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![]() | This article was nominated for
deletion. Please review the prior discussions if you are considering re-nomination:
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![]() | On 8 July 2021, it was proposed that this article be moved from Gang stalking to Gang stalking delusion. The result of the discussion was no consensus (overturned from moved). |
There have been numerous past deletion discussions about gang stalking and targeted individuals. I listed the seven I found here on the talk page, and this may be all of the actual deletion discussions. The most recent deletion was in 2014.
This topic meets notability now because researcher Sheridan published 2 papers on this topic in 2015 and 2020. The New York Times did a story on this in 2016. Psychology Today' published a 3-article series on this in 2020. In 2017, Vice published two video documentaries about this. These sources were not available during the previous deletions, and now the available media we have to cite makes this topic pass WP:GNG and eligible for inclusion in Wikipedia.
{{
cite journal}}
: CS1 maint: unflagged free DOI (
link)Blue Rasberry (talk) 00:51, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
This was a tense topic in the past and may be so in the future. If anyone has links to past discussions or consensus then please share, so that we can continue to use precedent to keep conversation productive. Blue Rasberry (talk) 00:53, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
Previously people have tried to start Wikipedia articles for "gang stalking" and "targeted individual". I propose that we keep both of these topics here. Gang stalkers are the perpetrators, and targeted individuals are the victims. They exist together and explaining one will explain the other.
"Gang stalking" is the name for the activity and I think the best name for this article. "Targeted individual" should redirect here, where there can be a section on targeted individuals if necessary. Blue Rasberry (talk) 00:57, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
From what I understand, gang stalking and electronic harassment are related but separate delusions as some self-identified "targeted individuals" believe that the stalking is happening in ways that are different than electronic surveillance. For example, there are those who are obsessed with black helicopters and others who think that they are being followed by people they see on the street. jps ( talk) 14:36, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
![]() | This discussion was listed at Wikipedia:Move review on 3 August 2021. The result of the move review was overturned to no consensus. |
The result of the move request was: Overturned to no consensus RandomCanadian ( talk / contribs) 03:27, 6 September 2021 (UTC)
Pre-MRV closure
|
---|
The result of the move request was: moved. Clear consensus to move. Gang stalking delusion seems to have a bit more support than the alternative with brackets. ( closed by non-admin page mover) Vpab15 ( talk) 18:11, 31 July 2021 (UTC) |
Gang stalking → Gang stalking delusion – see below Lembit Staan ( talk) 00:16, 8 July 2021 (UTC)
I was stalking the " Targeted individual" :-) in my watchlist , hence I see the article. I moved the page because ...er... "'Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't after you.'". This article is about a paranoid, not about the real gang stalking, right? Lembit Staan ( talk) 22:58, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
non-medical things to say, like what people experience, what effects this has on lives,-- is a non-argument. Paranoia does have effect on people's life, so does delusion of grandeur. Lembit Staan ( talk) 00:07, 8 July 2021 (UTC)
Usually, titles should unambiguously define the topical scope of the article, but should be no more precise than that.and the fact that group stalking (sometimes called "real" gang stalking) is an actual phenomenon, of which there are documented cases. In order to distinguish this article from that concept, I put forth what seems to be the current favorite in this discussion. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 12:58, 19 July 2021 (UTC)
It has a section with "gang stalking" in the title which has sources information relevant to this article. It must be merged heree. Lembit Staan ( talk) 23:11, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
Wikipedia is not a forum for discussing the subjects of articles. Contrary to that rule, I am about discuss the subject of this article because by briefly ignoring all rules I hope that we can get back to making the encyclopedia by focusing on what sources say.
Some people see "gang stalking" as a mental health issue or persecutory delusion. Yes, for some people there is a relationship between this and mental problems, but the practice of "calling people crazy" is neither productive as a medical intervention nor a reflection of all of the sources. The academic sources by Sheridan treat this as a public health issue of community harm. Read this one and see -
{{
cite journal}}
: CS1 maint: unflagged free DOI (
link)This source says, "we decided to conduct a study of the experiences of those reporting gang-stalking" and summarizes what people say, how the experience affects their lives, and suggests that research could help people experiencing this. The source does not make blanket medical diagnoses of people reporting this experience. I wish that this Wikipedia article could mirror some of the sensitivity of sources like this by presenting multiple perspectives in this article. We should include medical perspectives in this article. Emphasizing those perspectives beyond the original sources is excessive and may not be helpful.
