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Archive 15 | ← | Archive 17 | Archive 18 | Archive 19 | Archive 20 | Archive 21 | → | Archive 24 |
As a casual rugby fan and reader, I've been looking in the last week or so at some of the pages on the end of year and mid-year internationals. When I've done so on my mobile, however, I've found them almost unreadable due to their size; I've given up and looked at something else. Today, using my desktop, I can see that many of these articles are well over 150,000 bytes in size. For example since the 2015 World Cup:
As you can see, this mainly affects the end-of-year internationals, but the June matches are not immune from it either. By way of comparison, Special:LongPages shows that the biggest of these articles, the 2016 entry,is the 1283 biggest article on Wikipedia, out of 5,758,490 - that puts it in the top 0.025% of articles, sitting next in the list to the Economy of the United States; one could argue that these are differently important topics(!).
To be fair, looking at that list it's not uncommon for sport season articles to be lengthy (for example 2010 ATP World Tour is below the 2016 Autumun internationals in the list) but still I think it's worth considering if rugby articles really need to be in the top quarter of a tenth of a percent of articles in size; and if they do, how they could be more manageable.
I'm not a regular editor of these pages so I think it's up to the regular users to consider if they want to change practice or not. I'd make a couple of observations:
Either or both of these steps would probably solve the issue without really damaging what the pages are trying to do! -- Super Nintendo Chalmers ( talk) 10:14, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
I’m not a huge fan of having one external website be the sole criteria for inclusion or exclusion. I thought we had already achieved here something resembling a rough consensus:
Does that work? If not perfect as is, could we make it work with a small tweak or two? CUA 27 ( talk) 01:37, 4 December 2018 (UTC)
Given that list of fixtures filters by event and very clearly doesn't have any sort of "end of year" or "mid year" filter and instead filters by "2018 Argentia tour" or equivalent I really can't see how it can be used as a source claiming these games all fall under the same topic. I've slowly come around to the view that these articles are Wikipedia:SYNTH or maybe original research as independent sources simply do not list these matches together as one topic. That link also includes the disputed games e.g. Dragons v Russia and Cardiff Blues v Uruguay! Skeene88 ( talk) 14:39, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
Hello! Your WikiProject has been selected to participate in the WP 1.0 Bot rewrite beta. This means that, starting in the next few days or weeks, your assessment tables will be updated using code in the new bot, codenamed Lucky. You can read more about this change on the Wikipedia 1.0 Editorial team page. Thanks! audiodude ( talk) 06:47, 27 February 2019 (UTC)
Ernest Booth is the same person as the older article Ernie Booth. I'm not sure what to do? Merge and do a re-direct? How do you actually do that? Skeene88 ( talk) 20:18, 19 March 2019 (UTC)
So I was thinking about the possible split of the main tournament in the Hong Kong Sevens to the qualifier of the main series as its essentially two separate tournaments into one page. So what do people think of that idea? Matt294069 ( talk) 00:49, 3 April 2019 (UTC)
Support: I think separate pages would be appropriate for –
In 2013 the series qualifier event took place in London, so this event is not intrinsically part of the Hong Kong Sevens. While the CEO of the HKRU recently expressed interest in continuing to host core team qualifiers into the future, he indicated that this was still subject to World Rugby review. -- Ham105 ( talk) 14:00, 3 April 2019 (UTC)
Hello, I think that you wrote 2 articles for the same person. Actually Ngatai is the maiden name and Bosman is the name after her marriage... -- SERGIO aka the Black Cat 16:59, 12 April 2019 (UTC)
I've nominated a set of seasonal club squad navboxes for deletion ( 1, 2, 3, 4, 5). You can participate in the deletion discussion here. – Pee Jay 22:37, 22 April 2019 (UTC)
Billy Vunipola posted a message on social media supporting the hell tweet, yet there is no mention of it in his page. Bundee Aki also liked the hell tweet before doing a u-turn, that is not mentioned on Ali's page. I am not saying it should be in the lead but I think it should be in their pages. ( 78.17.78.31 ( talk) 13:51, 26 April 2019 (UTC))
Why is this conversation here? It seems better to discuss at the talk pages for those individuals. This is not a question that applies broadly across most rugby union articles. CUA 27 ( talk) 01:47, 27 April 2019 (UTC)
Hi guys, I wonder what you think about these two pages. To my knowledge London Welsh RFC (when still a functioning professional side) had an amateur team that was in the Herts & Middlesex leagues. Since the professional side folded, a phoenix London Welsh emerged, taking the amateur team's place in the London regional leagues. This has caused some confusion on Wiki, with regional league titles being applied to both pages, including by myself as I wasn't really sure which page to attribute what titles to. It would be good to hear what other contributors think as to whether we keep them as separate entities or combine into one. Jgjsmith006 ( talk) 18:53, 16 April 2019
WikiProject Women in Red is devoting the next two months (July and August) to a virtual editathon on Women in Sports. Please take this opportunity to write more articles about women in rugby who lag far behind men on Wikipedia.-- Ipigott ( talk) 07:20, 26 June 2019 (UTC)
I was wondering if the stadium should be split out of the Barnet Copthall. Barnet Copthall is the area which also houses Football playing fields, another rugby field, gym swimming pool complex, golf driving range, pitch and putt. etc. Govvy ( talk) 11:07, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
Hello,
The page of Justin Collins, a rugby league player better known as "Steve Collins", is wrongly linked via wikidata to the french wiki page of his namesake Justin Collins, wich is a former Northland and Blues loose forward. Moreover, it seem to be a confusion between these two players in these pages (and sources on the web), because we can reed that they are both born in Tasmania and shares the same birth date, wich is very unlikely. So, where is the truth ? The arabian's page is also a strange mix between the two players.
