![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 5 | ← | Archive 8 | Archive 9 | Archive 10 | Archive 11 | Archive 12 | → | Archive 15 |
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Would appreciate if anyone with first-hand experience or photos could attest to the accuracy (or otherwise) of this image. Responses directed here please. 81.111.114.131 ( talk) 17:31, 1 August 2009 (UTC)
![]() | A poll has been set up at Wikipedia:WikiProject_Ireland_Collaboration/Poll on Ireland article names. This is a formal vote regarding the naming of the Ireland and Republic of Ireland and possibly the Ireland (disambiguation) pages. The result of this poll will be binding on the affected article names for a period of two years. This poll arose from the Ireland article names case at the Arbitration Committee and the Ireland Collaboration Project. The order that the choices appear in the list has been generated randomly. Voting will end at 21:00 (UTC) of the evening of 13 September 2009 (that is 22:00 IST and BST). |
By what virtue are Dublin and Belfast of "Top Importance" to WikiProject Ireland while Cork, Derry, Limerick and Galway are merely of "High Importance"?
The ranking level clearly lacks objectivity, consistency, rationale and most of all credibility.
Belfast is not the capital of Northern Ireland, London is! And anyway, on what basis is a capital more important?
Cork's foundation predates Dublin's. Waterford's city charter dates from 1171, the same year as Dublin's.
Belfast, for example, has only been a city since 1888, whereas Derry, founded in 542, has been a city since 1662. Furthermore Derry is of much greater historical significance than Belfast ( the siege etc.).
It is the height of nonsense to dismiss the other cities as less important in an Irish context. Global context, arguably, but in an Irish context, utter nonsense. I mean, is this just about a population count? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.148.68.136 ( talk) 18:13, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
Christian conventions currently contains a notice that it is part of Wikiproject Ireland. This article concerns a little-known church originally formed in Ireland in the 1890s. Most of its membership is now found outside Ireland, however.
On multiple occasions I have requested reviews of this article by members of this project. It is now a rather robust article that is about to seek GA status. No member has answered my requests for peer review, nor my requests that the project change its status from "start class".
Based on this lack of interest, I am removing the article's Wikiproject Ireland notice. If some member wants to provide some focus and guidance, and relist the article as part of the project, your participation would be very welcome by the active editors. -- Nemonoman ( talk) 15:08, 5 August 2009 (UTC)
I have nominated Augusta, Lady Gregory for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Remove" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Cirt ( talk) 03:36, 6 August 2009 (UTC)
Could someone pop over to the Belfast talk page and give an opinion on the deletion of a few sections. I don't want to delete someone's work without a second opinion. Thanks. Stu ’Bout ye! 12:54, 8 August 2009 (UTC)
I'd like to request a bot to make an edit to all Irish towns and villages (i.e. everything in
Category:Towns and villages in Ireland by county). The purpose of the edit will be to roll out the {{Irish place name}}
(see for example
Ratoath).
Part 1: Roll out the {{Irish place name}} template
{{derive|Irish|XXX|YYY}}
-> {{Irish place name|XXX|YYY}}
{{lang-ga|XXX}}
in first para to -> {{Irish place name|XXX}}
(''XXX'' in {{Irish language|Irish}})
in first para to -> ({{Irish place name|XXX}})
({{Irish language|Irish}}: ''XXX'')
in first para to -> ({{Irish place name|XXX}})
{{lga}}
(an alias of {{Irish place name}}
), add to [[:Category:Irish towns and villages without Irish place names}}.Par 2: Roll out the {{gaeilge}} template
I will then manually go through that category and remove the category link from pages that are not Irish language names e.g. Acton, County Armagh. I will then request that a bot to go through that category, removing the category link and adding {{gaeilge}} immediately after the first bolded word in the article body.
What think? --rannṗáirtí anaiṫnid ( coṁrá) 19:13, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
I'm creating an article on the Irish mercantile marine during the emergency User:ClemMcGann/timeline - a rather neglected area imho - it's far from finished - but wonder what name to give it - and perhaps it should be two articles? - advice welcome - and I'm not holding a vote ;) - User:ClemMcGann/timeline -input welcome - ClemMcGann ( talk) 23:13, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
Could I ask for some input on this emerging problem, concerning the use of the term "killed on active service" in a few IRA articles. There are two viewpoints. One, that this is a term "used by PIRA and supporters/apologists to legitimise their actions as being on a par with military actions" to quote Mooretwin. The other, that this is a NPOV term used by other non-IRA sources.
