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Archive 25 | ← | Archive 28 | Archive 29 | Archive 30 | Archive 31 | Archive 32 | → | Archive 35 |
![]() | This
edit request to
Turkey has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Add to the end of 'Foreign Relations':
On January 2, 2020, Turkey's parliament approved a bill to deploy troops into Libya to back UN-recognized government in the capital after forces loyal to Haftar, a rival administration, launched an offensive. The legislation passed with a 325-184 vote, however the details of the deployment have yet to be revealed in terms of amount and timing. [1] JosephGX ( talk) 17:47, 2 January 2020 (UTC)
References
? Annick Tremblay ( talk) 07:10, 4 January 2020 (UTC)
Indeed "?" What the hell are you typing? I thought this was the English Wiki. O_o No offense meant, but translation please? I can speak a few languages but, not that one. D: SageSolomon ( talk) 02:28, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Not moved per WP:SNOW ( non-admin closure) ( t · c) buidhe 19:35, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
Turkey → Türkiye – The country has changed its English name to Türkiye. 2600:6C5A:657F:D1F5:48D3:2853:9745:8762 ( talk) 03:20, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
@ Mortense I just double checked what this guy's archived post on this talk page was about and verified. Indeed, at [ link] it states that Trump has cancelled this delivery of the F-35 to Turkey because they bought S-400s. It would be a help if we could get a few more sources to confirm this, but I'd put forth we should edit this tidbit of info on the main page everywhere, as its been done already over at the F-35 article. Such as in that pic with the F-35 and a Airbus A400M Atlas, for example. Unless I am mistaken and the United States is still selling them to Turkey? Any comments or feedback from anyone is welcome. SageSolomon ( talk) 02:49, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
@ SageSolomon first of all yes that is true and that's why i've corrected the sentence 'Turkey is one of nine partner states in the F-35 JSF program ' to 'Turkey was one of nine partner states in the F-35 JSF program' but that dude Khirurg or whatever just blatantly reverts my edits. Secondly, although Turkey is no more a participant, it is still a good demonstration that the Turkish arms industry is capable of involving in such a program. That's why i think that we should keep that image. kazekagetr 12:52, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request to
Turkey has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Add to the end of 'Foreign Relations':
On January 2, 2020, Turkey's parliament approved a bill to deploy troops into Libya to back UN-recognized government in the capital after forces loyal to Haftar, a rival administration, launched an offensive. The legislation passed with a 325-184 vote, however the details of the deployment have yet to be revealed in terms of amount and timing. [1] JosephGX ( talk) 17:47, 2 January 2020 (UTC)
References
? Annick Tremblay ( talk) 07:10, 4 January 2020 (UTC)
Indeed "?" What the hell are you typing? I thought this was the English Wiki. O_o No offense meant, but translation please? I can speak a few languages but, not that one. D: SageSolomon ( talk) 02:28, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
@ Mortense I just double checked what this guy's archived post on this talk page was about and verified. Indeed, at [ link] it states that Trump has cancelled this delivery of the F-35 to Turkey because they bought S-400s. It would be a help if we could get a few more sources to confirm this, but I'd put forth we should edit this tidbit of info on the main page everywhere, as its been done already over at the F-35 article. Such as in that pic with the F-35 and a Airbus A400M Atlas, for example. Unless I am mistaken and the United States is still selling them to Turkey? Any comments or feedback from anyone is welcome. SageSolomon ( talk) 02:49, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
@ SageSolomon first of all yes that is true and that's why i've corrected the sentence 'Turkey is one of nine partner states in the F-35 JSF program ' to 'Turkey was one of nine partner states in the F-35 JSF program' but that dude Khirurg or whatever just blatantly reverts my edits. Secondly, although Turkey is no more a participant, it is still a good demonstration that the Turkish arms industry is capable of involving in such a program. That's why i think that we should keep that image. kazekagetr 12:52, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
It was very sad to see my labor just fade away in front of my eyes and being able to do nothing about it. I've requested a peer review. Feel free to help me out with it. Actually, rather than 'feel free', just 'help me out' feels more suitable since it's been nearly three years over my last edit and it seems that article needs a complete overhaul. kazekagetr 17:23, 24 January 2020 (UTC)
Hi, can you pls elaborate a little further? Thanks, Cinadon 36 19:14, 24 January 2020 (UTC)
User:Cinadon36 yea sure, i wanna make it GA again is all and it would be awesome if someone lend me a hand instead of blatantly reverting my changes and editing this article with a anti-Turkish POV. kazekagetr 08:04, 25 January 2020 (UTC)
Ok, trying to get an article to GA status is a noble cause. I will keep an eye. Be prepared to use the Talk page alot. Cinadon 36 08:43, 25 January 2020 (UTC)
