case-by-case basis.
That being said, I am opening this thread here to confirm whether there is any consensus (or what that consensus might be) for confirming that WP:UE does not "trump" WP:COMMONNAME and WP:OR. Guliolopez ( talk) 20:20, 2 July 2020 (UTC)
The choice between anglicized and local spellings should follow English-language usage, e.g. the non-anglicized titles Besançon, Søren Kierkegaard, and Göttingen are used because they predominate in English-language reliable sources. So in the case of Peadar Ó Doirnín, it's obvious this was an erroneous move carried out without any due diligence as there's no way Peter O'Dornan is the predominant use in English. I'd say that makes all the other moves equally as questionable, so would suggest a mass move back without discussion, and anyone objecting to the existing names should start move requests. FDW777 ( talk) 20:59, 2 July 2020 (UTC)
I would agree with this. Peadar Ó Doirnín does appear to be the more common usage and there are several pages already with Irish names where an English one is available. Obviously, as I am a new user, I would take everything I say with a pinch of salt as I am still finding my feet. DarkerDai ( talk) 21:36, 2 July 2020 (UTC)
I have moved these three articles back, plus Tadhg Gaelach Ó Súilleabháin. Pinging Mabuska, since nobody else did. Scolaire ( talk) 22:06, 2 July 2020 (UTC)
"I have NEVER ONCE heard any of these subjects referred to by anything other than their (common) Irish name. And will admit to being taken aback by the notion that some these were/are known by anything other than their Irish names"in order to get their point of view across. Sadly, Guliolopez undermines the force of their own argument by such a ridiculous POV statement. Just look at the blue plaque photo for Art McCooey on the page about Art McCooey by the Ulster Historical Society ( here) to appreciate the 'unhelpfulness' of such a wild assertion. If one has 'NEVER ONCE' heard anything said, it's quite possibly because one has chosen to close ones mind and ears. Feel free to carry on with the debate - I have no interest in it - but do try to act rationally and even-handedly in all discussions folks, please, and for the betterment of this encyclopaedia and not of your own personal agenda(s). Nick Moyes ( talk) 22:09, 2 July 2020 (UTC)
This ties in with a discussion going on at Talk:Grace O'Malley about a move proposal to Gráinne Ní Mháille ☕ Antiqueight chatter 22:20, 2 July 2020 (UTC)
In regards to the medieval-early modern period articles such as Owen Roe etc, most are actually restorations to their original namespace after having being moved without discussion by Fergainanim and Claiomh Solais who are big proponents of Irish name everything regardless. Indeed it is fixing their moves that brought me into this current issue. Mabuska (talk) 12:26, 3 July 2020 (UTC)
Recently @ FDW777: removed post-Troubles incidents from the The Troubles in Ardoyne article on the point that they did not happen during the Troubles and demanded citations to support their inclusion.
Now these incidents have been in this article and other such Troubles lists for years with no problems. Even the article Timeline of the Troubles goes up to 2007.
There is an argument to be made that post-Troubles incidents deserve mention as many are Troubles related or spin-offs from it. Indeed as it was the Troubles that started the proliferation of paramilitary groups and their membership, all of which still exist in some form or another today and still carrying out incidents, they are Troubles related. Splinter-groups likewise are continuations of the same.
If FDW777 is adamant that they can't be included as the articles are formatted at the moment there is no reason why such "The Troubles in ..." articles can't have a "Post-Troubles" section listing such incidents afterwards.
Either that of we start a needless proliferation of new articles titled "Terrorist incidents in ..." etc.
Mabuska (talk) 13:36, 28 June 2020 (UTC)
The Omagh bombing was part of the Troubles. The Real IRA were responsible for the bombing. Therefore this Real IRA bombing from 20xx was part of the Troubles. As already said Timeline of the Troubles goes up to 2007, with good reason. Or at least a good reason to extend after 1998. If 1998 was the cut-off date, the timeline wouldn't include IRA decommissioning, the formal end of their armed campaign in 2005, the UVF's formal end to their armed campaign in 2007 etc etc etc. It would be a very strange timeline indeed for those things not to be included. FDW777 ( talk) 16:50, 28 June 2020 (UTC)
12 July: The CIRA was blamed for attacking PSNI officers with blast bombs during rioting in the Ardoyne area of north Belfast, following an Orange Order parade. Eighty officers were injured, one seriously, and several people were arrested
13 July: The RIRA was blamed for shooting at the PSNI in the Ardoyne area of North Belfast during heavy rioting after an Orange Order parade
11 September: The CIRA claimed responsibility for the punishment shootings of two men in the Ardoyne area of north Belfast.
I didn't realise you had responded yesterday so my apologies for that. I disagree with you however on your recent argument. Lists of Troubles incidents are mentioned in geographical place articles were they don't merit their own "The Troubles in" pages. Yet most places have a link to a specific list of incidents. If it wasn't relevant to geographical places then why does Derry and Ardoyne or anywhere else with them even have Troubles sub-sections in the first place? Because it is relevant to them. struck as I realise you are on about dissident.
On testamount, it may be more to do with certain editor bias' (not saying you) or lack of interest in editors, or lack of editors, adding the information that is playing a part. Mabuska (talk) 16:12, 3 July 2020 (UTC)
The Derry 32CSM websitetalking about an incident in Dublin). Add on the other dissident groups, and I'd suggest 50 incidents would be a conservative estimate. Are we really going to document them all in the main Derry article? FDW777 ( talk) 16:20, 3 July 2020 (UTC)
Who said anything about lists of only dissident attacks? I am talking about Post Troubles incidents regardless of whoever carried them out. So yes such an article does have a need as those you provide above only deal with specific groups province wide and not incidents in any one area by more than one group. Mabuska (talk) 21:13, 3 July 2020 (UTC)
Please see Wikipedia:Move_review/Log/2020_July#Gráinne_Ní_Mháille, a discussion on whether the move of the article Grace O'Malley to Gráinne Ní Mháille should be retained or overturned and relisted. Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 13:46, 14 July 2020 (UTC)
I recently overhauled File:Ireland location map.svg so it is easily text-editable, with a hierarchy of provinces, counties, and local government areas. This map also groups offshore islands with their relevant administrative division. I noticed many maps highlighting single provinces often missed these islands, so this new format should make it far simpler to create specific maps. Please let me know if you notice any islands that are incorrectly assigned, or if there are other issues.
I'm trying to extend this system to Northern Ireland, based on maps such as File:Island of Ireland location map Offaly.svg, as existing maps such as File:Island of Ireland location map.svg are missing the differences between the traditional country borders and the current district borders. On that Offaly map, the pre-2015 borders have two different dot sizes. I can't find a reason for that differentiation, so I'm wondering if anyone here might know, or if those borders should be the same. Thanks, CMD ( talk) 18:51, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
Does anyone think this Undiscussed move is a good idea? Fob.schools ( talk) 09:23, 25 July 2020 (UTC)
Society of United Irishmen and Unionism in Ireland have both undergone drastic changes recently. Here is the version of the United Irishmen article I propose to revert to, and here is the version of the Unionism article I propose to revert to. While neither version is perfect, the discussion at Talk:Irish nationalism#Recent edits came to the consensus that similar drastic edits by the same editor on that article had substantially degraded the quality of the article. There may well be content in the current versions that can be salvaged, and the reverts would not prevent a discussion taking place as to the merits of any content. But I don't believe the "personal essay"s are an improvement to either article, and they should be mass reverted. @ Scolaire: and @ Canterbury Tail:, since you were involved in the prior discussion. FDW777 ( talk) 20:38, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
they are not yet critiques since they don't explain themselves. This has been explained repeatedly, by multiple editors. I will say it once more. Your. Writing. Style. Is. Not. Suitable. For. An. Encyclopedia. There is no need to even point out specific examples, although they have been pointed out already, since the critique applies to every single sentence you have written. FDW777 ( talk) 12:25, 6 July 2020 (UTC)
I'll need to take a look at the articles to see for myself before making a judgment. @ Scolaire: really? I thought that was Irish Volunteers (18th century). Must give that a look to see what's happened it over the past few years. I also like how you worded that. Mabuska (talk) 15:48, 6 July 2020 (UTC)
may well be content in the current versions that can be salvaged. Since ManfredHugh has the references, he can re-write the offending text. FDW777 ( talk) 17:36, 6 July 2020 (UTC)
may well be content in the current versions that can be salvaged". If the problem with ManfredHugh's edits is as FDW777 states: "
Your. Writing. Style. Is. Not. Suitable. For. An. Encyclopedia", then surely the whole thing is salvageable as the issue is not the information but the writing style. Mabuska (talk) 18:11, 6 July 2020 (UTC)
Since ManfredHugh has the references, he can re-write the offending text.- it's a bit hard too when the editor doesn't know what exactly is "offending". And as you are the one highlighting the issue and proposal such a harsh draconian measure when the only issue is writing style, the burden and onus is one you to help as much as possible. Mabuska (talk) 18:11, 6 July 2020 (UTC)
Presbyterians were privileged to sit in Parliament in Dublin. In 1790, the future nemesis of the Society, the son of a gentrified Presbyterian family, Robert Stewart (Viscount Castlereagh), had won a county seat south of Belfast as a "friend of the people". But with its enfranchised forty-shilling freeholders, his had been a rare contest. Two thirds of the Irish House of Commons represented boroughs in the "pockets" of the Kingdom's largest proprietors. Belfast's two MPs were elected by the thirteen members of the corporation, all nominees of the Chichesters, Marquesses of Donegall. Against the Ascendancy's tithes, rack rents and sacramental tests, and against English restriction of Irish manufacture, Presbyterians voted with their feet: from 1710 to 1775, over 200,000 sailed for the North American colonies. When the American Revolutionary War commenced, the Reverend William Steel Dickson, who was to both campaign for Stewart and join the Society, remarked "there is scarcely a Protestant family of the middle classes amongst us who does not reckon kindred with the inhabitants of the extensive continent".
