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Neither source provides a credit for the designer of this flag, or its widespread adoption by the group it is said to represent, so I question it being used here in any sort of definitive manner. Maybe "a gay men's pride flag". Greyspeir ( talk) 21:07, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
...I don't think it does the cause any good to have 3 images of purported historical "gay sex" on the page. It reduces the concept to a merely sexual one. Also, I'm skeptical the Pre-Columbian image is even contextually appropriate as there is nothing in the image notes declaring it an image of gay men in particular, or even of two men, for that matter. Haven't we gone to great lengths to demonstrate that homosexual acts don't define gay men? Greyspeir ( talk) 18:46, 15 November 2023 (UTC)
reduc[ing] the concept to a merely sexual oneas you can get! If anything, it's emasculating. Sexuality is a key element of gay men's experience (at least it has been for me). Being encyclopaedically neutral does not require being neutered. Lastly, those are sections about the historical views of gayness. It is anachronistic in the extreme to pretend that gay men (by whatever term may have been in use in the time and culture presented) were not at that time largely defined by, often celebrated in, and usually depicted through their sexual expression. To retroactively emasculate them is, in my view, highly disrespectful of the lived experience of millions of gay men throughout history -- including me. Cheers, Last1in ( talk) 19:18, 15 November 2023 (UTC)
What about gay men in sports, Asian and other media, politics, etc? George Ho ( talk) 19:24, 23 December 2023 (UTC)
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Remove "pre-dates Christianity". Unnecesarry mention, as Christianity is not the bar in which every English speaker measures themself by. Biased mention. Christianity is a religion--personal and private and has nothing to do with the lives of homosexuals. 73.73.26.99 ( talk) 04:31, 18 January 2024 (UTC)
In cultures influenced by Abrahamic religions, the law and the church established sodomy as a transgression against divine law or a crime against nature. The condemnation of anal sex between males, however, predates Christian belief.Without that sentence, it is implied that
the law and churchwere the first to deem anal sex between males unacceptable. Tollens ( talk) 10:39, 18 January 2024 (UTC)
The
contentious topics procedure applies to this page. This page is related to gender-related disputes or controversies or people associated with them, which has been
designated as a contentious topic. Editors who repeatedly or seriously fail to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process may be blocked or restricted by an administrator. Editors are advised to familiarise themselves with the contentious topics procedures before editing this page. |
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Gay men article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: Index, 1Auto-archiving period: 60 days |
This article was nominated for deletion on 25 January 2021. The result of the discussion was keep. |
This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Neither source provides a credit for the designer of this flag, or its widespread adoption by the group it is said to represent, so I question it being used here in any sort of definitive manner. Maybe "a gay men's pride flag". Greyspeir ( talk) 21:07, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
...I don't think it does the cause any good to have 3 images of purported historical "gay sex" on the page. It reduces the concept to a merely sexual one. Also, I'm skeptical the Pre-Columbian image is even contextually appropriate as there is nothing in the image notes declaring it an image of gay men in particular, or even of two men, for that matter. Haven't we gone to great lengths to demonstrate that homosexual acts don't define gay men? Greyspeir ( talk) 18:46, 15 November 2023 (UTC)
reduc[ing] the concept to a merely sexual oneas you can get! If anything, it's emasculating. Sexuality is a key element of gay men's experience (at least it has been for me). Being encyclopaedically neutral does not require being neutered. Lastly, those are sections about the historical views of gayness. It is anachronistic in the extreme to pretend that gay men (by whatever term may have been in use in the time and culture presented) were not at that time largely defined by, often celebrated in, and usually depicted through their sexual expression. To retroactively emasculate them is, in my view, highly disrespectful of the lived experience of millions of gay men throughout history -- including me. Cheers, Last1in ( talk) 19:18, 15 November 2023 (UTC)
What about gay men in sports, Asian and other media, politics, etc? George Ho ( talk) 19:24, 23 December 2023 (UTC)
This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Remove "pre-dates Christianity". Unnecesarry mention, as Christianity is not the bar in which every English speaker measures themself by. Biased mention. Christianity is a religion--personal and private and has nothing to do with the lives of homosexuals. 73.73.26.99 ( talk) 04:31, 18 January 2024 (UTC)
In cultures influenced by Abrahamic religions, the law and the church established sodomy as a transgression against divine law or a crime against nature. The condemnation of anal sex between males, however, predates Christian belief.Without that sentence, it is implied that
the law and churchwere the first to deem anal sex between males unacceptable. Tollens ( talk) 10:39, 18 January 2024 (UTC)