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This bit:
...seems to be loitering around rather disconnectedly at the end of the article. A Google search [1] brings up a few variant versions of this quote; does anybody know the correct text and the exact source? It seems to be from DLG's diary, and possibly relates to the Disarmament Conference of 1932. I don't particularly want to take it out, but putting it in context would probably cast a little more light on the man. -- rbrwr
H.A.L. Fisher - President of the Board of Education was an Historian who wrote a 2 volume History of Europe. From my contemporary POV - a racist -- but after glancing at the above entry,maybe just a man of his time and place. - Sparky
I think that the article should include soemthing about Lloyd George's role in the Irish War of Independence and the subsequent peace settlement. Ausseagull ( talk) 09:24, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
Was his peerage title "Earl Lloyd George of Dwyfor"? I thought it was just "Earl of Dwyfor". Timrollpickering
As I just noticed that the older image formerly illustrating this article, and then for a while used in other articles, at present seems to be an orphan. I'm putting it here just so anyone who might have use for another image of Lloyd George on Wikipedia may be made aware of it. -- Infrogmation 18:51, 4 Jun 2004 (UTC)
In the article it notes that Lloyd George was bitterly oposed to Welsh Nationalism. This is incorrect - you should read the history of 'Cymru Fydd' a national movement lead by Lloyd George and Tom Ellis.
To whom did he "sell" titles? William Waldorf Astor, Sir William Maxwell Aitken, or Sir Rufus Isaacs? I read that King George V objected to Sir William Aitken's elevation to the baronage. Could that have been the reason? Anglius None of the above. Sir Max Aitkin became Lord Beaverbrook in 1916, the King did indeed object to his elevation but Beaverbrook paid no money, rather it was in the hope of buying his newspapers support that D LG sought his elevation, (see A J P Taylor's Beaverbrook pp 125-127 (Chatto &Unwin)) Sir Rufus Isaacs became Baron Reading when made Lord Chief Justice in 1914, for the people to whom honours were sold see my edit on the article Backnumber1662
David Lloyd George's comment, "We reserve the right to bomb the niggers", is cited in N. Chomsky's "Hegemony or Survival - America's Quest for Global Dominance" page 161 (Penguin, 2004), or from its original source, i.e. that quoted by Chomsky, V. G. Kiernan's "European Empires from Conquest to Collapse" (Fontana, 1982). SamWilson 19:56, 6 Jun 2005 (UTC)
________________________________________________ DLG & Greece Should some mention be made of Lloyd George's support for a creation of a greater Hellic state which included most of Turkey Agean coast and Thace. Reading from Patrick Kinloss's biograph on Ataturk and other sources it would seem that the Greek invasion was in part started due to the support of DLG himself?
Solomon
Could anyone tell me when and where answered Lloyd George to the question on how he did on the conferences? Where he compared Wilson to Jesus and Clemenceau to Napoleon? Thank you very much!
I found it quite strange that there is no mention of the Suez crises, the events that led to his downfall as a politician.-- 87.210.137.93 18:40, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
The Suez Crisis brought down Sir Anthony Eden, not Lloyd George.
Shouldn't there be some mention of the song "Lloyd George Knew My Father" - even if we don't mention My Father Knew Lloyd George ? -- Beardo 20:38, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
The section covering this part of his life is very brief and does not mention his role in the development of the Liberal's Yellow Book and subsequent program for government "We Can Conquer Unemployment" which dominated debate in the 1929 election. However, it goes into some detail of Trade Union activity from 1916-18 which seems out of place in thi article. ( Graemp 22:09, 6 March 2007 (UTC))
Added link to Eric Campbell Geddes, the author of that quote. Cite is located on his page.
Article states:"Despite this embarrassment, however, as the 1930s progressed Lloyd George became more clear-eyed about the German threat and joined Winston Churchill, among others, in fighting the government's policy of appeasement."