The Sheridan 2020 source lists characteristics of gang stalking.
Blue Rasberry (talk) 00:09, 8 July 2021 (UTC)
"Stalking Victimisation: Prevalence and Dynamics amongst Spanish University Students" is a 2017 statistical article .
Stalking was recently criminalised in Spain and other European countries, following the signing of the Council of Europe Convention on preventing and combating violence against women and domestic violence, despite a lack of empirical knowledge of victimisation by this phenomenon. Previous research carried out in the usa and in other European countries on victimisation by stalking with female samples has shown that young women are the most frequently victimised group. Based on those findings, research was conducted in Spain with a sample of 1,162 university students, including women and men. This paper presents the main findings of this research, determining the prevalence of stalking victimisation, the victim and stalker profiles, and the dynamics of this type of victimisation.
It defined "group stalking" as stalking by 3 or pore perpetrators. Findings about it:
More quotes:
Statistically significant differences were also found between stalker gender and the number of offenders involved in the stalking (χ2 (6, N=152) = 57.05; ρ < .001, Φ = .433). Whilst 80.6% of men acted alone, women preferred to act in groups (45.7% of the cases); only 42.9% of women stalked alone.
Finally, group stalking (stalking involving 3 or more offenders) was perpetrated by mixed groups (44%), followed by exclusively female groups (36%) and exclusively male ones (20%)
In most cases, the stalking was perpetrated by only one person (61.2%), although occasionally stalkers acted in groups of two, three or even more (Figure 5). (Fig 5. for "3 or more" shows 16.5%)
I guess we can start with section "Group stalking" in Stalking article and wait until it grows to decent size. -- Lembit Staan ( talk) 01:07, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
Since this phenomenon, which was first reported in 2000, seems to be almost identical to the plot of a very well-known movie released in 1998, the obvious conclusion is that people suffering from more common paranoid delusions of being persecuted by sinister cabals (with or without Air Looms), which differ from "gang stalking" only in the size of the gang involved, might perhaps have been a wee bit influenced by the movie?
Your article about the film does mention a rare mental illness officially called "the Truman Show Delusion", which is the specific belief that your whole life is a reality TV show, but gang stalking seems to be very much the same kind of thing, except that the hidden TV cameras are optional, and if it has no connection with the film, the timing is a remarkable coincidence.
Obviously my personal opinion isn't acceptable as a source, but the similarity is so screamingly obvious that surely it must have been discussed in respectable psychiatric literature somewhere or other? And assuming it has been and someone can find the article, isn't this one of the most significant aspects of the syndrome, and well worth a mention? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.145.55.72 ( talk • contribs)
"The gangstalking belief system is similar to some other well-established persecutory delusional belief systems, such as the Truman Show delusion, where those affected believe that their lives are surreptitiously being continuously recorded and produced into a reality television show and that everyone or nearly everyone they come into contact with is complicit in the deceit."
