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Comics Wikiproject and has thus listed it
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Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 January 12#Comics Wikiproject until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion.
Thryduulf (
talk)
11:05, 12 January 2022 (UTC)
Found this while investigating. Passing along. [User Contribs: Tyciol]( https://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Special:Contributions/Tyciol&target=Tyciol) >04:12, 4 January 2010 diff hist −3 User talk:Tyciol unfortunately I don't know how to disable bots like this from posting, but in the case of the Ivan Brandon article, it looks like User:Nightscream created that out of a redirect I made, plz tell him — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2603:7080:F201:54D7:D560:A0F:48D1:C989 ( talk)
Hi!
Noticed your massive revert of uncited material for latest appearance and the need for secondary sources. Well, sometimes it is as simple as just checking the web site, IF they have been in the comic before, but it will take some time clicking to verify... :) Garfield's fan wiki has records of the dates, I noticed now, but, it's a wikipage, and not reliable. It doesn't seem that the requested information is (was) collected anywere else than these two sources. /info/en/?search=List_of_Garfield_characters
-- Kejo ( talk) 10:59, 15 January 2022 (UTC)
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect
Ford Buick and has thus listed it
for discussion. This discussion will occur at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 January 31#Ford Buick until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion.
A7V2 (
talk)
03:35, 31 January 2022 (UTC)
Nightscream, how do you know that I don't edit here often, which I popup on Wikipedia at anytime when I just learned from the news? Maybe you shouldn't say how many edits I've made on Wikipedia since I started editing here, so does other users when you noted them about their edits that often came up without citing a reliable source or two, because what you said to me and them was creepy. —Also, since you
manually undo-ed my hat-note edit, why do you think those words should not be included in that hat-note as you said it's "grammatically incoherent"? Is that edit too wordy for you on that hat-note in that article? Between "Chumlee" and "Chumley", these names are often distinguished with a similar pronunciation that is not to be confused with
. --
Allen (
talk /
ctrb)
21:55, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
This article is about the reality television personality. For other subjects named "Chumley", which is not to be confused with, see Chumley. For the American entrepreneur, see Austin Russell (entrepreneur).
Hey there hope this is the best way to reach you. I understand your policy edits however I'd like to discuss this. I think my edit is better for the page because theres not too many gossipy details. As for the peacock phrase I believe legendary is the correct word. As for slang I think theres an exception to use eyed since we're discussing real estate development. I think its better to leave so much detail about city councils vision for the mall off Wikipedia as it frankly violates policy. Mentioning town council is also much more than im trying to convey. Perhaps we come to a conclusion together before we update again. Thanks! Complexhistorian ( talk) 17:53, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
I strongly disagree with you mentioning the city council. Its tabloid like and violates policy its one point of view that the center has been impacted by the economy. As for the hilton hotel mention, the article states they were certainly trying to build it and its their opinion its not likely to build. This is the only real development on the site. As for your other comments, I understand, I think its important we dont go into too much detail as well as bringing up city council, it suggests the center could be struggling which seems incorrect. I think we either keep it simple and mention just the store closing, or we include any developments that doesnt undermine the current success of the mall. Complexhistorian ( talk) 20:30, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
It wasnt my intention to remove that source hence me not mentioning it. I am strongly opposed to your edit, bringing up city council because of one store closure is too much. Mentioning city council firmly suggests the entire mall is in jeopardy which isnt true. Complexhistorian ( talk) 22:22, 23 February 2022 (UTC) 22:20, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
How come you are insisting I'm motivated by promoting the mall? As editors we have a responsibility, your edit simply suggests the entire mall is failing which is irresponsible as well as incorrect. Complexhistorian ( talk) 22:40, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
This isnt complicated like you seem to be making it, I disagree with your edit why arnt you willing to work with me? I think lord and taylors closure and the city councils comments have little to do with each other, the mall is successful so I disagree with their statements. I think its best to leave it as lord and taylor closed, using that particular quote along with lord and taylor paints this mall as failing, to be fair you shouldnt use this quote. Complexhistorian ( talk) 23:26, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
Hi there. My issue is with the way the sentence regarding Uncle Ben is worded, "Although to date the main timeline version of the MCU has not explicitly mentioned his Uncle Ben, Spider-Man: Homecoming wirter John Francis Daley stated that Peter's reference in that film to all that May had been through was a reference to Ben". That sounds so sloppy, "all May had been through" - meaning what? Perhaps this line would be better served under Characterization as opposed to Fictional character biography, since Uncle Ben has not actually been mentioned in the MCU as of yet. There is already a reference to him in that section - "The MCU depiction of Peter Parker omits explicit reference to Uncle Ben, whose death was a significant event both in the comic books and in previous film series. The one exception is "What If... Zombies?!", in which a variant of Parker mentions everyone who has died in his life in the universe seen in that episode". It would be pretty simple to expand on this by adding in John Francis Daley's information. Thoughts? Thanks.
Thanks for reviewing my edits to Western Electric. I am sorry that you had to revert my edits for lack of references. I am a retired telecommunications engineer with employment experience at Bell Telephone Laboratories, or, simply, Bell Labs, (which designed products manufactured by Western Electric), GTE Lenkurt, BNR Inc. (designed products manufactured by Northern Telecom) and Wiltron. I am new to editing Wikipedia. If you approve of what I wrote, and I think you do except for the stated reason, I'll add references. Most of the references will be to articles already in Wikipedia, for example Hush-A-Phone, acoustic couplers (I'll change modem to coupler), GTE Lenkurt (as Lenkurt Electric Company), Wiltron (Anritsu article), Ericofon, Independent Telephone Company and United States Telecom Association (USITA at the time of Western Electric's dominance). I don't know if I should just edit the article, and let the page be reverted if necessary, or submit changes for review. If I edit the article, I'll change a little at a time.
Some of these referenced articles really need expansion and I'd like to contribute. Of particular interest, Lenkurt Electric Company lacks information about its years after acquisition by GTE, when I was an employee. Some of what I wrote is from my engineering and personal experience. I need to either leave it out or maybe there is a way to reference it in accordance with Wikipedia guidelines. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Robert Sled ( talk • contribs) 17:23, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
I noticed that you reverted my wiki-linking of Die!namite on the Red Sonja page as WP:EASTEREGG. I respectfully disagree with this labelling and would love to hear your reasoning behind using it. The Die!namite link was not a piped link to an unrelated subject, rather it was a link to a dedicated page for that subject that currently is a redirect (instead of a redlink destination). Thank you for your time and I look forward to better understanding your reasoning. The Ghost of Art Toys Past ( talk) 07:12, 3 March 2022 (UTC)
![]() |
The Working Man's Barnstar |
17 years and more of contributions should be applauded and that you haven't had one of these yet means I can pop in and have the honour of awarding it to you. Long may you carry on! Hiding T 14:28, 3 March 2022 (UTC) |
Hi Nightscream. Just to let you know I've deleted a lot from this article. You're edit on the 14th duplicated everything starting at the Hispanics and crime section. I believe all the over changes you made are still present, but you may want to check. Thanks LCU ActivelyDisinterested ∆ transmission∆ ° co-ords° 14:59, 9 March 2022 (UTC)
Hello - my name is Susan Gerbic (Sgerbic) and I'm writing to you because at some point you joined Wikipedia:WikiProject Skepticism. This might have been months ago - or even years ago. With the best of intentions the project was created years ago, and sadly like many WikiProjects has started to go dormant. A group of us are attempting to revitalize the Skepticism project, already we have begun to clean up the main page and I've just redone the participant page. No one is in charge of this project, it is member directed, which might have been the reason it almost went dormant. We are attempting to bring back conversations on the talk page and have two subprojects as well, in the hopes that it might spark involvement and a way of getting to know each other better. One was created several years ago but is very well organized and a lot of progress was made, Wikipedia:WikiProject Skepticism/Skeptical organisations in Europe. The other I created a couple weeks ago, it is very simple and has a silly name Wikipedia:WikiProject Skepticism/Skepticism Stub Sub-Project Project (SSSPP). This sub-project runs from March 1 to June 1, 2022. We are attempting to rewrite skepticism stubs and add them to this list. As you can see we have already made progress.
