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Welcome to Wikipedia. I've added a welcome message to the top of this page that gives a great deal of information about Wikipedia. I hope you find it useful.
Additionally, I hope you don't mind if I share some of my thoughts on starting out as a new editor on Wikipedia: If I could get editors in your situation to follow just one piece of advice, it would be this: Learn Wikipedia by working only on non-contentious topics until you have a feel for the normal editing process and the policies that usually come up when editing casually. You'll find editing to be fun, easy, and rewarding. The rare disputes are resolved quickly and easily.
Working on biographical information about living persons is far more difficult. Wikipedia's Biographies of living persons policy requires strict adherence to multiple content policies, and applies to all information about living persons including talk pages.
If you have a relationship with the topics you want to edit, then you will need to review Wikipedia's Conflict of interest policy, which may require you to disclose your relationship and restrict your editing depending upon how you are affiliated with the subject matter.
Some topic areas within Wikipedia have special editing restrictions that apply to all editors. It's best to avoid these topics until you are extremely familiar with all relevant policies and guidelines.
I hope you find some useful information in all this, and welcome again. -- Ronz ( talk) 00:55, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
Hi Shinealittlelight! Thanks for contributing to Wikipedia. We hope to see you there!
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You keep making requests, as if there are problems. Are there problems in your opinion? If so, please quote. I'm happy to refactor anything I've written to help discussions go smoother. -- Ronz ( talk) 19:54, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
But you will apparently not say what you think on this score.[1] Given this comment, I hope you'll consider taking some time to help deescalate the situation. The article and consensus-building can always wait. -- Ronz ( talk) 22:46, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
Specifically: You have judged the NPR source in this case to be free of editorial bias. Is that not your "personal opinion"?Now you're making up others' viewpoints.. That's more WP:BATTLE.
But I wasn't making anything up about you.You made an assumption, and used it as a point of contention.
We have to figure out whether a source is biased to figure out whether to subject it to that special treatment.No we don't, and continuing to do so as you have so far may lead you to being blocked or banned. -- Ronz ( talk) 15:44, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
Re: BATTLE [2]: Getting an editor blocked or banned from an article or topic can take a great deal of work, and often results in a great deal of unnecessary drama. I'm hoping that my comments will get you to change your behavior: to keep your focus on content and policy, rather than on other editors. -- Ronz ( talk) 23:53, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
Hi Shinealittlelight. It's very unusual for such a new user to get stuck into such a protracted debate, so I'm sorry that that's been your first experience here. Regardless of who's right, arguments between editors are the least fun aspect of Wikipedia. I hope you find other articles to edit that don't involve the same strife. I'll save my opinions on the actual argument until I'm sure I've understood it. By the way, do you mind me asking why Dennis Prager was the first article you ended up editing? I always like to hear how people got into this. Mine was a book series I'd never heard of, Franny K. Stein, because I found a typo; not so interesting, so I leach off others' stories. › Mortee talk 01:17, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
You may want to go back and sign this post. (For others' unsigned posts you can use {{ unsigned}}. For your own, probably better to correct by copying a previous example of your signature and adjusting the timestamp). I frequently forgot to sign posts early on; this is just a friendly reminder. › Mortee talk 02:29, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
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Nice work on the revised wording at Prager. On a separate note, are you aware that you have not edited your User page? Even one exclamation point would activate it, after clicking "Save", of course. But it is up to you. Just thought I'd bring it to your attention. Bus stop ( talk) 21:16, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war according to the reverts you have made on PragerU ; that means that you are repeatedly changing content back to how you think it should be, when you have seen that other editors disagree. Users are expected to collaborate with others, to avoid editing disruptively, and to try to reach a consensus, rather than repeatedly undoing other users' edits once it is known that there is a disagreement.
Points to note:
If you find yourself in an editing dispute, use the article's talk page to discuss controversial changes and work towards a version that represents consensus among editors. You can post a request for help at an appropriate noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, it may be appropriate to request temporary page protection. If you engage in an edit war, you may be blocked from editing. -- Ronz ( talk) 17:10, 14 April 2019 (UTC)
See previous arguments. Feel free to take it up on the talk page. If Kruse's twitter feed calling this professor incompetent is due, then so is her response that was published by a RS[3] It's very difficult to take that comment as "collaborating" -- Ronz ( talk) 18:44, 14 April 2019 (UTC)
Your recent editing history shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war; that means that you are repeatedly changing content back to how you think it should be, when you have seen that other editors disagree. To resolve the content dispute, please do not revert or change the edits of others when you are reverted. Instead of reverting, please use the talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. The best practice at this stage is to discuss, not edit-war. See BRD for how this is done. If discussions reach an impasse, you can then post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection.
Being involved in an edit war can result in you being blocked from editing—especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring—even if you don't violate the three-revert rule—should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly.. Snooganssnoogans ( talk) 17:57, 14 April 2019 (UTC)
Just a little history. At the time the RFC was started, the lead didn't even contain that phrase. Isn't that astounding?!! (That sort of undermined the whole RfC, but no one seemed to notice.)
The person who started the RFC depends on unreliable sources and allows that to influence their editing and discussing on talk pages. They really wished to get rid of all three words because they don't believe it's a "conspiracy theory" or that what Trump said was "false". Well, they're wrong on all counts because RS accurately use those words to describe the situation, and so must we.
On occasion, a RS can get it wrong, but most RS get it right, and good editors follow RS and allow RS to form their thinking. Those who don't do that rightly get in trouble. That's what's great about editing here. We can learn an awful lot and bring our POV into line with the facts. To me, that makes this place a huge magnet, because I want to learn what's true, and I want to document that. I don't know what's true without RS telling me.
Here's how the lead sentence read at that time:
Regardless of that long separation between "conspiracy theory" and "false", since the lead sentence did contain those words, and it was causing much contention from a certain subset of very vocal fringe editors, I decided to resolve the matter by moving the "false" aspect to the last sentence of the lead. See this diff:
That pretty much killed off the RfC discussion and most editors drifted off to deal with other matters, but the RfC was never closed properly.
Sometimes a compromise can stop a lot of contention and edit warring, and that compromise seems to have worked, even though it rewarded and encouraged fringe editors for their disruptive efforts. -- BullRangifer ( talk) 15:15, 2 May 2019 (UTC)
BullRangifer: sure, we can talk more here if you like. Honestly, I enjoy talking about this stuff, and I'm willing to try to work it out with you just for the heck of it even if we're unlikely to succeed in achieving agreement. The issues that have really been on my mind are these:
My own answers are: No, no, yes, yes, and obviously. I'm genuinely and sincerely shocked to the point of feeling like a crazy person by the fact that there are people all over that page who deny that the FBI suveilled the Trump campaign, so that one is especially on my mind. Anyway, I'd be happy to talk about any of these things. I'd be curious to hear your thoughts. Shinealittlelight ( talk) 22:22, 2 May 2019 (UTC)
... we can't state in Wikipedia's own voice that there was FBI surveillance of his campaign (especially since the truth appears to be the opposite...).
...oppose ... [the title 'FBI Surveillance of the Trump Campaign'] until their is evidence of it actually having happeneded
[the title 'FBI Surveillance of the Trump Campaign'] sounds like it came from InfoWars.
