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Hi everyone. I have decided to ask these questions in the hopes that someone - maybe a native speaker or a someone with more expertise on the subject - can add these clarifications to the "Phonology" section of the article, because it has been sometime since I am looking for these answers, and I am sure more beginning students of these languages have been having the same doubts as me:
1. I think I read somewhere that in Malay and Indonesian there is an "automatic" glottal stop before each word-initial vowel (even if this vowel is preceded by a word ending in a consonant), and between any vowels - with the exception of diphthongs, obviously. I did not gave this much thought though, until I realized that that was the way the words were being pronounced in the "Rosetta Stone - Indonesian" language learning software. So here is the question: In the "RS-I" software, are the words being pronounced like that just to make them more easily intelligible for beginners like myself, or are they really pronounced like that in everyday conversations? For instance, a simple sentence like
Apakah ada seorang pria di atas rumah itu?
Would be pronounced
[ʔa'pakah 'ʔada se'ʔorang 'pria di 'ʔatas 'rumah 'ʔitu]
Or, in normal (or maybe fast-paced) conversation,
[a'pakah'adase'orang'priadi'atas'rumah'itu]?
(' = Tonic Syllable)
2. In the same software ("Rosetta Stone - Indonesian"), the tonic syllables of some words seem to be the last one instead of the penultimate, even when the vowel in this syllable is not the schwa, and some words even seem to "change" their tonic syllable according to who is saying them. So here is the other question: Are the accentuation rules really just
"If the penultimate has a schwa, the last syllable is the tonic one; if the penultimate does not have a schwa, the penultimate is the tonic one;"
Or is this wrong?
Thank you very much, XVoX 23:56, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
"However, many Malay dialects are not as mutually intelligible: for example, Kelantanese pronunciation is difficult even for some Malaysians to understand, while Javanese tends to have a lot of words unique to it which will be unfamiliar to other speakers of Malay."
So Javanese is a dialect of Malay? Hayabusa future 02:16, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
I don't think so. However it seems Malaysians also regard Kelantanese, Yawi, and Minangkabau of Negeri Sembilan as a dialect of Malay, so why not? :-p-- Gombang 10:57, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
No, it isn't. I've just fixed that. E.Cogoy 17:03, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
Speaking of Malay dialects, Minangkabau language can be considered a Malay dialect because it uses many Malay words, although they were slight differences in pronunciation, e.g., itiak = itik, for "duck" & goriang = goreng, for "fry/fried". -- 121.218.215.16 ( talk) 12:31, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
Please see Template talk:Distinguish#Incompatible wording for Distinguish2
For now I have changed the hatnote to
-- 83.253.36.136 15:16, 10 May 2007 (UTC)
The last paragraph of this subsection notes,
However, I have it on good authority that Māori and Hawaiian, for example, are very much mutually intelligible. Perhaps this should be changed to read, although many languages of the family are mutually unintelligible?
75.35.227.117 06:47, 5 July 2007 (UTC) --~~~~Insert non-formatted text here
-- Danazach ( talk) 22:43, 14 January 2008 (UTC)
I took out the note about 'x' representing /ks/, /z/ and /s/ because it is unnecessary. Another note, the one about "k" at the end of word being pronounced as a glottal stop should not be under orthography, it is a phonological phenomenon, just like the final vowel reduction - /a/ to schwa in some varieties 128.175.180.149 ( talk) 05:44, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
The article on the Indonesian language begins as follows: "Indonesian (Bahasa Indonesia) is the official language of Indonesia. Indonesian is a standardized dialect of the Malay language that was officially defined..." According to the Indonesian article, Indonesian is a form of Malay. According to this article, Malay is only similar to Indonesian. This article says that Indonesia adopted Malay as its official language but then goes on to refer to only the official register of it used in Malaysia (and Singapore & Brunei?). Shouldn't the wording of the introduction be changed, and the speaker statistics be changed to include Indonesian? And then shouldn't the point be made that the orthography being used in the article is Bahasa Malaysia, with a "main article" link to Indonesian? GSTQ ( talk) 22:34, 17 January 2008 (UTC)
Actually, on closer inspection this article is riddled with inconsistencies. I'm going to fix them up so that Indonesian is included as another official register of the Malay language. GSTQ ( talk) 00:06, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
I think you missed the point of the quotation if you think that the absence of "in Indonesia" was important. The quotation does not purport to include the Malay of other countries. It says Indonesian is a 20th century name, not the 20th century name. The point of the quotation was that Indonesian is a variant of Malay, and that this is not original research. I am familiar with the debate about what constitutes a language. All I'm trying to resolve here is how this article, and indeed all of Wikipedia, deals with this situation, and frankly since both Indonesia and Malaysia's constitutions claim Malay as the national language of each it seems a pretty uncontroversial claim that they are the same language. GSTQ ( talk) 04:57, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
I would like to adress this Malay -Indonesian issue once again: Should Indonesian register as just "a dialect of Malay?" Should Indonesian included in this Malay article, such as speaker of Indonesian included as speaker of Malay thus inflated the numbers of "Malay speaker" worldwide. Admit it, although Indonesian is second language to most of Indonesian, the number of Indonesian speakers are far surpassing Malay speaker, check the entry and compare the wikipedian articles numbers in Malay and Indonesian, you'll get the point. Malay is not an extinct language here in Indonesia, or turn and evolve into Indonesian language as some foreigners might naively perceived. Malay language still survive in Eastern coast of Sumatra and coastal Indonesian Borneo (Kalimantan) as Malay language, pretty much the same to Malay spoken in Peninsula. Malay in Indonesia have its native speakers, Indonesian (almost) not. Today in Indonesia Malay is considered as one of regional language, enjoying same status as Javanese, Sundanese, Minangkabau, and many other native languages in Indonesia. I would like to highlight this issue with different perception held in Malaysia and Indonesia.
The different evolution between Indonesian and Malay has led to a rift between the two standards. This is based more upon political nuance and the history of its standardization than on cultural reasons, and as a result there are asymmetrical different views regarding the other standard among Malaysians and Indonesians. In Malaysia, the national language is Malaysian; in Indonesia, it is Indonesian. The Malaysians tend to assert that Malay and Indonesian are merely variants of the same language, while the Indonesians tend to treat them as separate, albeit related, languages.
Treating Indonesian as the same as Malay or regarding its relations as British-USA english is a wishful or even worse, foolishly naive thinking. It is two separate language. Numbers of net language choice, Indonesian subtitles in Upin and Ipin aired in Indonesian television, vice versa Malay subtitles in Indonesian Sinetron aired in Malaysia, all testify them as two different entity (today). I believe this article took Malaysian side on insisting that Indonesian is the same as Malay. Here in Indonesia we have two of them, Malay spoken in Sumatra and coastal Borneo and Indonesian spoken in whole of Indonesia. Merging its speaker etc. is not doing justice to its history and its contemporary fact. I think Indonesian should be mentioned as took its base on Malay, yet its elements (number of speaker etc.) should not included in Malay language article. Gunkarta ( talk) 12:41, 6 April 2012 (UTC)
Where does the figure of 400 millions Malay speakers come from? Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore, Brunei, Pattani and East Timor together only make some 265 millions inhabitants. Meursault2004 ( talk) 01:58, 26 March 2008 (UTC)
I'm not really sure about this amount of speakers but I want to add: Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore, Brunei, East Timor, Southern Thailand, Southern Phillippines.
I think It's about 300 Millions something... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.53.192.107 ( talk) 12:34, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
I think that will be less, since clearly, Indonesian people (except those who specialize study Malay language and Malay ethnic in Sumatra and Borneo) CAN'T speak it. Therefore can not be categorized a speaker. They (include me) may understand up to certain % of the meaning but when we reply, certainly we will speak Indonesian Language.
In Malaysia, the language is now officially known as Bahasa Malaysia, ("Malaysian language"). Singapore, Brunei and southern Thailand refers to the language as Bahasa Melayu ("Malay language").
In Malaysia, the term Bahasa Malaysia, which was introduced by the National Language Act of 1967, was in use until the 1990s, when most academics and government officials reverted to "Bahasa Melayu," used in the Malay version of the Federal Constitution. According to Article 152 of the Federal Constitution, Bahasa Melayu is the official language of Malaysia. "Bahasa Kebangsaan" (National Language) was also used at one point during the 1970s.