Sorry for my broken english. Ginkgobiloquad ( talk) 16:55, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
Can someone help me determine what exactly happened to all the templates for the matches after September 2017 for the Ranfurly Shield 2010–19 article? When I updated this after the previous Ranfurly Shield match it all seemed fine but for some reason dozens of templates are not showing correctly at the moment, making this a visual nightmare. Not sure if there has been a template update somewhere which has caused this bug. Cheers. JaumeBG (talk) 02:28, 1 September 2019 (UTC)
I've seen quarter final, quarter-final, and quarterfinal written inconsistently across WP:RU articles. The term is often prominent in rugby tournament articles, as it is often the name of a section heading. Ideally we would spell the term consistently across WP:RU articles. Looking at MOS:HYPHEN, it appears that "quarterfinal" is the preferred way to write the word. Do folks agree? If so, we can add a sentence to the WP:RU style guide. (Same question goes for semi final, semi-final, and semifinal). CUA 27 ( talk) 19:07, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
Hi rugby union chums, there are two categories for Rotherham players; [[Category:Rotherham R.U.F.C. players]] (76 Players) and [[Category:Rotherham Titans players]] (4 Players), should they be combined, or have they been purposefully separated? Best regards. DynamoDegsy ( talk) 08:20, 4 September 2019 (UTC)
Hello and greetings from the maintainers of the WP 1.0 Bot! As you may or may not know, we are currently involved in an overhaul of the bot, in order to make it more modern and maintainable. As part of this process, we will be rewriting the web tool that is part of the project. You might have noticed this tool if you click through the links on the project assessment summary tables.
We'd like to collect information on how the current tool is used by....you! How do you yourself and the other maintainers of your project use the web tool? Which of its features do you need? How frequently do you use these features? And what features is the tool missing that would be useful to you? We have collected all of these questions at this Google form where you can leave your response. Walkerma ( talk) 04:24, 27 October 2019 (UTC)
Greetings RU enthusiasts. There's a discussion over at AfD which might benefit from the insights of your group. It can be found at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kellen Gordon. Thanks. Onel5969 TT me 12:13, 27 October 2019 (UTC)
Hi. There's a discussion over at Wikipedia talk:Notability (sports) which might be of interest to members of this project. You can find it HERE. Onel5969 TT me 15:09, 9 November 2019 (UTC)
Hi rugby union chums, would you consider the role of 'Director of Rugby' to be part of the '...rugby union administrators' or '...rugby union coaches' category? DynamoDegsy ( talk) 14:37, 25 November 2019 (UTC)
The Russian league is included as one of the fully pro leagues at
Wikipedia:WikiProject Rugby union/Notability criteria but it's unsourced, I can't find any sources demonstrating that the league is indeed fully professional, and the league's article even says Many of elevated clubs were semiprofessional or even amateur in nature, which lead a lack of competitive balance
which suggests even if the league were fully professional, it hasn't been during the entire extent of its tenure. Anyone have any sources on this?
SportingFlyer
T·
C
07:56, 28 November 2019 (UTC)
Hi rugby union chums, this could be a bit controversial, but please bear with me… I realise that in rugby union (and rugby league) ‘Ireland’ means ‘All-Ireland’, but the parent category of the ‘<insert nation here> rugby union players’ categories is ‘Rugby union players by nationality, and as ‘All-Ireland’ isn’t a nation, were associating Northern Irish footballers with the Republic of Ireland, which isn't correct, should there be ‘Northern Irish rugby union players’ category? Best regards. DynamoDegsy ( talk) 10:43, 3 December 2019 (UTC)
Hello, there's a mistaken statement in the article, or at least misleading: whereas it's undisputably true that it was the last shared Championship, the following statement lets the reader suppose that since the following edition the points system had changed (In future tournaments, overall points difference would be used to separate teams with the same number of points so that the tournament would be more likely to have an outright winner.): actually it was not before the 1994 Five Nations that the shared victory would no longer be allower, until 1993 it was theorically possible to have more than one winner in the same edition.. (see The Independent in a 1994 article). -- SERGIO aka the Black Cat 18:41, 15 January 2020 (UTC)
How are the 5th to 8th placed teams determined in Rugby Sevens?
Scotland came in 8th place in South Africa last December, with Argentina in 5th, Ireland in 6th, and Kenya in 7th places. May I be reassured that Wikipedia hasn’t lost the ability to properly record the results of Rugby Sevens Tournaments?
What I mean is that Scotland technically did better than Argentina if you look at the results closely of the Pool statue, as we had 8 points as opposed to their 7. Also, why isn’t Wikipedia recording the results of the 9th place thingy?
I can’t see how it is possible for Argentina to be above Scotland when the two teams hadn’t met at any point in this tournament? What in the name of goodness is going on here?