FBI surveillance of Donald Trump campaign - fails WP:FRINGE
Nothing in that source suggests that Halper was "surveilling" the Trump campaign
Trump has been referring to the FBI's use of an informant as "spygate".Why was NBC so sloppy early on? In a way, it isn't totally their fault: I think that it was never clear, and still isn't clear, what the heck Trump meant by 'spygate'. The original tweets don't say. He makes a bunch of claims and then says that SPYGATE is going to be a huge scandal. but he doesn't explicitly say exactly which allegations 'Spygate' is meant to refer to. And so sources--early and late--have been sloppy and confusing and inconsistent with each other in deciding what he meant, right from the outset. What we have done is cherry pick the "conspiracy theory" interpretation from Vox and NYT over the "inappropriately calling the legitimate investigation a scandal" interpretation from NBC news, or the still other interpretations of other sources. This is POV, it seems to me. Shinealittlelight ( talk) 01:59, 3 May 2019 (UTC)
Rusf10, calling me a liar is a pretty serious personal attack. AGF. There is a difference between being mistaken, and therefore speaking an untruth, and deliberately stating an untruth. Only the latter is a lie. Now you've got me wondering if I got it wrong! I'll go back and double check. I'll be back. -- BullRangifer ( talk) 04:42, 3 May 2019 (UTC)
Here's what I found:
The nearest diff from just before start of RfC shows that Rusf10 is correct. I got it wrong. My deepest apologies. The wording I quoted was apparently from about 24 hours later. I apparently got mixed up on my dates. Gotta be more careful! -- BullRangifer ( talk) 04:58, 3 May 2019 (UTC)
Shine..., you wrote: "He thinks that what has been shown false is that there was a spy, early in the campaign, paid a lot of money, that was politically motivated. He thinks that Halper was the informant, that Halper was not a member of the campaign, that Halper was not paid a lot of money..."
There are several misunderstandings there about what I believe. Let me sort it out:
I hope that helps. -- BullRangifer ( talk) 05:15, 3 May 2019 (UTC)
Upon further reflection, there are two methods editors can take. Method A, sees editors including the 2019 situation into the article first. After that, then the 2018 situation is re-analyzed, and the ultimate position of the article is determined. Method B, sees us putting 2019 aside, and straightaway analyzing 2018 for its position, after that is determined, then the 2019 situation is added. It's up to you, which method you think will have more success. starship .paint ( talk) 02:56, 14 May 2019 (UTC)
Shinealittlelight, I think your approach of attempting to change stuff from the lede is not making much progress. May I suggest inserting whatever content and sources in the body first, then you would be in a stronger position to use that content and sources to argue for inclusion of material in the lede. starship .paint ( talk) 01:16, 26 May 2019 (UTC)
- not the cart before the horse... Before using alternate definitions as an argument, perhaps it would be better if the alternate definitions were already in the article. starship .paint ( talk) 01:51, 3 June 2019 (UTC)
I just noticed this conversation, and without reading or analyzing every detail above, I'll just drop a thought here. Have you ever considered that highjacking an article isn't a proper thing to do? I've seen such attempts before, and had it happen to one of my better articles ( Charlotte's web (cannabis)).
The Spygate article was written about historical events. Maybe Starship.paint won't object, but if someone tried to highjack an article I wrote, I'd be pretty pissed off. Of course ownership behavior isn't allowed, but if someone wants a different article, they should go and write it without highjacking an existing article that's about a different subject. I just had to say that. Carry on. -- BullRangifer ( talk) 03:34, 3 June 2019 (UTC)
User:BullRangifer/Negotiation table
It's best to leave the sockpuppet alone. No one knows Wikipedia policies within a day of starting their account. They must have reason to hide their previous edits. starship .paint ( talk) 11:21, 5 June 2019 (UTC)
I guess the 'fringe' view you mentioned did turn up after all. [7] starship .paint ( talk) 07:33, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
12 years and over 1000 edits never seen such intellectual dishonesty. But its been enlightening because I see the true value of wiki. A colossol waste of time and if your side finally brings around NPOV what have you won? Victory over cretinous dishonesty. Your objective nature inspired me but I have no desire to wrestle the pig anymore. Good luck to you, hopefully you choose your battles wisely. I am too weak to resist returning thus closing the account is the only way. Batvette ( talk) 20:09, 19 May 2019 (UTC)
Editors who subsequently reinstate edits originally made by a blocked editor take complete responsibility for the content.This wasn't exactly reinstatement, but the concept remains. Shinealittlelight, since it's your user talk, would you please remove that quote, or at least the parts that are about me? R2 ( bleep) 21:14, 28 May 2019 (UTC)
This is a standard message to notify contributors about an administrative ruling in effect. It does not imply that there are any issues with your contributions to date.
You have shown interest in post-1932 politics of the United States and closely related people. Due to past disruption in this topic area, a more stringent set of rules called discretionary sanctions is in effect. Any administrator may impose sanctions on editors who do not strictly follow Wikipedia's policies, or the page-specific restrictions, when making edits related to the topic.
For additional information, please see the guidance on discretionary sanctions and the Arbitration Committee's decision here. If you have any questions, or any doubts regarding what edits are appropriate, you are welcome to discuss them with me or any other editor. Bishonen | talk 23:51, 29 May 2019 (UTC).
You're both stuck on the literal use when we're talking about a figurative/metaphorical use. I am prevented from using the Wikipedia term for doing that on an article talk page, so I'll let you know here. It's called IDHT (refusing to get the point) and disruptive behavior. It might be possible to disagree on use of the term rebranding for many other reasons, but doing this is a violation of policy and logic on several levels. Why do you refuse to do the obvious and right thing by staying on-topic when discussing this metaphorical use? By insisting on talking only about the non-figurative use you are deliberately staying off-topic, and that makes communication impossible. That is stonewalling. It's not only a violation of PAG, it's not fair. -- BullRangifer ( talk) 15:09, 7 June 2019 (UTC)
I appreciate your edits on the relevant articles - seem like honest attempts to counter Wikipedia being turned into a propaganda vehicle.
"Careful, Icarus" is a reference to Craig Ferguson's Late Late Show - easy to find on youtube. Not to everyone's humour - but at least it's humour! Cheers! tildetildetildetilde
On 3 July 2019, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Crossfire Hurricane (FBI investigation), which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that the Mueller probe was born in a crossfire hurricane? You are welcome to check how many page hits the article got while on the front page ( here's how, Crossfire Hurricane (FBI investigation)), and it may be added to the statistics page if the total is over 5,000. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.
Gatoclass ( talk) 00:02, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
This is your only warning; if you make personal attacks on others again, you may be blocked from editing without further notice. Comment on content, not on other contributors or people.