So which is it ? -endorf —Preceding unsigned comment added by Endorf ( talk • contribs) 18:10, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
It'd be great if this page had a map showing usage of the Malay language and derivitives. Mathiastck ( talk) 20:30, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
I think similar to other language group article in wikipedia like Slavic Languages family, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavic_languages. This page does not describes Malay language as a group of language, but instead, more toward "Malaysia Language". Therefore things like grammar, etc should be put in special page about the language. After some searching in the wikipedia, I found an article which better described about the Malay as a language group which is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malay_languages even the link for Standard Malayan Malay is linked to this page while the Standard Indonesian Malay (formal) is linked to Indonesia language. ( 114.59.163.169 ( talk) 14:56, 14 August 2009 (UTC))
I think the Malay is not the official language of Indonesia. As stated by official website of Indonesia government the official language of Indonesia is "Indonesian Language". On the other hand, the term "spoken in Indonesia", is clearly right, since Malay language spoken by Malay ethic in Borneo and Sumatra. Malay in Indonesia can be considered used as local dialect in some parts of Indonesia and not an official langauge. This is similar to Sunda Language, Jawa Language, etc which is spoken by its ethic member. ( 114.59.163.169 ( talk) 14:56, 14 August 2009 (UTC))
"Indonesian and Malay are separated by some centuries of different vocabulary development." The fact is, Indonesian version of Malay was developed early of 20th century. Indonesian as unifying language (as called in Youth's Oath 1928) is even not older than a century. Unless 100 years can be said as "some centuries", correction is needed here. Kembangraps ( talk) 18:28, 11 October 2009 (UTC)
I have the same problem with some text under "Origin", viz.
Although I have already cleaned up the grammar and pronunciation of this part, I have serious doubts about the final clause:
I believe this to constitute nothing more than opinion, and have seen no evidence for it. Thus, after a short pause for reflection - say a week or so - I intend to remove that clause unless someone can offer support for it.
Another factor (for which evidence may exist) should perhaps be mentioned, and that is the fondness of official Indonesian for constructing new portmanteau words and abbreviations, e.g. "Kapolda", found in news reports, which I can only guess to be a contraction of "Ketua Polis Daerah". Again, we would need suitable sources (but I have none) before adding to the article.
yoyo ( talk) 08:37, 23 January 2010 (UTC)
I do not mean to express my opinion about the similarities and the differences between Malay and Indonesian, as i don't know either, but the hatnote that says "Not to be confused with the Indonesian language, a variety officially spoken in Indonesia." is not appropriate. The idea of "Not to be confused" hatnotes is to disambiguate between different meanings of similarly sounding words. "Malay" and "Malayalam" sound similar, but "Malay" and "Indonesian" are completely different.
Besides, the fact that Indonesian is closely related to Malay is mentioned in the opening paragraph.
I am removing that hatnote. -- Amir E. Aharoni ( talk) 11:31, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
There are lots of Malay Dialects spoken in South East Asian. This works like the Chinese or Indians that has lots of dialects where outsiders almost can't tell the differences. These different dialects can be detected if a researcher stayed and listen carefully on different speakers.
Much of the cause of these differences are the many Malay Kingdoms around South East Asia before that developing the language on their own ways. Some are not too different and some are totally hard to understand. Until today, there are still 10 official Malay Kingdom with Kings or Sultanates, that are the 9 Kings or Sultanates of Malaysia and One Sultan of Kingdom of Brunei. However, there are also unofficial Malay Kings such as in Southern Thailand, Southern Philippines, and some parts of the Indonesian Islands such as in the Sumatra. Other lost Malay Kingdoms are the Pattani of South Thailand, Temasik of Singapore, Sulu of South Philippines, Malacca of Central Malay Peninsula, Acheh of North Sumatra, Palembang of Middle Sumatra and many more. Much of the lost kingdoms are because of the Colonization age. In Malaysia alone, the Malay Language are varied according to different states (Kingdoms). There are the Northern Malay Dialects spoken by the State of Kedah, Penang, Perlis and Northern Perak. The Johore-Riau Dialects are spoken in Selangor, Johore, Malacca and Singaporean Malay. The Unique Dialects that spoken only in their own states are the Nogori Dialects Spoken by the State of Negeri Sembilan Natives, the Perakian Dialects spoken by the Perak Natives, The Terengganu Dialects spoken by the Terengganu natives, the Pahang Dialects spoken by the Pahang Natives, the Kelantanese Dialects spoken by the Kelantan Natives, Sarawakian Dialects spoken by the Sarawak Malays and the Sabahan Dialects spoken by the Sabah Malays. The Southern Thailand of Malay area in Pattani spoke much similar to the Kelantanese and the Southern Thailand of Malay area in Narathiwat spoke much the same with the Northern Malay Dialects (Kedah Perlis). The Southern Philippines of Malay Area (Mindanao and Sulu) can be understood by the Sabahan Malays and the Kadazans becaus it is quite close to their Dialects.
A very common Malay Dialects that being considered as Official Malay Language (Bahasa Melayu/Bahasa Malaysia) are the Johore-Riau Dialects. These Dialects has been officially used in the government sectors, Mass-media (Printed and Electronics) and schools. A very unique dialects and considered as hard to understand are the Kelantanese, the Terengganu, and the Sarawakian Dialects.
If you find out that there are lots of Malay Dialects in parts of Malaysia-Singapore, Southern Thailand, and Southern Philippines. These are not too much if to compare with the diversity of Dialects in Indonesia. That would be covered in the different topics. Snoiprocs16 ( talk) 15:53, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
IMO grammar at Malaysian and Indonesian should be merged here, to avoid a content fork. The two standards differ primarily in vocab, but there's very little diff otherwise. We could leave a summary, but currently we have a lot of detail. I tagged the sections at Indo that IMO should be here; at Malaysian, it's primarily phonology that's dup'd, tho I'm guessing we'd want to leave at least a basic chart, as at Indo.
Titles are good, though we might want to consider 'Malaysian Malay' and 'Indonesian Malay' to clarify that these aren't languages any more than American English and British English are. Only prob w that is that 'Indonesian Malay' might be construed as native Malay spoken in Riau and Sumatra, which is called Bahasa Malayu rather than Bahasa Indonesia in Indonesia. — kwami ( talk) 08:06, 9 September 2010 (UTC)
Merge more or less done, and I expanded a bit, though this article needs a lot of work! — kwami ( talk) 13:11, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
I have added the awalan "juru-" into this article, since it is one of the five Malay noun prefixes. To note, Malay has five awalan or prefixes such as peN-, pe-, peR-, ke-, and juru-.
This was edited by me by referring to the Dewan Bahasa & Pustaka (DBP)'s grammar book, that is Tatabahasa Dewan Edisi Baharu. This loss of facts or information should be avoided in the future.
Master of Books ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 10:01, 16 November 2010 (UTC).
I would like to propose the following
The Etymology of Malay or Malayu goes back to the 7th century and is derived from what the Kshatriya ruling class of the Srivijaya Kingdom (the bunts and the Nairs), who were from South West region of India speaking Malayalam a Dravidian dialect named from Ancient times from Malaya Mountains where it originated. This is evidenced by the Balinese Kshatriya's who claim ancestral origin from south west India Kshatriya casts. Some historian promote that the word Melayu derives from the Sanskrit] term Malaiur translated as "land of mountains" which is erroneous since Sanskrit nor any other Prakrit has a similar word in context. During the time of the first unified Kingdom of the region the local people must have identified with the rulers and started to refer themselves as such, So when the European colonist first arrived the must have proclaimed themselves 'Malayu' or any such other similar variant. — Preceding unsigned comment added by NoeticOne ( talk • contribs) 08:13, 23 January 2011 (UTC)
Should we include the as Indonesian, as Malaysian, and possible others such as as Bruneian in the infobox after each country such as the IP just added to East Timor? Chipmunkdavis ( talk) 06:15, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
Can somebody give a reference to the term Malaysian language being the official English translation of the Malay term Bahasa Malaysia? The English translation in Malaysian English has always been, simply, Malay language. As in most things in Malaysia, the English term Malay refers to Malay ethnicity and native language, while Malaysian refers to nationality of all races, or in the context of the whole nation.
Malaysian language, to my best knowledge, can only be referred as an improper noun, as in Kadazan is a Malaysian language. Bahasa Indonesia is officially translated as Indonesian, but Bahasa Malaysia is still Malay language in Standard Malaysian, Singaporean, and Bruneian English. While I understand the need to separate between the general Malay language (in reference to the lingua franca of the region) and Bahasa Malaysia, I do not agree with the term Malaysian language without citing references.
To highlight my point further, see how ridiculous this sentence sounds: Malaysian is the official language of Brunei, and one of the four official languages of Singapore. The English version of the constitution of all these three Commonwealth countries clearly used the term Malay language, and not Malaysian language - even in Malaysia.
-- Anggerik ( talk) 21:03, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
Since when c and j are [t͡s] and [d͡z]? I just noticed it under the Phonology heading and I remember most sources saying it's [t͡ʃ] and [d͡ʒ] respectively. – Fanatix 08:22, 24 August 2011 (UTC)
The hatnote says: "This article is about the standard language. For the different variants and dialects, see Malay languages."