Recently the WikiProject Crime banner was removed from this talk page with the edit comments saying that the project is about "real crimes". However, I have put the banner back because I think this article is still within the scope of WikiProject Crime. The project's goal is to improve the quality of articles related to subjects about crime. The project focuses on criminology and a wide range of crime-related topics. I think that people who imagining they are victims of crime is a real phenomenon that is crime related. In many jurisdictions, making a false report of crime is itself a crime, so dismissing this article as "not a real crime" fails to appreciate that people's perception of crime is also important to the field of criminology. This article serves to explain one aspect of false reporting about crime, in that some people have delusions they are being stalked or harassed by a gang of people. Knowing this is is a reported phenomenon helps criminal investigators sort out those false allegations and permits investigators to identify that crime has not occurred even though it has been alleged. This is why the article is in the scope of the project: it is still "crime-related" even though the crime probably only imagined in this instance. One cannot necessarily discount that a crime allegation might be real in the absence of contrary evidence. - Cameron Dewe ( talk) 11:19, 19 October 2021 (UTC)
This is a real phenomenon!!! 2600:1008:B021:96E3:F44F:1A81:C05F:D4EC ( talk) 14:52, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
The definition is wrong, because gang stalking is real. What a bad manipulation: with such a fake definition, the gangstalking risks to be even more harrassive. 2A02:A020:9:92F6:AA33:DFE6:F5ED:BC2E ( talk) 19:56, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
The article describes gang stalking as a delusion, but I don't think that matches how reliable sources predominantly describe it. Sources paint the picture that gang-stalking is a phenomenon with limited informational that more research is needed to understand. It's often labeled as an "unexplored belief system". It is never labeled outright as delusional, that's always prefixed with something like "seemingly" or "apparently". I think we're taking way to much of a POV here that isn't represented in reliable sources. –– FormalDude talk 20:42, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
Status quo version:
"Gang stalking" is a novel persecutory belief system experienced by individuals who believe they are being followed, stalked, and harassed by a large number of people.[1] The term is associated with the "targeted individual" (T.I.) virtual community formed by like-minded individuals who claim their lives are disrupted from being stalked by organized groups intent on causing them harm.[2][3]
My version:
"Gang stalking" is a phenomenon where individuals believe they are being followed, stalked, and harassed by a large number of people.[1] Studies have determined that most cases are highly likely to be delusional in nature, and the phenomenon is considered a persecutory belief system.
The term is associated with the "targeted individual" (T.I.) virtual community formed by like-minded individuals who claim their lives are disrupted from being stalked by organized groups intent on causing them harm.[2][3] Researchers have suggested that online communities could be a catalyst for the experience.
Anyone else want to weigh in? –– FormalDude talk 00:03, 18 March 2022 (UTC)
is considereda persecutory belief system. They describe it as a persecutory belief system without qualification. They describe such beliefs as
delusional in basis. They describe TI forums as exacerbating mental illness, or creating psychotic symptoms. Adding
is consideredis in fact less neutral, in the same way it were if the White genocide conspiracy theory article were to be edited to say that it's considered a political myth. -- Equivamp - talk 01:01, 18 March 2022 (UTC)
The idea that "organized, large-scale persecution" is "unfeasible and impossible to remain secret" is factually incorrect and that's not a matter of opinion. Zerzetsung ( /info/en/?search=Zersetzung) lasted for two decades and victimized over 10 thousand people. So the point is not valid. @FormalDude's version is more neutral precisely because it doesn't dismiss the existence of the persecution in the definition of Gangs Stalking. Galmeida28 ( talk) 22:29, 22 March 2022 (UTC)
Looking through the sources in this article, it seems that the lead sentence is a too-close paraphrase of the source. As it reads currently:
Gang stalking is a novel persecutory belief system experienced by individuals who believe they are being followed, stalked, and harassed by a large number of people.
Compare to the first sentence of the source, which reads:
Gangstalking is a novel persecutory belief system whereby those affected believe they are being followed, stalked, and harassed by a large number of people, often numbering in the thousands.
Normally I would BOLDly rephrase it and mention the CLOP issue after the fact, but as the text in question is already under dispute, I thought I'd bring it up here first. IMO, definitely in need of a rewrite. And the rest of the article should probably be combed over for similar copyvio concerns... -- Equivamp - talk 01:13, 18 March 2022 (UTC)
Persecutory delusion reads According to the DSM-IV-TR, persecutory delusions are the most common form of delusions in paranoid schizophrenia, where the person believes "he or she is being tormented, followed, tricked, spied on, or ridiculed"
. I notice this article does not discuss schizophrenia in particular -- should this article have some discussion about paranoid schizophrenia as it relates to patients who are experiencing delusions of being stalked by large groups and organisations? I'm not familiar with the medical literature on the topic, but schizophrenia seems to be brought up often in lay discussions of gang stalking.