The reason I'm writing to you now is because we would love to have you come back to the project and become involved, either by working on one of the sub-projects, proposing your own (and managing it), or just hanging out on the talk page getting to know the other editors and maybe donate some of your wisdom to some of the conversations. As I said, no one is in charge, so if you have something in mind you would like to see done, please suggest it on the talk page and hopefully others will agree. Please add the project to your watchlist, update your personal user page showing you are a proud member of WikiProject Skepticism. And DIVE in, this is what the work list looks like [5] frightening at first glance, but we have already started chipping away at it.
The Wikipedia:WikiProject Skepticism/Participants page has gone though a giant change - you may want to update your information. And of course if this project no longer interests you, please remove your name from the participant list, we would hate to see you go, but completely understand.
Thank you for your time, I hope to edit with you in the future. Sgerbic ( talk) 07:20, 17 March 2022 (UTC)
Hello, In your recent edit to remove uncited material, you seem to have also deleted this photo: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Common_tern_in_flight_with_Manhattan_in_the_background.jpg. Just wanted to check if that was intentional. Shantham11 ( talk)
Dear Nightscream I have a request for you for the article horror film on Wikipedia can you restore the 2010s section and the 2020s section? 107.122.97.8 03:40, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
Someone merged the 2010s section and the 2020s section on the horror film article for no reason can you bring the 2010s section and the 2020s section back? NightscreamJr. ( talk) 17:41, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
Undo the 2010s to present section and bring back the 2010s section and the 2020s section. NightscreamJr. ( talk) 17:44, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
Don't worry about the History of horror films article I've already restored the 2010s and 2020s on there all you have to do is restore the 2010s section and the 2020s section on the horror film article that's all. NightscreamJr. ( talk) 18:19, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
Why not? NightscreamJr. ( talk) 18:23, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
I'm trying to tell you you just make it so hard for me to understand you see I'm Autistic. NightscreamJr. ( talk) 18:28, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
I'm on Wikipedia now now we can talk. NightscreamJr. ( talk) 18:30, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
I'm not trying to mock you I want to be your successor. NightscreamJr. ( talk) 18:31, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
Thank you for recently editing the Tim Vigil article, especially as your use of {{ Refimprove}} is far superior to my multitude of {{ Citation needed}} inputs. As for your comment on my use of {{ Unreliable source?}}, please bear in mind that it isn't questioning if the source itself as reliable rather it indicates that "it is questionable whether the source used is reliable for supporting the statement" (emphasis mine). I'm not sure if a webpage on Tim Vigil's Filmography that simply lists "Faust: Love of the Damned (2001); Role: Book as Source Material" is really enough to support "The book's main storyline, Faust: Love of the Damned, was adapted by director Brian Yuzna as the 2001 film of the same name."
And, out of curiosity, where did the phrase "demonic-themed series" come from? Without a source, I'd personally say it breaks WP:NEUTRAL.
Also, while I fully understand how it can easily happen, if you are going to name a user in your comment ("Remove uncited material by The Ghost of Art Toys Past") make sure that they are indeed the source of said uncited material; in this instance, the uncited material all pre-dated my first edit on the page, though I should've removed it as you did instead of trying to tighten the wording and adding {{ Citation needed}} templates. The Ghost of Art Toys Past ( talk) 15:53, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
Thanks for uploading File:VeronicaCale.jpg. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).
Note that any non-free images not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described in section F5 of the criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. -- B-bot ( talk) 18:00, 16 April 2022 (UTC)
You're using some old fashioned talk page, however that is fine. Your edits aren't though. I propose a debate. Pictureperfect2 ( talk) 01:52, 20 April 2022 (UTC)
Look, you are big on assuming things. I don't mind trying to come to some agreement however keep in mind anyone could be talking to you. I could be a head of state or something. You go on with guessing who knows more than whom. Keep in mind that commas are over used all over the place. If you want to spend time writing great ledes and getting articles up to par, fine. Stop with the dob debate and leave it out a 2nd time. Let's see what we can come to agree on. Pictureperfect2 ( talk) 05:04, 20 April 2022 (UTC)
Think about this idea a minute. Hardly anyone on here agrees on certain things. Maybe we could do more than a little good if we try to figure out what we agree on and do that. Maybe you can concur with me on the dob thing and repeat one or two items at most minus the dob. As for the lede or lead which Wikipedia is nonsensical in explaining and far from consistent... you have something called a news (newspaper or tv, etc. lede) which is also called a lead paragraph. Supposedly according to this site you don't introduce new information but you do. The lede on here has the individual's family names, place of birth, education information, and usually one more factoid. That is specifically new info. Pictureperfect2 ( talk) 05:29, 20 April 2022 (UTC)
Please do not add any uncited materials from each articles to the talk pages. Unless, keep the removal if "unsourced", please read Wikipedia:Verifiability. -- 49.150.104.127 ( talk) 02:42, 27 April 2022 (UTC)
@ 49.150.104.127: I will continue to source, fact tag, remove, or move to the talk page uncited material as I've been doing for the many years I've been here, per the very policy you cite, and discussions with other members of the community. Nightscream ( talk) 02:45, 27 April 2022 (UTC)
Hey Nightscream. I'm planning to some ce on Peter Parker (Marvel Cinematic Universe)'s lede and appearances section. I was wondering what was the result/consensus of the discussion you made over at WP Comics regarding Parker as the kid from IM2? – SirDot ( talk) 05:49, 30 April 2022 (UTC)
Hey there. I reverted your edit and explained it thoroughly but wanted to say I'd be open to discuss it on the talk page. But to add to what I wrote, there is no report saying Zach Braff and Pugh are no longer together, so the "as of" isn't necessary here. And Braff directing Pugh in a short film is also as suitable for the "career" section as it is for "personal life", so I was curious why you didn't move that along with the other materials. Thanks! KyleJoan talk 21:17, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
For the record I know Vevmo is reliable in that they usually are right with the information they provide. I just know that they don't pass Wikipedia's definition of WP:RS, due to it being a user-generated source. I was trying to update older articles with RS's since Vevmo usually is only available source early on before official announcements are out there. The birthday I removed as I couldn't find a RS for that anywhere, and often is the case for lesser known BLPs. WikiVirus C (talk) 13:59, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
It actually isn't "According to a 2010 study in the Journal of the Society for the Anthropology of Europe." The conclusion vis a vis Fascist Italy comes from them (and they say it's ineffective, not that the result is mixed, as the article currently reads), but the conclusion w.r.t. the U.S.S.R. comes from Kristy Ironside, and the conclusion w.r.t. U.S. tax policy comes from Hayley Fisher. All three papers tell completely different stories. That's why the paragraph started off by saying "mixed" and doesn't reference a single paper explicitly. Fephisto ( talk) 01:49, 5 June 2022 (UTC)
You have been reverting some of my edits on the American Dream Meadowlands article, so I want to consult you before going through with my next edit. I want to change the image in the infobox from the entrance to the parking garage to one of these two images.