This is rather confusing: My impression is that it's about the common language of which the languages of Malaysia, Indonesia and Brunei are official varieties. -- Amir E. Aharoni ( talk) 18:16, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
Another problem is that this article mentions the term "Indonesian Malay" several times. It is unclear whether this refers to the official language of Indonesia ( Indonesian language) or to the language of Indonesian Malays. The section Differences between Malaysian and Indonesian#Perception says that these are two separate things. -- Amir E. Aharoni ( talk) 18:16, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
ummm yeah. Malay is not spoken in the Philippines (unfortunately, which I as a Filipino, find to be VERY DISCGRACEFUL).
can someone like...upload a map where Philippines is NOT colored AT ALL? there are BARELY any Malay speakers in here. maybe there's "some" Malay speakers in Mindanao and Sulu but, again....its a bare amount. they just work as language translators, between Malays and Filipinos. thats not really a true speaker.
it may SEEM like there is but there isn't. "Filipinos" these days are too busy glorifying their Spanish and American conquerers while the Malays and Indonesians loathed them. its always great to reflect on a history, but Filipinos these days brag too much about it instead of finding their way back to their Malay roots REGARDLESS of being Catholic or Muslim, and again...this is unfortunate and discgraceful and embarassing to our southern neighbors. PacificWarrior101 ( talk) 01:00, 20 February 2012 (UTC)PacificWarrior101
It's really great to see it fixed. Really. Thanks. Terima Kasih! Salamat talaga! PacificWarrior101 ( talk) 03:10, 24 March 2012 (UTC)PacificWarrior101
Could someone add the Malay pronunciation to the Hassanal Bolkiah article abd Al-Muhtadee Billah?
“ | Standard Malay, also called Court Malay, was the literary standard of the pre-colonial Malacca and Riau-Johor Sultunates, and so the language is sometimes called Malacca Malay or Riau-Johor Malay | ” |
“ | The Malay language originated in Sumatra, where it has its closest relatives. The oldest inscriptions in Malay, Kedukan Bukit Inscription, dating from the end of the 7th century AD, were found on the banks of the River Tatang, a tributary of the River Musi, South Sumatra. It is the oldest surviving speciment of the Malay language, in a form known as Old Malay. "Malayu" was the name of an old kingdom located in Jambi province in eastern Sumatra. It was known in ancient Chinese texts as "Mo-lo-yo" and mentioned in the Nagarakertagama, an old Javanese epic written in 1365, as one of the "tributary states" of the Majapahit kingdom in eastern Java. | ” |
“ | From the island of Sumatra, the Malay language spread to peninsular South-east Asia (later known as Malaya and subsequently known as west Malaysia). | ” |
Please be very aware of how your posts are presented here, how text is rendered, etc. It's really confusing to read who has said what. If you want your comments/posts to be clear, then I suggest the following be adhered to:
Not all of my points above are necessarily part of policy, and you do not have to abide by them. On the other hand, they will help you get your message across. You may all think the above section is clear because you made the comments and you remember who said what, but for the first time reader (like me) it's a confusing mess, and I for one, cannot be bothered trying to work it out and hence your points are, at least in part, lost on me. -- Merbabu ( talk) 23:43, 14 July 2012 (UTC)
There's a really silly edit war going on here. Unless it can be established convincingly with reliable sources that Johor-Riau is the accepted term then the current Riau-Johor phrase should remain. It is the status quo for a long time, and there is no consensus yet to change it. Even if you someone does bring evidence/references to this talk page that they believe proves Johor-Riau is "correct" they must not change the article until consensus is reached here first. If it is changed again without agreement being reached first, then I will ask administrators to watch or even protect the page. And I'm happy to do this with any other editing dispute. cheers -- Merbabu ( talk) 23:47, 14 July 2012 (UTC)
http://www.lexilogos.com/english/malay_dictionary.htm
These old dictionaries contain the Malay words in both Jawi script and Roman script, so it will help non malays identify terms in Jawi script, and also they are significant and unique because modern english malay dictionaries only use Roman script and not Jawi anymore, so they should be put into the further reading section.
Jawi and Romanised
Romanised only
http://books.google.com/books?id=359kAAAAMAAJ
A practical Malay grammar
English, Sulu, Malay vocabulary
http://www.readanybook.com/author/andson-cowie-william-clark-cowie-192229
ENGLISH, SULU, AND MALAY VOCABULARY
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41560760?
ENGLISH, SULU, AND MALAY VOCABULARY W. E. Maxwell and T. H. HAYNES Journal of the Straits Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society No. 16 (DECEMBER, 1885), pp. 321-384 Published by: Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41560760 Page Count: 64
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41607025?
ENGLISH, SULU, AND MALAY VOCABULARY (Continued) T. H. Haynes Journal of the Straits Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society No. 18 (DECEMBER, 1886), pp. 191, 193-239 Published by: Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41607025 Page Count: 48
Teaching Malay
https://archive.org/details/cu31924011084948
Grammar
https://archive.org/details/practicalmalaygr00shelrich
https://archive.org/details/simplebutcomplet00pear
https://archive.org/details/grammarofmalayan00mars
https://archive.org/details/agrammarmalayan00marsgoog
https://archive.org/details/agrammarmalayan01marsgoog
https://archive.org/details/colloquialmalays00wins
https://archive.org/details/grammairedelala00favrgoog
https://archive.org/details/grammairedelalan00favr
A Malay manual with grammar, reading exercises, and vocabularies
https://archive.org/details/malaymanualwithg00freerich
Dictionary
https://archive.org/details/aeg2034.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afu7967.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/dictionaryofmala00marsrich
https://archive.org/details/dictionaryofmala01howi
https://archive.org/details/dictionnairemal00favrgoog
https://archive.org/details/dictionnairemal01favrgoog
https://archive.org/details/afu7933.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afu7933.0002.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/kitbpadameniatk00richgoog
https://archive.org/details/ahy2565.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afu7946.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afh0364.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/maleischnederla00tuukgoog
https://archive.org/details/afh0364.0003.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afu7948.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afh0364.0002.001.umich.edu
Grammar and Dictionary
https://archive.org/details/grammardictionar00craw
https://archive.org/details/grammardictionar02craw
https://archive.org/details/malaygrammar00winsrich
Vocabulary
https://archive.org/details/cu31924081220968
https://archive.org/details/vocabularyofengl01swet
https://archive.org/details/malayenglishvoca00sheliala
https://archive.org/details/afu7962.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afu7954.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afu7962.0002.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/anr0813.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/anr0813.0002.001.umich.edu
A lexilogus of the English, Malay, and Chinese languages : comprehending the vernacular idioms of the last in the Hok-keen and Canton dialects
https://archive.org/details/lexilogusofengli00malarich
The Singapore triglot vocabulary (English, Malay, Chinese)
https://archive.org/details/afu7959.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/singaporetriglo00shelgoog
A manual of the Malay language. With an introductory sketch of the Sanskrit element in Malay
https://archive.org/details/manualofmalaylan00maxwrich
https://archive.org/details/amanualofthemala25604gut
A Malay reader (romanized) for the use of pupils in the second standard of the vernacular schools of the Straits Settlements
https://archive.org/details/malayreaderroman00strarich
Malay Texts
https://archive.org/details/kitabperboewatan00klin
https://archive.org/details/wasiyatyanglamay33klin
https://archive.org/details/aeq4245.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/cu31924008136537
Dutch-Malay
https://archive.org/details/cu31924020365494
Bibles
https://archive.org/details/kitabindjilsoetj00klin
https://archive.org/details/hetnieuwetestame04klin
https://archive.org/details/wasiatjangbeharo00klin
https://archive.org/details/wasiyatyanglamay11klin
https://archive.org/details/wasiyatyanglamay22klin
https://archive.org/details/zaboorijaitoeseg00veth
Malay phonetics
https://archive.org/details/cu31924084672934
The Malay orthography
https://archive.org/details/malayorthography00hudsrich
Glossaire explicatif des mots de provenance malaise et javanaise
https://archive.org/details/GlossaireExplicatifDesMotsDeProvenanceMalaiseEtJavanaise
Mémoire, lettres et rapports relatifs au cours de langues malaye et javanaise fait à la Bibliothèque royale pendant les années 1840-41, 1841-42, et à deux voyages littéraires entrepris en Angleterre, pendant les années 1838 et 1840 (1843)
https://archive.org/details/mmoirelettreset00dulagoog
Catalogue of Malay manuscripts and manuscripts relating to the Malay language in the Bodleian library
https://archive.org/details/cu31924023611746
The natives of Sarawak and British North Borneo; based chiefly on the mss. of the late H. B. Low, Sarawak government service
https://archive.org/details/nativessarawaka01lowgoog
Rajmaan ( talk) 18:36, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41492943?
THE MISSING SECOND EDITION OF C.H. THOMSEN AND ABDULLAH BIN ABDUL KADIR'S ENGLISH AND MALAY VOCABULARY JOHN BASTIN Journal of the Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Vol. 56, No. 1 (244) (1983), pp. 10-11 Published by: Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41492943 Page Count: 4
History of Malay Chinese Dictionaries
http://books.google.com/books?id=BCmcEkjWOI4C&pg=PA75#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=5jz6acTOquoC&pg=PA79#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=VToJrBPbQ9AC&pg=PA493#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=hhvDD2NHv9gC&pg=PA143#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=PHo9AAAAIAAJ&pg=PA137#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://catalog.hathitrust.org/Record/007704411
https://archive.org/details/vocabularyofengl00sing
21:16, 15 February 2014 (UTC)
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41493568?