Searching Goebbels diary for something else I noticed numerous entries praising the work and political stature of Lloyd George. Obviously since its Goebbels his interest is in the media so I think there is even more to this than mentioned below
Also remarked on are Lloyd Georges attacks on Churchill in 1941 debates. Someone might want to go into this aspect of his career in a little more detail rather than skating over what he was doing during this time. Fluffy999 11:40, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
I think more space ought to be given to wrong steps in Lloyd George's war management, including his false charges of war crimes against the Germans. E. P. 9:26, 21 May 2007
There is some useful material at RFH ( Britain and the war between Poland and Russia) which could be adapted into this article. In particular see Lloyd George and Poland, 1919-20 (a paper by Norman Davies).-- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk 23:46, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
Did he like pie? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.158.103.87 ( talk) 15:12, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
No, but he knew my father. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.134.22.105 ( talk) 23:46, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm being serious, I need to know if he liked pie or not. If so, what flavour was his favourite? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.158.103.87 ( talk) 17:42, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
The "bomb niggers" quote being used by multiple politicians has 6 quotes. Is that really neccesary? It seems very unprofessional.
Deleted the section on Turks. Seemed like unbacked fact to me and certainly not in a neutral viewpoint, more of an attempt to smear him for certain policies conducted.
201.87.18.119 ( talk) 04:31, 6 July 2008 (UTC)
Of course there isn't a legacy section at present....the items I might add to it if there were one would be redlinks at hte moment anyway, but just to advise that various features in the Northern Rocky Mountains of British Columbia were named in honour of him:
Recently the file File:David Lloyd George, 1st Earl Lloyd-George from NPG.jpg (left) was uploaded and it appears to be relevant to this article and not currently used by it. If you're interested and think it would be a useful addition, please feel free to include it. Dcoetzee 03:32, 4 April 2009 (UTC)
Churchill and Lloyd George had worked together in Parliament and had been good friends however in later life this friendliness cooled somewhat. However in 1945 a few months before he died Lloyd George was raised to the peerage, According to 'Lloyd George and Churchill' by Richard Toye it was a final friendly act from Churchill that raised the ailing Lloyd George's spirits as he was dying. Perphaps the input from Churchill could be mentioned? Willski72 ( talk) 17:37, 19 April 2009 (UTC)
In the cabinet minister section it says, This resulted in Lloyd George's defeat in Cabinet and the adoption of estimates including provision for eight dreadnoughts. This was later to be said to be one of the main turning points in the naval arms race between Germany and Britain that contributed to the outbreak of World War I.
What is meant by the last sentence? I don't see it as a turning point, and it was not particularly one of the facts which contributed to Britain taking part in WW1. The war would certainly have taken place without us had we remained disinterested spectators (France would have lost). This particular reversal was not the instigation of a change, but more the culmination of one, where the politicians had become convinced, as eventually in Lloyd George's case, that military expenditure was essential despite all the reasons they did not want to do it. The affair of the ships was very public, but it was only reinstatement of ships previously cancelled so that overall British policy of maintaining naval supremacy over all comers remained consistent throughout 100 years.
The article goes on to say he attempted to rest control of military matters away from the generals. The first section of his autobiography talks about his conflict with Kitchener, in particular over the supply of munitions. This was entirely handled by the war office, who despite his giving them carte blanche as chancellor of the exchequer to spend as much as they needed, failed to order guns or ammunition. At a point when they anticipated having 3,000,000 men in uniform they only had rifles on order for half of them, never mind how many they physically had. I dont know how much he later wetn on to criticise their military strategy, but thus far he has concentrated on criticising their ability to provided guns and ammunition to people who were dying for lack of them. The progress of the war was being kept secret by the war office, even from the cabinet, to the point they were finding out what was happening by reading the newspapers or going to France to look. He states that general French in France was crying out for high explosive shells, but the war office insisted in supplying him with shrapnel ones, and way too few of any kind, despite HE shells being technically easier to make. Kitchener refused to allow engineering companies other than those who were established munitions suppliers before the war to make munitions. LG states that this similarly impacted on Russias ability to fight, because they were also placing orders with the same companies which were all being accepted, but which it was impossible to fulfill. The war office refused to countenance returning skilled engineering workers to munitions factories despite machinery lying idle for lack of them and men dying in the trenches for lack of what they shoulkd have been making. The picture he presents is quite extraordinary, with the war nearly being lost because of disorganisation at home rather than in France. The army was totally out of control by the government.