You have been asked by multiple editors to withdraw your pointed and serious personal attacks against @ Tsumikiria: and have explicitly refused to do so. This is a galling violation of WP:NPA and WP:IDHT - and this warning is to advise you to immediately cease this approach, to apologize to Tsumikiria and to strike through your personal attacks. Simonm223 ( talk) 14:23, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
The behaviour mentioned above is enough to get you blocked in the ordinary course of events, it's also possible that you could be topic banned as a sanction. Doug Weller talk 14:27, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
[8] I'm sure you were aware this was coming. Simonm223 ( talk) 14:50, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
{{
unblock|reason=Your reason here ~~~~}}
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Lourdes 15:55, 5 July 2019 (UTC)Sources
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You'll have to answer this when you return from your block. I see you wrote the following:
What's that really mean? Don't you consider our articles about the Nazis to be NPOV? Do you have a COI about that subject? (Since you seem to oppose ANTIFA, is there some other reason? are you a Nazi supporter?) Or do you mean something else? I'm really puzzled. --
BullRangifer (
talk) 18:13, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
@ Lourdes: Suppose that someone says that he supports Antifa. Here are my questions:
I assume it is a personal attack to say that the person believes that political violence is permissible, since that's what I was blocked for. But I admit, I'm having a hard time seeing the difference between that and the statement in question 3 above. So I think your answer to 3 is probably "yes". But then it's really surprising to me that the statement in 2 would be allowed, since the statement in 2 seems to immediately entail the one in 3. Your guidance is appreciated. Shinealittlelight ( talk) 11:49, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
In the context of a content dispute, personal commentary is prohibited. Period. It really is that simple. You should not ever be commenting on an editor or their views. If you have strong evidence that a user is pushing their POV in an article, you can report that evidence to us. But you should virtually never have any reason to be discussing an editor on a talk page. Having a bias is irrelevant. If you don't have hard evidence of policy violations, don't ever imply or accuse an editor of having a bias or a COI. That is a personal attack. ~Swarm~ {sting} 23:45, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
"Shame, shame, shame on you for defaming what we used to call heroes."I didn't realize I was defaming heroes. I thought I was upholding principles for what we should put on our Userpages. Bus stop ( talk) 02:07, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
Do you think that all personal commentary during content disputes amounts to a personal attack? Do you agree that all personal commentary during content disputes is prohibited?Very discouraged, as it may be considered PA by others and encourages defensive statements and off-topic discussion that is not for public article talk pages ( WP:NOTFORUM, etc). I don't have much to add considering Swarm's excellent comment. Maybe only that other than ANI, personal talk pages are also less restricted to cast aspersions. Welcome back from the block, it's possible that with these comments it'll be the last, — Paleo Neonate – 05:44, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
Suppose that someone says that he supports Antifa:
1. Is it a personal attack to say that the person supports Antifa?
2. Is it a personal attack to say that the person supports Antifa, which is a violent political advocacy group?
3. Is it a personal attack to say that the person supports a violent political advocacy group?
I am reminded of one case that my hubby shared from law school, where a guy put a case on his neighbour claiming she was a prostitute. He lost the case in court. The next day, he rented a couple of billboards outside her house, and wrote on those that the lady was not a prostitute. I find you replicating what the guy did.
As Swarm rightly says, the context is important. If the above three questions are being mentioned to prove conflicted editing, then the case has to be built up at COIN, and not on the talk pages of articles. On the talk pages, you only comment on content, and not on characters of editors. If you say it on article talk pages, and don't stop saying it after being told to, you'll be blocked. It's not about the truth (she's no prostitute), but if you keep repeating it at any place other than the relevant noticeboards, and don't retract it even when you are requested to, then you will be blocked. Thanks, Lourdes 09:40, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
Ok, thanks for the replies. I will abide by the rule that there is no non-complimentary personal commentary allowed in content disputes. I will also expect others--especially those who have been commenting here--to abide by that rule with respect to me. I will note that I am concerned that references to "common sense" and "context" are ultimately opportunities to apply the rule in a POV manner--i.e., to hold me to the strict standard, but to allow others to say non-complimentary things about me in content disputes. I would be disappointed with that outcome, and I hope that it won't work out that way. Shinealittlelight ( talk) 11:11, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
Is all comment on another editor's Userbox off limit- absolutely not. You can go to someone's talk page and say "I like your userbox" or "I disagree with the sentiments expressed in your userbox. You can say on an article talk page "I see you have a userbox saying that you're fluent in Dutch. Can you help us translate this source?" or "I see you're a supporter of [x], and I'm not. Can you take a look at what I added to make sure it's fair to both sides".
In the United States at this time passions are running high...Yes, precisely. If you follow your logic, anyone who is a US citizen is far too invested in the country to write about it in the neutral, dispassionate fashion that an encyclopeadia contributor should. Imagine if someone said that all Americans, by virtue of the fact that they have not renounced all ties to the country, endorse the way that refugee children are treated in at the US border.
( ←) Tradition is that personal opinions are permitted, no matter how extreme. One can declare themselves a communist, or an alt-righter, or a young earth creationist, or a flat earther, it does not matter. That doesn't mean you can drag it into content disputes. ~Swarm~ {sting} 06:42, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
Advice to WP editors: You will occasionally find that an editor with whom you are debating, having run out of arguments, will look at your user page to find something about you to add to the argument. For that reason, you should not put anything on your user page. In particular, and this is important, never put any advice to editors on your user page as they will surely accuse you of not following your own advice.
Can you think of a hypothetical context in which it would be correct to mention on a talk page that a user has explicitly stated on his user page that he is not here in good faith?Honestly, no. First, I will say that a user who declares that they not here in good faith is typically indef-blocked per WP:NOTHERE. Being here to contribute in good faith is not a personal view, it's a baseline prerequisite for an editor. We have no reason to assume good faith if a user tells us not to. But, let's take this as a thought experiment: a highly established user in good standing with no behavioral issues adds the statement "this user is no longer here to edit in good faith" to their userpage. Should you bring this up on an article talk page in the context of a content dispute? As has been explained for situations across the board, no. You're absolutely right, you should absolutely not use this as an argument in a content dispute. You can bring it up on their talk page, to clarify whether it's a genuine statement, or you can report it to admins/the community. It would certainly be highly controversial, being either a disruptive performance and apparent trolling (resulting in forcible removal and/or a short-term block), or a genuine view, in which case the user would be blocked indefinitely. But still, even in such an extreme situation, do not personally attack them over it. In the most extreme scenario, the user has declared their malicious intent and has been blocked as a NOTHERE troll. If the user propagated a major, non-credible content dispute, in which no one took their side, then it would be worth closing the discussion with a note that the user was blocked as a troll. However, the statement on the userpage itself is not the point, and becomes irrelevant at that point; the bad faith motivation is the actual concern. So, even in this extreme thought experiment, in which a user openly declares their disdain for Wikipedia, you should still not make personal attacks on the talk page. I hope this clears things up. ~Swarm~ {sting} 00:43, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
Apologies for being a stickler, but the antifa (however capitalized) article is under 1RR protection. I would ask that you self-undo your last revert for that reason. Cheers. Dumuzid ( talk) 19:12, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
Technically, any edit can be said to reverse some of a previous edit; however, this is not the way the community interprets reversion. In the edit you cite, I did not return the page to a previous state. So while it is true that I did remove some content, that doesn't automatically make it a revert. But look, sure, I'll undo my recent fix and return the incorrect direct quote to the text, thereby obviously decreasing the quality of the article. Perhaps you can fix the quote. Shinealittlelight ( talk) 20:00, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
If you want to see how well WP:IAR works as a response to an arbcom sanction, please be my guest. Simonm223 ( talk) 12:18, 8 August 2019 (UTC)
Thought you might like 1 more RS for the most recent Andy Ngo attack by antifa https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/17/us/portland-oregon-protests.html "Officials and residents feared a melee like one in the city on June 29, when a conservative writer was assaulted by black-clad protesters." "Many have blamed Antifa for the beating, which was captured on video. No one has been charged in connection with the assault, which the police are continuing to investigate." Also interesting to see a more nuanced take on the Proud Boys: "Among the other far-right groups were the Proud Boys, an all-male group whose members sometimes share racist or misogynist ideas, and who have fought with protesters before." Mbsyl ( talk) 00:49, 19 August 2019 (UTC)
Morning Shine,
I'm unfortunately a bit out of pocket today so I wasn't able to update the entire section. I had an updated version for the KCA specifically, but hand't written much more yet. I wanted to pass it along in case you were doing some work on this section. I'll be back on Wednesday and will take a stab at some of the later sections. I also sent it along to GrettLomborg in case he was working on it.
