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The Babur is also know as the author of three famous books. Can anyone mention the names of these three book. His autobiography is mentioned in the article but with no name. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 39.48.157.168 ( talk) 12:24, 22 February 2015 (UTC)
I observe that the account of Babur's ancestry is not consistent with the image shown alongside it. Maproom ( talk) 11:21, 12 June 2015 (UTC) According to the book Genghis Khan And The Making Of The Modern World by John Weatherford, Babur was the descendant of Genghis Khan rather than Timur Lane. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Avinder bindra ( talk • contribs) 11:10, 14 June 2017 (UTC)
After the battle Babur occupied Delhi and Agra, seated himself on the throne of Lodi and laid the foundation of the Mughal Rule in India, but it was yet to be established and Babur was yet to become the ruler of India, as new contenders for the throne like, Rana Sanga, who rose to challenge his rule.into English. It might as well be Uzbek for all the sense it makes. This GAN seems to have been rushed and I'm not happy. - Sitush ( talk) 19:37, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
In 1495, at twelve years old, Babur became the ruler of Farghana, present-day Uzbekistan, after Umar Sheikh Mirza died "while tending pigeons in an ill-constructed dovecote that toppled into the ravine below the palace"., well, we seem to be quoting without in-text attribution, perhaps because the cited source appears to be itself unattributed. Worse, the source says Babur was 11, not 12. - Sitush ( talk) 19:50, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
Babur's relations with the Safavids began when Ali Mirza Safavi ventured to meet Babur at Samarqand in order to maintain good relations that would last even after the Ottoman's reached out to Babur.is near gibberish. Calvin999, if you are going to take part in the GA Cup then I'm probably have to keep an eye on it myself. - Sitush ( talk) 20:16, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
In 1505, because of the low revenue his new mountain kingdom generated, Babur undertook his first expedition to India and had written before in his memoirs, "My desire for Hindustan had been constant. It was in the month of Shaban, the Sun being in Aquarius, that we rode out of Kabul for Hindustan"makes no sense. I can't see the relevant pages of Eraly but what we are saying is that he previously wrote his desire had been constant, which in the context of the entire sentence appears to be the incorrect tense. - Sitush ( talk) 20:25, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
Babur started for Lahore, Punjab, in 1524 but found that Daulat Khan Lodi had been driven out by forces sent by Ibrahim Lodi.[40] When Babur arrived at Lahore, the Lodi army marched out and was his army was routed.doesn't read well. When did he find out? Presumably after he got there, so when did he get there (as opposed to setting off for the place). For example, we could say something like: "Babur arrived at Lahore in 1524. He found that Daulat Khan Lodi had been driven from the city by the forces of Ibrahim Lodi, which then routed those of Babur." - Sitush ( talk) 20:48, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
@ Aristophanes68: thanks for the various suggestions above. I think I am going to clock-off shortly but they look good based on my quick skim through them. - Sitush ( talk) 21:52, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
Two paragraphs in I'm already convinced that it should be delisted. I'm sorry, but there are so many problems in the lede, which is after all the first thing the reader sees, that this can't stand. And apparently there are other problems (signaled in the two sections above)... Now, I'm interested in a proposed plan of action, or I will delist it myself. Mind you, Sitush pointed the article out to me, but he did so because I claim, rightly or wrongly, a certain expertise in English; I do not know who wrote, nominated, or passed this article and it's not an issue for me. Let's see if we can keep this at GA, which is the point of GAR. Copyedits first. Drmies ( talk) 21:46, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
I looked at the opening paragraph and that "series of setbacks" leapt out me - what's that doing in a GA's lead? I'll tell you what I understand procedure to be. The GA reviewer, Calvin999, doesn't seem to be a bad sort and the review might be over-brief, but it's not an obvious drive-by that can warrant a quick undo and reset. If Calvin is okay with undoing the GA review and putting it back on the queue, then our problem is resolved. Otherwise somebody needs to fix the article ASAP or it needs a reassessment. I don't really have enough subject knowledge to be able to do it myself (if you don't know the subject, how do you know if a GA candidate is "broad in coverage" or "focused"?) so I'd support a reassessment. Sitush seems like an ideal candidate to kick it off. You want an individual reassessment, a community reassessment is only really done if delisting is likely to be controversial (eg: Nick Griffin to pick a random example) Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 09:38, 13 June 2015 (UTC)
