This page contains discussions that have been archived from Village pump (proposals). Please do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to revive any of these discussions, either start a new thread or use the talk page associated with that topic.
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Hello, Im kind of new here but I am trying my best to make wikipedia a better place. I was told that one way to help out was removing pointless youtube links. After doing it for a while I thought make it easier to delete external links. After about the 100th time of having to listen to a crappy garage band youtube link and then having to search the article to find it I was getting sort of bored. Why not make it so external links can be removed right from the http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Special%3ALinksearch&target=www.youtube.com page. This feature could only be allowed by asking permission from an admin. It would make it a lot easier to keep track of irrelevant pointless links. Thank You for your time and have a Happy New Year!! KingsOfHearts ( talk) 18:10, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
The toolbar button for signatures provides: --~~~~ while the sign your username in the character map (below the edit box) provides ~~~~. Is there a reason for this incongruence or is it just something that was overlooked? I'd like both options to be consistent, with both producing the full --~~~~, since the two dashes serve to warn a reading user that they have reached the end of a post and should pull-up to avoid collision. -- Seans Potato Business 13:04, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
I have closed Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Wikipedia:Requests for adminship, as agreed on Wikipedia talk:Requests for adminship. Since I don't know how this process is supposed to work, I may have done it wrong. If my closing comments belong at the bottom of the page and not the top, then anyone is free to move them.
Based on a suggestion at the RFC by TomStar81 and Warlordjohncarter, I have started a proposal at Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/Proposal to add a discussion period before voting begins. Please comment on that proposal's talk page.
I hope everyone will understand that my decision to close the RFC is not "the last word". My goal was to summarize the suggestions that were made, and to observe that none of these suggestions has garnered consensus. Further discussion is welcome, as always, in the usual forums. With best wishes for a happy new year, Shalom ( Hello • Peace) 18:24, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
Why not have an edited black colored wikipedia to conserve energy? google has blackle. why not have wikiblack.com or blackipedia.com. just a suggestion for all of us who would like to help save the environment slowly but surely :P —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.86.146.156 ( talk) 21:52, 18 December 2007 (UTC)
This has been proposed several times, and it might be worth it for Wikipedia's graphical designers to collaborate and create such a skin. Gracenotes T § 00:47, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
Check your facts. I thought I saw someplace that black consumes more electricity on some displays. LCDs, maybe? -- SEWilco ( talk) 01:55, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
PPPhhhheeeewwww, for a second I thought this was a proposal to introduce apartheid on Wikipedia... A ecis Brievenbus 18:19, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
One can save more electricity by simply typing faster then turning the computer off. Remember, less consumption uses less energy than recycling. Archtransit ( talk) 19:34, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
How about giving users the opportunity to choose their own background colour? Some might prefer orange, others might prefer green, etc. A ecis Brievenbus 20:19, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
"Please make sure your entry is supported by a valid or referenceable source. Thank you for helping improve Wikipedia."
(Or ending with, "Thank you for helping keep Wikipedia reliable.")
How about a page that appears for unregistered users when they click "edit". The friendly note says what is expected, and then redirects to the edit section. -- Boozerker ( talk) 10:40, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
__(begin)...
Please make sure your entry is supported by a valid or referenceable source. Thank you for helping keep Wikipedia reliable.
Since you are not logged in, your IP address (which is linked to its originating network/corporation) will be logged in this page's edit history. It is sometimes possible for others to identify you with that information. If you create an account, you can conceal your IP address and get other benefits. Messages sent to your IP (rather than username) can be viewed on your talk page.
Please do not save test edits. If you want to experiment, please use the
sandbox.
___..(end) --
Boozerker (
talk) 21:39, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
:) On another note, we could make it so that readers could toggle a hide/show box link on and off, so if you don't want to read it again, then shrink the info by clicking it and to read the info later click it again.
You could make the entire MediaWiki:Anoneditwarning just three lines or fewer if we link to the appropriate pages for more info. For example, instead of defining what it means for your IP to be shown, frame the warning as follows.
__(begin)...
Since you're not logged in, your IP address will be shown. To avoid this, see here.
___..(end)
The bolded parts would be links. The first takes users to our policy for unregistered/registered users, and the second link explains the privileges a user gets from registering. Heck, one link could explain both.-- Boozerker ( talk) 22:06, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
Section edit refers to editing a particular section (separated by a heading dividor such as two or three "=" marks.). All sections other than the summary have an [edit] link in the article, allowing an editor to click it and edit that section only. It allows the author editing only the section they need, reduces chance of edit conflicts (as opposed to both editors editing the entire article), makes tracking changes easier, and reduces WP bandwidth load.