Personally, I think that stating "MacManus was killed on active service during a shoot-out after an ambush in Mulleek" is presenting the facts from a Republican perspective. I feel that Wikipedia:Words to avoid applies here, as well as the "Volunteer" usage mediation. I'm posting this to the terrorism project as well, asking for their input here. Stu ’Bout ye! 18:02, 10 August 2009 (UTC)
I don't really have a problem with Active Service Unit or ASU. (Provided the former is used first in an article) But the use of "on active service" does not comply with RS or NPOV. Some neutral souces may use the term, but they are using in context to the IRA and often in quotation marks. No one would have used the term in relation to the IRA, until the IRA started using it themselves. And there is absolutely no way it complies with NPOV. Stu ’Bout ye! 13:54, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
I'm currently expanding the article on List of UNESCO World Heritage Sites in the United Kingdom and am pondering what should be used as the lead image(s). It's not the most important issue in developing the article, but I thought that as the list includes Northern Ireland that editors here may be interested (Northern Ireland's sole WHS is Giant's Causeway although Mount Stewart has been proposed). I've left a note at the England and Scotland wikiprojects and the Welsh wikipedians' noticeboard to see if the discussion goes anywhere. Please leave any comments on the article talk page. Thanks, Nev1 ( talk) 19:25, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
Any input to this discussion would be helpful. There appears to be an inconsistency in that the names of victims of some atrocities are being removed form articles under the guise of WP:MEMORIAL, but not others. Consistency and clarity about the scope of WP:Memorial would be desirable. Mooretwin ( talk) 09:17, 13 August 2009 (UTC)
I created the article Cambrai Homily. It's been rated with a C, and since I thought I'd been rather thorough in gathering the scattered info on this obscure text, I was hoping the deficiencies could be explained on the talk page. I would be grateful if additional sources could be pointed out, as I think this little text is rather interesting. Thanks. Cynwolfe ( talk) 20:07, 15 August 2009 (UTC)
I posted this on the NI Wikiproject, and including it here too for more ideas. Could anyone suggest an article which would benefit from this photograph? It is from my family photo album and is from the summer of 1970, featuring a street off the Shankill Road. A nice historical piece. Fribbler ( talk) 19:49, 15 August 2009 (UTC)
Discussion here. Mooretwin ( talk) 20:06, 19 August 2009 (UTC)
227 articles about geographically locatable subjects in Ireland are missing geographical coordinates. Finding the latitude and longitude of locations, and entering coordinates into articles is straightforwards, and explained at Wikipedia:How to add geocodes to articles. Having coordinates on articles mean that they turn up in GoogleMaps, MultiMap and other such places which link to wikipedia based on geo-coordinates, and have a link on them enabling the article's subject to be located on a wide range of maps. The articles are listed at Category:Ireland articles missing geocoordinate data. All help in geo-coording them is welcome/urged/implored. thanks -- Tagishsimon (talk) 17:27, 5 September 2009 (UTC)
and timeline - suggestions, opinions, advice welcome ClemMcGann ( talk) 20:08, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
Hi, I have created a navbox for the winners of the Tidy Town Competition on my Sandbox. I would like if we could put it on each winners article, I just wanted to know if there would be any objections to this or if anyone had any ideas on how to improve on the navbox.-- Pyrite101 ( talk) 22:58, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
Thanks for your comments, I think i will go ahead with this navbox.If any one has any comments please don't hesitate to contact me.-- Pyrite101 ( talk) 14:04, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
Hi all - the Culinary_uses cold do with a stack of references, and some embellishment, from reliable sources, so I'd appreciated it if folks raided their cookbooks for references, or any other books for anything related to both potatoes and Ireland really - I am seeing whether we can get potato to GA...all help much appreciated :) Casliber ( talk · contribs) 14:37, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
Following recent changes by some editors to the Wikipedia:Naming conventions policy page, a Request For Comment, (RFC) is now being held to debate the removal of the passage specifying that individual WikiProject and other naming conventions are able to make exceptions to the standard policy of using Common Names as the titles of Wikipedia articles.
