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Can someone provide an ancient illustration or depiction of Jujustsu? thank you. Asian888 ( talk) 01:06, 11 July 2008 (UTC)
“ | The term "jūjutsu" was not coined until the 17th century, after which time it became a blanket term for a wide variety of grappling-related disciplines...
These systems of unarmed combat began to be known as Nihon koryu jūjutsu (Japanese old-style jujutsu), among other related terms, during the Muromachi period (1333-1573), according to densho (transmission scrolls) of the various ryuha (martial traditions) and historical records.... |
” |
How can the MAs be known as jujutsu in 1333 if the term jujutsu wasn't coined until 17th century? Doesn't the article contradict itself? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.7.54.224 ( talk) 19:14, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
There seems to be validity for Kumi Uchi being a seperate art. Perhaps it deserves its own article? Interesting video on kumi uchi here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42xTel5viUg&NR=1 User5802 ( talk) 06:51, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
This article includes enough information about weapons that the statemtent "Jujutsu... is a collective name for Japanese martial art styles consisting of grappling and striking techniques. Jujutsu evolved among the samurai of feudal Japan as a method for dispatching an armed and armored opponent in situations where the use of weapons was impractical or forbidden." does not appear to be accurate and is misleading.
There used to be discussion on weapons within this talk page. User5802 ( talk) 21:58, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
There's a section that mentions "The Chinese Character ..." in two places. This should be the "Kanji" character. Kanji is the generic term for that type of character used in multiple Asian languages. 206.222.194.162 ( talk) 20:20, 19 July 2009 (UTC) David Williss
The above statement is inaccurate. "Kanji" is the Japanese reading of "Hanzu," a Chinese character. In fact if you literally read the "Kan" and "Ji," they are translated as "Chinese character." Kanji is not the generic term, it is the Japanese term. There is something else that should be pointed out in the introduction (elsewhere in the article as well perhaps) with regards to language: Jujutsu actually should be translated as "The art of flexibility," though the modern Chinese character means in Chinese "softness," in Japanese it can also mean "flexible." Perhaps the reading given is the most widely known reading of Jujutsu, and therefor need not be altered, but a mention of the flexible is important. Also the link with the character "Ju" shows only Chinese definitions. There are Japanese readings given but not definitions. "Yawarakai" means flexible. 75.212.44.224 ( talk) 21:03, 31 August 2009 (UTC)
“ | ... literally meaning the "art of softness", or "way of yielding", is a collective ... | ” |
“ | The word Jujutsu can be broken down into two parts. "Ju" is a concept. The idea behind this meaning of Ju is "to be gentle", "to give way", "to yield", "to blend", "to move out of harm's way". "Jutsu" is the principle or "the action" part of Ju-Jutsu. In Japanese this word means science or art. | ” |
As far as I know the word jujutsu does not literally mean the "art of softness" nor "way of yielding", however it is in my belief more an approximative translation.
I am not completely sure of this, nor do I have any quotable material, however (again; as far as I know) Japanese is extremely difficult to precisely translate to English (or any other Western language).
Besides, "ju" also means 10, as shown here in the article Japanese Numerals.
How about editing it to "a possible meaning of the word "jujutsu" is "the art of softness" " or "an approximate translation of the word "jujutsu" is "the art of softness" "?
-- DKDexter999 ( talk) 18:46, 25 November 2009 (UTC)
Isn't the spelling jujitsu more common in English as found on thefreedictionary?. Unless I get any opposing views soon, I intend to rename the article with this spelling.-- Chrono1084 ( talk) 16:20, 11 April 2010 (UTC)
No, "jujitsu" is a common misspelling, and is incorrect. Interestingly, this mistake is currently only really made by non-Japanese practitioners of jujutsu. The kanji for "jutsu" is the same one used by every Japanese martial art like iaijutsu, kenjutsu, ninjutsu, etc. Asymnation ( talk) 16:20, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
thefreedictionary.org is not a source. Try e.g. something out of Cambridge [1], where we find "ju-jitsu (mainly US jiujitsu)". Ju-jitsu and jiujitsu are spelling variants, both acceptable. No evidence of unhyphenated "jujitsu" there, but Webster's also has "jujitsu, jujutsu" and variants. Google books seems to indicate that "jiu-jitsu" is the most common variant, followed by "jujitsu". The spelling jutsu is also acceptable, albeit clearly less common than jitsu. It is, however, linguistically more accurate. Both spellings are arguable: you either pick the most popular even if less accurate or encyclopedic, or the more encyclopedic even if less popular. -- dab (𒁳) 09:15, 28 June 2010 (UTC)
I really don't understand the "open to all" argument, although I keep encountering it all the time. How is an article less "open to all" if it is conscientious about its spelling?