All: I have no opinion on reversion, or not. But, either way, some wordings confuse a foreigner. I request that, after the decided action, or not, has happened, that some knowledgable editor(s) revise these and related articles to include precise meanings of the word "Protestant" within the contexts of these articles, and also within the contexts of the "Isles". These articles use the word "Protestant" with a different meaning(s) than is(are) usually understood in my native USA. It took me years to understand Isles' terminology(ies) of Christian religions, despite listening to my late English father. See my longer discussion about this confusion with @ManfredHugh: Talk:Unionism in Ireland#Confusing: what kind(s) of Protestants were/are unionists? . Tx. Acwilson9 ( talk) 20:11, 26 July 2020 (UTC)
I am trying to improve the article List of organisations based in the Republic of Ireland with royal patronage that explains why certain organisations in the Republic of Ireland have Royal Patronage/Prefix such as the Royal Irish Academy despite Ireland no longer being a monarchy. I would appreciate any help in writing up the header, adding organisations to the list and cleaning up the list. C. 22468 Talk to me 20:53, 3 August 2020 (UTC)
Please see Talk:Operation Demetrius#Requested move 9 August 2020. Thank you. FDW777 ( talk) 14:27, 9 August 2020 (UTC)
I was making my way through the Irish writer stubs (trying to find some articles for UCD students to work on in the new semester) and I came across this cluster of articles:
Should the first article become a redirect to one or other of the brothers' articles. Given they are all stubs (or near to), having the three articles seems overkill? Smirkybec ( talk) 16:48, 14 August 2020 (UTC)
Right now, the Chris Mullin page automatically leads to the basketball player - at the same time, there is a Chris Mullin (politician) - the one who led the fight to release the Birmingham Six and vote A Very British Coup (which was adapted to a TV series).
I've started a discussion on the talk page there, requesting to rename the basketball player page to Chris Mullin (basketball), and make the Chris Mullin page a disambiguation page with equal representation to both of them.
Arguments raised against my proposal:
My main argument for the move:
I invite you guys to take part in the discussion.
The link: Talk:Chris Mullin#Requested move 22 August_2020.
Thank you! Maxim.il89 ( talk) 19:44, 23 August 2020 (UTC)
The map used in the Irish towns infoboxes seems to have been messed up. Discussion here. Fob.schools ( talk) 08:32, 24 August 2020 (UTC)
You're going to get tired of hearing from me! (I have also posted a similar message on the list's talk page) I was involved in running Wiki Loves Earth for the first time in Ireland this year, so I had taken a look at the List of Special Areas of Conservation in the Republic of Ireland. I was wondering if it would be worth converting the lists into tables? We have some more images of some of the sites that we could use to illustrate it from the competition, and given that data on these sites is available for download under a CC-BY-SA licence so we could have dates of establishment, size etc. This means the tables could be organised and sortable with more information, like I did on the List of nature reserves in the Republic of Ireland. What do people think? Smirkybec ( talk) 19:40, 19 August 2020 (UTC)
There is currently a move request under way for Neville Chamberlain (Indian Army officer), which until recently was at Neville Francis Fitzgerald Chamberlain. The discussion is at Talk:Neville Chamberlain (Indian Army officer)#Requested move 29 August 2020. The request is not to move it back to the original title, but to agree a suitable title. For context, Chamberlain was a colonel in the British Indian Army in the late 19th century, and subsequently Inspector-General of the Royal Irish Constabulary, a post he held until his resignation in the immediate aftermath of the 1916 Easter Rising. -- Scolaire ( talk) 14:50, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
When I wrote this article earlier in the year, I would not have believed how badly mangled it would become. As there is more myth than fact about Máire Rua out there, it gets lots of very dubious edits from IPs and new users. I'd really appreciate a bit of help keeping an eye on it if anyone is inclined. Smirkybec ( talk) 14:40, 16 August 2020 (UTC)
I’ve placed a first warning on that active careless editor’s page, as a close watcher but not so directly involved. Actions today alone would easily justify already a second warning, if felt appropriate. Such a pity, all that energy but seemingly no heed paid to good advice and example. Great work done on article improvement! SeoR ( talk) 18:58, 4 September 2020 (UTC)
Leinster Schools Junior Cup, heads up on this cluster muck, don't know where to start. Not tonight anyway. Wept. Arnkellow ( talk) 19:58, 8 September 2020 (UTC)
Should Irish Mail on Sunday/Ireland Thinks polls be included in the Next Irish general election article? Discussion here. Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 18:16, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
Hello! I am helping a new to wikipedia editor with an article Draft:Edward McParland (and I'm quite new myself!). I don't know if this is the right place to ask for help with this article? Does it need extra information or is it reading okay? Thanks very much! KerstingFan ( talk) 10:25, 10 September 2020 (UTC)
I've moved it to mainspace, the article is well fit enough for it and it can be improved here. There's enough of a queue at AfC and this doesn't need to be in it. It can be improved in mainspace. Thankyou. Djm-leighpark ( talk) 18:14, 10 September 2020 (UTC)
Asking at the project page is generally discouraged as far as I am aware or everyone would be doing it and in some ways what I did was a was a bad precedent but as several established editors had implied the article was suitable for mainspace I rightly or wrongly went a little WP:BOLD and took it to mainspace and a couple of templates I added can also be observed on the history The short description can be improved, as can the contents of the infobox. I also noted a Wikipedia alternate site had copied the draft and made it mainspace on their site already! In general I would advise new editors to go via AfC especially for BLPs. Its actually sufficient to add the correct projects on the talk page as that way projects do get visibility of those waiting for AfC, Best to ask these questions at the Teahouse, or others here may care to add something. Redlinking from another Wikipedia article page just before going live is also useful to avoid an orphan tag. (NB: I did [6] to avoid an possible orphan tag) thankyou. 20:38, 10 September 2020 (UTC)
The article is at Bord na gCon, thier website is at www.igb.ie. Quick search shows IGB is more common than BngC, which taken in to account includes wikipedia results, is quite a difference. Should it be moved?
Quick stats giveen. TIA Arnkellow ( talk) 18:20, 11 September 2020 (UTC)
Hi all, I have been chatting with Ritchie333 about a project he did a few years ago focusing on all the London locations featured on the Monopoly board. As a lifelong fan of the game, and the proud owner of my family's 1972 Irish edition, I thought this would be a really fun way on targeting Irish content for improvement. It might also dovetail in nicely with some of the long-standing goals of this project to get Dublin to featured status. There are a few red links, but Ritchie333 has suggested getting O'Connell Street to GA would be a good first goal, and should definitely be an attainable one. You can see our chat on my talk page here, and the Monopoly board in Ritchie333's userspace here. I'd love to hear your thoughts! Smirkybec ( talk) 13:54, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
Currently Irish stereotypes and Stereotypes of Irish people redirect to Stage Irish. This strikes me as far from ideal – the redirect goes from a broad concept to a much narrower and more historically circumscribed one. The theatre certainly played a role in the formation of stereotypes of Irish people, but it hasn't been the primary source of those stereotypes for a century or so, and other stereotypes have developed that differ from those described in that article. Anti-Irish sentiment doesn't have much to say about stereotypes, and Irish Americans#Stereotypes is quite detailed but only deals with the U.S. context. Can the target, or Anti-Irish sentiment, or Irish people, or some other article, be expanded so that these redirects point the reader somewhere useful? If there's no enthusiasm for doing that I'll take them to RfD, but I thought it might be worth asking here first. – Arms & Hearts ( talk) 19:08, 11 October 2020 (UTC)
Should be agree best practice for when government departments and ministers are renamed. Nearly every time a new government is formed, there'll be some rejigging of government departments (the rainbow coalition was the most recent that didn't do this). There's a reasonable instinct to keep Wikipedia up to date and rename the departments after the Taoiseach's announcement (indeed, I have myself prematurely moved pages, as I acknowledged here). However, I would proposed that pages are moved only after we see the government order with the new name, e.g. Children and Youth Affairs (Alteration of Name of Department and Title of Minister) Order 2020. There are three reasons for this:
I'm not sure it's worthwhile reversing any changes that have been made prematurely so far, but we could benefit from establishing this before the next Taoiseach moves these around again. – Iveagh Gardens ( talk) 07:40, 18 October 2020 (UTC)
The RIA announced this month that the Dictionary of Irish Biography would be open access from next spring. The website dib.cambridge.org seems to have already been made free; dunno if this is a temporary trial run or a soft launch. In any case, time for a Template:Cite DIrB along the lines of Template:Cite ODNB. There's already a wikidata property, although it's not in Template:Authority control, I guess biographical dictionaries are not authority catalogs. jnestorius( talk) 02:00, 25 October 2020 (UTC)
to " Irish English. So far mainly American support. Johnbod ( talk) 02:56, 7 December 2020 (UTC)
There are a very few exceedingly minor instances of uncited text at Featured article John Millington Synge; is anyone able to fill those in? I have not tagged those instances as I do not want to deface the article. See WP:URFA/2020. @ Ceoil: SandyGeorgia ( Talk) 14:29, 23 November 2020 (UTC)
Synge looks reasonable now for marking as "Satisfactory" at WP:URFA/2020. Could Irish knowledgeable editors please have a look and comment on the article talk page if there are any outstanding deficiencies? SandyGeorgia ( Talk) 16:44, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
Please help to save this stub. Bearian ( talk) 00:36, 19 December 2020 (UTC)
The Mother and Baby Homes Commission of Investigation article is getting a lot of attention this week with the publication of its final report. Unfortunately this includes some editors wanting to change the likes of 'Taoiseach' to 'prime minister', so more eyes welcome. Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 01:31, 17 January 2021 (UTC)
Hi all, I just noticed an edit to the Department of Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth, for which one of the citations used is Gript. Given its stance and politics, I would suggest that it is not a relaible source in the same way that Russia Today and the Daily Mail is not. I've never ventured down the path of flagging a source before, is there anyone that might give me a hand in this? As it is quite specifically an Irish source, I wanted to see what other editors thought about it. Pinging @ Spleodrach: @ Guliolopez: as you might have feelings on this? Smirkybec ( talk) 19:35, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
Hey everyone,
I'm new to Wikipedia and have interests in Irish culture and the arts/music.
My first article
Ballet Ireland was approved today and given a C rating.
In order to gain experience I would be willing to take on some grunt work(adding citations, fixing grammar etc) under the scope of the Ireland project.
Can somebody flag articles with this need or point me to a resource where I could find such articles?
Many thanks! Midnight713 ( talk) 08:31, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
Excellent thanks very much! Wow, a lot of work to be done but I don’t mind tackling bits when time allows. Little by little I suppose. Yes the youth ballet could be a nice 2nd article for sure! I will look into them this week. I have a number of Irish musicians in mind. The country is full of notable musicians but the list on Wikipedia seems to mostly cover pop etc. I think there is scope to expand out into classical, contemporary etc (bearing in mind notability and other guidelines of course) Anyway before I go near any of that I want to get more familiar with practices on norms on here and will occupy myself with that short list you provided ;)
Might add some extra info to Ballet Ireland as well when I research them in further detail.
Many thanks!
