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Though it serves as an example of one kind of ruby usage, I wonder if the katakana ruby for Tokyo is a practical example. Since the word Tokyo is not a foreign word, katakana is inappropriate. Since I don't know too much Japanese, I am curious to know the answer. Any taker? Kowloonese 03:20, 4 Aug 2004 (UTC)
The ruby characters showed up in my version of Mozilla Foxfire v.0.9.2 for MS Windows, so the support must have been added. gK 15:34, 15 Oct 2004 (UTC)
The article says that Wikipedia doesn't support complex ruby. How can this be? AFAIK, Wikipedia supports (i.e. doesn't interfere with) any and all legitimate HTML constructs. Why should there be a difference here? -- Marnen Laibow-Koser (talk) 20:38, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)
It really can't. See it yourself:
<rbc>
-- minghong 08:38, 5 Apr 2005 (UTC)
the ruby thing is entirely a Japanese thing. In Chinese texts, one only see it in grade-school materials or dictionaries. The many places implies its use in Chinese really should be taken out.
Xah Lee 11:12, 2005 Mar 1 (UTC)
I just lived in "mainland" China for three years, and only saw "ruby" used in kids books when they first learned to read. Maybe it's common in Taiwan or in certain subject areas such as Buddhist texts, but the article to me implies it's common in both mainland China and Taiwan for every day use in newspapers, books, etc. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.1.105.42 ( talk) 22:21, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
There is a template to facilitate the use of ruby markup on Wikipedia.
Input: {{Ruby-zh-p|这|zhè}} {{Ruby-zh-p|是|shì}} {{Ruby-zh-p|一|yì}} {{Ruby-zh-p|些|xiē}} {{Ruby-zh-p|汉|hàn}} {{Ruby-zh-p|字|zì}}。
You'll see: 这 是 一 些 汉 字。
In addition, links to Wiktionary definitions are automatically added to each Han character. To make the text legible, the font size is a little larger than usual. This template is therefore not for in-line text.
If larger characters are necessary, then input: {{Ruby-big|梦|mèng}}
You'll see: 梦
Put {{ Ruby_notice}} on any pages with ruby text. — Chameleon 19:22, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)
ja
, zh
, ko
, etc.). For example, {{Ruby|京|kyō|ja}}
would produce something like <ruby lang="ja"><rb>[[Wiktionary:京]]</rb><rt>kyō</rt></ruby>
. Explicitly specifying fonts should not be necessary. —
mjb 00:41, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC)
The words "Ruby" and "Furi" don't refer to the fact that the annotation is romaji, hiragana, katakana, pinyin or bopomofo. "Furi" just refers to the Japanese word for such annotations; "Ruby" just refers to a non-Japanese word for such annotations. The only difference at the moment between the templates is the language tags. — Chameleon 10:55, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Give kanji and hanzi for Japanese and Chinese terms.
"Zhuyin is not as easy to read when presented horizontally.": Say why. Substantiate your claims.
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 210.201.31.246 ( talk • contribs)
Moved from Talk:Ruby characters -- ran ( talk) 22:24, 8 March 2006 (UTC)
I took out this sentence from the first paragraph:
as this is referring to ruby the typeface, not ruby the 'small, annotative characters that can be placed above or to the side of a character when writing logographic languages such as Chinese or Japanese to show the pronunciation'. If you are unaware that rubi characters are ultimately named after an annotative typeface for English, then this is really confusing as it jumps from one meaning to another. The typeface is talked about further down in the History section. — Moogsi 20:36, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
The Ruby notation on Four-character idiom seems to be working incorrectly. Can someone take a look? Shawnc 01:30, 17 April 2006 (UTC)
What's the difference between ruby characters and furigana? — Tamfang 19:46, 16 June 2006 (UTC)
This question is answered in the articles.
— mjb 07:46, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
Well, at least according to WP:MOS-JA → "Do not use the <ruby> tag to further annotate the kanji, as many browsers cannot display it properly, and it does not degrade gracefully." Evidently that's a codified guideline among Japanese Wiki-editors, and it was subsequently cited in an ongoing discussion/dispute as a reason for me to remove said helpful and clarifying hiragana ruby tags from a mangaka's name in kanji on a Wikipedia article. What does everyone here think; agree or disagree?
