The result was no consensus. ansh 666 08:02, 21 December 2017 (UTC)
Mid-level manager, not likely notable under
WP:NBIO. Apparently the work of one SPA. ☆
Bri (
talk) 09:12, 28 November 2017 (UTC)
Hello Everyone, This person was the head of a ministry. Not a mid level manager. According to all the references I added to the proposal of deletion discussion. I assume that there were not many accounts modifying this article because the person is currently out of office. If it is not important to document any information about people who managed or worked in governments during transition periods (after January 25th revolution) because not many people modified the article then feel free to delete it. However, I have checked the facts in this article and they were correct. This man was in charge of the Ministry of State for Administrative Development under Essam Sharaf's and Kamal Elganz2ouri's cabinets from March 2011 till August 2012. Cecs2010 ( talk) 17:14, 28 November 2017 (UTC) — Cecs2010 ( talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
Hi Bri, there was no actual minister of state during the one and a half year transition period. He was the head of the ministry of state for administrative development. I respectfully disagree with the notion that his position was considered a minor rank. If you feel that the article is not worth being on Wikipedia then feel free to delete it. Cecs2010 ( talk) 19:57, 28 November 2017 (UTC)
I have been saying that I was not going to add anything else but I thought to point out one last note so I apologize for that. Most people who know this person speak Arabic and those of whom who speak English will not probably know that this conversation is taking place. I have joined Wikipedia about a month ago wanting to contribute to Middle Eastern topics but what I am seeing here seems to me that we are having a popularity contest on facts. Cecs2010 ( talk) 19:51, 29 November 2017 (UTC)
This person is notable in Egypt and not in other regions like North America because they have not served in a position outside of Egypt. I could add so many Arabic news articles to the page if that is allowed. As well as interviews with major news outlets like Aljazeera and other news outlets. Here is a link to the Ministry of State's youtube page that shows some of Ashraf Abdelwahab's interviews with major news outlets in the region: http://viyoutube.com/channel/UC1LkIgnH14NkGXtahlyQb2w/%D9%88%D8%B2%D8%A7%D8%B1%D8%A9%20%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%AF%D9%88%D9%84%D8%A9%20%D9%84%D9%84%D8%AA%D9%86%D9%85%D9%8A%D8%A9%20%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A5%D8%AF%D8%A7%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9 Cecs2010 ( talk) 15:34, 7 December 2017 (UTC)
According to /info/en/?search=Wikipedia:Notability_(people), "People are presumed notable if they have received significant coverage in multiple published[4] secondary sources that are reliable, intellectually independent of each other,[5] and independent of the subject." to show some of the significant coverage in Multiple published secondary sources, I have included here some of the articles published in the Egyptian media about Ashraf AbdelWahab and Essam Sharaf. These articles are in Arabic but please feel free to use google translate to translate each page if needed: https://www.elwatannews.com/news/details/806565
http://gate.ahram.org.eg/News/53108.aspx (Ahram is a major news paper in Egypt)
https://www.elwatannews.com/news/details/806565
http://www.shorouknews.com/news/view.aspx?cdate=15062012&id=e891c97a-5f97-4601-81c4-2c9420530943
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=encP3_fMl50&list=UU1LkIgnH14NkGXtahlyQb2w&index=18 (Egyptian TV)
https://hrdiscussion.com/hr31595.html
If you open any of these pages using a chrome browser, you will be asked if you would like to translate the page. Click translate and you will get to see how Ashraf Abdelwahab was covered in the media.
I could add five times more articles if needed. Cecs2010 ( talk) 17:47, 7 December 2017 (UTC)
One of Ashraf Abdelwahab's interviews with Aljazeera: http://viyoutube.com/video/HG7-owK2jvY/%D8%AC2%20-%20%D9%84%D9%82%D8%A7%D8%A1%20%D8%AF.%D8%A3%D8%B4%D8%B1%D9%81%20%D8%B9%D8%A8%D8%AF%20%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%88%D9%87%D8%A7%D8%A8%20%D8%A8%D9%82%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%A9%20%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%AC%D8%B2%D9%8A%D8%B1%D8%A9%20%202%D8%A3%D9%83%D8%AA%D9%88%D8%A8%D8%B1%202011.flv Cecs2010 ( talk) 16:09, 8 December 2017 (UTC)
I will add more multiple independent coverages of Ashraf Abdelwahab in English:
The following link is of a UNODC (United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime) talking about the Ministry of State for Administrative Development and UNODC's efforts to strengthen Egypt's current reporting and complaints mechanisms against corrupt acts. (Article in English). They refer to Dr. Ashraf Abdelwahab as the Minister of State for Administrative development: https://www.unodc.org/middleeastandnorthafrica/en/web-stories/strengthening-egypts-complaint-mechanisms-against-corruption.html
United Nations Development Program's piece about officials from Tunisia, Egypt and Libya Discussing International Standards for Election Management where they cite Dr. Ashraf Abdelwahab's work.
