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Archive 25 | ← | Archive 30 | Archive 31 | Archive 32 | Archive 33 | Archive 34 | Archive 35 |
Does anyone here have access to issue 13 of the UK edition of PSU3 magazine because I need some info from of it for a citation. - X201 08:29, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
I, and many others, had been using Template:Vgrationale to add fair use rationale to images, and now it appears to be broken. It no longer shows on the image page what article the rationale applies to. It only says "Non-free / fair use media rationale - NEEDS ARTICLE NAME" and "Article {{{Article}}}"
Some users have taken advantage of this to flag a lot of images for WP:NFCC#10c. This is causing a lot of headaches. When we inserted this template, the article name was there. Now the images are nothing more than easy brownie points for bots and others.
I have no idea how templates work. Can someone PLEASE fix this? If it can be broken so easily, it should be able to be FIXED easily. Unfortunately, now we have hundreds of false deletion notices to dealt with manually. Thank you. SashaNein 13:33, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
Bump: I checked with BetaCommand, and according to him (presumably) the old way Vgrationale was used would not be tagged by the bot since the article name was being used still on the page outside of the "pages that use this image" link.
If anyone has an example image where the fair-use rationale was put in using the old VGrationale, but has recently been labeled as a #10c violation by some user (bot or otherwise), can they please provide an example (including hist/diff when the CSD warning was put onto the image?) I want to try to chase this down a bit more to make sure its not some bad faith editors doing it. -- Masem 09:34, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
Just looking at this set of articles, there is rampant problems with fair use, gamecruft, WP:IINFO, In-universe tone...
The main article looks fine, though it has a little bit overdetailed/in-universe plot-summary, and possibly more images than needed (and I'm generally for keeping images, too!). Also, the character sections seem to be more wordy than necessary, seeing as the same info is retold on the char pages, verbatim - if that's the case, then only a short sentence is necessary on the links part of the main anime page. Also, it seems to me that the pages are set up to preserve the spoiler of who the servants are - that seems like it should be mentioned at the top of the character pages, and as part of the blurb on the main page.
Thanks for your help. I've only seen a few episodes of this anime, so I won't actually be able to do anything besides comment, though.
KrytenKoro 15:12, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
The Zoo Tycoon task force was recently created without any discussion. I don't think that this topic has enough scope to justify a task force. Delete? JACO PLANE • 2007-10-1 21:32
Allow them a week for more than three members, otherwise remove the Task Force (after some discussion). Sounds sensible? Initiative is good, after all. User:Krator ( t c) 00:05, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
OK, I've taken it to mfd: Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/Zoo Tycoon. JACO PLANE • 2007-10-3 16:02
Check out Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Video games/Devil May Cry#I guess we're kind of "official" now. Apparently the DevilMayCry.com website has copied the synopsis from Devil May Cry, Devil May Cry 2, and Devil May Cry 3: Dante's Awakening. Even though it's probably a violation of the GFDL it's pretty awesome :) JACO PLANE • 2007-10-1 22:22
Please check the talk page of the list of best-selling video games and tell us whether you want the article divided or not. Yesterday we had an edit war between two people splitting it and two others reverting. Thanks. -- ReyBrujo 00:19, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
A user keeps adding to the Mega Drive article that the processor in the machine is 32-bit rather than the generally accepted 16-bit (certainly accepted by Sega themselves). From the Motorola 68000 article: "it is an implementation of a 32-bit architecture on a 16-bit CPU", indicating, to the best of my understanding, that it is a 16-bit processor. The user in question has also modified Motorola 68000, Amiga and Atari ST with this apparent POV/interpretation. Despite my protestations that this is a matter to be sorted out on Talk:Motorola 68000, or at the very least consensus should be gained for the change on each page (I and at least one other editor have reverted this change on the Mega Drive article), the user quotes WP:BOLD on the Mega Drive talk page as a reason to do as he likes, and removed my post on his talk page requesting he stop changing all these articles. So, any ideas how to deal with this? Miremare 22:38, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
Master Chief (Halo) is up for FAC, just a heads up. David Fuchs ( talk) 01:46, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
Anyone here familiar with the technical aspects of the Wii's Virtual Console? An anonymous user and I are currently in a content dispute ( see the discussion) over what the definition of the feature is. I'm trying my best to keep it from escalating, but I could use a third opinion and/or some outside verification - I currently do not have time to locate sources on this.
The IP user I'm arguing with asserts that VC is *only* the specialized portion of the Wii Shop channel, and that all of the emulation software is built in to each download. While this may be true, no source has been provided that verifies this. My own assertion (based on what little research I've had time to do, as well as my conclusions based on discussions I've had with people familiar with the product) is that Virtual Console is a feature of the Wii, and that the emulation software is provided as part of the Wii System Software, thus making the individual games just packages containing the ROM image and metadata. I also do not have a source to back this up, so technically both assertions are WP:OR right now.
If anyone can help with the discussion, it would be much appreciated. Thanks. — KieferSkunk ( talk) — 23:02, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
Thought you'd like to know. -- Kizor 02:33, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
Just to help things along, I nominated List of Warcraft items for deletion.-- SeizureDog 07:09, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
Hi. Please weigh in on the main picture choice for the video game article on Talk:Video game. There was a Pac-Man image being used, but I don't think it's necessary. There's plenty of free games that can be used as the main picture. I picked SuperTux since it's easily identifiable as a Super Mario Bros. clone. -- Jtalledo (talk) 07:33, 6 October 2007 (UTC)
Good, or is this WP:NOT#IINFO? hbdragon88 01:42, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
So...will anybody be bold and AFD this? Krator, can I copy your argument for the AFD? hbdragon88 22:54, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
Should the List of weapons in the Counter-Strike article be removed? -- Silver Edge 09:01, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
Okay, why is there a step-by-step scintallating page on the exact changes from beta to beta? Again WP:NOT#IINFO, at least in my opinion. hbdragon88 22:55, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
Opinions. Unlike the female protagonists, this is more clearly and easily defined, and probably is a bigger deal. Is just cleanup in order, or are there serious problems with the existence of the article itself? hbdragon88 23:59, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
The Chikyuu Boueigun 2 article is currently listed as a rename, but is now in the 'old' requests with no comments. It's Earth Defense Force 2, if the Japanese name doesn't ring a bell. All the sources I could find about the game are now cited in the article to help with any decision. I'd be grateful if any project members would give an opinion one way or the other on the requested moves page. Also, there's a couple of other game articles there too. Thanks. Someone another 16:44, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm not sure about games that have just been announced, like Fire Emblem DS. Do I create the article now, or wait until there is more info? Ashnard Talk Contribs 16:42, 10 October 2007 (UTC)
Further to the post above about the 26-article nomination of WoW-related articles and the subsequent (likely sucessful) AfD for List of Warcraft items, I had a look through the WoW pages, and there is a quite incredible amount of stuff that should be trimmed that hasn't been mentioned yet. I've grouped these together based on whether they should be kept or deleted (with a few unsures) along with basic reasoning. Due to the list being so long, I've put it on a seperate page here: User:Miremare/Wow. Comments welcome, especially on whether I've got any wrong, or on how to group these for AfD... Miremare 14:49, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm getting into a revert cycle at the Warhawk article with a user whose sole aim on Wikipedia seems to be to push PlayStation products, User:Playstationdude. Warhawk started off as a disambiguation page, and I feel it should stay that way. Playstationdude seems to think that it should be a redirect to Warhawk (PlayStation 3 game). This is an egregious example of recentism, Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, users are just as likely to be searching for the other articles related to that name such as the Curtiss P-40 or War Hawk. In edit summaries, I've told him to get to the talk page about it, but it hasn't happened. This could do with some extra input. - hahnch e n 17:03, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
I've insisted on keeping the Nintendo DS version based on the fact that it is not the same game, and in fact is a different plot, different gameplay engine, different genre, different graphics engine, different development history, different reception, different soundtrack, different composers, different critical reception, different commercial reception, and different awards (it won "Best Game no one Played for DS, 2006", while no other version has won a single award from a major news outlet). It is clearly a different game, and would be completely cluttered up if merged or simply undeveloped. If merged, it would require no less than two gameplay sections, two plot sections, two development sections, two presentation sections, and two reception sections, which, as far as I know, no one does, and I don't think anyone has advocated for such a thing.
A discussion is taking place
here. -
A Link to the Past
(talk) 05:01, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
Since Sesshomaru has decided to remove the argument when he failed to present his own argument, I'm moving my list of reasonings to this page.
