File:LindsayLohanMachete.jpg looks pretty suspicious: looks to me like the OTRS tag was added to avoid deletion of the image. I think you have OTRS privileges, so I'd appreciate it if you could check it out.— Kww( talk) 20:10, 23 February 2010 (UTC)
Replied on my talkpage.-- Cube lurker ( talk) 20:17, 23 February 2010 (UTC)
Hello, I note that you have commented on the first phase of Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Biographies of living people
As this RFC closes, there are two proposals being considered:
Your opinion on this is welcome. Okip 02:16, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
What scurrilous attack? You may not believe this, but I do have a lot of respect for you & your contributions -- even if we don't agree on issues. Even if we never do again. -- llywrch ( talk) 04:18, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
Leadup:
Without any attempt to inquire what I was talking about:
You have no idea what facts I was or wasn't considering nor what my motives are. These are scurrilous assertions of the lowest sort. I put up with a lot of potshots at the admin boards and usually ignore them, but this could have derailed the appropriate response to an actual real world stalking victim. It is beyond the pale. Durova 412 04:28, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
This is very simple. Think of the phrase stalking victim. Now think of its full real world meaning, especially the legal one. This is that situation. Of course there are things that can't be said onsite. The Wikipedia page had a direct effect on the victim's life. You've disregarded invitations to substantiate how that transpired; the rest of your words only communicate a profound lack of perspective. If you trivialize something this important again you're going to get conduct RfC'd. Durova 412 15:29, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
Prior to this event, I never really gave much thought to WP:BLP and if fact, I veered more towards the mindset that if it is encyclopedic than of course it should be included here. But this ordeal has been massively eye opening because I saw first hand how seemingly innocent edits can have far reaching and devastating impact on the lives of real, living people. The original editors to the curling articles had absolutely no malice intent and probably couldn't even conceive of what ill intent could have possibly came from their edits. But that is the rub, no one is omniscience. No one can possibly anticipate the response to any edit that we do here. However, while we can't be faulted for not knowing the impact of our edits, what matters most is how we respond to the concerns of the living subjects who those edits do impact. That, in my opinion, is the wisdom of WP:BLP and what I see Durova advocating. When something comes up, you act. This is not a game nor a "Think of the children" moment. We're not talking about vulgar lyrics or lewd pictures, we're talking about living, breathing people who through the power of the internet (particularly via our prominence on Google), we can have dramatic impacts on. We simply can not play with people's lives in such a flippant matter. Just because you can't wrap your head around how these edits impacted someone, doesn't make that real impact on their life go away. WP:BLP should have a "No questions ask" response because our need to be a responsible encyclopedia should trump all. An irresponsible encyclopedia is ultimately not a credible one and while, yes, we may have to sacrifice minutely "encyclopedic" details, the balance of value for those minute details is far less than the value of simply being decent human beings and doing the right thing. Agne Cheese/ Wine 05:48, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
Hi, Durova. I was very confused when I first went to the Workshop page, not having been involved in Arbcom before. I saw that people were adding proposals, including Tucker, a party to the case. I thought that I could do so. And of course I screwed up by adding something in the wrong place. Now I wonder if, as a party to the case, it was weird for me to add a section to the Workshop. Was it? Should I delete or abandon? Thanks. TimidGuy ( talk) 12:25, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
Materialscientist ( talk) 00:12, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
Works better on slower ISO, I should have read the manual...Thanks again (And more photos added to the poll) YellowMonkey ( vote in the Southern Stars and White Ferns supermodel photo poll) 05:12, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
As my idea is heavily based on your ideas and work, your thoughts on my proposal would be appreciated. J Milburn ( talk) 12:24, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
Hi. Could you please take a peek at this:
and let me know your view on this pair of images? Thanks. Jack Merridew 22:06, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
Browse the "other versions" notes of my featured pictures for samples. :) We do already have a featured picture of Mary Pickford, though. Durova 412 02:59, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
Hi Durova, I noticed your comment at Talk:Mary Pickford and it occurred to me that we have a tag on the Carl Van Vechten images that says basically not to crop or enhance the images as the donator wished their integrity to be maintained. I thought that would be a good example to refer to, and went to this picture of Laurence Olivier to provide an example of one such image, and was shocked to see this has been cropped several times, despite the clear message not to. Can you please tell me how I would go about having the cropped versions deleted and just the original image retained. I know how to do it here for images that have been reduced etc, but I'm not so sure how to nominate it on Commons. If you could please point me in the right direction, I'll go through the rest of the collection and see if any others have been cropped. Thank you. Rossrs ( talk) 06:51, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
Hell In A Bucket ( talk) 03:52, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
First of all, I really resent people proposing stuff for deletion as "sub-notable" who obviously know nothing about the subject. You are probably one of our teen-or-20-aged people who think that any song from before they were born is automatically not notable. WP:N states, "Songs that have been ranked on national or significant music charts, that have won significant awards or honors or that have been performed independently by several notable artists, bands or groups are probably notable." The song was a #18 charted hit, as was stated already in the article before you flagged it. Besides Perry Como, whose version was the one which reached that chart position, the song was also recorded by Benny Goodman, Tommy Dorsey, and other "notable artists, bands or groups." Before you conclude that some song is not notable, it might behoove you to read that quote again.