This WikiProject is being notified since it operates such a specific naming convention. Editors are invited to comment on the proposed change at this location. Xan dar 01:15, 16 September 2009 (UTC)
Hello folks, there are alot of redlinks in the Distribution section of the Kerry Slug article. Given I know very little about Irish geography, if some locals could either create some stubs, or alternately some might warrant subsections of other geographical articles or exist under another name, this'd be very helpful. Casliber ( talk · contribs) 00:53, 22 September 2009 (UTC)
I am concerned that the application of geographical co-ordinates (or of {{ coord missing}} tags) to articles on parliamentary constituencies may be misleading to readers. There seems to be a lot of this underway at the moment, including Irish constituencies such as Galway West. I have opened a centralised discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject_Geographical_coordinates#Use_of_co-ordinates_in_parliamentary_constituencies.
More input welcome! -- BrownHairedGirl (talk) • ( contribs) 19:57, 29 September 2009 (UTC)
Following on from an ANI discussion, I'd like some input on this with a mind to adding to at WP:IMOS. As the ARC survey and others confirm, the issue of identity in Northern Ireland is complicated to say the least. Currently some NI bio articles state that "Stu is an Irish Wikipedian" or "Stu is a Northern Irish Wikipedian". The former is generally used in articles on Catholics, the latter generally on Protestants. Given that identity isn't as simple as this, I propose that all articles should be "Stu is a Wikipedian from Northern Ireland" by default. The only exception would be a citation directly quoting the subject regarding their identity. And to be clear on this, it should only be a direct quote from the subject. Holding a certain passport would not do - I only hold an Irish passport, but identity as Northern Irish most of the time. Being described as Irish/Northern Irish by someone else would not do, even if it's from a reliable source. I think this should apply to living people born prior to partition as well. They may have been born in Ireland, but they are currently "from Northern Ireland", as above. Pre-partition and dead = Irish.
Categorisation is another issue, I believe the categories changed recently shouldn't have been, for uniformity at least. But this is a seperate debate and one I could not be arsed getting into. But I think we could possible agree on the opening sentence bit.
Hopefully this will solve some problems. I'd ask people to respond only on the subject of discussion, and not let this turn into the usual embarrassing, mudslinging mess :-)
Thoughts? Stu ’Bout ye! 12:51, 30 September 2009 (UTC)
As this is about a UK nationality, i think the debate will need a wider audience before anything is decided and whilst i have no strong feelings on which method is best i think this should be handled along with a larger reform of the Wikipedia:UKNATIONALS so there is consistent use. This matter clearly does not just impact on Ireland and WP:IMOS BritishWatcher ( talk) 14:09, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
British, is the correct descriptive, IMHO. Northern Ireland is within the United Kingdom (as are its people). GoodDay ( talk) 15:00, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
Per normal BLP guidelines, I believe that "from Northern Ireland" should be used when there is a reliable source for the birthplace location, and "Irish" and/or "British" should only be used when there is a reliable source for the person's nationality or how they self-identify themselves. I think the problem in far too many articles is that editors extrapolate from the birthplace location to assume a nationality, but that doesn't work very well for people born in Northern Ireland. Since it is probably much easier to find and cite a reliable source for birthplace location, I think "from Northern Ireland" would be the phrase used for most biographic articles. — Andrwsc ( talk · contribs) 17:52, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
Oppose It is all well and good allowing its removal if there is evidence the subject disputes it, that is how you correctly apply BLP, but to move into a default position of 'you are not Northern Irish unless you state it', is frankly not acceptable. There is no basis to the claim that readers see the words Northern Irish and assume it denotes a nationality, or worse, that the person is of a particular political or religious persuasion. Nobody would be so assuming as to claim that about use of the term Scottish or any other widely recognisable demonym, so nobody should be doing the same for Northern Irish. A default position of 'don't use Northern Irish' is actually Wikipedia taking a stance that 'Northern Ireland' is not considered a recognised place of origin - quite an outrageous violation of NPOV, given the fact there is a geo-political entity with recognised borders called