- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. and Move to Alex Bobidosh. Liz Read! Talk! 03:09, 5 December 2022 (UTC)
E. Bobadash
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- E. Bobadash ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Fails WP:GNG and prong 5 of WP:SPORTBASIC. Article has for 13 years remained as a sub-stub unsupported by any SIGCOV, and my searches failed to find any. (I tried redirecting to List of players who appeared in only one game in the NFL (1920–1929)#1922, but the redirect was reverted by User:BeanieFan11. A redirect remains a reasonable alternative to deletion IMO.) Cbl62 ( talk) 02:10, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
- Redirect per nom. We've gone over this extensively for over a year now; SIGCOV is required for sports articles, and simple participation has been deprecated. If User:BeanieFan11 is unprepared to do the work to properly source the articles, he does not now get to unilaterally decide to defy consensus-based notability standards. Either put up or shut up. Ravenswing 03:49, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. North America 1000 04:56, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
- Redirect until SIGCOV can be found.
Spike 'em (
talk)
08:52, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
- @
Spike 'em: Sigcov has been found.
BeanieFan11 (
talk)
00:45, 24 November 2022 (UTC)
SIGCOV generally requires multiple reliable sources. I guess it now passes SPORTBASIC, but not GNG.Sorry, only saw the first source, will review the rest. Spike 'em ( talk) 01:21, 24 November 2022 (UTC)
- @
Spike 'em: Sigcov has been found.
BeanieFan11 (
talk)
00:45, 24 November 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: American football and Wisconsin. Spiderone (Talk to Spider) 09:54, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
- Keep. You want SIGCOV, I give you SIGCOV: Bobidosh (not Bobadash) is mentioned on eight pages in Walter Lingo, Jim Thorpe, and the Oorang Indians: How a Dog Kennel Owner Created the NFL's Most Famous Traveling Team and has a multi-paragraph bio there (SIGCOV). It seems that he later became the tribal leader of the Chippewa Indians and a lake was named after him ( [1]). There also seems to be a bunch of mentions of him on Newspapers.com (e.g. [2] [3] [4] [5] [6]). That, along with playing in the NFL, should be enough for notability. BeanieFan11 ( talk) 20:42, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- None of these refer to "E. Bobadash". They all refer to "Alex Bobidosh." Is this the same person? Is the article mis-titled? Also, per
WP:SPORTBASIC, at least one example of the sources needs to be in the article. The book appears to be SIGCOV of "Alex Bobidosh". One possible solution: Create a well-sourced article on "Alex Bobidosh".
Cbl62 (
talk)
20:56, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- Yes, "Alex Bobidosh" and "E. Bobadash" are the same person. I have absolutely no idea why
PFR lists his name like that (especially since, on his PFR profile, underneath "E. Bobadash" it lists his full name as "Alex Bobidosh"! I'll have to contact them about that.) I'll try to expand the article soon, its just currently there's a lot of topics which I need to create "well-sourced article"s for (even before this stuff about one-game players popped up, my wikipedia "to-do" list at home was over four pages long).
BeanieFan11 (
talk)
21:10, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- An error in PFR is not a reason to keep. There is no SIGCOV whatsoever on anyone named "E. Bobadash". The sourcing you provided may or may not support creating an article on "Alex Bobidosh" but it absolutely does not support keeping an article on "E. Bobadash."
Cbl62 (
talk)
21:16, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- I meant that E. Bobadash and Alex Bobidosh are the same person, and the article should be moved to the latter title.
BeanieFan11 (
talk)
21:21, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- Hrm. I'm seeing a bunch of casual mentions, myself. And with that, "along with playing in the NFL" meets no notability criterion on Wikipedia. Simple participation criteria has been deprecated, full stop. That you don't like that outcome is apparent, but no one's personal approval is required for consensus to take place.
Ravenswing
05:18, 23 November 2022 (UTC)
- I wouldn't say a book giving someone a multi-para bio as well as mentioning that subject on eight different pages is just a "casual mention." BeanieFan11 ( talk) 15:21, 23 November 2022 (UTC)
- Hrm. I'm seeing a bunch of casual mentions, myself. And with that, "along with playing in the NFL" meets no notability criterion on Wikipedia. Simple participation criteria has been deprecated, full stop. That you don't like that outcome is apparent, but no one's personal approval is required for consensus to take place.
Ravenswing
05:18, 23 November 2022 (UTC)
- I meant that E. Bobadash and Alex Bobidosh are the same person, and the article should be moved to the latter title.
BeanieFan11 (
talk)
21:21, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- An error in PFR is not a reason to keep. There is no SIGCOV whatsoever on anyone named "E. Bobadash". The sourcing you provided may or may not support creating an article on "Alex Bobidosh" but it absolutely does not support keeping an article on "E. Bobadash."