I look forward to your replies, I hope to hear from you soon. Pablothepenguin ( talk) 12:22, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
Pretty much any system is going to have people complaining it's unfair because of X. The Sevens series are notable for actually bothering with some placing matches for lower levels, something many sports don't bother with. The short matches makes this easier, still sponsor and audience demands etc means there are time pressures, part of the reason quarter finals were eliminated for the Hamilton and Sydney [1] and Paris? [2]
Worth noting perhaps that despite the OP's claims of Scotland being better than Argentina are wholly unsupported. If we look at the history, Argentina has come out above Scotland in all these 1999–2000 World Sevens Series, 2000–01 World Sevens Series, 2001–02 World Sevens Series, 2002–03 IRB Sevens World Series, 2004–05 World Sevens Series, 2005–06 World Sevens Series, 2007–08 IRB Sevens World Series, 2008–09 IRB Sevens World Series, 2009–10 IRB Sevens World Series, 2010–11 IRB Sevens World Series, 2011–12 IRB Sevens World Series, 2012–13 IRB Sevens World Series, 2013–14 IRB Sevens World Series, 2015–16 World Rugby Sevens Series, 2017–18 World Rugby Sevens Series, 2018–19 World Rugby Sevens Series. Especially in the early ones, they often had double the points of Scotland. It's often a bit closer now, but still Argentina often had 50% or more points. The point difference is such that it cannot simply be accounted for by Argentina always getting 'luckier' in the groups stages and in any case them always getting 'luckier' would suggest it's not simply lucky.
The only times Scotland were ahead was in 2006–07 IRB Sevens World Series but only barely, 2014–15 Sevens World Series a bit more but still not much and 2016–17 World Rugby Sevens Series even more but still not that much, actually I think few points ahead than any time Argentina beat Scotland although I didn't check carefully.
Argentina national rugby sevens team also notes their performance especially in the first decade of this century. Scotland national rugby sevens team's record seems less stellar. Admittedly I'm not sure if Scotland attended all the events of the series earlier on for financial reasons.
Maybe also worth noting that the OP initially claimed Scotland had 8 points in the group stage as seen above or [3], something clearly wrong. Yet later in this thread, they seem to have completely forgotten how they were arguing it was unfair because Scotland clearly performed better than Argentina at the group stage even though we know that in fact Argentina performed better at the group stage. Ireland and Kenya did finish on 8 points (but still fewer points scored whether in the group or after the quarterfinals), so by some definitions you could argue they actually did do better than Argentina, unlike with Scotland. But the OP seems to have forgotten about their earlier arguments of relative group stage performance later on. There are probably strong limits on the OP commenting on Ireland and Scotland in the same thread since it would potentially violate their topic ban Wikipedia:Editing restrictions#Final warnings / Unblock conditions, so maybe this is why they are largely ignoring Ireland and Kenya, I don't know. But the OP seems to be putting aside the evidence that actually exists that Argentina has generally had a better sevens team than Scotland. And for that matter, anything else that contradicts their claims even contradicting their earlier arguments, to continually argue that Scotland was unfairly treated in that one particular tournament. (And from what I can tell the Scotland women's national rugby sevens team is probably even further from the Argentina women's national rugby sevens team, although the latter is also quite far from their men's position on the world stage.)
Nil Einne ( talk) 03:14, 29 January 2020 (UTC)
Why on earth does this article exist? The article itself makes the link: the "President's XV" is basically just the South Africa A team by a different name (c.f. Junior Springboks/Emerging Springboks). Anyone got any objection to merging South Africa President's XV into South Africa A? – Pee Jay 12:46, 29 January 2020 (UTC)
The article Hubert Lefèbvre has been proposed for deletion because it appears to have no references. Under Wikipedia policy, this biography of a living person will be deleted after seven days unless it has at least one reference to a reliable source that directly supports material in the article.
If you created the article, please don't be offended. Instead, consider improving the article. For help on inserting references, see Referencing for beginners, or ask at the help desk. Once you have provided at least one reliable source, you may remove the {{ prod blp/dated}} tag. Please do not remove the tag unless the article is sourced. If you cannot provide such a source within seven days, the article may be deleted, but you can request that it be undeleted when you are ready to add one. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Minecrafter0271 ( talk • contribs) 22:35, 1 February 2020 (UTC)
The first sentence of the France article reads "The France national rugby union team competes annually against England, Ireland, Italy, Scotland and Wales in the Six Nations Championship." It seems like this is undue weight on this competition. Some of the other five focus on it in the second sentence. That also seems undue. Would there be any objection if I moved Six Nations a little further down in the leads of these articles?-- SaskatchewanSenator ( talk) 20:09, 6 February 2020 (UTC)
Hi all, visiting from wp:footy where I'm currently on a mission to replace defunct Scoresway links across wikipedia (the majority of these being simple changes directly to sister site Soccerway). I've come across pages where Scoresway was used in a Rugby Union context (eg Argentina national under-20 rugby union team) and was wondering if you guys knew of an equivalent WP:RS that has the same breadth of data. Cheers, Gricehead ( talk) 08:55, 7 February 2020 (UTC) Please ping in responses.
I've gone ahead and
removed the two U.S. leagues from the fully professional list - as far as I can tell (and I've looked to make absolutely sure) they were added without discussion, and the brief discussion
here shows evidence MLR isn't "fully professional" in the way we would consider a league fully professional (ie, all players make a full time living from the league, as opposed to a semi-professional league.)
SportingFlyer
T·
C
00:24, 27 November 2019 (UTC)
Rpsmith1988 07:40, 28 November 2019 (UTC)
@
SportingFlyer,
Rpsmith1988, and
Onel5969: First off, it should never have been added to the list in the first place without prior
WP:CONSENSUS as the list is currently used as a Notability Guideline. And as a Sports Notability Guideline it must meet
WP:NSPORTS#Applicable policies and guidelines: All information included in Wikipedia, including articles about sports, must be verifiable. In addition, the subjects of standalone articles should meet the General Notability Guideline. The guideline on this page provides bright-line guidance to enable editors to determine quickly if a subject is likely to meet the General Notability Guideline. Information about living persons must meet the more stringent requirements for those types of articles.