References
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See what I did there? Anyway, your edit shouldn't be a 1RR violation since you are making a series of changes at one time. You can make a dozen individual, unrelated changes/removals and it's still 1 revert so long as no other editors make changes in the mean time. Where it gets gray is if there are unrelated changes by other editors during your changes. It's a problem if an editor reverts part of your changes then you revert/remove something in another part of the article. Anyway, short version, do long as no other editors make changes while you are making yours it's just one change. Springee ( talk) 11:38, 24 September 2019 (UTC)
I just saw your PU edits here [ [11]]. I agree with them (see the talk page) but I suspect they will get reverted shortly. I was disappointed that people seemed to want to focus on a partisan summary of the stories rather than what was actually said in the videos. I think MJ's summaries were misleading at best. However, I ran into issues with ABOUTSELF and FRINGE claims. Some aspects of the debate were interesting. I agree with those who say we as editors can't provide a counter point summary of the PU videos. So where MJ says PU claimed "there is no police discrimination", we can't say "the video actually said..." We would either need a reliable source to provide the summary or we would need PU to say "MJ's was wrong, we actually said X". The latter would be acceptable per my read of ABOUTSELF. However, some will claim that is unduly self serving (a debate I was engaged in on WP:V). I do wish more editors were more willing to consider what sources they don't like are actually saying vs writing in a way that is clearly meant to discredit. Incidentally there is a discussion related to a reporter who has been seen as anti-vax that has similar issues. I'm firmly in the "pro-vax" camp but I still don't like the way a BLP seems to want to discredit the subject rather than saying what the subject thinks and why. The latter can always be balanced out by pointing to RSs that say she is wrong. Springee ( talk) 18:29, 20 November 2019 (UTC)
...on the WLC page. I wanted to leave you a message here in case my tone in that thread seemed a bit too terse or dismissive. I appreciate your hard work on this mediation and constructive additions. I may (likely) have been a bit burned out earlier on some criticisms. Happy to see your suggestions and I can tell (looking at a history of your contributions to other topics) that they will be well thought out and productive. Squatch347 ( talk) 14:16, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
Hello. Help copy edit. Thanks you. Flopmn ( talk) 03:21, 2 March 2020 (UTC)
Hello. Jordan Peterson is under WP:1RR. As your recent revert was within twenty four hours, I request that you self revert. Thank you. Grayfell ( talk) 03:28, 2 March 2020 (UTC)
Your recent editing history shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war; that means that you are repeatedly changing content back to how you think it should be, when you have seen that other editors disagree. To resolve the content dispute, please do not revert or change the edits of others when you are reverted. Instead of reverting, please use the talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. The best practice at this stage is to discuss, not edit-war. See the bold, revert, discuss cycle for how this is done. If discussions reach an impasse, you can then post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection.
Being involved in an edit war can result in you being blocked from editing—especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring—even if you don't violate the three-revert rule—should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly.. Snooganssnoogans ( talk) 18:01, 6 March 2020 (UTC)
This is a standard message to notify contributors about an administrative ruling in effect. It does not imply that there are any issues with your contributions to date.
You have shown interest in post-1932 politics of the United States and closely related people. Due to past disruption in this topic area, a more stringent set of rules called discretionary sanctions is in effect. Any administrator may impose sanctions on editors who do not strictly follow Wikipedia's policies, or the page-specific restrictions, when making edits related to the topic.
For additional information, please see the guidance on discretionary sanctions and the Arbitration Committee's decision here. If you have any questions, or any doubts regarding what edits are appropriate, you are welcome to discuss them with me or any other editor.
Guerillero | Parlez Moi 14:25, 28 September 2020 (UTC)
Just curious...do you have a diff to what Swarm once told you? Atsme Talk 📧 13:12, 14 October 2020 (UTC)
Shinealittlelight self-identifies as a "reasonable conservative" (Shinealittlelight (talk) 22:12, 19 May 2019 (UTC)) - under the heading "12 years" on Shinealittlelight's talk page. I agree that Shinealittlelight is conservative but I believe they are displaying a conservative partisan bias that is impacting on the quality of their edits. Remember, NPOV means neutral editing, not neutral content. These are some comments that Shinealittlelight has made on their own talk page:
Now if you really want to see a revert, you should add a positive conservative opinion of Prager U to the reception section, which is now reserved for critical remarks from partisan leftists writing in fashion magazines and on twitter. Shinealittlelight (talk) 18:52, 20 November 2019 (UTC)
Here I was trying to come up with an absurd hypothetical, but I guess nothing is too absurd for Jimmy Carter. Now we can test my prediction that it would be included in some Trump-relevant article! Shinealittlelight (talk) 10:42, 29 June 2019 (UTC)... What will happen, though, is what has already happened: dumb-bunnies and former presidents alike will be allowed to speak in our articles, so long as they hold the right (I mean the left!) opinions. Meanwhile, Princeton experts will not be allowed if they say something that does not fit the desired narrative. One funny observation: Carter's view is apparently a conspiracy theory, since its a theory about a conspiracy. Lol. What a sham. The editors who argued that conspiracy theory = theory about a conspiracy would never say that Carter's view is a conspiracy theory. Think about that--it's just obviously a crazy level of bias. Shinealittlelight (talk) 15:53, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
Little wonder that another editor told Shinealittlelight, under the "What do you mean "civil"" subheading on this page:
NPOV requires us first to put aside editorial biases, such as those you demonstrate and don't appear to be able to manage. In that light, I feel there's much better use of my time than to trying to prevent you from being blocked or banned.
Some of Shinealittlelight's comments come worryingly close to "leftists dominate Wiki" culture-warrior nonsense. This is especially concerning given that Shinealittlelight appears to keep a close watch on certain pages related to conservative topics and relentlessly remove material, including on the page of the ubiquitous PragerU. I believe other Wikipedians should keep a close eye on this editor's page and watch for instances of clear partisan bias Noteduck ( talk) 07:38, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
I have filed an arbitration case request. I have listed you as a party. See:[ [13]]. Noteduck ( talk) 09:41, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
The case request Ongoing issues with PragerU page, which you were a party in, has been declined by the Arbitration Committee after a absolute majority of arbitrators voted to decline the case request. The case request has been removed from Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case, but a permanent link to the declined case request can be accessed here.
For the Arbitration Committee, Dreamy Jazz talk to me | my contributions 14:59, 9 January 2021 (UTC)
Hi there. I've named you as a "user involved" in the dispute regarding the PragerU page, which I've sent to Wikipedia:Dispute resolution noticeboard. [14] Please submit your statement when ready Noteduck ( talk) 07:45, 11 January 2021 (UTC)
I'm headed out the door. Thanks for your note. I should be back in 4-5 hours and I'll take a look at your concerns and see if we can't come to an accommodation. Thanks for your patience. Activist ( talk) 15:30, 20 January 2021 (UTC) I've been home for an hour but have been on the phone since I arrived. COVID-19, unfortunately, can turn 4-5 hours into 8-10 hours. I'll read your changes and respond. Activist ( talk) 02:15, 21 January 2021 (UTC)
Unexpected, but welcomed. starship .paint ( RUN) 14:57, 9 April 2024 (UTC)
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Welcome to Wikipedia. I've added a welcome message to the top of this page that gives a great deal of information about Wikipedia. I hope you find it useful.
