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 | Lists Project‑class Top‑importance | |||||||||
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Wikipedia has several talk pages relating to lists. (This page is just the talk page of the Wikipedia:Lists disambiguation page, and people do not watchlist it or discuss things here).
You may be looking for:
- Help talk:List
- Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Lists
- Wikipedia talk:Set index articles
- Wikipedia talk:Categories, lists, and navigation templates
- Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Lists
I haven't seen this discussed yet -- I've come across a list during New Pages Patrol that is predominately (could be exclusively) populated using a derivative of <nowiki>Template:Wdtable row</nowiki>. My feeling is that this is an altogether new list type and would not be out of place here. I'm just wondering if there has been a discussion around this list type or not and what the community consensus (if one exists) in relation to this "new" list type. Thanks for your input or referral (to another forum). --User:Ceyockey ( talk to me) 01:49, 31 August 2022 (UTC)
- Disallowed per last Wikidata Rfc as given at Wikipedia:Wikidata. Fram ( talk) 06:51, 31 August 2022 (UTC)
- In general, it is a bad idea to force people to edit (and watchlist) another site to change data on enwiki. Wikidata has different standards, different editing environment, different administration (for example, we wouldn´t be able to block, ban, topic ban or page ban people from such lists, while on the other hand Wikidata admins would be able to do this to enwiki editors), poor anti-vandalism records, and so on. We are two different sites, with completely different goals, and mixing them like this is the lazy option but not the right one. Creating talk or project page lists to help our article creation is of course acceptable. Fram ( talk) 07:07, 31 August 2022 (UTC)
Thanks for bringing this up Ceyockey. Contrary to the comments above, this has not been disallowed by any RfC. I am very familiar with previous discussions related to Wikidata. The relevant summaries from Wikipedia:Wikidata seem to be:
- It is not appropriate to use Wikidata in article text on English Wikipedia - a list or table of data is certainly not "article text".
- There is a valid point raised that while running text is clearly not suitable for Wikidata use, it might be worth discussing use in tables specifically – but no consensus regarding this has been reached in this discussion. - no consensus reached in 2013
- Wikidata should not be linked to within the body of the article. - the only link to Wikidata is the pencil icons which have been widely accepted across the project in infoboxes. The could of course be suppressed from the lists, but this would be highly inconvenient for editors trying to add/modify the values.
I don't really think this is a "new list type". If this is done correctly, then the final result will be a list article that meets all the relevant MoS the guidelines, and specifically Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Tables. I disagree with a lot of the other comments by Fram. One of the main purposes of Wikidata is to support other Wikimeda projects such as Wikipedia, and its goal to provide reliably sourced information is entirely in line with our own. You might as well say we shouldn't use Commons because it's a separate project with different goals. Regards — Martin ( MSGJ · talk) 10:08, 8 September 2022 (UTC)
Please comment at Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals)#Wikidata lists if you have time — Martin ( MSGJ · talk) 17:55, 19 September 2022 (UTC)
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| Disambiguation | |||
| ||||
|
| Lists Project‑class Top‑importance | |||||||||
| ||||||||||
Wikipedia has several talk pages relating to lists. (This page is just the talk page of the Wikipedia:Lists disambiguation page, and people do not watchlist it or discuss things here).
You may be looking for:
- Help talk:List
- Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Lists
- Wikipedia talk:Set index articles
- Wikipedia talk:Categories, lists, and navigation templates
- Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Lists
I haven't seen this discussed yet -- I've come across a list during New Pages Patrol that is predominately (could be exclusively) populated using a derivative of <nowiki>Template:Wdtable row</nowiki>. My feeling is that this is an altogether new list type and would not be out of place here. I'm just wondering if there has been a discussion around this list type or not and what the community consensus (if one exists) in relation to this "new" list type. Thanks for your input or referral (to another forum). --User:Ceyockey ( talk to me) 01:49, 31 August 2022 (UTC)
- Disallowed per last Wikidata Rfc as given at Wikipedia:Wikidata. Fram ( talk) 06:51, 31 August 2022 (UTC)
- In general, it is a bad idea to force people to edit (and watchlist) another site to change data on enwiki. Wikidata has different standards, different editing environment, different administration (for example, we wouldn´t be able to block, ban, topic ban or page ban people from such lists, while on the other hand Wikidata admins would be able to do this to enwiki editors), poor anti-vandalism records, and so on. We are two different sites, with completely different goals, and mixing them like this is the lazy option but not the right one. Creating talk or project page lists to help our article creation is of course acceptable. Fram ( talk) 07:07, 31 August 2022 (UTC)
Thanks for bringing this up Ceyockey. Contrary to the comments above, this has not been disallowed by any RfC. I am very familiar with previous discussions related to Wikidata. The relevant summaries from Wikipedia:Wikidata seem to be:
- It is not appropriate to use Wikidata in article text on English Wikipedia - a list or table of data is certainly not "article text".
- There is a valid point raised that while running text is clearly not suitable for Wikidata use, it might be worth discussing use in tables specifically – but no consensus regarding this has been reached in this discussion. - no consensus reached in 2013
- Wikidata should not be linked to within the body of the article. - the only link to Wikidata is the pencil icons which have been widely accepted across the project in infoboxes. The could of course be suppressed from the lists, but this would be highly inconvenient for editors trying to add/modify the values.
I don't really think this is a "new list type". If this is done correctly, then the final result will be a list article that meets all the relevant MoS the guidelines, and specifically Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Tables. I disagree with a lot of the other comments by Fram. One of the main purposes of Wikidata is to support other Wikimeda projects such as Wikipedia, and its goal to provide reliably sourced information is entirely in line with our own. You might as well say we shouldn't use Commons because it's a separate project with different goals. Regards — Martin ( MSGJ · talk) 10:08, 8 September 2022 (UTC)
Please comment at Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals)#Wikidata lists if you have time — Martin ( MSGJ · talk) 17:55, 19 September 2022 (UTC)