Midnight713 (
talk) 11:12, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
Smirkybec You’re very welcome! I’m not a regular Ballet-goer but I attended a concert of theirs in 2014 or 15(can’t remember which) in the Gaiety and have been to a few other since. I think the Cork one has a page? Maybe under a different name. Will check out the Cork Orchestral Society. I find the coverage of non-popular music (classical,contemporary) to be a bit lacking so I will do a bit of searching over the next while for this type of thing. Like I said to SeoR, I have other things I can do to help before that though, like chipping away at this quite considerable backlog of items. Many thanks Midnight713 ( talk) 11:22, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
Smirkybec SeoR I started out looking at some musicians on that list you gave me. Dear oh dear....Some stuff is just a single line of text and in this case I found a article of a 'living person' who is actually dead so I changed it. I felt a bit unsure about making such a drastic change to a page(even though it is a stub) so when ye have time, would ye mind taking a look? Page is Antoinette McKenna Many thanks and sorry for the many messages here. Once I get my footing, I'll feel more confident about these edits without having to ask all the time Midnight713 ( talk) 12:42, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
Midnight713 ( talk) 13:10, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
Smirkybec {{u|SeoR} How does one go about removing the template message about BLP from the Antoinette McKenna page? I doubt I have the credentials so if one of you wouldn't mind, whenever time permits of course. Many thanks. Midnight713 ( talk) 14:25, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
SeoR Just to let you know, I've been adding the odd citation to some of the articles on the list you posted. Learning very arbitrary information about disparate topics as I go.... Anyway, just wondering are these articles monitored automatically or do I need to inform someone or some database of my changes so that the article's problems can be either marked as persistent or resolved? Many thanks Midnight713 ( talk) 17:28, 21 January 2021 (UTC)
Hey everyone
Is there a list here of articles for creation to be requested that I can add to? I might start working on them over the coming weeks but in case another member has more time, the ones I'm thinking of are:
Improvised Music Company
Contemporary Music Centre
Cork Orchestral Society & Cork Ballet Company(as suggested by
smirkybec
Many thanks Midnight713 ( talk) 08:20, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
You're welcome, and here are the citation templates for such references:
SeoR ( talk) 20:15, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Religion in Ireland § Purpose of this page. Shhhnotsoloud ( talk) 08:08, 22 January 2021 (UTC)
Having noticed that this article was a stub, and been trying to work on Dublin articles more generally as part of my Irish Monopoly Board project, I've tried to expand it as best I can with the books I have access to. I'm not always the best copy editor, so if anyone would be interested in casting an eye over it, or even lending a hand, I'd very very grateful! Even suggestions on what infobox to use would be appreciated. Smirkybec ( talk) 23:21, 21 January 2021 (UTC)
Smirkybec Great - an article is really missed. He had a long career, and I gather did a lot of good work, though there were shadows on NMI in the latter years, due to well-publicised staff cuts, and morale and harassment issues (I think one case, involving a deputy keeper, was only settled two directors later, in 2019), and the part-closure of the Dead Zoo (I think the upper galleries never did reopen) - and I seem to recall Pat Wallace himself describing himself as having been "forced out" by the Civil Service. A pity. I'd be happy to contribute too. JSTOR would be really helpful - they were generous with access last year. Ww2censor Sounds fascinating re. meeting, and visiting the old remote storage; I only saw the outside of the place but apparently it was a treasure trove, but parts were poorly stored / suffering damage. SeoR ( talk) 22:09, 23 January 2021 (UTC)
Hi all, this is a bit of random question, but a colleague in OSMap pointed out to me that there is a lack of consistent definition of when an Irish settlement goes from being a village to a town. Has this ever come up in discussions, or a consensus decided upon? As the CSO seem to have gone with defining areas as urban or rural rather than having different settlement delineations. I've taken a look at the article on town, but the Irish section doesn't really make it much clearer. I'd be really interested to hear people's thought's on this. The reason this came up was the article on Adare, which seems to use village and town interchangeably throughout the article (in the way that the centre of Dublin is called "town", but equally it is called Swords "village"!). I presume that in the face of no clear definition, the next best thing is to just chose one and be consistent? Smirkybec ( talk) 23:10, 25 January 2021 (UTC)
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 15 | ← | Archive 17 | Archive 18 | Archive 19 | Archive 20 | Archive 21 |
The view as far as I am aware and can see across academia is that Ireland become a de facto and de jure republic in 1949 after the Republic of Ireland Act (1948). It would seem that in general or in all essentials it acted like one prior to this. No-one is doubting that, however @ Frenchmalawi: strongly disagrees and calls this a common misconception, with their preference for the 1937 "republican constitution" (as they put it. I have seen no source that academia calls it that) as the starting point for Ireland being a republic.
Currently they are deadlocked at trying to get this accepted at Republic of Ireland. Back in March they added it to this article, without a single source to back themselves up. Who knows where else they have added their POV to.
Any sources they seem to have provided at Talk:Republic_of_Ireland#“It_was_officially_declared_a_republic_in_1949,_following_the_Republic_of_Ireland_Act_1948.” do not explicitly back their personal view and original research.
So when did Ireland become an actual republic? If not with the 1948 act then can alternative years be reliably and academically sourced? This means sources that state it fact not state it "in all essentials". Mabuska (talk) 22:06, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
User:Mabuska, I’m happy to explore your question. When did Ireland legally become a republic? This is a question of law so we must look at the law. Well, United Kingdom law is very clear. United Kingdom law says that it happened in 1949. This is expressly set out in the Ireland Act 1949. In that Act it is provided that “It is hereby recognized and declared that the part of Ireland heretofore known as Eire ceased, as from the eighteenth day of April, nineteen hundred and forty-nine, to be part of His Majesty’s dominions.” So there is no doubt whatsoever that insofar as United Kingdom law is concerned, Ireland became a republic in 1949. Should we stop there? Should we accept that as the final answer and not consider anything else? Well, I don’t think so. The question, of course, is about Ireland so it makes sense that we also have to look at what Irish law says too. So, here goes, let’s look at Irish law:
1. Irish law removed the British king from its constitution in 1936. A secondary source that backs that up is “AN AMBIGUOUS OFFICE? THE POSITION OF HEAD OF STATE IN THE IRISH CONSTITUTION; JOHN COAKLEY; Irish Jurist; Irish Jurist; New Series, Vol. 48, 2012 pp 43-70. It includes QUOTE: “Two important Acts redefined the relationship between the State and the King. The first, the [Irish] Constitution (Amendment No. 27) Act, which went through all stages in the Dail on 11 December 1936, terminated any role for the Crown in the domestic affairs of the Free State and removed all references to the functions of the Governor-General (whose last official act was, indeed, to sign this bill into law the same day) but left space for the Government, for purposes of international affairs to avail of any “organ” used by the other dominions. The second, the [Irish] Executive Authority (External Relations) Act, enacted the following day and signed by the Ceann Comhairle made provision for the King to “act on behalf of the Irish Free State”, on the advice of the government “for the purposes of the appointment of diplomatic and consular representatives and the conclusion of international agreements.” In line with de Valera’s earlier thinking on the place of the King in the Constitution, then, this matter was now resolved: provision for the King would be made only in legislation, not in the State’s basic law.” This is very clearly explaining that under Irish law teh King was taken out of the Constitution in 1936; long, long before 1949.
2. Internationally, the constitution of the Ireland is often described as a republican one. Here is another source describing it in those terms: “A Federal Republic: Australia's Constitutional System of Government” By Brian Galligan, Cambridge University Press page 122, QUOTE: “After the French Revolution the constitution for France’s First Republic was passed by referendum, as was Eire’s republican constitution in 1937 after that country finally won independence from Britain” That’s an impartial source clearly describing the Irish constitution of 1937 as a republican one.
3. Am I the only one who says that Irish law and United Kingdom law do not agree on when Ireland became a republic? No, of course I am not. There are secondary sources explaining that Irish and United Kingdom law do not agree on the point. Here is a secondary source in that vein: “In the ast thirty years, there have been three distinct experiments in the ordering of Anglo-Irish relations. Two of them have failed. The first was the experiment of Commonwealth membership embodied in the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921 in which the status of the Irish Free State was specifically associated with that of the senior dominion, Canada, and generally with that of oversea dominions. That experiment MAY BE SAID TO HAVE COME TO AN END IN 1936-37 when the External Relations Act was passed and the new Irish constitution enacted with the sanction of popular approval in a plebiscite....THEN FROM 1936-49...EIRE OWED NO ALLIEGANCE TO THE CROWN AND WAS NOT, IN THE IRISH VIEW, A MEMBER OF THE BRITISH COMMONWEALTH OF NATIONS, BUT A STATE WHOSE ASSOCIATION WITH IT FROM WITHOUT was symbolized by the King’s signature to the letters of appointment of Irish representatives to foreign countries.” Ireland: The Republic Outside the Commonwealth by Nicholas Mansergh, International Affairs (Royal Institute of International Affairs 1944-), Vol. 28, No. 3 (Jul., 1952), pp. 277-291, Published by: Oxford University Press on behalf of the Royal Institute of International Affairs. [My EMPHASIS is added in parts of the above quote].
CONCLUSIONS: Secondary sources support the view that Irish law regarded Ireland as already having left the Commonwealth well before 1949. The British law view conflicts with that. There is a conflict of laws. One can properly say that as a matter of United Kingdom law Ireland left the Commonwealth in 1949. One cannot say the same thing as a matter of Irish law which holds that Ireland left the Commonwealth in 1936-1937. This is nothing new that’s being raised by me here. I have never suggested that either view must be accepted as correct. We on Wiki, simply have to report these historical matters, damn complicated though they may be. I’m sure we can all agree that law is often not simple. And simply saying that Ireland left the Commonwealth in 1949 doesn’t actually address that the position is more complicated than that. Frenchmalawi ( talk) 13:03, 4 August 2019 (UTC)
This is a question of law so we must look at the law.- directly quoting from the law it is all you can do otherwise you are performing original research and synthesis.
United Kingdom law is very clear. United Kingdom law says that it happened in 1949. This is expressly set out in the Ireland Act 1949... So there is no doubt whatsoever that insofar as United Kingdom law is concerned, Ireland became a republic in 1949.- Then it is settled. 1949 is the year. Thank you for providing that.
Should we stop there? Should we accept that as the final answer and not consider anything else? Well, I don’t think so.To be blunt it doesn't matter what you think, all that matters is what the law and what academia says on the matter. Otherwise it is original research and synthesis.
Irish law removed the British king from its constitution in 1936.- Does that make it a republic? Do you have a source that states that this constition made the Irish Free State a republic? If not then you are performing original research and synthesis.
Internationally, the constitution of the Ireland is often described as a republican one.- You've provided only this one single source and it is not an international one. Describing something as being republican does not make it republican. All that source is stating is that the constitution had republican overtones. In a real world example I prefer the name Londonderry over Derry, I prefer the name Northern Ireland over the Six Counties or the North. Those can be easily called sentiments of loyalism however does that make me a loyalist? No and nor would I be. Thus simply having a constitution being "republican" in tone does not make it a republic. It still needs to declare it.