@ Cinadon36 It cannot be PRO Turkey either. It has to state just facts, nothing more and nothing less. Neutral point of view. Not Anti Turkey, nor Pro Turkey. Just, Turkey. End of. There can not be any bias either way when creating Wikipedia articles, as this is an encyclopedia, not a political battleground. That being said, if there HAS been edits made that are anti-Turkey, I would agree, REMOVE them and make it as it should be with verifiable reliable sources and WP:NPOV. This is the sum of all human knowledge, not a platform for anyone's bias to be pushed to world at large. Please note, I am just stating this, and this is not a jab or an attack at anyone. Cinadon36 if you did work on this article in the past and gave it high marks, and someone came in a edited it and made it bias, and you are wishing to correct that, more power to you. :) Think Ive stated my two cents. I would have to learn far more about Turkey before I felt comfortable in assisting with editing this article, personally. There is SO much about this country for me to learn yet. D: Id want to do research on it first. Hit me up thy still wishes for assistance, anyway? I'll do my best? Haha. Apologies if this was abrupt or unwelcome. Turkey should be a well flushed out article, so I support the move to remove any bias of any kind. Happy editing! ^__^ SageSolomon ( talk) 02:25, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
Kazekage, please explain what consensus you are challenging and then don't remove the consensus details from the article until you gain new consensus to remove them. You are free to edit non-controversial aspects of the article, but the way you do it so far makes it difficult to restore consensus edits you are removing without also removing your non-controversial edits since you are making too many small edits which are interconnected to each other making it difficult to separate the details without reverting all of them. Please make edits in such a way, as to enable editors to separate the controversial aspects from the non-controversial ones. That way your edits will not be reverted en mass. Dr. K. 17:53, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
I'm challengig the consensus that @ User:Khirurg keep claiming 'non-negotiable'. I think he/she talks about that Kurdish insurgency at the lede. I though Wikipedia was an open platform that anyone could edit and negotiate about any article, well it seems that now people like him/her have some enforcing power that they decide what to negotiate or not :D. Imma make my edits again and keep that Kurdish insurgency on lede, but here is what i say. We don't get to see other terrorist groups such as RAF,ETA,IRA,Zeta and other cartels unless the country is engulfed in a civil war or they have a timeline which goes on in lede. But in our case, it directly jumps from Atatürk's reforms which were enacted in 1920s-1930s and creates a half-a-century jump in timeline and it looks like that we are in a civil war or something like that but in reality even the Kurdish dominated cities like Diyarbakır or Van have seen dramatic drops in insurgency in last decade. Also i would like to add that the 'consensuses' on that Armenian Genocide image and PKK terrorism on lede doesn't strike me as consensuses rather topics which were left in vague and were argued on with some constant POVs. kazekagetr 17:38, 27 January 2020 (UTC)
Oh yea also umm where have i insulted anyone, can you please adress to that @ User:Dr.K.? I've just said that I'am aware of your ethnicity and your POV towards Turkey. But i didin't happen to say anything on both of them? kazekagetr 17:48, 27 January 2020 (UTC)
I've already checked the preview discussion about this image and i don't see any 'consensus' to keep it, rather i see people reacting to it in a logical way that i side with.
I think that since it has an article and it's been mentioned in both in the lede and in the history section, there is no need for such an image. As a citizen of this country, i could provide you images about other topics which reflect this country's rich history, which this image cannot possibly present.
Also in the previous discussion, there is a perfect sentence by User:Buhedyar that i totally agree: 'No country page has "look at this sad picture of a person dying" photo. China doesn't, Germany doesn't, UK doesn't, Russia doesn't and why should Turkey have it?' We can also add third world countries like Myanmar to this list.
I've noticed that User:Dr.K. reverted my change and i've opened up this discussion in order to respect everybody's views&thoughts. I was not able to join the other discussion since the block was removed since 01/01/2020. Love you all. kazekagetr 16:47, 24 January 2020 (UTC)
Turkish Wikipedia is using this audio file instead of the one in this wiki. This has lyrics too and it had been produced by the Turkish presidency.
The page is semi-protected so I can't change it by myself.-- Yagizhan49 ( talk) 13:56, 14 February 2020 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request to
Turkey has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
the writer of the istiklal marşı is mehmet akif ersoy. Gungurbuz ( talk) 17:31, 11 March 2020 (UTC)
Joshua Project is not reliable see this. I wonder why it is still being sourced in the article? - Fylindfotberserk ( talk) 16:41, 28 March 2020 (UTC)
"During World War I, the Ottoman government committed genocides against its Armenian, Assyrian and Pontic Greek subjects." This statement can be found in Turkey Republic's wikipedia page but can't be found in Türkiye page. Giving the message that ancestors of Turkish folk did commit genocide without doubt even though Armenian genocide case is not accepted by majority of different sources. Stating the Ottomans commited genocide by counting on only one source and protecting that page is just gives the message that Wikipedia presents not reality but politically and emotionaly affected wiews of a subject. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gorkem20 ( talk • contribs) 12:46, 8 April 2020 (UTC)
in turkish page of this article there is no """Mehmet Akif Ersoy's""" in """"Mehmet Akif Ersoy's İstiklal Marşı" "The Independence March" """".