Let me know which one you prefer. I think AmericanDreamExterior2 which is the first one I sent is the best option, but both beat the current image. Have a nice day. Jibreel23 ( talk) 17:09, 26 June 2022 (UTC)
Hi. I looked at the article for Miles Morales' Earth-616 counterpart and I am pleased with the information about him becoming Ultimatum. While he does have the size-shifting abilities of Earth-1610 Giant-Man, I was wondering if you will be able to make a mentioning on how his costume resembles a hybrid of the outfits worn by Earth-1610 Giant-Man and Earth-1610 Iron Man as well as sporting a shield similar to Earth-1610 Captain America as you are the main editor for Miles Morales page. I'm just making a suggestion here. -- Rtkat3 ( talk) 17:21, 30 June 2022 (UTC)
I have proposed a merger of the Western Electric (tube manufacturer) article into the main Western Electric article. I have posted a thread on Talk:Western Electric (tube manufacturer) to discuss the proposed merger. I invite everyone's thoughts on the idea. Garagepunk66 ( talk) 20:30, 30 June 2022 (UTC)
Hey, sorry that I didn't see your notices when you posted them to my talk page. Real life has a way of dragging me away these days.
Is there still something you wanted to talk with me about, or have things resolved? - jc37 17:26, 18 July 2022 (UTC)
@ Jc37, BOZ, and Daniel Case: Okay, I'm sorry it took me so long to respond. The importance of approaching this matter the right way led me to struggle with figuring out how to compose it properly, and since I have less time now to devote to Wikipedia, it got put on the back burner.
Originally, I wanted to consult with you regarding a confict that arose in comics-related articles, but now it seems I could use your counsel regarding a separate, unrelated matter, in which an admin had threatened to block me for a practice with which I've approached uncited material in articles, one that was reached as a compromise with other editors on Jimmy Wales' discussion page back in May 2009. It invovles fact-tagging and adding the refimprove tag to articles, and then, if no one sources the material after a month, moving it to the article's talk page, in a collapsible section, complete with a diff showing precisely where that material was in the article.
This practice has resulted in other editors' being spurred to fix the uncited material in some cases, as with the Western Electric article. and I myself do this as well. Sometimes, when moving uncited mateiral to the talk page, I'll find sources for some of it, as with the ones I added to the top of the Properties section of polyvinyl chloride, or I'll do far more, as with the entire section I rewrote, complete with a dozen or so cites in phonograph record.
However, in the section just below this one, editor Kvng challenged me on this, falsely accusing me of "bullying" for requiring citations for material. I asked him how this constituted "bullying", and he has refused to respond, presumably because he knows this accusation is bogus. Then, administrator Johnuniq joined that discussion, saying I should not remove uncited material that is "probably good" or "potentially good", unless I know that it is "unverifiable". I repeatedly asked him point-blank how one can make a determination that material is "probably good", "potentially good", or "unverifiable", and he steadfastly refused to answer this question, while simultaneously claiming that I refused to address his points, even though I responded to each and every one (with the exception of one point about diffs that I missed). He has now threatened to block me if I remove uncited material again.
I tried asking Jimbo Wales about this in a discussion I recently started on his talk page here. My question to you (and feel free to voice it there), is that threat legitimate, if the practice is one I reached with other editors 13 years ago, and with which no one has ever had a problem? Would you support such a block? Nightscream ( talk) 14:53, 4 August 2022 (UTC)
And based just on what I've read below, I don't see grounds for a block but I would want to look at all the diffs and such involved ... Daniel Case ( talk) 15:10, 6 August 2022 (UTC)
You've said in an edit comment, Tagging helps people such as myself identify, at a glance, uncited passages. This helps editors spot places that need cites, and also helps me spot the places that typically need to be moved to the talk page a month after I fact-tag them.
Please see
WP:TAGBOMB. It is not difficult to identify uncited material - the notes stand out. The articles where you're peppering the text with {{
fact}} already have a {{
Ref improve}} at the top.
You also indicate here that your intent is to return a month later and remove this content. I appreciate WP:V technically allows you to challenge unsourced material and then eventually remove it if no one steps up and provides a reference. However many of the statements you've tagged are not controversial (tape available in reel, cartridge and cassette; motors are used to move tape) and I would consider such a campaign WP:DISRUPT and WP:DEMOLISH. Please be patient; There are WP:NODEADLINES. ~ Kvng ( talk) 15:00, 29 July 2022 (UTC)
@ Kvng: You may like to see User talk:Jimbo Wales#Moving uncited material to talk pages after a month.
@Nightscream: Please only remove text if you are sure that the text is unverifiable or WP:UNDUE or a WP:BLP violation. Systematically removing probably good text would be highly disruptive. It would be useful to see some diffs of removals. Removals such as diff1 (unsourced birth date) are fine, but diff2 is dubious given what Jeff Bittiger proclaims. The latter might need fixing but my guess is that the claimed facts would be well known to people familiar with the sport and probably easily verifiable for someone with access to the right sources. If wanting to improve the article, a request at WT:WikiProject Baseball would be a good start. Johnuniq ( talk) 09:37, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
Thank you for reviewing my request at Maggie Thompson and making changes to the article. However, while you removed the information about her being a librarian from the body of the article, you missed the place where it was causing an actual problem -- the introductory sentence. Might you review that again and remove the "former librarian" descriptor, if you deem appropriate? Thank you, Nat Gertler ( talk) 20:46, 1 August 2022 (UTC)
I have requested a third opinion over this matter. U-Mos ( talk) 22:06, 3 August 2022 (UTC)
Thanks for having a look at my overhaul of the Francis Barraud page and making some edits. I read your note on the article's talk page about "Uncited material in need of citations" and made sure I had a lot of sources before I edited the page! QueenPuck ( talk) 19:26, 10 August 2022 (UTC)
Which is weird. Doug Weller talk 10:23, 11 August 2022 (UTC)
I have reported this. ~ Kvng ( talk) 14:08, 19 August 2022 (UTC)
There is currently a discussion at
Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you.
Fountains of Bryn Mawr (
talk)
11:53, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion involving you at
Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring regarding a possible violation of Wikipedia's policy on
edit warring. Thank you.
86.181.0.154 (
talk)
13:08, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
I just happened to notice this edit on the Phonograph record page where you changed from DMY to MDY dates and I was wondering what your reasoning was for making the change? Gusfriend ( talk) 13:17, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
"the closest thing to an absolute", e.g. not an absolute but close to it, or nearly without exception. I wouldn't use absolute to mean anything over than... well absolute. -- LCU ActivelyDisinterested ∆ transmissions∆ ° co-ords° 16:13, 8 September 2022 (UTC)
I'm still interested in understanding how you see your deletion/moves of uncited uncontroversial material from articles as improvements to the article or the encyclopedia. I know you have claimed to have answered this and I tried to summarize as your vision is that deleting stalled work-in-progress leaves us with a high-quality encyclopedia
to which you objected to without elaborating.