i am very disappointed by the repeated disruptive edits by User:Sitush. The dispute here is about using Babur's autobiography as the primary reference for his sexual proclivities. Sitush instead prefers to use Abraham Eraly (who is depending in turn on Babur's autobiography) as the primary and only reference on this issue. What Sitush is suggesting is against all cannons of historical scholarship. Wherever a primary historical source like Babur's autobiography is available on a particular historical issue it should be used (particularly about something like his sexual proclivity)--this is what every student of history is taught. (Of course the primary source can be supplemented by secondary sources.) Sitush's insinuation that Babur's autobiography may have become "corrupted" is not supported by any mainstream historian. Soham321 ( talk) 22:01, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
There has been discussion on the talk page here and here, as well as at other venues, eg: here, from which it is clear that several people are not satisfied that this article meets the standards expected of a GA. Some of the issues have been fixed already but others remain. These include:
Sorting this lot out may take some time as it will require a review of the major uncited sources, such as those listed in the further reading section. - Sitush ( talk) 10:53, 13 June 2015 (UTC)
At that time, north India was ruled by Ibrahim Lodi of the Lodi dynasty. In 1524, he got an invitation from his uncle Daulat Khan Lodi to overthrow Ibrahim and establish his rule.in which the referents for the pronouns were unclear. Since then the senetences have been rewritten
In 1524, Daulat Khan Lodi invited his nephew, Babur, to overthrow Ibrahim and become ruler.Can someone verify that Daulat Khan Lodi was the uncle of Babur and not Ibrahim? It's possible, but wanted to be sure.
Unlike his father, he had ascetic tendencies and did not have any great interest in women....Babur treated them and his other women relatives well., especially without attributing them to the source. Also the section (like others) has numerous prose issues, eg
...who was was five years old);
He had one daughter by her, Fakhr-un-Nissa, who died as an infant within a year in 1500 AD.)
In the period 1506-08, Babar married four women, being...)
I've just reverted a bunch of edits made over the last few hours. Some of them were indubitable copyright violations, some were taking us off at great tangents from the main thrust of this article, some were awkward phrasing, and old sources such as Stanley Lane-Poole were being introduced when we have a host of top-notch sources that are still not cited. Basically, we were going backwards, further away from GA standard rather than closer to it. Sorry. - Sitush ( talk) 05:48, 14 June 2015 (UTC)
I notice that two sections created by me, 'Goodwill towards Hindus' and 'Clash with Mewat', have been deleted by User:Sitush. The reason Sitush gives is 'copyright violation'. However, i have been careful to always summarize or paraphrase the material from the reference i have given and i have fully sourced the edits i made to the given reference. In my talk page, where Sitush has seen it fit to give me a warning, i have told him that i am challenging him to give a single edit of mine where i am giving material from the reference verbatim. Given this, i am a little surprised why the entire material should be deleted instead of Sitush spending some time making necessary modifications (perhaps further paraphrasing or summarizing). Soham321 ( talk) 05:49, 14 June 2015 (UTC)
Thus, when Rani Padmavati, the widow of Rana Sanga, sought Babur's support for her son Vikramjit, who was in conflict with his brother, Babur received her envoy with honor.(using the wrong spelling of "honor", by the way); Chandra says "Thus, Rani Padmavati, the widow of Rana Sanga, sought Babur's support for her son Vikramjit, who was being harassed by his brother. ... Babur received the Rani's envoy with honour." - Sitush ( talk) 06:13, 14 June 2015 (UTC)
Indian articles tend to follow British English spellings, if only because India's English derives from the colonial period. This article is a mess of inconsistencies and I have been trying to fix those: it is a slow job and it is not helped if people introduce new examples as fast as I clean up the old ones. - Sitush ( talk) 06:26, 14 June 2015 (UTC)
And now i notice Sitush has deleted all my edits. The Battle of Chanderi, for instance is a part of Babur's life. He took part in this battle. Sitush has seen it fit to delete this entire section, along with several other sections. May i respectfully suggest that what Sitush is trying to do is this: WP:Ownership_of_articles Soham321 ( talk) 05:55, 14 June 2015 (UTC) Whether it is appropriate to allow someone who has an obviously poor opinion about Indians--with views that smack of racism-- to have the final word on Babur (or indeed on any India related article) is something to be pondered upon: https://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons/Noticeboard&diff=prev&oldid=666714511 Soham321 ( talk) 07:04, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
The article's history is not on your side with regard to this accusations, Sitush. It doesn't look good. — Calvin999 11:29, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
Babur considers Central Asia his homeland and had shown that he hates india.
