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I was about to write an article titled Temperature (meat), searched under the obvious terms, and found that for some reason, only "medium rare" had an article. Rather than re-invent the wheel, i propose to move this page to Temperature (meat), and add redirects for Doneness as well as each of the specific degrees mentioned on the page (one for "Medium rare" will be automatically created). After the page move I'll do the necessary cleanup to make it general to all the degrees of doneness. MCB 01:57, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
It's not the case that raw meat "has only been exposed to room temperature". Meat remains raw up to the temperature where the proteins begin to denature. The ranges shown for the degrees of doneness are for the center of a cut of meat measured by a meat thermometer; they're not the cooking temperatures. -- MCB 04:16, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
Until the livestock becomes meat, the temperature is quite often above room temperature in some parts of the world, and well below that of room temperature in others. If you have a room which is 135 degrees, by all means the mean would be evenly medium-rare, but without any of the browning that contributes so much to savory qualities of meat. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.137.225.247 ( talk) 00:08, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
The article says, The USDA recommends a temperature of at least 145°F (63°C) to prevent foodborne illness. But medium is the first level which reaches 145. How then, is it that so many people eat rare steak without incident? I once even saw someone order a hamburger rare, which just about made me fall over. Are they just taking a risk each time they eat it? -- Birdhombre 18:43, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/8675.php -- Lycan1841 ( talk) 19:54, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
"Foodborne illness" is a media myth. 97.76.251.90 ( talk) 04:09, 30 September 2016 (UTC)
something I noticed in my trip to the USA in 2002, was that even though when I had a steak a a resteraunt and asked for it to be rare, it was much more cooked than a steak of simmilar size that was requested to be cooked rare in Australia. This could potentialy mean that the reccomendation to not have rare meat may only apply to the USA. potentialy even moreso if you take into account the fact that people in places that still serve meat rare would possibly build up resistance to the small amounts of the less harmful bacteria that is found in rare meat because they would be exposed to it more.
It could also just mean that Australia has regulations for beef cattle that mean we dont need to worry as much about having our meat done rare. But whatever the reason is, it might be an idea to make some kind of referanced note if any verifiable infomation can be found. -- 124.168.197.253 22:06, 11 September 2007 (UTC)
I heard on a trivia game on the radio that "People with more of this in their lives tend to order their meat more rare," with the answer being money. If this is true, it would be an interesting factoid to add to the article, unfortunately, however, "I heard it on the radio" doesn't quite cut it for a citation. Has anyone heard of this, or have an idea where to verify such a thing? Dansiman ( talk| Contribs) 16:26, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
As the article is currently written, it really is entirely about beef. It should either have a similar level of content added about other types of meat, or be renamed to Temperature (beef). Dansiman ( talk| Contribs) 16:45, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
It would be interesting to know when the USDA decreed that Americans shouldn't eat meat cooked medium rare or less (I'm sorry, but calling something that's medium "medium rare" doesn't make it so). It seems to me that only large chain restaurants follow these guidelines stringently; when I go to my local tavern they cook it how I darn well want it...mostly. Anyone else notice this trend? XINOPH | TALK 01:00, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
What is the source for this information? There is no citation...is this a common deviation from traditional? Sottolacqua ( talk) 18:52, 12 May 2008 (UTC)
The U.S. government has an information fact sheet on beef, including temperature as it relates to doneness, can be found here http://www.fsis.usda.gov/FactSheets/Beef_from_Farm_to_Table/index.asp Alex ( talk) 00:43, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
This article talk page was automatically added with {{ WikiProject Food and drink}} banner as it falls under Category:Food or one of its subcategories. If you find this addition an error, Kindly undo the changes and update the inappropriate categories if needed. The bot was instructed to tagg these articles upon consenus from WikiProject Food and drink. You can find the related request for tagging here . If you have concerns , please inform on the project talk page -- TinucherianBot ( talk) 11:55, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
To avoid previous problems with original research and informal sources, I turned to a well-known reference book (The Field Guide to Meat) for temperature ranges and summarized its description of the gradations (to avoid copyvio) and adjusted the information in the table accordingly. I also removed the USDA column since the ranges there were not found in any of the USDA sources mentioned; instead, USDA uses a minimum safe temperature for each meat, which is mentioned in its own paragraph. -- MCB ( talk) 08:04, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
Isn't it that the recommended temperatures not only need to be reached but be sustained over a certain time? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.197.221.226 ( talk) 20:00, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
That's hardly medium...That's way closer to rare...Not even medium rare.. 68.38.197.76 ( talk) 00:18, 29 December 2013 (UTC)
It is written that "Well done cuts, in addition to being brown, are drier and contain little or no juices. Note that searing (cooking the exterior at a high temperature) in no way "seals in the juices" – water evaporates at the same or higher rates as unseared meat."
