Is phase 2 a good idea? Seems like we'd just end up RFCing the same things again. RFCs are extremely time intensive, especially 13 of them. Perhaps we should just do a phase 1. There will likely be one or two follow up RFCs for certain proposals after phase 1, but I am not sure they need the structure of a "phase 2", i.e. all starting and ending at the same time. Those could be run at the village pump ad hoc / only as needed. – Novem Linguae ( talk) 06:21, 23 February 2024 (UTC)
As we move into the later parts of phase 1, something occurs to me that continues some of the points made previously in this thread. On the one hand, I like the idea that phase 1 has been an opportunity for trial balloons, and it seems to me that a lot of the discussion has treated proposals in that way. On the other hand, some of the proposals look like there will end up having been a lot of participation, and some of those may perhaps have significantly more support than opposition. I think everyone agrees that when a proposal has gotten a lot of support in phase 1, then that's a proposal that has the potential to lead to something. But I would not want to see any phase 1 proposals closed as "having consensus" and consequently enacted as initially written, even if they seem to have clear majority support. I say that because even those that have gotten a lot of support have also gotten a lot of feedback about ways they could be improved, or about things that potentially might need revision. So if we're going to have a phase 2 at all, then phase 2 should include finalizing/polishing up even the most supported proposals, followed only then by RfCs asking whether or not they should be enacted. -- Tryptofish ( talk) 20:45, 16 March 2024 (UTC)
But I would not want to see any phase 1 proposals closed as "having consensus" and consequently enacted as initially written, even if they seem to have clear majority support.This sounds like bureaucracy for the sake of having bureaucracy so I disagree. If there is significantly enough people who want a specific proposal edited before it gets implemented, sure. But I am hard against all proposals going through another set of hoops no matter what. That's the easiest way to overturn consensus completely, just make all proposals go through another set of rubber stamping where they may potentially fail. Soni ( talk) 01:20, 17 March 2024 (UTC)
There might be a simple best of both worlds. We just need to have a the fourth category of results
For #1 the closer only counts the unconditional supports. For #4 count the unconditional and conditional supports, the latter including things like "good idea but needs refining". North8000 ( talk) 23:07, 17 March 2024 (UTC)
BTW further workshopping was initially specified "Any proposals that require workshopping or follow-up can be discussed in Phase II, where participants will discuss the outcomes of trial proposals and refine the implementation details of broad-strokes ideas. " and this is the basis/framework that many folks used in responding. North8000 ( talk) 23:13, 17 March 2024 (UTC)
I think it might be good to put all closed/rejected proposal into an archive. The page is already quite long, having closed RFCs out of the way would make it a lot easier to parse. Soni ( talk) 06:54, 23 February 2024 (UTC)
People commenting on the proposal page should not be closing any section of the page. SNOW or otherwise.
If it continues, it will invalidate the page, as No Action, due to INVOLVED closers.
I don't think anything untoward was intended. But I think everyone participating would like the community to have confidence in any results here. - jc37 08:29, 23 February 2024 (UTC)
I am just discovering this page for the first time today, and it seems it's been going a while already. If major restructures of the way the community's processes work are going to be held it seems imperative that all editors be alerted via watchlist notices so they can give their tuppence-worth. Cheers — Amakuru ( talk) 21:54, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
Is there a summary of past changes? Has there been any discussion or evaluation? The first step in thinking about future changes ought to be reflection on the status quo and past improvement efforts. YBG ( talk) 02:52, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
There's no invitation to make proposals and no method to make proposals. North8000 ( talk) 13:36, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
Also this IMO is headed for the same problem as the previous one. A effective process is one that is going to do the long hard work of evolving and refining some really good ideas. Under the last and current process, this work is terminated at the very beginning of the process. Sincerely, North8000 ( talk) 14:02, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
The people that we really need are the capable "I'm willing to serve" people rather than the "I want this" folks. RFA has an "I want this" atmosphere / basis, a basis and environment that the "willing to serve" folks are often unwilling to go into. Also, it puts the crowd and conversations at RFA into a "you are asking for this, you'll need to fight/grovel/beg for it" mode. Changing the name to "Nominations For Adminship" would shift the psychological ground in all of these areas. North8000 ( talk) 13:46, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
The page is getting quite long and can be hard to read through. By collapsing them, it would be much easier to read through Fanfanboy ( talk) 16:20, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
Like the subject line says. ☆ Bri ( talk) 23:01, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
Having new proposals streaming in the entire time !voting and discussion takes place means the status of each proposal becomes less and less clear as participation thins. Create a deadline for proposals and start the RfC at that point. — Rhododendrites talk \\ 15:37, 29 February 2024 (UTC)
Hilst
[talk]
00:34, 2 March 2024 (UTC)Once the deadline has arrived, I think it would be appropriate to issue a new set of notifications.