This does not appear to have been properly vetted like the other Wikiprojects. This is the time to do so. Please provide references that even the least-used players can meet
WP:GNG. Generalized player pay, overall league professionalism, and other un-vetted league's inclusion (
WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS) are irrelevant. I'll keep the discussion about adding the leagues on this talk page. If the entire SNG needs a drastic overhaul, then
WT:NSPORTS might be better.
Yosemiter (
talk)
17:33, 28 November 2019 (UTC)
Wikipedia is not a crystal ball, so we can only go on what is happening currently and what has happened in the past. On that basis I think MLR is a professional league (per above it is widely described as such) but large number of players do not yet meet GNG. I would suggest reviewing it going forward as, from my own view of the league, independent media coverage is growing so in another year we may be able to consider all players generally notable due to an increase in sources. To be clear Remove for now.
Skeene88 (
talk)
18:59, 28 November 2019 (UTC)
@ SportingFlyer, Rpsmith1988, Onel5969, and Skeene88: (and @ Elahrairah: sorry I missed you in the previous pings. Yosemiter ( talk) 19:53, 28 November 2019 (UTC)) Per the above suggestion I gave, both Kellen Gordon and Kody O’Neil were recently kept for what appears to be solely based MLR having been listed in WP:NRU and not based on a full discussion of the sourcing for WP:GNG ( Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kellen Gordon and Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kody O’Neil). So let's do an unofficial source review if these pass GNG (SportingFlyer may know of few more to add and please do, they do not necessarily have to already gone thru the AfD process). This is how I have encouraged other Wikiprojects to analyze including new leagues in certain sports such as ice hockey and basketball, and it is good thought experiment in general on Notability. Discuss each subject's source in detail below: Yosemiter ( talk) 19:37, 28 November 2019 (UTC)
Source analysis, starting with the ones in the article:
Gordon is also briefly mentioned here. What is lacking, however, is significant coverage of Gordon in reliable source coverage - there's really not all that much else, and that includes WP:PRIMARY sources.
Compare the level of coverage to minor league soccer player Shandon Hopeau, who I picked at random from the Tacoma Defiance roster. The Defiance are the Seattle minor league soccer team. Hopeau has been covered by the Tacoma News-Tribune, FourFourTwo, and the Honolulu Star-Advertiser (though I think the last one is prep sports) along with a slew of game coverage, database coverage, and some non-RS blog posts which wouldn't count toward WP:GNG.
I tried to get lineups from here for a random league game but none of the statistics loaded, just the final score. I ended up looking at Daniel Trierweiler, whose three sources are the America's Rugby News squad list, the Seawolves website, and a DJ Coil blurb - there's another Seawolves source and a couple blog posts mention his game participation in passing. Looking at the worst team in the league - for an SNG to exist for a league almost all players must pass WP:GNG - I looked at Mason Pedersen, who has two sources - the America's Rugby News roster, and his USA Rugby profile. There's a smattering of coverage for him from the usual blogs and a few game report mentions - including one from Australia but unfortunately is WP:ROUTINE/fails WP:SIGCOV - but not much else out there, which isn't surprising. The league really isn't well covered by the media, and it doesn't mean we can't have articles on players in the league - just means they'll need to pass WP:GNG. SportingFlyer T· C 04:52, 29 November 2019 (UTC)
@ SportingFlyer, Rpsmith1988, Elahrairah, and Skeene88: I see some stubs have appeared with only stats and transactions used as sources. Anyone want to evaluate the GNG value of these players? Most seem to have played in other second tier leagues before joining an MLR side. Yosemiter ( talk) 17:21, 9 February 2020 (UTC)
There is also a new top level league and teams that need evaluating: Yosemiter ( talk) 17:21, 9 February 2020 (UTC)
Can we get some more input at Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2020 January 29#South Africa rugby union tour squads please? User:TheMightyPeanut and I aren't going to get anywhere just talking among ourselves, so a few more voices would be appreciated. Cheers. – Pee Jay 11:21, 1 February 2020 (UTC)
It's currently redirect to Serbia national rugby union team, but it could be a seperate article as it was a seperate team. It also seems there are sources at Serbia's article +some content. Some sports already have an article about Serbia&Montenegro teams (see {{ National sports teams of Serbia and Montenegro}}). Do you think this also deserves an article and can someone create a stub? Pelmeen10 ( talk) 20:03, 26 February 2020 (UTC)
Hi all, please could I get some opinions on a nationality issue regarding Mat Protheroe? @ NikeCage68: is arguing that the fact that Protheroe has been capped at under-18 and under-20 level for England means he is English, but Protheroe was born in Swansea, Wales, and only qualified to represent England after being educated at Hartpury College near Gloucester, which isn't very far at all from Wales, and then going on to play for Gloucester and Bristol. Again, neither of these clubs are very far from Wales, my point being that it wouldn't be unusual for a Welsh person to attend school in that area. Protheroe himself refers to himself as Welsh in this source], and this source also refers to Protheroe as Welsh. My opinion is that Protheroe is Welsh. It's where he was born, and I'd say that him representing England at under-18 and under-20 level was a matter of circumstance, and perhaps being overlooked by the Welsh Rugby Union at the time, rather than Protheroe identifying as English, and the fact that he is returning to Wales, the land of his birth, and the aforementioned BBC source, proves that he has ambitions of representing the country at senior international level, something he has never done for England. MunsterFan2011 ( talk) 18:40, 26 February 2020 (UTC)
I have so far failed to get a satisfactory response on the article's talk page, but User:Stmky appears intent on adding summary tables of the tournament's highest and average attendances for no other reason than "it's been in all the previous articles". Until now, they have simply been content to revert me without comment, but they really need to provide a better reason before adding the content again. Could someone else please weigh in on the discussion at Talk:2020 Rugby Europe Championship#Attendances? – Pee Jay 10:12, 27 February 2020 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 15 | ← | Archive 17 | Archive 18 | Archive 19 | Archive 20 | Archive 21 | → | Archive 24 |
As a casual rugby fan and reader, I've been looking in the last week or so at some of the pages on the end of year and mid-year internationals. When I've done so on my mobile, however, I've found them almost unreadable due to their size; I've given up and looked at something else. Today, using my desktop, I can see that many of these articles are well over 150,000 bytes in size. For example since the 2015 World Cup:
As you can see, this mainly affects the end-of-year internationals, but the June matches are not immune from it either. By way of comparison, Special:LongPages shows that the biggest of these articles, the 2016 entry,is the 1283 biggest article on Wikipedia, out of 5,758,490 - that puts it in the top 0.025% of articles, sitting next in the list to the Economy of the United States; one could argue that these are differently important topics(!).