Northern Ireland, to which Northern Irish cannot be divorced from (you would not for example ever get away with using Eastern Irish in other bio's instead of Irish, because the meaning is actually very well understood in the English speaking world). It is frankly not being neutral to erase a term from the entire 'pedia (and this has amazingly been attempted even on non-bio articles) just because some editors find it objectionable to their particular world view (and worse, want to see it as objectionable on behalf of article subjects they might know nothing at all about). And in addition to all of this weighty argument, from a less important sentence structure point of view, 'from Northern Ireland' is not a no-loss alternative, because it changes the use of the -ish demonym as an informative but otherwise unobstructive factoid which is quickly scanned over in normal reading, into an in your face integral fact that immediately implies it is of upmost importance to the article (assuming you can fit it in the sentence cleanly at all). That is when the 'Eddie Jordan' argument becomes relevant, not for 'Northern Irish'. MickMacNee ( talk) 19:27, 7 October 2009 (UTC)
An article has been created on Queen of the Land Festival, a beauty pageant in Ireland. Any improvements would be welcome. -- Eastmain ( talk) 04:43, 3 October 2009 (UTC)
I've recently added an article on the the murder of
Shane Geoghegan. While researching it, I noticed there's not much in the way of background on the crime problems in Limerick here. I was thinking that an article such as
Gangland crime in Limerick would help with this but its not an area I'm very familiar with and it seems quite complex with all the inter feuding. I'd gladly help if anyone else with a bit more experience was to take it on. Any takers?
GainLine
♠
♥
15:47, 21 October 2009 (UTC)
Category:Ireland articles missing geocoordinate data now has a set of per-county subcategories, which I hope will make geotagging these articles easier for editors with local knowledge.
Note that, as with other top-level country categories in this hierarchy, this is for the state of Ireland; for the counties of Northern Ireland see Category:Northern Ireland articles missing geocoordinate data.
I'm now beginning the process of re-filing some 1,400 articles currently in Category:Ireland articles missing geocoordinate data into their respective county subcategories. -- The Anome ( talk) 15:15, 21 October 2009 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 5 | ← | Archive 8 | Archive 9 | Archive 10 | Archive 11 | Archive 12 | → | Archive 15 |
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Would appreciate if anyone with first-hand experience or photos could attest to the accuracy (or otherwise) of this image. Responses directed here please. 81.111.114.131 ( talk) 17:31, 1 August 2009 (UTC)
![]() | A poll has been set up at Wikipedia:WikiProject_Ireland_Collaboration/Poll on Ireland article names. This is a formal vote regarding the naming of the Ireland and Republic of Ireland and possibly the Ireland (disambiguation) pages. The result of this poll will be binding on the affected article names for a period of two years. This poll arose from the Ireland article names case at the Arbitration Committee and the Ireland Collaboration Project. The order that the choices appear in the list has been generated randomly. Voting will end at 21:00 (UTC) of the evening of 13 September 2009 (that is 22:00 IST and BST). |
By what virtue are Dublin and Belfast of "Top Importance" to WikiProject Ireland while Cork, Derry, Limerick and Galway are merely of "High Importance"?
The ranking level clearly lacks objectivity, consistency, rationale and most of all credibility.
Belfast is not the capital of Northern Ireland, London is! And anyway, on what basis is a capital more important?
Cork's foundation predates Dublin's. Waterford's city charter dates from 1171, the same year as Dublin's.
Belfast, for example, has only been a city since 1888, whereas Derry, founded in 542, has been a city since 1662. Furthermore Derry is of much greater historical significance than Belfast ( the siege etc.).
It is the height of nonsense to dismiss the other cities as less important in an Irish context. Global context, arguably, but in an Irish context, utter nonsense. I mean, is this just about a population count? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.148.68.136 ( talk) 18:13, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
Christian conventions currently contains a notice that it is part of Wikiproject Ireland. This article concerns a little-known church originally formed in Ireland in the 1890s. Most of its membership is now found outside Ireland, however.
On multiple occasions I have requested reviews of this article by members of this project. It is now a rather robust article that is about to seek GA status. No member has answered my requests for peer review, nor my requests that the project change its status from "start class".