That said, I think your proposal has some merit. It is always a good idea to consult OED directly instead of wasting time with crappy online dictionaries (OED is also online, but not crappy:) In the opinion of the editors of OED, -jutsu is a "former" spelling:
So according to OED at least, the majority spelling is ju-jitsu. It also tells us there are nine other acceptable spellings,
-- dab (𒁳) 10:23, 29 June 2010 (UTC)
I would oppose renaming the article. There are several variant spellings, and whatever one is chosen would still not be the correct one. It seems to me that since this is about a Japanese martial art, it makes sense to have it named the way it is now, even though other alternate spellings may be frequently used. In any case, "Jiujitsu" redirects to this article, and the most common variants are mentioned in the first few words of the article, so I see no problem. Omnedon ( talk) 17:33, 7 July 2010 (UTC)
There's been some edit warring on the spelling in this section. Questions:
The spelling in this section should hinge on which of these two questions is gets a "yes" answer. My first impression, based on a little googling, is that it's the 1st question, and that either Sport Jujitsu (or Ju-Jitsu) should be used in this section, but that the section needs tweaking to explain the relationship between the organized competitive sport and jujutsu more generally. Just a guess at this point.
Regardless of the answer, edit warring is not an effective way to get changes implemented. Show us why the changes are right! / ninly( talk) 16:32, 4 February 2011 (UTC)
Concur with 220.101... Jitsu is acceptable in the context of BJJ and the JJIF, but not in the broader sense of jujutsu. Catfish Jim & the soapdish 16:58, 6 February 2011 (UTC)
If you really want to learn Jiu-Jitsu, you need to learn Judo first (because 99% of the Judo techniques are coming from Jiu-Jitsu). That's the way the Japanese Samurai learned to fight for many centuries. And then you get one of those old Judo books from Kano, where he also described deadly techniques and leg locks aso. Because the real Jiujitsu is extinct nowadays, although in Europe there are some schools teaching it, but missing the proper education of Judo, so that's no real deal. And "Brasilian Jiu-Jitsu" is just Judo...mainly ground-work Judo. A good Judo fighter always wins agains Brasilian Jiujitsu, because BJ is just a small part of Judo. And certainly Judo is a lot stronger than modern Jiu-Jitsu-"free fighting", because I just need to defend my chin and grab the opponent and throw him on the flow. If somebody wears clothes or a gi and can defend against a boxer and kicker, he always wins. But without a gi, you need wrestling techniques, that's why Judo fails in free fighting. Never mind, because people wear clothes on the street ;). So go learn Judo for self-defense! 178.197.234.33 ( talk) 04:50, 11 April 2013 (UTC)
Prior content in this article duplicated one or more previously published sources. The material was copied from: http://smaa-hq.com/articles.php?articleid=10. Content entered in 2003; it seems likely that more content was entered at that time, but I have not been able to identify a source that clearly predates the article. Many mirrors of Wikipedia have picked up the content since.