Endwise (
talk)
06:50, 26 March 2022 (UTC)
Schizophrenic patients commonly see patterns and abnormal cause and effect, gang stalking is definitely a result of this illness. With medication their “suspicions” vanish entirely. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 222.153.110.240 ( talk) 11:09, 8 May 2022 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Firstly, the definition of gang stalking is "stalking done on individual by two or more people". Does this ever happen in a real life, is whole another question and it has nothing to do with the definition. If somebody wants to coin a term for a persecutory belief system, please do but do not use the term ´gang stalking` bcause that is reserved for another use. Secondly, as many writers here seem to think that gang stalking does never happen in a real life, I would like point out that to come to that conclusion you need to watch the whole Earth at once for a long period of time to be able determine does some behaviour lack here all together. I do not think anybody has ever done that for it seems to impossible for humans to do. So, how about if writers here would stop outright lying and stick to the facts? UnderLittleFacts ( talk) 17:14, 29 June 2022 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
1. Protected article 2. Quite short 3. No neutral definition 4. References to study but no further information about study 5. No notable cases mentioned FI961091 ( talk) 11:18, 20 September 2022 (UTC)
@ TargetedUK: please discuss the changes you want to make here first. If you continue inserting unsourced opinion into the article, you'll likely wind up blocked by an administrator. We have strict rules about sourcing edits made to articles. — The Hand That Feeds You: Bite 23:31, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
This is the first time I've edited a Wikipedia article, so am not familiar with the process. Nowhere did it say that my edits or inserts need to be discussed with anyone before posting, although I have to admit that I skipped over the T's and C's...
As someone who has personal first-hand experience of gang stalking, I feel strongly that this subject should be accurately portrayed, which it currently is not in this media.
I dispute the portrayal of victims of this widespread crime as being mentally ill, as in this Wikipedia article. There is an inexhaustible amount of information and publications available in support of gang stalking being a real phenomenon, however none of these are referred to or quoted in the Wikipedia article. TargetedUK ( talk) 23:58, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
I will return with the relevant reliable sources and will then make changes to this article which will represent a more balanced and factual description of gang stalking. TargetedUK ( talk) 03:14, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
In the meantime, having now read some of the 'Terms of use' please note the following from the 'Wikipedia Behavioural Guidelines':- - Do not bite the newcomers - Di not be hostile towards fellow editors, newcomers in particular - Remember to assume good faith and respond to problematic edits in a clear and POLITE manner. TargetedUK ( talk) 03:45, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
Please add the following:
1. Add a missing sentence to the paragraph of the Sheridan and James study [13].
The study is, however, exploratory in nature, and replications of its findings are necessary before they can be considered to be clearly established.
2. Add a paragraph below the paragraph of the Sheridan and James study[13]:
In the Sheridan and James study [13] the definition of a delusion was taken from the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, 5th edition, [DSM-V]. However: "The distinction between a delusion and a strongly held idea is sometimes difficult to make and depends in part on the degree of conviction with which the belief is held despite clear or reasonable contradictory evidence regarding its veracity."[]
Link to: Wikipedia - Delusion /info/en/?search=Delusion Petermooring ( talk) 16:10, 24 October 2023 (UTC)
I believe Kiwi Farms should be removed from the See Also section of this page, and added to the See Also section of the Stalking page. Since this article is about persecutory delusions rather than actual group stalking, including it here seems to imply that the victims of Kiwi Farms aren't actually being stalked, and are just having delusions that they are. Alternatively, it seems to imply that Gang Stalking is a real phenomenon, and that the actions of Kiwi Farms is an example of it. From what I gather, Wikipedia holds neither of these positions to be true. Cerrathegreat ( talk) 19:00, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
Here are three new sources which review the ways in which targeted individuals tell their stories online.