Based on this lack of interest, I am removing the article's Wikiproject Ireland notice. If some member wants to provide some focus and guidance, and relist the article as part of the project, your participation would be very welcome by the active editors. -- Nemonoman ( talk) 15:08, 5 August 2009 (UTC)
I have nominated Augusta, Lady Gregory for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Remove" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Cirt ( talk) 03:36, 6 August 2009 (UTC)
Could someone pop over to the Belfast talk page and give an opinion on the deletion of a few sections. I don't want to delete someone's work without a second opinion. Thanks. Stu ’Bout ye! 12:54, 8 August 2009 (UTC)
I'd like to request a bot to make an edit to all Irish towns and villages (i.e. everything in
Category:Towns and villages in Ireland by county). The purpose of the edit will be to roll out the {{Irish place name}}
(see for example
Ratoath).
Part 1: Roll out the {{Irish place name}} template
{{derive|Irish|XXX|YYY}}
-> {{Irish place name|XXX|YYY}}
{{lang-ga|XXX}}
in first para to -> {{Irish place name|XXX}}
(''XXX'' in {{Irish language|Irish}})
in first para to -> ({{Irish place name|XXX}})
({{Irish language|Irish}}: ''XXX'')
in first para to -> ({{Irish place name|XXX}})
{{lga}}
(an alias of {{Irish place name}}
), add to [[:Category:Irish towns and villages without Irish place names}}.Par 2: Roll out the {{gaeilge}} template
I will then manually go through that category and remove the category link from pages that are not Irish language names e.g. Acton, County Armagh. I will then request that a bot to go through that category, removing the category link and adding {{gaeilge}} immediately after the first bolded word in the article body.
What think? --rannṗáirtí anaiṫnid ( coṁrá) 19:13, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
I'm creating an article on the Irish mercantile marine during the emergency User:ClemMcGann/timeline - a rather neglected area imho - it's far from finished - but wonder what name to give it - and perhaps it should be two articles? - advice welcome - and I'm not holding a vote ;) - User:ClemMcGann/timeline -input welcome - ClemMcGann ( talk) 23:13, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
Could I ask for some input on this emerging problem, concerning the use of the term "killed on active service" in a few IRA articles. There are two viewpoints. One, that this is a term "used by PIRA and supporters/apologists to legitimise their actions as being on a par with military actions" to quote Mooretwin. The other, that this is a NPOV term used by other non-IRA sources.
Personally, I think that stating "MacManus was killed on active service during a shoot-out after an ambush in Mulleek" is presenting the facts from a Republican perspective. I feel that Wikipedia:Words to avoid applies here, as well as the "Volunteer" usage mediation. I'm posting this to the terrorism project as well, asking for their input here. Stu ’Bout ye! 18:02, 10 August 2009 (UTC)
I don't really have a problem with Active Service Unit or ASU. (Provided the former is used first in an article) But the use of "on active service" does not comply with RS or NPOV. Some neutral souces may use the term, but they are using in context to the IRA and often in quotation marks. No one would have used the term in relation to the IRA, until the IRA started using it themselves. And there is absolutely no way it complies with NPOV. Stu ’Bout ye! 13:54, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
I'm currently expanding the article on List of UNESCO World Heritage Sites in the United Kingdom and am pondering what should be used as the lead image(s). It's not the most important issue in developing the article, but I thought that as the list includes Northern Ireland that editors here may be interested (Northern Ireland's sole WHS is Giant's Causeway although Mount Stewart has been proposed). I've left a note at the England and Scotland wikiprojects and the Welsh wikipedians' noticeboard to see if the discussion goes anywhere. Please leave any comments on the article talk page. Thanks, Nev1 ( talk) 19:25, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
Any input to this discussion would be helpful. There appears to be an inconsistency in that the names of victims of some atrocities are being removed form articles under the guise of WP:MEMORIAL, but not others. Consistency and clarity about the scope of WP:Memorial would be desirable. Mooretwin ( talk) 09:17, 13 August 2009 (UTC)
I created the article Cambrai Homily. It's been rated with a C, and since I thought I'd been rather thorough in gathering the scattered info on this obscure text, I was hoping the deficiencies could be explained on the talk page. I would be grateful if additional sources could be pointed out, as I think this little text is rather interesting. Thanks. Cynwolfe ( talk) 20:07, 15 August 2009 (UTC)