Additionally, I hope you don't mind if I share some of my thoughts on starting out as a new editor on Wikipedia: If I could get editors in your situation to follow just one piece of advice, it would be this: Learn Wikipedia by working only on non-contentious topics until you have a feel for the normal editing process and the policies that usually come up when editing casually. You'll find editing to be fun, easy, and rewarding. The rare disputes are resolved quickly and easily.
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I hope you find some useful information in all this, and welcome again. -- Ronz ( talk) 00:55, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
Hi Shinealittlelight! Thanks for contributing to Wikipedia. We hope to see you there!
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You keep making requests, as if there are problems. Are there problems in your opinion? If so, please quote. I'm happy to refactor anything I've written to help discussions go smoother. -- Ronz ( talk) 19:54, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
But you will apparently not say what you think on this score.[1] Given this comment, I hope you'll consider taking some time to help deescalate the situation. The article and consensus-building can always wait. -- Ronz ( talk) 22:46, 23 August 2018 (UTC)
Specifically: You have judged the NPR source in this case to be free of editorial bias. Is that not your "personal opinion"?Now you're making up others' viewpoints.. That's more WP:BATTLE.
But I wasn't making anything up about you.You made an assumption, and used it as a point of contention.
We have to figure out whether a source is biased to figure out whether to subject it to that special treatment.No we don't, and continuing to do so as you have so far may lead you to being blocked or banned. -- Ronz ( talk) 15:44, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
Re: BATTLE [2]: Getting an editor blocked or banned from an article or topic can take a great deal of work, and often results in a great deal of unnecessary drama. I'm hoping that my comments will get you to change your behavior: to keep your focus on content and policy, rather than on other editors. -- Ronz ( talk) 23:53, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
Hi Shinealittlelight. It's very unusual for such a new user to get stuck into such a protracted debate, so I'm sorry that that's been your first experience here. Regardless of who's right, arguments between editors are the least fun aspect of Wikipedia. I hope you find other articles to edit that don't involve the same strife. I'll save my opinions on the actual argument until I'm sure I've understood it. By the way, do you mind me asking why Dennis Prager was the first article you ended up editing? I always like to hear how people got into this. Mine was a book series I'd never heard of, Franny K. Stein, because I found a typo; not so interesting, so I leach off others' stories. › Mortee talk 01:17, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
You may want to go back and sign this post. (For others' unsigned posts you can use {{ unsigned}}. For your own, probably better to correct by copying a previous example of your signature and adjusting the timestamp). I frequently forgot to sign posts early on; this is just a friendly reminder. › Mortee talk 02:29, 28 August 2018 (UTC)
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Nice work on the revised wording at Prager. On a separate note, are you aware that you have not edited your User page? Even one exclamation point would activate it, after clicking "Save", of course. But it is up to you. Just thought I'd bring it to your attention. Bus stop ( talk) 21:16, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war according to the reverts you have made on PragerU ; that means that you are repeatedly changing content back to how you think it should be, when you have seen that other editors disagree. Users are expected to collaborate with others, to avoid editing disruptively, and to try to reach a consensus, rather than repeatedly undoing other users' edits once it is known that there is a disagreement.
Points to note:
If you find yourself in an editing dispute, use the article's talk page to discuss controversial changes and work towards a version that represents consensus among editors. You can post a request for help at an appropriate noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, it may be appropriate to request temporary page protection. If you engage in an edit war, you may be blocked from editing. -- Ronz ( talk) 17:10, 14 April 2019 (UTC)
See previous arguments. Feel free to take it up on the talk page. If Kruse's twitter feed calling this professor incompetent is due, then so is her response that was published by a RS[3] It's very difficult to take that comment as "collaborating" -- Ronz ( talk) 18:44, 14 April 2019 (UTC)
Your recent editing history shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war; that means that you are repeatedly changing content back to how you think it should be, when you have seen that other editors disagree. To resolve the content dispute, please do not revert or change the edits of others when you are reverted. Instead of reverting, please use the talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. The best practice at this stage is to discuss, not edit-war. See BRD for how this is done. If discussions reach an impasse, you can then post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection.
Being involved in an edit war can result in you being blocked from editing—especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring—even if you don't violate the three-revert rule—should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly.. Snooganssnoogans ( talk) 17:57, 14 April 2019 (UTC)
Just a little history. At the time the RFC was started, the lead didn't even contain that phrase. Isn't that astounding?!! (That sort of undermined the whole RfC, but no one seemed to notice.)
The person who started the RFC depends on unreliable sources and allows that to influence their editing and discussing on talk pages. They really wished to get rid of all three words because they don't believe it's a "conspiracy theory" or that what Trump said was "false". Well, they're wrong on all counts because RS accurately use those words to describe the situation, and so must we.
On occasion, a RS can get it wrong, but most RS get it right, and good editors follow RS and allow RS to form their thinking. Those who don't do that rightly get in trouble. That's what's great about editing here. We can learn an awful lot and bring our POV into line with the facts. To me, that makes this place a huge magnet, because I want to learn what's true, and I want to document that. I don't know what's true without RS telling me.
Here's how the lead sentence read at that time:
Regardless of that long separation between "conspiracy theory" and "false", since the lead sentence did contain those words, and it was causing much contention from a certain subset of very vocal fringe editors, I decided to resolve the matter by moving the "false" aspect to the last sentence of the lead. See this diff:
That pretty much killed off the RfC discussion and most editors drifted off to deal with other matters, but the RfC was never closed properly.
Sometimes a compromise can stop a lot of contention and edit warring, and that compromise seems to have worked, even though it rewarded and encouraged fringe editors for their disruptive efforts. -- BullRangifer ( talk) 15:15, 2 May 2019 (UTC)
BullRangifer: sure, we can talk more here if you like. Honestly, I enjoy talking about this stuff, and I'm willing to try to work it out with you just for the heck of it even if we're unlikely to succeed in achieving agreement. The issues that have really been on my mind are these:
My own answers are: No, no, yes, yes, and obviously. I'm genuinely and sincerely shocked to the point of feeling like a crazy person by the fact that there are people all over that page who deny that the FBI suveilled the Trump campaign, so that one is especially on my mind. Anyway, I'd be happy to talk about any of these things. I'd be curious to hear your thoughts. Shinealittlelight ( talk) 22:22, 2 May 2019 (UTC)
... we can't state in Wikipedia's own voice that there was FBI surveillance of his campaign (especially since the truth appears to be the opposite...).
...oppose ... [the title 'FBI Surveillance of the Trump Campaign'] until their is evidence of it actually having happeneded
[the title 'FBI Surveillance of the Trump Campaign'] sounds like it came from InfoWars.