This is not to cause some Indians anger Alexis Ivanov ( talk) 00:20, 29 October 2015 (UTC)
I wouldn't call it hate, more of a disdain. 72.53.146.173 ( talk) 22:33, 28 February 2016 (UTC)
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I like to add this template to this page but not sure what the problem is. This page is part of a series on Islam in South Asia. Please help! Why it is not useful? 65.95.136.96 ( talk) 14:53, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
I'm addding the individual reigns for each of Babur's realms to the infobox. My idea was that it made it a bit easier to understand in comparison to what we had previously. But considering the sheer number of times that Babur gained and lost a kingdom... I guess what I added could look a bit excessive. Any thoughts anyone? Alivardi ( talk) 14:24, 17 January 2019 (UTC)
The infobox states that Babur was the ruler of Kabul between 1504-1526. Does this mean that he lost Kabul in 1526? -- Kautilya3 ( talk) 12:15, 8 February 2019 (UTC)
Just wanted to get some thoughts on whether Babur's inclusion in the category is appropriate. I'm wondering if it gives undue weight to his sexuality, since the only basis is a single mention in his autobiography.
[1]
Alivardi (
talk) 19:30, 18 September 2019 (UTC)
Babur was an Islamic invader and there are huge evidences to prove this fact. Anyone who wish to challenge this theory can discuss the matter here. ArifSingh99999 ( talk) 14:17, 5 December 2020 (UTC)
Isn't this a fringe theory? Let's consider it's true, how did Babur's parent knew PIE words? Beshogur ( talk) 20:12, 3 February 2021 (UTC)
It appears that Chagatai Turkic was largely a literary language, rather than a spoken language. See [2] and Language Policy in the Soviet Union pages 143-144. Additionally, it is listed as the written register of Uzbek and Uyghur on Wikipedia's Literary language page. This explains why Babur could understand and use the language, but probably means he didn't speak it. However, I realise that many sources say he did speak the language, which seems to be a miscategorisation of Turkic languages in general, exacerbated by the mutual intelligibility of many languages in the Turkic family. So I think this detail should be omitted from the Babur's wikipedia page until solid resources can paint a better picture. Gowhk8 ( talk) 10:56, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
Genuinely what's this? Why do we even use these spellings? Beshogur ( talk) 08:00, 29 May 2021 (UTC)
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Please add 3rd wife of Babur as "Maham Begum" : Reference: " /info/en/?search=Humayun" Wikicontributer255 ( talk) 16:25, 30 August 2021 (UTC)
Under heading "religious policy", (after 54th citation)
"The violence of Babur in the 1520s was witnessed by Guru Nanak, who commented upon it in four hymns.[citation needed]"
we can find citation here: https://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Babar_Vani which states these hymns can be found in following pages (of the standard recension) of Guru Granth Sahib 360 417-418 722-723 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.145.83.64 ( talk) 16:06, 4 March 2022 (UTC)
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Category:Founding_monarchs Monkeyboi111 ( talk) 06:26, 3 April 2022 (UTC)
What is the source of the Portrait of Babur in the infobox?
It appears it might not be the right persons image.
Sultans of the South: Arts of India's Deccan Courts, 1323–1687 pg 24.
It states that this portrait is of Mirza Muhammad Hakim.
If this is true then this image can be used as the next portrait. >>>
Extorc.
talk 15:36, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
The article says Meanwhile, a rebellion back home, approximately 350 kilometres (220 mi) away, amongst nobles who favoured his brother, robbed him of Fergana.
The cited source is
this and these pages dont talk about Babur. It appears it talks about Ahmad Shah Abdali. In fact it doesn't appear this book talks about Babur at all.