Cbl62 (
talk)
21:16, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- Yes, "Alex Bobidosh" and "E. Bobadash" are the same person. I have absolutely no idea why
PFR lists his name like that (especially since, on his PFR profile, underneath "E. Bobadash" it lists his full name as "Alex Bobidosh"! I'll have to contact them about that.) I'll try to expand the article soon, its just currently there's a lot of topics which I need to create "well-sourced article"s for (even before this stuff about one-game players popped up, my wikipedia "to-do" list at home was over four pages long).
BeanieFan11 (
talk)
21:10, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- None of these refer to "E. Bobadash". They all refer to "Alex Bobidosh." Is this the same person? Is the article mis-titled? Also, per
WP:SPORTBASIC, at least one example of the sources needs to be in the article. The book appears to be SIGCOV of "Alex Bobidosh". One possible solution: Create a well-sourced article on "Alex Bobidosh".
Cbl62 (
talk)
20:56, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- Redirect until SIGCOV sourcing is found and added to the article as required by SPORTBASIC. –
dlthewave
☎
04:34, 23 November 2022 (UTC)
- How is a book describing someone on eight pages and giving them a multi-paragraph bio not sigcov? BeanieFan11 ( talk) 15:21, 23 November 2022 (UTC)
- Weak keep per User:BeanieFan11 sources and move the page to Alex Bobidosh. Alvaldi ( talk) 20:25, 23 November 2022 (UTC)
- Keep - I'm persuaded that Bobadash/Bobidosh meets Wikipedia's notability guidelines based on the sources provided above by BeanieFan11; that said, it appears the page should be moved to Alex Bobidosh (per WP:COMMONNAME) and E. Bobadash should be kept as a redirect. Hatman31 ( talk) 20:58, 26 November 2022 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting. Is there any definitive way to come up with an accurate identification/name? Please do not move the article though during this AFD discussion.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 02:12, 28 November 2022 (UTC)
- Keep as per BeanieFan11. An article being poorly written isn't the same as non-notable. Macktheknifeau ( talk) 03:13, 28 November 2022 (UTC)
- Keep and move to Alex Bobidosh per Hatman31 and BeanieFan11. Rlendog ( talk) 15:27, 28 November 2022 (UTC)
- Keep and move to Alex Bobidosh. Enough WP:SIGCOV has been identified earlier in this discussion to make it a clear pass of WP:GNG. Frank Anchor 17:53, 28 November 2022 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. and Move to Alex Bobidosh. Liz Read! Talk! 03:09, 5 December 2022 (UTC)
E. Bobadash
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- E. Bobadash ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
Fails WP:GNG and prong 5 of WP:SPORTBASIC. Article has for 13 years remained as a sub-stub unsupported by any SIGCOV, and my searches failed to find any. (I tried redirecting to List of players who appeared in only one game in the NFL (1920–1929)#1922, but the redirect was reverted by User:BeanieFan11. A redirect remains a reasonable alternative to deletion IMO.) Cbl62 ( talk) 02:10, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
- Redirect per nom. We've gone over this extensively for over a year now; SIGCOV is required for sports articles, and simple participation has been deprecated. If User:BeanieFan11 is unprepared to do the work to properly source the articles, he does not now get to unilaterally decide to defy consensus-based notability standards. Either put up or shut up. Ravenswing 03:49, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. North America 1000 04:56, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
- Redirect until SIGCOV can be found.
Spike 'em (
talk)
08:52, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
- @
Spike 'em: Sigcov has been found.
BeanieFan11 (
talk)
00:45, 24 November 2022 (UTC)
SIGCOV generally requires multiple reliable sources. I guess it now passes SPORTBASIC, but not GNG.Sorry, only saw the first source, will review the rest. Spike 'em ( talk) 01:21, 24 November 2022 (UTC)
- @
Spike 'em: Sigcov has been found.
BeanieFan11 (
talk)
00:45, 24 November 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: American football and Wisconsin. Spiderone (Talk to Spider) 09:54, 21 November 2022 (UTC)
- Keep. You want SIGCOV, I give you SIGCOV: Bobidosh (not Bobadash) is mentioned on eight pages in Walter Lingo, Jim Thorpe, and the Oorang Indians: How a Dog Kennel Owner Created the NFL's Most Famous Traveling Team and has a multi-paragraph bio there (SIGCOV). It seems that he later became the tribal leader of the Chippewa Indians and a lake was named after him ( [1]). There also seems to be a bunch of mentions of him on Newspapers.com (e.g. [2] [3] [4] [5] [6]). That, along with playing in the NFL, should be enough for notability. BeanieFan11 ( talk) 20:42, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- None of these refer to "E. Bobadash". They all refer to "Alex Bobidosh." Is this the same person? Is the article mis-titled? Also, per
WP:SPORTBASIC, at least one example of the sources needs to be in the article. The book appears to be SIGCOV of "Alex Bobidosh". One possible solution: Create a well-sourced article on "Alex Bobidosh".