FBI surveillance of Donald Trump campaign - fails WP:FRINGE
Nothing in that source suggests that Halper was "surveilling" the Trump campaign
Trump has been referring to the FBI's use of an informant as "spygate".Why was NBC so sloppy early on? In a way, it isn't totally their fault: I think that it was never clear, and still isn't clear, what the heck Trump meant by 'spygate'. The original tweets don't say. He makes a bunch of claims and then says that SPYGATE is going to be a huge scandal. but he doesn't explicitly say exactly which allegations 'Spygate' is meant to refer to. And so sources--early and late--have been sloppy and confusing and inconsistent with each other in deciding what he meant, right from the outset. What we have done is cherry pick the "conspiracy theory" interpretation from Vox and NYT over the "inappropriately calling the legitimate investigation a scandal" interpretation from NBC news, or the still other interpretations of other sources. This is POV, it seems to me. Shinealittlelight ( talk) 01:59, 3 May 2019 (UTC)
Rusf10, calling me a liar is a pretty serious personal attack. AGF. There is a difference between being mistaken, and therefore speaking an untruth, and deliberately stating an untruth. Only the latter is a lie. Now you've got me wondering if I got it wrong! I'll go back and double check. I'll be back. -- BullRangifer ( talk) 04:42, 3 May 2019 (UTC)
Here's what I found:
The nearest diff from just before start of RfC shows that Rusf10 is correct. I got it wrong. My deepest apologies. The wording I quoted was apparently from about 24 hours later. I apparently got mixed up on my dates. Gotta be more careful! -- BullRangifer ( talk) 04:58, 3 May 2019 (UTC)
Shine..., you wrote: "He thinks that what has been shown false is that there was a spy, early in the campaign, paid a lot of money, that was politically motivated. He thinks that Halper was the informant, that Halper was not a member of the campaign, that Halper was not paid a lot of money..."
There are several misunderstandings there about what I believe. Let me sort it out:
I hope that helps. -- BullRangifer ( talk) 05:15, 3 May 2019 (UTC)
Upon further reflection, there are two methods editors can take. Method A, sees editors including the 2019 situation into the article first. After that, then the 2018 situation is re-analyzed, and the ultimate position of the article is determined. Method B, sees us putting 2019 aside, and straightaway analyzing 2018 for its position, after that is determined, then the 2019 situation is added. It's up to you, which method you think will have more success. starship .paint ( talk) 02:56, 14 May 2019 (UTC)
Shinealittlelight, I think your approach of attempting to change stuff from the lede is not making much progress. May I suggest inserting whatever content and sources in the body first, then you would be in a stronger position to use that content and sources to argue for inclusion of material in the lede. starship .paint ( talk) 01:16, 26 May 2019 (UTC)
- not the cart before the horse... Before using alternate definitions as an argument, perhaps it would be better if the alternate definitions were already in the article. starship .paint ( talk) 01:51, 3 June 2019 (UTC)
I just noticed this conversation, and without reading or analyzing every detail above, I'll just drop a thought here. Have you ever considered that highjacking an article isn't a proper thing to do? I've seen such attempts before, and had it happen to one of my better articles ( Charlotte's web (cannabis)).
The Spygate article was written about historical events. Maybe Starship.paint won't object, but if someone tried to highjack an article I wrote, I'd be pretty pissed off. Of course ownership behavior isn't allowed, but if someone wants a different article, they should go and write it without highjacking an existing article that's about a different subject. I just had to say that. Carry on. -- BullRangifer ( talk) 03:34, 3 June 2019 (UTC)
User:BullRangifer/Negotiation table
It's best to leave the sockpuppet alone. No one knows Wikipedia policies within a day of starting their account. They must have reason to hide their previous edits. starship .paint ( talk) 11:21, 5 June 2019 (UTC)
I guess the 'fringe' view you mentioned did turn up after all. [7] starship .paint ( talk) 07:33, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
12 years and over 1000 edits never seen such intellectual dishonesty. But its been enlightening because I see the true value of wiki. A colossol waste of time and if your side finally brings around NPOV what have you won? Victory over cretinous dishonesty. Your objective nature inspired me but I have no desire to wrestle the pig anymore. Good luck to you, hopefully you choose your battles wisely. I am too weak to resist returning thus closing the account is the only way. Batvette ( talk) 20:09, 19 May 2019 (UTC)
Editors who subsequently reinstate edits originally made by a blocked editor take complete responsibility for the content.This wasn't exactly reinstatement, but the concept remains. Shinealittlelight, since it's your user talk, would you please remove that quote, or at least the parts that are about me? R2 ( bleep) 21:14, 28 May 2019 (UTC)
This is a standard message to notify contributors about an administrative ruling in effect. It does not imply that there are any issues with your contributions to date.
You have shown interest in post-1932 politics of the United States and closely related people. Due to past disruption in this topic area, a more stringent set of rules called discretionary sanctions is in effect. Any administrator may impose sanctions on editors who do not strictly follow Wikipedia's policies, or the page-specific restrictions, when making edits related to the topic.
For additional information, please see the guidance on discretionary sanctions and the Arbitration Committee's decision here. If you have any questions, or any doubts regarding what edits are appropriate, you are welcome to discuss them with me or any other editor. Bishonen | talk 23:51, 29 May 2019 (UTC).
You're both stuck on the literal use when we're talking about a figurative/metaphorical use. I am prevented from using the Wikipedia term for doing that on an article talk page, so I'll let you know here. It's called IDHT (refusing to get the point) and disruptive behavior. It might be possible to disagree on use of the term rebranding for many other reasons, but doing this is a violation of policy and logic on several levels. Why do you refuse to do the obvious and right thing by staying on-topic when discussing this metaphorical use? By insisting on talking only about the non-figurative use you are deliberately staying off-topic, and that makes communication impossible. That is stonewalling. It's not only a violation of PAG, it's not fair. -- BullRangifer ( talk) 15:09, 7 June 2019 (UTC)
I appreciate your edits on the relevant articles - seem like honest attempts to counter Wikipedia being turned into a propaganda vehicle.
"Careful, Icarus" is a reference to Craig Ferguson's Late Late Show - easy to find on youtube. Not to everyone's humour - but at least it's humour! Cheers! tildetildetildetilde
On 3 July 2019, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Crossfire Hurricane (FBI investigation), which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that the Mueller probe was born in a crossfire hurricane? You are welcome to check how many page hits the article got while on the front page ( here's how, Crossfire Hurricane (FBI investigation)), and it may be added to the statistics page if the total is over 5,000. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.
Gatoclass ( talk) 00:02, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
This is your only warning; if you make personal attacks on others again, you may be blocked from editing without further notice. Comment on content, not on other contributors or people.