However, the very first section, which is the "summary" section, the section above any headers, and titled "section 0", does not have a quick edit link. You can still go there manually by typing §ion=0 at the end of the edit link, but the quick shortcut is missing. I also know you can change skins or add javascript or use a FF addon or whatever to make it visible, but the point is that the majority of WP editors won't have the link, and most of whom either won't know it even exists or will not bother typing the URL. These editors will then have to use the full article edit link at the top of the page, bypassing all the benefits of section edit outlined above.
Why not add an [edit] link to the summary section? Place it right under the article name. Here's a proposed way of how it looks.
http://img195.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=35619_edit_122_347lo.jpg (if someone registered wants to reupload this image to WP, feel free)
Since the proposed lead section "edit" link is in a separate place from the full article edit link, is worded differently from it, and worded similar to all the other inline "edit" links (such as other sections as well as templates), I don't think there'll be ambiguity that this edit refers to the summary and not to the whole article like the top link, to anyone experienced enough to know what the other inline "edit" links mean.
Consider the fact that since the summary section is most visible and read first, more people will read (and be inclined to edit) the summary section than any other section. Adding a convenient summary "edit" link should thus be most beneficial compared to full page edit, than any other edit link in the page. 24.83.195.130 ( talk) 01:13, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
At present the "cite web" template does not appear to accept an "authors" parameter, only "author". I discovered this when I noticed that a ref for which I'd specified "authors" did not show the names. Of course the work-round is to use "author". But supporting "authors" would help editors by making citation templates more consistent. Philcha ( talk) 13:52, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
The quality of Portal:Current events is dropping in my personal opinion, especially where it concerns things that are not about the last 7 days. I think its time we started doing something about it, and you are invited to discuss it here. -- TheDJ ( talk • contribs) 18:11, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
I've requested at Wikipedia talk:Upload#Please add "logo" to the list to add an option to the upload form for uploading non-free logos. This change would bring us one step closer to making sure that logos are uploaded with all the necessary information. — Remember the dot ( talk) 01:24, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
I finally discovered Yahoo! Answers today, and frankly while playing with it I feel that I'd rather use the Reference Desk. Unfortunately, nobody knows about the Reference Desk because it is cloistered away in the nether regions of W: space. Making the Reference desk into its own specific project will bring several benefits: other than higher profile it will also enable us to dedicate a different page for each question, which will make formatting a little easier than it is now. 211.25.16.132 ( talk) 01:26, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
There have been a number of cases in which information provided at the RDs has been used to update and, in some cases, create brand new articles. In particular, much of the information provided by User:Clio the Muse goes into Wikipedia articles, because Clio does not edit articles. In addition, it's frequently used when people are trying to find something but can't find the place within Wikipedia where the information might be available. Corvus cornix talk 17:42, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
I have been kicking this around for awhile unsure how to proceed. Regarding templates that must or should be
substituted (such as {{
prod}} or {{
uw-vandalism1}} respectively), is there some way a
shortcut can be created that will do this automatically? For example, if I were to type {{
T:PROD}} on an article page, it would go to a shortcut that would recall {{
prod}} and automatically substitute it for me. I can see at least 2 benefits from this: saves time and reduces confusion. However, I cannot figure out the coding to do such a thing. I tried <includeonly>{{subst:prod}}</includeonly>
but that just subst's it on the shortcut page (my sandbox). It also would need to somehow recognize the the "reason" parameter which would appear after a pipe. I was hoping for some input on this to see if it is possible with the current code available or if something new would need to be developed. Regards.--
12 Noon
2¢ 19:59, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
I use wikipedia a lot and sometimes have trouble pronouncing certain keywords and names. I then copy the words and look them up on merriam-webster because they have audio pronunciations of the words. I’m suggesting that you add a similar feature, especially for names. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 155.229.83.41 ( talk) 16:19, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
I'd like to propose doing exactly the same thing as has been suggested on the top of meta's Proposals for New Projects page = redoing the proposal system.
Just looking down this page it's pretty clear why the existing approach can't work. E.g. penubag has done some really good work on formatting how a Simple English link would work. His/her previous discussion got lost when the page got archived (like this one will). It takes time to develop and/or talk through a good idea. So this stupidity of talking all you like, until a page runs out, then throwing the golden stuff away and starting again later, is just ludicrous.