http://www.eg.undp.org/content/egypt/en/home/presscenter/pressreleases/officials-from-tunisia--egypt-and-libya-discuss-international-st.html
Study of Dr. Abdelwahab's work published in the proceedings of the European Conference on E-Government. The publication was authored by Dr. Abdelwahab and MSAD officials: https://books.google.com/books?id=cIkxJXGyhv8C&pg=PA213&lpg=PA213&dq=Ashraf+Abdelwahab+Egyptian+Minister+of+state&source=bl&ots=RgX6ZLipBO&sig=D74woObgouzJsOuk8w8JdtscWWI&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwitppDUqIPYAhVJ0oMKHZBCAcgQ6AEIcTAP#v=onepage&q=Ashraf%20Abdelwahab%20Egyptian%20Minister%20of%20state&f=false
The Citizenship Initiative Press conference (UNDP sponsored event):
https://uprdoc.ohchr.org/uprweb/downloadfile.aspx?filename=1236&file=Annexe1
The document includes how the press conference was covered in the Egyptian media. The document is on a United Nations affiliated server. Cecs2010 ( talk) 01:47, 12 December 2017 (UTC)
After adding all the credible references and external links above, I was wondering if anyone who were not for keeping the article above have changed their opinion. I have added many credible resources that were not present at the beginning of the conversation. Cecs2010 ( talk) 18:05, 14 December 2017 (UTC)
I was wondering if the discussion will be relisted for a third time or a more experienced Wikipedian will close the conversation and finalise a decision soon? I think that we should not keep the nomination for deletion box on this article for too long as it may discourage the page's editors. Cecs2010 ( talk) 20:09, 20 December 2017 (UTC)
The result was no consensus. ansh 666 08:02, 21 December 2017 (UTC)
Mid-level manager, not likely notable under
WP:NBIO. Apparently the work of one SPA. ☆
Bri (
talk) 09:12, 28 November 2017 (UTC)
Hello Everyone, This person was the head of a ministry. Not a mid level manager. According to all the references I added to the proposal of deletion discussion. I assume that there were not many accounts modifying this article because the person is currently out of office. If it is not important to document any information about people who managed or worked in governments during transition periods (after January 25th revolution) because not many people modified the article then feel free to delete it. However, I have checked the facts in this article and they were correct. This man was in charge of the Ministry of State for Administrative Development under Essam Sharaf's and Kamal Elganz2ouri's cabinets from March 2011 till August 2012. Cecs2010 ( talk) 17:14, 28 November 2017 (UTC) — Cecs2010 ( talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
Hi Bri, there was no actual minister of state during the one and a half year transition period. He was the head of the ministry of state for administrative development. I respectfully disagree with the notion that his position was considered a minor rank. If you feel that the article is not worth being on Wikipedia then feel free to delete it. Cecs2010 ( talk) 19:57, 28 November 2017 (UTC)
I have been saying that I was not going to add anything else but I thought to point out one last note so I apologize for that. Most people who know this person speak Arabic and those of whom who speak English will not probably know that this conversation is taking place. I have joined Wikipedia about a month ago wanting to contribute to Middle Eastern topics but what I am seeing here seems to me that we are having a popularity contest on facts. Cecs2010 ( talk) 19:51, 29 November 2017 (UTC)
This person is notable in Egypt and not in other regions like North America because they have not served in a position outside of Egypt. I could add so many Arabic news articles to the page if that is allowed. As well as interviews with major news outlets like Aljazeera and other news outlets. Here is a link to the Ministry of State's youtube page that shows some of Ashraf Abdelwahab's interviews with major news outlets in the region: http://viyoutube.com/channel/UC1LkIgnH14NkGXtahlyQb2w/%D9%88%D8%B2%D8%A7%D8%B1%D8%A9%20%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%AF%D9%88%D9%84%D8%A9%20%D9%84%D9%84%D8%AA%D9%86%D9%85%D9%8A%D8%A9%20%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A5%D8%AF%D8%A7%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9 Cecs2010 ( talk) 15:34, 7 December 2017 (UTC)
According to /info/en/?search=Wikipedia:Notability_(people), "People are presumed notable if they have received significant coverage in multiple published[4] secondary sources that are reliable, intellectually independent of each other,[5] and independent of the subject." to show some of the significant coverage in Multiple published secondary sources, I have included here some of the articles published in the Egyptian media about Ashraf AbdelWahab and Essam Sharaf. These articles are in Arabic but please feel free to use google translate to translate each page if needed: https://www.elwatannews.com/news/details/806565
http://gate.ahram.org.eg/News/53108.aspx (Ahram is a major news paper in Egypt)
https://www.elwatannews.com/news/details/806565
http://www.shorouknews.com/news/view.aspx?cdate=15062012&id=e891c97a-5f97-4601-81c4-2c9420530943
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=encP3_fMl50&list=UU1LkIgnH14NkGXtahlyQb2w&index=18 (Egyptian TV)
https://hrdiscussion.com/hr31595.html
If you open any of these pages using a chrome browser, you will be asked if you would like to translate the page. Click translate and you will get to see how Ashraf Abdelwahab was covered in the media.