I'm generally trying to understand who you (and the others with similar position – ToBeFree, Black Kite, Daniel Case, Levivich, Trey Maturin, nableezy) expect to come around and restore with citations and how an article with uncited material that's been reviewed by experts is worse than an article with holes blown in it. ~ Kvng ( talk) 18:35, 12 September 2022 (UTC)
Do not add unsourced material from your personal experience, because that would make Wikipedia a primary source of that materialand
Consensus is more important than policy. I will have a look at the rest of this later when I have more time.
|reason=
. The question your editing pattern raises is what should we do with then do with existing material of this nature. My solution is to
systematically review it. In reviewing, I treat existing material just like a new contribution as described above. IMO, this is best done in place in the article to avoid
branching issues and where the work in progress is clearly visible and collaboration can occur. Deleting it from article and trying to work on it on the talk page, in addition to being cumbersome, tends to create disengagement and
WP:FOC issues.How is the casual reader — or the rest of the editing community, for that matter — supposed to be able to vet material on the basis of the self-stated expertise of editors?
uncontroversial statements ... unsourced for years. The article that has received the most discussion, Radio has about 0.5 million pageviews per year, is, on average, edited every day or so, and has, over it's 20 year lifespan, received over 6000 edits by about 3000 editors. There is robust and generally productive discussion and explicit evidence of comprehensive reviews by editors in the talk page archives. I just don't see Daniel's story holding up over that long with so many visitors and competent editors involved. I acknowledge that there is no proof here. The word I used was evidenced. I think the evidence supports my assertion that the uncited material is well reviewed and that editors, for whatever reasons, have been uninterested in doing the work of adding the citations you have recently demanded. You are welcome use this same evidence to try and support your position. What do you make of it? It may well be that you are the first to come through and try to strictly enforce (your interpretation of) policy here but my point is that a very large number of editors and readers do not see the same problems with this article that you do. ~ Kvng ( talk) 14:56, 16 September 2022 (UTC)
I not only give a big +1 to Nightscream's response, I would again point you to the broader world, where a few years ago Michael Gove, then a high-ranking member of the British cabinet, famously said in response to being told that there was no expert opinion supporting his contention that Britain would be better off outside the EU that "the people of this country have had enough of experts". Yes, if you read the article, there's a bit of qualification on that quote since a journalist interrupted him before he got out the whole sentence, but I think the reason the truncated version has had such a long life is as much because there was a lot of agreement with it as because it confirmed Remainers' belief that despite Gove's Oxford degree he was a philistine who built his political base on appeals to ignorance.
And the former aspect of that is ably sustained by your admission above that you can't be bothered to look up the basic facts all experts know and, therefore, the article doesn't need them. I knew there was such contempt abroad for experts, and on an intellectual level I understood why but I never saw this or felt this on a personal, emotional level until reading this.
If, as is said to the point of hammy cliché, " knowledge is power", then we are remiss in not doing the necessary algebraic substitution with some other overused-but-no-less-true aphorisms. Most pertinent in the present context would be " with great knowledge comes great responsibility", and I think that understanding that to mean that those with that great knowledge are nevertheless not relieved of the duty of explaining to the layperson where they might acquaint themselves with the basics of the knowledge expounded upon, even though that might be understood in expert discourse.
Indeed, as the linked article shows by illustration, we are not unaware of this principle as it applies to what we have chosen to do here. I would say, in fact, that Wikipedia as a project has in fact if it has accomplished anything made the connection between knowledge and power too explicit to deny, as those of us who have made it a dedication and commitment to create and improve content here in so many ways cannot, at this point, be unaware of how much credibility we have with the global online public and therefore the power of shaping how the world sees itself. (Of course, those of us who had to read a lot of Foucault in graduate school already knew this, but as I said before it's one thing to know something by learning it and another thing to know something by living or being it). Daniel Case ( talk) 18:26, 16 September 2022 (UTC)
Experts, such as myself, don't enjoy spending time researching things they already knowyet. I should get to this next and will try to address your point in that too. I don't have enough time right now. Does anyone have any comments on what I have responded to? ~ Kvng ( talk) 20:09, 16 September 2022 (UTC)
Experts, such as myself, don't enjoy spending time researching things they already know.I'll stand my this statement for myself. I only have circumstantial evidence (see
uncontroversial statements...) that it applies to others. I believe WP:VOLUNTEER grants me the right to do the work I am interested in and pass over other chores. This is a crowdsourced project and monitoring my watchlist, I frequently see others happy to pick up slack I've left.
Do not add unsourced material from your personal experience). I'm not always right about these things and my best wiki experiences are when I'm wrong and learn something new through my own curiosity-induced research or interaction with other editors or reading other editors' contributions. I'm not sure why Daniel is having such a visceral reaction to my neglect of his priorities/responsibilities for article improvement but I don't think it is appropriate to ascribe this sort of behavior to experts in general, it's just how I personally choose to approach my Wikipedia hobby. I suggest you look at the positives here. I know that we disagree about whether deleting uncontroversial uncited material is positive but I invite you to assess my other contributions. I may not be doing the work that you consider urgent but I hope we can agree that most of my contributions are improving the encyclopedia. ~ Kvng ( talk) 16:02, 18 September 2022 (UTC)
If the project has matured to the point that we're requiring perfection...Much of this I've already touched on in my
How is the casual reader...response above. I think we can generally agree on WP:FA as a goal. The question and disagreement is about how and when are we going to get there? It is my impression that the WP:GA and WP:FA bars are cleared by heroic editors who enjoy this sort of accomplishment. My hat is off to them. I believe, however, that this level of editor talent is in short supply especially in technical subject areas - WP:COMP has 7 FA and 178 GA out of 58,109 articles assigned to the project.
Hello Nightscream, the copy editor User:AngusWOOF is reviewing a draft of a new DCAU article I am trying to have published. He has directed me to seek the feedback of people like you who have edited the DCAU page in the past to provide feedback as to whether or not you believe the content I included is something Wikipedia readers interested in the DCAU would find value in. Mainly the copy editing team would like feedback on the table depicting chronological narrative viewing order. I would appreciate it if you can review my inquiry and the draft article and inform if you think the content is of value to those who may be reading about or wanting to watch the DCAU. This will help get the copy editing team the feedback they need to proceed with either an approve or decline decision. Thanks for your feedback.
JGott85
Inquiry to fellow DC Fans based on Copy Editors Feedback:
Draft Article attempting to be published
Draft:DC Animated Universe (DCAU) Media Continuity, Canonicity, and Viewing Order JGott85 ( talk) 01:04, 15 September 2022 (UTC)
Hi, you have posted to User talk:86.181.0.154 - are you still watching it? -- Redrose64 🌹 ( talk) 21:51, 22 September 2022 (UTC)
Hi, an article that already has a global "citation needed" tag doesn't need additional cn tags after every sentence, see WP:TAGBOMBING -- FMSky ( talk) 00:16, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect
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WCQuidditch
☎
✎
01:31, 17 October 2022 (UTC)
I thought it was easier to revert back to your clean version, but if you think this version is better, feel free to revert me. We're both restoring one of your edits. And thanks for the cleanup. Star Mississippi 20:21, 18 October 2022 (UTC)
Thanks for your notes re: recent edits to Bill Sienkiewicz's page. To answer your question, I'm using Wikipedia's automated citation generator. If fields are left out, that's an error in that system that I didn't catch. GimmeChoco44 ( talk) 10:17, 4 November 2022 (UTC)
I didn't know "update" as post-edit message was fraudolent, I thought it was just an easy and immediate way to say that an article was edited adding missing content. But thanks for telling me, now I know. 151.34.74.45 ( talk) 06:44, 20 November 2022 (UTC)
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Hi! You reverted my edit that I made on Jonny Fairplay. I’m not here to argue, since I’m a young editor (both in terms of irl and account age), but I am curious. If Ancestry is an unreliable source, why is it offered as apart of the Wikipedia Library project? Does that mean the unreliability status on Ancestry is wrong, or Wikipedia is offering bad sources as apart of their own program? Cornmazes ( talk) 00:39, 8 December 2022 (UTC)
Hi,
I got here by clicking on your user box ("If I made a mistake...') You made an edit on this page that reverted my edits and doesn't seem to match with your edit summary. Did you mean to revert my edit (which was done to fix references)?
Ira
Ira Leviton ( talk) 17:56, 19 December 2022 (UTC)
BOZ (
talk) is wishing you a
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Spread the holiday cheer by adding {{ subst: User:Flaming/MC2008}} to their talk page with a friendly message.