Quoting our own Wikipedia article on the gentleman in question: “Philip Nicholas Seton Mansergh, OBE (27 June 1910 – 16 January 1991) was a historian of Ireland and the British Commonwealth. As the Smuts Professor of Commonwealth History at Cambridge University after 1953, he trained many of the specialists in the field of Irish, Indian, and Commonwealth studies.” This is the gentleman - a Smuts Professor of Commonwealth History at Cambridge - whose qualifications you appear to feel fall short of being able to express a reliable view on what the constitutional status of Ireland was during the period 1936/7-49. Apparently, you feel he could express himself on “practical realities” but his view carries not on constitutional matters. Seriously? Ahh, “in the Irish view” versus “in Irish law”. I see. Indeed. Yes, that would make sense if Prof. Mansergh had not referenced the External Relations Act and the 1937 Constitution in the very same sentence. Both are laws. But ultimately, it’s another red herring. The late Cambridge Professor of Commonwealth History is a perfectly good source for a statement that “Ireland had, in its view, left the Commonwealth” years before 1949. Do you disagree? If so, why? I don’t think I attacked you; rebutting arguments is not personal attack. It is collaborative. Let’s be collaborative and respectful but by all means challenge each other if we do not agree and feel we have good reason. Frenchmalawi ( talk) 00:06, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
[Ireland] was officially declared a republic in 1949, following the Republic of Ireland Act 1948.
"It was officially declared a republic in 1949, following the Republic of Ireland Act 1948." is perfectly accurate and there is no need to change that. Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 12:01, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
Could this be solved with the application of "de facto" and "de jure" for the different dates? The Banner talk 14:15, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
[Ireland] cut its last links with the Commonwealth in 1949, following the Republic of Ireland Act 1948.
The President's functions, as defined in the Constitution, then, are purely domestic ones; the King continued as Head of State after the Constitution came into force, and was formally responsible for all aspects of the State's external affairs.
— Coakley, p. 59
You again quote what politicians speaking in debating chambers’ views were...that’s what I was lambasted for doing at the very beginning of this discussion (see our friend Mabuska’s early exchanges with me!)., whilst being valid in one way, is not in another. Scolaire isn't trying to use those views to put something contentious and disputed into an article. They are simply using them to disprove your points based on similar sources. So not the same.
By virtue of its 1937 Constitution, the Irish Free State changed its name to Eire and considered itself a republic.
WE ARE an independent republic since December 29, 1937, the day on which our new Constitution came into operation...'The State whose institutions correspond to these articles [of the 1937 Constitution of Ireland] is, it seems to me, demonstrably a republic. Look up any standard text on political theories; look up any standard book of reference and get from any of them any definition of a republic or any description of what a republic is and judge whether our State does not possess every characteristic mark by which a republic can be distinguished or recognised...The position as I conceive it to be is this: We are an independent republic associated as a matter of our external policy with the States of the British Commonwealth.
I proposed to merge Minister for the Public Service into Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, in the form previously done boldly but reverted (there was an error in one of the headings in my edit). While the responsibilities have little in common, it is our practice here to list ministers according to the formal legal successors, even when this results in odd outcomes, such as the Minister for Economic Planning becoming the Minister for Culture, Heritage and the Gaeltacht, while the Minister for the Gaeltacht becomes the Minister for Children and Youth Affairs. The legislation and statutory instruments whereby the old Department of Transport established in 1959 was abolished, and the Department of the Public Service became the Department of Tourism and Transport are linked at Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport. This is also explained in part by Charles Haughey in the debate on the nomination of members of the government on 10 March 1987. It is also within the Appendices of Politics in the Republic of Ireland, ed. by Coakley and Gallagher. I have the fifth edition, published in 2010, at p. 455 it shows the transformation of the Department of the Public Service up to the Department of Transport, as it was at the time, now the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport.
I agree that the history of government departments are a bit of a mess, but save for separating articles when we decide the shift is substantial enough, I think following the current system is the best option, to follow SIs titled Alteration of Name of Department and Title of Minister. The Minister for the Public Service was left out when these were consolidated before, but given we have the Minister for Labour becoming the Minister for Equality and Law Reform, or the examples listed above, I don't think there's any reason to leave it as a special case. – Iveagh Gardens ( talk) 15:14, 24 August 2019 (UTC)
A dispute has emerged at Field hockey at the 1908 Summer Olympics over what is the correct flag or flags to use. Great Britain did not compete in this tournament so I don't believe the Union Jack should be included. England, Ireland, Scotland and Wales competed independently. Also at issue is which Ireland flag to use. verses . The former has never been used by Hockey Ireland or it's predecessors. Any thoughts ? I think it is important that Irish editors have say. Djln Djln ( talk) 14:25, 17 August 2019 (UTC)
Also posted at Talk:Rush, Dublin
I'm working on
Lady Elizabeth Echlin as part of
WP:Women in Red's "writers" theme for September. She lived at Rush House, Rush, which burned down in 1827 and was replaced by
Kenure House, itself now demolished except for the portico. Her entry in the
Oxford Dictionary of National Biography, written 2004, includes the intriguing: "A coastal grotto or ‘shell house’ built by Lady Echlin in 1755–6, and engraved with verses composed for the occasion by the novelist Samuel Richardson, is marked on Rocque's 1759 map of co. Dublin, and has recently been discovered in use as a cattle pen.
" I can't find anything by googling various likely terms, but am curious. Does anyone out there know any more about this grotto / shell house / pig-pen?
Pam
D 20:05, 28 August 2019 (UTC)
The Department of the Taoiseach has recently revised its website, or merged it into gov.ie, and rather unhelpfully, has removed the pages on historical background. So the pages there which had given lists of previous governments are now gone, or at least I can't find a new link for them. We've been using them for our Government of the nth Dáil pages. I've solved that in most instances by using references to Dáil debates, which are probably a more stable and direct source in any case. But it does leave us without a source for the 1922 Provisional Government for both Government of the 2nd Dáil and Government of the 3rd Dáil, which was not approved by the Dáil. Currently, the link at [1] is being used, which is now effectively a dead link. We could use the archived link at [2]. But do we have any more permanent source for this? An academic source, perhaps? — Iveagh Gardens ( talk) 20:14, 30 August 2019 (UTC)
Just to make sure the merger notice is seen before I move ahead next week, I've proposed merging President of the Irish Republic into President of Dáil Éireann. — Iveagh Gardens ( talk) 08:31, 3 September 2019 (UTC)
A few weeks ago, I proposed moving the lists of ministers into the pages of their respective government pages, so Parliamentary Secretaries of the 3rd Dáil into Government of the 3rd Dáil up to merging Ministers of State of the 32nd Dáil into Government of the 32nd Dáil, making the distinction clear of course, between those requiring appointment by the president after approval by the Dáil, and those requiring only appointment by the government itself. There was a mixed response at the discussion, and no clear consensus. After finishing a project of adding references to Dáil debates for the approval of all government ministers where possible, I'm more convinced that this would be a good idea.
In summary:
Most reference books like Nealon list them on a single page, as do the equivalent pages for other jurisdictions, and the government's website. None of these bind us, but they at least suggest it's a reasonable way to organise the information.
I'm rehearsing some arguments, if any of you have thoughts beyond this, the conversation is at Talk:Government of the 32nd Dáil#Proposed merger of Ministers of States into this page. – Iveagh Gardens ( talk) 15:22, 6 September 2019 (UTC)
I've massively added to the sources for and against in the past month. I might sign up for an account while it's still free. 78.16.41.64 ( talk) 12:57, 16 September 2019 (UTC)
Proposal to delete all portals
The discussion is at Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals)#Proposal to delete Portal space. Voceditenore ( talk) 07:37, 23 September 2019 (UTC)
Hello everyone,
I was wondering would anyone else like to help me, I want to work on getting together more Irish Charities on wikipedia? Some have pages but they are very short.
I was also going to try add mre info to The Wheel /info/en/?search=The_Wheel_%E2%80%93_Supporting_Voluntary_Activity_in_Ireland
Declanedits ( talk) 19:02, 25 September 2019 (UTC)
Hello and greetings from the maintainers of the WP 1.0 Bot! As you may or may not know, we are currently involved in an overhaul of the bot, in order to make it more modern and maintainable. As part of this process, we will be rewriting the web tool that is part of the project. You might have noticed this tool if you click through the links on the project assessment summary tables.
We'd like to collect information on how the current tool is used by....you! How do you yourself and the other maintainers of your project use the web tool? Which of its features do you need? How frequently do you use these features? And what features is the tool missing that would be useful to you? We have collected all of these questions at this Google form where you can leave your response. Walkerma ( talk) 04:24, 27 October 2019 (UTC)
The Harry Boland article was moved to Harry Boland (politician) on 11 November, with Harry Boland becoming a disambiguation page. There is a discussion about moving it back at Talk:Harry Boland (politician)#Requested move 12 November 2019. -- Scolaire ( talk) 18:56, 22 November 2019 (UTC)
Perhaps it is the upcoming centenaries of the Tan War and Civil War, but there has been a marked increase in what (with every respect) I can only describe as "well-meaning amateur genealogists" using Wikipedia as a place to publish articles on family members. Some of whom may have had notable roles in either conflict. But many of whom were, along with 25,000 other Irish men and women, peripherally involved in the war. While more <ahem> "seasoned" editors are more familiar with the WP:NBIO and WP:MILPEOPLE guidelines (which confirm, for example, that just being a member of the Volunteers, RIC, IRB, old-IRA or C na mB doesn't automatically confer notability), there are others who seem less familiar. And there are an increasing number of "my great granny met Dev once" and "my great uncle hid a pike for some lads" style articles cropping-up of late. Do we need to consider specific WikiProject Ireland guidelines on how to identify or deal with these outliers? Or, do we just leave it to the broader PROD and AfD processes to address any creations which stretch the bounds of WP:NOTGENEALOGY or WP:NOTMEMORIAL? (I ask mainly as, unfortunately, it seems like the members of this project are going to be a little busy in the next while dealing with some stuff retrospectively....) Guliolopez ( talk) 21:25, 22 November 2019 (UTC)
Issues have occurred due to replacement of etymology/name with toponymy on a couple of Irish settlement articles recently. Discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Cities/Settlements: Article structure#Etymology or toponymy or name. Thankyou. Djm-leighpark ( talk) 04:32, 1 December 2019 (UTC)
For background see Talk:Leader of Sinn Féin#Leader in Northern Ireland Assembly. At present various articles contain often contradictory information regarding the purported position of "Leader in Northern Ireland Assembly" (or similar title). While it is true that Michelle O'Neill became "leader in the North" in January 2017 and said she was following in the footsteps of Martin McGuinness, there is no evidence of him holding that position other than him being a de facto leader as a result of being deputy First Minister of Northern Ireland. O'Neill's position has been variously described in media sources as "leader in the North", "leader in the Assembly", "leader in Northern Ireland", "leader at Stormont" or close variations of those. Due to Sinn Féin's ambiguous job title, it is unclear whether she is leader in the Assembly or the whole of Northern Ireland.