BABA MALAY DIALECT TAN CHEE-BENG Journal of the Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Vol. 53, No. 1 (237) (1980), pp. 150-166 Published by: Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41493568 Page Count: 17
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41493734?
The Malay Chetty Creole Language of Malacca: A Historical and Linguistic Perspective Noriah Mohamed Journal of the Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Vol. 82, No. 1 (296) (June 2009), pp. 55-70 Published by: Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41493734 Page Count: 16
A Vocabulary of Brunei Malay H. B. Marshall Journal of the Straits Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society No. 83 (APRIL, 1921), pp. 45-74 Published by: Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Stable URL: http://www.jstor.org/stable/41561363 Page Count: 30
http://guides.lib.umich.edu/islamicmsstudies/onlinecollections
Adat
Agama
Bahasa
Hikayat
Kitab Tib
Lain-lain
Salasilah dan Sejarah
Syair
Undang-undang
Ambonese Malay
http://eap.bl.uk/database/overview_project.a4d?projID=EAP276;r=41
http://eap.bl.uk/database/results.a4d?projID=EAP276
Auroux, Sylvain; Koerner, E.F.K.; Niederehe, Hans-Josef; Versteegh, Kees: History of the Language Sciences / Geschichte der Sprachwissenschaften / Histoire des sciences du langage. 1. Teilband edited by Sylvain Auroux
http://books.google.com/books?id=JqxnjTKaQvQC&pg=PA333#v=onepage&q=Malay&f=false
http://www.jstor.org/stable/25817713?
MALAY: A SHORT HISTORY
K. ALEXANDER ADELAAR
Oriente Moderno
Nuova serie, Anno 19 (80), Nr. 2, ALAM MELAYU IL MONDO MALESE: LINGUA, STORIA, CULTURA (2000), pp. 225-242
Published by: Istituto per l'Oriente C. A. Nallino
Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/25817713
Page Count: 18
http://www.jstor.org/stable/3488474?
Malay
C. O. Blagden
Bulletin of the School of Oriental Studies, University of London
Vol. 1, No. 1 (1917), pp. 97-100
Published by: Cambridge University Press on behalf of the School of Oriental and African Studies
Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/3488474
Page Count: 4
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41493148?
EARLY MALAY PRINTING: an Introduction to the British Library Collections
ANNABEL TEH GALLOP
Journal of the Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society
Vol. 63, No. 1 (258) (1990), pp. 85-124
Published by: Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society
Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41493148
Page Count: 40
Hanlin_Academy#Foreign_language_vocabularies
A Chinese Vocabulary of Malacca Malay Words and Phrases Collected between A.D.1403 and 1511?
A Chinese Vocabulary of Malacca Malay Words and Phrases Collected between A. D. 1403 and 1511 (?) E. D. Edwards and C. O. Blagden Bulletin of the School of Oriental Studies, University of London, Vol. 6, No. 3 (1931), pp. 715-749 Published by: Cambridge University Press on behalf of the School of Oriental and African Studies Article Stable URL: http://www.jstor.org/stable/607205
Page 95
Rajmaan ( talk) 01:55, 13 January 2015 (UTC)
History of Malay Chinese Dictionaries
http://books.google.com/books?id=BCmcEkjWOI4C&pg=PA75#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=5jz6acTOquoC&pg=PA79#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=VToJrBPbQ9AC&pg=PA493#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=hhvDD2NHv9gC&pg=PA143#v=onepage&q&f=false
The article currently says there is no grammatical plural, but Reduplication#Function_and_meaning claims the same thing I had thought: that plurals are indicated by reduplication. Can someone clarify? —Largo Plazo ( talk) 16:00, 19 August 2013 (UTC)
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Please, how to make that all and only Indonesian IP users get redirected to Indonesian language when trying to view this article. Thank you. 202.73.225.84 ( talk) 22:56, 1 June 2015 (UTC) 202.73.225.84 ( talk) 22:56, 1 June 2015 (UTC)
Is Indonesian and Malay the same language. When I am trying to access a website and set the language to Malay, the webpage shows the Indonesian version of the webpage, like flirchi.com. I think they are the same language. Please merge Indonesian and Malay Wikipedia. Thank You. 139.193.86.20 ( talk) 07:00, 2 June 2015 (UTC)
I set a smartphone language to Malay. When I am running an Android app which has Indonesian language resources but no Malay language resources (such as Cymera), while the smartphone language is set to Malay, the application used the default language (usually English) and not Indonesian language. Why? Does Android know that Indonesian is similar to Malay? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.73.225.18 ( talk) 13:39, 2 June 2015 (UTC)
I want to redirect this page to Indonesian language for all and only Indonesian IPs. How this can be done? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.62.17.217 ( talk) 00:32, 1 August 2015 (UTC)
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An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Malay langauge. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. Steel1943 ( talk) 18:29, 11 November 2019 (UTC)
I felt article Islamic_literature is in bit of neglect so I added my note on talk page there, requesting to take note of Talk:Islamic_literature#Article_review. If possible requesting copy edit support. Suggestions for suitable reference sources at Talk:Islamic_literature is also welcome.
Posting message here too for neutrality sake
Thanks and greetings
Bookku ( talk) 08:27, 21 May 2020 (UTC)
The terms "Aurat", "Arvad", "Avret", and "Awrath" may refer to: Women of Asian religious or cultural descent and identity.
Self nomination for AFD since article copy pasted to Draft:Aurat for incubation because IMHO current article title Aurat (word) is misleading and confusing leading to western systemic bias and stifling the article growth. Please find Detail reason at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Aurat (word)
I invite project members to review current and potential sourcing and weigh in on the AfD discussion. Thanks! Bookku ( talk) 02:58, 10 June 2020 (UTC)
Hello many greetings,
Requesting your proactive contribution and support in updating Draft:Aurats (word) in relation to the related languages you know well.
Thanks and warm regards
Bookku ( talk) 03:20, 12 July 2020 (UTC)
Bahasa Indonesia or Indonesian language is indeed originated from Bahasa Melayu, but calling it Bahasa Melayu or Malay would make it complicated in the Indonesian context as Bahasa Melayu is one of the regional languages in Indonesia 202.43.95.31 ( talk) 19:07, 23 March 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 09:07, 29 August 2022 (UTC)
I fail to see how Malay could be a “recognised minority language” in Australia, seeing as we do not recognise any language in any official capacity. 101.112.0.95 ( talk) 22:20, 21 October 2022 (UTC)
@ Bebasnama: Before you add "Melindo" as alternative name for the Malay macro-language again, I advise you to carefully read the source that you have cited. The volume is correctly entitled Melbourne Studies in Education, the relevant chapter is "Language and Values in Indonesia" by Sue Nichterlein. Here's a courtesy link for all editors with a Internet Archive account: [21]. In this chapter, the author describes attempts in the 1950s to create a unified standard language from Indonesian and Standard Malay (as then used in Malaya) under the umbrella term "Bahasa Melindo". This project was aborted in the Konfrontasi period. So the "Melindo" language never has come to be, and the term is simply not used as an alternative name for Malay/Indonesian as a pluricentric language.
The associated "Melindo spelling" (Ejaan Melindo) is discussed some sources about the Malay/Indonesian spelling reform proposals of the 1950s, 60s and 70s.
This footnote of history might be an interesting addition to this article (or History of the Malay language), but it's nothing to be mentioned in the infobox. Austronesier ( talk) 19:39, 15 August 2023 (UTC)
Why this sentence had to use quotation mark like this? (including 260 million as "Indonesian".) Whats the matter for using such feature? Thank you. 182.253.54.81 ( talk) 09:50, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
@ Ckfasdf: While Indonesian shares historical roots with Malay and there is mutual intelligibility to some extent, Indonesian has undergone significant linguistic development and standardization efforts, leading to differences in vocabulary, grammar, and pronunciation. Additionally, Indonesian has absorbed vocabulary from various local languages spoken across the Indonesian archipelago, further distinguishing it from classical Malay. Bayoka55 ( talk) 21:11, 20 March 2024 (UTC)
L1 numbers are listed at 83 million, but in the /info/en/?search=List_of_languages_by_total_number_of_speakers article, Indonesian is listed as 44 million, and on ethnologue ( https://www.ethnologue.com/insights/ethnologue200/) Malay L1+L2 is listed as 19.2m, so are the extra 19 million coming from 'Baba Malay' and 'Baba Indonesian'?