I also think it would be appropriate to provide a talk page notification, containing a list of all active proposals and a brief neutral summary of each one, to every editor who has participated in any discussion here - editors may be unaware that the proposals have kept being added, and I think it would be a good idea to give them every possible opportunity of participating.
I'm happy to write up the summary and then post it here for approval prior to it being disseminated. BilledMammal ( talk) 00:11, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
isaacl ( talk) 17:32, 16 March 2024 (UTC)
Could we collapse closed proposals? SmokeyJoe ( talk) 11:27, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
There are some proposals that could benefit from greater participation. I wonder if an alternate route to highlight those could just be to transclude or summarise all currently open proposals somewhere. I attempted to wrangle with Template:Excerpt at User:Soni/sandbox3 but there's probably smarter ways out there too.
There's a number of proposals that seem to be at consensus already, I'm just hoping we can also increase engagement and ease of joining discussions for someone new. Soni ( talk) 14:37, 4 March 2024 (UTC)
I considered making a proposal but I'm not sure how to word it clearly/concisely, and it may be slightly outside of the scope of this process.
It's well known that Wikipedia needs more administrators, but there seems to be a disconnect between that fact and getting volunteers to stand for RFA. It seems to me that the process should go the other direction, in a sense - that is, there should be more clarity on which tasks we need more admins for, and by extension, more clarity on who would be well-suited to volunteer. Adminship, at least in the eyes of some, has been seen as something that one strives for less so than volunteering to take on something new, which might contribute to some of the hostility at RFA. I suspect there are a number of people who would consider standing for RFA if they knew where the needs were and where they could contribute. Candidates are often nominated by current administrators, but how many potential candidates are overlooked? I don't know if I can articulate a specific proposal here, but this is something that's been on my mind for a while so I thought now was a good time to bring it up. -- Sable232 ( talk) 02:02, 5 March 2024 (UTC)
Reviewing the discussion, I think the following can be closed as a clear consensus against:
If no one objects in the next 24 hours I will close 8, 12, 16b, and 22 as "consensus against" with a suitable summary - I am not involved in any of those, and have no personal opinions on them. I will not close 20 and 21, as I voted in favor of both of them and am thus WP:INVOLVED, although I hope another editor will be willing to do so. BilledMammal ( talk) 00:09, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
By my count, we've got 44 proposals and sub-proposals and we're not even a month in (though a few have been closed). How many of these are we going to have? It makes it kind of difficult to read through. BeanieFan11 ( talk) 21:05, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
Is it a good idea to be closing proposals as successful with only 5 days of discussion? Could this possibly open the closes up to wiki-lawyering later? Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/2024 review/Phase I#Proposal 25: Require nominees to be extended confirmed (closed). It is my understanding from our discussions above that we were going to have a 30 day period where no new proposals were introduced so that everyone could catch up on !voting for the existing proposals. – Novem Linguae ( talk) 05:43, 8 March 2024 (UTC)
I changed the section headers to make it easier for editors to identify proposals that are still open; if there is a concern about links elsewhere being broken, we can add anchors. BilledMammal ( talk) 06:18, 8 March 2024 (UTC)
where participants will discuss the outcomes of trial proposalsto a later phase and just focus phase 2 on
and refine the implementation details of broad-strokes ideas. isaacl ( talk) 15:14, 8 March 2024 (UTC)
I didn't have a chance to actually draft a proposal to this effect, but for me one of the most critical things to determine would be how to make it easier/smoother for editors like myself, who are purely technical editors, to gain the mop. Having admins who are exclusively dedicated to counter vandalism and technical work is not a bad thing (despite what some might try to say otherwise). However, nominations of these types of editors generally fail because of the content thing; and while I guess I understand why some content-building experience would be important for those who wish to dive deep into the drama boards and dispute resolution and CTs and all that "fun" stuff, I would argue that it should also be indisputable that one does not need experience writing content to be able to have sufficient skills to block vandal accounts, inappropriate username, delete obvious CSD pages, etc. Like, the ability to determine whether something is or isn't blatant disruption, to determine whether something is or isn't a username violation, or to determine whether some page meets or doesn't meet the rather black-and-white CSD criteria doesn't really require