"Different developers, different composers. 100% of the staff is unique to this game. It's developed with a different engine, uses a completely different concept (an adventure game with swapping characters, which IGN compared to Tomb Raider, and others to Lost Vikings). It sold excellently, one of the best-selling Over the Hedge games ever made by far. It consisted of more than 50% of the combined versions' sales regularly in PAL regions. It sold more than 300k in the United States. It has different development history. It won an award from IGN. It's the only version that did. "In Over the Hedge DS players are drawn into an all-new storyline" from Vicarious Visions' web site. GameSpot refers to it as taking place after the movie. The console games are about the movie, thusly, this is a sequel if anything. GDC also featured a keynote about the graphics engine and its implementation in Over the Hedge for the DS. The visuals also received great reception. So in the end, if they were merged, there would need to be:
If these conditions AREN'T met, then the subject is not adequately covered. If you do one section for the gameplay and one section for the plot, then only the console games are covered. Just because it's called Over the Hedge and shares the same title as the console versions doesn't mean that they are in any way similar outside of the license. In all intents and purposes, they're as different as night and day. What matters is if there's a need to be separate, and the fact that license is the only similarity proves that there is a need. - A Link to the Past (talk) 04:22, 12 October 2007 (UTC)"
Would anyone want to explain how much similarity an article on the console versions and an article on the handheld version would have? - A Link to the Past (talk) 05:18, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
Do you have a reference to this claim of the games being different? Salavat 06:54, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
I've begun a merge discussion at Talk:Over the Hedge (Nintendo DS)#Requested merge and everyone is invited to participate. Lord Sesshomaru ( talk • edits) 17:06, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Hi guys. I'm in a quandary. As Melodia mentioned above, Tetris Attack and Panel de Pon are currently both in the same article. I started to split them apart again, but then I realized part of why they were merged in the first place. I need some help, and/or would appreciate it if someone else is willing to do the work to split these articles or find another solution that works.
The problem is that these two games are essentially the same - their presentation details are significantly different, but their gameplay mechanics are nearly identical and they share a lot in common in terms of reception and following releases. Part of the rationale behind merging them was to reduce that redundancy and show how similar the games are, but there is ENOUGH different material between the two that we have a very messy TA article with separate distributed sections for each game.
I've argued before that having PdP as part of the TA article puts undue weight on TA, but now I can't seem to figure out how to split these apart again without repeating a huge amount of information between the two. Need some more opinions on this. Please help. :) — KieferSkunk ( talk) — 22:57, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
i can sense nationalistic wars brewing again. This could be epic. Of course, nothing beats the Mega Drive war, though Brain Age was a bit contentious with Another Code being a small little skirmish. hbdragon88 23:22, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
Just a quick note that Half-Life 2: Episode One is up for FA. Thankyou. Qjuad 23:55, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
So, how do you source those sections? Obviously, the game itself is a source for them, but that isn't good enough (apparently), so I've cited the game manual for the entire gameplay section, which, again, doesn't appear to be good enough, so I'm now stumped (I'm mostly talking about the Kohan: Immortal Sovereigns article here - not citing the gameplay section is why it failed the GA process, but the questions stand for other articles too). Ideas? How do you source those sections? -- VPeric 10:56, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I noticed that a lot of articles have very similar tables to show review scores, agrigate scores and awards but there's no standard among them so most of them end up being completely different to each other. To me, it seems particularly messy and that's what templated are here for. So after a bit of experimentation and a lot of investigating, I made a template for it. This is my first template so it may not entirely be correct but I think I've got a good base down which people can add to.
I haven't copied this over to the templates section yet though just in case if it's just not going to be used so I would like a bit of feedback.
Crimsonfox 16:29, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Nitpicking, but "Compilations of Multiple Reviews" should be in lower case: "Compilations of multiple reviews". -- Mika1h 17:00, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm wondering if it makes sense to explicitly include a reference parameter for each review source. Sure, one can add it after the review score in the same parameter value, but people may get lazy in adding. Unfortunately, there's issues with dealing with named vs unnamed parameters. you could add a parameter that would include the whole ref tag instead of just the citation template, that'll deal with it. Thinking about it a bit more, if you DO add this and then check that any review that has a score but otherwise empty reference tag should flag some error. It would help with making sure people cite their sources. Same with awards as well. But, dunno...it's a possible idea. -- MASEM 17:23, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
A few nitpicks: Why require redundant parameters like both 1UP=yes
and score1UP=…
, instead of just coding it as {{#if:{{{score1UP|}}}|<tr><td>[[1UP.com]]</td><td>{{{score1UP|}}}</td></tr>}}
? You could similarly eliminate the awards=yes
by requiring that award1
be used for the first award. You could also do {{#if:{{{MC|}}}{{{GR|}}}|…}}
instead of using a compilations
parameter, but if many more compilators get added that might not scale so well. Also, I would consider changing the whole thing to use HTML rather than wikitable syntax.
Anomie 17:54, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I'll say this now, if you can make the template more efficient, please do so, because I'm new to this whole template thing. A lot of it is new and scary to me. I understand what you mean with that Anomie, so I'll get on that right away. Also I'll add a note in the documentation per Masem's comment. Crimsonfox 18:44, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Does anyone else have any major issues with this template or shall I go ahead and add it to the templates section and start implementing it? Crimsonfox 23:20, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
Any objection to an addition to the documentation? Please copy the whole template and do not delete unused fields - X201 15:12, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
Is there any guideline for how to cite review scores (references) when using this template? Specifically, where should editors stick the "ref" tag and associated content so that the reference doesn't negatively impact the appearance of the table? -- Slordak 16:24, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
OK, fair enough. Next question... I'm having trouble with the way this table sits with the text, i.e. there's a massive amount of whitespace above the table. For an example, see my recent edit to Mario Party 8 where I attempted to use this template. -- Slordak 14:04, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
I was browsing the HL2 mod list when I noticed a request for an Empires (mod) article on the Talk:List of Half-Life 2 mods page. The problem is that the mod in question already had an article, but it was deleted after a pretty messy and, in my opinion, biased afd (look for Empires in the deletion log). I'm wondering if any work I put forth toward this article will just be in vain as die hards would just argue the mod still isn't notable/meritable enough and the previous deletion is only grounds for another one. What the mod does have going for it though is a couple of magazine articles, features and a few awards. Think the article has a chance to live now, or will it just be shot down by guys like User:GestaltG? -- L3TUC3 23:24, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm usually up for a good and controversial deletion debate. Once you've done what Jacoplane wrote above, drop me a message when it will inevitably be up for deletion. User:Krator ( t c) 23:52, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Thanks to Donkey Kong, we now have a precedent for using copyrighted images for featured video game articles. DK survived the entire day with an image of the Game & Watch handheld (with game graphics clearly displayed, even). So, next time your pet VG FA comes to the main page, you'll have some ammunition for using a box image. Zeality 02:25, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
Hi, when I checked Video game genres, I found that the article, its template and Category:Video game genres classify games differently. Is there any standard for this issue.-- Sa.vakilian( t- c) 06:14, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
OK, I think it has been long enough, so let's try this again (see the original discussion here). This time, we know that unless real world information is provided, there is none. There have been enough attempts to prove that already. The point of this discussion should be to prove that the information exists; otherwise, these need to be redirected to fit WP:N, WP:V, WP:RS, WP:FICT, and WP:WAF.
For those new to the discussion, Goomba and Koopa Troopa are pretty much the top two enemies of the Mario series. One would think that information would be available, but there have been at least a dozen attempts that I know of, and probably many more. Unless that information is shown, the is no longer any reasonable doubt. Please remember that in the discussion. TTN 19:50, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
I've noticed that most Tekken character articles and The House of the Dead video game articles have a list at the end of all the possible endings. Is this fine, or do you think this makes for an excessively detailed plot, perhaps too in-universe? I'd like some support before I rampage through the article, or a reprimand if I am actually damaging the articles. hbdragon88 03:34, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
Hey guys... Age of Mythology was recently featured (woot!), and I'd like to see it on the Main Page at some stage. Anybody have any tips or advice on ways to make this happen? Cheers, Dihydrogen Monoxide ( H2O) 08:20, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
Considering how important of a game this is, it's really quite shameful that it's stayed a stub for as long as it has. I've built up a "Gameplay" section for the article, and plan to get it up to GA status (which really shouldn't be too hard). Any help would be appreciated, especially if anyone has any information on its development or can help build a reception section.-- SeizureDog 11:57, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
I've started the daunting task of re-listing this article by year of publication, so that it's doing something other than duplicating Category:ZX Spectrum games. I've chosen by-publication year over by-genre as it's more objective. It's a big list though, so any help will be appreciated. Cheers, Marasmusine 17:29, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
...is one of my favorite PC games. I know it isn't very well known. In fact the biggest community of that game is so deserted that it's like there are few people there.
