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This list is obviously only for notable slave owners (otherwise it would be against Wikipedia policy). Plus, it says "notable" right in the lead section. No confusion. -- brian0918 ™ 01:39, 30 Apr 2005 (UTC)
what the...? this is much like a List of people who were married, for substantial periods of history. Let's vfd it, this is leading nowhere. dab (ᛏ) 29 June 2005 08:26 (UTC)
Delete this. It's a testament to wikipedia's bad reputation. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.131.255.88 ( talk) 20:26, 8 May 2017 (UTC)
See Wikipedia:Deletion process Wtmitchell (talk) (earlier Boracay Bill) 23:38, 30 May 2018 (UTC)
I'd like to revisit the discussion above and once again suggest shortening the list to slave owners after abolitionism emerged as a political force. There is no point in listing every affluent notable Roman. Pinkbeast ( talk) 09:37, 3 August 2019 (UTC)
neither of those has value as a criterion, but only value as hints about “which ballpark” of deciding it is, that we are playing in. Including or excluding any particular slave from listing, based solely, or even significantly, on dates per se would be repugnant to the mission we have set. A more rational criterion would be the slave owners with articles who are in some way significantly notable ‘’by virtue of their relation to slaveholding. Pirates known to have notably sold captives into slavery might be an example. More to the point would be not the owners, but their de facto business plans.
The image in the right-side Infobox of leg irons used on prisoners implies that slaves did something wrong and deserved to be slaves. I know this is subtle, but it screamed out at me...so maybe there are others who see this too. There are many appropriate images to place in this article; This is just not one of them. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 162.207.130.235 ( talk) 20:21, 28 April 2020 (UTC)
Reference #12 points to an article in the "Opinion" section of "The Globe and Mail". Since the author, altough a journalist, is not an expert on the subject, and it represent only his opinion, I don't think that it should be in the reference list. It does not [1]"directly support the information presented in the article". But itself cites a book written by an historian, Marcel Trudel. I think this reference #12 sould be removed.
"Slave owner" implies that enslaved individuals can be "owned" like property. Instead "enslaver" or something similar should be used, to remove this implication that humans can be property, rather than the reality that the enslavers are enforcing the state slavery on other people. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.187.88.97 ( talk) 16:41, 18 June 2020 (UTC)
There are quite a few emperors, pharaohs, kings and other rulers on this list. While many of these people surely did own slaves personally, there were also many periods of history where slavery was restricted to states. I think we ought to distinguish between people who enslaved others in a private capacity vs. those who were served by people enslaved by the state they ruled. Some will argue that modern prison labor is a form of state slavery; will we be adding the recent governors of Arkansas to this list? pburka ( talk) 17:30, 13 July 2020 (UTC)
hi all, I note that presently there are around 230 people listed in this article, of those about 190 lived 17th to 19th cents, and yet, for example, there are 1000s of romans at the category:Roman people by century, the majority of whom were slave owners (let alone all the other ancient peoples), who have not been included. Why the undue weight?". Coolabahapple ( talk) 13:42, 16 July 2020 (UTC)
The comment about Penn being a slave owner "despite being a Quaker" is close to ahistorical - Penn died in 1718; the first Quaker meeting to condemn slavery in America was in 1711, and it was not widely discouraged among American Quakers until the 1750s. I haven't been able to figure out what the state of things was in England where Penn was, but abolition didn't really get much of a start there generally until about the 1770s. Brianyoumans ( talk) 15:58, 18 July 2020 (UTC)
The U.S. Census has the names of a few million slave owners, for example. [1] Bilipede ( talk) 22:25, 4 February 2021 (UTC)
References
Historically, most royal rulers all around the globe over the centuries have owned slaves. They could potentially all be added to this article. For example, every signle Ottoman sultan could be inkluded in this list. So I am a little unsure who to include. Are this list only to include American slave ovners of American enslaved people? -- Aciram ( talk) 17:44, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
Be sure to include the well-known Monsanto family, who recently sold their business for $66 billion - seems like they should be among the first to pay reparations instead of sloughing their responsibilities off to innocent Americans 174.208.171.74 ( talk) 21:07, 27 May 2023 (UTC)
It's been nearly one year since this page was nominated for deletion. The result of the discussion was a clear consensus to keep, but several editors noted that the page was poorly referenced. I've spent some time over the last year correcting this by adding references and context to most of the entries. There are now over two hundred references, almost all to reliable and explicit secondary sources. For some I haven't been able to find strong, secondary sources demonstrating "a consensus of historical evidence" as required by the lead. In some cases I found only primary sources (e.g. census records) or implied slave ownership ("planter" usually means slave owner, but it could depend on context). I was able to find reliable and explicit sources for some of the listed monarchs and figures from antiquity, but not most of them. As the list is now mostly sourced, I plan to start removing the unreferenced entries; we can address any poorly referenced ones in a subsequent round. I plan to relocate any removed entries into a subsection of this comment. pburka ( talk) 21:53, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
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Done. I've removed about 60 unreferenced entries from the list and preserved them above. I encourage other editors to research them and, if you can find a reliable, secondary source, return them to the main list along with a few words of context and a citation.