In any case, it's also unfortunate that people are now flagging things as "unreferenced" and forcing editors to go back and waste time tracking sources. Back in 2005, when I originally created the article, it was not the normal practice to put in references. Instead of flagging things as "unreferenced" it would be a more useful employment of your effort just to do a Google search and find a source.
Frankly, I admit to being an unashamed inclusionist. Moreover, in the interest of progress, I think that it is the deletionists who are killing Wikipedia, by discouraging people from editing articles because they are afraid their work will simply fall victim to some deletionist who finds it easier to simply propose something for deletion than to add whatever they think an article is missing. -- BRG ( talk) 20:12, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
The
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This has been an automated delivery by
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talk) 21:24, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
Sorry for the late reply as I was in the hospital for two weeks, and just came out. I didn't know it takes 20 hours to restore a picture, that's heavy work. I hope your pets feel better. Thanks Secret account 16:25, 2 March 2010 (UTC)
Thoughts ? Abecedare ( talk) 19:07, 2 March 2010 (UTC)
File:LindsayLohanMachete.jpg looks pretty suspicious: looks to me like the OTRS tag was added to avoid deletion of the image. I think you have OTRS privileges, so I'd appreciate it if you could check it out.— Kww( talk) 20:10, 23 February 2010 (UTC)
Replied on my talkpage.-- Cube lurker ( talk) 20:17, 23 February 2010 (UTC)
Hello, I note that you have commented on the first phase of Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Biographies of living people
As this RFC closes, there are two proposals being considered:
Your opinion on this is welcome. Okip 02:16, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
What scurrilous attack? You may not believe this, but I do have a lot of respect for you & your contributions -- even if we don't agree on issues. Even if we never do again. -- llywrch ( talk) 04:18, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
Leadup:
Without any attempt to inquire what I was talking about:
You have no idea what facts I was or wasn't considering nor what my motives are. These are scurrilous assertions of the lowest sort. I put up with a lot of potshots at the admin boards and usually ignore them, but this could have derailed the appropriate response to an actual real world stalking victim. It is beyond the pale. Durova 412 04:28, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
This is very simple. Think of the phrase stalking victim. Now think of its full real world meaning, especially the legal one. This is that situation. Of course there are things that can't be said onsite. The Wikipedia page had a direct effect on the victim's life. You've disregarded invitations to substantiate how that transpired; the rest of your words only communicate a profound lack of perspective. If you trivialize something this important again you're going to get conduct RfC'd. Durova 412 15:29, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
Prior to this event, I never really gave much thought to WP:BLP and if fact, I veered more towards the mindset that if it is encyclopedic than of course it should be included here. But this ordeal has been massively eye opening because I saw first hand how seemingly innocent edits can have far reaching and devastating impact on the lives of real, living people. The original editors to the curling articles had absolutely no malice intent and probably couldn't even conceive of what ill intent could have possibly came from their edits. But that is the rub, no one is omniscience. No one can possibly anticipate the response to any edit that we do here. However, while we can't be faulted for not knowing the impact of our edits, what matters most is how we respond to the concerns of the living subjects who those edits do impact. That, in my opinion, is the wisdom of WP:BLP and what I see Durova advocating. When something comes up, you act. This is not a game nor a "Think of the children" moment. We're not talking about vulgar lyrics or lewd pictures, we're talking about living, breathing people who through the power of the internet (particularly via our prominence on Google), we can have dramatic impacts on. We simply can not play with people's lives in such a flippant matter. Just because you can't wrap your head around how these edits impacted someone, doesn't make that real impact on their life go away. WP:BLP should have a "No questions ask" response because our need to be a responsible encyclopedia should trump all. An irresponsible encyclopedia is ultimately not a credible one and while, yes, we may have to sacrifice minutely "encyclopedic" details, the balance of value for those minute details is far less than the value of simply being decent human beings and doing the right thing. Agne Cheese/ Wine 05:48, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