But the article reads like a story. I don't know how to trim a story, so help would be appreciated. Thanks. TheBlazikenMaster 18:54, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
Template_talk:Infobox_CVG#Move_to_Template:Infobox_VG. We should probably change this follow the new name of this Wikiproject. Axem Titanium 21:15, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
I just did a major overhaul on the Mega Drive article but it's considerably lacking in the technical specifications. I've gathered as much info as I can understand but without someone who understands it a bit more than I can, it's not going to get improved any further. I left the tables on the left for information purposes until the info boxes on the right are fully fleshed out. Also, it would be good if someone with technical skills can write short summaries of each section with in the "Technical Specification" as well, something similar to the SNES article.
Not sure where else to take this, so I figured this would be the best place to try. Thanks. Crimsonfox 23:24, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
PS: If anyone has any old copies of Viz Magazine with those rude Sega adverts in, give me a shout, I'd rather reference those than a website. Thanks. Crimsonfox 11:06, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
There's a discussion on the page which was settled in favour of the article being at We Love Katamari, but the article's recently been moved back to the heart symbol. I'm under the impression there should have been a discussion but I'm no expert on article names - could someone clarify? Someone another 13:56, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
I created a new template, Template:Title MoS, to address this situation. The MoS dictates that our titles should contain English words even if the trademark dictates otherwise. So I added a note to We Love Katamari at the top indicating what its correct title is and that the title is listed differently due to the MoS. (Usually, these notes indicate technical limitations, but this isn't a limitation so much as a rule.) — KieferSkunk ( talk) — 07:16, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
I found that earlier and it's incredibly extensive on the Mega Drive but I'm not sure if it could be used as a source or not. Could someone help me out? Thanks Crimsonfox 15:14, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
Project Exile has been announced to be published in 2008 by Graffiti Entertainment. Should the article be recreated? - A Link to the Past (talk) 17:41, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
WP:DRV first. hbdragon88 00:19, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm running Populous: The Beginning through WP:FAC again. If you can, look over the article and respond on the candidates page. David Fuchs ( talk) 19:45, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm really curious as to why this article has not been created yet. Kotaku and Joystiq both have entries. I know this sounds like whining, I'm just curious as to what the general consensus is behind not having a page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.235.204.236 ( talk) 00:08, 23 October 2007 (UTC)
Does this need to exist? It seems like a cruft article to me. It's on gamer wiki already, so why have it here? Compiling information, and just jamming it into a list with many sections... doesn't seem that helpful overall. I recall seeing this before, and it had less sections. Now people just seem to be adding more and more. Even cutting some sections, still makes it seem like a fancruft article to me. Resolution and aspect sections make the article only useful to those that want to know the information. In a way, this is a game guide on what features are in each game. Wikipedia isn't a game guide, so shouldn't this be deleted? RobJ1981 04:27, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
How do we create an assessment table for a Wikiproject? WP:FF lacks an assessment table that would make it easier to find out about article assessment statuses. — Bl ue 。 04:28, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
Someone has proposed that the GTA task force be split off into a separate WikiProject. Discussion is here. JACO PLANE • 2007-10-25 12:05
Guys, after looking and not seeing an Atari related project, I just created Wikipedia:WikiProject_Atari. I basically copied over and quickly edited the Wikipedia:WikiProject_Nintendo page for a quick template. So that means it still needs lots and lots of work to get it going as an actual functioning page. If anyone with experience in setting up project pages could help out (and of course join the project) that would be great! -- Marty Goldberg 18:34, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm questioning the use of Images on character specific articles. Some articles, such as King Dedede, feature a picture of them from outside their franchise in the Infobox. In all honesty, I don't really like that. This leads me to believe that said Cameo/appearance is an official portrayal of the character, when, in all reality, it's not. For example, in the article I mentioned, They are now using the image of King Dedede from Super Smash Bros. Brawl. The Brawl Dedede is an entirely different Dedede, and his design, and appearance in Brawl is not canon to the Kirby Franchise, for if it was, then Link/ Sonic/ Snake/ect would be cannon to the Kirby series.
In short, I don't think Cameos/Special appearances should be displayed on the infobox, when the article is about the cannon character. But this gets me into alot of edit wars, so I was hoping to hear the projects opinion on this. Dengarde ► Complaints 23:31, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
If there is not yet a VG guideline for it, it should read:
Time of publication is irrelevant to this, IMHO. User:Krator ( t c) 00:20, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
The quality of the entire set of articles on the Legacy of Kain series is of really poor quality, and I was wondering if anyone wanted to help me do a major clean-up of the articles, especially the series page and the Defiance article. I just joined, so I'm still not sure how everything works around here. I look forward to making the Wiki articles I know and love even better! ClockworkCompanionCube 04:09, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
Look at WWE SmackDown vs. Raw 2008 for example. It's cluttered with lists: some useful, some not. I think things such as: match types and championship belts/titles need to be in prose form and not a list. Yes, knowing which titles are in the game is useful: however it's simply game guide content in my view. If people want to know this information, they should be visiting a gaming or wrestling site that specializes in it. I've looked at other fighting game articles as wrestling games are basically fighters as well, and I don't see all these massive lists there. Fighting games don't feature titles much that I know of, but they certainly have many modes and types of battles.) I've mentioned this on the pro wrestling project as well, since some work on the video game articles as well. RobJ1981 05:08, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
Diff Happier? User:Krator ( t c) 08:16, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
Chrono Trigger | |
---|---|
Developer(s) | Square |
Publisher(s) |
Square Square Electronic Arts |
Designer(s) |
Kazuhiko Aoki (
producer) Takashi Tokita ( director) |
Series | Chrono series |
Engine | Chrono Trigger engine |
Platform(s) | Super Nintendo Entertainment System |
Release | 22 August 1995 |
Genre(s) | Console role-playing game |
Mode(s) | Single player |
Proposing a new layout of Template: Infobox CVG. Quite a bit of markup cleanup, title is taken from article name if not specified, and much closer in appearance to templates like Template: Infobox software. Code is at user:thumperward/infobox CVG for now. Thoughts? Chris Cunningham 10:14, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
I've added the existing one to make comparing them easier. - X201 12:29, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
... Sorry to be a stick-in-the-mud, but I find the old version a lot easier to read (with the dividing lines) and a lot more pleasing to the eye. Could you explain (in layman's terms) how the technical side is improved by this new infobox? Someone another 13:04, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
if
statements to make them optional (though the title field is already optional in the old template).caption
field is required if an image is provided. I don't know if this is intended? The old template checks for the caption field and only adds it (complete with extra line break) if present. --
DatRoot 14:43, 26 October 2007 (UTC)Well I don't really have a strong opinion either way, though I thought it should be brought up.
But while we're on the subject of change, I realise I'm completely new here but I just thought I would throw this into the mix as this is something that has irked me whilst I've been looking at a few articles. The infobox has a field for release dates, where many different release dates for different platforms are often seen, and then another field that lists the separate platforms again, and then another field that lists the media the game came on, sometimes with the corresponding platform beside it, sometimes not (see Sonic Spinball, GTA III etc.)
So I'd like all that infomation to be consolidated into one field in the infobox, looking something like one of these (info taken from Sonic Spinball:
|
|
Obviously, even though the infobox would be coded to allow both old and new formats, it's still a pretty big change, and I accept it's likely to be rejected, but any thoughts?
Chris Cunningham, I think it is safe to assume there is a consensus for changing the code of the infobox, but the technical improvements only for now. I believe style should be discussed separately and extensively. As it is a protected template you want to edit, I went ahead with this assessment of consensus, for the sake of speedy and bold editing. User:Krator ( t c) 22:30, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
There is very slow edit war going on on SNES and NES over whether the article should say each "is" or "was" a video game console. No one seems to have much of a problem with the verb tense of rest of the article, just with this opening sentence. A few editors have repeatedly edited the above articles to use "was", while a few other editors have changed it back to "is".
The current situation is that most of the articles in {{ Dedicated video game consoles}} that use the above wording use "is", except for the two mentioned above and Vectrex. Arguments seem to be: Feel free to add additional arguments to this section.
