A fact from Slavery in Poland appeared on Wikipedia's
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I'm pretty positive that the opening section of the article is total nonsense. Slavery didn't transition into serfdom until the 20th century? What? People have numbers assigned to them based on "importance" to this day? Who wrote this nonsense?! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A04:EE41:81:C2F0:5808:BD21:E064:AF42 ( talk) 15:05, 12 September 2020 (UTC)
It's great that the article starts with a clarification of terminology. I find it not clear enough, however. What does ludzie mean? The Latin words are contrasted, but should be explained, as well. Ben T/ C 09:57, 10 April 2012 (UTC)
The section starts out with giving a historical context (nice) and an idea of the impact and importance of slavery. This could be extended a bit, maybe. Then, it is said that the number of slaves rose significantly with the establishment of the Polish state. It would be nice to have some statistics at that point. Non-free people were emancipated in Poland in 1347 under the Statutes of Casimir the Great. What did this imply for them? What did these statutes stipulate with respect to the lives of non-free people? From the last sentence I don't understand when serfdom was abolished. Additionally, I find the comma confusing. What are the differences between serfs and slaves (legally, practically)? Ben T/ C 10:12, 10 April 2012 (UTC)
Not sure if "features" is a good term for the section header. Did royal jurisdiction imply a legal protection for the niewolni? Ben T/ C 10:12, 10 April 2012 (UTC)
One thing - as far as I understand the matter, there wasn't a continuous evolution which linked slavery of the early middle ages to the serfdom of the late Jagiellonian/early elective period. In between 1300's and 1500's the peasants actually enjoyed quite a bit of freedom and even prosperity. Even during the slavery period most peasants were free (kmiecie) and slaves were mostly war captives (i.e. small % of population). So it wasn't that slavery transformed into serfdom. It was more like first slavery gradually died out (it wasn't that significant to begin with), then few hundred years later, the free peasants got progressively enserfed.
Since this is the "slavery" article, I'll comment on emergence of serfdom on the Serfdom in Poland article. VolunteerMarek 16:25, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
A fact from Slavery in Poland appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the
Did you know column on 10 April 2012 (
check views). The text of the entry was as follows:
|
This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||
|
I'm pretty positive that the opening section of the article is total nonsense. Slavery didn't transition into serfdom until the 20th century? What? People have numbers assigned to them based on "importance" to this day? Who wrote this nonsense?! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A04:EE41:81:C2F0:5808:BD21:E064:AF42 ( talk) 15:05, 12 September 2020 (UTC)
It's great that the article starts with a clarification of terminology. I find it not clear enough, however. What does ludzie mean? The Latin words are contrasted, but should be explained, as well. Ben T/ C 09:57, 10 April 2012 (UTC)
The section starts out with giving a historical context (nice) and an idea of the impact and importance of slavery. This could be extended a bit, maybe. Then, it is said that the number of slaves rose significantly with the establishment of the Polish state. It would be nice to have some statistics at that point. Non-free people were emancipated in Poland in 1347 under the Statutes of Casimir the Great. What did this imply for them? What did these statutes stipulate with respect to the lives of non-free people? From the last sentence I don't understand when serfdom was abolished. Additionally, I find the comma confusing. What are the differences between serfs and slaves (legally, practically)? Ben T/ C 10:12, 10 April 2012 (UTC)
Not sure if "features" is a good term for the section header. Did royal jurisdiction imply a legal protection for the niewolni? Ben T/ C 10:12, 10 April 2012 (UTC)
One thing - as far as I understand the matter, there wasn't a continuous evolution which linked slavery of the early middle ages to the serfdom of the late Jagiellonian/early elective period. In between 1300's and 1500's the peasants actually enjoyed quite a bit of freedom and even prosperity. Even during the slavery period most peasants were free (kmiecie) and slaves were mostly war captives (i.e. small % of population). So it wasn't that slavery transformed into serfdom. It was more like first slavery gradually died out (it wasn't that significant to begin with), then few hundred years later, the free peasants got progressively enserfed.
Since this is the "slavery" article, I'll comment on emergence of serfdom on the Serfdom in Poland article. VolunteerMarek 16:25, 18 April 2012 (UTC)