Kindly look into this. >>>
Extorc.
talk 09:14, 19 April 2022 (UTC)
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Typographic error, Babur married Aisha in 1499, not 1599. Bitter Almonds ( talk) 19:39, 2 May 2022 (UTC)
Dear @ Beshogur:. You've reverted my removal of a verse added by @ Visioncurve: with the helpful edit summary "part of his poetry". Assuming that Babur wrote a lot of poetry, and that each verse of all the poetry he wrote is a "part of his poetry", does it follow that we include the entire collected works of Babur in this article? Or is there something special about the verse that Visioncurve has included? Please note that the "something special" should be sourced to reliable sources and not based on what you or Visioncurve consider special. I await a reasonable explanation from the two of you. -- RegentsPark ( comment) 12:35, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
I have reverted the addition of the verse, because (a) it is WP:UNDUE,, and, more importantly, (b) it is provided with insufficient context. If you check the source, Balabanlilar discusses the verse in the context of Babur's possibly insincere, but definitely politically beneficial, adoption of religious piety. In particular, she prefaces the quote with "the verse has been described as ‘more like a ritualistic observance or an ex post facto religious legitimation than a cry of religious triumph.'" and notes that this garb of defender-of-faith is a small part of the collection that, having served its purpose, is soon dropped as Babur "again turned his thoughts to the conquest of territory, rather than the destruction of infidels and Hindus". Excluding this context and presenting the verse as if the language it was composed in, is the relevant issue is IMO (possibly, unintentionally) misleading and misrepresent the cited source. Abecedare ( talk) 15:09, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
A special importance given to Islam by Baburis an accurate summary of what Balabanlilar and Michael Fisher say? It's definitely not.
@ Beshogur and Sutyarashi: The source published by Infobase publishing is not reliable. I found this RSN discussion Wikipedia:Reliable_sources/Noticeboard/Archive_87#Infobase_Publishing. Aman Kumar Goel ( Talk) 10:35, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
@ User:Aman.kumar.goel Anyways, replaced the reference. Have you got any question on it too? Sutyarashi ( talk) 10:46, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
It seems like you don't have enough information on the topic. To start with, just read the articles on Mughal empire, Barlas and Timur. Sutyarashi ( talk) 11:03, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
Encyclopedia Britannica also points to his Barlas Mongol origin, which makes it credible enough for inclusion. Sutyarashi ( talk)
@ User:Beshogur explain your stand on how Encyclopedia Britannica isn't reliable source. Make reference to any past RFC on this. Otherwise your edit will be considered a breach of WP:3RR and treated as such. Sutyarashi ( talk) 02:03, 19 February 2023 (UTC)
Oh God, there is one week betweeb my 4th edit. And meantime, you got reveerted by another user as well. Beshogur ( talk) 05:37, 19 February 2023 (UTC)
I removed it. Also we need am alternative for Britannica in this case, it's used below again. Beshogur ( talk) 05:44, 19 February 2023 (UTC)
@ User:HistoryofIran and User:Beshogur ok, come on, i maybe quite bad at citing but isn't this an established fact that Babur was fron Barlas tribe and it was one of the Mongol tribes which migrated to central Asia? He was also a descendant of Timur, a Turko-Mongol conqueror? Sutyarashi ( talk)
@HistoryofIran please refer where i removed any already existing reference? Talking about my past edits, it was explicitly mentioned afterwards that they had Arab ancestry, and there was not really any reference about their being Persian. Sutyarashi ( talk) 07:02, 19 February 2023 (UTC)
To be precise, he was neither a Turk nor a Mongol, but a Turko Mongol. Sutyarashi ( talk) 10:17, 19 February 2023 (UTC)
please refer where i removed any already existing reference?
Talking about my past edits, it was explicitly mentioned afterwards that they had Arab ancestry, and there was not really any reference about their being Persian.
ok, come on, i maybe quite bad at citing but isn't this an established fact that Babur was fron Barlas tribe and it was one of the Mongol tribes which migrated to central Asia?