I'm wishing you a Merry Christmas, because that is what I celebrate. Feel free to take a "Happy Holidays" or "Season's Greetings" if you prefer. :) BOZ ( talk) 23:16, 22 December 2022 (UTC)
![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
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Thryduulf (
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11:05, 12 January 2022 (UTC)
Found this while investigating. Passing along. [User Contribs: Tyciol]( https://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Special:Contributions/Tyciol&target=Tyciol) >04:12, 4 January 2010 diff hist −3 User talk:Tyciol unfortunately I don't know how to disable bots like this from posting, but in the case of the Ivan Brandon article, it looks like User:Nightscream created that out of a redirect I made, plz tell him — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2603:7080:F201:54D7:D560:A0F:48D1:C989 ( talk)
Hi!
Noticed your massive revert of uncited material for latest appearance and the need for secondary sources. Well, sometimes it is as simple as just checking the web site, IF they have been in the comic before, but it will take some time clicking to verify... :) Garfield's fan wiki has records of the dates, I noticed now, but, it's a wikipage, and not reliable. It doesn't seem that the requested information is (was) collected anywere else than these two sources. /info/en/?search=List_of_Garfield_characters
-- Kejo ( talk) 10:59, 15 January 2022 (UTC)
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A7V2 (
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03:35, 31 January 2022 (UTC)
Nightscream, how do you know that I don't edit here often, which I popup on Wikipedia at anytime when I just learned from the news? Maybe you shouldn't say how many edits I've made on Wikipedia since I started editing here, so does other users when you noted them about their edits that often came up without citing a reliable source or two, because what you said to me and them was creepy. —Also, since you
manually undo-ed my hat-note edit, why do you think those words should not be included in that hat-note as you said it's "grammatically incoherent"? Is that edit too wordy for you on that hat-note in that article? Between "Chumlee" and "Chumley", these names are often distinguished with a similar pronunciation that is not to be confused with
. --
Allen (
talk /
ctrb)
21:55, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
This article is about the reality television personality. For other subjects named "Chumley", which is not to be confused with, see Chumley. For the American entrepreneur, see Austin Russell (entrepreneur).
Hey there hope this is the best way to reach you. I understand your policy edits however I'd like to discuss this. I think my edit is better for the page because theres not too many gossipy details. As for the peacock phrase I believe legendary is the correct word. As for slang I think theres an exception to use eyed since we're discussing real estate development. I think its better to leave so much detail about city councils vision for the mall off Wikipedia as it frankly violates policy. Mentioning town council is also much more than im trying to convey. Perhaps we come to a conclusion together before we update again. Thanks! Complexhistorian ( talk) 17:53, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
I strongly disagree with you mentioning the city council. Its tabloid like and violates policy its one point of view that the center has been impacted by the economy. As for the hilton hotel mention, the article states they were certainly trying to build it and its their opinion its not likely to build. This is the only real development on the site. As for your other comments, I understand, I think its important we dont go into too much detail as well as bringing up city council, it suggests the center could be struggling which seems incorrect. I think we either keep it simple and mention just the store closing, or we include any developments that doesnt undermine the current success of the mall. Complexhistorian ( talk) 20:30, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
It wasnt my intention to remove that source hence me not mentioning it. I am strongly opposed to your edit, bringing up city council because of one store closure is too much. Mentioning city council firmly suggests the entire mall is in jeopardy which isnt true. Complexhistorian ( talk) 22:22, 23 February 2022 (UTC) 22:20, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
How come you are insisting I'm motivated by promoting the mall? As editors we have a responsibility, your edit simply suggests the entire mall is failing which is irresponsible as well as incorrect. Complexhistorian ( talk) 22:40, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
This isnt complicated like you seem to be making it, I disagree with your edit why arnt you willing to work with me? I think lord and taylors closure and the city councils comments have little to do with each other, the mall is successful so I disagree with their statements. I think its best to leave it as lord and taylor closed, using that particular quote along with lord and taylor paints this mall as failing, to be fair you shouldnt use this quote. Complexhistorian ( talk) 23:26, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
Hi there. My issue is with the way the sentence regarding Uncle Ben is worded, "Although to date the main timeline version of the MCU has not explicitly mentioned his Uncle Ben, Spider-Man: Homecoming wirter John Francis Daley stated that Peter's reference in that film to all that May had been through was a reference to Ben". That sounds so sloppy, "all May had been through" - meaning what? Perhaps this line would be better served under Characterization as opposed to Fictional character biography, since Uncle Ben has not actually been mentioned in the MCU as of yet. There is already a reference to him in that section - "The MCU depiction of Peter Parker omits explicit reference to Uncle Ben, whose death was a significant event both in the comic books and in previous film series. The one exception is "What If... Zombies?!", in which a variant of Parker mentions everyone who has died in his life in the universe seen in that episode". It would be pretty simple to expand on this by adding in John Francis Daley's information. Thoughts? Thanks.
Thanks for reviewing my edits to Western Electric. I am sorry that you had to revert my edits for lack of references. I am a retired telecommunications engineer with employment experience at Bell Telephone Laboratories, or, simply, Bell Labs, (which designed products manufactured by Western Electric), GTE Lenkurt, BNR Inc. (designed products manufactured by Northern Telecom) and Wiltron. I am new to editing Wikipedia. If you approve of what I wrote, and I think you do except for the stated reason, I'll add references. Most of the references will be to articles already in Wikipedia, for example Hush-A-Phone, acoustic couplers (I'll change modem to coupler), GTE Lenkurt (as Lenkurt Electric Company), Wiltron (Anritsu article), Ericofon, Independent Telephone Company and United States Telecom Association (USITA at the time of Western Electric's dominance). I don't know if I should just edit the article, and let the page be reverted if necessary, or submit changes for review. If I edit the article, I'll change a little at a time.
Some of these referenced articles really need expansion and I'd like to contribute. Of particular interest, Lenkurt Electric Company lacks information about its years after acquisition by GTE, when I was an employee. Some of what I wrote is from my engineering and personal experience. I need to either leave it out or maybe there is a way to reference it in accordance with Wikipedia guidelines. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Robert Sled ( talk • contribs) 17:23, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
I noticed that you reverted my wiki-linking of Die!namite on the Red Sonja page as WP:EASTEREGG. I respectfully disagree with this labelling and would love to hear your reasoning behind using it. The Die!namite link was not a piped link to an unrelated subject, rather it was a link to a dedicated page for that subject that currently is a redirect (instead of a redlink destination). Thank you for your time and I look forward to better understanding your reasoning. The Ghost of Art Toys Past ( talk) 07:12, 3 March 2022 (UTC)
![]() |
The Working Man's Barnstar |
17 years and more of contributions should be applauded and that you haven't had one of these yet means I can pop in and have the honour of awarding it to you. Long may you carry on! Hiding T 14:28, 3 March 2022 (UTC) |
Hi Nightscream. Just to let you know I've deleted a lot from this article. You're edit on the 14th duplicated everything starting at the Hispanics and crime section. I believe all the over changes you made are still present, but you may want to check. Thanks LCU ActivelyDisinterested ∆ transmission∆ ° co-ords° 14:59, 9 March 2022 (UTC)
Hello - my name is Susan Gerbic (Sgerbic) and I'm writing to you because at some point you joined Wikipedia:WikiProject Skepticism. This might have been months ago - or even years ago. With the best of intentions the project was created years ago, and sadly like many WikiProjects has started to go dormant. A group of us are attempting to revitalize the Skepticism project, already we have begun to clean up the main page and I've just redone the participant page. No one is in charge of this project, it is member directed, which might have been the reason it almost went dormant. We are attempting to bring back conversations on the talk page and have two subprojects as well, in the hopes that it might spark involvement and a way of getting to know each other better. One was created several years ago but is very well organized and a lot of progress was made, Wikipedia:WikiProject Skepticism/Skeptical organisations in Europe. The other I created a couple weeks ago, it is very simple and has a silly name Wikipedia:WikiProject Skepticism/Skepticism Stub Sub-Project Project (SSSPP). This sub-project runs from March 1 to June 1, 2022. We are attempting to rewrite skepticism stubs and add them to this list. As you can see we have already made progress.