I lean towards "is a video game console" rather than "was", but if we can come up with good arguments for "was" I can accept it. I just want a real consensus rather than 4 people reaching no conclusion. I'm tempted to rewrite the lead of NES and SNES to completely remove the copula and settle it that way. Anomie 12:11, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
'Is', if they're no longer game consoles then what are they, toasters? All the NES and SNES owners must be wondering what monstrous forms their former consoles have taken - "Aiieee, it's got me in a headlock". Someone another 13:19, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
I want to thank Anomie for bringing this discussion to this page. As one who has edited Wikipedia for about two years, I should probably know about these "behind the scenes" pages, but I never know how to find them when they would be appropriate. And clearly, this is appropriate, since this issue affects so many articles.
With all respect, I think that the obviously sincere and well-balanced debating points above do not fully capture the essence of the arguments on this issue (as is sometimes the case with an attempt to boil down an issue to bulleted points). So I want to add below some points previously made elsewhere, then see what kind of response results. My position is that the use of "is" with SNES and several other game systems, while obviously popular amongst many video game afficianados (as evidenced by previous discussions) is atypical usage amongst most native-English speakers. I support in most cases employing "was" for older game systems. I recognize that there is an inherent element of subjectivity in any such rule, but what I think is not recognized is that the insistence upon use of "is" will result either in similar subjectivity, or even worse, an appearance of ridiculousness. Again, some previous points, with my own comments slightly edited for what I hope to be increased clarity:
From Unschool: Before we all start jumping up and down saying, "But the Super NES still exists, I still love playing with mine!", let us consider a few things. There are still people (like me) who also continue to take beautiful pictures with their AE-1s, and even some people (like my mother) having their Ramblers washed and waxed regularly. These products have been out of production for quite a while, however, and several generations of replacement models have come and gone. That is why, in those articles, the past tense is used. I was struck by the awkwardness of [the SNES] article's opening when it came up on FA, and feel that it simply reads more sensibly in the past tense, as we are now several generations past this system.
Unschool:Thank you for your well-considered comments, Kiefer. Allow me to respond (and this may not be smooth—I'm still thinking this out). Your assertion, Kiefer, that "most" articles referring to things that still exist use present-tense, would, I suspect, be a difficult thing to support factually—not because it's necessarily wrong, but because no one has time to pull up the plethora of articles that would need to be examined. Be that as it may, I would further assert that there is likely a difference in the way most editors treat physical commercial goods from the way they treat works of art. Works of art, be they paintings or sculptures or stage plays or books, are unique items. Automobiles and video games and cameras and washing machines are mass-produced. I'm not saying I know why we treat these two categories of items differently, it is just my observation that we do. When I read this article using the present tense, it simply struck me as wrong, or at least very odd. I'm still formulating in my mind why, but when I read it, I immediately looked up a few other items (as cited in my original talk page entry) and found that they also used the past tense, despite the clear continued existence of the items concerned. I think that the Super NES is closer to the AE-1 than it is to The Red Green Show. That is merely my opinion, of course. But it is the opinion of a great many editors that the past tense is more appropriate for many of these items which are no longer in production. Unschool 19:58, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
KieferSkunk: In response to Unschool: I think what you're saying is that we need to distinguish between the model (the design and manufacture of the SNES) vs. physical units. You're saying that because the SNES is no longer being made, it makes sense to refer to the SNES model in past tense, even though SNES units are still around and in use today. Comparing the SNES to the Chevy Nova (as Loodog did) makes for a good argument in that light. In my opinion, though, it makes just as much sense to refer to the Chevy Nova as a car that still exists, but is no longer being made - just like the SNES. It exists, people still use it, etc., but you'd still refer to its manufacture, advertising, etc. in past-tense since it's not in production anymore. Mixing tense can be tricky, but I think it makes more sense to refer to the SNES itself in present-tense and anything relating to its commercial period in past-tense. — KieferSkunk ( talk) — 22:55, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
From Anomie: I agree with KieferSkunk, in that statements of fact about the SNES should use the present tense, while statements about events in the past should use past tense. This does seem to be the general case with console articles: for example, NES, Mega Drive, and Nintendo 64 all use "is" in the first sentence of the lead. Anomie 23:54, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
Added by Unschool 23:09, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
I vote for "is" as well, and that seems to be the consensus here. I really see this as a non-issue, or one that's pretty self-evident. If you're talking about marketing, events, etc., you use past tense (that would include an automobile line). If you're talking about an object you use present tense. I.e. "a leaf is an above-ground plant organ specialized for photosynthesis." You don't use "A leaf was..." unless you're identifying a specific instance of a leaf that also is no more. Such as "I had a maple tree leaf that had a unique split. Unfortunately I didn't preserve properly and it disintegrated. The leaf was unique." An NES *is* an 8-bit video game console that *was* released by Nintendo. It *was* released in 1985, it *was* part of Nintendo's lineup, it *was* well received, it *is* a console that launched some legendary game characters, Zelda *is* a game that *was* released for the NES, etc. etc. I'm thinking since we have consensus for "is" vs. "was" that we should put this in to the guidelines. -- Marty Goldberg 07:16, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
User:Unschool, no offence taken, I've heard worse. :) A few points though: I wasn't saying "everyone who reads Wikipedia is stupid" (though it would be foolish to assume that no one who reads Wikipedia is stupid), as that doesn't matter. If someone who knows absolutely nothing about the SNES, or game consoles in general, were to read that first line, it would be quite reasonable for them to assume the SNES to be something that no longer exists. It's misleading whether you're stupid or you've got a Ph.d in being smart. Your argument for the past tense seems to be because "it's what people say". While this is probably true it doesn't make it right. People say things we wouldn't write in an encyclopedia - they use slang, contractions, grunting noises, single word sentences, say "of" instead of "have", and all manner of other terrible affronts to the English language! Just because people writing articles about cars or movies or whatever want to use the wrong tense, that's no reason to follow their lead. As for your third point, I don't specifically dislike using the past tense for video games, I dislike using it wherever it's not appropriate - if something exists it's present, if it existed it's past. As far as I see it that's an axiomatic truth. Finally, I wasn't trying to say "I'm right because I say I'm right", I was trying to say "these are the reasons that present tense should be used". Other than that I'm not really sure what I should have said... Miremare 19:03, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
Since this is settled now, I'm going to suggest again we put something regarding this in the guidelines, because it seems to be an important point (thanks again Unschool for starting the discussion here). I'll start a topic on the talk page there to get the ball rolling on discussing the actual wording. -- Marty Goldberg 16:24, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
History of computer role-playing games, Cultural differences in role-playing video games and Console RPG are all embarrassingly bad. Maybe someone could go over them and provide some feedback. Computer role-playing game is passable. I couldn't find an RPG task-force. SharkD 03:17, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
Should there be a task force of people who, once a week, check all of the changes made to a particular featured article, to make sure vandalism, false statements, unnecessary content, or unsourced material be either fixed or removed? And in the cases of non FAs, people can request that it be monitored. - A Link to the Past (talk) 03:50, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
I just recently found this obscure article about an obscure game that's related to a not at all obscure creator of a pretty famous game. From the looks of it, it's only a few short steps from being GA status, but it lacks a bit of things. With a little work it could be ready for a proper GA review in no time. - InsaneZeroG 05:35, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
This is an idea I've been mulling over for some time, but only decided to propose now. I noticed it says on the main page of WP:STARWARS that it's effectively a collaboration of numerous projects including this one, but I thought one task force specifically focusing on one aspect of Star Wars (and one which doesn't actually have so many high-quality articles) would be pretty useful. It's fairly self-explanatory, so check out the proposal. I'd be interested to hear what you think. Una Laguna Talk 18:52, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
I was thinking that the Star Wars WikiProject could cover it just fine, but if a task force is necessary, I have no objections to it. hbdragon88 22:49, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
List of video games: A-C, List of video games: D-H and so on. Anyone want to format these better? As of now, they seem to be "catchalls" for every game ever. All of these lists are important, but need a lot of work. I personally feel the catchall attitude isn't the way to go, unless the lists get a better format. Some sort of sourcing wouldn't hurt either. Going by the fact that most on the lists have articles isn't completely helpful, as people could be adding hoax articles to the lists that go unnoticed. RobJ1981 20:46, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
Hi, have just picked this up from the Wikification project and have done what I can with it but this is not my area of expertise so if someone wants to take a look at it I'd be grateful. -- Rodhullandemu ( talk - contribs) 22:43, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 25 | ← | Archive 30 | Archive 31 | Archive 32 | Archive 33 | Archive 34 | Archive 35 |
Does anyone here have access to issue 13 of the UK edition of PSU3 magazine because I need some info from of it for a citation. - X201 08:29, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
I, and many others, had been using Template:Vgrationale to add fair use rationale to images, and now it appears to be broken. It no longer shows on the image page what article the rationale applies to. It only says "Non-free / fair use media rationale - NEEDS ARTICLE NAME" and "Article {{{Article}}}"
Some users have taken advantage of this to flag a lot of images for WP:NFCC#10c. This is causing a lot of headaches. When we inserted this template, the article name was there. Now the images are nothing more than easy brownie points for bots and others.