– Bakemono 04:51, 01 July 2006 (UTC)
It is posible to have acceptable output in all navigators by using the the following CSS code (should be added as default in wikipedia CSS imho):
ruby{ display:inline-table; text-align:center; white-space:nowrap;} ruby>rb{display:table-row-group;} ruby>rt{display:table-header-group;font-size:40%;} ruby>rp{display:none;}
on navigators with proper CSS support (like firefox), it would display with furigana on top, and parenthesis won't show; with navigators without proper CSS support (like konqueror) it will show on the same line, with the parenthesis. with MS-IE it works fine too (but I don't know if because of the CSS or the ruby support; well, doesn't matter), with the exception that the ruby text is not centered.
Srtxg 13:49, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
Is it possible to code basic ruby so that it doesn't show up at all when the browser lacks support? I'm trying to write a document with ruby support, but I would rather not have all of the parentheses appearing for users without ruby support. Anybody know? (This is not related to Wikipedia!) freshofftheufo ΓΛĿЌ 11:59, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
I understand that this is not a language lesson, but the example of 愛 (love) is important. We should not focus on writing in an in-universe style, and the information informs people who are not familiar with the subject. If we need to shorten the example, can we merge the information with another section in this article or add it to a different article and then a relevant lead–in and wikilink, for the reader to lean more? Taric25 19:02, 14 February 2007 (UTC)
I'd fix it myself if I knew how, but in the boxes with the characters in the section near the top, the "tō" of "Tokyo" and the "ai" character are wrong in all cases--unless it's my browser or something, but I think not. Can anyone fix that? Apeman 03:35, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
"Most Chinese ruby characters are written with the zhuyin (also known as bopomofo) syllabary, but pinyin is also occasionally used."
This is probably biased, and I'm wondering if there is any evidence that testifies "most". Actually pinyin is much more widely used in mainland China, esp. in primary school textbooks, dictionaries and when typing Chinese characters. Those zhuyin symbols are not taught in schools and most mainlanders have never used them. Puppy8800 ( talk) 04:26, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
It should be noted that as of 22 Sep 2009 HTML 5 is an Editor's Draft. (ref: HTML5: A vocabulary and associated APIs for HTML and XHTML, World Wide Web Consortium, URL = http://dev.w3.org/html5/spec/Overview.html#the-ruby-element) It appears that HTML 5 will not support complex ruby. -- allen四 names 03:23, 23 September 2009 (UTC)
The current definition has problems, probably because it began as a description of a specific Japanese use, and what's being defined has become more general over time:
Ruby characters are small, annotative glosses that can be placed above or to the right of a Chinese character when writing languages with logographic characters such as Chinese or Japanese to show the pronunciation. Typically called just ruby or rubi, such annotations are usually used as a pronunciation guide for relatively obscure characters.
I'm putting this up here for discussion before making any changes as I am no expert on the subject. Also I feel a bit lazy to make so many changes :-) -- Kai Carver ( talk) 17:33, 27 January 2010 (UTC)
does pinyin ruby plugin for Web browsers exist?
As Ruby the programming language also came from Japan I can't but help think there could be a link here? Does anybody know? Mathmo Talk 06:47, 14 September 2010 (UTC)
Markup example in the article is rendered fine in Safari 4.1.3 (Mac OS 10.4.11). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.63.83.181 ( talk) 10:20, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
I was under the impression that ruby characters had their origin in rubrics, particularly as described in Rubric#Instructions_in_liturgical_contexts:
...rubric has a second meaning of an instruction in a text, regardless of how it is written or printed. This is in fact the oldest recorded meaning in English, found in 1375.
Rubrics were typically printed in red ink, hence the etymological relation to ruby.
Does anyone know more about this? Does it merit mention in the article body? -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 18:55, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
The article on Furigana states that it is "one type of Ruby." This article, however, does not seem to make any clear distinction between Ruby and Furigana. The Furigana article does not contain some of the technical aspects/uses of Ruby. Does it need to be made clear that this is the distinction between the two articles? Opaanderson ( talk) 01:26, 3 December 2012 (UTC)
This portion is entirely unhelpful and seems not to be discussing ruby at all. Also, having looked at the document it cites, at least quickly, nowhere is the little tsu mentioned at all. However, I'm new to editing wikipedia and I don't know the policy for removing portions outright - what should be done here? Telmac ( talk) 15:22, 12 December 2014 (UTC)
Is there a font tool which similarly allows 1 line of text to be written atop another line of text, but where they are of equal size instead of small on big like ruby? Or perhaps to have big on small as its inverse? If there is, I am wondering if I could do an article for them in the see also. Ranze ( talk) 21:20, 12 December 2016 (UTC)
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This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Though it serves as an example of one kind of ruby usage, I wonder if the katakana ruby for Tokyo is a practical example. Since the word Tokyo is not a foreign word, katakana is inappropriate. Since I don't know too much Japanese, I am curious to know the answer. Any taker? Kowloonese 03:20, 4 Aug 2004 (UTC)
The ruby characters showed up in my version of Mozilla Foxfire v.0.9.2 for MS Windows, so the support must have been added. gK 15:34, 15 Oct 2004 (UTC)
The article says that Wikipedia doesn't support complex ruby. How can this be? AFAIK, Wikipedia supports (i.e. doesn't interfere with) any and all legitimate HTML constructs. Why should there be a difference here? -- Marnen Laibow-Koser (talk) 20:38, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)
It really can't. See it yourself:
<rbc>
-- minghong 08:38, 5 Apr 2005 (UTC)
the ruby thing is entirely a Japanese thing. In Chinese texts, one only see it in grade-school materials or dictionaries. The many places implies its use in Chinese really should be taken out.