To be fair, looking at that list it's not uncommon for sport season articles to be lengthy (for example 2010 ATP World Tour is below the 2016 Autumun internationals in the list) but still I think it's worth considering if rugby articles really need to be in the top quarter of a tenth of a percent of articles in size; and if they do, how they could be more manageable.
I'm not a regular editor of these pages so I think it's up to the regular users to consider if they want to change practice or not. I'd make a couple of observations:
Either or both of these steps would probably solve the issue without really damaging what the pages are trying to do! -- Super Nintendo Chalmers ( talk) 10:14, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
I’m not a huge fan of having one external website be the sole criteria for inclusion or exclusion. I thought we had already achieved here something resembling a rough consensus:
Does that work? If not perfect as is, could we make it work with a small tweak or two? CUA 27 ( talk) 01:37, 4 December 2018 (UTC)
Given that list of fixtures filters by event and very clearly doesn't have any sort of "end of year" or "mid year" filter and instead filters by "2018 Argentia tour" or equivalent I really can't see how it can be used as a source claiming these games all fall under the same topic. I've slowly come around to the view that these articles are Wikipedia:SYNTH or maybe original research as independent sources simply do not list these matches together as one topic. That link also includes the disputed games e.g. Dragons v Russia and Cardiff Blues v Uruguay! Skeene88 ( talk) 14:39, 5 December 2018 (UTC)
Hello! Your WikiProject has been selected to participate in the WP 1.0 Bot rewrite beta. This means that, starting in the next few days or weeks, your assessment tables will be updated using code in the new bot, codenamed Lucky. You can read more about this change on the Wikipedia 1.0 Editorial team page. Thanks! audiodude ( talk) 06:47, 27 February 2019 (UTC)
Ernest Booth is the same person as the older article Ernie Booth. I'm not sure what to do? Merge and do a re-direct? How do you actually do that? Skeene88 ( talk) 20:18, 19 March 2019 (UTC)
So I was thinking about the possible split of the main tournament in the Hong Kong Sevens to the qualifier of the main series as its essentially two separate tournaments into one page. So what do people think of that idea? Matt294069 ( talk) 00:49, 3 April 2019 (UTC)
Support: I think separate pages would be appropriate for –
In 2013 the series qualifier event took place in London, so this event is not intrinsically part of the Hong Kong Sevens. While the CEO of the HKRU recently expressed interest in continuing to host core team qualifiers into the future, he indicated that this was still subject to World Rugby review. -- Ham105 ( talk) 14:00, 3 April 2019 (UTC)
Hello, I think that you wrote 2 articles for the same person. Actually Ngatai is the maiden name and Bosman is the name after her marriage... -- SERGIO aka the Black Cat 16:59, 12 April 2019 (UTC)
I've nominated a set of seasonal club squad navboxes for deletion ( 1, 2, 3, 4, 5). You can participate in the deletion discussion here. – Pee Jay 22:37, 22 April 2019 (UTC)
Billy Vunipola posted a message on social media supporting the hell tweet, yet there is no mention of it in his page. Bundee Aki also liked the hell tweet before doing a u-turn, that is not mentioned on Ali's page. I am not saying it should be in the lead but I think it should be in their pages. ( 78.17.78.31 ( talk) 13:51, 26 April 2019 (UTC))
Why is this conversation here? It seems better to discuss at the talk pages for those individuals. This is not a question that applies broadly across most rugby union articles. CUA 27 ( talk) 01:47, 27 April 2019 (UTC)
Hi guys, I wonder what you think about these two pages. To my knowledge London Welsh RFC (when still a functioning professional side) had an amateur team that was in the Herts & Middlesex leagues. Since the professional side folded, a phoenix London Welsh emerged, taking the amateur team's place in the London regional leagues. This has caused some confusion on Wiki, with regional league titles being applied to both pages, including by myself as I wasn't really sure which page to attribute what titles to. It would be good to hear what other contributors think as to whether we keep them as separate entities or combine into one. Jgjsmith006 ( talk) 18:53, 16 April 2019
WikiProject Women in Red is devoting the next two months (July and August) to a virtual editathon on Women in Sports. Please take this opportunity to write more articles about women in rugby who lag far behind men on Wikipedia.-- Ipigott ( talk) 07:20, 26 June 2019 (UTC)
I was wondering if the stadium should be split out of the Barnet Copthall. Barnet Copthall is the area which also houses Football playing fields, another rugby field, gym swimming pool complex, golf driving range, pitch and putt. etc. Govvy ( talk) 11:07, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
Hello,
The page of Justin Collins, a rugby league player better known as "Steve Collins", is wrongly linked via wikidata to the french wiki page of his namesake Justin Collins, wich is a former Northland and Blues loose forward. Moreover, it seem to be a confusion between these two players in these pages (and sources on the web), because we can reed that they are both born in Tasmania and shares the same birth date, wich is very unlikely. So, where is the truth ? The arabian's page is also a strange mix between the two players.