Identified infringing material has been rewritten or removed and must not be restored, unless it is duly released under a compatible license. (For more information, please see "using copyrighted works from others" if you are not the copyright holder of this material, or "donating copyrighted materials" if you are.) For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or published material; such additions will be deleted. Contributors may use copyrighted publications as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences or phrases. Accordingly, the material may be rewritten, but only if it does not infringe on the copyright of the original or plagiarize from that source. Please see our guideline on non-free text for how to properly implement limited quotations of copyrighted text. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously, and persistent violators will be blocked from editing. While we appreciate contributions, we must require all contributors to understand and comply with these policies. Thank you. Moonriddengirl (talk) 10:46, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
Please watch the contributions of this user, their edit was completely ridiculous and appears to be personally motivated. They claimed Japan didn't adopt neo-confucianism, which is a major point in the development of modern jujutsu. There is an actual article on neo-confucianism in Japan Neo-Confucianism in Japan and its opposing philosophical schools Kokugaku who tried to expel foreign influence from Japan especially confucianism. For those who speak Japanese here is a Japanese government website with the same details, http://www.city.miki.lg.jp/bunka/jugakusha.html. This will also be added as a reference for further deterrence which shouldn't be needed. 27.33.143.93 ( talk) 18:53, 1 April 2012 (UTC)
In the description section, there is a bit describing the contents of jujutsu training:
This was added in 2008: http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Jujutsu&diff=195904600&oldid=195542379
The description is a part of some specific jujutsu system and their system of organizing things. Most jujutsu schools do not separate their curriculum in such a way, and certainly no traditional Japanese jujutsu system does. Most likely the text is copy&paste from some modern jujutsu school description.
I strongly recommend deleting the entire paragraph as it doesn't really add anything that has not been said elsewhere.
80.223.84.100 ( talk) 21:21, 18 October 2012 (UTC)
Daito ryu Aiki Ju-Jutsu has no proof of being an koryu just some claims by its members. They just want to sound more important that's all and that 9. century nonsense is just wet dream of them. So unless they can prove it with historical documents its just a lie and it shouldn't be listed as koryu. Me 176.76.94.156 ( talk) 16:32, 26 February 2013 (UTC)
"...although many who study judo still believe as Kano did, that judo isn't a sport but a self defense system creating a pathway towards peace and universal harmony through the art and physical exercise." - This is very wrong. Judo practioner all know that Judo is a sport, but they also say that Judo is more than a sport, heavily affecting the mind and spirit, like all martial arts are meant to do. It's not a question of "or" but a question of "and". So I strongly suggest the author to learn some basic logics. 178.197.234.33 ( talk) 04:32, 11 April 2013 (UTC)
What are the prerequisites to include a martial art as a descendant art? For example, yes it has been said by certain martial artists and historians that catch wrestling was influenced by jujutsu. But it has also been said that for example judo was influenced by western wrestling too(as in case of fireman's carry). However nothing of that is mentioned in judo article, let alone having it under parent arts. Same in jujutsu article: just blanket term of Native Japanese Martial Arts parenthood. No mention of possible Indian or Chinese influences. So in this light, how much info of how prominent jujutsu influence we have to call catch wrestling a descendant art? In catch wrestling article it looks better balanced since Jujutsu IS mentioned, but after several other parent arts. In here it seems bit awkward finding catch wrestling among sambo, judo or aikido; styles that have heavily borrowed and built upon jujutsu. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.84.98.87 ( talk) 22:32, 6 May 2014 (UTC)
These are mentioned in the text along with kempo, but I can't be the only one who doesn't know what they are, and I have read quite a bit of stuff about martial arts. How about explaining them a bit even if they are not entirely related to this article, or link to somewhere where they are talked about. 62.78.251.108 ( talk) 19:27, 23 October 2014 (UTC)
What we know of jujutsu developed in Japan in the early 16th century. One of the earliest schools was founded by Takenouchi Hisamori ( Takenouchi-ryu) but it is pretty much understood that there was not a single point origin of jujutsu. It would be very incorrect to say Takenouchi was the founder of jujutsu. Peter Rehse ( talk) 17:12, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
Classified as a "hybrid" style rather than a "grappling" style? I think are dealing with the ancestor of Japanese grappling arts. Kortoso ( talk) 00:21, 2 January 2018 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: not moved. ( closed by non-admin page mover) Brad v 19:53, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
Jujutsu → Jujitsu – "Jujitsu" is the more popular name than "Jujutsu" based on Google Trends and per WP:COMMONNAME. This is similar to Brazil/Brasil or Kiev/Kyiv where the popular name is used as title. Hddty. ( talk) 11:05, 1 September 2018 (UTC)
I'm no expert or authority on this; that's why I consulted the article. But imho there are serious mistakes, howlers even, in the very short opening paragraph. First, the word "jutsu". What I've always heard before is that "do" as in judo means Way, as in a discipline or practice, often a spiritual method. So kendo is a sport or art using the sword; kenjutsu is actual combat with the sword. If judo means the "Gentle Way", then jujutsu would be the combat equivalent; "gentle fighting" wouldn't be a good translation, but it's fighting based on "softness". (Of course it's not soft, really. When you get thrown down hard or caught in a painful joint lock, it doesn't feel soft. I don't know how to translate the whole term jūjutsu in a way that really captures it, but my point is, "jutsu" means "fighting", or "fighting technique", maybe, as opposed to non-combat skills, not just "technique", so as far as I can see this is a mistake.