This really comes down to choosing the right tool for the right job, and in this case a wiki ain't it. Whoever suggested splitting out the reference desk as a separate project is getting close, although i would have said, "put a reference desk on every project's proposal page" might be a better way to start an improvement.
Ultimately these referenced Proposal pages could be the beginnings of relieving some of the frustration Jimmy goes on about when talking about the Foundation email list becoming a sewer. And it's not as if suggestions haven't been made about to improve things. If there isn't a clear way for wikimedians to suggest something, then over time, find and gather some interested people who can give it legs or put it to bed, we can't blame them for flaming.
So before this proposal is buried in last month's archives along with the others, could we give some consideration to choosing some kind of forum tool, which might keep and reference the threads of a similar or related proposals together, while enabling another project's people to discover if someone hasn't suggested their "original idea" in the past. It's getting very tiring watching their still birth.-- Simonfj ( talk) 21:44, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
Just out of interest, why don't we automatically sign comments? Or to put it another way, why not automatically add " ~~~~" to the end of everyone's comments on any talk space, and only require it be done manually if it is not a talk space (i.e. in votes). This is more or less what "Signbot" does and would be much more efficient. Ferdia O'Brien (T)/ (C) 17:25, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
Based on a discussion on WP:AN located here about fair use images tags done by bots, and the pending fair use deadlings from the Foundation, I've started this proposed policy/project/change at WP:TODAY. Please check it out and weigh in. The specifics as discussed above about a run for the Images problem we have is at Wikipedia:Task of the Day#Early 2008 trial run. Lawrence Cohen 16:58, 4 January 2008 (UTC) copied by MBisanz talk 19:10, 4 January 2008 (UTC) arguing for the inclusion of my own bio, but with full disclosure at least. -- LDC ( talk) 16:44, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
I've been trying to format the proposal at Wikipedia:Linking to other wikis, and wanted to see what other ideas people have before the asking the community to comment on which ideas they like and which they don't like. If nothing new comes up in the next day or two, I'll tidy up the page and pimp the proposal out. -- Ned Scott 04:10, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
Based on an article in this month's edition of Communications of the ACM, the following idea came to my mind. Citing reliable sources is one of the key pillars on which the whole Wikipedia construction rests. My feeling (based on my limited experience) is that the way sources are cited is rather messy and lacks consistency. There is also a lot of redundancy in citations. Each time an article is cited, in different articles, the citation is most of the times recreated from scratch. One consequence of this is that 1) citations of the same article in different places tend to be different, with significant variations (title mispelled, truncated, capitalized differently; list of authors incomplete, abbreviated differently, names mispelled, initials or first names in full, etc.), spanning a very large number of possibilities; 2) when an editor takes the trouble of correcting a citation, to make it accurate and conform to established standards, this only applies to the article on which he/she works, while this valuable contribution could benefit all instances of the specific citation, in all the articles which reference it.
One solution might be perhaps to have a Wiki for citations (Wikicite?), where each individual citation would be treated like a full article (including a discussion page). The lead section of the main page would consist of a citation template, duly filled out, which would be used to generate the citation each time it is used in plain Wikipedia articles. Citations of articles could refer to citation of journals or books in which they appear, and so on. The citation article could contain other sections, with comments about the citation, backed by sources which would be other citations. Such a solution would factor citations across Wikipedia articles. It would have other side advantages, such as finding all articles in which a given citation is used.
Perhaps not a new idea, or perhaps not realistic, but I needed to sound others' opinion about it. -- Dessources ( talk) 21:39, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
As demonstrated by WP:BACKLOG, Wikipedia has some really quite long and severe backlogs such as CAT:CLEANUP, CAT:WIKIFY and Category:Articles with unsourced statements and there is no sign of these being reduced. In short, if we continue as we are doing Wikipedia will be permanently plagued by backlogs which could never possibly be cleaned up. However, we do have very large number of people visiting the site.