having written anything at all. And yet we still say that all admin candidates must be content creators because admins are the ones who mediate disputes involving content that become conduct disputes, and admins have to make tough calls at AFD or AE and whatnot. Which is all true... but the problem is that not all admins will have a desire to do that stuff. How much content one has created doesn't provide any insight as to one's technical knowledge. If only there was a way to somehow segregate the technical/janitorial aspects of adminship from the social aspects of adminship, we would be much better off. We could have two different boilerplate templates for RFAs - one for someone who is running on purely technical grounds, and one for someone who is running on social grounds or both grounds. An RFA for an exclusively technical editor who would be focused on AIV/UAA/RPP/CSD/etc would be able to be evaluated solely based on their understanding, execution, and application of the relevant enforcement policies (i.e. check their AIV/UAA reports for general compliance with standards, make sure there aren't hoards of blue links in their CSD log, ask some basic questions about when to block vs. protect, etc.) Contrarily someone who is running with a stated intention to get involved in the more complex areas could be evaluated based on their social skills, content work, dispute resolution skills, etc. Not all admin candidates are created equal; we should stop trying to apply a one-size-fits-all criteria that all candidates have to meet before being considered regardless of their backgrounds or their intentions. We must tailor applications to the specific applicant and what they plan to do with the tools. If we did this, I have a feeling we'd have a lot more nominations. End Rant. Taking Out The Trash ( talk) 23:49, 15 March 2024 (UTC)
This might seem like a really simple question, but when will the general voting/discussion period be over and successful proposals closed? Do we have to wait for more RfAs for the process to continue? Thanks for dealing with a semi-clueless user! ❤History Theorist❤ 00:22, 19 March 2024 (UTC)
I've just closed proposals 16 and 16c as successful but requiring further discussion of specifics in Phase II. What's the format for that going to be? – Joe ( talk) 09:56, 27 March 2024 (UTC)
In my opinion, this RFC should only be to determine if community consensus exists to try some kind of admin election / secret voting system. The technical details should be worked out later.Xaosflux said in the discussion that ACE suffrage would be time-consuming, scrutineering and election location haven't been worked out, and I think the threshold is too high. An idea was passed, and the community should have the chance to workshop and concretize it before a test run. If the closer wants to fill in blanks, that's great, but no, I don't think skipping phase II is fair. theleekycauldron ( talk • she/her) 12:13, 27 March 2024 (UTC)
The technical details should be worked out laterbecause of what happened in RFA2021, but I have completely changed my mind about it because support for prop 13 was so strong in RFA2024. Just now I have struck my original comment so that this is clearer.
I think that any plan needs to recognize and handle the following which I think is the case with many of the passing proposals:
Sincerely, North8000 ( talk) 18:23, 27 March 2024 (UTC)
@ Joe For Proposal 14, is the consensus to restrict voting in RFA to "Extended Confirmed" or to "30 days and 500 edits"? The former can be manually added to users based on a request, the latter cannot. I don't know if that matters in 14, but it was a non-insignificant factor for discussion in #25 (Nominees should be EC) Soni ( talk) 13:40, 30 March 2024 (UTC)
@ Nagol0929: In your close, can you please address the related issues brought up in Proposal 9b, as discussed above in #Is phase 2 a good idea? Thanks. -- Tryptofish ( talk) 20:22, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
Editors may not make allegations of improper conduct without evidence.". Now, if you believe there is consensus for the wording as written, then Tryptofish is asking for clarification as to how proposals 2 and 9b are going to be reconciled as they appear contradictory. — Sirdog ( talk) 23:27, 19 April 2024 (UTC)
I find that there is consensus for this to be implemented at RfA. However there is not a clear consensus on what the actual message should say.isaacl ( talk) 03:49, 20 April 2024 (UTC)
All discussions are now closed. Toadette Edit! 22:41, 24 April 2024 (UTC)
Is phase 2 a good idea? Seems like we'd just end up RFCing the same things again. RFCs are extremely time intensive, especially 13 of them. Perhaps we should just do a phase 1. There will likely be one or two follow up RFCs for certain proposals after phase 1, but I am not sure they need the structure of a "phase 2", i.e. all starting and ending at the same time. Those could be run at the village pump ad hoc / only as needed. – Novem Linguae ( talk) 06:21, 23 February 2024 (UTC)