Second, fighting armed samurai with your bare hands? Seriously???? If barehand fighters with the right training could really fight armed samurai, why would the samurai bother with weapons and armor? Barehand fighters can NOT fight armed samurai! Give ma a break. This is just myth and legend. It's misinformation, and needs to be changed. So what good was judo? It was good for fighting thugs and highwaymen, maybe; for acting as a bouncer in a brothel. It was good for an armored samurai when he closed with an opponent on the battlefield, maybe. The article says that striking "proved ineffective" against armored opponents. As if! You wouldn't have to try it to know that you can't punch an armored knight! Well, armored knights can't punch each other either; when you've dropped your sword or you adversary has gotten inside your spear, what you want to do is throw him down, not trade punches with him, breaking your knuckles without hurting the enemy. But you might as well go up against a machine gun with your judo skills, as a trained samurai with a sword or spear.Wood Monkey 18:06, 28 August 2019 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Neurodog ( talk • contribs)
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Dschiu Dschitsu and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 May 5#Dschiu Dschitsu until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Steel1943 ( talk) 17:55, 5 May 2022 (UTC)
The redirect Combat Jujitsu has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 July 9 § Combat Jujitsu until a consensus is reached. Certes ( talk) 18:15, 9 July 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Jujutsu article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1, 2, 3, 4 |
This
level-4 vital article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Can someone provide an ancient illustration or depiction of Jujustsu? thank you. Asian888 ( talk) 01:06, 11 July 2008 (UTC)
“ | The term "jūjutsu" was not coined until the 17th century, after which time it became a blanket term for a wide variety of grappling-related disciplines...
These systems of unarmed combat began to be known as Nihon koryu jūjutsu (Japanese old-style jujutsu), among other related terms, during the Muromachi period (1333-1573), according to densho (transmission scrolls) of the various ryuha (martial traditions) and historical records.... |
” |
How can the MAs be known as jujutsu in 1333 if the term jujutsu wasn't coined until 17th century? Doesn't the article contradict itself? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.7.54.224 ( talk) 19:14, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
There seems to be validity for Kumi Uchi being a seperate art. Perhaps it deserves its own article? Interesting video on kumi uchi here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42xTel5viUg&NR=1 User5802 ( talk) 06:51, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
This article includes enough information about weapons that the statemtent "Jujutsu... is a collective name for Japanese martial art styles consisting of grappling and striking techniques. Jujutsu evolved among the samurai of feudal Japan as a method for dispatching an armed and armored opponent in situations where the use of weapons was impractical or forbidden." does not appear to be accurate and is misleading.
