- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was withdrawn. Since this AfD was started, multiple users have improved the article such that it is not eligible for deletion. I commend these users for their actions. I may even further improve it myself at some point. On a side note, a frequently used fallacious argument I find at AfD is that "sources exist, such as [1] [2] [3]." To those who !voted and provided this as a rationale: add them! Saying a topic is notable is all well and good but sources aren't going to add themselves: we assess articles on their current state, not on things outside of Wikipedia. ( non-admin closure) DrStrauss talk 18:13, 6 August 2017 (UTC)
Jasraj
- Jasraj ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
The singer fails WP:MUSICBIO. Lots of irrelevant and unsourced information in the "Early life" and "Personal life" sections. There's a lot of puffery throughout and the sources show a lack of notability.
- Source 1 is a broken link.
- Source 2 is written like an advertisement and Jasraj is not the primary subject.
- Source 3 is a book in which I can only presume he is mentioned in passing as he is not the primary topic, failing WP:SIGCOV.
- Source 4 is just an anniversary: fails WP:1EVENT. Having a birthday doesn't make one notable.
- Source 5 is a miscellaneous collection of interviews, none of which confer notability.
- Source 6 is a broken link.
- Source 7 is about his wife: notability is WP:NOTINHERITED.
- Source 8 is a massive list of minor award-recipients, all of which can gain no claim of notability as the award is not a Grammy etc which gives automatic notability per WP:MUSICBIO.
- Source 9 is a press release and a broken link.
So sources 2, 4 and 5 could in any way be considered the sources which are primarily about him, none of which appear to be more than either opinion pieces, birthday celebrations or random information. Most of the important music-related claims are unsourced and I cannot find any sources which could back them up.
DrStrauss talk 13:43, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of India-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 16:25, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Music-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 16:26, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 16:26, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the Article Rescue Squadron's list of content for rescue consideration. — Syrenka V ( talk) 06:50, 5 August 2017 (UTC)
- Keep - The subject in discussion is a recipient of both India's second-highest civilian award - Padma Vibhushan & third-highest civilian award - Padma Bhushan (And also, Sangeet Natak Akademi Award). Regarding the sources listed one has to admit it does not provide enough vital information. The article can be improved with well written, broad coverage and better referencing. - Ninney ( talk) 17:16, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
- Speedy keep. Admittedly the article is a mess. But notability is not a question here per Ninney. -- regentspark ( comment) 16:27, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
- Keep. Meets WP:GNG. Meets the criteria for 'Others' within WP:NMUSIC which is for "composers and performers outside mass media traditions". Apparently a legendary musician who was deemed worthy of a tribute concert in a 60,000 seater stadium to recognise their 80 year musical career. The article can be improved. Why are we discussing this??? Curb Safe Charmer ( talk) 19:55, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the Article Rescue Squadron's list of content for rescue consideration. Curb Safe Charmer ( talk) 20:36, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
- Keep Notability not in question: has been given India's second highest civilian award, several thousands of news stories, several thousands google books hits...@
DrStrauss: I'd suggest you withdraw this nomination: it is highly unlikely to go anywhere. Indeed I almost closed it as a "Speedy keep" myself.
Vanamonde (
talk) 10:12, 4 August 2017 (UTC)
- Strong keep. A Google search on "jasraj music award" turned up this: Pandit Jasraj to receive lifetime achievement award, on the first page of results. I wish I could honestly say "Speedy keep" but this travesty of an AfD doesn't quite meet the current very restrictive standards of WP:KEEP, though it might well make a good argument for broadening those standards. I agree entirely with Vanamonde that DrStrauss ought to withdraw the nomination.
-
- @ Vanamonde93: I was about to withdraw it but after reading all the !votes I have decided that I would prefer it to run its 7-day course. I noticed Curb Safe Charmer listed it under the Article Rescue Squadron-related articles and I think closing it now would remove the impetus to improve it. Whether he's notable or not, the article is an absolute mess (per RegentsPark) and a pending deletion discussion spurs on improvement. TL;DR: admins, please don't prematurely close this. DrStrauss talk 14:24, 5 August 2017 (UTC)
- Speedy keep Meets WP:GNG. Very well-known Indian classical musician. -- Dwaipayan ( talk) 17:39, 4 August 2017 (UTC)
- Speedy keep - Oi, no love for the his beautiful khayals? I'm not trying to be rude but what a poor nomination. A brief WP:BEFORE check quickly reveals a bounty of reliable sources. TheGracefulSlick ( talk) 07:00, 6 August 2017 (UTC)
- Keep - loads of sources and an awardee - Sitush ( talk) 11:16, 6 August 2017 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was withdrawn. Since this AfD was started, multiple users have improved the article such that it is not eligible for deletion. I commend these users for their actions. I may even further improve it myself at some point. On a side note, a frequently used fallacious argument I find at AfD is that "sources exist, such as [1] [2] [3]." To those who !voted and provided this as a rationale: add them! Saying a topic is notable is all well and good but sources aren't going to add themselves: we assess articles on their current state, not on things outside of Wikipedia. ( non-admin closure) DrStrauss talk 18:13, 6 August 2017 (UTC)
Jasraj
- Jasraj ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
The singer fails WP:MUSICBIO. Lots of irrelevant and unsourced information in the "Early life" and "Personal life" sections. There's a lot of puffery throughout and the sources show a lack of notability.