The reason I'm writing to you now is because we would love to have you come back to the project and become involved, either by working on one of the sub-projects, proposing your own (and managing it), or just hanging out on the talk page getting to know the other editors and maybe donate some of your wisdom to some of the conversations. As I said, no one is in charge, so if you have something in mind you would like to see done, please suggest it on the talk page and hopefully others will agree. Please add the project to your watchlist, update your personal user page showing you are a proud member of WikiProject Skepticism. And DIVE in, this is what the work list looks like [5] frightening at first glance, but we have already started chipping away at it.
The Wikipedia:WikiProject Skepticism/Participants page has gone though a giant change - you may want to update your information. And of course if this project no longer interests you, please remove your name from the participant list, we would hate to see you go, but completely understand.
Thank you for your time, I hope to edit with you in the future. Sgerbic ( talk) 07:20, 17 March 2022 (UTC)
Hello, In your recent edit to remove uncited material, you seem to have also deleted this photo: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Common_tern_in_flight_with_Manhattan_in_the_background.jpg. Just wanted to check if that was intentional. Shantham11 ( talk)
Dear Nightscream I have a request for you for the article horror film on Wikipedia can you restore the 2010s section and the 2020s section? 107.122.97.8 03:40, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
Someone merged the 2010s section and the 2020s section on the horror film article for no reason can you bring the 2010s section and the 2020s section back? NightscreamJr. ( talk) 17:41, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
Undo the 2010s to present section and bring back the 2010s section and the 2020s section. NightscreamJr. ( talk) 17:44, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
Don't worry about the History of horror films article I've already restored the 2010s and 2020s on there all you have to do is restore the 2010s section and the 2020s section on the horror film article that's all. NightscreamJr. ( talk) 18:19, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
Why not? NightscreamJr. ( talk) 18:23, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
I'm trying to tell you you just make it so hard for me to understand you see I'm Autistic. NightscreamJr. ( talk) 18:28, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
I'm on Wikipedia now now we can talk. NightscreamJr. ( talk) 18:30, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
I'm not trying to mock you I want to be your successor. NightscreamJr. ( talk) 18:31, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
Thank you for recently editing the Tim Vigil article, especially as your use of {{ Refimprove}} is far superior to my multitude of {{ Citation needed}} inputs. As for your comment on my use of {{ Unreliable source?}}, please bear in mind that it isn't questioning if the source itself as reliable rather it indicates that "it is questionable whether the source used is reliable for supporting the statement" (emphasis mine). I'm not sure if a webpage on Tim Vigil's Filmography that simply lists "Faust: Love of the Damned (2001); Role: Book as Source Material" is really enough to support "The book's main storyline, Faust: Love of the Damned, was adapted by director Brian Yuzna as the 2001 film of the same name."
And, out of curiosity, where did the phrase "demonic-themed series" come from? Without a source, I'd personally say it breaks WP:NEUTRAL.
Also, while I fully understand how it can easily happen, if you are going to name a user in your comment ("Remove uncited material by The Ghost of Art Toys Past") make sure that they are indeed the source of said uncited material; in this instance, the uncited material all pre-dated my first edit on the page, though I should've removed it as you did instead of trying to tighten the wording and adding {{ Citation needed}} templates. The Ghost of Art Toys Past ( talk) 15:53, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
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Note that any non-free images not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described in section F5 of the criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. -- B-bot ( talk) 18:00, 16 April 2022 (UTC)
You're using some old fashioned talk page, however that is fine. Your edits aren't though. I propose a debate. Pictureperfect2 ( talk) 01:52, 20 April 2022 (UTC)
Look, you are big on assuming things. I don't mind trying to come to some agreement however keep in mind anyone could be talking to you. I could be a head of state or something. You go on with guessing who knows more than whom. Keep in mind that commas are over used all over the place. If you want to spend time writing great ledes and getting articles up to par, fine. Stop with the dob debate and leave it out a 2nd time. Let's see what we can come to agree on. Pictureperfect2 ( talk) 05:04, 20 April 2022 (UTC)
Think about this idea a minute. Hardly anyone on here agrees on certain things. Maybe we could do more than a little good if we try to figure out what we agree on and do that. Maybe you can concur with me on the dob thing and repeat one or two items at most minus the dob. As for the lede or lead which Wikipedia is nonsensical in explaining and far from consistent... you have something called a news (newspaper or tv, etc. lede) which is also called a lead paragraph. Supposedly according to this site you don't introduce new information but you do. The lede on here has the individual's family names, place of birth, education information, and usually one more factoid. That is specifically new info. Pictureperfect2 ( talk) 05:29, 20 April 2022 (UTC)
Please do not add any uncited materials from each articles to the talk pages. Unless, keep the removal if "unsourced", please read Wikipedia:Verifiability. -- 49.150.104.127 ( talk) 02:42, 27 April 2022 (UTC)
@ 49.150.104.127: I will continue to source, fact tag, remove, or move to the talk page uncited material as I've been doing for the many years I've been here, per the very policy you cite, and discussions with other members of the community. Nightscream ( talk) 02:45, 27 April 2022 (UTC)
Hey Nightscream. I'm planning to some ce on Peter Parker (Marvel Cinematic Universe)'s lede and appearances section. I was wondering what was the result/consensus of the discussion you made over at WP Comics regarding Parker as the kid from IM2? – SirDot ( talk) 05:49, 30 April 2022 (UTC)
Hey there. I reverted your edit and explained it thoroughly but wanted to say I'd be open to discuss it on the talk page. But to add to what I wrote, there is no report saying Zach Braff and Pugh are no longer together, so the "as of" isn't necessary here. And Braff directing Pugh in a short film is also as suitable for the "career" section as it is for "personal life", so I was curious why you didn't move that along with the other materials. Thanks! KyleJoan talk 21:17, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
For the record I know Vevmo is reliable in that they usually are right with the information they provide. I just know that they don't pass Wikipedia's definition of WP:RS, due to it being a user-generated source. I was trying to update older articles with RS's since Vevmo usually is only available source early on before official announcements are out there. The birthday I removed as I couldn't find a RS for that anywhere, and often is the case for lesser known BLPs. WikiVirus C (talk) 13:59, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
It actually isn't "According to a 2010 study in the Journal of the Society for the Anthropology of Europe." The conclusion vis a vis Fascist Italy comes from them (and they say it's ineffective, not that the result is mixed, as the article currently reads), but the conclusion w.r.t. the U.S.S.R. comes from Kristy Ironside, and the conclusion w.r.t. U.S. tax policy comes from Hayley Fisher. All three papers tell completely different stories. That's why the paragraph started off by saying "mixed" and doesn't reference a single paper explicitly. Fephisto ( talk) 01:49, 5 June 2022 (UTC)
You have been reverting some of my edits on the American Dream Meadowlands article, so I want to consult you before going through with my next edit. I want to change the image in the infobox from the entrance to the parking garage to one of these two images.