It would be helpful if someone could post the L2 figures from Ethnologue so at least things would be consistent in the infobox. 90.167.94.143 ( talk) 00:36, 23 May 2024 (UTC)
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Hi everyone. I have decided to ask these questions in the hopes that someone - maybe a native speaker or a someone with more expertise on the subject - can add these clarifications to the "Phonology" section of the article, because it has been sometime since I am looking for these answers, and I am sure more beginning students of these languages have been having the same doubts as me:
1. I think I read somewhere that in Malay and Indonesian there is an "automatic" glottal stop before each word-initial vowel (even if this vowel is preceded by a word ending in a consonant), and between any vowels - with the exception of diphthongs, obviously. I did not gave this much thought though, until I realized that that was the way the words were being pronounced in the "Rosetta Stone - Indonesian" language learning software. So here is the question: In the "RS-I" software, are the words being pronounced like that just to make them more easily intelligible for beginners like myself, or are they really pronounced like that in everyday conversations? For instance, a simple sentence like
Apakah ada seorang pria di atas rumah itu?
Would be pronounced
[ʔa'pakah 'ʔada se'ʔorang 'pria di 'ʔatas 'rumah 'ʔitu]
Or, in normal (or maybe fast-paced) conversation,
[a'pakah'adase'orang'priadi'atas'rumah'itu]?
(' = Tonic Syllable)
2. In the same software ("Rosetta Stone - Indonesian"), the tonic syllables of some words seem to be the last one instead of the penultimate, even when the vowel in this syllable is not the schwa, and some words even seem to "change" their tonic syllable according to who is saying them. So here is the other question: Are the accentuation rules really just
"If the penultimate has a schwa, the last syllable is the tonic one; if the penultimate does not have a schwa, the penultimate is the tonic one;"
Or is this wrong?
Thank you very much, XVoX 23:56, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
"However, many Malay dialects are not as mutually intelligible: for example, Kelantanese pronunciation is difficult even for some Malaysians to understand, while Javanese tends to have a lot of words unique to it which will be unfamiliar to other speakers of Malay."
So Javanese is a dialect of Malay? Hayabusa future 02:16, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
I don't think so. However it seems Malaysians also regard Kelantanese, Yawi, and Minangkabau of Negeri Sembilan as a dialect of Malay, so why not? :-p-- Gombang 10:57, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
No, it isn't. I've just fixed that. E.Cogoy 17:03, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
Speaking of Malay dialects, Minangkabau language can be considered a Malay dialect because it uses many Malay words, although they were slight differences in pronunciation, e.g., itiak = itik, for "duck" & goriang = goreng, for "fry/fried". -- 121.218.215.16 ( talk) 12:31, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
Please see Template talk:Distinguish#Incompatible wording for Distinguish2
For now I have changed the hatnote to
-- 83.253.36.136 15:16, 10 May 2007 (UTC)
The last paragraph of this subsection notes,
However, I have it on good authority that Māori and Hawaiian, for example, are very much mutually intelligible. Perhaps this should be changed to read, although many languages of the family are mutually unintelligible?
75.35.227.117 06:47, 5 July 2007 (UTC) --~~~~Insert non-formatted text here
-- Danazach ( talk) 22:43, 14 January 2008 (UTC)
I took out the note about 'x' representing /ks/, /z/ and /s/ because it is unnecessary. Another note, the one about "k" at the end of word being pronounced as a glottal stop should not be under orthography, it is a phonological phenomenon, just like the final vowel reduction - /a/ to schwa in some varieties 128.175.180.149 ( talk) 05:44, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
The article on the Indonesian language begins as follows: "Indonesian (Bahasa Indonesia) is the official language of Indonesia. Indonesian is a standardized dialect of the Malay language that was officially defined..." According to the Indonesian article, Indonesian is a form of Malay. According to this article, Malay is only similar to Indonesian. This article says that Indonesia adopted Malay as its official language but then goes on to refer to only the official register of it used in Malaysia (and Singapore & Brunei?). Shouldn't the wording of the introduction be changed, and the speaker statistics be changed to include Indonesian? And then shouldn't the point be made that the orthography being used in the article is Bahasa Malaysia, with a "main article" link to Indonesian? GSTQ ( talk) 22:34, 17 January 2008 (UTC)
Actually, on closer inspection this article is riddled with inconsistencies. I'm going to fix them up so that Indonesian is included as another official register of the Malay language. GSTQ ( talk) 00:06, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
I think you missed the point of the quotation if you think that the absence of "in Indonesia" was important. The quotation does not purport to include the Malay of other countries. It says Indonesian is a 20th century name, not the 20th century name. The point of the quotation was that Indonesian is a variant of Malay, and that this is not original research. I am familiar with the debate about what constitutes a language. All I'm trying to resolve here is how this article, and indeed all of Wikipedia, deals with this situation, and frankly since both Indonesia and Malaysia's constitutions claim Malay as the national language of each it seems a pretty uncontroversial claim that they are the same language. GSTQ ( talk) 04:57, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
I would like to adress this Malay -Indonesian issue once again: Should Indonesian register as just "a dialect of Malay?" Should Indonesian included in this Malay article, such as speaker of Indonesian included as speaker of Malay thus inflated the numbers of "Malay speaker" worldwide. Admit it, although Indonesian is second language to most of Indonesian, the number of Indonesian speakers are far surpassing Malay speaker, check the entry and compare the wikipedian articles numbers in Malay and Indonesian, you'll get the point. Malay is not an extinct language here in Indonesia, or turn and evolve into Indonesian language as some foreigners might naively perceived. Malay language still survive in Eastern coast of Sumatra and coastal Indonesian Borneo (Kalimantan) as Malay language, pretty much the same to Malay spoken in Peninsula. Malay in Indonesia have its native speakers, Indonesian (almost) not. Today in Indonesia Malay is considered as one of regional language, enjoying same status as Javanese, Sundanese, Minangkabau, and many other native languages in Indonesia. I would like to highlight this issue with different perception held in Malaysia and Indonesia.
The different evolution between Indonesian and Malay has led to a rift between the two standards. This is based more upon political nuance and the history of its standardization than on cultural reasons, and as a result there are asymmetrical different views regarding the other standard among Malaysians and Indonesians. In Malaysia, the national language is Malaysian; in Indonesia, it is Indonesian. The Malaysians tend to assert that Malay and Indonesian are merely variants of the same language, while the Indonesians tend to treat them as separate, albeit related, languages.
Treating Indonesian as the same as Malay or regarding its relations as British-USA english is a wishful or even worse, foolishly naive thinking. It is two separate language. Numbers of net language choice, Indonesian subtitles in Upin and Ipin aired in Indonesian television, vice versa Malay subtitles in Indonesian Sinetron aired in Malaysia, all testify them as two different entity (today). I believe this article took Malaysian side on insisting that Indonesian is the same as Malay. Here in Indonesia we have two of them, Malay spoken in Sumatra and coastal Borneo and Indonesian spoken in whole of Indonesia. Merging its speaker etc. is not doing justice to its history and its contemporary fact. I think Indonesian should be mentioned as took its base on Malay, yet its elements (number of speaker etc.) should not included in Malay language article. Gunkarta ( talk) 12:41, 6 April 2012 (UTC)
Where does the figure of 400 millions Malay speakers come from? Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore, Brunei, Pattani and East Timor together only make some 265 millions inhabitants. Meursault2004 ( talk) 01:58, 26 March 2008 (UTC)
I'm not really sure about this amount of speakers but I want to add: Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore, Brunei, East Timor, Southern Thailand, Southern Phillippines.
I think It's about 300 Millions something... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.53.192.107 ( talk) 12:34, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
I think that will be less, since clearly, Indonesian people (except those who specialize study Malay language and Malay ethnic in Sumatra and Borneo) CAN'T speak it. Therefore can not be categorized a speaker. They (include me) may understand up to certain % of the meaning but when we reply, certainly we will speak Indonesian Language.
In Malaysia, the language is now officially known as Bahasa Malaysia, ("Malaysian language"). Singapore, Brunei and southern Thailand refers to the language as Bahasa Melayu ("Malay language").
In Malaysia, the term Bahasa Malaysia, which was introduced by the National Language Act of 1967, was in use until the 1990s, when most academics and government officials reverted to "Bahasa Melayu," used in the Malay version of the Federal Constitution. According to Article 152 of the Federal Constitution, Bahasa Melayu is the official language of Malaysia. "Bahasa Kebangsaan" (National Language) was also used at one point during the 1970s.