I have no idea how templates work. Can someone PLEASE fix this? If it can be broken so easily, it should be able to be FIXED easily. Unfortunately, now we have hundreds of false deletion notices to dealt with manually. Thank you. SashaNein 13:33, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
Bump: I checked with BetaCommand, and according to him (presumably) the old way Vgrationale was used would not be tagged by the bot since the article name was being used still on the page outside of the "pages that use this image" link.
If anyone has an example image where the fair-use rationale was put in using the old VGrationale, but has recently been labeled as a #10c violation by some user (bot or otherwise), can they please provide an example (including hist/diff when the CSD warning was put onto the image?) I want to try to chase this down a bit more to make sure its not some bad faith editors doing it. -- Masem 09:34, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
Just looking at this set of articles, there is rampant problems with fair use, gamecruft, WP:IINFO, In-universe tone...
The main article looks fine, though it has a little bit overdetailed/in-universe plot-summary, and possibly more images than needed (and I'm generally for keeping images, too!). Also, the character sections seem to be more wordy than necessary, seeing as the same info is retold on the char pages, verbatim - if that's the case, then only a short sentence is necessary on the links part of the main anime page. Also, it seems to me that the pages are set up to preserve the spoiler of who the servants are - that seems like it should be mentioned at the top of the character pages, and as part of the blurb on the main page.
Thanks for your help. I've only seen a few episodes of this anime, so I won't actually be able to do anything besides comment, though.
KrytenKoro 15:12, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
The Zoo Tycoon task force was recently created without any discussion. I don't think that this topic has enough scope to justify a task force. Delete? JACO PLANE • 2007-10-1 21:32
Allow them a week for more than three members, otherwise remove the Task Force (after some discussion). Sounds sensible? Initiative is good, after all. User:Krator ( t c) 00:05, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
OK, I've taken it to mfd: Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Wikipedia:WikiProject Video games/Zoo Tycoon. JACO PLANE • 2007-10-3 16:02
Check out Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Video games/Devil May Cry#I guess we're kind of "official" now. Apparently the DevilMayCry.com website has copied the synopsis from Devil May Cry, Devil May Cry 2, and Devil May Cry 3: Dante's Awakening. Even though it's probably a violation of the GFDL it's pretty awesome :) JACO PLANE • 2007-10-1 22:22
Please check the talk page of the list of best-selling video games and tell us whether you want the article divided or not. Yesterday we had an edit war between two people splitting it and two others reverting. Thanks. -- ReyBrujo 00:19, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
A user keeps adding to the Mega Drive article that the processor in the machine is 32-bit rather than the generally accepted 16-bit (certainly accepted by Sega themselves). From the Motorola 68000 article: "it is an implementation of a 32-bit architecture on a 16-bit CPU", indicating, to the best of my understanding, that it is a 16-bit processor. The user in question has also modified Motorola 68000, Amiga and Atari ST with this apparent POV/interpretation. Despite my protestations that this is a matter to be sorted out on Talk:Motorola 68000, or at the very least consensus should be gained for the change on each page (I and at least one other editor have reverted this change on the Mega Drive article), the user quotes WP:BOLD on the Mega Drive talk page as a reason to do as he likes, and removed my post on his talk page requesting he stop changing all these articles. So, any ideas how to deal with this? Miremare 22:38, 2 October 2007 (UTC)
Master Chief (Halo) is up for FAC, just a heads up. David Fuchs ( talk) 01:46, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
Anyone here familiar with the technical aspects of the Wii's Virtual Console? An anonymous user and I are currently in a content dispute ( see the discussion) over what the definition of the feature is. I'm trying my best to keep it from escalating, but I could use a third opinion and/or some outside verification - I currently do not have time to locate sources on this.
The IP user I'm arguing with asserts that VC is *only* the specialized portion of the Wii Shop channel, and that all of the emulation software is built in to each download. While this may be true, no source has been provided that verifies this. My own assertion (based on what little research I've had time to do, as well as my conclusions based on discussions I've had with people familiar with the product) is that Virtual Console is a feature of the Wii, and that the emulation software is provided as part of the Wii System Software, thus making the individual games just packages containing the ROM image and metadata. I also do not have a source to back this up, so technically both assertions are WP:OR right now.
If anyone can help with the discussion, it would be much appreciated. Thanks. — KieferSkunk ( talk) — 23:02, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
Thought you'd like to know. -- Kizor 02:33, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
Just to help things along, I nominated List of Warcraft items for deletion.-- SeizureDog 07:09, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
Hi. Please weigh in on the main picture choice for the video game article on Talk:Video game. There was a Pac-Man image being used, but I don't think it's necessary. There's plenty of free games that can be used as the main picture. I picked SuperTux since it's easily identifiable as a Super Mario Bros. clone. -- Jtalledo (talk) 07:33, 6 October 2007 (UTC)
Good, or is this WP:NOT#IINFO? hbdragon88 01:42, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
So...will anybody be bold and AFD this? Krator, can I copy your argument for the AFD? hbdragon88 22:54, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
Should the List of weapons in the Counter-Strike article be removed? -- Silver Edge 09:01, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
Okay, why is there a step-by-step scintallating page on the exact changes from beta to beta? Again WP:NOT#IINFO, at least in my opinion. hbdragon88 22:55, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
Opinions. Unlike the female protagonists, this is more clearly and easily defined, and probably is a bigger deal. Is just cleanup in order, or are there serious problems with the existence of the article itself? hbdragon88 23:59, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
The Chikyuu Boueigun 2 article is currently listed as a rename, but is now in the 'old' requests with no comments. It's Earth Defense Force 2, if the Japanese name doesn't ring a bell. All the sources I could find about the game are now cited in the article to help with any decision. I'd be grateful if any project members would give an opinion one way or the other on the requested moves page. Also, there's a couple of other game articles there too. Thanks. Someone another 16:44, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm not sure about games that have just been announced, like Fire Emblem DS. Do I create the article now, or wait until there is more info? Ashnard Talk Contribs 16:42, 10 October 2007 (UTC)
Further to the post above about the 26-article nomination of WoW-related articles and the subsequent (likely sucessful) AfD for List of Warcraft items, I had a look through the WoW pages, and there is a quite incredible amount of stuff that should be trimmed that hasn't been mentioned yet. I've grouped these together based on whether they should be kept or deleted (with a few unsures) along with basic reasoning. Due to the list being so long, I've put it on a seperate page here: User:Miremare/Wow. Comments welcome, especially on whether I've got any wrong, or on how to group these for AfD... Miremare 14:49, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm getting into a revert cycle at the Warhawk article with a user whose sole aim on Wikipedia seems to be to push PlayStation products, User:Playstationdude. Warhawk started off as a disambiguation page, and I feel it should stay that way. Playstationdude seems to think that it should be a redirect to Warhawk (PlayStation 3 game). This is an egregious example of recentism, Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, users are just as likely to be searching for the other articles related to that name such as the Curtiss P-40 or War Hawk. In edit summaries, I've told him to get to the talk page about it, but it hasn't happened. This could do with some extra input. - hahnch e n 17:03, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
I've insisted on keeping the Nintendo DS version based on the fact that it is not the same game, and in fact is a different plot, different gameplay engine, different genre, different graphics engine, different development history, different reception, different soundtrack, different composers, different critical reception, different commercial reception, and different awards (it won "Best Game no one Played for DS, 2006", while no other version has won a single award from a major news outlet). It is clearly a different game, and would be completely cluttered up if merged or simply undeveloped. If merged, it would require no less than two gameplay sections, two plot sections, two development sections, two presentation sections, and two reception sections, which, as far as I know, no one does, and I don't think anyone has advocated for such a thing.
A discussion is taking place
here. -
A Link to the Past
(talk) 05:01, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
Since Sesshomaru has decided to remove the argument when he failed to present his own argument, I'm moving my list of reasonings to this page.