timur also claimed to be the descendant of Genghis Khan. I think, this should be added. XK2aXsmasherX ( talk) 17:34, 27 March 2023 (UTC)
The paragraph about the Babri Masjid in the Death and Legacy section is mostly full of Hindu nationalist sources and talking points. It's a contentious issue right now, but setting aside the biased narrative, it's mostly irrelevant to Babur's construction (especially the part about how the Supreme Court ruled it was okay to build the temple) and only shows the one POV. Yeep yorp ( talk) 16:47, 27 January 2024 (UTC)
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Babur was one of the History good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. | ||||||||||||||||||||||
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The Babur is also know as the author of three famous books. Can anyone mention the names of these three book. His autobiography is mentioned in the article but with no name. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 39.48.157.168 ( talk) 12:24, 22 February 2015 (UTC)
I observe that the account of Babur's ancestry is not consistent with the image shown alongside it. Maproom ( talk) 11:21, 12 June 2015 (UTC) According to the book Genghis Khan And The Making Of The Modern World by John Weatherford, Babur was the descendant of Genghis Khan rather than Timur Lane. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Avinder bindra ( talk • contribs) 11:10, 14 June 2017 (UTC)
After the battle Babur occupied Delhi and Agra, seated himself on the throne of Lodi and laid the foundation of the Mughal Rule in India, but it was yet to be established and Babur was yet to become the ruler of India, as new contenders for the throne like, Rana Sanga, who rose to challenge his rule.into English. It might as well be Uzbek for all the sense it makes. This GAN seems to have been rushed and I'm not happy. - Sitush ( talk) 19:37, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
In 1495, at twelve years old, Babur became the ruler of Farghana, present-day Uzbekistan, after Umar Sheikh Mirza died "while tending pigeons in an ill-constructed dovecote that toppled into the ravine below the palace"., well, we seem to be quoting without in-text attribution, perhaps because the cited source appears to be itself unattributed. Worse, the source says Babur was 11, not 12. - Sitush ( talk) 19:50, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
Babur's relations with the Safavids began when Ali Mirza Safavi ventured to meet Babur at Samarqand in order to maintain good relations that would last even after the Ottoman's reached out to Babur.is near gibberish. Calvin999, if you are going to take part in the GA Cup then I'm probably have to keep an eye on it myself. - Sitush ( talk) 20:16, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
In 1505, because of the low revenue his new mountain kingdom generated, Babur undertook his first expedition to India and had written before in his memoirs, "My desire for Hindustan had been constant. It was in the month of Shaban, the Sun being in Aquarius, that we rode out of Kabul for Hindustan"makes no sense. I can't see the relevant pages of Eraly but what we are saying is that he previously wrote his desire had been constant, which in the context of the entire sentence appears to be the incorrect tense. - Sitush ( talk) 20:25, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
Babur started for Lahore, Punjab, in 1524 but found that Daulat Khan Lodi had been driven out by forces sent by Ibrahim Lodi.[40] When Babur arrived at Lahore, the Lodi army marched out and was his army was routed.doesn't read well. When did he find out? Presumably after he got there, so when did he get there (as opposed to setting off for the place). For example, we could say something like: "Babur arrived at Lahore in 1524. He found that Daulat Khan Lodi had been driven from the city by the forces of Ibrahim Lodi, which then routed those of Babur." - Sitush ( talk) 20:48, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
@ Aristophanes68: thanks for the various suggestions above. I think I am going to clock-off shortly but they look good based on my quick skim through them. - Sitush ( talk) 21:52, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
Two paragraphs in I'm already convinced that it should be delisted. I'm sorry, but there are so many problems in the lede, which is after all the first thing the reader sees, that this can't stand. And apparently there are other problems (signaled in the two sections above)... Now, I'm interested in a proposed plan of action, or I will delist it myself. Mind you, Sitush pointed the article out to me, but he did so because I claim, rightly or wrongly, a certain expertise in English; I do not know who wrote, nominated, or passed this article and it's not an issue for me. Let's see if we can keep this at GA, which is the point of GAR. Copyedits first. Drmies ( talk) 21:46, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
I looked at the opening paragraph and that "series of setbacks" leapt out me - what's that doing in a GA's lead? I'll tell you what I understand procedure to be. The GA reviewer, Calvin999, doesn't seem to be a bad sort and the review might be over-brief, but it's not an obvious drive-by that can warrant a quick undo and reset. If Calvin is okay with undoing the GA review and putting it back on the queue, then our problem is resolved. Otherwise somebody needs to fix the article ASAP or it needs a reassessment. I don't really have enough subject knowledge to be able to do it myself (if you don't know the subject, how do you know if a GA candidate is "broad in coverage" or "focused"?) so I'd support a reassessment. Sitush seems like an ideal candidate to kick it off. You want an individual reassessment, a community reassessment is only really done if delisting is likely to be controversial (eg: Nick Griffin to pick a random example) Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 09:38, 13 June 2015 (UTC)