As we move into the later parts of phase 1, something occurs to me that continues some of the points made previously in this thread. On the one hand, I like the idea that phase 1 has been an opportunity for trial balloons, and it seems to me that a lot of the discussion has treated proposals in that way. On the other hand, some of the proposals look like there will end up having been a lot of participation, and some of those may perhaps have significantly more support than opposition. I think everyone agrees that when a proposal has gotten a lot of support in phase 1, then that's a proposal that has the potential to lead to something. But I would not want to see any phase 1 proposals closed as "having consensus" and consequently enacted as initially written, even if they seem to have clear majority support. I say that because even those that have gotten a lot of support have also gotten a lot of feedback about ways they could be improved, or about things that potentially might need revision. So if we're going to have a phase 2 at all, then phase 2 should include finalizing/polishing up even the most supported proposals, followed only then by RfCs asking whether or not they should be enacted. -- Tryptofish ( talk) 20:45, 16 March 2024 (UTC)
But I would not want to see any phase 1 proposals closed as "having consensus" and consequently enacted as initially written, even if they seem to have clear majority support.This sounds like bureaucracy for the sake of having bureaucracy so I disagree. If there is significantly enough people who want a specific proposal edited before it gets implemented, sure. But I am hard against all proposals going through another set of hoops no matter what. That's the easiest way to overturn consensus completely, just make all proposals go through another set of rubber stamping where they may potentially fail. Soni ( talk) 01:20, 17 March 2024 (UTC)
There might be a simple best of both worlds. We just need to have a the fourth category of results
For #1 the closer only counts the unconditional supports. For #4 count the unconditional and conditional supports, the latter including things like "good idea but needs refining". North8000 ( talk) 23:07, 17 March 2024 (UTC)
BTW further workshopping was initially specified "Any proposals that require workshopping or follow-up can be discussed in Phase II, where participants will discuss the outcomes of trial proposals and refine the implementation details of broad-strokes ideas. " and this is the basis/framework that many folks used in responding. North8000 ( talk) 23:13, 17 March 2024 (UTC)
I think it might be good to put all closed/rejected proposal into an archive. The page is already quite long, having closed RFCs out of the way would make it a lot easier to parse. Soni ( talk) 06:54, 23 February 2024 (UTC)
People commenting on the proposal page should not be closing any section of the page. SNOW or otherwise.
If it continues, it will invalidate the page, as No Action, due to INVOLVED closers.
I don't think anything untoward was intended. But I think everyone participating would like the community to have confidence in any results here. - jc37 08:29, 23 February 2024 (UTC)
I am just discovering this page for the first time today, and it seems it's been going a while already. If major restructures of the way the community's processes work are going to be held it seems imperative that all editors be alerted via watchlist notices so they can give their tuppence-worth. Cheers — Amakuru ( talk) 21:54, 26 February 2024 (UTC)
Is there a summary of past changes? Has there been any discussion or evaluation? The first step in thinking about future changes ought to be reflection on the status quo and past improvement efforts. YBG ( talk) 02:52, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
There's no invitation to make proposals and no method to make proposals. North8000 ( talk) 13:36, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
Also this IMO is headed for the same problem as the previous one. A effective process is one that is going to do the long hard work of evolving and refining some really good ideas. Under the last and current process, this work is terminated at the very beginning of the process. Sincerely, North8000 ( talk) 14:02, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
The people that we really need are the capable "I'm willing to serve" people rather than the "I want this" folks. RFA has an "I want this" atmosphere / basis, a basis and environment that the "willing to serve" folks are often unwilling to go into. Also, it puts the crowd and conversations at RFA into a "you are asking for this, you'll need to fight/grovel/beg for it" mode. Changing the name to "Nominations For Adminship" would shift the psychological ground in all of these areas. North8000 ( talk) 13:46, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
The page is getting quite long and can be hard to read through. By collapsing them, it would be much easier to read through Fanfanboy ( talk) 16:20, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
Like the subject line says. ☆ Bri ( talk) 23:01, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
Having new proposals streaming in the entire time !voting and discussion takes place means the status of each proposal becomes less and less clear as participation thins. Create a deadline for proposals and start the RfC at that point. — Rhododendrites talk \\ 15:37, 29 February 2024 (UTC)
Hilst
[talk]
00:34, 2 March 2024 (UTC)Once the deadline has arrived, I think it would be appropriate to issue a new set of notifications.