I posted this on the NI Wikiproject, and including it here too for more ideas. Could anyone suggest an article which would benefit from this photograph? It is from my family photo album and is from the summer of 1970, featuring a street off the Shankill Road. A nice historical piece. Fribbler ( talk) 19:49, 15 August 2009 (UTC)
Discussion here. Mooretwin ( talk) 20:06, 19 August 2009 (UTC)
227 articles about geographically locatable subjects in Ireland are missing geographical coordinates. Finding the latitude and longitude of locations, and entering coordinates into articles is straightforwards, and explained at Wikipedia:How to add geocodes to articles. Having coordinates on articles mean that they turn up in GoogleMaps, MultiMap and other such places which link to wikipedia based on geo-coordinates, and have a link on them enabling the article's subject to be located on a wide range of maps. The articles are listed at Category:Ireland articles missing geocoordinate data. All help in geo-coording them is welcome/urged/implored. thanks -- Tagishsimon (talk) 17:27, 5 September 2009 (UTC)
and timeline - suggestions, opinions, advice welcome ClemMcGann ( talk) 20:08, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
Hi, I have created a navbox for the winners of the Tidy Town Competition on my Sandbox. I would like if we could put it on each winners article, I just wanted to know if there would be any objections to this or if anyone had any ideas on how to improve on the navbox.-- Pyrite101 ( talk) 22:58, 7 September 2009 (UTC)
Thanks for your comments, I think i will go ahead with this navbox.If any one has any comments please don't hesitate to contact me.-- Pyrite101 ( talk) 14:04, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
Hi all - the Culinary_uses cold do with a stack of references, and some embellishment, from reliable sources, so I'd appreciated it if folks raided their cookbooks for references, or any other books for anything related to both potatoes and Ireland really - I am seeing whether we can get potato to GA...all help much appreciated :) Casliber ( talk · contribs) 14:37, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
Following recent changes by some editors to the Wikipedia:Naming conventions policy page, a Request For Comment, (RFC) is now being held to debate the removal of the passage specifying that individual WikiProject and other naming conventions are able to make exceptions to the standard policy of using Common Names as the titles of Wikipedia articles.
This WikiProject is being notified since it operates such a specific naming convention. Editors are invited to comment on the proposed change at this location. Xan dar 01:15, 16 September 2009 (UTC)
Hello folks, there are alot of redlinks in the Distribution section of the Kerry Slug article. Given I know very little about Irish geography, if some locals could either create some stubs, or alternately some might warrant subsections of other geographical articles or exist under another name, this'd be very helpful. Casliber ( talk · contribs) 00:53, 22 September 2009 (UTC)
I am concerned that the application of geographical co-ordinates (or of {{ coord missing}} tags) to articles on parliamentary constituencies may be misleading to readers. There seems to be a lot of this underway at the moment, including Irish constituencies such as Galway West. I have opened a centralised discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject_Geographical_coordinates#Use_of_co-ordinates_in_parliamentary_constituencies.
More input welcome! -- BrownHairedGirl (talk) • ( contribs) 19:57, 29 September 2009 (UTC)
Following on from an ANI discussion, I'd like some input on this with a mind to adding to at WP:IMOS. As the ARC survey and others confirm, the issue of identity in Northern Ireland is complicated to say the least. Currently some NI bio articles state that "Stu is an Irish Wikipedian" or "Stu is a Northern Irish Wikipedian". The former is generally used in articles on Catholics, the latter generally on Protestants. Given that identity isn't as simple as this, I propose that all articles should be "Stu is a Wikipedian from Northern Ireland" by default. The only exception would be a citation directly quoting the subject regarding their identity. And to be clear on this, it should only be a direct quote from the subject. Holding a certain passport would not do - I only hold an Irish passport, but identity as Northern Irish most of the time. Being described as Irish/Northern Irish by someone else would not do, even if it's from a reliable source. I think this should apply to living people born prior to partition as well. They may have been born in Ireland, but they are currently "from Northern Ireland", as above. Pre-partition and dead = Irish.