Reading his book I am struck by the parallel he provides to the UK situation now. He railed against the governments folly of accepting the advice of bankers (very very expensive mistake), and against the inability to supply troops with equipment they needed in a war which was taking longer than expected to accomplish anything. A prophet for our times. Talking about chancellor of the exchequer M'Kenna in 1915 he says, his action had, no doubt, the fullest authorisation from leading circles of banking and finance. But the country has since then had ample evidence that these circles are by no means to be reckoned as infallible advisors. (p.74, war memoirs vol I, DLG, Odhams, 1938) Sandpiper ( talk) 09:31, 12 January 2010 (UTC)
Place of birth is given as Chorlton-on-Medlock, Manchester, United Kingdom. Place of death is given as Tŷ Newydd, Llanystumdwy, Caernarfonshire, Wales. I will add "United Kingdom" to the place of death, for sake of accuracy. Irvine22 ( talk) 17:47, 23 March 2010 (UTC)
repeat prior comments -- Snowded TALK 20:15, 23 March 2010 (UTC)
You may 'delete' the UK from those (if ya like). Trust me, you don't want to get into these types of disputes. GoodDay ( talk) 23:57, 23 March 2010 (UTC)
There is a very clear policy on UK place names at WP:UKPLACE It states:
I was made aware of this towards the end of a debate on one page and it seemed to me to settle the issue so I tidied up the modern UK Prime Ministers to conform with it. I'm nor really surprised that Irvine22 went on a revert spree, he has a pattern of disruptive editing (see here and a recording of picking up a minor theme and running it over many pages (for example labeling any Irishperson born in England as English, even a Provisional IRA commander). More recently he has move this campaign to the Welsh from the Irish including edit warring on my own article on Wikipedia. His pattern of editing is to push to the limits of tolerance with the community, then back off with either an enforced or a voluntary withdrawal from editing for a period before he returns to start all over again.
I will also post a notice at th talk page of WP:UKPLACE but pending a change of policy agreed by the community at that location Irvine22's recent edits should be reverted. -- Snowded TALK 07:12, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
The opening paragraph of the article has the footnote "If James Callaghan is excluded from consideration." From consideration as what? "The first Welsh Prime Minister"? Even if Callaghan was Welsh (which isn't mentioned in his article, and doesn't seem likely to me, considering he was born in Portsmouth and had an Irish surname), he can't be a candidate for the _first_ Welsh Prime Minister. "The only Prime Minister to have spoken English as a second language"? I think it's even more unlikely that this would apply to Callaghan, and I would expect it to be mentioned in Callaghan's article were it true. I propose that the footnote be deleted, if clarification is not forthcoming. Tevildo ( talk) 16:23, 6 May 2010 (UTC)
Did LG visit Hitler in March, June or September 1936--or all three? Does anyone have the exact dates of these trips to hand? Drutt ( talk) 04:46, 12 May 2010 (UTC)
As an outside observer, I'm starting a thread here simply so that the issue, of whether the article should refer to this case, can be discussed. The IP should not be abusive to other editors, but equally those other editors should, it seems to be, be more hesitant in removing apparently referenced information. Personally, I would have thought it deserves a sentence but perhaps not much more - but I admit to very substantial ignorance both about Lloyd George's life as a whole, and Cork in 1920 in particular. Ghmyrtle ( talk) 12:07, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
The following confirm the claim. Surely if other wiki pages accept it then this one should as well. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom%C3%A1s_Mac_Curtain
http://www.corkcity.ie/aboutcork/historyofcork/themurderoftomasmaccurtain/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_War_of_Independence
http://www.spiritus-temporis.com/anglo-irish-war/british-response.html
http://www.rsfcork.com/maccurtinmacsuibhne.htm
http://www.leighrayment.com/commons/Ccommons5.htm
http://www.anphoblacht.com/news/detail/39649 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.101.165.150 ( talk) 14:45, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
The Coogan book (p.124) does appear (I only say that because I can't access the reference itself) to give the verbatim wording of the jury's decision in the coroner's court, and it specifically names Lloyd George. (The fact that the jury itself got his title wrong isn't really relevant.) I think it is certainly worthy of clarification in the article on Mac Curtain, and it may be that it should also be mentioned in this article. The issue is essentially one of weight and balance, but it seems to me as though the sections on his 1918-22 premiership, and Ireland within that, are actually quite short, and a mention of the Mac Curtain case could relatively easily be made within a (slightly, not excessively) longer paragraph explaining his role in relation to Ireland. Ghmyrtle ( talk) 15:22, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
This must be regarded as a reliable source.