There used to be discussion on weapons within this talk page. User5802 ( talk) 21:58, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
There's a section that mentions "The Chinese Character ..." in two places. This should be the "Kanji" character. Kanji is the generic term for that type of character used in multiple Asian languages. 206.222.194.162 ( talk) 20:20, 19 July 2009 (UTC) David Williss
The above statement is inaccurate. "Kanji" is the Japanese reading of "Hanzu," a Chinese character. In fact if you literally read the "Kan" and "Ji," they are translated as "Chinese character." Kanji is not the generic term, it is the Japanese term. There is something else that should be pointed out in the introduction (elsewhere in the article as well perhaps) with regards to language: Jujutsu actually should be translated as "The art of flexibility," though the modern Chinese character means in Chinese "softness," in Japanese it can also mean "flexible." Perhaps the reading given is the most widely known reading of Jujutsu, and therefor need not be altered, but a mention of the flexible is important. Also the link with the character "Ju" shows only Chinese definitions. There are Japanese readings given but not definitions. "Yawarakai" means flexible. 75.212.44.224 ( talk) 21:03, 31 August 2009 (UTC)
“ | ... literally meaning the "art of softness", or "way of yielding", is a collective ... | ” |
“ | The word Jujutsu can be broken down into two parts. "Ju" is a concept. The idea behind this meaning of Ju is "to be gentle", "to give way", "to yield", "to blend", "to move out of harm's way". "Jutsu" is the principle or "the action" part of Ju-Jutsu. In Japanese this word means science or art. | ” |
As far as I know the word jujutsu does not literally mean the "art of softness" nor "way of yielding", however it is in my belief more an approximative translation.
I am not completely sure of this, nor do I have any quotable material, however (again; as far as I know) Japanese is extremely difficult to precisely translate to English (or any other Western language).
Besides, "ju" also means 10, as shown here in the article Japanese Numerals.
How about editing it to "a possible meaning of the word "jujutsu" is "the art of softness" " or "an approximate translation of the word "jujutsu" is "the art of softness" "?
-- DKDexter999 ( talk) 18:46, 25 November 2009 (UTC)
Isn't the spelling jujitsu more common in English as found on thefreedictionary?. Unless I get any opposing views soon, I intend to rename the article with this spelling.-- Chrono1084 ( talk) 16:20, 11 April 2010 (UTC)
No, "jujitsu" is a common misspelling, and is incorrect. Interestingly, this mistake is currently only really made by non-Japanese practitioners of jujutsu. The kanji for "jutsu" is the same one used by every Japanese martial art like iaijutsu, kenjutsu, ninjutsu, etc. Asymnation ( talk) 16:20, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
thefreedictionary.org is not a source. Try e.g. something out of Cambridge [1], where we find "ju-jitsu (mainly US jiujitsu)". Ju-jitsu and jiujitsu are spelling variants, both acceptable. No evidence of unhyphenated "jujitsu" there, but Webster's also has "jujitsu, jujutsu" and variants. Google books seems to indicate that "jiu-jitsu" is the most common variant, followed by "jujitsu". The spelling jutsu is also acceptable, albeit clearly less common than jitsu. It is, however, linguistically more accurate. Both spellings are arguable: you either pick the most popular even if less accurate or encyclopedic, or the more encyclopedic even if less popular. -- dab (𒁳) 09:15, 28 June 2010 (UTC)
I really don't understand the "open to all" argument, although I keep encountering it all the time. How is an article less "open to all" if it is conscientious about its spelling?
That said, I think your proposal has some merit. It is always a good idea to consult OED directly instead of wasting time with crappy online dictionaries (OED is also online, but not crappy:) In the opinion of the editors of OED, -jutsu is a "former" spelling:
So according to OED at least, the majority spelling is ju-jitsu. It also tells us there are nine other acceptable spellings,
-- dab (𒁳) 10:23, 29 June 2010 (UTC)
I would oppose renaming the article. There are several variant spellings, and whatever one is chosen would still not be the correct one. It seems to me that since this is about a Japanese martial art, it makes sense to have it named the way it is now, even though other alternate spellings may be frequently used. In any case, "Jiujitsu" redirects to this article, and the most common variants are mentioned in the first few words of the article, so I see no problem. Omnedon ( talk) 17:33, 7 July 2010 (UTC)
There's been some edit warring on the spelling in this section. Questions:
The spelling in this section should hinge on which of these two questions is gets a "yes" answer. My first impression, based on a little googling, is that it's the 1st question, and that either Sport Jujitsu (or Ju-Jitsu) should be used in this section, but that the section needs tweaking to explain the relationship between the organized competitive sport and jujutsu more generally. Just a guess at this point.