Let me know which one you prefer. I think AmericanDreamExterior2 which is the first one I sent is the best option, but both beat the current image. Have a nice day. Jibreel23 ( talk) 17:09, 26 June 2022 (UTC)
Hi. I looked at the article for Miles Morales' Earth-616 counterpart and I am pleased with the information about him becoming Ultimatum. While he does have the size-shifting abilities of Earth-1610 Giant-Man, I was wondering if you will be able to make a mentioning on how his costume resembles a hybrid of the outfits worn by Earth-1610 Giant-Man and Earth-1610 Iron Man as well as sporting a shield similar to Earth-1610 Captain America as you are the main editor for Miles Morales page. I'm just making a suggestion here. -- Rtkat3 ( talk) 17:21, 30 June 2022 (UTC)
I have proposed a merger of the Western Electric (tube manufacturer) article into the main Western Electric article. I have posted a thread on Talk:Western Electric (tube manufacturer) to discuss the proposed merger. I invite everyone's thoughts on the idea. Garagepunk66 ( talk) 20:30, 30 June 2022 (UTC)
Hey, sorry that I didn't see your notices when you posted them to my talk page. Real life has a way of dragging me away these days.
Is there still something you wanted to talk with me about, or have things resolved? - jc37 17:26, 18 July 2022 (UTC)
@ Jc37, BOZ, and Daniel Case: Okay, I'm sorry it took me so long to respond. The importance of approaching this matter the right way led me to struggle with figuring out how to compose it properly, and since I have less time now to devote to Wikipedia, it got put on the back burner.
Originally, I wanted to consult with you regarding a confict that arose in comics-related articles, but now it seems I could use your counsel regarding a separate, unrelated matter, in which an admin had threatened to block me for a practice with which I've approached uncited material in articles, one that was reached as a compromise with other editors on Jimmy Wales' discussion page back in May 2009. It invovles fact-tagging and adding the refimprove tag to articles, and then, if no one sources the material after a month, moving it to the article's talk page, in a collapsible section, complete with a diff showing precisely where that material was in the article.
This practice has resulted in other editors' being spurred to fix the uncited material in some cases, as with the Western Electric article. and I myself do this as well. Sometimes, when moving uncited mateiral to the talk page, I'll find sources for some of it, as with the ones I added to the top of the Properties section of polyvinyl chloride, or I'll do far more, as with the entire section I rewrote, complete with a dozen or so cites in phonograph record.
However, in the section just below this one, editor Kvng challenged me on this, falsely accusing me of "bullying" for requiring citations for material. I asked him how this constituted "bullying", and he has refused to respond, presumably because he knows this accusation is bogus. Then, administrator Johnuniq joined that discussion, saying I should not remove uncited material that is "probably good" or "potentially good", unless I know that it is "unverifiable". I repeatedly asked him point-blank how one can make a determination that material is "probably good", "potentially good", or "unverifiable", and he steadfastly refused to answer this question, while simultaneously claiming that I refused to address his points, even though I responded to each and every one (with the exception of one point about diffs that I missed). He has now threatened to block me if I remove uncited material again.
I tried asking Jimbo Wales about this in a discussion I recently started on his talk page here. My question to you (and feel free to voice it there), is that threat legitimate, if the practice is one I reached with other editors 13 years ago, and with which no one has ever had a problem? Would you support such a block? Nightscream ( talk) 14:53, 4 August 2022 (UTC)
And based just on what I've read below, I don't see grounds for a block but I would want to look at all the diffs and such involved ... Daniel Case ( talk) 15:10, 6 August 2022 (UTC)
You've said in an edit comment, Tagging helps people such as myself identify, at a glance, uncited passages. This helps editors spot places that need cites, and also helps me spot the places that typically need to be moved to the talk page a month after I fact-tag them.
Please see
WP:TAGBOMB. It is not difficult to identify uncited material - the notes stand out. The articles where you're peppering the text with {{
fact}} already have a {{
Ref improve}} at the top.
You also indicate here that your intent is to return a month later and remove this content. I appreciate WP:V technically allows you to challenge unsourced material and then eventually remove it if no one steps up and provides a reference. However many of the statements you've tagged are not controversial (tape available in reel, cartridge and cassette; motors are used to move tape) and I would consider such a campaign WP:DISRUPT and WP:DEMOLISH. Please be patient; There are WP:NODEADLINES. ~ Kvng ( talk) 15:00, 29 July 2022 (UTC)
@ Kvng: You may like to see User talk:Jimbo Wales#Moving uncited material to talk pages after a month.
@Nightscream: Please only remove text if you are sure that the text is unverifiable or WP:UNDUE or a WP:BLP violation. Systematically removing probably good text would be highly disruptive. It would be useful to see some diffs of removals. Removals such as diff1 (unsourced birth date) are fine, but diff2 is dubious given what Jeff Bittiger proclaims. The latter might need fixing but my guess is that the claimed facts would be well known to people familiar with the sport and probably easily verifiable for someone with access to the right sources. If wanting to improve the article, a request at WT:WikiProject Baseball would be a good start. Johnuniq ( talk) 09:37, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
Thank you for reviewing my request at Maggie Thompson and making changes to the article. However, while you removed the information about her being a librarian from the body of the article, you missed the place where it was causing an actual problem -- the introductory sentence. Might you review that again and remove the "former librarian" descriptor, if you deem appropriate? Thank you, Nat Gertler ( talk) 20:46, 1 August 2022 (UTC)
I have requested a third opinion over this matter. U-Mos ( talk) 22:06, 3 August 2022 (UTC)
Thanks for having a look at my overhaul of the Francis Barraud page and making some edits. I read your note on the article's talk page about "Uncited material in need of citations" and made sure I had a lot of sources before I edited the page! QueenPuck ( talk) 19:26, 10 August 2022 (UTC)
Which is weird. Doug Weller talk 10:23, 11 August 2022 (UTC)
I have reported this. ~ Kvng ( talk) 14:08, 19 August 2022 (UTC)
There is currently a discussion at
Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you.
Fountains of Bryn Mawr (
talk)
11:53, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion involving you at
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86.181.0.154 (
talk)
13:08, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
I just happened to notice this edit on the Phonograph record page where you changed from DMY to MDY dates and I was wondering what your reasoning was for making the change? Gusfriend ( talk) 13:17, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
"the closest thing to an absolute", e.g. not an absolute but close to it, or nearly without exception. I wouldn't use absolute to mean anything over than... well absolute. -- LCU ActivelyDisinterested ∆ transmissions∆ ° co-ords° 16:13, 8 September 2022 (UTC)
I'm still interested in understanding how you see your deletion/moves of uncited uncontroversial material from articles as improvements to the article or the encyclopedia. I know you have claimed to have answered this and I tried to summarize as your vision is that deleting stalled work-in-progress leaves us with a high-quality encyclopedia
to which you objected to without elaborating.