Mehmet Akif Ersoy's "İstiklal Marşı" "The Independence March" its should be this: "The Independence March" "İstiklal Marşı"
if it must be """Mehmet Akif Ersoy's""" in """"Mehmet Akif Ersoy's İstiklal Marşı" "The Independence March" """", then turkish page should be """Mehmet Akif Ersoy's""" in """"Mehmet Akif Ersoy's İstiklal Marşı" "The Independence March" """" too.
my english is very bad..
the main thing is: we should delete "Mehmet Akif Ersoy's" in english page
hope to understanding...
Modern primat (
talk)
19:53, 22 April 2020 (UTC)modern_primat
![]() | This
edit request to
Turkey has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Change nominal gdp per capita from $9,683 to $8,957. BlueTea97 ( talk) 06:48, 29 April 2020 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request to
Turkey has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
"During World War I, the Ottoman government committed genocides against its Armenian, Assyrian and Pontic Greek subjects."
The term "genocide" cannot be used on any issue that has not been accepted, not discussed by the historical commissions of the countries and not examined the evidence, and not discussed by any international court or united nations. It is just the argument of a claiming country. Wikipedia is an environment where no person, institution or country's political agenda is motivated, and it is a motto that it freely shares truthful data sharing. How can an "not confirmed", "not critisized, "judicially undecided" accusation can still be actively shown to the whole world by the hand of Wikipedia and this revision or editing is semi protected? How this type of text, action can be tolerated and accepted? This error needs to be corrected in a short term. Otherwise, it is the debt of the citizens to do what needs to be done in law and social, of that country both in the country and in the international arena due to this accusation of false information that pushes the society to hate and hate speech. Giving a reference doesnt mean it's a true information. Ttkhan ( talk) 07:35, 4 May 2020 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request to
Turkey has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
In the /info/en/?search=Turkey#Healthcare Title
"In 2012, there were 29,960 medical institutions in Turkey,[452] and on average one doctor per 583 people[453] and 2.65 beds per 1000 people.[452]"
this line can be updated via its source has 2018 values which should be
"In 2018, there were 34,559 medical institutions in Turkey,[452] and on average one doctor per 536 people[453] and 2.83 beds per 1000 people.[452]"
Sources are same and dont need an update. Thanks. Ttkhan ( talk) 06:27, 4 May 2020 (UTC)
I noticed that the
China,
Iran and
Russia articles don't have the Human Rights section, while
North Korea,
Syria and
Saudi Arabia have it, but they are much shorter than the section in Turkey, which appears a bit like defamation. Should the information in this section be summarized and the excessive details moved to the main article
Human rights in Turkey? — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
TR34Istanbul (
talk •
contribs) 05:13, 26 April 2020 (UTC) Blocked sock.
T*U (
talk)
13:06, 10 May 2020 (UTC)
See the article
Human rights in Turkey. Nothing disappeared, I moved the text there. Summary edit is a must. Otherwise, the Human Rights section (which doesn't exist in most country articles, including China, Iran and Russia) becomes 3 times longer than the regular sections. — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
TR34Istanbul (
talk •
contribs) 23:55, 26 April 2020 (UTC) Blocked sock.
T*U (
talk)
13:06, 10 May 2020 (UTC)
Consensus to remove the picture was reached before but the pictures were added again. I don’t see any pictures of the victims of the Holocaust in Germany, then why is this picture being included in the article? I’m going to remove it if no one opposes my opinion. Rodrigo Valequez( 🗣) 16:20, 5 May 2020 (UTC)
Anlıyorum, bence de öyle bir fotoğraf eklemek oldukça gereksiz. “Ermeni Soykırımı” (soykırım olduğuna inanmıyorum) dedikleri şey zaten Osmanlı döneminde gerçekleştiğinden böyle bir fotoğraf eklemek alakasız olur. Kaç kişiye haber verdiğini bilemiyorum ama bizim yapacağımız olan şeylere sorun çıkaracak çok kişi var, haber verdiğin diğer kişiler dönüş yapana kadar daha fazla kişiden yardım talep etmeli miyiz? Ayrıca, planın bu tip şeyleri çıkarıp sayfayı düzeltmek mi yoksa bu fotoğrafları çıkartmak mı. Ben ilk opsiyonu daha makul bulup ve topluca sayfayı geliştirebileceğimizi inansamda senin Vikipedi’yi bırakmadan böyle büyük bir projeye girişeceğinden emin değilim. Önceden dediğim gibi, yardım etmekten zevk duyarım. —-Rodrigo Valequez(🗣) 13:33, 5 May 2020 (UTC)