Cbl62 (
talk)
20:56, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- Yes, "Alex Bobidosh" and "E. Bobadash" are the same person. I have absolutely no idea why
PFR lists his name like that (especially since, on his PFR profile, underneath "E. Bobadash" it lists his full name as "Alex Bobidosh"! I'll have to contact them about that.) I'll try to expand the article soon, its just currently there's a lot of topics which I need to create "well-sourced article"s for (even before this stuff about one-game players popped up, my wikipedia "to-do" list at home was over four pages long).
BeanieFan11 (
talk)
21:10, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- An error in PFR is not a reason to keep. There is no SIGCOV whatsoever on anyone named "E. Bobadash". The sourcing you provided may or may not support creating an article on "Alex Bobidosh" but it absolutely does not support keeping an article on "E. Bobadash."
Cbl62 (
talk)
21:16, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- I meant that E. Bobadash and Alex Bobidosh are the same person, and the article should be moved to the latter title.
BeanieFan11 (
talk)
21:21, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- Hrm. I'm seeing a bunch of casual mentions, myself. And with that, "along with playing in the NFL" meets no notability criterion on Wikipedia. Simple participation criteria has been deprecated, full stop. That you don't like that outcome is apparent, but no one's personal approval is required for consensus to take place.
Ravenswing
05:18, 23 November 2022 (UTC)
- I wouldn't say a book giving someone a multi-para bio as well as mentioning that subject on eight different pages is just a "casual mention." BeanieFan11 ( talk) 15:21, 23 November 2022 (UTC)
- Hrm. I'm seeing a bunch of casual mentions, myself. And with that, "along with playing in the NFL" meets no notability criterion on Wikipedia. Simple participation criteria has been deprecated, full stop. That you don't like that outcome is apparent, but no one's personal approval is required for consensus to take place.
Ravenswing
05:18, 23 November 2022 (UTC)
- I meant that E. Bobadash and Alex Bobidosh are the same person, and the article should be moved to the latter title.
BeanieFan11 (
talk)
21:21, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- An error in PFR is not a reason to keep. There is no SIGCOV whatsoever on anyone named "E. Bobadash". The sourcing you provided may or may not support creating an article on "Alex Bobidosh" but it absolutely does not support keeping an article on "E. Bobadash."
Cbl62 (
talk)
21:16, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- Yes, "Alex Bobidosh" and "E. Bobadash" are the same person. I have absolutely no idea why
PFR lists his name like that (especially since, on his PFR profile, underneath "E. Bobadash" it lists his full name as "Alex Bobidosh"! I'll have to contact them about that.) I'll try to expand the article soon, its just currently there's a lot of topics which I need to create "well-sourced article"s for (even before this stuff about one-game players popped up, my wikipedia "to-do" list at home was over four pages long).
BeanieFan11 (
talk)
21:10, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- None of these refer to "E. Bobadash". They all refer to "Alex Bobidosh." Is this the same person? Is the article mis-titled? Also, per
WP:SPORTBASIC, at least one example of the sources needs to be in the article. The book appears to be SIGCOV of "Alex Bobidosh". One possible solution: Create a well-sourced article on "Alex Bobidosh".
Cbl62 (
talk)
20:56, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
- Redirect until SIGCOV sourcing is found and added to the article as required by SPORTBASIC. –
dlthewave
☎
04:34, 23 November 2022 (UTC)
- How is a book describing someone on eight pages and giving them a multi-paragraph bio not sigcov? BeanieFan11 ( talk) 15:21, 23 November 2022 (UTC)
- Weak keep per User:BeanieFan11 sources and move the page to Alex Bobidosh. Alvaldi ( talk) 20:25, 23 November 2022 (UTC)
- Keep - I'm persuaded that Bobadash/Bobidosh meets Wikipedia's notability guidelines based on the sources provided above by BeanieFan11; that said, it appears the page should be moved to Alex Bobidosh (per WP:COMMONNAME) and E. Bobadash should be kept as a redirect. Hatman31 ( talk) 20:58, 26 November 2022 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting. Is there any definitive way to come up with an accurate identification/name? Please do not move the article though during this AFD discussion.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 02:12, 28 November 2022 (UTC)
- Keep as per BeanieFan11. An article being poorly written isn't the same as non-notable. Macktheknifeau ( talk) 03:13, 28 November 2022 (UTC)
- Keep and move to Alex Bobidosh per Hatman31 and BeanieFan11. Rlendog ( talk) 15:27, 28 November 2022 (UTC)
- Keep and move to Alex Bobidosh. Enough WP:SIGCOV has been identified earlier in this discussion to make it a clear pass of WP:GNG. Frank Anchor 17:53, 28 November 2022 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.