pburka (
talk)
19:34, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
Look at that, Americans really think world is 400 yo 93.95.184.193 ( talk) 17:58, 17 March 2022 (UTC)
![]() | This article was nominated for deletion on 12 July 2020. The result of the discussion was keep. |
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
List of slave owners article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
![]() | This article is rated List-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
This list is obviously only for notable slave owners (otherwise it would be against Wikipedia policy). Plus, it says "notable" right in the lead section. No confusion. -- brian0918 ™ 01:39, 30 Apr 2005 (UTC)
what the...? this is much like a List of people who were married, for substantial periods of history. Let's vfd it, this is leading nowhere. dab (ᛏ) 29 June 2005 08:26 (UTC)
Delete this. It's a testament to wikipedia's bad reputation. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.131.255.88 ( talk) 20:26, 8 May 2017 (UTC)
See Wikipedia:Deletion process Wtmitchell (talk) (earlier Boracay Bill) 23:38, 30 May 2018 (UTC)
I'd like to revisit the discussion above and once again suggest shortening the list to slave owners after abolitionism emerged as a political force. There is no point in listing every affluent notable Roman. Pinkbeast ( talk) 09:37, 3 August 2019 (UTC)
neither of those has value as a criterion, but only value as hints about “which ballpark” of deciding it is, that we are playing in. Including or excluding any particular slave from listing, based solely, or even significantly, on dates per se would be repugnant to the mission we have set. A more rational criterion would be the slave owners with articles who are in some way significantly notable ‘’by virtue of their relation to slaveholding. Pirates known to have notably sold captives into slavery might be an example. More to the point would be not the owners, but their de facto business plans.
The image in the right-side Infobox of leg irons used on prisoners implies that slaves did something wrong and deserved to be slaves. I know this is subtle, but it screamed out at me...so maybe there are others who see this too. There are many appropriate images to place in this article; This is just not one of them. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 162.207.130.235 ( talk) 20:21, 28 April 2020 (UTC)
Reference #12 points to an article in the "Opinion" section of "The Globe and Mail". Since the author, altough a journalist, is not an expert on the subject, and it represent only his opinion, I don't think that it should be in the reference list. It does not [1]"directly support the information presented in the article". But itself cites a book written by an historian, Marcel Trudel. I think this reference #12 sould be removed.
"Slave owner" implies that enslaved individuals can be "owned" like property. Instead "enslaver" or something similar should be used, to remove this implication that humans can be property, rather than the reality that the enslavers are enforcing the state slavery on other people. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.187.88.97 ( talk) 16:41, 18 June 2020 (UTC)
There are quite a few emperors, pharaohs, kings and other rulers on this list. While many of these people surely did own slaves personally, there were also many periods of history where slavery was restricted to states. I think we ought to distinguish between people who enslaved others in a private capacity vs. those who were served by people enslaved by the state they ruled. Some will argue that modern prison labor is a form of state slavery; will we be adding the recent governors of Arkansas to this list? pburka ( talk) 17:30, 13 July 2020 (UTC)
hi all, I note that presently there are around 230 people listed in this article, of those about 190 lived 17th to 19th cents, and yet, for example, there are 1000s of romans at the category:Roman people by century, the majority of whom were slave owners (let alone all the other ancient peoples), who have not been included. Why the undue weight?". Coolabahapple ( talk) 13:42, 16 July 2020 (UTC)
The comment about Penn being a slave owner "despite being a Quaker" is close to ahistorical - Penn died in 1718; the first Quaker meeting to condemn slavery in America was in 1711, and it was not widely discouraged among American Quakers until the 1750s. I haven't been able to figure out what the state of things was in England where Penn was, but abolition didn't really get much of a start there generally until about the 1770s. Brianyoumans ( talk) 15:58, 18 July 2020 (UTC)
The U.S. Census has the names of a few million slave owners, for example. [1] Bilipede ( talk) 22:25, 4 February 2021 (UTC)
References
Historically, most royal rulers all around the globe over the centuries have owned slaves. They could potentially all be added to this article. For example, every signle Ottoman sultan could be inkluded in this list. So I am a little unsure who to include. Are this list only to include American slave ovners of American enslaved people? -- Aciram ( talk) 17:44, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
Be sure to include the well-known Monsanto family, who recently sold their business for $66 billion - seems like they should be among the first to pay reparations instead of sloughing their responsibilities off to innocent Americans 174.208.171.74 ( talk) 21:07, 27 May 2023 (UTC)
It's been nearly one year since this page was nominated for deletion. The result of the discussion was a clear consensus to keep, but several editors noted that the page was poorly referenced. I've spent some time over the last year correcting this by adding references and context to most of the entries. There are now over two hundred references, almost all to reliable and explicit secondary sources. For some I haven't been able to find strong, secondary sources demonstrating "a consensus of historical evidence" as required by the lead. In some cases I found only primary sources (e.g. census records) or implied slave ownership ("planter" usually means slave owner, but it could depend on context). I was able to find reliable and explicit sources for some of the listed monarchs and figures from antiquity, but not most of them. As the list is now mostly sourced, I plan to start removing the unreferenced entries; we can address any poorly referenced ones in a subsequent round. I plan to relocate any removed entries into a subsection of this comment. pburka ( talk) 21:53, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
Extended content
|
---|
A
B
C
D
E
F
G
H
L
M
N
P
R
S
T
V
|
Done. I've removed about 60 unreferenced entries from the list and preserved them above. I encourage other editors to research them and, if you can find a reliable, secondary source, return them to the main list along with a few words of context and a citation.
pburka (
talk)
19:34, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
Look at that, Americans really think world is 400 yo 93.95.184.193 ( talk) 17:58, 17 March 2022 (UTC)