I'm generally trying to understand who you (and the others with similar position – ToBeFree, Black Kite, Daniel Case, Levivich, Trey Maturin, nableezy) expect to come around and restore with citations and how an article with uncited material that's been reviewed by experts is worse than an article with holes blown in it. ~ Kvng ( talk) 18:35, 12 September 2022 (UTC)
Do not add unsourced material from your personal experience, because that would make Wikipedia a primary source of that materialand
Consensus is more important than policy. I will have a look at the rest of this later when I have more time.
|reason=
. The question your editing pattern raises is what should we do with then do with existing material of this nature. My solution is to
systematically review it. In reviewing, I treat existing material just like a new contribution as described above. IMO, this is best done in place in the article to avoid
branching issues and where the work in progress is clearly visible and collaboration can occur. Deleting it from article and trying to work on it on the talk page, in addition to being cumbersome, tends to create disengagement and
WP:FOC issues.How is the casual reader — or the rest of the editing community, for that matter — supposed to be able to vet material on the basis of the self-stated expertise of editors?
uncontroversial statements ... unsourced for years. The article that has received the most discussion, Radio has about 0.5 million pageviews per year, is, on average, edited every day or so, and has, over it's 20 year lifespan, received over 6000 edits by about 3000 editors. There is robust and generally productive discussion and explicit evidence of comprehensive reviews by editors in the talk page archives. I just don't see Daniel's story holding up over that long with so many visitors and competent editors involved. I acknowledge that there is no proof here. The word I used was evidenced. I think the evidence supports my assertion that the uncited material is well reviewed and that editors, for whatever reasons, have been uninterested in doing the work of adding the citations you have recently demanded. You are welcome use this same evidence to try and support your position. What do you make of it? It may well be that you are the first to come through and try to strictly enforce (your interpretation of) policy here but my point is that a very large number of editors and readers do not see the same problems with this article that you do. ~ Kvng ( talk) 14:56, 16 September 2022 (UTC)
I not only give a big +1 to Nightscream's response, I would again point you to the broader world, where a few years ago Michael Gove, then a high-ranking member of the British cabinet, famously said in response to being told that there was no expert opinion supporting his contention that Britain would be better off outside the EU that "the people of this country have had enough of experts". Yes, if you read the article, there's a bit of qualification on that quote since a journalist interrupted him before he got out the whole sentence, but I think the reason the truncated version has had such a long life is as much because there was a lot of agreement with it as because it confirmed Remainers' belief that despite Gove's Oxford degree he was a philistine who built his political base on appeals to ignorance.
And the former aspect of that is ably sustained by your admission above that you can't be bothered to look up the basic facts all experts know and, therefore, the article doesn't need them. I knew there was such contempt abroad for experts, and on an intellectual level I understood why but I never saw this or felt this on a personal, emotional level until reading this.
If, as is said to the point of hammy cliché, " knowledge is power", then we are remiss in not doing the necessary algebraic substitution with some other overused-but-no-less-true aphorisms. Most pertinent in the present context would be " with great knowledge comes great responsibility", and I think that understanding that to mean that those with that great knowledge are nevertheless not relieved of the duty of explaining to the layperson where they might acquaint themselves with the basics of the knowledge expounded upon, even though that might be understood in expert discourse.
Indeed, as the linked article shows by illustration, we are not unaware of this principle as it applies to what we have chosen to do here. I would say, in fact, that Wikipedia as a project has in fact if it has accomplished anything made the connection between knowledge and power too explicit to deny, as those of us who have made it a dedication and commitment to create and improve content here in so many ways cannot, at this point, be unaware of how much credibility we have with the global online public and therefore the power of shaping how the world sees itself. (Of course, those of us who had to read a lot of Foucault in graduate school already knew this, but as I said before it's one thing to know something by learning it and another thing to know something by living or being it). Daniel Case ( talk) 18:26, 16 September 2022 (UTC)
Experts, such as myself, don't enjoy spending time researching things they already knowyet. I should get to this next and will try to address your point in that too. I don't have enough time right now. Does anyone have any comments on what I have responded to? ~ Kvng ( talk) 20:09, 16 September 2022 (UTC)
Experts, such as myself, don't enjoy spending time researching things they already know.I'll stand my this statement for myself. I only have circumstantial evidence (see
uncontroversial statements...) that it applies to others. I believe WP:VOLUNTEER grants me the right to do the work I am interested in and pass over other chores. This is a crowdsourced project and monitoring my watchlist, I frequently see others happy to pick up slack I've left.
Do not add unsourced material from your personal experience). I'm not always right about these things and my best wiki experiences are when I'm wrong and learn something new through my own curiosity-induced research or interaction with other editors or reading other editors' contributions. I'm not sure why Daniel is having such a visceral reaction to my neglect of his priorities/responsibilities for article improvement but I don't think it is appropriate to ascribe this sort of behavior to experts in general, it's just how I personally choose to approach my Wikipedia hobby. I suggest you look at the positives here. I know that we disagree about whether deleting uncontroversial uncited material is positive but I invite you to assess my other contributions. I may not be doing the work that you consider urgent but I hope we can agree that most of my contributions are improving the encyclopedia. ~ Kvng ( talk) 16:02, 18 September 2022 (UTC)
If the project has matured to the point that we're requiring perfection...Much of this I've already touched on in my
How is the casual reader...response above. I think we can generally agree on WP:FA as a goal. The question and disagreement is about how and when are we going to get there? It is my impression that the WP:GA and WP:FA bars are cleared by heroic editors who enjoy this sort of accomplishment. My hat is off to them. I believe, however, that this level of editor talent is in short supply especially in technical subject areas - WP:COMP has 7 FA and 178 GA out of 58,109 articles assigned to the project.
Hello Nightscream, the copy editor User:AngusWOOF is reviewing a draft of a new DCAU article I am trying to have published. He has directed me to seek the feedback of people like you who have edited the DCAU page in the past to provide feedback as to whether or not you believe the content I included is something Wikipedia readers interested in the DCAU would find value in. Mainly the copy editing team would like feedback on the table depicting chronological narrative viewing order. I would appreciate it if you can review my inquiry and the draft article and inform if you think the content is of value to those who may be reading about or wanting to watch the DCAU. This will help get the copy editing team the feedback they need to proceed with either an approve or decline decision. Thanks for your feedback.
JGott85
Inquiry to fellow DC Fans based on Copy Editors Feedback:
Draft Article attempting to be published
Draft:DC Animated Universe (DCAU) Media Continuity, Canonicity, and Viewing Order JGott85 ( talk) 01:04, 15 September 2022 (UTC)
Hi, you have posted to User talk:86.181.0.154 - are you still watching it? -- Redrose64 🌹 ( talk) 21:51, 22 September 2022 (UTC)
Hi, an article that already has a global "citation needed" tag doesn't need additional cn tags after every sentence, see WP:TAGBOMBING -- FMSky ( talk) 00:16, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect
WABC News and has thus listed it
for discussion. This discussion will occur at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 October 17#WABC News until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion.
WCQuidditch
☎
✎
01:31, 17 October 2022 (UTC)
I thought it was easier to revert back to your clean version, but if you think this version is better, feel free to revert me. We're both restoring one of your edits. And thanks for the cleanup. Star Mississippi 20:21, 18 October 2022 (UTC)
Thanks for your notes re: recent edits to Bill Sienkiewicz's page. To answer your question, I'm using Wikipedia's automated citation generator. If fields are left out, that's an error in that system that I didn't catch. GimmeChoco44 ( talk) 10:17, 4 November 2022 (UTC)
I didn't know "update" as post-edit message was fraudolent, I thought it was just an easy and immediate way to say that an article was edited adding missing content. But thanks for telling me, now I know. 151.34.74.45 ( talk) 06:44, 20 November 2022 (UTC)
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00:27, 29 November 2022 (UTC)
Hi! You reverted my edit that I made on Jonny Fairplay. I’m not here to argue, since I’m a young editor (both in terms of irl and account age), but I am curious. If Ancestry is an unreliable source, why is it offered as apart of the Wikipedia Library project? Does that mean the unreliability status on Ancestry is wrong, or Wikipedia is offering bad sources as apart of their own program? Cornmazes ( talk) 00:39, 8 December 2022 (UTC)
Hi,
I got here by clicking on your user box ("If I made a mistake...') You made an edit on this page that reverted my edits and doesn't seem to match with your edit summary. Did you mean to revert my edit (which was done to fix references)?
Ira
Ira Leviton ( talk) 17:56, 19 December 2022 (UTC)
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