I therefore propose that we attempt to encourage backlog clearing by the use of MediaWiki:Sitenotice and/or {{ Main page banner}}, possibly including a "maintenance month" long the same lines as the fundraiser month but with the emphasis on editing and backlog clearing and not donations. This should vastly improve the readability and quality of the encyclopedia. GDonato ( talk) 11:53, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
I'm proposing an additional category in the Template:Editabuselinks to reduce the number of posts at WP:AN and WP:AN/I, please feel free to comment here User:Mbisanz/TemplateSandbox. MBisanz talk 13:19, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
I was wondering who thinks it would be a good idea to create an encyclopedia article on Wikipedia vandalism at the page Wikipedia vandalism (currently a redirect to the page Wikipedia:Vandalism). I think the subject matter may be notable and significant enough to merit an article. What do you all think?-- Urban Rose ( talk) 01:50, 6 January 2008 (UTC)
I suggest that we consider two tiers of adminship, junior and senior. The current admins would be grandfathered into the senior level. Junior admins would have a limited set of powers, such as only blocking for a maximum of 12 hours or so, or some other restrictions. This would allow us to have more admins as we grow, and make it easier to give adminship tools to people who are more borderline. It would create an effective training program before giving admins a huge set of powers with less restrictions. It would give another option instead of just de-sysopping senior admins; demotion to junior admins. Comments?-- Filll ( talk) 00:30, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
(unindent) That is a good point, there is never a valid argument for less scrutiny of those we trust with tools. I still have concerns though of creating more red-tape, letting in vandals, or just bloating the bureaucracy. The biggest admin backlogs I've seen are RFDs (which is also an issue of a lack of users expressing opinions) and image issues (BCB/Orphan tags). Maybe if we could restrict the namespaces that a junior admin could delete (only image and main, no talk, etc), I'd see more value in the proposal as addressing a backlog Mbisanz ( talk) 07:01, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
(undent) If you look at Wikipedia:User access levels#Table, you'll see that it's a relatively minor change to add a column (say, "Junior Administrator") and to specify which rows apply to that column (as Mr. Z-Man suggests, protecting pages and deleting pages - since deletion is a reversible action in Wikipedia - are the most likely candidates). I personally would support that, while I think the reconfirming new admins isn't going to ever get community support, because (a) it doubles the number of RfAs, as noted; and (b) many if not most editors are going to think that if someone is trusted with admin tools for 6 months, why not just trust them indefinitely (until/unless they mess up)? -- John Broughton (♫♫) 15:53, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
This page contains discussions that have been archived from Village pump (proposals). Please do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to revive any of these discussions, either start a new thread or use the talk page associated with that topic.
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Hello, Im kind of new here but I am trying my best to make wikipedia a better place. I was told that one way to help out was removing pointless youtube links. After doing it for a while I thought make it easier to delete external links. After about the 100th time of having to listen to a crappy garage band youtube link and then having to search the article to find it I was getting sort of bored. Why not make it so external links can be removed right from the http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Special%3ALinksearch&target=www.youtube.com page. This feature could only be allowed by asking permission from an admin. It would make it a lot easier to keep track of irrelevant pointless links. Thank You for your time and have a Happy New Year!! KingsOfHearts ( talk) 18:10, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
The toolbar button for signatures provides: --~~~~ while the sign your username in the character map (below the edit box) provides ~~~~. Is there a reason for this incongruence or is it just something that was overlooked? I'd like both options to be consistent, with both producing the full --~~~~, since the two dashes serve to warn a reading user that they have reached the end of a post and should pull-up to avoid collision. -- Seans Potato Business 13:04, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
I have closed Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Wikipedia:Requests for adminship, as agreed on Wikipedia talk:Requests for adminship. Since I don't know how this process is supposed to work, I may have done it wrong. If my closing comments belong at the bottom of the page and not the top, then anyone is free to move them.
Based on a suggestion at the RFC by TomStar81 and Warlordjohncarter, I have started a proposal at Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/Proposal to add a discussion period before voting begins. Please comment on that proposal's talk page.