- Source 1 is a broken link.
- Source 2 is written like an advertisement and Jasraj is not the primary subject.
- Source 3 is a book in which I can only presume he is mentioned in passing as he is not the primary topic, failing WP:SIGCOV.
- Source 4 is just an anniversary: fails WP:1EVENT. Having a birthday doesn't make one notable.
- Source 5 is a miscellaneous collection of interviews, none of which confer notability.
- Source 6 is a broken link.
- Source 7 is about his wife: notability is WP:NOTINHERITED.
- Source 8 is a massive list of minor award-recipients, all of which can gain no claim of notability as the award is not a Grammy etc which gives automatic notability per WP:MUSICBIO.
- Source 9 is a press release and a broken link.
So sources 2, 4 and 5 could in any way be considered the sources which are primarily about him, none of which appear to be more than either opinion pieces, birthday celebrations or random information. Most of the important music-related claims are unsourced and I cannot find any sources which could back them up.
DrStrauss talk 13:43, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of India-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 16:25, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Music-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 16:26, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 16:26, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the Article Rescue Squadron's list of content for rescue consideration. — Syrenka V ( talk) 06:50, 5 August 2017 (UTC)
- Keep - The subject in discussion is a recipient of both India's second-highest civilian award - Padma Vibhushan & third-highest civilian award - Padma Bhushan (And also, Sangeet Natak Akademi Award). Regarding the sources listed one has to admit it does not provide enough vital information. The article can be improved with well written, broad coverage and better referencing. - Ninney ( talk) 17:16, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
- Speedy keep. Admittedly the article is a mess. But notability is not a question here per Ninney. -- regentspark ( comment) 16:27, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
- Keep. Meets WP:GNG. Meets the criteria for 'Others' within WP:NMUSIC which is for "composers and performers outside mass media traditions". Apparently a legendary musician who was deemed worthy of a tribute concert in a 60,000 seater stadium to recognise their 80 year musical career. The article can be improved. Why are we discussing this??? Curb Safe Charmer ( talk) 19:55, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the Article Rescue Squadron's list of content for rescue consideration. Curb Safe Charmer ( talk) 20:36, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
- Keep Notability not in question: has been given India's second highest civilian award, several thousands of news stories, several thousands google books hits...@
DrStrauss: I'd suggest you withdraw this nomination: it is highly unlikely to go anywhere. Indeed I almost closed it as a "Speedy keep" myself.
Vanamonde (
talk) 10:12, 4 August 2017 (UTC)
- Strong keep. A Google search on "jasraj music award" turned up this: Pandit Jasraj to receive lifetime achievement award, on the first page of results. I wish I could honestly say "Speedy keep" but this travesty of an AfD doesn't quite meet the current very restrictive standards of WP:KEEP, though it might well make a good argument for broadening those standards. I agree entirely with Vanamonde that DrStrauss ought to withdraw the nomination.
-
- @ Vanamonde93: I was about to withdraw it but after reading all the !votes I have decided that I would prefer it to run its 7-day course. I noticed Curb Safe Charmer listed it under the Article Rescue Squadron-related articles and I think closing it now would remove the impetus to improve it. Whether he's notable or not, the article is an absolute mess (per RegentsPark) and a pending deletion discussion spurs on improvement. TL;DR: admins, please don't prematurely close this. DrStrauss talk 14:24, 5 August 2017 (UTC)
- Speedy keep Meets WP:GNG. Very well-known Indian classical musician. -- Dwaipayan ( talk) 17:39, 4 August 2017 (UTC)
- Speedy keep - Oi, no love for the his beautiful khayals? I'm not trying to be rude but what a poor nomination. A brief WP:BEFORE check quickly reveals a bounty of reliable sources. TheGracefulSlick ( talk) 07:00, 6 August 2017 (UTC)
- Keep - loads of sources and an awardee - Sitush ( talk) 11:16, 6 August 2017 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.