You have been asked by multiple editors to withdraw your pointed and serious personal attacks against @ Tsumikiria: and have explicitly refused to do so. This is a galling violation of WP:NPA and WP:IDHT - and this warning is to advise you to immediately cease this approach, to apologize to Tsumikiria and to strike through your personal attacks. Simonm223 ( talk) 14:23, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
The behaviour mentioned above is enough to get you blocked in the ordinary course of events, it's also possible that you could be topic banned as a sanction. Doug Weller talk 14:27, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
[8] I'm sure you were aware this was coming. Simonm223 ( talk) 14:50, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
{{
unblock|reason=Your reason here ~~~~}}
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Lourdes 15:55, 5 July 2019 (UTC)Sources
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You'll have to answer this when you return from your block. I see you wrote the following:
What's that really mean? Don't you consider our articles about the Nazis to be NPOV? Do you have a COI about that subject? (Since you seem to oppose ANTIFA, is there some other reason? are you a Nazi supporter?) Or do you mean something else? I'm really puzzled. --
BullRangifer (
talk) 18:13, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
@ Lourdes: Suppose that someone says that he supports Antifa. Here are my questions:
I assume it is a personal attack to say that the person believes that political violence is permissible, since that's what I was blocked for. But I admit, I'm having a hard time seeing the difference between that and the statement in question 3 above. So I think your answer to 3 is probably "yes". But then it's really surprising to me that the statement in 2 would be allowed, since the statement in 2 seems to immediately entail the one in 3. Your guidance is appreciated. Shinealittlelight ( talk) 11:49, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
In the context of a content dispute, personal commentary is prohibited. Period. It really is that simple. You should not ever be commenting on an editor or their views. If you have strong evidence that a user is pushing their POV in an article, you can report that evidence to us. But you should virtually never have any reason to be discussing an editor on a talk page. Having a bias is irrelevant. If you don't have hard evidence of policy violations, don't ever imply or accuse an editor of having a bias or a COI. That is a personal attack. ~Swarm~ {sting} 23:45, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
"Shame, shame, shame on you for defaming what we used to call heroes."I didn't realize I was defaming heroes. I thought I was upholding principles for what we should put on our Userpages. Bus stop ( talk) 02:07, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
Do you think that all personal commentary during content disputes amounts to a personal attack? Do you agree that all personal commentary during content disputes is prohibited?Very discouraged, as it may be considered PA by others and encourages defensive statements and off-topic discussion that is not for public article talk pages ( WP:NOTFORUM, etc). I don't have much to add considering Swarm's excellent comment. Maybe only that other than ANI, personal talk pages are also less restricted to cast aspersions. Welcome back from the block, it's possible that with these comments it'll be the last, — Paleo Neonate – 05:44, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
Suppose that someone says that he supports Antifa:
1. Is it a personal attack to say that the person supports Antifa?
2. Is it a personal attack to say that the person supports Antifa, which is a violent political advocacy group?
3. Is it a personal attack to say that the person supports a violent political advocacy group?
I am reminded of one case that my hubby shared from law school, where a guy put a case on his neighbour claiming she was a prostitute. He lost the case in court. The next day, he rented a couple of billboards outside her house, and wrote on those that the lady was not a prostitute. I find you replicating what the guy did.
As Swarm rightly says, the context is important. If the above three questions are being mentioned to prove conflicted editing, then the case has to be built up at COIN, and not on the talk pages of articles. On the talk pages, you only comment on content, and not on characters of editors. If you say it on article talk pages, and don't stop saying it after being told to, you'll be blocked. It's not about the truth (she's no prostitute), but if you keep repeating it at any place other than the relevant noticeboards, and don't retract it even when you are requested to, then you will be blocked. Thanks, Lourdes 09:40, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
Ok, thanks for the replies. I will abide by the rule that there is no non-complimentary personal commentary allowed in content disputes. I will also expect others--especially those who have been commenting here--to abide by that rule with respect to me. I will note that I am concerned that references to "common sense" and "context" are ultimately opportunities to apply the rule in a POV manner--i.e., to hold me to the strict standard, but to allow others to say non-complimentary things about me in content disputes. I would be disappointed with that outcome, and I hope that it won't work out that way. Shinealittlelight ( talk) 11:11, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
Is all comment on another editor's Userbox off limit- absolutely not. You can go to someone's talk page and say "I like your userbox" or "I disagree with the sentiments expressed in your userbox. You can say on an article talk page "I see you have a userbox saying that you're fluent in Dutch. Can you help us translate this source?" or "I see you're a supporter of [x], and I'm not. Can you take a look at what I added to make sure it's fair to both sides".
In the United States at this time passions are running high...Yes, precisely. If you follow your logic, anyone who is a US citizen is far too invested in the country to write about it in the neutral, dispassionate fashion that an encyclopeadia contributor should. Imagine if someone said that all Americans, by virtue of the fact that they have not renounced all ties to the country, endorse the way that refugee children are treated in at the US border.
( ←) Tradition is that personal opinions are permitted, no matter how extreme. One can declare themselves a communist, or an alt-righter, or a young earth creationist, or a flat earther, it does not matter. That doesn't mean you can drag it into content disputes. ~Swarm~ {sting} 06:42, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
Advice to WP editors: You will occasionally find that an editor with whom you are debating, having run out of arguments, will look at your user page to find something about you to add to the argument. For that reason, you should not put anything on your user page. In particular, and this is important, never put any advice to editors on your user page as they will surely accuse you of not following your own advice.
Can you think of a hypothetical context in which it would be correct to mention on a talk page that a user has explicitly stated on his user page that he is not here in good faith?Honestly, no. First, I will say that a user who declares that they not here in good faith is typically indef-blocked per WP:NOTHERE. Being here to contribute in good faith is not a personal view, it's a baseline prerequisite for an editor. We have no reason to assume good faith if a user tells us not to. But, let's take this as a thought experiment: a highly established user in good standing with no behavioral issues adds the statement "this user is no longer here to edit in good faith" to their userpage. Should you bring this up on an article talk page in the context of a content dispute? As has been explained for situations across the board, no. You're absolutely right, you should absolutely not use this as an argument in a content dispute. You can bring it up on their talk page, to clarify whether it's a genuine statement, or you can report it to admins/the community. It would certainly be highly controversial, being either a disruptive performance and apparent trolling (resulting in forcible removal and/or a short-term block), or a genuine view, in which case the user would be blocked indefinitely. But still, even in such an extreme situation, do not personally attack them over it. In the most extreme scenario, the user has declared their malicious intent and has been blocked as a NOTHERE troll. If the user propagated a major, non-credible content dispute, in which no one took their side, then it would be worth closing the discussion with a note that the user was blocked as a troll. However, the statement on the userpage itself is not the point, and becomes irrelevant at that point; the bad faith motivation is the actual concern. So, even in this extreme thought experiment, in which a user openly declares their disdain for Wikipedia, you should still not make personal attacks on the talk page. I hope this clears things up. ~Swarm~ {sting} 00:43, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
Apologies for being a stickler, but the antifa (however capitalized) article is under 1RR protection. I would ask that you self-undo your last revert for that reason. Cheers. Dumuzid ( talk) 19:12, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
Technically, any edit can be said to reverse some of a previous edit; however, this is not the way the community interprets reversion. In the edit you cite, I did not return the page to a previous state. So while it is true that I did remove some content, that doesn't automatically make it a revert. But look, sure, I'll undo my recent fix and return the incorrect direct quote to the text, thereby obviously decreasing the quality of the article. Perhaps you can fix the quote. Shinealittlelight ( talk) 20:00, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
If you want to see how well WP:IAR works as a response to an arbcom sanction, please be my guest. Simonm223 ( talk) 12:18, 8 August 2019 (UTC)
Thought you might like 1 more RS for the most recent Andy Ngo attack by antifa https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/17/us/portland-oregon-protests.html "Officials and residents feared a melee like one in the city on June 29, when a conservative writer was assaulted by black-clad protesters." "Many have blamed Antifa for the beating, which was captured on video. No one has been charged in connection with the assault, which the police are continuing to investigate." Also interesting to see a more nuanced take on the Proud Boys: "Among the other far-right groups were the Proud Boys, an all-male group whose members sometimes share racist or misogynist ideas, and who have fought with protesters before." Mbsyl ( talk) 00:49, 19 August 2019 (UTC)
Morning Shine,
I'm unfortunately a bit out of pocket today so I wasn't able to update the entire section. I had an updated version for the KCA specifically, but hand't written much more yet. I wanted to pass it along in case you were doing some work on this section. I'll be back on Wednesday and will take a stab at some of the later sections. I also sent it along to GrettLomborg in case he was working on it.