I hope everyone will understand that my decision to close the RFC is not "the last word". My goal was to summarize the suggestions that were made, and to observe that none of these suggestions has garnered consensus. Further discussion is welcome, as always, in the usual forums. With best wishes for a happy new year, Shalom ( Hello • Peace) 18:24, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
Why not have an edited black colored wikipedia to conserve energy? google has blackle. why not have wikiblack.com or blackipedia.com. just a suggestion for all of us who would like to help save the environment slowly but surely :P —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.86.146.156 ( talk) 21:52, 18 December 2007 (UTC)
This has been proposed several times, and it might be worth it for Wikipedia's graphical designers to collaborate and create such a skin. Gracenotes T § 00:47, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
Check your facts. I thought I saw someplace that black consumes more electricity on some displays. LCDs, maybe? -- SEWilco ( talk) 01:55, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
PPPhhhheeeewwww, for a second I thought this was a proposal to introduce apartheid on Wikipedia... A ecis Brievenbus 18:19, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
One can save more electricity by simply typing faster then turning the computer off. Remember, less consumption uses less energy than recycling. Archtransit ( talk) 19:34, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
How about giving users the opportunity to choose their own background colour? Some might prefer orange, others might prefer green, etc. A ecis Brievenbus 20:19, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
"Please make sure your entry is supported by a valid or referenceable source. Thank you for helping improve Wikipedia."
(Or ending with, "Thank you for helping keep Wikipedia reliable.")
How about a page that appears for unregistered users when they click "edit". The friendly note says what is expected, and then redirects to the edit section. -- Boozerker ( talk) 10:40, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
__(begin)...
Please make sure your entry is supported by a valid or referenceable source. Thank you for helping keep Wikipedia reliable.
Since you are not logged in, your IP address (which is linked to its originating network/corporation) will be logged in this page's edit history. It is sometimes possible for others to identify you with that information. If you create an account, you can conceal your IP address and get other benefits. Messages sent to your IP (rather than username) can be viewed on your talk page.
Please do not save test edits. If you want to experiment, please use the
sandbox.
___..(end) --
Boozerker (
talk) 21:39, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
:) On another note, we could make it so that readers could toggle a hide/show box link on and off, so if you don't want to read it again, then shrink the info by clicking it and to read the info later click it again.
You could make the entire MediaWiki:Anoneditwarning just three lines or fewer if we link to the appropriate pages for more info. For example, instead of defining what it means for your IP to be shown, frame the warning as follows.
__(begin)...
Since you're not logged in, your IP address will be shown. To avoid this, see here.
___..(end)
The bolded parts would be links. The first takes users to our policy for unregistered/registered users, and the second link explains the privileges a user gets from registering. Heck, one link could explain both.-- Boozerker ( talk) 22:06, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
Section edit refers to editing a particular section (separated by a heading dividor such as two or three "=" marks.). All sections other than the summary have an [edit] link in the article, allowing an editor to click it and edit that section only. It allows the author editing only the section they need, reduces chance of edit conflicts (as opposed to both editors editing the entire article), makes tracking changes easier, and reduces WP bandwidth load.
However, the very first section, which is the "summary" section, the section above any headers, and titled "section 0", does not have a quick edit link. You can still go there manually by typing §ion=0 at the end of the edit link, but the quick shortcut is missing. I also know you can change skins or add javascript or use a FF addon or whatever to make it visible, but the point is that the majority of WP editors won't have the link, and most of whom either won't know it even exists or will not bother typing the URL. These editors will then have to use the full article edit link at the top of the page, bypassing all the benefits of section edit outlined above.
Why not add an [edit] link to the summary section? Place it right under the article name. Here's a proposed way of how it looks.
http://img195.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=35619_edit_122_347lo.jpg (if someone registered wants to reupload this image to WP, feel free)
Since the proposed lead section "edit" link is in a separate place from the full article edit link, is worded differently from it, and worded similar to all the other inline "edit" links (such as other sections as well as templates), I don't think there'll be ambiguity that this edit refers to the summary and not to the whole article like the top link, to anyone experienced enough to know what the other inline "edit" links mean.