{{
cite journal}}
: CS1 maint: unflagged free DOI (
link){{
cite journal}}
: CS1 maint: unflagged free DOI (
link)Bluerasberry (talk) 18:21, 15 December 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Gang stalking article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | This article was nominated for
deletion. Please review the prior discussions if you are considering re-nomination:
|
![]() | On 8 July 2021, it was proposed that this article be moved from Gang stalking to Gang stalking delusion. The result of the discussion was no consensus (overturned from moved). |
There have been numerous past deletion discussions about gang stalking and targeted individuals. I listed the seven I found here on the talk page, and this may be all of the actual deletion discussions. The most recent deletion was in 2014.
This topic meets notability now because researcher Sheridan published 2 papers on this topic in 2015 and 2020. The New York Times did a story on this in 2016. Psychology Today' published a 3-article series on this in 2020. In 2017, Vice published two video documentaries about this. These sources were not available during the previous deletions, and now the available media we have to cite makes this topic pass WP:GNG and eligible for inclusion in Wikipedia.
{{
cite journal}}
: CS1 maint: unflagged free DOI (
link)Blue Rasberry (talk) 00:51, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
This was a tense topic in the past and may be so in the future. If anyone has links to past discussions or consensus then please share, so that we can continue to use precedent to keep conversation productive. Blue Rasberry (talk) 00:53, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
Previously people have tried to start Wikipedia articles for "gang stalking" and "targeted individual". I propose that we keep both of these topics here. Gang stalkers are the perpetrators, and targeted individuals are the victims. They exist together and explaining one will explain the other.
"Gang stalking" is the name for the activity and I think the best name for this article. "Targeted individual" should redirect here, where there can be a section on targeted individuals if necessary. Blue Rasberry (talk) 00:57, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
From what I understand, gang stalking and electronic harassment are related but separate delusions as some self-identified "targeted individuals" believe that the stalking is happening in ways that are different than electronic surveillance. For example, there are those who are obsessed with black helicopters and others who think that they are being followed by people they see on the street. jps ( talk) 14:36, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
![]() | This discussion was listed at Wikipedia:Move review on 3 August 2021. The result of the move review was overturned to no consensus. |
The result of the move request was: Overturned to no consensus RandomCanadian ( talk / contribs) 03:27, 6 September 2021 (UTC)
Pre-MRV closure
|
---|
The result of the move request was: moved. Clear consensus to move. Gang stalking delusion seems to have a bit more support than the alternative with brackets. ( closed by non-admin page mover) Vpab15 ( talk) 18:11, 31 July 2021 (UTC) |
Gang stalking → Gang stalking delusion – see below Lembit Staan ( talk) 00:16, 8 July 2021 (UTC)
I was stalking the " Targeted individual" :-) in my watchlist , hence I see the article. I moved the page because ...er... "'Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't after you.'". This article is about a paranoid, not about the real gang stalking, right? Lembit Staan ( talk) 22:58, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
non-medical things to say, like what people experience, what effects this has on lives,-- is a non-argument. Paranoia does have effect on people's life, so does delusion of grandeur. Lembit Staan ( talk) 00:07, 8 July 2021 (UTC)
Usually, titles should unambiguously define the topical scope of the article, but should be no more precise than that.and the fact that group stalking (sometimes called "real" gang stalking) is an actual phenomenon, of which there are documented cases. In order to distinguish this article from that concept, I put forth what seems to be the current favorite in this discussion. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 12:58, 19 July 2021 (UTC)
It has a section with "gang stalking" in the title which has sources information relevant to this article. It must be merged heree. Lembit Staan ( talk) 23:11, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
Wikipedia is not a forum for discussing the subjects of articles. Contrary to that rule, I am about discuss the subject of this article because by briefly ignoring all rules I hope that we can get back to making the encyclopedia by focusing on what sources say.