That makes no sense as the meat loses the most of its juice when it gives away the juice as a result of slow cooking. Sealing helps the steak to hold its juice. The water evaporation has very little effect. I can cook perfectly juicy steaks that are well done. The trick is to seal first and then cook under lower temperature and let the steak rest at the end. I think praising rare meat is just a result of british/french snobbishness... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 134.105.82.216 ( talk) 15:53, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Moved to Doneness Mike Cline ( talk) 15:23, 20 February 2016 (UTC)
Temperature (meat) →
Meat temperature –
WP:NATURAL disambiguation fits here much better. "Temperature" is not even a term of art in the field so that it would be more recognizable to the specialists; this title is, as far as I can tell, intended just as a
neutral descriptive one, so it should really be at "meat temperature".
No such user (
talk) 08:05, 8 February 2016 (UTC)
During the writing of Modernist Cuisine, our editor-in-chief Wayt Gibbs pointed out to me that, according to the Webster's Third New International unabridged dictionary, 'doneness' is officially not a word. My response was that it ought to be, and unless there was another word that communicated my meaning just as clearly, then I would insist that we make 'doneness' a word. [Editor's note: We later discovered that the word is indeed included in the 2002 addenda to Web3.]. Cuchullain? No such user ( talk) 08:01, 10 February 2016 (UTC)
The description of meat doneness here is the American description and not a universal global description. There was previously other nationality descriptions, at least French and Chinese, that were reverted. If we want to ban the use of foreign words here, that is fine, though it should be acceptable to have numbers. Unless there is objection, I would like to add back in the Chinese number system for describing meat doneness. Thoughts? Sthubbar ( talk) 00:06, 24 October 2016 (UTC)
a steak in China (typically at a Western steak house). And where the end would be? There are terms for meat doneness in probably hundreds of world languages, why stop on Chinese?
the steak is a deeply nationalized foodstuff, 'a basic element' of the cuisine of France. And that's probably as much of foreign terminology I'd expect to found in this article. No such user ( talk) 15:16, 24 October 2016 (UTC)
America | China | Haute-Cuisine | Description | Temperature range | |
---|---|---|---|---|---|
Extra-rare or Blue | Very red | 46–49 °C | 115–120 °F | ||
Rare | #3 | Saignant | Red center; soft | 52–55 °C | 125–130 °F |
Medium rare | #4 | À point | Warm red center; firmer | 55–60 °C | 130–140 °F |
Medium | #5 | Demi-anglais | Pink and firm | 60–65 °C | 140–150 °F |
Medium well | #7 | Cuit | Small amount of pink in the center | 65–69 °C | 150–155 °F |
Well done | Cuit | Gray-brown throughout; firm | 71+ °C | 160+ °F | |
Overcooked | Trop cuit | Blacken throughout; hard | >71 °C |
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This entry needs to be corrected. As a very experienced grill cook in high end restaurants I can tell you this McGee person doesn't know what he's talking about when it goes to cooking steak. First off the juices in meat are not water based, so how water evaporates is totally moot. The juices are fat based, so searing does in fact seal in these juices which are the ones you want to keep, not water based juices which will be lost. This why lean cuts are drier when cooked then fat cuts of meat.