I understand, I think adding a photo like that is pretty unnecessary. Adding such a photo would be irrelevant, because what they call the "Armenian Genocide" (I don't believe it was genocide) happened already during the Ottoman period. I don't know how many people are reporting, but there are a lot of people who are going to have trouble with what we're going to do, should we ask more people for help until the other people you report have returned? Also, is your plan to take this kind of thing out and improve the page or take out these photos? I am not sure that you will embark on such a big project without leaving Wikipedia, even if I believe we can find the first option more reasonable and improve the page collectively. As I said before, I enjoy helping. —- Rodrigo Valequez 13:33, 5 May 2020 (UTC)
Dr. K. 16:45, 5 May 2020 (UTC)I’ve proposed the changes on the articles talk page. Regards, Rodrigo Valequez(🗣) 16:25, 5 May 2020 (UTC)
I would like to make it clear that I wasn’t going to start edit-warring, I was merely proposing a change which seemed logical to me. I’ll translate everything I said to English on the canvassing organisers user page. Also, is what he did not allowed? Rodrigo Valequez( 🗣) 17:54, 5 May 2020 (UTC) I’ve comepleted my translation. Rodrigo Valequez( 🗣) 18:56, 5 May 2020 (UTC)
In any case, it should be added to the
Ottoman Empire article. There's already an image in the
Turkey article that mentions the Armenian Genocide, at the "Human Rights" section. A second image is not necessary. The Armenian Genocide is mentioned in full detail within the text of the "History" section, in the lede, and in numerous other sections of the Turkey article. But if those are not enough, we can dedicate the entire article to the Armenian Genocide. For example, we can add at least one paragraph and one picture about the Armenian Genocide to each section in the article. That being said, in the
Germany article they have
a picture of Adolf Hitler and a map showing his "conquests". No pictures of "dead Jews", whatsoever. In the
Poland article there are no pictures of "dead Jews" in the
Auschwitz concentration camp,
Belzec extermination camp,
Chełmno extermination camp,
Gross-Rosen concentration camp,
Majdanek concentration camp,
Kraków-Płaszów concentration camp,
Sobibor extermination camp,
Stutthof concentration camp,
Treblinka extermination camp, etc.— Preceding
unsigned comment added by
TR34Istanbul (
talk •
contribs) 13:43, 6 May 2020 (UTC) Blocked sock.
T*U (
talk)
13:06, 10 May 2020 (UTC)
References
fellas i really don't know what to say, just wanna thank Rodrigo for his/her help since Khirurg accused me totally blindly. I was just notifying some users to join into this discussion since consensuses can be challenged (contrary to Khirurg's statement which he explictly said that this consensus was non-negotiable?). Now for the last time, before i retire (yeah i've graduated and started to work full time, it's not a cover like Khirurg suggests :D) i would like to challenge this so called 'consensus' to remove this image which in my opinion explictly instates a negative perspective on a country with a very deep historical backgorund. We can put tons of other (again imo) 'more important' images which reflects these lands' rich history. I also wanted to acknowledge that i do not deny genocide. so dont be using that card I just don't want that image. dudewithafez 19:21, 7 May 2020 (UTC)
I was just notifying some users to join into this discussion...I see you are in denial about the massive WP:CANVASSING you engaged in, not with
some usersbut with Turkish users, and in the Turkish language sending them messages to support your cause. If you don't understand this is blatant ethnic canvassing, you need to be blocked. Dr. K. 20:26, 7 May 2020 (UTC)
so please stop accusing me of canvassing!in your response to me, do you think it is a friendly way to address me? Please look in the mirror before you give me a reply. Dr. K. 22:43, 7 May 2020 (UTC)
Also, is there a way I can mute a user from constantly accusing me? Asking for a friend. Rodrigo Valequez( 🗣) 21:29, 7 May 2020 (UTC)
During the war, the empire's Armenians were deported to Syria as part of the Armenian Genocide. As a result, an estimated 800,000 to 1,500,000 Armenians were killed. The Turkish government has refused to acknowledge the events as genocide and states that Armenians were only relocated from the eastern war zone.