Sorry for my broken english. Ginkgobiloquad ( talk) 16:55, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
Can someone help me determine what exactly happened to all the templates for the matches after September 2017 for the Ranfurly Shield 2010–19 article? When I updated this after the previous Ranfurly Shield match it all seemed fine but for some reason dozens of templates are not showing correctly at the moment, making this a visual nightmare. Not sure if there has been a template update somewhere which has caused this bug. Cheers. JaumeBG (talk) 02:28, 1 September 2019 (UTC)
I've seen quarter final, quarter-final, and quarterfinal written inconsistently across WP:RU articles. The term is often prominent in rugby tournament articles, as it is often the name of a section heading. Ideally we would spell the term consistently across WP:RU articles. Looking at MOS:HYPHEN, it appears that "quarterfinal" is the preferred way to write the word. Do folks agree? If so, we can add a sentence to the WP:RU style guide. (Same question goes for semi final, semi-final, and semifinal). CUA 27 ( talk) 19:07, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
Hi rugby union chums, there are two categories for Rotherham players; [[Category:Rotherham R.U.F.C. players]] (76 Players) and [[Category:Rotherham Titans players]] (4 Players), should they be combined, or have they been purposefully separated? Best regards. DynamoDegsy ( talk) 08:20, 4 September 2019 (UTC)
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Greetings RU enthusiasts. There's a discussion over at AfD which might benefit from the insights of your group. It can be found at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kellen Gordon. Thanks. Onel5969 TT me 12:13, 27 October 2019 (UTC)
Hi. There's a discussion over at Wikipedia talk:Notability (sports) which might be of interest to members of this project. You can find it HERE. Onel5969 TT me 15:09, 9 November 2019 (UTC)
Hi rugby union chums, would you consider the role of 'Director of Rugby' to be part of the '...rugby union administrators' or '...rugby union coaches' category? DynamoDegsy ( talk) 14:37, 25 November 2019 (UTC)
The Russian league is included as one of the fully pro leagues at
Wikipedia:WikiProject Rugby union/Notability criteria but it's unsourced, I can't find any sources demonstrating that the league is indeed fully professional, and the league's article even says Many of elevated clubs were semiprofessional or even amateur in nature, which lead a lack of competitive balance
which suggests even if the league were fully professional, it hasn't been during the entire extent of its tenure. Anyone have any sources on this?
SportingFlyer
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07:56, 28 November 2019 (UTC)
Hi rugby union chums, this could be a bit controversial, but please bear with me… I realise that in rugby union (and rugby league) ‘Ireland’ means ‘All-Ireland’, but the parent category of the ‘<insert nation here> rugby union players’ categories is ‘Rugby union players by nationality, and as ‘All-Ireland’ isn’t a nation, were associating Northern Irish footballers with the Republic of Ireland, which isn't correct, should there be ‘Northern Irish rugby union players’ category? Best regards. DynamoDegsy ( talk) 10:43, 3 December 2019 (UTC)
Hello, there's a mistaken statement in the article, or at least misleading: whereas it's undisputably true that it was the last shared Championship, the following statement lets the reader suppose that since the following edition the points system had changed (In future tournaments, overall points difference would be used to separate teams with the same number of points so that the tournament would be more likely to have an outright winner.): actually it was not before the 1994 Five Nations that the shared victory would no longer be allower, until 1993 it was theorically possible to have more than one winner in the same edition.. (see The Independent in a 1994 article). -- SERGIO aka the Black Cat 18:41, 15 January 2020 (UTC)
How are the 5th to 8th placed teams determined in Rugby Sevens?
Scotland came in 8th place in South Africa last December, with Argentina in 5th, Ireland in 6th, and Kenya in 7th places. May I be reassured that Wikipedia hasn’t lost the ability to properly record the results of Rugby Sevens Tournaments?
What I mean is that Scotland technically did better than Argentina if you look at the results closely of the Pool statue, as we had 8 points as opposed to their 7. Also, why isn’t Wikipedia recording the results of the 9th place thingy?
I can’t see how it is possible for Argentina to be above Scotland when the two teams hadn’t met at any point in this tournament? What in the name of goodness is going on here?
I look forward to your replies, I hope to hear from you soon. Pablothepenguin ( talk) 12:22, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
Pretty much any system is going to have people complaining it's unfair because of X. The Sevens series are notable for actually bothering with some placing matches for lower levels, something many sports don't bother with. The short matches makes this easier, still sponsor and audience demands etc means there are time pressures, part of the reason quarter finals were eliminated for the Hamilton and Sydney [1] and Paris? [2]
Worth noting perhaps that despite the OP's claims of Scotland being better than Argentina are wholly unsupported. If we look at the history, Argentina has come out above Scotland in all these 1999–2000 World Sevens Series, 2000–01 World Sevens Series, 2001–02 World Sevens Series, 2002–03 IRB Sevens World Series, 2004–05 World Sevens Series, 2005–06 World Sevens Series, 2007–08 IRB Sevens World Series, 2008–09 IRB Sevens World Series, 2009–10 IRB Sevens World Series, 2010–11 IRB Sevens World Series, 2011–12 IRB Sevens World Series, 2012–13 IRB Sevens World Series, 2013–14 IRB Sevens World Series, 2015–16 World Rugby Sevens Series, 2017–18 World Rugby Sevens Series, 2018–19 World Rugby Sevens Series. Especially in the early ones, they often had double the points of Scotland. It's often a bit closer now, but still Argentina often had 50% or more points. The point difference is such that it cannot simply be accounted for by Argentina always getting 'luckier' in the groups stages and in any case them always getting 'luckier' would suggest it's not simply lucky.