Some people see "gang stalking" as a mental health issue or persecutory delusion. Yes, for some people there is a relationship between this and mental problems, but the practice of "calling people crazy" is neither productive as a medical intervention nor a reflection of all of the sources. The academic sources by Sheridan treat this as a public health issue of community harm. Read this one and see -
{{
cite journal}}
: CS1 maint: unflagged free DOI (
link)This source says, "we decided to conduct a study of the experiences of those reporting gang-stalking" and summarizes what people say, how the experience affects their lives, and suggests that research could help people experiencing this. The source does not make blanket medical diagnoses of people reporting this experience. I wish that this Wikipedia article could mirror some of the sensitivity of sources like this by presenting multiple perspectives in this article. We should include medical perspectives in this article. Emphasizing those perspectives beyond the original sources is excessive and may not be helpful.
The Sheridan 2020 source lists characteristics of gang stalking.
Blue Rasberry (talk) 00:09, 8 July 2021 (UTC)
"Stalking Victimisation: Prevalence and Dynamics amongst Spanish University Students" is a 2017 statistical article .
Stalking was recently criminalised in Spain and other European countries, following the signing of the Council of Europe Convention on preventing and combating violence against women and domestic violence, despite a lack of empirical knowledge of victimisation by this phenomenon. Previous research carried out in the usa and in other European countries on victimisation by stalking with female samples has shown that young women are the most frequently victimised group. Based on those findings, research was conducted in Spain with a sample of 1,162 university students, including women and men. This paper presents the main findings of this research, determining the prevalence of stalking victimisation, the victim and stalker profiles, and the dynamics of this type of victimisation.
It defined "group stalking" as stalking by 3 or pore perpetrators. Findings about it:
More quotes:
Statistically significant differences were also found between stalker gender and the number of offenders involved in the stalking (χ2 (6, N=152) = 57.05; ρ < .001, Φ = .433). Whilst 80.6% of men acted alone, women preferred to act in groups (45.7% of the cases); only 42.9% of women stalked alone.
Finally, group stalking (stalking involving 3 or more offenders) was perpetrated by mixed groups (44%), followed by exclusively female groups (36%) and exclusively male ones (20%)
In most cases, the stalking was perpetrated by only one person (61.2%), although occasionally stalkers acted in groups of two, three or even more (Figure 5). (Fig 5. for "3 or more" shows 16.5%)
I guess we can start with section "Group stalking" in Stalking article and wait until it grows to decent size. -- Lembit Staan ( talk) 01:07, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
Since this phenomenon, which was first reported in 2000, seems to be almost identical to the plot of a very well-known movie released in 1998, the obvious conclusion is that people suffering from more common paranoid delusions of being persecuted by sinister cabals (with or without Air Looms), which differ from "gang stalking" only in the size of the gang involved, might perhaps have been a wee bit influenced by the movie?
Your article about the film does mention a rare mental illness officially called "the Truman Show Delusion", which is the specific belief that your whole life is a reality TV show, but gang stalking seems to be very much the same kind of thing, except that the hidden TV cameras are optional, and if it has no connection with the film, the timing is a remarkable coincidence.
Obviously my personal opinion isn't acceptable as a source, but the similarity is so screamingly obvious that surely it must have been discussed in respectable psychiatric literature somewhere or other? And assuming it has been and someone can find the article, isn't this one of the most significant aspects of the syndrome, and well worth a mention? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.145.55.72 ( talk • contribs)
"The gangstalking belief system is similar to some other well-established persecutory delusional belief systems, such as the Truman Show delusion, where those affected believe that their lives are surreptitiously being continuously recorded and produced into a reality television show and that everyone or nearly everyone they come into contact with is complicit in the deceit."