The problem many people have with cooking steaks has to do with their methods. The heat of the grill drives the fat away from the heat source making it rise to the surface of the meat. The higher the temperature the faster the fat is driven to the surface. Well done steaks are usually dry because lazy or inexperienced grill cooks use too high a heat and cook the steak too quickly driving all the fat out of the meat in the process. Then they don't let the meat rest long enough to allow the juices to redistribute in the meat. If you ever cut a steak and see juices come bubbling out of it that's the steak drying out because it hasn't rested long enough, and isn't a sign of a properly cooked steak.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Gezzer58 ( talk • contribs)
Where are the translations in this article based on? I know some sources that state that 'saignant' is closer to 'medium-rare' than 'rare', the latter is written in the article (the same applies to 'a point' which is then a synonym for 'medium'). I'm wondering if the current information in the article is all correct. 213.124.174.59 ( talk) 12:06, 2 April 2022 (UTC)
![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||
|
I was about to write an article titled Temperature (meat), searched under the obvious terms, and found that for some reason, only "medium rare" had an article. Rather than re-invent the wheel, i propose to move this page to Temperature (meat), and add redirects for Doneness as well as each of the specific degrees mentioned on the page (one for "Medium rare" will be automatically created). After the page move I'll do the necessary cleanup to make it general to all the degrees of doneness. MCB 01:57, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
It's not the case that raw meat "has only been exposed to room temperature". Meat remains raw up to the temperature where the proteins begin to denature. The ranges shown for the degrees of doneness are for the center of a cut of meat measured by a meat thermometer; they're not the cooking temperatures. -- MCB 04:16, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
Until the livestock becomes meat, the temperature is quite often above room temperature in some parts of the world, and well below that of room temperature in others. If you have a room which is 135 degrees, by all means the mean would be evenly medium-rare, but without any of the browning that contributes so much to savory qualities of meat. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.137.225.247 ( talk) 00:08, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
The article says, The USDA recommends a temperature of at least 145°F (63°C) to prevent foodborne illness. But medium is the first level which reaches 145. How then, is it that so many people eat rare steak without incident? I once even saw someone order a hamburger rare, which just about made me fall over. Are they just taking a risk each time they eat it? -- Birdhombre 18:43, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/8675.php -- Lycan1841 ( talk) 19:54, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
"Foodborne illness" is a media myth. 97.76.251.90 ( talk) 04:09, 30 September 2016 (UTC)
something I noticed in my trip to the USA in 2002, was that even though when I had a steak a a resteraunt and asked for it to be rare, it was much more cooked than a steak of simmilar size that was requested to be cooked rare in Australia. This could potentialy mean that the reccomendation to not have rare meat may only apply to the USA. potentialy even moreso if you take into account the fact that people in places that still serve meat rare would possibly build up resistance to the small amounts of the less harmful bacteria that is found in rare meat because they would be exposed to it more.
It could also just mean that Australia has regulations for beef cattle that mean we dont need to worry as much about having our meat done rare. But whatever the reason is, it might be an idea to make some kind of referanced note if any verifiable infomation can be found. -- 124.168.197.253 22:06, 11 September 2007 (UTC)
I heard on a trivia game on the radio that "People with more of this in their lives tend to order their meat more rare," with the answer being money. If this is true, it would be an interesting factoid to add to the article, unfortunately, however, "I heard it on the radio" doesn't quite cut it for a citation. Has anyone heard of this, or have an idea where to verify such a thing? Dansiman ( talk| Contribs) 16:26, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
As the article is currently written, it really is entirely about beef. It should either have a similar level of content added about other types of meat, or be renamed to Temperature (beef). Dansiman ( talk| Contribs) 16:45, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
It would be interesting to know when the USDA decreed that Americans shouldn't eat meat cooked medium rare or less (I'm sorry, but calling something that's medium "medium rare" doesn't make it so). It seems to me that only large chain restaurants follow these guidelines stringently; when I go to my local tavern they cook it how I darn well want it...mostly. Anyone else notice this trend? XINOPH | TALK 01:00, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
What is the source for this information? There is no citation...is this a common deviation from traditional? Sottolacqua ( talk) 18:52, 12 May 2008 (UTC)
The U.S. government has an information fact sheet on beef, including temperature as it relates to doneness, can be found here http://www.fsis.usda.gov/FactSheets/Beef_from_Farm_to_Table/index.asp Alex ( talk) 00:43, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
This article talk page was automatically added with {{ WikiProject Food and drink}} banner as it falls under Category:Food or one of its subcategories. If you find this addition an error, Kindly undo the changes and update the inappropriate categories if needed. The bot was instructed to tagg these articles upon consenus from WikiProject Food and drink. You can find the related request for tagging here . If you have concerns , please inform on the project talk page -- TinucherianBot ( talk) 11:55, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
To avoid previous problems with original research and informal sources, I turned to a well-known reference book (The Field Guide to Meat) for temperature ranges and summarized its description of the gradations (to avoid copyvio) and adjusted the information in the table accordingly. I also removed the USDA column since the ranges there were not found in any of the USDA sources mentioned; instead, USDA uses a minimum safe temperature for each meat, which is mentioned in its own paragraph. -- MCB ( talk) 08:04, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
Isn't it that the recommended temperatures not only need to be reached but be sustained over a certain time? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.197.221.226 ( talk) 20:00, 9 September 2011 (UTC)
That's hardly medium...That's way closer to rare...Not even medium rare.. 68.38.197.76 ( talk) 00:18, 29 December 2013 (UTC)
It is written that "Well done cuts, in addition to being brown, are drier and contain little or no juices. Note that searing (cooking the exterior at a high temperature) in no way "seals in the juices" – water evaporates at the same or higher rates as unseared meat."