"Different developers, different composers. 100% of the staff is unique to this game. It's developed with a different engine, uses a completely different concept (an adventure game with swapping characters, which IGN compared to Tomb Raider, and others to Lost Vikings). It sold excellently, one of the best-selling Over the Hedge games ever made by far. It consisted of more than 50% of the combined versions' sales regularly in PAL regions. It sold more than 300k in the United States. It has different development history. It won an award from IGN. It's the only version that did. "In Over the Hedge DS players are drawn into an all-new storyline" from Vicarious Visions' web site. GameSpot refers to it as taking place after the movie. The console games are about the movie, thusly, this is a sequel if anything. GDC also featured a keynote about the graphics engine and its implementation in Over the Hedge for the DS. The visuals also received great reception. So in the end, if they were merged, there would need to be:
If these conditions AREN'T met, then the subject is not adequately covered. If you do one section for the gameplay and one section for the plot, then only the console games are covered. Just because it's called Over the Hedge and shares the same title as the console versions doesn't mean that they are in any way similar outside of the license. In all intents and purposes, they're as different as night and day. What matters is if there's a need to be separate, and the fact that license is the only similarity proves that there is a need. - A Link to the Past (talk) 04:22, 12 October 2007 (UTC)"
Would anyone want to explain how much similarity an article on the console versions and an article on the handheld version would have? - A Link to the Past (talk) 05:18, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
Do you have a reference to this claim of the games being different? Salavat 06:54, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
I've begun a merge discussion at Talk:Over the Hedge (Nintendo DS)#Requested merge and everyone is invited to participate. Lord Sesshomaru ( talk • edits) 17:06, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
Hi guys. I'm in a quandary. As Melodia mentioned above, Tetris Attack and Panel de Pon are currently both in the same article. I started to split them apart again, but then I realized part of why they were merged in the first place. I need some help, and/or would appreciate it if someone else is willing to do the work to split these articles or find another solution that works.
The problem is that these two games are essentially the same - their presentation details are significantly different, but their gameplay mechanics are nearly identical and they share a lot in common in terms of reception and following releases. Part of the rationale behind merging them was to reduce that redundancy and show how similar the games are, but there is ENOUGH different material between the two that we have a very messy TA article with separate distributed sections for each game.
I've argued before that having PdP as part of the TA article puts undue weight on TA, but now I can't seem to figure out how to split these apart again without repeating a huge amount of information between the two. Need some more opinions on this. Please help. :) — KieferSkunk ( talk) — 22:57, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
i can sense nationalistic wars brewing again. This could be epic. Of course, nothing beats the Mega Drive war, though Brain Age was a bit contentious with Another Code being a small little skirmish. hbdragon88 23:22, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
Just a quick note that Half-Life 2: Episode One is up for FA. Thankyou. Qjuad 23:55, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
So, how do you source those sections? Obviously, the game itself is a source for them, but that isn't good enough (apparently), so I've cited the game manual for the entire gameplay section, which, again, doesn't appear to be good enough, so I'm now stumped (I'm mostly talking about the Kohan: Immortal Sovereigns article here - not citing the gameplay section is why it failed the GA process, but the questions stand for other articles too). Ideas? How do you source those sections? -- VPeric 10:56, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I noticed that a lot of articles have very similar tables to show review scores, agrigate scores and awards but there's no standard among them so most of them end up being completely different to each other. To me, it seems particularly messy and that's what templated are here for. So after a bit of experimentation and a lot of investigating, I made a template for it. This is my first template so it may not entirely be correct but I think I've got a good base down which people can add to.
I haven't copied this over to the templates section yet though just in case if it's just not going to be used so I would like a bit of feedback.
Crimsonfox 16:29, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Nitpicking, but "Compilations of Multiple Reviews" should be in lower case: "Compilations of multiple reviews". -- Mika1h 17:00, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm wondering if it makes sense to explicitly include a reference parameter for each review source. Sure, one can add it after the review score in the same parameter value, but people may get lazy in adding. Unfortunately, there's issues with dealing with named vs unnamed parameters. you could add a parameter that would include the whole ref tag instead of just the citation template, that'll deal with it. Thinking about it a bit more, if you DO add this and then check that any review that has a score but otherwise empty reference tag should flag some error. It would help with making sure people cite their sources. Same with awards as well. But, dunno...it's a possible idea. -- MASEM 17:23, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
A few nitpicks: Why require redundant parameters like both 1UP=yes
and score1UP=…
, instead of just coding it as {{#if:{{{score1UP|}}}|<tr><td>[[1UP.com]]</td><td>{{{score1UP|}}}</td></tr>}}
? You could similarly eliminate the awards=yes
by requiring that award1
be used for the first award. You could also do {{#if:{{{MC|}}}{{{GR|}}}|…}}
instead of using a compilations
parameter, but if many more compilators get added that might not scale so well. Also, I would consider changing the whole thing to use HTML rather than wikitable syntax.
Anomie 17:54, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
I'll say this now, if you can make the template more efficient, please do so, because I'm new to this whole template thing. A lot of it is new and scary to me. I understand what you mean with that Anomie, so I'll get on that right away. Also I'll add a note in the documentation per Masem's comment. Crimsonfox 18:44, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Does anyone else have any major issues with this template or shall I go ahead and add it to the templates section and start implementing it? Crimsonfox 23:20, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
Any objection to an addition to the documentation? Please copy the whole template and do not delete unused fields - X201 15:12, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
Is there any guideline for how to cite review scores (references) when using this template? Specifically, where should editors stick the "ref" tag and associated content so that the reference doesn't negatively impact the appearance of the table? -- Slordak 16:24, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
OK, fair enough. Next question... I'm having trouble with the way this table sits with the text, i.e. there's a massive amount of whitespace above the table. For an example, see my recent edit to Mario Party 8 where I attempted to use this template. -- Slordak 14:04, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
I was browsing the HL2 mod list when I noticed a request for an Empires (mod) article on the Talk:List of Half-Life 2 mods page. The problem is that the mod in question already had an article, but it was deleted after a pretty messy and, in my opinion, biased afd (look for Empires in the deletion log). I'm wondering if any work I put forth toward this article will just be in vain as die hards would just argue the mod still isn't notable/meritable enough and the previous deletion is only grounds for another one. What the mod does have going for it though is a couple of magazine articles, features and a few awards. Think the article has a chance to live now, or will it just be shot down by guys like User:GestaltG? -- L3TUC3 23:24, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm usually up for a good and controversial deletion debate. Once you've done what Jacoplane wrote above, drop me a message when it will inevitably be up for deletion. User:Krator ( t c) 23:52, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Thanks to Donkey Kong, we now have a precedent for using copyrighted images for featured video game articles. DK survived the entire day with an image of the Game & Watch handheld (with game graphics clearly displayed, even). So, next time your pet VG FA comes to the main page, you'll have some ammunition for using a box image. Zeality 02:25, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
Hi, when I checked Video game genres, I found that the article, its template and Category:Video game genres classify games differently. Is there any standard for this issue.-- Sa.vakilian( t- c) 06:14, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
OK, I think it has been long enough, so let's try this again (see the original discussion here). This time, we know that unless real world information is provided, there is none. There have been enough attempts to prove that already. The point of this discussion should be to prove that the information exists; otherwise, these need to be redirected to fit WP:N, WP:V, WP:RS, WP:FICT, and WP:WAF.
For those new to the discussion, Goomba and Koopa Troopa are pretty much the top two enemies of the Mario series. One would think that information would be available, but there have been at least a dozen attempts that I know of, and probably many more. Unless that information is shown, the is no longer any reasonable doubt. Please remember that in the discussion. TTN 19:50, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
I've noticed that most Tekken character articles and The House of the Dead video game articles have a list at the end of all the possible endings. Is this fine, or do you think this makes for an excessively detailed plot, perhaps too in-universe? I'd like some support before I rampage through the article, or a reprimand if I am actually damaging the articles. hbdragon88 03:34, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
Hey guys... Age of Mythology was recently featured (woot!), and I'd like to see it on the Main Page at some stage. Anybody have any tips or advice on ways to make this happen? Cheers, Dihydrogen Monoxide ( H2O) 08:20, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
Considering how important of a game this is, it's really quite shameful that it's stayed a stub for as long as it has. I've built up a "Gameplay" section for the article, and plan to get it up to GA status (which really shouldn't be too hard). Any help would be appreciated, especially if anyone has any information on its development or can help build a reception section.-- SeizureDog 11:57, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
I've started the daunting task of re-listing this article by year of publication, so that it's doing something other than duplicating Category:ZX Spectrum games. I've chosen by-publication year over by-genre as it's more objective. It's a big list though, so any help will be appreciated. Cheers, Marasmusine 17:29, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
...is one of my favorite PC games. I know it isn't very well known. In fact the biggest community of that game is so deserted that it's like there are few people there.