As a result of this I propose the following:
Certain things will need to be changed in addition to the proposals above. For example there's a photo captioned "Michelle O'Neill replaced McGuinness as Sinn Féin's leader in the Northern Ireland Assembly in January 2017" in the Martin McGuinness article, and the section at Michelle O'Neill#Leader of Sinn Féin in the Northern Ireland Assembly. I figured it would be simpler to break down the problems into manageable chunks, so further discussion will take place here, or at the relevant articles, to decide on how to amend those articles. If I have missed any articles that need changing please say so.
See Talk:Michelle O'Neill#"Leader of Sinn Féin in the Northern Ireland Assembly" section. It probably makes sense for that discussion to take place there, since it's specific to her article. FDW777 ( talk) 15:44, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
I know we have limited bandwidth, but one thing that strikes me, as I review thousands of articles, is that our generous coverage of GAA and other sports figures (with which I have no quarrel, we can accommodate) is so unmatched in the area of academics and researchers (and also business people and entrepreneurs) that it produces a bizarre result - the Notable Persons sections in many of our third-level institution articles are overwhelmed with people notable for sports careers (often of limited, or no, relevance to the institutions) but very (embarrassingly) short on people actually notable as academics (it is so severe that even heads of institutions can be missed). Some of this is due to an overly high bar for academic inclusion (even long-term professors don't always qualify) but if anyone has some spare time (a big ask, I know), I think there must be some ready gap-filling to be done. The Women in Red initiative is closing some gaps, and editors like Antiqueight are doing great article creation work. SeoR ( talk) 08:50, 5 December 2019 (UTC)
The entries in Category:United Irishmen which are disambiguated have either (United Irishmen) or (United Irishman) appended with no consistency. Which should it be? Cabayi ( talk) 16:43, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
Hello! I have recently created a bot to remove completed infobox requests and am sending this message to WikiProject Ireland since the project currently has a backlogged infobox request category. Details about the task can be found at Wikipedia:Bots/Requests for approval/PearBOT 2, but in short it removes all infobox requests from articles with an infobox, once a week. To sign up, reply with {{ ping|Trialpears}} and tell me if any special considerations are required for the Wikiproject. For example: if only a specific infobox should be detected, such as {{ infobox journal}} for WikiProject Academic Journals; or if an irregularly named infobox such as {{ starbox begin}} should be detected. Feel free to ask if you have any questions!
Sent on behalf of Trialpears ( talk) via MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 02:34, 12 December 2019 (UTC)
Anyone see a discussion before a keen editor from Greece starting recategorising sport? Not sure they are fully familiar with all-Ireland vs separate territory governing bodies. Thanks, SeoR ( talk) 21:51, 11 December 2019 (UTC)
@ DuhallowContributor: just rewrote this page which was previously declined at New Page Review. The comment by (pinging @ Chris troutman:) was that it did not satisfy WP:ORG. At first glance, most non-Irish Wikipedia editors would agree I suspect. In contrast, most people in Ireland would presume that the local GAA club is a suitable topic for a Wikipedia article in terms of WP:GNG. However, I've reviewed some of the other articles for GAA clubs and I think there may be a geographic bias regarding sources. Can anyone offer guidance on how we could make a wp:blueink case for general notability of local GAA clubs beyond the sporting element based on cultural and historical significance in addition to community role? AugusteBlanqui ( talk) 10:15, 18 December 2019 (UTC)
Ireland, an article that you or your project may be interested in, has been nominated for a community good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. AIRcorn (talk) 08:50, 25 November 2019 (UTC)
It appears Scaramanga731 whilst doing some excellent grammar and spelling correction they have also been adding external links to the Eiretains website to Irish station articles. My understanding is this is not acceptable per WP:ELNO. While I reverted one at Sligo Mac Diarmada railway station and Scaramanga731 thanked me for the same Scaramanga731 has continued to add this link to other articles. Can people confirm that this is not acceptable, or if it is OK then I will be happy to go with consensus. Thankyou. Djm-leighpark ( talk) 22:39, 18 December 2019 (UTC)
I just came across List of townlands of County Limerick and its baby lists, all found at Category:Townlands of County Limerick. It looks like the sub-lists were split from the main list long ago with the intent that the main list would be "simpler" or less detail-heavy (see the talk page of the main list). However, it appears that the lists are identical and have identical levels of detail.
Does anyone have any opinion as to what should be done with them? I feel like we can either a) redirect the sub-lists back to the main list and leave the main list intact, b) strip the main list entirely and make it into a navigation list to the sub-lists, or c) partially strip the main list down to basics and leave the details to the sub-lists. ♠ PMC♠ (talk) 23:20, 13 December 2019 (UTC)
Ok, in the absence of objections, I'm going to redirect the split lists to the master. ♠ PMC♠ (talk) 01:04, 20 December 2019 (UTC)
Hi all. If anyone has access—perhaps via a library, or an academic institution—and can send a couple of articles over for WP stuff, I'd greatly appreciate it! Thanks in (hopeful!) advance. —— SN 54129 07:35, 29 January 2020 (UTC)
http://dib.cambridge.org/viewReadPage.do?articleId=a2437&searchClicked=clicked&quickadvsearch=yes http://dib.cambridge.org/viewReadPage.do?articleId=a5955&searchClicked=clicked&quickadvsearch=yes Unfortunately I don't have much time this week to edit content or else I would start integrating content. AugusteBlanqui ( talk) 09:23, 29 January 2020 (UTC)
I just uploaded 174 new images, mostly unidentified Dublin city, from Flickr that have very generic file names, such as "Dublin (the Flickr number)" and "Dublin" or even nothing as the description. You can find them all here. If you can identify them, please add the description and if you are a file move please move them to a better name and categorise them if possible, better then just this commons category: c:Category:Unidentified locations in Dublin though a few are identified. Thanks in advance. ww2censor ( talk) 14:07, 20 December 2019 (UTC)
2A02:8084:51BC:9A00:55D4:EB05:BAB3:FB04 has made edits to the above article that not only put comments into the body of the article but they are personal attacks (e.g. referring to "luvvie"). The anonymous editor also:
What do people suggest? This seems like a case where the above diff should be reverted, but given the personal attacks and determination this could result in more personal attacks on edits who revert the edits. Autarch ( talk) 19:32, 3 January 2020 (UTC)
Bell X1 (band), an article that you or your project may be interested in, has been nominated for a community good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. MER-C 04:21, 10 January 2020 (UTC)
See Talk:Timeline of the Northern Ireland Troubles and peace process#Requested move 21 January 2020. Thank you. FDW777 ( talk) 21:22, 21 January 2020 (UTC)
An article that you have been involved with (2020 Irish general election) has content that is proposed to be removed and move to another article (Opinion polling prior to 2020 Irish general election). If you are interested, please visit the discussion at Talk:2020 Irish general election#Splitting proposal. Thank you. Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 16:33, 23 January 2020 (UTC) Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 16:33, 23 January 2020 (UTC)
Hi there, is anyone handy at creating/modifying maps? A lot of the Dáil constituency maps for the 2020 general election are out of date (or missing). Is there a dedicated wikigroup I could ask to help? Tx, Spleodrach ( talk) 11:25, 2 February 2020 (UTC)
Hi. The Wikipedia:The Great Britain/Ireland Destubathon is planned for March 2020, a contest/editathon to eliminate as many stubs as possible from all 134 counties. Amazon vouchers/book prizes are planned for most articles destubbed from England, Wales, Scotland and Ireland and Northern Ireland and whoever destubs articles from the most counties out of the 134. Sign up on page if interested in participating, hope this will prove to be good fun and productive, we have over 44,000 stubs! Even if "contests" aren't your thing, think of it as motivation to improve our content! Hope to see a lot of articles improved as part of this, there is a £50 prize for most Ireland and Northern Ireland articles destubbed!♦ Dr. Blofeld 15:22, 2 February 2020 (UTC)
Would someone from WP:IE mind taking a look at this article? There have been some posts about the company added to the article's talk page and also made at the Teahouse which may or may not be true, but it might be a good idea to check as to whehter there is anything about this type of thing being covered in reliable sources and whether it's something worth mentioning if it has. -- Marchjuly ( talk) 05:13, 5 February 2020 (UTC)
I don't know if it worthy of an article in of itself, but I noticed that there is just one photo of the church from 2007. Given that its demolition has now been approved, should we look more photos and if not its own article but include it in the Finglas article? Smirkybec ( talk) 14:11, 6 February 2020 (UTC)
Category:Sinn Féin TDs who attended fee paying schools, which you created, has been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. FDW777 ( talk) 14:21, 11 February 2020 (UTC)
The discussion can be found at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2020 February 18#IRA Directorate of Intelligence related categories. FDW777 ( talk) 21:53, 18 February 2020 (UTC)
There is a discussion at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Ireland-related articles#Use of Taoiseach regarding to the use of Taoiseach in articles. FDW777 ( talk) 10:36, 23 February 2020 (UTC)
There is a discussion at Talk:Sinn Féin#First preference votes which has the potential to affect some other articles about Irish political parties, advertising it here for maximum visibility. FDW777 ( talk) 18:25, 25 February 2020 (UTC)
There is a discussion at Talk:Unionism in Ireland#Recent changes which may benefit from more participants. Thank you. FDW777 ( talk) 16:11, 4 March 2020 (UTC)
If any WikiProject Ireland participants are interested there is an editathon at Maynooth University on Monday, March 9: Wikipedia:Meetup/Ireland Maynooth University International Women’s Day Editathon 2020 AugusteBlanqui ( talk) 11:58, 5 March 2020 (UTC)
Anyone else got time to pitch in at this edit-a-thon ( Wikipedia:The Great Britain/Ireland Destubathon)? - after reviewing thousands of articles, it's great to have something which helps reduce the stub pile. Good fun, and almost 120 articles have already been upgraded for Ireland + Northern Ireland, not to mention the hundreds more for England (incl. Isle of Man, Channel Islands), Scotland and Wales. There are clear guidelines and tallies, and yes, prizes too, for the ambitious and energetic. Especially in a time when face-to-face edit-a-thons are off. SeoR ( talk) 18:11, 20 March 2020 (UTC)