Xah Lee 11:12, 2005 Mar 1 (UTC)
I just lived in "mainland" China for three years, and only saw "ruby" used in kids books when they first learned to read. Maybe it's common in Taiwan or in certain subject areas such as Buddhist texts, but the article to me implies it's common in both mainland China and Taiwan for every day use in newspapers, books, etc. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.1.105.42 ( talk) 22:21, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
There is a template to facilitate the use of ruby markup on Wikipedia.
Input: {{Ruby-zh-p|这|zhè}} {{Ruby-zh-p|是|shì}} {{Ruby-zh-p|一|yì}} {{Ruby-zh-p|些|xiē}} {{Ruby-zh-p|汉|hàn}} {{Ruby-zh-p|字|zì}}。
You'll see: 这 是 一 些 汉 字。
In addition, links to Wiktionary definitions are automatically added to each Han character. To make the text legible, the font size is a little larger than usual. This template is therefore not for in-line text.
If larger characters are necessary, then input: {{Ruby-big|梦|mèng}}
You'll see: 梦
Put {{ Ruby_notice}} on any pages with ruby text. — Chameleon 19:22, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)
ja
, zh
, ko
, etc.). For example, {{Ruby|京|kyō|ja}}
would produce something like <ruby lang="ja"><rb>[[Wiktionary:京]]</rb><rt>kyō</rt></ruby>
. Explicitly specifying fonts should not be necessary. —
mjb 00:41, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC)
The words "Ruby" and "Furi" don't refer to the fact that the annotation is romaji, hiragana, katakana, pinyin or bopomofo. "Furi" just refers to the Japanese word for such annotations; "Ruby" just refers to a non-Japanese word for such annotations. The only difference at the moment between the templates is the language tags. — Chameleon 10:55, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Give kanji and hanzi for Japanese and Chinese terms.
"Zhuyin is not as easy to read when presented horizontally.": Say why. Substantiate your claims.
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 210.201.31.246 ( talk • contribs)
Moved from Talk:Ruby characters -- ran ( talk) 22:24, 8 March 2006 (UTC)
I took out this sentence from the first paragraph:
as this is referring to ruby the typeface, not ruby the 'small, annotative characters that can be placed above or to the side of a character when writing logographic languages such as Chinese or Japanese to show the pronunciation'. If you are unaware that rubi characters are ultimately named after an annotative typeface for English, then this is really confusing as it jumps from one meaning to another. The typeface is talked about further down in the History section. — Moogsi 20:36, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
The Ruby notation on Four-character idiom seems to be working incorrectly. Can someone take a look? Shawnc 01:30, 17 April 2006 (UTC)
What's the difference between ruby characters and furigana? — Tamfang 19:46, 16 June 2006 (UTC)
This question is answered in the articles.
— mjb 07:46, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
Well, at least according to WP:MOS-JA → "Do not use the <ruby> tag to further annotate the kanji, as many browsers cannot display it properly, and it does not degrade gracefully." Evidently that's a codified guideline among Japanese Wiki-editors, and it was subsequently cited in an ongoing discussion/dispute as a reason for me to remove said helpful and clarifying hiragana ruby tags from a mangaka's name in kanji on a Wikipedia article. What does everyone here think; agree or disagree?