But the article reads like a story. I don't know how to trim a story, so help would be appreciated. Thanks. TheBlazikenMaster 18:54, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
Template_talk:Infobox_CVG#Move_to_Template:Infobox_VG. We should probably change this follow the new name of this Wikiproject. Axem Titanium 21:15, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
I just did a major overhaul on the Mega Drive article but it's considerably lacking in the technical specifications. I've gathered as much info as I can understand but without someone who understands it a bit more than I can, it's not going to get improved any further. I left the tables on the left for information purposes until the info boxes on the right are fully fleshed out. Also, it would be good if someone with technical skills can write short summaries of each section with in the "Technical Specification" as well, something similar to the SNES article.
Not sure where else to take this, so I figured this would be the best place to try. Thanks. Crimsonfox 23:24, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
PS: If anyone has any old copies of Viz Magazine with those rude Sega adverts in, give me a shout, I'd rather reference those than a website. Thanks. Crimsonfox 11:06, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
There's a discussion on the page which was settled in favour of the article being at We Love Katamari, but the article's recently been moved back to the heart symbol. I'm under the impression there should have been a discussion but I'm no expert on article names - could someone clarify? Someone another 13:56, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
I created a new template, Template:Title MoS, to address this situation. The MoS dictates that our titles should contain English words even if the trademark dictates otherwise. So I added a note to We Love Katamari at the top indicating what its correct title is and that the title is listed differently due to the MoS. (Usually, these notes indicate technical limitations, but this isn't a limitation so much as a rule.) — KieferSkunk ( talk) — 07:16, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
I found that earlier and it's incredibly extensive on the Mega Drive but I'm not sure if it could be used as a source or not. Could someone help me out? Thanks Crimsonfox 15:14, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
Project Exile has been announced to be published in 2008 by Graffiti Entertainment. Should the article be recreated? - A Link to the Past (talk) 17:41, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
WP:DRV first. hbdragon88 00:19, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm running Populous: The Beginning through WP:FAC again. If you can, look over the article and respond on the candidates page. David Fuchs ( talk) 19:45, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm really curious as to why this article has not been created yet. Kotaku and Joystiq both have entries. I know this sounds like whining, I'm just curious as to what the general consensus is behind not having a page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.235.204.236 ( talk) 00:08, 23 October 2007 (UTC)
Does this need to exist? It seems like a cruft article to me. It's on gamer wiki already, so why have it here? Compiling information, and just jamming it into a list with many sections... doesn't seem that helpful overall. I recall seeing this before, and it had less sections. Now people just seem to be adding more and more. Even cutting some sections, still makes it seem like a fancruft article to me. Resolution and aspect sections make the article only useful to those that want to know the information. In a way, this is a game guide on what features are in each game. Wikipedia isn't a game guide, so shouldn't this be deleted? RobJ1981 04:27, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
How do we create an assessment table for a Wikiproject? WP:FF lacks an assessment table that would make it easier to find out about article assessment statuses. — Bl ue 。 04:28, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
Someone has proposed that the GTA task force be split off into a separate WikiProject. Discussion is here. JACO PLANE • 2007-10-25 12:05
Guys, after looking and not seeing an Atari related project, I just created Wikipedia:WikiProject_Atari. I basically copied over and quickly edited the Wikipedia:WikiProject_Nintendo page for a quick template. So that means it still needs lots and lots of work to get it going as an actual functioning page. If anyone with experience in setting up project pages could help out (and of course join the project) that would be great! -- Marty Goldberg 18:34, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm questioning the use of Images on character specific articles. Some articles, such as King Dedede, feature a picture of them from outside their franchise in the Infobox. In all honesty, I don't really like that. This leads me to believe that said Cameo/appearance is an official portrayal of the character, when, in all reality, it's not. For example, in the article I mentioned, They are now using the image of King Dedede from Super Smash Bros. Brawl. The Brawl Dedede is an entirely different Dedede, and his design, and appearance in Brawl is not canon to the Kirby Franchise, for if it was, then Link/ Sonic/ Snake/ect would be cannon to the Kirby series.
In short, I don't think Cameos/Special appearances should be displayed on the infobox, when the article is about the cannon character. But this gets me into alot of edit wars, so I was hoping to hear the projects opinion on this. Dengarde ► Complaints 23:31, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
If there is not yet a VG guideline for it, it should read:
Time of publication is irrelevant to this, IMHO. User:Krator ( t c) 00:20, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
The quality of the entire set of articles on the Legacy of Kain series is of really poor quality, and I was wondering if anyone wanted to help me do a major clean-up of the articles, especially the series page and the Defiance article. I just joined, so I'm still not sure how everything works around here. I look forward to making the Wiki articles I know and love even better! ClockworkCompanionCube 04:09, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
Look at WWE SmackDown vs. Raw 2008 for example. It's cluttered with lists: some useful, some not. I think things such as: match types and championship belts/titles need to be in prose form and not a list. Yes, knowing which titles are in the game is useful: however it's simply game guide content in my view. If people want to know this information, they should be visiting a gaming or wrestling site that specializes in it. I've looked at other fighting game articles as wrestling games are basically fighters as well, and I don't see all these massive lists there. Fighting games don't feature titles much that I know of, but they certainly have many modes and types of battles.) I've mentioned this on the pro wrestling project as well, since some work on the video game articles as well. RobJ1981 05:08, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
Diff Happier? User:Krator ( t c) 08:16, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
Chrono Trigger | |
---|---|
Developer(s) | Square |
Publisher(s) |
Square Square Electronic Arts |
Designer(s) |
Kazuhiko Aoki (
producer) Takashi Tokita ( director) |
Series | Chrono series |
Engine | Chrono Trigger engine |
Platform(s) | Super Nintendo Entertainment System |
Release | 22 August 1995 |
Genre(s) | Console role-playing game |
Mode(s) | Single player |
Proposing a new layout of Template: Infobox CVG. Quite a bit of markup cleanup, title is taken from article name if not specified, and much closer in appearance to templates like Template: Infobox software. Code is at user:thumperward/infobox CVG for now. Thoughts? Chris Cunningham 10:14, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
I've added the existing one to make comparing them easier. - X201 12:29, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
... Sorry to be a stick-in-the-mud, but I find the old version a lot easier to read (with the dividing lines) and a lot more pleasing to the eye. Could you explain (in layman's terms) how the technical side is improved by this new infobox? Someone another 13:04, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
if
statements to make them optional (though the title field is already optional in the old template).caption
field is required if an image is provided. I don't know if this is intended? The old template checks for the caption field and only adds it (complete with extra line break) if present. --
DatRoot 14:43, 26 October 2007 (UTC)Well I don't really have a strong opinion either way, though I thought it should be brought up.
But while we're on the subject of change, I realise I'm completely new here but I just thought I would throw this into the mix as this is something that has irked me whilst I've been looking at a few articles. The infobox has a field for release dates, where many different release dates for different platforms are often seen, and then another field that lists the separate platforms again, and then another field that lists the media the game came on, sometimes with the corresponding platform beside it, sometimes not (see Sonic Spinball, GTA III etc.)
So I'd like all that infomation to be consolidated into one field in the infobox, looking something like one of these (info taken from Sonic Spinball:
|
|
Obviously, even though the infobox would be coded to allow both old and new formats, it's still a pretty big change, and I accept it's likely to be rejected, but any thoughts?
Chris Cunningham, I think it is safe to assume there is a consensus for changing the code of the infobox, but the technical improvements only for now. I believe style should be discussed separately and extensively. As it is a protected template you want to edit, I went ahead with this assessment of consensus, for the sake of speedy and bold editing. User:Krator ( t c) 22:30, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
There is very slow edit war going on on SNES and NES over whether the article should say each "is" or "was" a video game console. No one seems to have much of a problem with the verb tense of rest of the article, just with this opening sentence. A few editors have repeatedly edited the above articles to use "was", while a few other editors have changed it back to "is".
The current situation is that most of the articles in {{ Dedicated video game consoles}} that use the above wording use "is", except for the two mentioned above and Vectrex. Arguments seem to be: Feel free to add additional arguments to this section.