i am very disappointed by the repeated disruptive edits by User:Sitush. The dispute here is about using Babur's autobiography as the primary reference for his sexual proclivities. Sitush instead prefers to use Abraham Eraly (who is depending in turn on Babur's autobiography) as the primary and only reference on this issue. What Sitush is suggesting is against all cannons of historical scholarship. Wherever a primary historical source like Babur's autobiography is available on a particular historical issue it should be used (particularly about something like his sexual proclivity)--this is what every student of history is taught. (Of course the primary source can be supplemented by secondary sources.) Sitush's insinuation that Babur's autobiography may have become "corrupted" is not supported by any mainstream historian. Soham321 ( talk) 22:01, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
There has been discussion on the talk page here and here, as well as at other venues, eg: here, from which it is clear that several people are not satisfied that this article meets the standards expected of a GA. Some of the issues have been fixed already but others remain. These include:
Sorting this lot out may take some time as it will require a review of the major uncited sources, such as those listed in the further reading section. - Sitush ( talk) 10:53, 13 June 2015 (UTC)
At that time, north India was ruled by Ibrahim Lodi of the Lodi dynasty. In 1524, he got an invitation from his uncle Daulat Khan Lodi to overthrow Ibrahim and establish his rule.in which the referents for the pronouns were unclear. Since then the senetences have been rewritten
In 1524, Daulat Khan Lodi invited his nephew, Babur, to overthrow Ibrahim and become ruler.Can someone verify that Daulat Khan Lodi was the uncle of Babur and not Ibrahim? It's possible, but wanted to be sure.
Unlike his father, he had ascetic tendencies and did not have any great interest in women....Babur treated them and his other women relatives well., especially without attributing them to the source. Also the section (like others) has numerous prose issues, eg
...who was was five years old);
He had one daughter by her, Fakhr-un-Nissa, who died as an infant within a year in 1500 AD.)
In the period 1506-08, Babar married four women, being...)
I've just reverted a bunch of edits made over the last few hours. Some of them were indubitable copyright violations, some were taking us off at great tangents from the main thrust of this article, some were awkward phrasing, and old sources such as Stanley Lane-Poole were being introduced when we have a host of top-notch sources that are still not cited. Basically, we were going backwards, further away from GA standard rather than closer to it. Sorry. - Sitush ( talk) 05:48, 14 June 2015 (UTC)
I notice that two sections created by me, 'Goodwill towards Hindus' and 'Clash with Mewat', have been deleted by User:Sitush. The reason Sitush gives is 'copyright violation'. However, i have been careful to always summarize or paraphrase the material from the reference i have given and i have fully sourced the edits i made to the given reference. In my talk page, where Sitush has seen it fit to give me a warning, i have told him that i am challenging him to give a single edit of mine where i am giving material from the reference verbatim. Given this, i am a little surprised why the entire material should be deleted instead of Sitush spending some time making necessary modifications (perhaps further paraphrasing or summarizing). Soham321 ( talk) 05:49, 14 June 2015 (UTC)
Thus, when Rani Padmavati, the widow of Rana Sanga, sought Babur's support for her son Vikramjit, who was in conflict with his brother, Babur received her envoy with honor.(using the wrong spelling of "honor", by the way); Chandra says "Thus, Rani Padmavati, the widow of Rana Sanga, sought Babur's support for her son Vikramjit, who was being harassed by his brother. ... Babur received the Rani's envoy with honour." - Sitush ( talk) 06:13, 14 June 2015 (UTC)
Indian articles tend to follow British English spellings, if only because India's English derives from the colonial period. This article is a mess of inconsistencies and I have been trying to fix those: it is a slow job and it is not helped if people introduce new examples as fast as I clean up the old ones. - Sitush ( talk) 06:26, 14 June 2015 (UTC)
And now i notice Sitush has deleted all my edits. The Battle of Chanderi, for instance is a part of Babur's life. He took part in this battle. Sitush has seen it fit to delete this entire section, along with several other sections. May i respectfully suggest that what Sitush is trying to do is this: WP:Ownership_of_articles Soham321 ( talk) 05:55, 14 June 2015 (UTC) Whether it is appropriate to allow someone who has an obviously poor opinion about Indians--with views that smack of racism-- to have the final word on Babur (or indeed on any India related article) is something to be pondered upon: https://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons/Noticeboard&diff=prev&oldid=666714511 Soham321 ( talk) 07:04, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
The article's history is not on your side with regard to this accusations, Sitush. It doesn't look good. — Calvin999 11:29, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
Babur considers Central Asia his homeland and had shown that he hates india.