The issue is weight and the latest edit makes this the one incident that is covered in the whole war. I think that is excessive, either no incidents or an extended entry surely? To expand on the point, one of the worst disgraces in British History was the Black and Tans, established during Lloyd George's time as Prime Minister. At the same time he was one of the most vigorous in attempting to gain home rule for Ireland. The previous version of the article in effect made no commentary, just the historical events. It is now unbalanced so I am going to revert it for the moment while we reach agreement on how to handle this. Ideally we would have some reference from a biography of Lloyd George rather than an incidental one from a book(s) with a different focus. For the record I do not agree with BW that any reference would have to go into the past of Mac Curtain -- Snowded TALK 19:07, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
would it be fair to presume he is the most powerful man to have ever lived because he was in charge of the biggest empire at its peak?? should be put in maybe...? 86.2.249.20 ( talk) 20:12, 7 August 2010 (UTC)
In 1919 Britain had one rival of similar power (the USA) and two others not far behind (France and Japan). Britain did not dominate in absolute terms in the way of the Roman Empire under Trajan, or even to the extent of the USA in the 1990s and 2000s. Paulturtle ( talk) 16:06, 7 September 2011 (UTC)
Although fairly trivial, no where in the article is the term 'Welsh Wizard' used, though this was a common nickname and one that appears often in trivia and modern newspaper articles 1, 2. 3, should this not be acknowledged? FruitMonkey ( talk) 00:34, 8 August 2010 (UTC)
The article calls for a citation showing that Robert Lloyd George is accurately described. I don't have a citation, but I know from personal acquaintance that he is. 67.173.10.34 ( talk) 02:46, 8 September 2010 (UTC)Larry Siegel
This says she might not be:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article711381.ece
http://lloydgeorgesociety.org.uk/news/000006/memories_of_david_lloyd_george__by_jennifer_longford.html admits her father is more likely to be someone else, called Tweed.