I also think it would be appropriate to provide a talk page notification, containing a list of all active proposals and a brief neutral summary of each one, to every editor who has participated in any discussion here - editors may be unaware that the proposals have kept being added, and I think it would be a good idea to give them every possible opportunity of participating.
I'm happy to write up the summary and then post it here for approval prior to it being disseminated. BilledMammal ( talk) 00:11, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
isaacl ( talk) 17:32, 16 March 2024 (UTC)
Could we collapse closed proposals? SmokeyJoe ( talk) 11:27, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
There are some proposals that could benefit from greater participation. I wonder if an alternate route to highlight those could just be to transclude or summarise all currently open proposals somewhere. I attempted to wrangle with Template:Excerpt at User:Soni/sandbox3 but there's probably smarter ways out there too.
There's a number of proposals that seem to be at consensus already, I'm just hoping we can also increase engagement and ease of joining discussions for someone new. Soni ( talk) 14:37, 4 March 2024 (UTC)
I considered making a proposal but I'm not sure how to word it clearly/concisely, and it may be slightly outside of the scope of this process.
It's well known that Wikipedia needs more administrators, but there seems to be a disconnect between that fact and getting volunteers to stand for RFA. It seems to me that the process should go the other direction, in a sense - that is, there should be more clarity on which tasks we need more admins for, and by extension, more clarity on who would be well-suited to volunteer. Adminship, at least in the eyes of some, has been seen as something that one strives for less so than volunteering to take on something new, which might contribute to some of the hostility at RFA. I suspect there are a number of people who would consider standing for RFA if they knew where the needs were and where they could contribute. Candidates are often nominated by current administrators, but how many potential candidates are overlooked? I don't know if I can articulate a specific proposal here, but this is something that's been on my mind for a while so I thought now was a good time to bring it up. -- Sable232 ( talk) 02:02, 5 March 2024 (UTC)
Reviewing the discussion, I think the following can be closed as a clear consensus against:
If no one objects in the next 24 hours I will close 8, 12, 16b, and 22 as "consensus against" with a suitable summary - I am not involved in any of those, and have no personal opinions on them. I will not close 20 and 21, as I voted in favor of both of them and am thus WP:INVOLVED, although I hope another editor will be willing to do so. BilledMammal ( talk) 00:09, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
By my count, we've got 44 proposals and sub-proposals and we're not even a month in (though a few have been closed). How many of these are we going to have? It makes it kind of difficult to read through. BeanieFan11 ( talk) 21:05, 7 March 2024 (UTC)
Is it a good idea to be closing proposals as successful with only 5 days of discussion? Could this possibly open the closes up to wiki-lawyering later? Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/2024 review/Phase I#Proposal 25: Require nominees to be extended confirmed (closed). It is my understanding from our discussions above that we were going to have a 30 day period where no new proposals were introduced so that everyone could catch up on !voting for the existing proposals. – Novem Linguae ( talk) 05:43, 8 March 2024 (UTC)
I changed the section headers to make it easier for editors to identify proposals that are still open; if there is a concern about links elsewhere being broken, we can add anchors. BilledMammal ( talk) 06:18, 8 March 2024 (UTC)
where participants will discuss the outcomes of trial proposalsto a later phase and just focus phase 2 on
and refine the implementation details of broad-strokes ideas. isaacl ( talk) 15:14, 8 March 2024 (UTC)
I didn't have a chance to actually draft a proposal to this effect, but for me one of the most critical things to determine would be how to make it easier/smoother for editors like myself, who are purely technical editors, to gain the mop. Having admins who are exclusively dedicated to counter vandalism and technical work is not a bad thing (despite what some might try to say otherwise). However, nominations of these types of editors generally fail because of the content thing; and while I guess I understand why some content-building experience would be important for those who wish to dive deep into the drama boards and dispute resolution and CTs and all that "fun" stuff, I would argue that it should also be indisputable that one does not need experience writing content to be able to