Regardless of the answer, edit warring is not an effective way to get changes implemented. Show us why the changes are right! / ninly( talk) 16:32, 4 February 2011 (UTC)
Concur with 220.101... Jitsu is acceptable in the context of BJJ and the JJIF, but not in the broader sense of jujutsu. Catfish Jim & the soapdish 16:58, 6 February 2011 (UTC)
If you really want to learn Jiu-Jitsu, you need to learn Judo first (because 99% of the Judo techniques are coming from Jiu-Jitsu). That's the way the Japanese Samurai learned to fight for many centuries. And then you get one of those old Judo books from Kano, where he also described deadly techniques and leg locks aso. Because the real Jiujitsu is extinct nowadays, although in Europe there are some schools teaching it, but missing the proper education of Judo, so that's no real deal. And "Brasilian Jiu-Jitsu" is just Judo...mainly ground-work Judo. A good Judo fighter always wins agains Brasilian Jiujitsu, because BJ is just a small part of Judo. And certainly Judo is a lot stronger than modern Jiu-Jitsu-"free fighting", because I just need to defend my chin and grab the opponent and throw him on the flow. If somebody wears clothes or a gi and can defend against a boxer and kicker, he always wins. But without a gi, you need wrestling techniques, that's why Judo fails in free fighting. Never mind, because people wear clothes on the street ;). So go learn Judo for self-defense! 178.197.234.33 ( talk) 04:50, 11 April 2013 (UTC)
Prior content in this article duplicated one or more previously published sources. The material was copied from: http://smaa-hq.com/articles.php?articleid=10. Content entered in 2003; it seems likely that more content was entered at that time, but I have not been able to identify a source that clearly predates the article. Many mirrors of Wikipedia have picked up the content since.
Identified infringing material has been rewritten or removed and must not be restored, unless it is duly released under a compatible license. (For more information, please see "using copyrighted works from others" if you are not the copyright holder of this material, or "donating copyrighted materials" if you are.) For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or published material; such additions will be deleted. Contributors may use copyrighted publications as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences or phrases. Accordingly, the material may be rewritten, but only if it does not infringe on the copyright of the original or plagiarize from that source. Please see our guideline on non-free text for how to properly implement limited quotations of copyrighted text. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously, and persistent violators will be blocked from editing. While we appreciate contributions, we must require all contributors to understand and comply with these policies. Thank you. Moonriddengirl (talk) 10:46, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
Please watch the contributions of this user, their edit was completely ridiculous and appears to be personally motivated. They claimed Japan didn't adopt neo-confucianism, which is a major point in the development of modern jujutsu. There is an actual article on neo-confucianism in Japan Neo-Confucianism in Japan and its opposing philosophical schools Kokugaku who tried to expel foreign influence from Japan especially confucianism. For those who speak Japanese here is a Japanese government website with the same details, http://www.city.miki.lg.jp/bunka/jugakusha.html. This will also be added as a reference for further deterrence which shouldn't be needed. 27.33.143.93 ( talk) 18:53, 1 April 2012 (UTC)
In the description section, there is a bit describing the contents of jujutsu training:
This was added in 2008: http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Jujutsu&diff=195904600&oldid=195542379
The description is a part of some specific jujutsu system and their system of organizing things. Most jujutsu schools do not separate their curriculum in such a way, and certainly no traditional Japanese jujutsu system does. Most likely the text is copy&paste from some modern jujutsu school description.
I strongly recommend deleting the entire paragraph as it doesn't really add anything that has not been said elsewhere.