So which is it ? -endorf —Preceding unsigned comment added by Endorf ( talk • contribs) 18:10, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
It'd be great if this page had a map showing usage of the Malay language and derivitives. Mathiastck ( talk) 20:30, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
I think similar to other language group article in wikipedia like Slavic Languages family, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavic_languages. This page does not describes Malay language as a group of language, but instead, more toward "Malaysia Language". Therefore things like grammar, etc should be put in special page about the language. After some searching in the wikipedia, I found an article which better described about the Malay as a language group which is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malay_languages even the link for Standard Malayan Malay is linked to this page while the Standard Indonesian Malay (formal) is linked to Indonesia language. ( 114.59.163.169 ( talk) 14:56, 14 August 2009 (UTC))
I think the Malay is not the official language of Indonesia. As stated by official website of Indonesia government the official language of Indonesia is "Indonesian Language". On the other hand, the term "spoken in Indonesia", is clearly right, since Malay language spoken by Malay ethic in Borneo and Sumatra. Malay in Indonesia can be considered used as local dialect in some parts of Indonesia and not an official langauge. This is similar to Sunda Language, Jawa Language, etc which is spoken by its ethic member. ( 114.59.163.169 ( talk) 14:56, 14 August 2009 (UTC))
"Indonesian and Malay are separated by some centuries of different vocabulary development." The fact is, Indonesian version of Malay was developed early of 20th century. Indonesian as unifying language (as called in Youth's Oath 1928) is even not older than a century. Unless 100 years can be said as "some centuries", correction is needed here. Kembangraps ( talk) 18:28, 11 October 2009 (UTC)
I have the same problem with some text under "Origin", viz.
Although I have already cleaned up the grammar and pronunciation of this part, I have serious doubts about the final clause:
I believe this to constitute nothing more than opinion, and have seen no evidence for it. Thus, after a short pause for reflection - say a week or so - I intend to remove that clause unless someone can offer support for it.
Another factor (for which evidence may exist) should perhaps be mentioned, and that is the fondness of official Indonesian for constructing new portmanteau words and abbreviations, e.g. "Kapolda", found in news reports, which I can only guess to be a contraction of "Ketua Polis Daerah". Again, we would need suitable sources (but I have none) before adding to the article.
yoyo ( talk) 08:37, 23 January 2010 (UTC)
I do not mean to express my opinion about the similarities and the differences between Malay and Indonesian, as i don't know either, but the hatnote that says "Not to be confused with the Indonesian language, a variety officially spoken in Indonesia." is not appropriate. The idea of "Not to be confused" hatnotes is to disambiguate between different meanings of similarly sounding words. "Malay" and "Malayalam" sound similar, but "Malay" and "Indonesian" are completely different.
Besides, the fact that Indonesian is closely related to Malay is mentioned in the opening paragraph.
I am removing that hatnote. -- Amir E. Aharoni ( talk) 11:31, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
There are lots of Malay Dialects spoken in South East Asian. This works like the Chinese or Indians that has lots of dialects where outsiders almost can't tell the differences. These different dialects can be detected if a researcher stayed and listen carefully on different speakers.
Much of the cause of these differences are the many Malay Kingdoms around South East Asia before that developing the language on their own ways. Some are not too different and some are totally hard to understand. Until today, there are still 10 official Malay Kingdom with Kings or Sultanates, that are the 9 Kings or Sultanates of Malaysia and One Sultan of Kingdom of Brunei. However, there are also unofficial Malay Kings such as in Southern Thailand, Southern Philippines, and some parts of the Indonesian Islands such as in the Sumatra. Other lost Malay Kingdoms are the Pattani of South Thailand, Temasik of Singapore, Sulu of South Philippines, Malacca of Central Malay Peninsula, Acheh of North Sumatra, Palembang of Middle Sumatra and many more. Much of the lost kingdoms are because of the Colonization age. In Malaysia alone, the Malay Language are varied according to different states (Kingdoms). There are the Northern Malay Dialects spoken by the State of Kedah, Penang, Perlis and Northern Perak. The Johore-Riau Dialects are spoken in Selangor, Johore, Malacca and Singaporean Malay. The Unique Dialects that spoken only in their own states are the Nogori Dialects Spoken by the State of Negeri Sembilan Natives, the Perakian Dialects spoken by the Perak Natives, The Terengganu Dialects spoken by the Terengganu natives, the Pahang Dialects spoken by the Pahang Natives, the Kelantanese Dialects spoken by the Kelantan Natives, Sarawakian Dialects spoken by the Sarawak Malays and the Sabahan Dialects spoken by the Sabah Malays. The Southern Thailand of Malay area in Pattani spoke much similar to the Kelantanese and the Southern Thailand of Malay area in Narathiwat spoke much the same with the Northern Malay Dialects (Kedah Perlis). The Southern Philippines of Malay Area (Mindanao and Sulu) can be understood by the Sabahan Malays and the Kadazans becaus it is quite close to their Dialects.
A very common Malay Dialects that being considered as Official Malay Language (Bahasa Melayu/Bahasa Malaysia) are the Johore-Riau Dialects. These Dialects has been officially used in the government sectors, Mass-media (Printed and Electronics) and schools. A very unique dialects and considered as hard to understand are the Kelantanese, the Terengganu, and the Sarawakian Dialects.
If you find out that there are lots of Malay Dialects in parts of Malaysia-Singapore, Southern Thailand, and Southern Philippines. These are not too much if to compare with the diversity of Dialects in Indonesia. That would be covered in the different topics. Snoiprocs16 ( talk) 15:53, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
IMO grammar at Malaysian and Indonesian should be merged here, to avoid a content fork. The two standards differ primarily in vocab, but there's very little diff otherwise. We could leave a summary, but currently we have a lot of detail. I tagged the sections at Indo that IMO should be here; at Malaysian, it's primarily phonology that's dup'd, tho I'm guessing we'd want to leave at least a basic chart, as at Indo.
Titles are good, though we might want to consider 'Malaysian Malay' and 'Indonesian Malay' to clarify that these aren't languages any more than American English and British English are. Only prob w that is that 'Indonesian Malay' might be construed as native Malay spoken in Riau and Sumatra, which is called Bahasa Malayu rather than Bahasa Indonesia in Indonesia. — kwami ( talk) 08:06, 9 September 2010 (UTC)
Merge more or less done, and I expanded a bit, though this article needs a lot of work! — kwami ( talk) 13:11, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
I have added the awalan "juru-" into this article, since it is one of the five Malay noun prefixes. To note, Malay has five awalan or prefixes such as peN-, pe-, peR-, ke-, and juru-.
This was edited by me by referring to the Dewan Bahasa & Pustaka (DBP)'s grammar book, that is Tatabahasa Dewan Edisi Baharu. This loss of facts or information should be avoided in the future.
Master of Books ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 10:01, 16 November 2010 (UTC).
I would like to propose the following
The Etymology of Malay or Malayu goes back to the 7th century and is derived from what the Kshatriya ruling class of the Srivijaya Kingdom (the bunts and the Nairs), who were from South West region of India speaking Malayalam a Dravidian dialect named from Ancient times from Malaya Mountains where it originated. This is evidenced by the Balinese Kshatriya's who claim ancestral origin from south west India Kshatriya casts. Some historian promote that the word Melayu derives from the Sanskrit] term Malaiur translated as "land of mountains" which is erroneous since Sanskrit nor any other Prakrit has a similar word in context. During the time of the first unified Kingdom of the region the local people must have identified with the rulers and started to refer themselves as such, So when the European colonist first arrived the must have proclaimed themselves 'Malayu' or any such other similar variant. — Preceding unsigned comment added by NoeticOne ( talk • contribs) 08:13, 23 January 2011 (UTC)
Should we include the as Indonesian, as Malaysian, and possible others such as as Bruneian in the infobox after each country such as the IP just added to East Timor? Chipmunkdavis ( talk) 06:15, 2 February 2011 (UTC)
Can somebody give a reference to the term Malaysian language being the official English translation of the Malay term Bahasa Malaysia? The English translation in Malaysian English has always been, simply, Malay language. As in most things in Malaysia, the English term Malay refers to Malay ethnicity and native language, while Malaysian refers to nationality of all races, or in the context of the whole nation.
Malaysian language, to my best knowledge, can only be referred as an improper noun, as in Kadazan is a Malaysian language. Bahasa Indonesia is officially translated as Indonesian, but Bahasa Malaysia is still Malay language in Standard Malaysian, Singaporean, and Bruneian English. While I understand the need to separate between the general Malay language (in reference to the lingua franca of the region) and Bahasa Malaysia, I do not agree with the term Malaysian language without citing references.
To highlight my point further, see how ridiculous this sentence sounds: Malaysian is the official language of Brunei, and one of the four official languages of Singapore. The English version of the constitution of all these three Commonwealth countries clearly used the term Malay language, and not Malaysian language - even in Malaysia.
-- Anggerik ( talk) 21:03, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
Since when c and j are [t͡s] and [d͡z]? I just noticed it under the Phonology heading and I remember most sources saying it's [t͡ʃ] and [d͡ʒ] respectively. – Fanatix 08:22, 24 August 2011 (UTC)
The hatnote says: "This article is about the standard language. For the different variants and dialects, see Malay languages."