have sufficient skills to block vandal accounts, inappropriate username, delete obvious CSD pages, etc. Like, the ability to determine whether something is or isn't blatant disruption, to determine whether something is or isn't a username violation, or to determine whether some page meets or doesn't meet the rather black-and-white CSD criteria doesn't really require having written anything at all. And yet we still say that all admin candidates must be content creators because admins are the ones who mediate disputes involving content that become conduct disputes, and admins have to make tough calls at AFD or AE and whatnot. Which is all true... but the problem is that not all admins will have a desire to do that stuff. How much content one has created doesn't provide any insight as to one's technical knowledge. If only there was a way to somehow segregate the technical/janitorial aspects of adminship from the social aspects of adminship, we would be much better off. We could have two different boilerplate templates for RFAs - one for someone who is running on purely technical grounds, and one for someone who is running on social grounds or both grounds. An RFA for an exclusively technical editor who would be focused on AIV/UAA/RPP/CSD/etc would be able to be evaluated solely based on their understanding, execution, and application of the relevant enforcement policies (i.e. check their AIV/UAA reports for general compliance with standards, make sure there aren't hoards of blue links in their CSD log, ask some basic questions about when to block vs. protect, etc.) Contrarily someone who is running with a stated intention to get involved in the more complex areas could be evaluated based on their social skills, content work, dispute resolution skills, etc. Not all admin candidates are created equal; we should stop trying to apply a one-size-fits-all criteria that all candidates have to meet before being considered regardless of their backgrounds or their intentions. We must tailor applications to the specific applicant and what they plan to do with the tools. If we did this, I have a feeling we'd have a lot more nominations. End Rant. Taking Out The Trash ( talk) 23:49, 15 March 2024 (UTC)
This might seem like a really simple question, but when will the general voting/discussion period be over and successful proposals closed? Do we have to wait for more RfAs for the process to continue? Thanks for dealing with a semi-clueless user! ❤History Theorist❤ 00:22, 19 March 2024 (UTC)
I've just closed proposals 16 and 16c as successful but requiring further discussion of specifics in Phase II. What's the format for that going to be? – Joe ( talk) 09:56, 27 March 2024 (UTC)
In my opinion, this RFC should only be to determine if community consensus exists to try some kind of admin election / secret voting system. The technical details should be worked out later.Xaosflux said in the discussion that ACE suffrage would be time-consuming, scrutineering and election location haven't been worked out, and I think the threshold is too high. An idea was passed, and the community should have the chance to workshop and concretize it before a test run. If the closer wants to fill in blanks, that's great, but no, I don't think skipping phase II is fair. theleekycauldron ( talk • she/her) 12:13, 27 March 2024 (UTC)
The technical details should be worked out laterbecause of what happened in RFA2021, but I have completely changed my mind about it because support for prop 13 was so strong in RFA2024. Just now I have struck my original comment so that this is clearer.
I think that any plan needs to recognize and handle the following which I think is the case with many of the passing proposals:
Sincerely, North8000 ( talk) 18:23, 27 March 2024 (UTC)
@ Joe For Proposal 14, is the consensus to restrict voting in RFA to "Extended Confirmed" or to "30 days and 500 edits"? The former can be manually added to users based on a request, the latter cannot. I don't know if that matters in 14, but it was a non-insignificant factor for discussion in #25 (Nominees should be EC) Soni ( talk) 13:40, 30 March 2024 (UTC)
@ Nagol0929: In your close, can you please address the related issues brought up in Proposal 9b, as discussed above in #Is phase 2 a good idea? Thanks. -- Tryptofish ( talk) 20:22, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
Editors may not make allegations of improper conduct without evidence.". Now, if you believe there is consensus for the wording as written, then Tryptofish is asking for clarification as to how proposals 2 and 9b are going to be reconciled as they appear contradictory. — Sirdog ( talk) 23:27, 19 April 2024 (UTC)
I find that there is consensus for this to be implemented at RfA. However there is not a clear consensus on what the actual message should say.isaacl ( talk) 03:49, 20 April 2024 (UTC)
All discussions are now closed. Toadette Edit! 22:41, 24 April 2024 (UTC)