This AfD discussion may be of interest to members of WikiProject Ireland /info/en/?search=Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Saoirse_McHugh AugusteBlanqui ( talk) 12:36, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
Category:British and Irish political parties has been nominated for deletion, merging, or renaming. You are encouraged to join the discussion on the Categories for discussion page. Place Clichy ( talk) 15:15, 22 April 2020 (UTC)
There's an RFC underway at Talk:Oscar Wilde:
What is the best option for the lead image (See MOS:LEADIMAGE)? |
Your participation would be welcome! Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 17:56, 27 April 2020 (UTC)
It's been years since I've actively edited wikipedia, but I noticed a link on Cabinteely F.C. where the article directly links to a Football Manager Let's Play by a YouTuber in the opening section. and removed it as possible WP:LINKSPAM, possibly by the youtuber themselves. It looks like another anonymous IP user has undone my edit and reinstated this, but I still feel it shouldn't be in the article, but rather than get into an edit war, I thought I'd just raise it to the attention of more active editors. 89.100.234.197 ( talk) 14:29, 28 April 2020 (UTC)
Dia dhaoibh! I've been trying to show the editors of the COVID-19 pandemic in the United Kingdom article how biased UK=England it is. COVID-19 is a health issue, which comes under the devolved governments and NOT under Boris Johnson. The article, in my view, contains disproportional coverage of England, is unbalanced and is an insult to the three smaller nations. If you have two minutes please read the Talk page and leave any comments at the bottom. You may disagree with me of course! Saol fada chuga! John Jones ( talk) 18:17, 15 May 2020 (UTC)
The date of birth for Sabina Higgins appears to be wrong, see Talk:Sabina Higgins#Date of birth. Can we find a reliable source? Verbcatcher ( talk) 23:16, 4 June 2020 (UTC)
The is a discussion at Talk:The Troubles/Archive 3#WikiProject Organized crime on whether that article belongs in that category. Wider input would be appreciated. Scolaire ( talk) 15:36, 28 May 2020 (UTC)
I've added two new list articles on Irish politics ahead of the government formation, whenever that eventually occurs:
Both of these bring together work I'd previously done on the respective government and department pages. Now that I've moved them into the mainspace, I'd certainly welcome any additions or developments from other editors. — Iveagh Gardens ( talk) 08:14, 9 June 2020 (UTC)
Does anyone live near Fermoy or can get there now that lockdown allows travel within the county? If you are living in Cork you will not be breaking the new rules to go to Fremoy. There is a bust of him there (per [4]) and as no images have been found perhaps someone can take a decent photo of it for his article. It's on the northern side of the bridge that goes over the River Blackwater. ww2censor ( talk) 11:20, 10 June 2020 (UTC)
Hello, I'm hoping someone expertise in medieval Ireland and Irish mythology can review the situation at Fir Bolg and Cath Maige Tuired, which use the same image but different captions. The former dates it to 1911, the latter to 1910. I think the latter is correct, but that's a minor, easy fix. The bigger problem is that Fir Bolg describes the image as depicting "Ambassadors of the Fir Bolg and Tuath Dé meeting before the Battle of Moytura", while Cath Maige Tuired describes it as "The expulsion of King Bres". Viewing the book image in context, which clearly labels it "The Two Ambassadors", I conclude the caption at Fir Bolg is correct, despite having the wrong date.
Do I have that right? If so, what's the remedy? I think probably update the caption at Cath Maige Tuired, replace the image, or just remove the image outright. Thoughts? -- BDD ( talk) 19:25, 8 June 2020 (UTC)
I have nominated this article for deletion. The discussion is at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Burning of the Burning Embers pub. Thank you. FDW777 ( talk) 22:09, 10 June 2020 (UTC)
Given the recent moves to remove a number of statues and memorials to Leopold II of Belgium, would anyone else be interested on working on Casement's article with me? It has had a lot of those maintenance tags for a long time, and would be great to tackle them. I have access to the DIB and ONDB as well as some journals, so could make a start? Smirkybec ( talk) 23:13, 13 June 2020 (UTC)
There is a discussion about the scope of the List of disasters in Great Britain and Ireland by death toll taking place at Talk:List of disasters in Great Britain and Ireland by death toll#Scope of the list. Please feel free to join in. Mjroots ( talk) 11:11, 14 June 2020 (UTC)
Hi all, just over from WikiProject Cricket! We're in need of photos of cricket grounds that have hosted one of the three major formats of cricket at either international or domestic level. This is the list of grounds we need photos for, most of which are in and around Dublin. If anyone has some spare time and lives close to these, any photos would be much appreciated. Cheers! StickyWicket ( talk) 10:54, 23 June 2020 (UTC)
File:Anglesea-cricket-ground.jpg
File:The-dig.jpg — Preceding unsigned comment added by Daniton999 ( talk • contribs) 11:02, 23 June 2020 (UTC)
There were images of Castle Avenue and Sydney Parade on Commons and Geograph respectively. I have added them to the relevant articles. I personally cannot assist with the others. Guliolopez ( talk) 13:07, 23 June 2020 (UTC)
Hi all, can't seem to find it in the notability guides, but would being elected the president of the Union of Students of Ireland confer notability? I'm thinking of the incumbent or more recent presidents rather than those how have a career since. Thanks! Smirkybec ( talk) 19:40, 24 June 2020 (UTC)
There is a discussion at Talk:Irish nationalism#Recent edits about a complete rewrite currently being done by ManfredHugh. Some more input would be appreciated. Scolaire ( talk) 23:00, 28 June 2020 (UTC)
Please help or delete the page. Xx236 ( talk) 11:54, 30 June 2020 (UTC)
This article doesn't seem to serve any purpose other than as an advert, complete with how good the classes are and how much it costs. Is this notable? Regards! Usedtobecool ☎️ 09:17, 30 June 2020 (UTC)
Along with a number of other articles which use the subject's Irish-language name, the articles on a number of "historic" Irish-language poets were recently moved. For example:
In each case, the rationale given for the move was a reference to WP:UE. Without discussion or otherwise. And in a manner which totally ignored WP:COMMONNAME and WP:IMOS.
I have NEVER ONCE heard any of these subjects referred to by anything other than their (common) Irish name. And will admit to being taken aback by the notion that some these were/are known by anything other than their Irish names. However, if (as dispassionately as possible) I take just Peadar Ó Doirnín, I would note that this is the subject's COMMONNAME in English-language sources. Peter O'Dornan is entirely a neologism. Having just 9 Google search results (and only ONE OF THOSE seems to relate to the subject in question). On the other hand, the original title, Peadar Ó Doirnín, has upwards of 8,000 results. Confirming that it is by ANY MEASURE the COMMONNAME of the subject. Including in English-language sources.
I am absolutely going to be advocating that Peadar Ó Doirnín be moved "back" to the more appropriate and common-name (over the proposed neolgism). Immediately. And will likely undertake a review of the others on a case-by-case basis.
That being said, I am opening this thread here to confirm whether there is any consensus (or what that consensus might be) for confirming that WP:UE does not "trump" WP:COMMONNAME and WP:OR. Guliolopez ( talk) 20:20, 2 July 2020 (UTC)
The choice between anglicized and local spellings should follow English-language usage, e.g. the non-anglicized titles Besançon, Søren Kierkegaard, and Göttingen are used because they predominate in English-language reliable sources. So in the case of Peadar Ó Doirnín, it's obvious this was an erroneous move carried out without any due diligence as there's no way Peter O'Dornan is the predominant use in English. I'd say that makes all the other moves equally as questionable, so would suggest a mass move back without discussion, and anyone objecting to the existing names should start move requests. FDW777 ( talk) 20:59, 2 July 2020 (UTC)
I would agree with this. Peadar Ó Doirnín does appear to be the more common usage and there are several pages already with Irish names where an English one is available. Obviously, as I am a new user, I would take everything I say with a pinch of salt as I am still finding my feet. DarkerDai ( talk) 21:36, 2 July 2020 (UTC)
I have moved these three articles back, plus Tadhg Gaelach Ó Súilleabháin. Pinging Mabuska, since nobody else did. Scolaire ( talk) 22:06, 2 July 2020 (UTC)
"I have NEVER ONCE heard any of these subjects referred to by anything other than their (common) Irish name. And will admit to being taken aback by the notion that some these were/are known by anything other than their Irish names"in order to get their point of view across. Sadly, Guliolopez undermines the force of their own argument by such a ridiculous POV statement. Just look at the blue plaque photo for Art McCooey on the page about Art McCooey by the Ulster Historical Society ( here) to appreciate the 'unhelpfulness' of such a wild assertion. If one has 'NEVER ONCE' heard anything said, it's quite possibly because one has chosen to close ones mind and ears. Feel free to carry on with the debate - I have no interest in it - but do try to act rationally and even-handedly in all discussions folks, please, and for the betterment of this encyclopaedia and not of your own personal agenda(s). Nick Moyes ( talk) 22:09, 2 July 2020 (UTC)
This ties in with a discussion going on at Talk:Grace O'Malley about a move proposal to Gráinne Ní Mháille ☕ Antiqueight chatter 22:20, 2 July 2020 (UTC)
In regards to the medieval-early modern period articles such as Owen Roe etc, most are actually restorations to their original namespace after having being moved without discussion by Fergainanim and Claiomh Solais who are big proponents of Irish name everything regardless. Indeed it is fixing their moves that brought me into this current issue. Mabuska (talk) 12:26, 3 July 2020 (UTC)
Recently @ FDW777: removed post-Troubles incidents from the The Troubles in Ardoyne article on the point that they did not happen during the Troubles and demanded citations to support their inclusion.
Now these incidents have been in this article and other such Troubles lists for years with no problems. Even the article Timeline of the Troubles goes up to 2007.
There is an argument to be made that post-Troubles incidents deserve mention as many are Troubles related or spin-offs from it. Indeed as it was the Troubles that started the proliferation of paramilitary groups and their membership, all of which still exist in some form or another today and still carrying out incidents, they are Troubles related. Splinter-groups likewise are continuations of the same.
If FDW777 is adamant that they can't be included as the articles are formatted at the moment there is no reason why such "The Troubles in ..." articles can't have a "Post-Troubles" section listing such incidents afterwards.
Either that of we start a needless proliferation of new articles titled "Terrorist incidents in ..." etc.