Comment: What we're seeing here is coordinated ethnic bloc voting, as a result of WP:CANVAS by a now indeffed user. The arguments for removal are either completely inane ("the city is not in Turkey") or boil down to WP:JDL and whataboutism. Khirurg ( talk) 19:28, 8 May 2020 (UTC)
Absolutely not. The Armenian Genocide is far more important than Mehmed V. The "too many pictures" argument doesn't make any sense at all. The Seljuks and Ottomans section only has three pictures, and it's very long. There is plenty of room for the Genocide pic. If there are too many pics in the article in general, that is another matter, and easily addressed. Khirurg ( talk) 23:40, 8 May 2020 (UTC)
The above discussion is a very good example of why we make it very clear that decisions are not taken by vote. For a long time now, a highly disruptive nationalist has tried to remove all references to the Armenian genocide. This has been going on for months. Having failed to achieve anything with their repetitive edit warring, the user has then canvassed like-minded individuals (some of whom make perfectly valid arguments and whose overall contributions are welcome) to push through what the lone user did not accomplish through edit warring. This is exactly the oppositve of how Wikipedia works. We operate on the strength of arguments, not on the number of people being called in to support an argument. Please note that none of this is to suggest some users are not welcome use; quite the opposite, anyone is welcome to contribute no matter how they learned about this issue. I recognize that some new contributors here are perfectly constructive and we all welcome debate and discussion. However, the edit-warring POV-pusher needs to understand that canvassing others does not in itself change things Jeppiz ( talk) 11:53, 9 May 2020 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 25 | ← | Archive 28 | Archive 29 | Archive 30 | Archive 31 | Archive 32 | → | Archive 35 |
![]() | This
edit request to
Turkey has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Add to the end of 'Foreign Relations':
On January 2, 2020, Turkey's parliament approved a bill to deploy troops into Libya to back UN-recognized government in the capital after forces loyal to Haftar, a rival administration, launched an offensive. The legislation passed with a 325-184 vote, however the details of the deployment have yet to be revealed in terms of amount and timing. [1] JosephGX ( talk) 17:47, 2 January 2020 (UTC)
References
? Annick Tremblay ( talk) 07:10, 4 January 2020 (UTC)
Indeed "?" What the hell are you typing? I thought this was the English Wiki. O_o No offense meant, but translation please? I can speak a few languages but, not that one. D: SageSolomon ( talk) 02:28, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Not moved per WP:SNOW ( non-admin closure) ( t · c) buidhe 19:35, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
Turkey → Türkiye – The country has changed its English name to Türkiye. 2600:6C5A:657F:D1F5:48D3:2853:9745:8762 ( talk) 03:20, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
@ Mortense I just double checked what this guy's archived post on this talk page was about and verified. Indeed, at [ link] it states that Trump has cancelled this delivery of the F-35 to Turkey because they bought S-400s. It would be a help if we could get a few more sources to confirm this, but I'd put forth we should edit this tidbit of info on the main page everywhere, as its been done already over at the F-35 article. Such as in that pic with the F-35 and a Airbus A400M Atlas, for example. Unless I am mistaken and the United States is still selling them to Turkey? Any comments or feedback from anyone is welcome. SageSolomon ( talk) 02:49, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
@ SageSolomon first of all yes that is true and that's why i've corrected the sentence 'Turkey is one of nine partner states in the F-35 JSF program ' to 'Turkey was one of nine partner states in the F-35 JSF program' but that dude Khirurg or whatever just blatantly reverts my edits. Secondly, although Turkey is no more a participant, it is still a good demonstration that the Turkish arms industry is capable of involving in such a program. That's why i think that we should keep that image. kazekagetr 12:52, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request to
Turkey has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Add to the end of 'Foreign Relations':
On January 2, 2020, Turkey's parliament approved a bill to deploy troops into Libya to back UN-recognized government in the capital after forces loyal to Haftar, a rival administration, launched an offensive. The legislation passed with a 325-184 vote, however the details of the deployment have yet to be revealed in terms of amount and timing. [1] JosephGX ( talk) 17:47, 2 January 2020 (UTC)
References
? Annick Tremblay ( talk) 07:10, 4 January 2020 (UTC)
Indeed "?" What the hell are you typing? I thought this was the English Wiki. O_o No offense meant, but translation please? I can speak a few languages but, not that one. D: SageSolomon ( talk) 02:28, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
@ Mortense I just double checked what this guy's archived post on this talk page was about and verified. Indeed, at [ link] it states that Trump has cancelled this delivery of the F-35 to Turkey because they bought S-400s. It would be a help if we could get a few more sources to confirm this, but I'd put forth we should edit this tidbit of info on the main page everywhere, as its been done already over at the F-35 article. Such as in that pic with the F-35 and a Airbus A400M Atlas, for example. Unless I am mistaken and the United States is still selling them to Turkey? Any comments or feedback from anyone is welcome. SageSolomon ( talk) 02:49, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
@ SageSolomon first of all yes that is true and that's why i've corrected the sentence 'Turkey is one of nine partner states in the F-35 JSF program ' to 'Turkey was one of nine partner states in the F-35 JSF program' but that dude Khirurg or whatever just blatantly reverts my edits. Secondly, although Turkey is no more a participant, it is still a good demonstration that the Turkish arms industry is capable of involving in such a program. That's why i think that we should keep that image. kazekagetr 12:52, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
It was very sad to see my labor just fade away in front of my eyes and being able to do nothing about it. I've requested a peer review. Feel free to help me out with it. Actually, rather than 'feel free', just 'help me out' feels more suitable since it's been nearly three years over my last edit and it seems that article needs a complete overhaul. kazekagetr 17:23, 24 January 2020 (UTC)