This is rather confusing: My impression is that it's about the common language of which the languages of Malaysia, Indonesia and Brunei are official varieties. -- Amir E. Aharoni ( talk) 18:16, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
Another problem is that this article mentions the term "Indonesian Malay" several times. It is unclear whether this refers to the official language of Indonesia ( Indonesian language) or to the language of Indonesian Malays. The section Differences between Malaysian and Indonesian#Perception says that these are two separate things. -- Amir E. Aharoni ( talk) 18:16, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
ummm yeah. Malay is not spoken in the Philippines (unfortunately, which I as a Filipino, find to be VERY DISCGRACEFUL).
can someone like...upload a map where Philippines is NOT colored AT ALL? there are BARELY any Malay speakers in here. maybe there's "some" Malay speakers in Mindanao and Sulu but, again....its a bare amount. they just work as language translators, between Malays and Filipinos. thats not really a true speaker.
it may SEEM like there is but there isn't. "Filipinos" these days are too busy glorifying their Spanish and American conquerers while the Malays and Indonesians loathed them. its always great to reflect on a history, but Filipinos these days brag too much about it instead of finding their way back to their Malay roots REGARDLESS of being Catholic or Muslim, and again...this is unfortunate and discgraceful and embarassing to our southern neighbors. PacificWarrior101 ( talk) 01:00, 20 February 2012 (UTC)PacificWarrior101
It's really great to see it fixed. Really. Thanks. Terima Kasih! Salamat talaga! PacificWarrior101 ( talk) 03:10, 24 March 2012 (UTC)PacificWarrior101
Could someone add the Malay pronunciation to the Hassanal Bolkiah article abd Al-Muhtadee Billah?
“ | Standard Malay, also called Court Malay, was the literary standard of the pre-colonial Malacca and Riau-Johor Sultunates, and so the language is sometimes called Malacca Malay or Riau-Johor Malay | ” |
“ | The Malay language originated in Sumatra, where it has its closest relatives. The oldest inscriptions in Malay, Kedukan Bukit Inscription, dating from the end of the 7th century AD, were found on the banks of the River Tatang, a tributary of the River Musi, South Sumatra. It is the oldest surviving speciment of the Malay language, in a form known as Old Malay. "Malayu" was the name of an old kingdom located in Jambi province in eastern Sumatra. It was known in ancient Chinese texts as "Mo-lo-yo" and mentioned in the Nagarakertagama, an old Javanese epic written in 1365, as one of the "tributary states" of the Majapahit kingdom in eastern Java. | ” |
“ | From the island of Sumatra, the Malay language spread to peninsular South-east Asia (later known as Malaya and subsequently known as west Malaysia). | ” |
Please be very aware of how your posts are presented here, how text is rendered, etc. It's really confusing to read who has said what. If you want your comments/posts to be clear, then I suggest the following be adhered to:
Not all of my points above are necessarily part of policy, and you do not have to abide by them. On the other hand, they will help you get your message across. You may all think the above section is clear because you made the comments and you remember who said what, but for the first time reader (like me) it's a confusing mess, and I for one, cannot be bothered trying to work it out and hence your points are, at least in part, lost on me. -- Merbabu ( talk) 23:43, 14 July 2012 (UTC)
There's a really silly edit war going on here. Unless it can be established convincingly with reliable sources that Johor-Riau is the accepted term then the current Riau-Johor phrase should remain. It is the status quo for a long time, and there is no consensus yet to change it. Even if you someone does bring evidence/references to this talk page that they believe proves Johor-Riau is "correct" they must not change the article until consensus is reached here first. If it is changed again without agreement being reached first, then I will ask administrators to watch or even protect the page. And I'm happy to do this with any other editing dispute. cheers -- Merbabu ( talk) 23:47, 14 July 2012 (UTC)
http://www.lexilogos.com/english/malay_dictionary.htm
These old dictionaries contain the Malay words in both Jawi script and Roman script, so it will help non malays identify terms in Jawi script, and also they are significant and unique because modern english malay dictionaries only use Roman script and not Jawi anymore, so they should be put into the further reading section.
Jawi and Romanised
Romanised only
http://books.google.com/books?id=359kAAAAMAAJ
A practical Malay grammar
English, Sulu, Malay vocabulary
http://www.readanybook.com/author/andson-cowie-william-clark-cowie-192229
ENGLISH, SULU, AND MALAY VOCABULARY
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41560760?
ENGLISH, SULU, AND MALAY VOCABULARY W. E. Maxwell and T. H. HAYNES Journal of the Straits Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society No. 16 (DECEMBER, 1885), pp. 321-384 Published by: Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41560760 Page Count: 64
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41607025?
ENGLISH, SULU, AND MALAY VOCABULARY (Continued) T. H. Haynes Journal of the Straits Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society No. 18 (DECEMBER, 1886), pp. 191, 193-239 Published by: Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41607025 Page Count: 48
Teaching Malay
https://archive.org/details/cu31924011084948
Grammar
https://archive.org/details/practicalmalaygr00shelrich
https://archive.org/details/simplebutcomplet00pear
https://archive.org/details/grammarofmalayan00mars
https://archive.org/details/agrammarmalayan00marsgoog
https://archive.org/details/agrammarmalayan01marsgoog
https://archive.org/details/colloquialmalays00wins
https://archive.org/details/grammairedelala00favrgoog
https://archive.org/details/grammairedelalan00favr
A Malay manual with grammar, reading exercises, and vocabularies
https://archive.org/details/malaymanualwithg00freerich
Dictionary
https://archive.org/details/aeg2034.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afu7967.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/dictionaryofmala00marsrich
https://archive.org/details/dictionaryofmala01howi
https://archive.org/details/dictionnairemal00favrgoog
https://archive.org/details/dictionnairemal01favrgoog
https://archive.org/details/afu7933.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afu7933.0002.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/kitbpadameniatk00richgoog
https://archive.org/details/ahy2565.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afu7946.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afh0364.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/maleischnederla00tuukgoog
https://archive.org/details/afh0364.0003.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afu7948.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afh0364.0002.001.umich.edu
Grammar and Dictionary
https://archive.org/details/grammardictionar00craw
https://archive.org/details/grammardictionar02craw
https://archive.org/details/malaygrammar00winsrich
Vocabulary
https://archive.org/details/cu31924081220968
https://archive.org/details/vocabularyofengl01swet
https://archive.org/details/malayenglishvoca00sheliala
https://archive.org/details/afu7962.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afu7954.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/afu7962.0002.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/anr0813.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/anr0813.0002.001.umich.edu
A lexilogus of the English, Malay, and Chinese languages : comprehending the vernacular idioms of the last in the Hok-keen and Canton dialects
https://archive.org/details/lexilogusofengli00malarich
The Singapore triglot vocabulary (English, Malay, Chinese)
https://archive.org/details/afu7959.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/singaporetriglo00shelgoog
A manual of the Malay language. With an introductory sketch of the Sanskrit element in Malay
https://archive.org/details/manualofmalaylan00maxwrich
https://archive.org/details/amanualofthemala25604gut
A Malay reader (romanized) for the use of pupils in the second standard of the vernacular schools of the Straits Settlements
https://archive.org/details/malayreaderroman00strarich
Malay Texts
https://archive.org/details/kitabperboewatan00klin
https://archive.org/details/wasiyatyanglamay33klin
https://archive.org/details/aeq4245.0001.001.umich.edu
https://archive.org/details/cu31924008136537
Dutch-Malay
https://archive.org/details/cu31924020365494
Bibles
https://archive.org/details/kitabindjilsoetj00klin
https://archive.org/details/hetnieuwetestame04klin
https://archive.org/details/wasiatjangbeharo00klin
https://archive.org/details/wasiyatyanglamay11klin
https://archive.org/details/wasiyatyanglamay22klin
https://archive.org/details/zaboorijaitoeseg00veth
Malay phonetics
https://archive.org/details/cu31924084672934
The Malay orthography
https://archive.org/details/malayorthography00hudsrich
Glossaire explicatif des mots de provenance malaise et javanaise
https://archive.org/details/GlossaireExplicatifDesMotsDeProvenanceMalaiseEtJavanaise
Mémoire, lettres et rapports relatifs au cours de langues malaye et javanaise fait à la Bibliothèque royale pendant les années 1840-41, 1841-42, et à deux voyages littéraires entrepris en Angleterre, pendant les années 1838 et 1840 (1843)
https://archive.org/details/mmoirelettreset00dulagoog
Catalogue of Malay manuscripts and manuscripts relating to the Malay language in the Bodleian library
https://archive.org/details/cu31924023611746
The natives of Sarawak and British North Borneo; based chiefly on the mss. of the late H. B. Low, Sarawak government service
https://archive.org/details/nativessarawaka01lowgoog
Rajmaan ( talk) 18:36, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41492943?
THE MISSING SECOND EDITION OF C.H. THOMSEN AND ABDULLAH BIN ABDUL KADIR'S ENGLISH AND MALAY VOCABULARY JOHN BASTIN Journal of the Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Vol. 56, No. 1 (244) (1983), pp. 10-11 Published by: Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41492943 Page Count: 4
History of Malay Chinese Dictionaries
http://books.google.com/books?id=BCmcEkjWOI4C&pg=PA75#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=5jz6acTOquoC&pg=PA79#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=VToJrBPbQ9AC&pg=PA493#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=hhvDD2NHv9gC&pg=PA143#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=PHo9AAAAIAAJ&pg=PA137#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://catalog.hathitrust.org/Record/007704411
https://archive.org/details/vocabularyofengl00sing
21:16, 15 February 2014 (UTC)
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41493568?