Recently the WikiProject Crime banner was removed from this talk page with the edit comments saying that the project is about "real crimes". However, I have put the banner back because I think this article is still within the scope of WikiProject Crime. The project's goal is to improve the quality of articles related to subjects about crime. The project focuses on criminology and a wide range of crime-related topics. I think that people who imagining they are victims of crime is a real phenomenon that is crime related. In many jurisdictions, making a false report of crime is itself a crime, so dismissing this article as "not a real crime" fails to appreciate that people's perception of crime is also important to the field of criminology. This article serves to explain one aspect of false reporting about crime, in that some people have delusions they are being stalked or harassed by a gang of people. Knowing this is is a reported phenomenon helps criminal investigators sort out those false allegations and permits investigators to identify that crime has not occurred even though it has been alleged. This is why the article is in the scope of the project: it is still "crime-related" even though the crime probably only imagined in this instance. One cannot necessarily discount that a crime allegation might be real in the absence of contrary evidence. - Cameron Dewe ( talk) 11:19, 19 October 2021 (UTC)
This is a real phenomenon!!! 2600:1008:B021:96E3:F44F:1A81:C05F:D4EC ( talk) 14:52, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
The definition is wrong, because gang stalking is real. What a bad manipulation: with such a fake definition, the gangstalking risks to be even more harrassive. 2A02:A020:9:92F6:AA33:DFE6:F5ED:BC2E ( talk) 19:56, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
The article describes gang stalking as a delusion, but I don't think that matches how reliable sources predominantly describe it. Sources paint the picture that gang-stalking is a phenomenon with limited informational that more research is needed to understand. It's often labeled as an "unexplored belief system". It is never labeled outright as delusional, that's always prefixed with something like "seemingly" or "apparently". I think we're taking way to much of a POV here that isn't represented in reliable sources. –– FormalDude talk 20:42, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
Status quo version:
"Gang stalking" is a novel persecutory belief system experienced by individuals who believe they are being followed, stalked, and harassed by a large number of people.[1] The term is associated with the "targeted individual" (T.I.) virtual community formed by like-minded individuals who claim their lives are disrupted from being stalked by organized groups intent on causing them harm.[2][3]
My version:
"Gang stalking" is a phenomenon where individuals believe they are being followed, stalked, and harassed by a large number of people.[1] Studies have determined that most cases are highly likely to be delusional in nature, and the phenomenon is considered a persecutory belief system.
The term is associated with the "targeted individual" (T.I.) virtual community formed by like-minded individuals who claim their lives are disrupted from being stalked by organized groups intent on causing them harm.[2][3] Researchers have suggested that online communities could be a catalyst for the experience.
Anyone else want to weigh in? –– FormalDude talk 00:03, 18 March 2022 (UTC)
is considereda persecutory belief system. They describe it as a persecutory belief system without qualification. They describe such beliefs as
delusional in basis. They describe TI forums as exacerbating mental illness, or creating psychotic symptoms. Adding
is consideredis in fact less neutral, in the same way it were if the White genocide conspiracy theory article were to be edited to say that it's considered a political myth. -- Equivamp - talk 01:01, 18 March 2022 (UTC)
The idea that "organized, large-scale persecution" is "unfeasible and impossible to remain secret" is factually incorrect and that's not a matter of opinion. Zerzetsung ( /info/en/?search=Zersetzung) lasted for two decades and victimized over 10 thousand people. So the point is not valid. @FormalDude's version is more neutral precisely because it doesn't dismiss the existence of the persecution in the definition of Gangs Stalking. Galmeida28 ( talk) 22:29, 22 March 2022 (UTC)
Looking through the sources in this article, it seems that the lead sentence is a too-close paraphrase of the source. As it reads currently:
Gang stalking is a novel persecutory belief system experienced by individuals who believe they are being followed, stalked, and harassed by a large number of people.
Compare to the first sentence of the source, which reads:
Gangstalking is a novel persecutory belief system whereby those affected believe they are being followed, stalked, and harassed by a large number of people, often numbering in the thousands.
Normally I would BOLDly rephrase it and mention the CLOP issue after the fact, but as the text in question is already under dispute, I thought I'd bring it up here first. IMO, definitely in need of a rewrite. And the rest of the article should probably be combed over for similar copyvio concerns... -- Equivamp - talk 01:13, 18 March 2022 (UTC)
Persecutory delusion reads According to the DSM-IV-TR, persecutory delusions are the most common form of delusions in paranoid schizophrenia, where the person believes "he or she is being tormented, followed, tricked, spied on, or ridiculed"
. I notice this article does not discuss schizophrenia in particular -- should this article have some discussion about paranoid schizophrenia as it relates to patients who are experiencing delusions of being stalked by large groups and organisations? I'm not familiar with the medical literature on the topic, but schizophrenia seems to be brought up often in lay discussions of gang stalking.