Hi, Durova. I was very confused when I first went to the Workshop page, not having been involved in Arbcom before. I saw that people were adding proposals, including Tucker, a party to the case. I thought that I could do so. And of course I screwed up by adding something in the wrong place. Now I wonder if, as a party to the case, it was weird for me to add a section to the Workshop. Was it? Should I delete or abandon? Thanks. TimidGuy ( talk) 12:25, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
Materialscientist ( talk) 00:12, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
Works better on slower ISO, I should have read the manual...Thanks again (And more photos added to the poll) YellowMonkey ( vote in the Southern Stars and White Ferns supermodel photo poll) 05:12, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
As my idea is heavily based on your ideas and work, your thoughts on my proposal would be appreciated. J Milburn ( talk) 12:24, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
Hi. Could you please take a peek at this:
and let me know your view on this pair of images? Thanks. Jack Merridew 22:06, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
Browse the "other versions" notes of my featured pictures for samples. :) We do already have a featured picture of Mary Pickford, though. Durova 412 02:59, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
Hi Durova, I noticed your comment at Talk:Mary Pickford and it occurred to me that we have a tag on the Carl Van Vechten images that says basically not to crop or enhance the images as the donator wished their integrity to be maintained. I thought that would be a good example to refer to, and went to this picture of Laurence Olivier to provide an example of one such image, and was shocked to see this has been cropped several times, despite the clear message not to. Can you please tell me how I would go about having the cropped versions deleted and just the original image retained. I know how to do it here for images that have been reduced etc, but I'm not so sure how to nominate it on Commons. If you could please point me in the right direction, I'll go through the rest of the collection and see if any others have been cropped. Thank you. Rossrs ( talk) 06:51, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
Hell In A Bucket ( talk) 03:52, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
First of all, I really resent people proposing stuff for deletion as "sub-notable" who obviously know nothing about the subject. You are probably one of our teen-or-20-aged people who think that any song from before they were born is automatically not notable. WP:N states, "Songs that have been ranked on national or significant music charts, that have won significant awards or honors or that have been performed independently by several notable artists, bands or groups are probably notable." The song was a #18 charted hit, as was stated already in the article before you flagged it. Besides Perry Como, whose version was the one which reached that chart position, the song was also recorded by Benny Goodman, Tommy Dorsey, and other "notable artists, bands or groups." Before you conclude that some song is not notable, it might behoove you to read that quote again.
In any case, it's also unfortunate that people are now flagging things as "unreferenced" and forcing editors to go back and waste time tracking sources. Back in 2005, when I originally created the article, it was not the normal practice to put in references. Instead of flagging things as "unreferenced" it would be a more useful employment of your effort just to do a Google search and find a source.
Frankly, I admit to being an unashamed inclusionist. Moreover, in the interest of progress, I think that it is the deletionists who are killing Wikipedia, by discouraging people from editing articles because they are afraid their work will simply fall victim to some deletionist who finds it easier to simply propose something for deletion than to add whatever they think an article is missing. -- BRG ( talk) 20:12, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
The
Military history WikiProject coordinator selection process has started; to elect the coordinators to serve for the next six months. If you are interested in running, please sign up
here by 23:59 (UTC) on 8 March 2010! More information on coordinatorship may be found on the
coordinator academy course and in the
responsibilities section on the coordinator page.
This has been an automated delivery by
BrownBot (
talk) 21:24, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
Sorry for the late reply as I was in the hospital for two weeks, and just came out. I didn't know it takes 20 hours to restore a picture, that's heavy work. I hope your pets feel better. Thanks Secret account 16:25, 2 March 2010 (UTC)
Thoughts ? Abecedare ( talk) 19:07, 2 March 2010 (UTC)