BABA MALAY DIALECT TAN CHEE-BENG Journal of the Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Vol. 53, No. 1 (237) (1980), pp. 150-166 Published by: Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41493568 Page Count: 17
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41493734?
The Malay Chetty Creole Language of Malacca: A Historical and Linguistic Perspective Noriah Mohamed Journal of the Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Vol. 82, No. 1 (296) (June 2009), pp. 55-70 Published by: Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41493734 Page Count: 16
A Vocabulary of Brunei Malay H. B. Marshall Journal of the Straits Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society No. 83 (APRIL, 1921), pp. 45-74 Published by: Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society Stable URL: http://www.jstor.org/stable/41561363 Page Count: 30
http://guides.lib.umich.edu/islamicmsstudies/onlinecollections
Adat
Agama
Bahasa
Hikayat
Kitab Tib
Lain-lain
Salasilah dan Sejarah
Syair
Undang-undang
Ambonese Malay
http://eap.bl.uk/database/overview_project.a4d?projID=EAP276;r=41
http://eap.bl.uk/database/results.a4d?projID=EAP276
Auroux, Sylvain; Koerner, E.F.K.; Niederehe, Hans-Josef; Versteegh, Kees: History of the Language Sciences / Geschichte der Sprachwissenschaften / Histoire des sciences du langage. 1. Teilband edited by Sylvain Auroux
http://books.google.com/books?id=JqxnjTKaQvQC&pg=PA333#v=onepage&q=Malay&f=false
http://www.jstor.org/stable/25817713?
MALAY: A SHORT HISTORY
K. ALEXANDER ADELAAR
Oriente Moderno
Nuova serie, Anno 19 (80), Nr. 2, ALAM MELAYU IL MONDO MALESE: LINGUA, STORIA, CULTURA (2000), pp. 225-242
Published by: Istituto per l'Oriente C. A. Nallino
Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/25817713
Page Count: 18
http://www.jstor.org/stable/3488474?
Malay
C. O. Blagden
Bulletin of the School of Oriental Studies, University of London
Vol. 1, No. 1 (1917), pp. 97-100
Published by: Cambridge University Press on behalf of the School of Oriental and African Studies
Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/3488474
Page Count: 4
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41493148?
EARLY MALAY PRINTING: an Introduction to the British Library Collections
ANNABEL TEH GALLOP
Journal of the Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society
Vol. 63, No. 1 (258) (1990), pp. 85-124
Published by: Malaysian Branch of the Royal Asiatic Society
Stable URL:
http://www.jstor.org/stable/41493148
Page Count: 40
Hanlin_Academy#Foreign_language_vocabularies
A Chinese Vocabulary of Malacca Malay Words and Phrases Collected between A.D.1403 and 1511?
A Chinese Vocabulary of Malacca Malay Words and Phrases Collected between A. D. 1403 and 1511 (?) E. D. Edwards and C. O. Blagden Bulletin of the School of Oriental Studies, University of London, Vol. 6, No. 3 (1931), pp. 715-749 Published by: Cambridge University Press on behalf of the School of Oriental and African Studies Article Stable URL: http://www.jstor.org/stable/607205
Page 95
Rajmaan ( talk) 01:55, 13 January 2015 (UTC)
History of Malay Chinese Dictionaries
http://books.google.com/books?id=BCmcEkjWOI4C&pg=PA75#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=5jz6acTOquoC&pg=PA79#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=VToJrBPbQ9AC&pg=PA493#v=onepage&q&f=false
http://books.google.com/books?id=hhvDD2NHv9gC&pg=PA143#v=onepage&q&f=false
The article currently says there is no grammatical plural, but Reduplication#Function_and_meaning claims the same thing I had thought: that plurals are indicated by reduplication. Can someone clarify? —Largo Plazo ( talk) 16:00, 19 August 2013 (UTC)
This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Please, how to make that all and only Indonesian IP users get redirected to Indonesian language when trying to view this article. Thank you. 202.73.225.84 ( talk) 22:56, 1 June 2015 (UTC) 202.73.225.84 ( talk) 22:56, 1 June 2015 (UTC)
Is Indonesian and Malay the same language. When I am trying to access a website and set the language to Malay, the webpage shows the Indonesian version of the webpage, like flirchi.com. I think they are the same language. Please merge Indonesian and Malay Wikipedia. Thank You. 139.193.86.20 ( talk) 07:00, 2 June 2015 (UTC)
I set a smartphone language to Malay. When I am running an Android app which has Indonesian language resources but no Malay language resources (such as Cymera), while the smartphone language is set to Malay, the application used the default language (usually English) and not Indonesian language. Why? Does Android know that Indonesian is similar to Malay? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.73.225.18 ( talk) 13:39, 2 June 2015 (UTC)
I want to redirect this page to Indonesian language for all and only Indonesian IPs. How this can be done? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.62.17.217 ( talk) 00:32, 1 August 2015 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
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An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Malay langauge. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. Steel1943 ( talk) 18:29, 11 November 2019 (UTC)
I felt article Islamic_literature is in bit of neglect so I added my note on talk page there, requesting to take note of Talk:Islamic_literature#Article_review. If possible requesting copy edit support. Suggestions for suitable reference sources at Talk:Islamic_literature is also welcome.
Posting message here too for neutrality sake
Thanks and greetings
Bookku ( talk) 08:27, 21 May 2020 (UTC)
The terms "Aurat", "Arvad", "Avret", and "Awrath" may refer to: Women of Asian religious or cultural descent and identity.
Self nomination for AFD since article copy pasted to Draft:Aurat for incubation because IMHO current article title Aurat (word) is misleading and confusing leading to western systemic bias and stifling the article growth. Please find Detail reason at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Aurat (word)
I invite project members to review current and potential sourcing and weigh in on the AfD discussion. Thanks! Bookku ( talk) 02:58, 10 June 2020 (UTC)
Hello many greetings,
Requesting your proactive contribution and support in updating Draft:Aurats (word) in relation to the related languages you know well.
Thanks and warm regards
Bookku ( talk) 03:20, 12 July 2020 (UTC)
Bahasa Indonesia or Indonesian language is indeed originated from Bahasa Melayu, but calling it Bahasa Melayu or Malay would make it complicated in the Indonesian context as Bahasa Melayu is one of the regional languages in Indonesia 202.43.95.31 ( talk) 19:07, 23 March 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 09:07, 29 August 2022 (UTC)
I fail to see how Malay could be a “recognised minority language” in Australia, seeing as we do not recognise any language in any official capacity. 101.112.0.95 ( talk) 22:20, 21 October 2022 (UTC)
@ Bebasnama: Before you add "Melindo" as alternative name for the Malay macro-language again, I advise you to carefully read the source that you have cited. The volume is correctly entitled Melbourne Studies in Education, the relevant chapter is "Language and Values in Indonesia" by Sue Nichterlein. Here's a courtesy link for all editors with a Internet Archive account: [21]. In this chapter, the author describes attempts in the 1950s to create a unified standard language from Indonesian and Standard Malay (as then used in Malaya) under the umbrella term "Bahasa Melindo". This project was aborted in the Konfrontasi period. So the "Melindo" language never has come to be, and the term is simply not used as an alternative name for Malay/Indonesian as a pluricentric language.
The associated "Melindo spelling" (Ejaan Melindo) is discussed some sources about the Malay/Indonesian spelling reform proposals of the 1950s, 60s and 70s.
This footnote of history might be an interesting addition to this article (or History of the Malay language), but it's nothing to be mentioned in the infobox. Austronesier ( talk) 19:39, 15 August 2023 (UTC)
Why this sentence had to use quotation mark like this? (including 260 million as "Indonesian".) Whats the matter for using such feature? Thank you. 182.253.54.81 ( talk) 09:50, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
@ Ckfasdf: While Indonesian shares historical roots with Malay and there is mutual intelligibility to some extent, Indonesian has undergone significant linguistic development and standardization efforts, leading to differences in vocabulary, grammar, and pronunciation. Additionally, Indonesian has absorbed vocabulary from various local languages spoken across the Indonesian archipelago, further distinguishing it from classical Malay. Bayoka55 ( talk) 21:11, 20 March 2024 (UTC)
L1 numbers are listed at 83 million, but in the /info/en/?search=List_of_languages_by_total_number_of_speakers article, Indonesian is listed as 44 million, and on ethnologue ( https://www.ethnologue.com/insights/ethnologue200/) Malay L1+L2 is listed as 19.2m, so are the extra 19 million coming from 'Baba Malay' and 'Baba Indonesian'?
It would be helpful if someone could post the L2 figures from Ethnologue so at least things would be consistent in the infobox. 90.167.94.143 ( talk) 00:36, 23 May 2024 (UTC)