Consider the fact that since the summary section is most visible and read first, more people will read (and be inclined to edit) the summary section than any other section. Adding a convenient summary "edit" link should thus be most beneficial compared to full page edit, than any other edit link in the page. 24.83.195.130 ( talk) 01:13, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
At present the "cite web" template does not appear to accept an "authors" parameter, only "author". I discovered this when I noticed that a ref for which I'd specified "authors" did not show the names. Of course the work-round is to use "author". But supporting "authors" would help editors by making citation templates more consistent. Philcha ( talk) 13:52, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
The quality of Portal:Current events is dropping in my personal opinion, especially where it concerns things that are not about the last 7 days. I think its time we started doing something about it, and you are invited to discuss it here. -- TheDJ ( talk • contribs) 18:11, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
I've requested at Wikipedia talk:Upload#Please add "logo" to the list to add an option to the upload form for uploading non-free logos. This change would bring us one step closer to making sure that logos are uploaded with all the necessary information. — Remember the dot ( talk) 01:24, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
I finally discovered Yahoo! Answers today, and frankly while playing with it I feel that I'd rather use the Reference Desk. Unfortunately, nobody knows about the Reference Desk because it is cloistered away in the nether regions of W: space. Making the Reference desk into its own specific project will bring several benefits: other than higher profile it will also enable us to dedicate a different page for each question, which will make formatting a little easier than it is now. 211.25.16.132 ( talk) 01:26, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
There have been a number of cases in which information provided at the RDs has been used to update and, in some cases, create brand new articles. In particular, much of the information provided by User:Clio the Muse goes into Wikipedia articles, because Clio does not edit articles. In addition, it's frequently used when people are trying to find something but can't find the place within Wikipedia where the information might be available. Corvus cornix talk 17:42, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
I have been kicking this around for awhile unsure how to proceed. Regarding templates that must or should be
substituted (such as {{
prod}} or {{
uw-vandalism1}} respectively), is there some way a
shortcut can be created that will do this automatically? For example, if I were to type {{
T:PROD}} on an article page, it would go to a shortcut that would recall {{
prod}} and automatically substitute it for me. I can see at least 2 benefits from this: saves time and reduces confusion. However, I cannot figure out the coding to do such a thing. I tried <includeonly>{{subst:prod}}</includeonly>
but that just subst's it on the shortcut page (my sandbox). It also would need to somehow recognize the the "reason" parameter which would appear after a pipe. I was hoping for some input on this to see if it is possible with the current code available or if something new would need to be developed. Regards.--
12 Noon
2¢ 19:59, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
I use wikipedia a lot and sometimes have trouble pronouncing certain keywords and names. I then copy the words and look them up on merriam-webster because they have audio pronunciations of the words. I’m suggesting that you add a similar feature, especially for names. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 155.229.83.41 ( talk) 16:19, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
I'd like to propose doing exactly the same thing as has been suggested on the top of meta's Proposals for New Projects page = redoing the proposal system.
Just looking down this page it's pretty clear why the existing approach can't work. E.g. penubag has done some really good work on formatting how a Simple English link would work. His/her previous discussion got lost when the page got archived (like this one will). It takes time to develop and/or talk through a good idea. So this stupidity of talking all you like, until a page runs out, then throwing the golden stuff away and starting again later, is just ludicrous.
This really comes down to choosing the right tool for the right job, and in this case a wiki ain't it. Whoever suggested splitting out the reference desk as a separate project is getting close, although i would have said, "put a reference desk on every project's proposal page" might be a better way to start an improvement.
Ultimately these referenced Proposal pages could be the beginnings of relieving some of the frustration Jimmy goes on about when talking about the Foundation email list becoming a sewer. And it's not as if suggestions haven't been made about to improve things. If there isn't a clear way for wikimedians to suggest something, then over time, find and gather some interested people who can give it legs or put it to bed, we can't blame them for flaming.
So before this proposal is buried in last month's archives along with the others, could we give some consideration to choosing some kind of forum tool, which might keep and reference the threads of a similar or related proposals together, while enabling another project's people to discover if someone hasn't suggested their "original idea" in the past. It's getting very tiring watching their still birth.-- Simonfj ( talk) 21:44, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
Just out of interest, why don't we automatically sign comments? Or to put it another way, why not automatically add " ~~~~" to the end of everyone's comments on any talk space, and only require it be done manually if it is not a talk space (i.e. in votes). This is more or less what "Signbot" does and would be much more efficient. Ferdia O'Brien (T)/ (C) 17:25, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
Based on a discussion on WP:AN located here about fair use images tags done by bots, and the pending fair use deadlings from the Foundation, I've started this proposed policy/project/change at WP:TODAY. Please check it out and weigh in. The specifics as discussed above about a run for the Images problem we have is at Wikipedia:Task of the Day#Early 2008 trial run. Lawrence Cohen 16:58, 4 January 2008 (UTC) copied by MBisanz talk 19:10, 4 January 2008 (UTC) arguing for the inclusion of my own bio, but with full disclosure at least. -- LDC ( talk) 16:44, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
I've been trying to format the proposal at Wikipedia:Linking to other wikis, and wanted to see what other ideas people have before the asking the community to comment on which ideas they like and which they don't like. If nothing new comes up in the next day or two, I'll tidy up the page and pimp the proposal out. -- Ned Scott 04:10, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
Based on an article in this month's edition of Communications of the ACM, the following idea came to my mind. Citing reliable sources is one of the key pillars on which the whole Wikipedia construction rests. My feeling (based on my limited experience) is that the way sources are cited is rather messy and lacks consistency. There is also a lot of redundancy in citations. Each time an article is cited, in different articles, the citation is most of the times recreated from scratch. One consequence of this is that 1) citations of the same article in different places tend to be different, with significant variations (title mispelled, truncated, capitalized differently; list of authors incomplete, abbreviated differently, names mispelled, initials or first names in full, etc.), spanning a very large number of possibilities; 2) when an editor takes the trouble of correcting a citation, to make it accurate and conform to established standards, this only applies to the article on which he/she works, while this valuable contribution could benefit all instances of the specific citation, in all the articles which reference it.