Hi, can you pls elaborate a little further? Thanks, Cinadon 36 19:14, 24 January 2020 (UTC)
User:Cinadon36 yea sure, i wanna make it GA again is all and it would be awesome if someone lend me a hand instead of blatantly reverting my changes and editing this article with a anti-Turkish POV. kazekagetr 08:04, 25 January 2020 (UTC)
Ok, trying to get an article to GA status is a noble cause. I will keep an eye. Be prepared to use the Talk page alot. Cinadon 36 08:43, 25 January 2020 (UTC)
@ Cinadon36 It cannot be PRO Turkey either. It has to state just facts, nothing more and nothing less. Neutral point of view. Not Anti Turkey, nor Pro Turkey. Just, Turkey. End of. There can not be any bias either way when creating Wikipedia articles, as this is an encyclopedia, not a political battleground. That being said, if there HAS been edits made that are anti-Turkey, I would agree, REMOVE them and make it as it should be with verifiable reliable sources and WP:NPOV. This is the sum of all human knowledge, not a platform for anyone's bias to be pushed to world at large. Please note, I am just stating this, and this is not a jab or an attack at anyone. Cinadon36 if you did work on this article in the past and gave it high marks, and someone came in a edited it and made it bias, and you are wishing to correct that, more power to you. :) Think Ive stated my two cents. I would have to learn far more about Turkey before I felt comfortable in assisting with editing this article, personally. There is SO much about this country for me to learn yet. D: Id want to do research on it first. Hit me up thy still wishes for assistance, anyway? I'll do my best? Haha. Apologies if this was abrupt or unwelcome. Turkey should be a well flushed out article, so I support the move to remove any bias of any kind. Happy editing! ^__^ SageSolomon ( talk) 02:25, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
Kazekage, please explain what consensus you are challenging and then don't remove the consensus details from the article until you gain new consensus to remove them. You are free to edit non-controversial aspects of the article, but the way you do it so far makes it difficult to restore consensus edits you are removing without also removing your non-controversial edits since you are making too many small edits which are interconnected to each other making it difficult to separate the details without reverting all of them. Please make edits in such a way, as to enable editors to separate the controversial aspects from the non-controversial ones. That way your edits will not be reverted en mass. Dr. K. 17:53, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
I'm challengig the consensus that @ User:Khirurg keep claiming 'non-negotiable'. I think he/she talks about that Kurdish insurgency at the lede. I though Wikipedia was an open platform that anyone could edit and negotiate about any article, well it seems that now people like him/her have some enforcing power that they decide what to negotiate or not :D. Imma make my edits again and keep that Kurdish insurgency on lede, but here is what i say. We don't get to see other terrorist groups such as RAF,ETA,IRA,Zeta and other cartels unless the country is engulfed in a civil war or they have a timeline which goes on in lede. But in our case, it directly jumps from Atatürk's reforms which were enacted in 1920s-1930s and creates a half-a-century jump in timeline and it looks like that we are in a civil war or something like that but in reality even the Kurdish dominated cities like Diyarbakır or Van have seen dramatic drops in insurgency in last decade. Also i would like to add that the 'consensuses' on that Armenian Genocide image and PKK terrorism on lede doesn't strike me as consensuses rather topics which were left in vague and were argued on with some constant POVs. kazekagetr 17:38, 27 January 2020 (UTC)
Oh yea also umm where have i insulted anyone, can you please adress to that @ User:Dr.K.? I've just said that I'am aware of your ethnicity and your POV towards Turkey. But i didin't happen to say anything on both of them? kazekagetr 17:48, 27 January 2020 (UTC)
I've already checked the preview discussion about this image and i don't see any 'consensus' to keep it, rather i see people reacting to it in a logical way that i side with.
I think that since it has an article and it's been mentioned in both in the lede and in the history section, there is no need for such an image. As a citizen of this country, i could provide you images about other topics which reflect this country's rich history, which this image cannot possibly present.
Also in the previous discussion, there is a perfect sentence by User:Buhedyar that i totally agree: 'No country page has "look at this sad picture of a person dying" photo. China doesn't, Germany doesn't, UK doesn't, Russia doesn't and why should Turkey have it?' We can also add third world countries like Myanmar to this list.
I've noticed that User:Dr.K. reverted my change and i've opened up this discussion in order to respect everybody's views&thoughts. I was not able to join the other discussion since the block was removed since 01/01/2020. Love you all. kazekagetr 16:47, 24 January 2020 (UTC)
Turkish Wikipedia is using this audio file instead of the one in this wiki. This has lyrics too and it had been produced by the Turkish presidency.
The page is semi-protected so I can't change it by myself.-- Yagizhan49 ( talk) 13:56, 14 February 2020 (UTC)
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the writer of the istiklal marşı is mehmet akif ersoy. Gungurbuz ( talk) 17:31, 11 March 2020 (UTC)
Joshua Project is not reliable see this. I wonder why it is still being sourced in the article? - Fylindfotberserk ( talk) 16:41, 28 March 2020 (UTC)
"During World War I, the Ottoman government committed genocides against its Armenian, Assyrian and Pontic Greek subjects." This statement can be found in Turkey Republic's wikipedia page but can't be found in Türkiye page. Giving the message that ancestors of Turkish folk did commit genocide without doubt even though Armenian genocide case is not accepted by majority of different sources. Stating the Ottomans commited genocide by counting on only one source and protecting that page is just gives the message that Wikipedia presents not reality but politically and emotionaly affected wiews of a subject. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gorkem20 ( talk • contribs) 12:46, 8 April 2020 (UTC)
in turkish page of this article there is no """Mehmet Akif Ersoy's""" in """"Mehmet Akif Ersoy's İstiklal Marşı" "The Independence March" """".