I lean towards "is a video game console" rather than "was", but if we can come up with good arguments for "was" I can accept it. I just want a real consensus rather than 4 people reaching no conclusion. I'm tempted to rewrite the lead of NES and SNES to completely remove the copula and settle it that way. Anomie 12:11, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
'Is', if they're no longer game consoles then what are they, toasters? All the NES and SNES owners must be wondering what monstrous forms their former consoles have taken - "Aiieee, it's got me in a headlock". Someone another 13:19, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
I want to thank Anomie for bringing this discussion to this page. As one who has edited Wikipedia for about two years, I should probably know about these "behind the scenes" pages, but I never know how to find them when they would be appropriate. And clearly, this is appropriate, since this issue affects so many articles.
With all respect, I think that the obviously sincere and well-balanced debating points above do not fully capture the essence of the arguments on this issue (as is sometimes the case with an attempt to boil down an issue to bulleted points). So I want to add below some points previously made elsewhere, then see what kind of response results. My position is that the use of "is" with SNES and several other game systems, while obviously popular amongst many video game afficianados (as evidenced by previous discussions) is atypical usage amongst most native-English speakers. I support in most cases employing "was" for older game systems. I recognize that there is an inherent element of subjectivity in any such rule, but what I think is not recognized is that the insistence upon use of "is" will result either in similar subjectivity, or even worse, an appearance of ridiculousness. Again, some previous points, with my own comments slightly edited for what I hope to be increased clarity:
From Unschool: Before we all start jumping up and down saying, "But the Super NES still exists, I still love playing with mine!", let us consider a few things. There are still people (like me) who also continue to take beautiful pictures with their AE-1s, and even some people (like my mother) having their Ramblers washed and waxed regularly. These products have been out of production for quite a while, however, and several generations of replacement models have come and gone. That is why, in those articles, the past tense is used. I was struck by the awkwardness of [the SNES] article's opening when it came up on FA, and feel that it simply reads more sensibly in the past tense, as we are now several generations past this system.
Unschool:Thank you for your well-considered comments, Kiefer. Allow me to respond (and this may not be smooth—I'm still thinking this out). Your assertion, Kiefer, that "most" articles referring to things that still exist use present-tense, would, I suspect, be a difficult thing to support factually—not because it's necessarily wrong, but because no one has time to pull up the plethora of articles that would need to be examined. Be that as it may, I would further assert that there is likely a difference in the way most editors treat physical commercial goods from the way they treat works of art. Works of art, be they paintings or sculptures or stage plays or books, are unique items. Automobiles and video games and cameras and washing machines are mass-produced. I'm not saying I know why we treat these two categories of items differently, it is just my observation that we do. When I read this article using the present tense, it simply struck me as wrong, or at least very odd. I'm still formulating in my mind why, but when I read it, I immediately looked up a few other items (as cited in my original talk page entry) and found that they also used the past tense, despite the clear continued existence of the items concerned. I think that the Super NES is closer to the AE-1 than it is to The Red Green Show. That is merely my opinion, of course. But it is the opinion of a great many editors that the past tense is more appropriate for many of these items which are no longer in production. Unschool 19:58, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
KieferSkunk: In response to Unschool: I think what you're saying is that we need to distinguish between the model (the design and manufacture of the SNES) vs. physical units. You're saying that because the SNES is no longer being made, it makes sense to refer to the SNES model in past tense, even though SNES units are still around and in use today. Comparing the SNES to the Chevy Nova (as Loodog did) makes for a good argument in that light. In my opinion, though, it makes just as much sense to refer to the Chevy Nova as a car that still exists, but is no longer being made - just like the SNES. It exists, people still use it, etc., but you'd still refer to its manufacture, advertising, etc. in past-tense since it's not in production anymore. Mixing tense can be tricky, but I think it makes more sense to refer to the SNES itself in present-tense and anything relating to its commercial period in past-tense. — KieferSkunk ( talk) — 22:55, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
From Anomie: I agree with KieferSkunk, in that statements of fact about the SNES should use the present tense, while statements about events in the past should use past tense. This does seem to be the general case with console articles: for example, NES, Mega Drive, and Nintendo 64 all use "is" in the first sentence of the lead. Anomie 23:54, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
Added by Unschool 23:09, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
I vote for "is" as well, and that seems to be the consensus here. I really see this as a non-issue, or one that's pretty self-evident. If you're talking about marketing, events, etc., you use past tense (that would include an automobile line). If you're talking about an object you use present tense. I.e. "a leaf is an above-ground plant organ specialized for photosynthesis." You don't use "A leaf was..." unless you're identifying a specific instance of a leaf that also is no more. Such as "I had a maple tree leaf that had a unique split. Unfortunately I didn't preserve properly and it disintegrated. The leaf was unique." An NES *is* an 8-bit video game console that *was* released by Nintendo. It *was* released in 1985, it *was* part of Nintendo's lineup, it *was* well received, it *is* a console that launched some legendary game characters, Zelda *is* a game that *was* released for the NES, etc. etc. I'm thinking since we have consensus for "is" vs. "was" that we should put this in to the guidelines. -- Marty Goldberg 07:16, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
User:Unschool, no offence taken, I've heard worse. :) A few points though: I wasn't saying "everyone who reads Wikipedia is stupid" (though it would be foolish to assume that no one who reads Wikipedia is stupid), as that doesn't matter. If someone who knows absolutely nothing about the SNES, or game consoles in general, were to read that first line, it would be quite reasonable for them to assume the SNES to be something that no longer exists. It's misleading whether you're stupid or you've got a Ph.d in being smart. Your argument for the past tense seems to be because "it's what people say". While this is probably true it doesn't make it right. People say things we wouldn't write in an encyclopedia - they use slang, contractions, grunting noises, single word sentences, say "of" instead of "have", and all manner of other terrible affronts to the English language! Just because people writing articles about cars or movies or whatever want to use the wrong tense, that's no reason to follow their lead. As for your third point, I don't specifically dislike using the past tense for video games, I dislike using it wherever it's not appropriate - if something exists it's present, if it existed it's past. As far as I see it that's an axiomatic truth. Finally, I wasn't trying to say "I'm right because I say I'm right", I was trying to say "these are the reasons that present tense should be used". Other than that I'm not really sure what I should have said... Miremare 19:03, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
Since this is settled now, I'm going to suggest again we put something regarding this in the guidelines, because it seems to be an important point (thanks again Unschool for starting the discussion here). I'll start a topic on the talk page there to get the ball rolling on discussing the actual wording. -- Marty Goldberg 16:24, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
History of computer role-playing games, Cultural differences in role-playing video games and Console RPG are all embarrassingly bad. Maybe someone could go over them and provide some feedback. Computer role-playing game is passable. I couldn't find an RPG task-force. SharkD 03:17, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
Should there be a task force of people who, once a week, check all of the changes made to a particular featured article, to make sure vandalism, false statements, unnecessary content, or unsourced material be either fixed or removed? And in the cases of non FAs, people can request that it be monitored. - A Link to the Past (talk) 03:50, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
I just recently found this obscure article about an obscure game that's related to a not at all obscure creator of a pretty famous game. From the looks of it, it's only a few short steps from being GA status, but it lacks a bit of things. With a little work it could be ready for a proper GA review in no time. - InsaneZeroG 05:35, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
This is an idea I've been mulling over for some time, but only decided to propose now. I noticed it says on the main page of WP:STARWARS that it's effectively a collaboration of numerous projects including this one, but I thought one task force specifically focusing on one aspect of Star Wars (and one which doesn't actually have so many high-quality articles) would be pretty useful. It's fairly self-explanatory, so check out the proposal. I'd be interested to hear what you think. Una Laguna Talk 18:52, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
I was thinking that the Star Wars WikiProject could cover it just fine, but if a task force is necessary, I have no objections to it. hbdragon88 22:49, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
List of video games: A-C, List of video games: D-H and so on. Anyone want to format these better? As of now, they seem to be "catchalls" for every game ever. All of these lists are important, but need a lot of work. I personally feel the catchall attitude isn't the way to go, unless the lists get a better format. Some sort of sourcing wouldn't hurt either. Going by the fact that most on the lists have articles isn't completely helpful, as people could be adding hoax articles to the lists that go unnoticed. RobJ1981 20:46, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
Hi, have just picked this up from the Wikification project and have done what I can with it but this is not my area of expertise so if someone wants to take a look at it I'd be grateful. -- Rodhullandemu ( talk - contribs) 22:43, 28 October 2007 (UTC)