80.223.84.100 ( talk) 21:21, 18 October 2012 (UTC)
Daito ryu Aiki Ju-Jutsu has no proof of being an koryu just some claims by its members. They just want to sound more important that's all and that 9. century nonsense is just wet dream of them. So unless they can prove it with historical documents its just a lie and it shouldn't be listed as koryu. Me 176.76.94.156 ( talk) 16:32, 26 February 2013 (UTC)
"...although many who study judo still believe as Kano did, that judo isn't a sport but a self defense system creating a pathway towards peace and universal harmony through the art and physical exercise." - This is very wrong. Judo practioner all know that Judo is a sport, but they also say that Judo is more than a sport, heavily affecting the mind and spirit, like all martial arts are meant to do. It's not a question of "or" but a question of "and". So I strongly suggest the author to learn some basic logics. 178.197.234.33 ( talk) 04:32, 11 April 2013 (UTC)
What are the prerequisites to include a martial art as a descendant art? For example, yes it has been said by certain martial artists and historians that catch wrestling was influenced by jujutsu. But it has also been said that for example judo was influenced by western wrestling too(as in case of fireman's carry). However nothing of that is mentioned in judo article, let alone having it under parent arts. Same in jujutsu article: just blanket term of Native Japanese Martial Arts parenthood. No mention of possible Indian or Chinese influences. So in this light, how much info of how prominent jujutsu influence we have to call catch wrestling a descendant art? In catch wrestling article it looks better balanced since Jujutsu IS mentioned, but after several other parent arts. In here it seems bit awkward finding catch wrestling among sambo, judo or aikido; styles that have heavily borrowed and built upon jujutsu. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.84.98.87 ( talk) 22:32, 6 May 2014 (UTC)
These are mentioned in the text along with kempo, but I can't be the only one who doesn't know what they are, and I have read quite a bit of stuff about martial arts. How about explaining them a bit even if they are not entirely related to this article, or link to somewhere where they are talked about. 62.78.251.108 ( talk) 19:27, 23 October 2014 (UTC)
What we know of jujutsu developed in Japan in the early 16th century. One of the earliest schools was founded by Takenouchi Hisamori ( Takenouchi-ryu) but it is pretty much understood that there was not a single point origin of jujutsu. It would be very incorrect to say Takenouchi was the founder of jujutsu. Peter Rehse ( talk) 17:12, 13 November 2014 (UTC)
Classified as a "hybrid" style rather than a "grappling" style? I think are dealing with the ancestor of Japanese grappling arts. Kortoso ( talk) 00:21, 2 January 2018 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: not moved. ( closed by non-admin page mover) Brad v 19:53, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
Jujutsu → Jujitsu – "Jujitsu" is the more popular name than "Jujutsu" based on Google Trends and per WP:COMMONNAME. This is similar to Brazil/Brasil or Kiev/Kyiv where the popular name is used as title. Hddty. ( talk) 11:05, 1 September 2018 (UTC)
I'm no expert or authority on this; that's why I consulted the article. But imho there are serious mistakes, howlers even, in the very short opening paragraph. First, the word "jutsu". What I've always heard before is that "do" as in judo means Way, as in a discipline or practice, often a spiritual method. So kendo is a sport or art using the sword; kenjutsu is actual combat with the sword. If judo means the "Gentle Way", then jujutsu would be the combat equivalent; "gentle fighting" wouldn't be a good translation, but it's fighting based on "softness". (Of course it's not soft, really. When you get thrown down hard or caught in a painful joint lock, it doesn't feel soft. I don't know how to translate the whole term jūjutsu in a way that really captures it, but my point is, "jutsu" means "fighting", or "fighting technique", maybe, as opposed to non-combat skills, not just "technique", so as far as I can see this is a mistake.
Second, fighting armed samurai with your bare hands? Seriously???? If barehand fighters with the right training could really fight armed samurai, why would the samurai bother with weapons and armor? Barehand fighters can NOT fight armed samurai! Give ma a break. This is just myth and legend. It's misinformation, and needs to be changed. So what good was judo? It was good for fighting thugs and highwaymen, maybe; for acting as a bouncer in a brothel. It was good for an armored samurai when he closed with an opponent on the battlefield, maybe. The article says that striking "proved ineffective" against armored opponents. As if! You wouldn't have to try it to know that you can't punch an armored knight! Well, armored knights can't punch each other either; when you've dropped your sword or you adversary has gotten inside your spear, what you want to do is throw him down, not trade punches with him, breaking your knuckles without hurting the enemy. But you might as well go up against a machine gun with your judo skills, as a trained samurai with a sword or spear.Wood Monkey 18:06, 28 August 2019 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Neurodog ( talk • contribs)
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Dschiu Dschitsu and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 May 5#Dschiu Dschitsu until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Steel1943 ( talk) 17:55, 5 May 2022 (UTC)
The redirect Combat Jujitsu has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 July 9 § Combat Jujitsu until a consensus is reached. Certes ( talk) 18:15, 9 July 2023 (UTC)