I haven't found any trace of the result. This book review (not a verifying source) implies Jennifer go the DNA tested and then didn't tell anyone. http://www.socialaffairsunit.org.uk/blog/archives/001808.php http://www.walesonline.co.uk/showbiz-and-lifestyle/television-in-wales/2009/09/18/ffion-hague-why-i-find-the-women-behind-lloyd-george-so-captivating-91466-24722426/
Drianmcdonald ( talk) 21:57, 5 October 2010 (UTC)
Why the is nothing about Turkish national independence war??As we know as well the falling falling reason of politic life of David Lloyd George is Turkish victory!-- Kamuran Ötükenli ( talk) 09:10, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
-- Snowded TALK 11:56, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
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After noticing no mention of when Lloyd George received his OM, I have made a list of honours he received - decorations, academic distinctions and honorary freedoms - cited to Burke's Peerage, Kelly's Handbook and Who's Who. I have only attached dates where there was mention in any of my sources. Cloptonson ( talk) 19:24, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 |
This bit:
...seems to be loitering around rather disconnectedly at the end of the article. A Google search [1] brings up a few variant versions of this quote; does anybody know the correct text and the exact source? It seems to be from DLG's diary, and possibly relates to the Disarmament Conference of 1932. I don't particularly want to take it out, but putting it in context would probably cast a little more light on the man. -- rbrwr
H.A.L. Fisher - President of the Board of Education was an Historian who wrote a 2 volume History of Europe. From my contemporary POV - a racist -- but after glancing at the above entry,maybe just a man of his time and place. - Sparky
I think that the article should include soemthing about Lloyd George's role in the Irish War of Independence and the subsequent peace settlement. Ausseagull ( talk) 09:24, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
Was his peerage title "Earl Lloyd George of Dwyfor"? I thought it was just "Earl of Dwyfor". Timrollpickering
As I just noticed that the older image formerly illustrating this article, and then for a while used in other articles, at present seems to be an orphan. I'm putting it here just so anyone who might have use for another image of Lloyd George on Wikipedia may be made aware of it. -- Infrogmation 18:51, 4 Jun 2004 (UTC)
In the article it notes that Lloyd George was bitterly oposed to Welsh Nationalism. This is incorrect - you should read the history of 'Cymru Fydd' a national movement lead by Lloyd George and Tom Ellis.
To whom did he "sell" titles? William Waldorf Astor, Sir William Maxwell Aitken, or Sir Rufus Isaacs? I read that King George V objected to Sir William Aitken's elevation to the baronage. Could that have been the reason? Anglius None of the above. Sir Max Aitkin became Lord Beaverbrook in 1916, the King did indeed object to his elevation but Beaverbrook paid no money, rather it was in the hope of buying his newspapers support that D LG sought his elevation, (see A J P Taylor's Beaverbrook pp 125-127 (Chatto &Unwin)) Sir Rufus Isaacs became Baron Reading when made Lord Chief Justice in 1914, for the people to whom honours were sold see my edit on the article Backnumber1662
David Lloyd George's comment, "We reserve the right to bomb the niggers", is cited in N. Chomsky's "Hegemony or Survival - America's Quest for Global Dominance" page 161 (Penguin, 2004), or from its original source, i.e. that quoted by Chomsky, V. G. Kiernan's "European Empires from Conquest to Collapse" (Fontana, 1982). SamWilson 19:56, 6 Jun 2005 (UTC)
________________________________________________ DLG & Greece Should some mention be made of Lloyd George's support for a creation of a greater Hellic state which included most of Turkey Agean coast and Thace. Reading from Patrick Kinloss's biograph on Ataturk and other sources it would seem that the Greek invasion was in part started due to the support of DLG himself?
Solomon
Could anyone tell me when and where answered Lloyd George to the question on how he did on the conferences? Where he compared Wilson to Jesus and Clemenceau to Napoleon? Thank you very much!
I found it quite strange that there is no mention of the Suez crises, the events that led to his downfall as a politician.-- 87.210.137.93 18:40, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
The Suez Crisis brought down Sir Anthony Eden, not Lloyd George.
Shouldn't there be some mention of the song "Lloyd George Knew My Father" - even if we don't mention My Father Knew Lloyd George ? -- Beardo 20:38, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
The section covering this part of his life is very brief and does not mention his role in the development of the Liberal's Yellow Book and subsequent program for government "We Can Conquer Unemployment" which dominated debate in the 1929 election. However, it goes into some detail of Trade Union activity from 1916-18 which seems out of place in thi article. ( Graemp 22:09, 6 March 2007 (UTC))
Added link to Eric Campbell Geddes, the author of that quote. Cite is located on his page.
Article states:"Despite this embarrassment, however, as the 1930s progressed Lloyd George became more clear-eyed about the German threat and joined Winston Churchill, among others, in fighting the government's policy of appeasement."