That makes no sense as the meat loses the most of its juice when it gives away the juice as a result of slow cooking. Sealing helps the steak to hold its juice. The water evaporation has very little effect. I can cook perfectly juicy steaks that are well done. The trick is to seal first and then cook under lower temperature and let the steak rest at the end. I think praising rare meat is just a result of british/french snobbishness... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 134.105.82.216 ( talk) 15:53, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Moved to Doneness Mike Cline ( talk) 15:23, 20 February 2016 (UTC)
Temperature (meat) →
Meat temperature –
WP:NATURAL disambiguation fits here much better. "Temperature" is not even a term of art in the field so that it would be more recognizable to the specialists; this title is, as far as I can tell, intended just as a
neutral descriptive one, so it should really be at "meat temperature".
No such user (
talk) 08:05, 8 February 2016 (UTC)
During the writing of Modernist Cuisine, our editor-in-chief Wayt Gibbs pointed out to me that, according to the Webster's Third New International unabridged dictionary, 'doneness' is officially not a word. My response was that it ought to be, and unless there was another word that communicated my meaning just as clearly, then I would insist that we make 'doneness' a word. [Editor's note: We later discovered that the word is indeed included in the 2002 addenda to Web3.]. Cuchullain? No such user ( talk) 08:01, 10 February 2016 (UTC)
The description of meat doneness here is the American description and not a universal global description. There was previously other nationality descriptions, at least French and Chinese, that were reverted. If we want to ban the use of foreign words here, that is fine, though it should be acceptable to have numbers. Unless there is objection, I would like to add back in the Chinese number system for describing meat doneness. Thoughts? Sthubbar ( talk) 00:06, 24 October 2016 (UTC)
a steak in China (typically at a Western steak house). And where the end would be? There are terms for meat doneness in probably hundreds of world languages, why stop on Chinese?
the steak is a deeply nationalized foodstuff, 'a basic element' of the cuisine of France. And that's probably as much of foreign terminology I'd expect to found in this article. No such user ( talk) 15:16, 24 October 2016 (UTC)
America | China | Haute-Cuisine | Description | Temperature range | |
---|---|---|---|---|---|
Extra-rare or Blue | Very red | 46–49 °C | 115–120 °F | ||
Rare | #3 | Saignant | Red center; soft | 52–55 °C | 125–130 °F |
Medium rare | #4 | À point | Warm red center; firmer | 55–60 °C | 130–140 °F |
Medium | #5 | Demi-anglais | Pink and firm | 60–65 °C | 140–150 °F |
Medium well | #7 | Cuit | Small amount of pink in the center | 65–69 °C | 150–155 °F |
Well done | Cuit | Gray-brown throughout; firm | 71+ °C | 160+ °F | |
Overcooked | Trop cuit | Blacken throughout; hard | >71 °C |
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Doneness. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 20:05, 12 September 2017 (UTC)
This entry needs to be corrected. As a very experienced grill cook in high end restaurants I can tell you this McGee person doesn't know what he's talking about when it goes to cooking steak. First off the juices in meat are not water based, so how water evaporates is totally moot. The juices are fat based, so searing does in fact seal in these juices which are the ones you want to keep, not water based juices which will be lost. This why lean cuts are drier when cooked then fat cuts of meat.
The problem many people have with cooking steaks has to do with their methods. The heat of the grill drives the fat away from the heat source making it rise to the surface of the meat. The higher the temperature the faster the fat is driven to the surface. Well done steaks are usually dry because lazy or inexperienced grill cooks use too high a heat and cook the steak too quickly driving all the fat out of the meat in the process. Then they don't let the meat rest long enough to allow the juices to redistribute in the meat. If you ever cut a steak and see juices come bubbling out of it that's the steak drying out because it hasn't rested long enough, and isn't a sign of a properly cooked steak.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Gezzer58 ( talk • contribs)
Where are the translations in this article based on? I know some sources that state that 'saignant' is closer to 'medium-rare' than 'rare', the latter is written in the article (the same applies to 'a point' which is then a synonym for 'medium'). I'm wondering if the current information in the article is all correct. 213.124.174.59 ( talk) 12:06, 2 April 2022 (UTC)