References
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See what I did there? Anyway, your edit shouldn't be a 1RR violation since you are making a series of changes at one time. You can make a dozen individual, unrelated changes/removals and it's still 1 revert so long as no other editors make changes in the mean time. Where it gets gray is if there are unrelated changes by other editors during your changes. It's a problem if an editor reverts part of your changes then you revert/remove something in another part of the article. Anyway, short version, do long as no other editors make changes while you are making yours it's just one change. Springee ( talk) 11:38, 24 September 2019 (UTC)
I just saw your PU edits here [ [11]]. I agree with them (see the talk page) but I suspect they will get reverted shortly. I was disappointed that people seemed to want to focus on a partisan summary of the stories rather than what was actually said in the videos. I think MJ's summaries were misleading at best. However, I ran into issues with ABOUTSELF and FRINGE claims. Some aspects of the debate were interesting. I agree with those who say we as editors can't provide a counter point summary of the PU videos. So where MJ says PU claimed "there is no police discrimination", we can't say "the video actually said..." We would either need a reliable source to provide the summary or we would need PU to say "MJ's was wrong, we actually said X". The latter would be acceptable per my read of ABOUTSELF. However, some will claim that is unduly self serving (a debate I was engaged in on WP:V). I do wish more editors were more willing to consider what sources they don't like are actually saying vs writing in a way that is clearly meant to discredit. Incidentally there is a discussion related to a reporter who has been seen as anti-vax that has similar issues. I'm firmly in the "pro-vax" camp but I still don't like the way a BLP seems to want to discredit the subject rather than saying what the subject thinks and why. The latter can always be balanced out by pointing to RSs that say she is wrong. Springee ( talk) 18:29, 20 November 2019 (UTC)
...on the WLC page. I wanted to leave you a message here in case my tone in that thread seemed a bit too terse or dismissive. I appreciate your hard work on this mediation and constructive additions. I may (likely) have been a bit burned out earlier on some criticisms. Happy to see your suggestions and I can tell (looking at a history of your contributions to other topics) that they will be well thought out and productive. Squatch347 ( talk) 14:16, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
Hello. Help copy edit. Thanks you. Flopmn ( talk) 03:21, 2 March 2020 (UTC)
Hello. Jordan Peterson is under WP:1RR. As your recent revert was within twenty four hours, I request that you self revert. Thank you. Grayfell ( talk) 03:28, 2 March 2020 (UTC)
Your recent editing history shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war; that means that you are repeatedly changing content back to how you think it should be, when you have seen that other editors disagree. To resolve the content dispute, please do not revert or change the edits of others when you are reverted. Instead of reverting, please use the talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. The best practice at this stage is to discuss, not edit-war. See the bold, revert, discuss cycle for how this is done. If discussions reach an impasse, you can then post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection.
Being involved in an edit war can result in you being blocked from editing—especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring—even if you don't violate the three-revert rule—should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly.. Snooganssnoogans ( talk) 18:01, 6 March 2020 (UTC)
This is a standard message to notify contributors about an administrative ruling in effect. It does not imply that there are any issues with your contributions to date.
You have shown interest in post-1932 politics of the United States and closely related people. Due to past disruption in this topic area, a more stringent set of rules called discretionary sanctions is in effect. Any administrator may impose sanctions on editors who do not strictly follow Wikipedia's policies, or the page-specific restrictions, when making edits related to the topic.
For additional information, please see the guidance on discretionary sanctions and the Arbitration Committee's decision here. If you have any questions, or any doubts regarding what edits are appropriate, you are welcome to discuss them with me or any other editor.
Guerillero | Parlez Moi 14:25, 28 September 2020 (UTC)
Just curious...do you have a diff to what Swarm once told you? Atsme Talk 📧 13:12, 14 October 2020 (UTC)
Shinealittlelight self-identifies as a "reasonable conservative" (Shinealittlelight (talk) 22:12, 19 May 2019 (UTC)) - under the heading "12 years" on Shinealittlelight's talk page. I agree that Shinealittlelight is conservative but I believe they are displaying a conservative partisan bias that is impacting on the quality of their edits. Remember, NPOV means neutral editing, not neutral content. These are some comments that Shinealittlelight has made on their own talk page:
Now if you really want to see a revert, you should add a positive conservative opinion of Prager U to the reception section, which is now reserved for critical remarks from partisan leftists writing in fashion magazines and on twitter. Shinealittlelight (talk) 18:52, 20 November 2019 (UTC)
Here I was trying to come up with an absurd hypothetical, but I guess nothing is too absurd for Jimmy Carter. Now we can test my prediction that it would be included in some Trump-relevant article! Shinealittlelight (talk) 10:42, 29 June 2019 (UTC)... What will happen, though, is what has already happened: dumb-bunnies and former presidents alike will be allowed to speak in our articles, so long as they hold the right (I mean the left!) opinions. Meanwhile, Princeton experts will not be allowed if they say something that does not fit the desired narrative. One funny observation: Carter's view is apparently a conspiracy theory, since its a theory about a conspiracy. Lol. What a sham. The editors who argued that conspiracy theory = theory about a conspiracy would never say that Carter's view is a conspiracy theory. Think about that--it's just obviously a crazy level of bias. Shinealittlelight (talk) 15:53, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
Little wonder that another editor told Shinealittlelight, under the "What do you mean "civil"" subheading on this page:
NPOV requires us first to put aside editorial biases, such as those you demonstrate and don't appear to be able to manage. In that light, I feel there's much better use of my time than to trying to prevent you from being blocked or banned.
Some of Shinealittlelight's comments come worryingly close to "leftists dominate Wiki" culture-warrior nonsense. This is especially concerning given that Shinealittlelight appears to keep a close watch on certain pages related to conservative topics and relentlessly remove material, including on the page of the ubiquitous PragerU. I believe other Wikipedians should keep a close eye on this editor's page and watch for instances of clear partisan bias Noteduck ( talk) 07:38, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
I have filed an arbitration case request. I have listed you as a party. See:[ [13]]. Noteduck ( talk) 09:41, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
The case request Ongoing issues with PragerU page, which you were a party in, has been declined by the Arbitration Committee after a absolute majority of arbitrators voted to decline the case request. The case request has been removed from Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case, but a permanent link to the declined case request can be accessed here.
For the Arbitration Committee, Dreamy Jazz talk to me | my contributions 14:59, 9 January 2021 (UTC)
Hi there. I've named you as a "user involved" in the dispute regarding the PragerU page, which I've sent to Wikipedia:Dispute resolution noticeboard. [14] Please submit your statement when ready Noteduck ( talk) 07:45, 11 January 2021 (UTC)
I'm headed out the door. Thanks for your note. I should be back in 4-5 hours and I'll take a look at your concerns and see if we can't come to an accommodation. Thanks for your patience. Activist ( talk) 15:30, 20 January 2021 (UTC) I've been home for an hour but have been on the phone since I arrived. COVID-19, unfortunately, can turn 4-5 hours into 8-10 hours. I'll read your changes and respond. Activist ( talk) 02:15, 21 January 2021 (UTC)
Unexpected, but welcomed. starship .paint ( RUN) 14:57, 9 April 2024 (UTC)