The only times Scotland were ahead was in 2006–07 IRB Sevens World Series but only barely, 2014–15 Sevens World Series a bit more but still not much and 2016–17 World Rugby Sevens Series even more but still not that much, actually I think few points ahead than any time Argentina beat Scotland although I didn't check carefully.
Argentina national rugby sevens team also notes their performance especially in the first decade of this century. Scotland national rugby sevens team's record seems less stellar. Admittedly I'm not sure if Scotland attended all the events of the series earlier on for financial reasons.
Maybe also worth noting that the OP initially claimed Scotland had 8 points in the group stage as seen above or [3], something clearly wrong. Yet later in this thread, they seem to have completely forgotten how they were arguing it was unfair because Scotland clearly performed better than Argentina at the group stage even though we know that in fact Argentina performed better at the group stage. Ireland and Kenya did finish on 8 points (but still fewer points scored whether in the group or after the quarterfinals), so by some definitions you could argue they actually did do better than Argentina, unlike with Scotland. But the OP seems to have forgotten about their earlier arguments of relative group stage performance later on. There are probably strong limits on the OP commenting on Ireland and Scotland in the same thread since it would potentially violate their topic ban Wikipedia:Editing restrictions#Final warnings / Unblock conditions, so maybe this is why they are largely ignoring Ireland and Kenya, I don't know. But the OP seems to be putting aside the evidence that actually exists that Argentina has generally had a better sevens team than Scotland. And for that matter, anything else that contradicts their claims even contradicting their earlier arguments, to continually argue that Scotland was unfairly treated in that one particular tournament. (And from what I can tell the Scotland women's national rugby sevens team is probably even further from the Argentina women's national rugby sevens team, although the latter is also quite far from their men's position on the world stage.)
Nil Einne ( talk) 03:14, 29 January 2020 (UTC)
Why on earth does this article exist? The article itself makes the link: the "President's XV" is basically just the South Africa A team by a different name (c.f. Junior Springboks/Emerging Springboks). Anyone got any objection to merging South Africa President's XV into South Africa A? – Pee Jay 12:46, 29 January 2020 (UTC)
The article Hubert Lefèbvre has been proposed for deletion because it appears to have no references. Under Wikipedia policy, this biography of a living person will be deleted after seven days unless it has at least one reference to a reliable source that directly supports material in the article.
If you created the article, please don't be offended. Instead, consider improving the article. For help on inserting references, see Referencing for beginners, or ask at the help desk. Once you have provided at least one reliable source, you may remove the {{ prod blp/dated}} tag. Please do not remove the tag unless the article is sourced. If you cannot provide such a source within seven days, the article may be deleted, but you can request that it be undeleted when you are ready to add one. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Minecrafter0271 ( talk • contribs) 22:35, 1 February 2020 (UTC)
The first sentence of the France article reads "The France national rugby union team competes annually against England, Ireland, Italy, Scotland and Wales in the Six Nations Championship." It seems like this is undue weight on this competition. Some of the other five focus on it in the second sentence. That also seems undue. Would there be any objection if I moved Six Nations a little further down in the leads of these articles?-- SaskatchewanSenator ( talk) 20:09, 6 February 2020 (UTC)
Hi all, visiting from wp:footy where I'm currently on a mission to replace defunct Scoresway links across wikipedia (the majority of these being simple changes directly to sister site Soccerway). I've come across pages where Scoresway was used in a Rugby Union context (eg Argentina national under-20 rugby union team) and was wondering if you guys knew of an equivalent WP:RS that has the same breadth of data. Cheers, Gricehead ( talk) 08:55, 7 February 2020 (UTC) Please ping in responses.
I've gone ahead and
removed the two U.S. leagues from the fully professional list - as far as I can tell (and I've looked to make absolutely sure) they were added without discussion, and the brief discussion
here shows evidence MLR isn't "fully professional" in the way we would consider a league fully professional (ie, all players make a full time living from the league, as opposed to a semi-professional league.)
SportingFlyer
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00:24, 27 November 2019 (UTC)
Rpsmith1988 07:40, 28 November 2019 (UTC)
@
SportingFlyer,
Rpsmith1988, and
Onel5969: First off, it should never have been added to the list in the first place without prior
WP:CONSENSUS as the list is currently used as a Notability Guideline. And as a Sports Notability Guideline it must meet
WP:NSPORTS#Applicable policies and guidelines: All information included in Wikipedia, including articles about sports, must be verifiable. In addition, the subjects of standalone articles should meet the General Notability Guideline. The guideline on this page provides bright-line guidance to enable editors to determine quickly if a subject is likely to meet the General Notability Guideline. Information about living persons must meet the more stringent requirements for those types of articles.
This does not appear to have been properly vetted like the other Wikiprojects. This is the time to do so. Please provide references that even the least-used players can meet
WP:GNG. Generalized player pay, overall league professionalism, and other un-vetted league's inclusion (
WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS) are irrelevant. I'll keep the discussion about adding the leagues on this talk page. If the entire SNG needs a drastic overhaul, then
WT:NSPORTS might be better.