One solution might be perhaps to have a Wiki for citations (Wikicite?), where each individual citation would be treated like a full article (including a discussion page). The lead section of the main page would consist of a citation template, duly filled out, which would be used to generate the citation each time it is used in plain Wikipedia articles. Citations of articles could refer to citation of journals or books in which they appear, and so on. The citation article could contain other sections, with comments about the citation, backed by sources which would be other citations. Such a solution would factor citations across Wikipedia articles. It would have other side advantages, such as finding all articles in which a given citation is used.
Perhaps not a new idea, or perhaps not realistic, but I needed to sound others' opinion about it. -- Dessources ( talk) 21:39, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
As demonstrated by WP:BACKLOG, Wikipedia has some really quite long and severe backlogs such as CAT:CLEANUP, CAT:WIKIFY and Category:Articles with unsourced statements and there is no sign of these being reduced. In short, if we continue as we are doing Wikipedia will be permanently plagued by backlogs which could never possibly be cleaned up. However, we do have very large number of people visiting the site.
I therefore propose that we attempt to encourage backlog clearing by the use of MediaWiki:Sitenotice and/or {{ Main page banner}}, possibly including a "maintenance month" long the same lines as the fundraiser month but with the emphasis on editing and backlog clearing and not donations. This should vastly improve the readability and quality of the encyclopedia. GDonato ( talk) 11:53, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
I'm proposing an additional category in the Template:Editabuselinks to reduce the number of posts at WP:AN and WP:AN/I, please feel free to comment here User:Mbisanz/TemplateSandbox. MBisanz talk 13:19, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
I was wondering who thinks it would be a good idea to create an encyclopedia article on Wikipedia vandalism at the page Wikipedia vandalism (currently a redirect to the page Wikipedia:Vandalism). I think the subject matter may be notable and significant enough to merit an article. What do you all think?-- Urban Rose ( talk) 01:50, 6 January 2008 (UTC)
I suggest that we consider two tiers of adminship, junior and senior. The current admins would be grandfathered into the senior level. Junior admins would have a limited set of powers, such as only blocking for a maximum of 12 hours or so, or some other restrictions. This would allow us to have more admins as we grow, and make it easier to give adminship tools to people who are more borderline. It would create an effective training program before giving admins a huge set of powers with less restrictions. It would give another option instead of just de-sysopping senior admins; demotion to junior admins. Comments?-- Filll ( talk) 00:30, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
(unindent) That is a good point, there is never a valid argument for less scrutiny of those we trust with tools. I still have concerns though of creating more red-tape, letting in vandals, or just bloating the bureaucracy. The biggest admin backlogs I've seen are RFDs (which is also an issue of a lack of users expressing opinions) and image issues (BCB/Orphan tags). Maybe if we could restrict the namespaces that a junior admin could delete (only image and main, no talk, etc), I'd see more value in the proposal as addressing a backlog Mbisanz ( talk) 07:01, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
(undent) If you look at Wikipedia:User access levels#Table, you'll see that it's a relatively minor change to add a column (say, "Junior Administrator") and to specify which rows apply to that column (as Mr. Z-Man suggests, protecting pages and deleting pages - since deletion is a reversible action in Wikipedia - are the most likely candidates). I personally would support that, while I think the reconfirming new admins isn't going to ever get community support, because (a) it doubles the number of RfAs, as noted; and (b) many if not most editors are going to think that if someone is trusted with admin tools for 6 months, why not just trust them indefinitely (until/unless they mess up)? -- John Broughton (♫♫) 15:53, 30 December 2007 (UTC)