Endwise (
talk)
06:50, 26 March 2022 (UTC)
Schizophrenic patients commonly see patterns and abnormal cause and effect, gang stalking is definitely a result of this illness. With medication their “suspicions” vanish entirely. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 222.153.110.240 ( talk) 11:09, 8 May 2022 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Firstly, the definition of gang stalking is "stalking done on individual by two or more people". Does this ever happen in a real life, is whole another question and it has nothing to do with the definition. If somebody wants to coin a term for a persecutory belief system, please do but do not use the term ´gang stalking` bcause that is reserved for another use. Secondly, as many writers here seem to think that gang stalking does never happen in a real life, I would like point out that to come to that conclusion you need to watch the whole Earth at once for a long period of time to be able determine does some behaviour lack here all together. I do not think anybody has ever done that for it seems to impossible for humans to do. So, how about if writers here would stop outright lying and stick to the facts? UnderLittleFacts ( talk) 17:14, 29 June 2022 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
1. Protected article 2. Quite short 3. No neutral definition 4. References to study but no further information about study 5. No notable cases mentioned FI961091 ( talk) 11:18, 20 September 2022 (UTC)
@ TargetedUK: please discuss the changes you want to make here first. If you continue inserting unsourced opinion into the article, you'll likely wind up blocked by an administrator. We have strict rules about sourcing edits made to articles. — The Hand That Feeds You: Bite 23:31, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
This is the first time I've edited a Wikipedia article, so am not familiar with the process. Nowhere did it say that my edits or inserts need to be discussed with anyone before posting, although I have to admit that I skipped over the T's and C's...
As someone who has personal first-hand experience of gang stalking, I feel strongly that this subject should be accurately portrayed, which it currently is not in this media.
I dispute the portrayal of victims of this widespread crime as being mentally ill, as in this Wikipedia article. There is an inexhaustible amount of information and publications available in support of gang stalking being a real phenomenon, however none of these are referred to or quoted in the Wikipedia article. TargetedUK ( talk) 23:58, 8 February 2023 (UTC)
I will return with the relevant reliable sources and will then make changes to this article which will represent a more balanced and factual description of gang stalking. TargetedUK ( talk) 03:14, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
In the meantime, having now read some of the 'Terms of use' please note the following from the 'Wikipedia Behavioural Guidelines':- - Do not bite the newcomers - Di not be hostile towards fellow editors, newcomers in particular - Remember to assume good faith and respond to problematic edits in a clear and POLITE manner. TargetedUK ( talk) 03:45, 9 February 2023 (UTC)
Please add the following:
1. Add a missing sentence to the paragraph of the Sheridan and James study [13].
The study is, however, exploratory in nature, and replications of its findings are necessary before they can be considered to be clearly established.
2. Add a paragraph below the paragraph of the Sheridan and James study[13]:
In the Sheridan and James study [13] the definition of a delusion was taken from the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, 5th edition, [DSM-V]. However: "The distinction between a delusion and a strongly held idea is sometimes difficult to make and depends in part on the degree of conviction with which the belief is held despite clear or reasonable contradictory evidence regarding its veracity."[]
Link to: Wikipedia - Delusion /info/en/?search=Delusion Petermooring ( talk) 16:10, 24 October 2023 (UTC)
I believe Kiwi Farms should be removed from the See Also section of this page, and added to the See Also section of the Stalking page. Since this article is about persecutory delusions rather than actual group stalking, including it here seems to imply that the victims of Kiwi Farms aren't actually being stalked, and are just having delusions that they are. Alternatively, it seems to imply that Gang Stalking is a real phenomenon, and that the actions of Kiwi Farms is an example of it. From what I gather, Wikipedia holds neither of these positions to be true. Cerrathegreat ( talk) 19:00, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
Here are three new sources which review the ways in which targeted individuals tell their stories online.
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link)Bluerasberry (talk) 18:21, 15 December 2023 (UTC)