Yosemiter (
talk)
17:33, 28 November 2019 (UTC)
Wikipedia is not a crystal ball, so we can only go on what is happening currently and what has happened in the past. On that basis I think MLR is a professional league (per above it is widely described as such) but large number of players do not yet meet GNG. I would suggest reviewing it going forward as, from my own view of the league, independent media coverage is growing so in another year we may be able to consider all players generally notable due to an increase in sources. To be clear Remove for now.
Skeene88 (
talk)
18:59, 28 November 2019 (UTC)
@ SportingFlyer, Rpsmith1988, Onel5969, and Skeene88: (and @ Elahrairah: sorry I missed you in the previous pings. Yosemiter ( talk) 19:53, 28 November 2019 (UTC)) Per the above suggestion I gave, both Kellen Gordon and Kody O’Neil were recently kept for what appears to be solely based MLR having been listed in WP:NRU and not based on a full discussion of the sourcing for WP:GNG ( Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kellen Gordon and Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kody O’Neil). So let's do an unofficial source review if these pass GNG (SportingFlyer may know of few more to add and please do, they do not necessarily have to already gone thru the AfD process). This is how I have encouraged other Wikiprojects to analyze including new leagues in certain sports such as ice hockey and basketball, and it is good thought experiment in general on Notability. Discuss each subject's source in detail below: Yosemiter ( talk) 19:37, 28 November 2019 (UTC)
Source analysis, starting with the ones in the article:
Gordon is also briefly mentioned here. What is lacking, however, is significant coverage of Gordon in reliable source coverage - there's really not all that much else, and that includes WP:PRIMARY sources.
Compare the level of coverage to minor league soccer player Shandon Hopeau, who I picked at random from the Tacoma Defiance roster. The Defiance are the Seattle minor league soccer team. Hopeau has been covered by the Tacoma News-Tribune, FourFourTwo, and the Honolulu Star-Advertiser (though I think the last one is prep sports) along with a slew of game coverage, database coverage, and some non-RS blog posts which wouldn't count toward WP:GNG.
I tried to get lineups from here for a random league game but none of the statistics loaded, just the final score. I ended up looking at Daniel Trierweiler, whose three sources are the America's Rugby News squad list, the Seawolves website, and a DJ Coil blurb - there's another Seawolves source and a couple blog posts mention his game participation in passing. Looking at the worst team in the league - for an SNG to exist for a league almost all players must pass WP:GNG - I looked at Mason Pedersen, who has two sources - the America's Rugby News roster, and his USA Rugby profile. There's a smattering of coverage for him from the usual blogs and a few game report mentions - including one from Australia but unfortunately is WP:ROUTINE/fails WP:SIGCOV - but not much else out there, which isn't surprising. The league really isn't well covered by the media, and it doesn't mean we can't have articles on players in the league - just means they'll need to pass WP:GNG. SportingFlyer T· C 04:52, 29 November 2019 (UTC)
@ SportingFlyer, Rpsmith1988, Elahrairah, and Skeene88: I see some stubs have appeared with only stats and transactions used as sources. Anyone want to evaluate the GNG value of these players? Most seem to have played in other second tier leagues before joining an MLR side. Yosemiter ( talk) 17:21, 9 February 2020 (UTC)
There is also a new top level league and teams that need evaluating: Yosemiter ( talk) 17:21, 9 February 2020 (UTC)
Can we get some more input at Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2020 January 29#South Africa rugby union tour squads please? User:TheMightyPeanut and I aren't going to get anywhere just talking among ourselves, so a few more voices would be appreciated. Cheers. – Pee Jay 11:21, 1 February 2020 (UTC)
It's currently redirect to Serbia national rugby union team, but it could be a seperate article as it was a seperate team. It also seems there are sources at Serbia's article +some content. Some sports already have an article about Serbia&Montenegro teams (see {{ National sports teams of Serbia and Montenegro}}). Do you think this also deserves an article and can someone create a stub? Pelmeen10 ( talk) 20:03, 26 February 2020 (UTC)
Hi all, please could I get some opinions on a nationality issue regarding Mat Protheroe? @ NikeCage68: is arguing that the fact that Protheroe has been capped at under-18 and under-20 level for England means he is English, but Protheroe was born in Swansea, Wales, and only qualified to represent England after being educated at Hartpury College near Gloucester, which isn't very far at all from Wales, and then going on to play for Gloucester and Bristol. Again, neither of these clubs are very far from Wales, my point being that it wouldn't be unusual for a Welsh person to attend school in that area. Protheroe himself refers to himself as Welsh in this source], and this source also refers to Protheroe as Welsh. My opinion is that Protheroe is Welsh. It's where he was born, and I'd say that him representing England at under-18 and under-20 level was a matter of circumstance, and perhaps being overlooked by the Welsh Rugby Union at the time, rather than Protheroe identifying as English, and the fact that he is returning to Wales, the land of his birth, and the aforementioned BBC source, proves that he has ambitions of representing the country at senior international level, something he has never done for England. MunsterFan2011 ( talk) 18:40, 26 February 2020 (UTC)
I have so far failed to get a satisfactory response on the article's talk page, but User:Stmky appears intent on adding summary tables of the tournament's highest and average attendances for no other reason than "it's been in all the previous articles". Until now, they have simply been content to revert me without comment, but they really need to provide a better reason before adding the content again. Could someone else please weigh in on the discussion at Talk:2020 Rugby Europe Championship#Attendances? – Pee Jay 10:12, 27 February 2020 (UTC)