– Bakemono 04:51, 01 July 2006 (UTC)
It is posible to have acceptable output in all navigators by using the the following CSS code (should be added as default in wikipedia CSS imho):
ruby{ display:inline-table; text-align:center; white-space:nowrap;} ruby>rb{display:table-row-group;} ruby>rt{display:table-header-group;font-size:40%;} ruby>rp{display:none;}
on navigators with proper CSS support (like firefox), it would display with furigana on top, and parenthesis won't show; with navigators without proper CSS support (like konqueror) it will show on the same line, with the parenthesis. with MS-IE it works fine too (but I don't know if because of the CSS or the ruby support; well, doesn't matter), with the exception that the ruby text is not centered.
Srtxg 13:49, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
Is it possible to code basic ruby so that it doesn't show up at all when the browser lacks support? I'm trying to write a document with ruby support, but I would rather not have all of the parentheses appearing for users without ruby support. Anybody know? (This is not related to Wikipedia!) freshofftheufo ΓΛĿЌ 11:59, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
I understand that this is not a language lesson, but the example of 愛 (love) is important. We should not focus on writing in an in-universe style, and the information informs people who are not familiar with the subject. If we need to shorten the example, can we merge the information with another section in this article or add it to a different article and then a relevant lead–in and wikilink, for the reader to lean more? Taric25 19:02, 14 February 2007 (UTC)
I'd fix it myself if I knew how, but in the boxes with the characters in the section near the top, the "tō" of "Tokyo" and the "ai" character are wrong in all cases--unless it's my browser or something, but I think not. Can anyone fix that? Apeman 03:35, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
"Most Chinese ruby characters are written with the zhuyin (also known as bopomofo) syllabary, but pinyin is also occasionally used."
This is probably biased, and I'm wondering if there is any evidence that testifies "most". Actually pinyin is much more widely used in mainland China, esp. in primary school textbooks, dictionaries and when typing Chinese characters. Those zhuyin symbols are not taught in schools and most mainlanders have never used them. Puppy8800 ( talk) 04:26, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
It should be noted that as of 22 Sep 2009 HTML 5 is an Editor's Draft. (ref: HTML5: A vocabulary and associated APIs for HTML and XHTML, World Wide Web Consortium, URL = http://dev.w3.org/html5/spec/Overview.html#the-ruby-element) It appears that HTML 5 will not support complex ruby. -- allen四 names 03:23, 23 September 2009 (UTC)
The current definition has problems, probably because it began as a description of a specific Japanese use, and what's being defined has become more general over time:
Ruby characters are small, annotative glosses that can be placed above or to the right of a Chinese character when writing languages with logographic characters such as Chinese or Japanese to show the pronunciation. Typically called just ruby or rubi, such annotations are usually used as a pronunciation guide for relatively obscure characters.
I'm putting this up here for discussion before making any changes as I am no expert on the subject. Also I feel a bit lazy to make so many changes :-) -- Kai Carver ( talk) 17:33, 27 January 2010 (UTC)
does pinyin ruby plugin for Web browsers exist?
As Ruby the programming language also came from Japan I can't but help think there could be a link here? Does anybody know? Mathmo Talk 06:47, 14 September 2010 (UTC)
Markup example in the article is rendered fine in Safari 4.1.3 (Mac OS 10.4.11). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.63.83.181 ( talk) 10:20, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
I was under the impression that ruby characters had their origin in rubrics, particularly as described in Rubric#Instructions_in_liturgical_contexts:
...rubric has a second meaning of an instruction in a text, regardless of how it is written or printed. This is in fact the oldest recorded meaning in English, found in 1375.
Rubrics were typically printed in red ink, hence the etymological relation to ruby.
Does anyone know more about this? Does it merit mention in the article body? -- Eiríkr Útlendi | Tala við mig 18:55, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
The article on Furigana states that it is "one type of Ruby." This article, however, does not seem to make any clear distinction between Ruby and Furigana. The Furigana article does not contain some of the technical aspects/uses of Ruby. Does it need to be made clear that this is the distinction between the two articles? Opaanderson ( talk) 01:26, 3 December 2012 (UTC)
This portion is entirely unhelpful and seems not to be discussing ruby at all. Also, having looked at the document it cites, at least quickly, nowhere is the little tsu mentioned at all. However, I'm new to editing wikipedia and I don't know the policy for removing portions outright - what should be done here? Telmac ( talk) 15:22, 12 December 2014 (UTC)
Is there a font tool which similarly allows 1 line of text to be written atop another line of text, but where they are of equal size instead of small on big like ruby? Or perhaps to have big on small as its inverse? If there is, I am wondering if I could do an article for them in the see also. Ranze ( talk) 21:20, 12 December 2016 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Ruby character. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 05:20, 3 December 2017 (UTC)