Searching Goebbels diary for something else I noticed numerous entries praising the work and political stature of Lloyd George. Obviously since its Goebbels his interest is in the media so I think there is even more to this than mentioned below
Also remarked on are Lloyd Georges attacks on Churchill in 1941 debates. Someone might want to go into this aspect of his career in a little more detail rather than skating over what he was doing during this time. Fluffy999 11:40, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
I think more space ought to be given to wrong steps in Lloyd George's war management, including his false charges of war crimes against the Germans. E. P. 9:26, 21 May 2007
There is some useful material at RFH ( Britain and the war between Poland and Russia) which could be adapted into this article. In particular see Lloyd George and Poland, 1919-20 (a paper by Norman Davies).-- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk 23:46, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
Did he like pie? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.158.103.87 ( talk) 15:12, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
No, but he knew my father. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.134.22.105 ( talk) 23:46, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm being serious, I need to know if he liked pie or not. If so, what flavour was his favourite? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.158.103.87 ( talk) 17:42, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
The "bomb niggers" quote being used by multiple politicians has 6 quotes. Is that really neccesary? It seems very unprofessional.
Deleted the section on Turks. Seemed like unbacked fact to me and certainly not in a neutral viewpoint, more of an attempt to smear him for certain policies conducted.
201.87.18.119 ( talk) 04:31, 6 July 2008 (UTC)
Of course there isn't a legacy section at present....the items I might add to it if there were one would be redlinks at hte moment anyway, but just to advise that various features in the Northern Rocky Mountains of British Columbia were named in honour of him:
Recently the file File:David Lloyd George, 1st Earl Lloyd-George from NPG.jpg (left) was uploaded and it appears to be relevant to this article and not currently used by it. If you're interested and think it would be a useful addition, please feel free to include it. Dcoetzee 03:32, 4 April 2009 (UTC)
Churchill and Lloyd George had worked together in Parliament and had been good friends however in later life this friendliness cooled somewhat. However in 1945 a few months before he died Lloyd George was raised to the peerage, According to 'Lloyd George and Churchill' by Richard Toye it was a final friendly act from Churchill that raised the ailing Lloyd George's spirits as he was dying. Perphaps the input from Churchill could be mentioned? Willski72 ( talk) 17:37, 19 April 2009 (UTC)
In the cabinet minister section it says, This resulted in Lloyd George's defeat in Cabinet and the adoption of estimates including provision for eight dreadnoughts. This was later to be said to be one of the main turning points in the naval arms race between Germany and Britain that contributed to the outbreak of World War I.
What is meant by the last sentence? I don't see it as a turning point, and it was not particularly one of the facts which contributed to Britain taking part in WW1. The war would certainly have taken place without us had we remained disinterested spectators (France would have lost). This particular reversal was not the instigation of a change, but more the culmination of one, where the politicians had become convinced, as eventually in Lloyd George's case, that military expenditure was essential despite all the reasons they did not want to do it. The affair of the ships was very public, but it was only reinstatement of ships previously cancelled so that overall British policy of maintaining naval supremacy over all comers remained consistent throughout 100 years.
The article goes on to say he attempted to rest control of military matters away from the generals. The first section of his autobiography talks about his conflict with Kitchener, in particular over the supply of munitions. This was entirely handled by the war office, who despite his giving them carte blanche as chancellor of the exchequer to spend as much as they needed, failed to order guns or ammunition. At a point when they anticipated having 3,000,000 men in uniform they only had rifles on order for half of them, never mind how many they physically had. I dont know how much he later wetn on to criticise their military strategy, but thus far he has concentrated on criticising their ability to provided guns and ammunition to people who were dying for lack of them. The progress of the war was being kept secret by the war office, even from the cabinet, to the point they were finding out what was happening by reading the newspapers or going to France to look. He states that general French in France was crying out for high explosive shells, but the war office insisted in supplying him with shrapnel ones, and way too few of any kind, despite HE shells being technically easier to make. Kitchener refused to allow engineering companies other than those who were established munitions suppliers before the war to make munitions. LG states that this similarly impacted on Russias ability to fight, because they were also placing orders with the same companies which were all being accepted, but which it was impossible to fulfill. The war office refused to countenance returning skilled engineering workers to munitions factories despite machinery lying idle for lack of them and men dying in the trenches for lack of what they shoulkd have been making. The picture he presents is quite extraordinary, with the war nearly being lost because of disorganisation at home rather than in France. The army was totally out of control by the government.