Mehmet Akif Ersoy's "İstiklal Marşı" "The Independence March" its should be this: "The Independence March" "İstiklal Marşı"
if it must be """Mehmet Akif Ersoy's""" in """"Mehmet Akif Ersoy's İstiklal Marşı" "The Independence March" """", then turkish page should be """Mehmet Akif Ersoy's""" in """"Mehmet Akif Ersoy's İstiklal Marşı" "The Independence March" """" too.
my english is very bad..
the main thing is: we should delete "Mehmet Akif Ersoy's" in english page
hope to understanding...
Modern primat (
talk)
19:53, 22 April 2020 (UTC)modern_primat
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Change nominal gdp per capita from $9,683 to $8,957. BlueTea97 ( talk) 06:48, 29 April 2020 (UTC)
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"During World War I, the Ottoman government committed genocides against its Armenian, Assyrian and Pontic Greek subjects."
The term "genocide" cannot be used on any issue that has not been accepted, not discussed by the historical commissions of the countries and not examined the evidence, and not discussed by any international court or united nations. It is just the argument of a claiming country. Wikipedia is an environment where no person, institution or country's political agenda is motivated, and it is a motto that it freely shares truthful data sharing. How can an "not confirmed", "not critisized, "judicially undecided" accusation can still be actively shown to the whole world by the hand of Wikipedia and this revision or editing is semi protected? How this type of text, action can be tolerated and accepted? This error needs to be corrected in a short term. Otherwise, it is the debt of the citizens to do what needs to be done in law and social, of that country both in the country and in the international arena due to this accusation of false information that pushes the society to hate and hate speech. Giving a reference doesnt mean it's a true information. Ttkhan ( talk) 07:35, 4 May 2020 (UTC)
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In the /info/en/?search=Turkey#Healthcare Title
"In 2012, there were 29,960 medical institutions in Turkey,[452] and on average one doctor per 583 people[453] and 2.65 beds per 1000 people.[452]"
this line can be updated via its source has 2018 values which should be
"In 2018, there were 34,559 medical institutions in Turkey,[452] and on average one doctor per 536 people[453] and 2.83 beds per 1000 people.[452]"
Sources are same and dont need an update. Thanks. Ttkhan ( talk) 06:27, 4 May 2020 (UTC)
I noticed that the
China,
Iran and
Russia articles don't have the Human Rights section, while
North Korea,
Syria and
Saudi Arabia have it, but they are much shorter than the section in Turkey, which appears a bit like defamation. Should the information in this section be summarized and the excessive details moved to the main article
Human rights in Turkey? — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
TR34Istanbul (
talk •
contribs) 05:13, 26 April 2020 (UTC) Blocked sock.
T*U (
talk)
13:06, 10 May 2020 (UTC)
See the article
Human rights in Turkey. Nothing disappeared, I moved the text there. Summary edit is a must. Otherwise, the Human Rights section (which doesn't exist in most country articles, including China, Iran and Russia) becomes 3 times longer than the regular sections. — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
TR34Istanbul (
talk •
contribs) 23:55, 26 April 2020 (UTC) Blocked sock.
T*U (
talk)
13:06, 10 May 2020 (UTC)
Consensus to remove the picture was reached before but the pictures were added again. I don’t see any pictures of the victims of the Holocaust in Germany, then why is this picture being included in the article? I’m going to remove it if no one opposes my opinion. Rodrigo Valequez( 🗣) 16:20, 5 May 2020 (UTC)
Anlıyorum, bence de öyle bir fotoğraf eklemek oldukça gereksiz. “Ermeni Soykırımı” (soykırım olduğuna inanmıyorum) dedikleri şey zaten Osmanlı döneminde gerçekleştiğinden böyle bir fotoğraf eklemek alakasız olur. Kaç kişiye haber verdiğini bilemiyorum ama bizim yapacağımız olan şeylere sorun çıkaracak çok kişi var, haber verdiğin diğer kişiler dönüş yapana kadar daha fazla kişiden yardım talep etmeli miyiz? Ayrıca, planın bu tip şeyleri çıkarıp sayfayı düzeltmek mi yoksa bu fotoğrafları çıkartmak mı. Ben ilk opsiyonu daha makul bulup ve topluca sayfayı geliştirebileceğimizi inansamda senin Vikipedi’yi bırakmadan böyle büyük bir projeye girişeceğinden emin değilim. Önceden dediğim gibi, yardım etmekten zevk duyarım. —-Rodrigo Valequez(🗣) 13:33, 5 May 2020 (UTC)
I understand, I think adding a photo like that is pretty unnecessary. Adding such a photo would be irrelevant, because what they call the "Armenian Genocide" (I don't believe it was genocide) happened already during the Ottoman period. I don't know how many people are reporting, but there are a lot of people who are going to have trouble with what we're going to do, should we ask more people for help until the other people you report have returned? Also, is your plan to take this kind of thing out and improve the page or take out these photos? I am not sure that you will embark on such a big project without leaving Wikipedia, even if I believe we can find the first option more reasonable and improve the page collectively. As I said before, I enjoy helping. —- Rodrigo Valequez 13:33, 5 May 2020 (UTC)