Mabuska (talk) 13:36, 28 June 2020 (UTC)
The Omagh bombing was part of the Troubles. The Real IRA were responsible for the bombing. Therefore this Real IRA bombing from 20xx was part of the Troubles. As already said Timeline of the Troubles goes up to 2007, with good reason. Or at least a good reason to extend after 1998. If 1998 was the cut-off date, the timeline wouldn't include IRA decommissioning, the formal end of their armed campaign in 2005, the UVF's formal end to their armed campaign in 2007 etc etc etc. It would be a very strange timeline indeed for those things not to be included. FDW777 ( talk) 16:50, 28 June 2020 (UTC)
12 July: The CIRA was blamed for attacking PSNI officers with blast bombs during rioting in the Ardoyne area of north Belfast, following an Orange Order parade. Eighty officers were injured, one seriously, and several people were arrested
13 July: The RIRA was blamed for shooting at the PSNI in the Ardoyne area of North Belfast during heavy rioting after an Orange Order parade
11 September: The CIRA claimed responsibility for the punishment shootings of two men in the Ardoyne area of north Belfast.
I didn't realise you had responded yesterday so my apologies for that. I disagree with you however on your recent argument. Lists of Troubles incidents are mentioned in geographical place articles were they don't merit their own "The Troubles in" pages. Yet most places have a link to a specific list of incidents. If it wasn't relevant to geographical places then why does Derry and Ardoyne or anywhere else with them even have Troubles sub-sections in the first place? Because it is relevant to them. struck as I realise you are on about dissident.
On testamount, it may be more to do with certain editor bias' (not saying you) or lack of interest in editors, or lack of editors, adding the information that is playing a part. Mabuska (talk) 16:12, 3 July 2020 (UTC)
The Derry 32CSM websitetalking about an incident in Dublin). Add on the other dissident groups, and I'd suggest 50 incidents would be a conservative estimate. Are we really going to document them all in the main Derry article? FDW777 ( talk) 16:20, 3 July 2020 (UTC)
Who said anything about lists of only dissident attacks? I am talking about Post Troubles incidents regardless of whoever carried them out. So yes such an article does have a need as those you provide above only deal with specific groups province wide and not incidents in any one area by more than one group. Mabuska (talk) 21:13, 3 July 2020 (UTC)
Please see Wikipedia:Move_review/Log/2020_July#Gráinne_Ní_Mháille, a discussion on whether the move of the article Grace O'Malley to Gráinne Ní Mháille should be retained or overturned and relisted. Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 13:46, 14 July 2020 (UTC)
I recently overhauled File:Ireland location map.svg so it is easily text-editable, with a hierarchy of provinces, counties, and local government areas. This map also groups offshore islands with their relevant administrative division. I noticed many maps highlighting single provinces often missed these islands, so this new format should make it far simpler to create specific maps. Please let me know if you notice any islands that are incorrectly assigned, or if there are other issues.
I'm trying to extend this system to Northern Ireland, based on maps such as File:Island of Ireland location map Offaly.svg, as existing maps such as File:Island of Ireland location map.svg are missing the differences between the traditional country borders and the current district borders. On that Offaly map, the pre-2015 borders have two different dot sizes. I can't find a reason for that differentiation, so I'm wondering if anyone here might know, or if those borders should be the same. Thanks, CMD ( talk) 18:51, 17 July 2020 (UTC)
Does anyone think this Undiscussed move is a good idea? Fob.schools ( talk) 09:23, 25 July 2020 (UTC)
Society of United Irishmen and Unionism in Ireland have both undergone drastic changes recently. Here is the version of the United Irishmen article I propose to revert to, and here is the version of the Unionism article I propose to revert to. While neither version is perfect, the discussion at Talk:Irish nationalism#Recent edits came to the consensus that similar drastic edits by the same editor on that article had substantially degraded the quality of the article. There may well be content in the current versions that can be salvaged, and the reverts would not prevent a discussion taking place as to the merits of any content. But I don't believe the "personal essay"s are an improvement to either article, and they should be mass reverted. @ Scolaire: and @ Canterbury Tail:, since you were involved in the prior discussion. FDW777 ( talk) 20:38, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
they are not yet critiques since they don't explain themselves. This has been explained repeatedly, by multiple editors. I will say it once more. Your. Writing. Style. Is. Not. Suitable. For. An. Encyclopedia. There is no need to even point out specific examples, although they have been pointed out already, since the critique applies to every single sentence you have written. FDW777 ( talk) 12:25, 6 July 2020 (UTC)
I'll need to take a look at the articles to see for myself before making a judgment. @ Scolaire: really? I thought that was Irish Volunteers (18th century). Must give that a look to see what's happened it over the past few years. I also like how you worded that. Mabuska (talk) 15:48, 6 July 2020 (UTC)
may well be content in the current versions that can be salvaged. Since ManfredHugh has the references, he can re-write the offending text. FDW777 ( talk) 17:36, 6 July 2020 (UTC)
may well be content in the current versions that can be salvaged". If the problem with ManfredHugh's edits is as FDW777 states: "
Your. Writing. Style. Is. Not. Suitable. For. An. Encyclopedia", then surely the whole thing is salvageable as the issue is not the information but the writing style. Mabuska (talk) 18:11, 6 July 2020 (UTC)
Since ManfredHugh has the references, he can re-write the offending text.- it's a bit hard too when the editor doesn't know what exactly is "offending". And as you are the one highlighting the issue and proposal such a harsh draconian measure when the only issue is writing style, the burden and onus is one you to help as much as possible. Mabuska (talk) 18:11, 6 July 2020 (UTC)
Presbyterians were privileged to sit in Parliament in Dublin. In 1790, the future nemesis of the Society, the son of a gentrified Presbyterian family, Robert Stewart (Viscount Castlereagh), had won a county seat south of Belfast as a "friend of the people". But with its enfranchised forty-shilling freeholders, his had been a rare contest. Two thirds of the Irish House of Commons represented boroughs in the "pockets" of the Kingdom's largest proprietors. Belfast's two MPs were elected by the thirteen members of the corporation, all nominees of the Chichesters, Marquesses of Donegall. Against the Ascendancy's tithes, rack rents and sacramental tests, and against English restriction of Irish manufacture, Presbyterians voted with their feet: from 1710 to 1775, over 200,000 sailed for the North American colonies. When the American Revolutionary War commenced, the Reverend William Steel Dickson, who was to both campaign for Stewart and join the Society, remarked "there is scarcely a Protestant family of the middle classes amongst us who does not reckon kindred with the inhabitants of the extensive continent".
All: I have no opinion on reversion, or not. But, either way, some wordings confuse a foreigner. I request that, after the decided action, or not, has happened, that some knowledgable editor(s) revise these and related articles to include precise meanings of the word "Protestant" within the contexts of these articles, and also within the contexts of the "Isles". These articles use the word "Protestant" with a different meaning(s) than is(are) usually understood in my native USA. It took me years to understand Isles' terminology(ies) of Christian religions, despite listening to my late English father. See my longer discussion about this confusion with @ManfredHugh: Talk:Unionism in Ireland#Confusing: what kind(s) of Protestants were/are unionists? . Tx. Acwilson9 ( talk) 20:11, 26 July 2020 (UTC)
I am trying to improve the article List of organisations based in the Republic of Ireland with royal patronage that explains why certain organisations in the Republic of Ireland have Royal Patronage/Prefix such as the Royal Irish Academy despite Ireland no longer being a monarchy. I would appreciate any help in writing up the header, adding organisations to the list and cleaning up the list. C. 22468 Talk to me 20:53, 3 August 2020 (UTC)
Please see Talk:Operation Demetrius#Requested move 9 August 2020. Thank you. FDW777 ( talk) 14:27, 9 August 2020 (UTC)
I was making my way through the Irish writer stubs (trying to find some articles for UCD students to work on in the new semester) and I came across this cluster of articles:
Should the first article become a redirect to one or other of the brothers' articles. Given they are all stubs (or near to), having the three articles seems overkill? Smirkybec ( talk) 16:48, 14 August 2020 (UTC)
Right now, the Chris Mullin page automatically leads to the basketball player - at the same time, there is a Chris Mullin (politician) - the one who led the fight to release the Birmingham Six and vote A Very British Coup (which was adapted to a TV series).
I've started a discussion on the talk page there, requesting to rename the basketball player page to Chris Mullin (basketball), and make the Chris Mullin page a disambiguation page with equal representation to both of them.
Arguments raised against my proposal:
My main argument for the move:
I invite you guys to take part in the discussion.
The link: Talk:Chris Mullin#Requested move 22 August_2020.
Thank you! Maxim.il89 ( talk) 19:44, 23 August 2020 (UTC)
The map used in the Irish towns infoboxes seems to have been messed up. Discussion here. Fob.schools ( talk) 08:32, 24 August 2020 (UTC)
You're going to get tired of hearing from me! (I have also posted a similar message on the list's talk page) I was involved in running Wiki Loves Earth for the first time in Ireland this year, so I had taken a look at the List of Special Areas of Conservation in the Republic of Ireland. I was wondering if it would be worth converting the lists into tables? We have some more images of some of the sites that we could use to illustrate it from the competition, and given that data on these sites is available for download under a CC-BY-SA licence so we could have dates of establishment, size etc. This means the tables could be organised and sortable with more information, like I did on the List of nature reserves in the Republic of Ireland. What do people think? Smirkybec ( talk) 19:40, 19 August 2020 (UTC)
There is currently a move request under way for Neville Chamberlain (Indian Army officer), which until recently was at Neville Francis Fitzgerald Chamberlain. The discussion is at Talk:Neville Chamberlain (Indian Army officer)#Requested move 29 August 2020. The request is not to move it back to the original title, but to agree a suitable title. For context, Chamberlain was a colonel in the British Indian Army in the late 19th century, and subsequently Inspector-General of the Royal Irish Constabulary, a post he held until his resignation in the immediate aftermath of the 1916 Easter Rising. -- Scolaire ( talk) 14:50, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
When I wrote this article earlier in the year, I would not have believed how badly mangled it would become. As there is more myth than fact about Máire Rua out there, it gets lots of very dubious edits from IPs and new users. I'd really appreciate a bit of help keeping an eye on it if anyone is inclined. Smirkybec ( talk) 14:40, 16 August 2020 (UTC)
I’ve placed a first warning on that active careless editor’s page, as a close watcher but not so directly involved. Actions today alone would easily justify already a second warning, if felt appropriate. Such a pity, all that energy but seemingly no heed paid to good advice and example. Great work done on article improvement! SeoR ( talk) 18:58, 4 September 2020 (UTC)
Leinster Schools Junior Cup, heads up on this cluster muck, don't know where to start. Not tonight anyway. Wept. Arnkellow ( talk) 19:58, 8 September 2020 (UTC)
Should Irish Mail on Sunday/Ireland Thinks polls be included in the Next Irish general election article? Discussion here. Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 18:16, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
Hello! I am helping a new to wikipedia editor with an article Draft:Edward McParland (and I'm quite new myself!). I don't know if this is the right place to ask for help with this article? Does it need extra information or is it reading okay? Thanks very much! KerstingFan ( talk) 10:25, 10 September 2020 (UTC)
I've moved it to mainspace, the article is well fit enough for it and it can be improved here. There's enough of a queue at AfC and this doesn't need to be in it. It can be improved in mainspace. Thankyou. Djm-leighpark ( talk) 18:14, 10 September 2020 (UTC)
Asking at the project page is generally discouraged as far as I am aware or everyone would be doing it and in some ways what I did was a was a bad precedent but as several established editors had implied the article was suitable for mainspace I rightly or wrongly went a little WP:BOLD and took it to mainspace and a couple of templates I added can also be observed on the history The short description can be improved, as can the contents of the infobox. I also noted a Wikipedia alternate site had copied the draft and made it mainspace on their site already! In general I would advise new editors to go via AfC especially for BLPs. Its actually sufficient to add the correct projects on the talk page as that way projects do get visibility of those waiting for AfC, Best to ask these questions at the Teahouse, or others here may care to add something. Redlinking from another Wikipedia article page just before going live is also useful to avoid an orphan tag. (NB: I did [6] to avoid an possible orphan tag) thankyou. 20:38, 10 September 2020 (UTC)
The article is at Bord na gCon, thier website is at www.igb.ie. Quick search shows IGB is more common than BngC, which taken in to account includes wikipedia results, is quite a difference. Should it be moved?