Reading his book I am struck by the parallel he provides to the UK situation now. He railed against the governments folly of accepting the advice of bankers (very very expensive mistake), and against the inability to supply troops with equipment they needed in a war which was taking longer than expected to accomplish anything. A prophet for our times. Talking about chancellor of the exchequer M'Kenna in 1915 he says, his action had, no doubt, the fullest authorisation from leading circles of banking and finance. But the country has since then had ample evidence that these circles are by no means to be reckoned as infallible advisors. (p.74, war memoirs vol I, DLG, Odhams, 1938) Sandpiper ( talk) 09:31, 12 January 2010 (UTC)
Place of birth is given as Chorlton-on-Medlock, Manchester, United Kingdom. Place of death is given as Tŷ Newydd, Llanystumdwy, Caernarfonshire, Wales. I will add "United Kingdom" to the place of death, for sake of accuracy. Irvine22 ( talk) 17:47, 23 March 2010 (UTC)
repeat prior comments -- Snowded TALK 20:15, 23 March 2010 (UTC)
You may 'delete' the UK from those (if ya like). Trust me, you don't want to get into these types of disputes. GoodDay ( talk) 23:57, 23 March 2010 (UTC)
There is a very clear policy on UK place names at WP:UKPLACE It states:
I was made aware of this towards the end of a debate on one page and it seemed to me to settle the issue so I tidied up the modern UK Prime Ministers to conform with it. I'm nor really surprised that Irvine22 went on a revert spree, he has a pattern of disruptive editing (see here and a recording of picking up a minor theme and running it over many pages (for example labeling any Irishperson born in England as English, even a Provisional IRA commander). More recently he has move this campaign to the Welsh from the Irish including edit warring on my own article on Wikipedia. His pattern of editing is to push to the limits of tolerance with the community, then back off with either an enforced or a voluntary withdrawal from editing for a period before he returns to start all over again.
I will also post a notice at th talk page of WP:UKPLACE but pending a change of policy agreed by the community at that location Irvine22's recent edits should be reverted. -- Snowded TALK 07:12, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
The opening paragraph of the article has the footnote "If James Callaghan is excluded from consideration." From consideration as what? "The first Welsh Prime Minister"? Even if Callaghan was Welsh (which isn't mentioned in his article, and doesn't seem likely to me, considering he was born in Portsmouth and had an Irish surname), he can't be a candidate for the _first_ Welsh Prime Minister. "The only Prime Minister to have spoken English as a second language"? I think it's even more unlikely that this would apply to Callaghan, and I would expect it to be mentioned in Callaghan's article were it true. I propose that the footnote be deleted, if clarification is not forthcoming. Tevildo ( talk) 16:23, 6 May 2010 (UTC)
Did LG visit Hitler in March, June or September 1936--or all three? Does anyone have the exact dates of these trips to hand? Drutt ( talk) 04:46, 12 May 2010 (UTC)
As an outside observer, I'm starting a thread here simply so that the issue, of whether the article should refer to this case, can be discussed. The IP should not be abusive to other editors, but equally those other editors should, it seems to be, be more hesitant in removing apparently referenced information. Personally, I would have thought it deserves a sentence but perhaps not much more - but I admit to very substantial ignorance both about Lloyd George's life as a whole, and Cork in 1920 in particular. Ghmyrtle ( talk) 12:07, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
The following confirm the claim. Surely if other wiki pages accept it then this one should as well. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom%C3%A1s_Mac_Curtain
http://www.corkcity.ie/aboutcork/historyofcork/themurderoftomasmaccurtain/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_War_of_Independence
http://www.spiritus-temporis.com/anglo-irish-war/british-response.html
http://www.rsfcork.com/maccurtinmacsuibhne.htm
http://www.leighrayment.com/commons/Ccommons5.htm
http://www.anphoblacht.com/news/detail/39649 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.101.165.150 ( talk) 14:45, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
The Coogan book (p.124) does appear (I only say that because I can't access the reference itself) to give the verbatim wording of the jury's decision in the coroner's court, and it specifically names Lloyd George. (The fact that the jury itself got his title wrong isn't really relevant.) I think it is certainly worthy of clarification in the article on Mac Curtain, and it may be that it should also be mentioned in this article. The issue is essentially one of weight and balance, but it seems to me as though the sections on his 1918-22 premiership, and Ireland within that, are actually quite short, and a mention of the Mac Curtain case could relatively easily be made within a (slightly, not excessively) longer paragraph explaining his role in relation to Ireland. Ghmyrtle ( talk) 15:22, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
This must be regarded as a reliable source.