I could add five times more articles if needed. Cecs2010 ( talk) 17:47, 7 December 2017 (UTC)
One of Ashraf Abdelwahab's interviews with Aljazeera: http://viyoutube.com/video/HG7-owK2jvY/%D8%AC2%20-%20%D9%84%D9%82%D8%A7%D8%A1%20%D8%AF.%D8%A3%D8%B4%D8%B1%D9%81%20%D8%B9%D8%A8%D8%AF%20%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%88%D9%87%D8%A7%D8%A8%20%D8%A8%D9%82%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%A9%20%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%AC%D8%B2%D9%8A%D8%B1%D8%A9%20%202%D8%A3%D9%83%D8%AA%D9%88%D8%A8%D8%B1%202011.flv Cecs2010 ( talk) 16:09, 8 December 2017 (UTC)
I will add more multiple independent coverages of Ashraf Abdelwahab in English:
The following link is of a UNODC (United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime) talking about the Ministry of State for Administrative Development and UNODC's efforts to strengthen Egypt's current reporting and complaints mechanisms against corrupt acts. (Article in English). They refer to Dr. Ashraf Abdelwahab as the Minister of State for Administrative development: https://www.unodc.org/middleeastandnorthafrica/en/web-stories/strengthening-egypts-complaint-mechanisms-against-corruption.html
United Nations Development Program's piece about officials from Tunisia, Egypt and Libya Discussing International Standards for Election Management where they cite Dr. Ashraf Abdelwahab's work.
http://www.eg.undp.org/content/egypt/en/home/presscenter/pressreleases/officials-from-tunisia--egypt-and-libya-discuss-international-st.html
Study of Dr. Abdelwahab's work published in the proceedings of the European Conference on E-Government. The publication was authored by Dr. Abdelwahab and MSAD officials: https://books.google.com/books?id=cIkxJXGyhv8C&pg=PA213&lpg=PA213&dq=Ashraf+Abdelwahab+Egyptian+Minister+of+state&source=bl&ots=RgX6ZLipBO&sig=D74woObgouzJsOuk8w8JdtscWWI&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwitppDUqIPYAhVJ0oMKHZBCAcgQ6AEIcTAP#v=onepage&q=Ashraf%20Abdelwahab%20Egyptian%20Minister%20of%20state&f=false
The Citizenship Initiative Press conference (UNDP sponsored event):
https://uprdoc.ohchr.org/uprweb/downloadfile.aspx?filename=1236&file=Annexe1
The document includes how the press conference was covered in the Egyptian media. The document is on a United Nations affiliated server. Cecs2010 ( talk) 01:47, 12 December 2017 (UTC)
After adding all the credible references and external links above, I was wondering if anyone who were not for keeping the article above have changed their opinion. I have added many credible resources that were not present at the beginning of the conversation. Cecs2010 ( talk) 18:05, 14 December 2017 (UTC)
I was wondering if the discussion will be relisted for a third time or a more experienced Wikipedian will close the conversation and finalise a decision soon? I think that we should not keep the nomination for deletion box on this article for too long as it may discourage the page's editors. Cecs2010 ( talk) 20:09, 20 December 2017 (UTC)