Categorisation is another issue, I believe the categories changed recently shouldn't have been, for uniformity at least. But this is a seperate debate and one I could not be arsed getting into. But I think we could possible agree on the opening sentence bit.
Hopefully this will solve some problems. I'd ask people to respond only on the subject of discussion, and not let this turn into the usual embarrassing, mudslinging mess :-)
Thoughts? Stu ’Bout ye! 12:51, 30 September 2009 (UTC)
As this is about a UK nationality, i think the debate will need a wider audience before anything is decided and whilst i have no strong feelings on which method is best i think this should be handled along with a larger reform of the Wikipedia:UKNATIONALS so there is consistent use. This matter clearly does not just impact on Ireland and WP:IMOS BritishWatcher ( talk) 14:09, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
British, is the correct descriptive, IMHO. Northern Ireland is within the United Kingdom (as are its people). GoodDay ( talk) 15:00, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
Per normal BLP guidelines, I believe that "from Northern Ireland" should be used when there is a reliable source for the birthplace location, and "Irish" and/or "British" should only be used when there is a reliable source for the person's nationality or how they self-identify themselves. I think the problem in far too many articles is that editors extrapolate from the birthplace location to assume a nationality, but that doesn't work very well for people born in Northern Ireland. Since it is probably much easier to find and cite a reliable source for birthplace location, I think "from Northern Ireland" would be the phrase used for most biographic articles. — Andrwsc ( talk · contribs) 17:52, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
Oppose It is all well and good allowing its removal if there is evidence the subject disputes it, that is how you correctly apply BLP, but to move into a default position of 'you are not Northern Irish unless you state it', is frankly not acceptable. There is no basis to the claim that readers see the words Northern Irish and assume it denotes a nationality, or worse, that the person is of a particular political or religious persuasion. Nobody would be so assuming as to claim that about use of the term Scottish or any other widely recognisable demonym, so nobody should be doing the same for Northern Irish. A default position of 'don't use Northern Irish' is actually Wikipedia taking a stance that 'Northern Ireland' is not considered a recognised place of origin - quite an outrageous violation of NPOV, given the fact there is a geo-political entity with recognised borders called Northern Ireland, to which Northern Irish cannot be divorced from (you would not for example ever get away with using Eastern Irish in other bio's instead of Irish, because the meaning is actually very well understood in the English speaking world). It is frankly not being neutral to erase a term from the entire 'pedia (and this has amazingly been attempted even on non-bio articles) just because some editors find it objectionable to their particular world view (and worse, want to see it as objectionable on behalf of article subjects they might know nothing at all about). And in addition to all of this weighty argument, from a less important sentence structure point of view, 'from Northern Ireland' is not a no-loss alternative, because it changes the use of the -ish demonym as an informative but otherwise unobstructive factoid which is quickly scanned over in normal reading, into an in your face integral fact that immediately implies it is of upmost importance to the article (assuming you can fit it in the sentence cleanly at all). That is when the 'Eddie Jordan' argument becomes relevant, not for 'Northern Irish'. MickMacNee ( talk) 19:27, 7 October 2009 (UTC)
An article has been created on Queen of the Land Festival, a beauty pageant in Ireland. Any improvements would be welcome. -- Eastmain ( talk) 04:43, 3 October 2009 (UTC)
I've recently added an article on the the murder of
Shane Geoghegan. While researching it, I noticed there's not much in the way of background on the crime problems in Limerick here. I was thinking that an article such as
Gangland crime in Limerick would help with this but its not an area I'm very familiar with and it seems quite complex with all the inter feuding. I'd gladly help if anyone else with a bit more experience was to take it on. Any takers?
GainLine
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15:47, 21 October 2009 (UTC)
Category:Ireland articles missing geocoordinate data now has a set of per-county subcategories, which I hope will make geotagging these articles easier for editors with local knowledge.
Note that, as with other top-level country categories in this hierarchy, this is for the state of Ireland; for the counties of Northern Ireland see Category:Northern Ireland articles missing geocoordinate data.
I'm now beginning the process of re-filing some 1,400 articles currently in Category:Ireland articles missing geocoordinate data into their respective county subcategories. -- The Anome ( talk) 15:15, 21 October 2009 (UTC)