The issue is weight and the latest edit makes this the one incident that is covered in the whole war. I think that is excessive, either no incidents or an extended entry surely? To expand on the point, one of the worst disgraces in British History was the Black and Tans, established during Lloyd George's time as Prime Minister. At the same time he was one of the most vigorous in attempting to gain home rule for Ireland. The previous version of the article in effect made no commentary, just the historical events. It is now unbalanced so I am going to revert it for the moment while we reach agreement on how to handle this. Ideally we would have some reference from a biography of Lloyd George rather than an incidental one from a book(s) with a different focus. For the record I do not agree with BW that any reference would have to go into the past of Mac Curtain -- Snowded TALK 19:07, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
would it be fair to presume he is the most powerful man to have ever lived because he was in charge of the biggest empire at its peak?? should be put in maybe...? 86.2.249.20 ( talk) 20:12, 7 August 2010 (UTC)
In 1919 Britain had one rival of similar power (the USA) and two others not far behind (France and Japan). Britain did not dominate in absolute terms in the way of the Roman Empire under Trajan, or even to the extent of the USA in the 1990s and 2000s. Paulturtle ( talk) 16:06, 7 September 2011 (UTC)
Although fairly trivial, no where in the article is the term 'Welsh Wizard' used, though this was a common nickname and one that appears often in trivia and modern newspaper articles 1, 2. 3, should this not be acknowledged? FruitMonkey ( talk) 00:34, 8 August 2010 (UTC)
The article calls for a citation showing that Robert Lloyd George is accurately described. I don't have a citation, but I know from personal acquaintance that he is. 67.173.10.34 ( talk) 02:46, 8 September 2010 (UTC)Larry Siegel
This says she might not be:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article711381.ece
http://lloydgeorgesociety.org.uk/news/000006/memories_of_david_lloyd_george__by_jennifer_longford.html admits her father is more likely to be someone else, called Tweed.
I haven't found any trace of the result. This book review (not a verifying source) implies Jennifer go the DNA tested and then didn't tell anyone. http://www.socialaffairsunit.org.uk/blog/archives/001808.php http://www.walesonline.co.uk/showbiz-and-lifestyle/television-in-wales/2009/09/18/ffion-hague-why-i-find-the-women-behind-lloyd-george-so-captivating-91466-24722426/
Drianmcdonald ( talk) 21:57, 5 October 2010 (UTC)
Why the is nothing about Turkish national independence war??As we know as well the falling falling reason of politic life of David Lloyd George is Turkish victory!-- Kamuran Ötükenli ( talk) 09:10, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
-- Snowded TALK 11:56, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
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After noticing no mention of when Lloyd George received his OM, I have made a list of honours he received - decorations, academic distinctions and honorary freedoms - cited to Burke's Peerage, Kelly's Handbook and Who's Who. I have only attached dates where there was mention in any of my sources. Cloptonson ( talk) 19:24, 22 December 2012 (UTC)