Dr. K. 16:45, 5 May 2020 (UTC)I’ve proposed the changes on the articles talk page. Regards, Rodrigo Valequez(🗣) 16:25, 5 May 2020 (UTC)
I would like to make it clear that I wasn’t going to start edit-warring, I was merely proposing a change which seemed logical to me. I’ll translate everything I said to English on the canvassing organisers user page. Also, is what he did not allowed? Rodrigo Valequez( 🗣) 17:54, 5 May 2020 (UTC) I’ve comepleted my translation. Rodrigo Valequez( 🗣) 18:56, 5 May 2020 (UTC)
In any case, it should be added to the
Ottoman Empire article. There's already an image in the
Turkey article that mentions the Armenian Genocide, at the "Human Rights" section. A second image is not necessary. The Armenian Genocide is mentioned in full detail within the text of the "History" section, in the lede, and in numerous other sections of the Turkey article. But if those are not enough, we can dedicate the entire article to the Armenian Genocide. For example, we can add at least one paragraph and one picture about the Armenian Genocide to each section in the article. That being said, in the
Germany article they have
a picture of Adolf Hitler and a map showing his "conquests". No pictures of "dead Jews", whatsoever. In the
Poland article there are no pictures of "dead Jews" in the
Auschwitz concentration camp,
Belzec extermination camp,
Chełmno extermination camp,
Gross-Rosen concentration camp,
Majdanek concentration camp,
Kraków-Płaszów concentration camp,
Sobibor extermination camp,
Stutthof concentration camp,
Treblinka extermination camp, etc.— Preceding
unsigned comment added by
TR34Istanbul (
talk •
contribs) 13:43, 6 May 2020 (UTC) Blocked sock.
T*U (
talk)
13:06, 10 May 2020 (UTC)
References
fellas i really don't know what to say, just wanna thank Rodrigo for his/her help since Khirurg accused me totally blindly. I was just notifying some users to join into this discussion since consensuses can be challenged (contrary to Khirurg's statement which he explictly said that this consensus was non-negotiable?). Now for the last time, before i retire (yeah i've graduated and started to work full time, it's not a cover like Khirurg suggests :D) i would like to challenge this so called 'consensus' to remove this image which in my opinion explictly instates a negative perspective on a country with a very deep historical backgorund. We can put tons of other (again imo) 'more important' images which reflects these lands' rich history. I also wanted to acknowledge that i do not deny genocide. so dont be using that card I just don't want that image. dudewithafez 19:21, 7 May 2020 (UTC)
I was just notifying some users to join into this discussion...I see you are in denial about the massive WP:CANVASSING you engaged in, not with
some usersbut with Turkish users, and in the Turkish language sending them messages to support your cause. If you don't understand this is blatant ethnic canvassing, you need to be blocked. Dr. K. 20:26, 7 May 2020 (UTC)
so please stop accusing me of canvassing!in your response to me, do you think it is a friendly way to address me? Please look in the mirror before you give me a reply. Dr. K. 22:43, 7 May 2020 (UTC)
Also, is there a way I can mute a user from constantly accusing me? Asking for a friend. Rodrigo Valequez( 🗣) 21:29, 7 May 2020 (UTC)
During the war, the empire's Armenians were deported to Syria as part of the Armenian Genocide. As a result, an estimated 800,000 to 1,500,000 Armenians were killed. The Turkish government has refused to acknowledge the events as genocide and states that Armenians were only relocated from the eastern war zone.
Comment: What we're seeing here is coordinated ethnic bloc voting, as a result of WP:CANVAS by a now indeffed user. The arguments for removal are either completely inane ("the city is not in Turkey") or boil down to WP:JDL and whataboutism. Khirurg ( talk) 19:28, 8 May 2020 (UTC)
Absolutely not. The Armenian Genocide is far more important than Mehmed V. The "too many pictures" argument doesn't make any sense at all. The Seljuks and Ottomans section only has three pictures, and it's very long. There is plenty of room for the Genocide pic. If there are too many pics in the article in general, that is another matter, and easily addressed. Khirurg ( talk) 23:40, 8 May 2020 (UTC)
The above discussion is a very good example of why we make it very clear that decisions are not taken by vote. For a long time now, a highly disruptive nationalist has tried to remove all references to the Armenian genocide. This has been going on for months. Having failed to achieve anything with their repetitive edit warring, the user has then canvassed like-minded individuals (some of whom make perfectly valid arguments and whose overall contributions are welcome) to push through what the lone user did not accomplish through edit warring. This is exactly the oppositve of how Wikipedia works. We operate on the strength of arguments, not on the number of people being called in to support an argument. Please note that none of this is to suggest some users are not welcome use; quite the opposite, anyone is welcome to contribute no matter how they learned about this issue. I recognize that some new contributors here are perfectly constructive and we all welcome debate and discussion. However, the edit-warring POV-pusher needs to understand that canvassing others does not in itself change things Jeppiz ( talk) 11:53, 9 May 2020 (UTC)