This is not to cause some Indians anger Alexis Ivanov ( talk) 00:20, 29 October 2015 (UTC)
I wouldn't call it hate, more of a disdain. 72.53.146.173 ( talk) 22:33, 28 February 2016 (UTC)
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I like to add this template to this page but not sure what the problem is. This page is part of a series on Islam in South Asia. Please help! Why it is not useful? 65.95.136.96 ( talk) 14:53, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
I'm addding the individual reigns for each of Babur's realms to the infobox. My idea was that it made it a bit easier to understand in comparison to what we had previously. But considering the sheer number of times that Babur gained and lost a kingdom... I guess what I added could look a bit excessive. Any thoughts anyone? Alivardi ( talk) 14:24, 17 January 2019 (UTC)
The infobox states that Babur was the ruler of Kabul between 1504-1526. Does this mean that he lost Kabul in 1526? -- Kautilya3 ( talk) 12:15, 8 February 2019 (UTC)
Just wanted to get some thoughts on whether Babur's inclusion in the category is appropriate. I'm wondering if it gives undue weight to his sexuality, since the only basis is a single mention in his autobiography.
[1]
Alivardi (
talk) 19:30, 18 September 2019 (UTC)
Babur was an Islamic invader and there are huge evidences to prove this fact. Anyone who wish to challenge this theory can discuss the matter here. ArifSingh99999 ( talk) 14:17, 5 December 2020 (UTC)
Isn't this a fringe theory? Let's consider it's true, how did Babur's parent knew PIE words? Beshogur ( talk) 20:12, 3 February 2021 (UTC)
It appears that Chagatai Turkic was largely a literary language, rather than a spoken language. See [2] and Language Policy in the Soviet Union pages 143-144. Additionally, it is listed as the written register of Uzbek and Uyghur on Wikipedia's Literary language page. This explains why Babur could understand and use the language, but probably means he didn't speak it. However, I realise that many sources say he did speak the language, which seems to be a miscategorisation of Turkic languages in general, exacerbated by the mutual intelligibility of many languages in the Turkic family. So I think this detail should be omitted from the Babur's wikipedia page until solid resources can paint a better picture. Gowhk8 ( talk) 10:56, 16 April 2021 (UTC)
Genuinely what's this? Why do we even use these spellings? Beshogur ( talk) 08:00, 29 May 2021 (UTC)
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Please add 3rd wife of Babur as "Maham Begum" : Reference: " /info/en/?search=Humayun" Wikicontributer255 ( talk) 16:25, 30 August 2021 (UTC)
Under heading "religious policy", (after 54th citation)
"The violence of Babur in the 1520s was witnessed by Guru Nanak, who commented upon it in four hymns.[citation needed]"
we can find citation here: https://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Babar_Vani which states these hymns can be found in following pages (of the standard recension) of Guru Granth Sahib 360 417-418 722-723 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.145.83.64 ( talk) 16:06, 4 March 2022 (UTC)
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Category:Founding_monarchs Monkeyboi111 ( talk) 06:26, 3 April 2022 (UTC)
What is the source of the Portrait of Babur in the infobox?
It appears it might not be the right persons image.
Sultans of the South: Arts of India's Deccan Courts, 1323–1687 pg 24.
It states that this portrait is of Mirza Muhammad Hakim.
If this is true then this image can be used as the next portrait. >>>
Extorc.
talk 15:36, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
The article says Meanwhile, a rebellion back home, approximately 350 kilometres (220 mi) away, amongst nobles who favoured his brother, robbed him of Fergana.
The cited source is
this and these pages dont talk about Babur. It appears it talks about Ahmad Shah Abdali. In fact it doesn't appear this book talks about Babur at all.