Quick stats giveen. TIA Arnkellow ( talk) 18:20, 11 September 2020 (UTC)
Hi all, I have been chatting with Ritchie333 about a project he did a few years ago focusing on all the London locations featured on the Monopoly board. As a lifelong fan of the game, and the proud owner of my family's 1972 Irish edition, I thought this would be a really fun way on targeting Irish content for improvement. It might also dovetail in nicely with some of the long-standing goals of this project to get Dublin to featured status. There are a few red links, but Ritchie333 has suggested getting O'Connell Street to GA would be a good first goal, and should definitely be an attainable one. You can see our chat on my talk page here, and the Monopoly board in Ritchie333's userspace here. I'd love to hear your thoughts! Smirkybec ( talk) 13:54, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
Currently Irish stereotypes and Stereotypes of Irish people redirect to Stage Irish. This strikes me as far from ideal – the redirect goes from a broad concept to a much narrower and more historically circumscribed one. The theatre certainly played a role in the formation of stereotypes of Irish people, but it hasn't been the primary source of those stereotypes for a century or so, and other stereotypes have developed that differ from those described in that article. Anti-Irish sentiment doesn't have much to say about stereotypes, and Irish Americans#Stereotypes is quite detailed but only deals with the U.S. context. Can the target, or Anti-Irish sentiment, or Irish people, or some other article, be expanded so that these redirects point the reader somewhere useful? If there's no enthusiasm for doing that I'll take them to RfD, but I thought it might be worth asking here first. – Arms & Hearts ( talk) 19:08, 11 October 2020 (UTC)
Should be agree best practice for when government departments and ministers are renamed. Nearly every time a new government is formed, there'll be some rejigging of government departments (the rainbow coalition was the most recent that didn't do this). There's a reasonable instinct to keep Wikipedia up to date and rename the departments after the Taoiseach's announcement (indeed, I have myself prematurely moved pages, as I acknowledged here). However, I would proposed that pages are moved only after we see the government order with the new name, e.g. Children and Youth Affairs (Alteration of Name of Department and Title of Minister) Order 2020. There are three reasons for this:
I'm not sure it's worthwhile reversing any changes that have been made prematurely so far, but we could benefit from establishing this before the next Taoiseach moves these around again. – Iveagh Gardens ( talk) 07:40, 18 October 2020 (UTC)
The RIA announced this month that the Dictionary of Irish Biography would be open access from next spring. The website dib.cambridge.org seems to have already been made free; dunno if this is a temporary trial run or a soft launch. In any case, time for a Template:Cite DIrB along the lines of Template:Cite ODNB. There's already a wikidata property, although it's not in Template:Authority control, I guess biographical dictionaries are not authority catalogs. jnestorius( talk) 02:00, 25 October 2020 (UTC)
to " Irish English. So far mainly American support. Johnbod ( talk) 02:56, 7 December 2020 (UTC)
There are a very few exceedingly minor instances of uncited text at Featured article John Millington Synge; is anyone able to fill those in? I have not tagged those instances as I do not want to deface the article. See WP:URFA/2020. @ Ceoil: SandyGeorgia ( Talk) 14:29, 23 November 2020 (UTC)
Synge looks reasonable now for marking as "Satisfactory" at WP:URFA/2020. Could Irish knowledgeable editors please have a look and comment on the article talk page if there are any outstanding deficiencies? SandyGeorgia ( Talk) 16:44, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
Please help to save this stub. Bearian ( talk) 00:36, 19 December 2020 (UTC)
The Mother and Baby Homes Commission of Investigation article is getting a lot of attention this week with the publication of its final report. Unfortunately this includes some editors wanting to change the likes of 'Taoiseach' to 'prime minister', so more eyes welcome. Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 01:31, 17 January 2021 (UTC)
Hi all, I just noticed an edit to the Department of Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth, for which one of the citations used is Gript. Given its stance and politics, I would suggest that it is not a relaible source in the same way that Russia Today and the Daily Mail is not. I've never ventured down the path of flagging a source before, is there anyone that might give me a hand in this? As it is quite specifically an Irish source, I wanted to see what other editors thought about it. Pinging @ Spleodrach: @ Guliolopez: as you might have feelings on this? Smirkybec ( talk) 19:35, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
Hey everyone,
I'm new to Wikipedia and have interests in Irish culture and the arts/music.
My first article
Ballet Ireland was approved today and given a C rating.
In order to gain experience I would be willing to take on some grunt work(adding citations, fixing grammar etc) under the scope of the Ireland project.
Can somebody flag articles with this need or point me to a resource where I could find such articles?
Many thanks! Midnight713 ( talk) 08:31, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
Excellent thanks very much! Wow, a lot of work to be done but I don’t mind tackling bits when time allows. Little by little I suppose. Yes the youth ballet could be a nice 2nd article for sure! I will look into them this week. I have a number of Irish musicians in mind. The country is full of notable musicians but the list on Wikipedia seems to mostly cover pop etc. I think there is scope to expand out into classical, contemporary etc (bearing in mind notability and other guidelines of course) Anyway before I go near any of that I want to get more familiar with practices on norms on here and will occupy myself with that short list you provided ;)
Might add some extra info to Ballet Ireland as well when I research them in further detail.
Many thanks!
Midnight713 (
talk) 11:12, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
Smirkybec You’re very welcome! I’m not a regular Ballet-goer but I attended a concert of theirs in 2014 or 15(can’t remember which) in the Gaiety and have been to a few other since. I think the Cork one has a page? Maybe under a different name. Will check out the Cork Orchestral Society. I find the coverage of non-popular music (classical,contemporary) to be a bit lacking so I will do a bit of searching over the next while for this type of thing. Like I said to SeoR, I have other things I can do to help before that though, like chipping away at this quite considerable backlog of items. Many thanks Midnight713 ( talk) 11:22, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
Smirkybec SeoR I started out looking at some musicians on that list you gave me. Dear oh dear....Some stuff is just a single line of text and in this case I found a article of a 'living person' who is actually dead so I changed it. I felt a bit unsure about making such a drastic change to a page(even though it is a stub) so when ye have time, would ye mind taking a look? Page is Antoinette McKenna Many thanks and sorry for the many messages here. Once I get my footing, I'll feel more confident about these edits without having to ask all the time Midnight713 ( talk) 12:42, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
Midnight713 ( talk) 13:10, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
Smirkybec {{u|SeoR} How does one go about removing the template message about BLP from the Antoinette McKenna page? I doubt I have the credentials so if one of you wouldn't mind, whenever time permits of course. Many thanks. Midnight713 ( talk) 14:25, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
SeoR Just to let you know, I've been adding the odd citation to some of the articles on the list you posted. Learning very arbitrary information about disparate topics as I go.... Anyway, just wondering are these articles monitored automatically or do I need to inform someone or some database of my changes so that the article's problems can be either marked as persistent or resolved? Many thanks Midnight713 ( talk) 17:28, 21 January 2021 (UTC)
Hey everyone
Is there a list here of articles for creation to be requested that I can add to? I might start working on them over the coming weeks but in case another member has more time, the ones I'm thinking of are:
Improvised Music Company
Contemporary Music Centre
Cork Orchestral Society & Cork Ballet Company(as suggested by
smirkybec
Many thanks Midnight713 ( talk) 08:20, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
You're welcome, and here are the citation templates for such references:
SeoR ( talk) 20:15, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Religion in Ireland § Purpose of this page. Shhhnotsoloud ( talk) 08:08, 22 January 2021 (UTC)
Having noticed that this article was a stub, and been trying to work on Dublin articles more generally as part of my Irish Monopoly Board project, I've tried to expand it as best I can with the books I have access to. I'm not always the best copy editor, so if anyone would be interested in casting an eye over it, or even lending a hand, I'd very very grateful! Even suggestions on what infobox to use would be appreciated. Smirkybec ( talk) 23:21, 21 January 2021 (UTC)
Smirkybec Great - an article is really missed. He had a long career, and I gather did a lot of good work, though there were shadows on NMI in the latter years, due to well-publicised staff cuts, and morale and harassment issues (I think one case, involving a deputy keeper, was only settled two directors later, in 2019), and the part-closure of the Dead Zoo (I think the upper galleries never did reopen) - and I seem to recall Pat Wallace himself describing himself as having been "forced out" by the Civil Service. A pity. I'd be happy to contribute too. JSTOR would be really helpful - they were generous with access last year. Ww2censor Sounds fascinating re. meeting, and visiting the old remote storage; I only saw the outside of the place but apparently it was a treasure trove, but parts were poorly stored / suffering damage. SeoR ( talk) 22:09, 23 January 2021 (UTC)
Hi all, this is a bit of random question, but a colleague in OSMap pointed out to me that there is a lack of consistent definition of when an Irish settlement goes from being a village to a town. Has this ever come up in discussions, or a consensus decided upon? As the CSO seem to have gone with defining areas as urban or rural rather than having different settlement delineations. I've taken a look at the article on town, but the Irish section doesn't really make it much clearer. I'd be really interested to hear people's thought's on this. The reason this came up was the article on Adare, which seems to use village and town interchangeably throughout the article (in the way that the centre of Dublin is called "town", but equally it is called Swords "village"!). I presume that in the face of no clear definition, the next best thing is to just chose one and be consistent? Smirkybec ( talk) 23:10, 25 January 2021 (UTC)