Kindly look into this. >>>
Extorc.
talk 09:14, 19 April 2022 (UTC)
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Typographic error, Babur married Aisha in 1499, not 1599. Bitter Almonds ( talk) 19:39, 2 May 2022 (UTC)
Dear @ Beshogur:. You've reverted my removal of a verse added by @ Visioncurve: with the helpful edit summary "part of his poetry". Assuming that Babur wrote a lot of poetry, and that each verse of all the poetry he wrote is a "part of his poetry", does it follow that we include the entire collected works of Babur in this article? Or is there something special about the verse that Visioncurve has included? Please note that the "something special" should be sourced to reliable sources and not based on what you or Visioncurve consider special. I await a reasonable explanation from the two of you. -- RegentsPark ( comment) 12:35, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
I have reverted the addition of the verse, because (a) it is WP:UNDUE,, and, more importantly, (b) it is provided with insufficient context. If you check the source, Balabanlilar discusses the verse in the context of Babur's possibly insincere, but definitely politically beneficial, adoption of religious piety. In particular, she prefaces the quote with "the verse has been described as ‘more like a ritualistic observance or an ex post facto religious legitimation than a cry of religious triumph.'" and notes that this garb of defender-of-faith is a small part of the collection that, having served its purpose, is soon dropped as Babur "again turned his thoughts to the conquest of territory, rather than the destruction of infidels and Hindus". Excluding this context and presenting the verse as if the language it was composed in, is the relevant issue is IMO (possibly, unintentionally) misleading and misrepresent the cited source. Abecedare ( talk) 15:09, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
A special importance given to Islam by Baburis an accurate summary of what Balabanlilar and Michael Fisher say? It's definitely not.
@ Beshogur and Sutyarashi: The source published by Infobase publishing is not reliable. I found this RSN discussion Wikipedia:Reliable_sources/Noticeboard/Archive_87#Infobase_Publishing. Aman Kumar Goel ( Talk) 10:35, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
@ User:Aman.kumar.goel Anyways, replaced the reference. Have you got any question on it too? Sutyarashi ( talk) 10:46, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
It seems like you don't have enough information on the topic. To start with, just read the articles on Mughal empire, Barlas and Timur. Sutyarashi ( talk) 11:03, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
Encyclopedia Britannica also points to his Barlas Mongol origin, which makes it credible enough for inclusion. Sutyarashi ( talk)
@ User:Beshogur explain your stand on how Encyclopedia Britannica isn't reliable source. Make reference to any past RFC on this. Otherwise your edit will be considered a breach of WP:3RR and treated as such. Sutyarashi ( talk) 02:03, 19 February 2023 (UTC)
Oh God, there is one week betweeb my 4th edit. And meantime, you got reveerted by another user as well. Beshogur ( talk) 05:37, 19 February 2023 (UTC)
I removed it. Also we need am alternative for Britannica in this case, it's used below again. Beshogur ( talk) 05:44, 19 February 2023 (UTC)
@ User:HistoryofIran and User:Beshogur ok, come on, i maybe quite bad at citing but isn't this an established fact that Babur was fron Barlas tribe and it was one of the Mongol tribes which migrated to central Asia? He was also a descendant of Timur, a Turko-Mongol conqueror? Sutyarashi ( talk)
@HistoryofIran please refer where i removed any already existing reference? Talking about my past edits, it was explicitly mentioned afterwards that they had Arab ancestry, and there was not really any reference about their being Persian. Sutyarashi ( talk) 07:02, 19 February 2023 (UTC)
To be precise, he was neither a Turk nor a Mongol, but a Turko Mongol. Sutyarashi ( talk) 10:17, 19 February 2023 (UTC)
please refer where i removed any already existing reference?
Talking about my past edits, it was explicitly mentioned afterwards that they had Arab ancestry, and there was not really any reference about their being Persian.
ok, come on, i maybe quite bad at citing but isn't this an established fact that Babur was fron Barlas tribe and it was one of the Mongol tribes which migrated to central Asia?
timur also claimed to be the descendant of Genghis Khan. I think, this should be added. XK2aXsmasherX ( talk) 17:34, 27 March 2023 (UTC)
The paragraph about the Babri Masjid in the Death and Legacy section is mostly full of Hindu nationalist sources and talking points. It's a contentious issue right now, but setting aside the biased narrative, it's mostly irrelevant to Babur's construction (especially the part about how the Supreme Court ruled it was okay to build the temple) and only shows the one POV. Yeep yorp ( talk) 16:47, 27 January 2024 (UTC)