- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. ✗ plicit 12:22, 5 August 2023 (UTC)
List of right-wing terrorist attacks
AfDs for this article:
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- List of right-wing terrorist attacks ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
This is a POV fork of List of terrorist incidents. Any content that isn't irredeemably biased belongs there along with all other terrorist incidents. This page should be deleted and set to redirect to List of terrorist incidents. AlanS talk 09:40, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Events, Politics, and Terrorism. AlanS talk 09:40, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. Shellwood ( talk) 10:34, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
Note that
List of left-wing terrorist attacks also has a
discussion in Articles for Deletion.
- Delete per WP:NOTDATABASE. By the way, I think a lot of OR is happening here. For example: this article lists several attack's motivation as "incel", but Incel is a general online subculture, and research claims that this subculture is "not particularly right-wing or white".
- I think, for this subject, at most a category is needed, instead of an explicit list like this. To quote User:TFD from the AfD of List of left-wing terrorist attacks, "list articles of this type quickly become exercises in original research." -- TheLonelyPather ( talk) 11:51, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Comment: I have observed a recent flurry of editing activity that seems to indicate how hard it is for editors to come to a consensus on what amounts to a right-wing terrorist attack. While right-wing terrorism is a serious matter, especially after the Capitol and Brazilian Congress attacks, I agree that neither articles have a solid criteria, resulting in a lot of OR and tit-for-tat POV activity, as we have seen with List of left-wing terrorist attacks ( AfD discussion). -- Minoa ( talk) 12:21, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Delete If this information was actually valid, it could be included in a column at List of terrorist incidents. Dream Focus 16:25, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Delete I've basically posted the same thing at the other AfD, but it applies here as well. This and the other article suffer from over inclusion based on poor grounds. This is just going to be a massive time sink to maintain against POV editing. As Dream Focus says anything useful can be included in List of terrorist incidents. -- LCU ActivelyDisinterested ∆ transmissions∆ ° co-ords° 18:57, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Delete for the same reason that I gave in the current AfD for the article List of left-wing terrorist attacks. Namely, mainstream sources do not normally use the joint term "right-wing terrorist", probably because the term "right wing" is ambiguous and means different things to different people and in different countries. Instead they generally use a more precise term to modify "terrorist", such as "Palestinian terrorist" or "eco-terrorist" or "white-supremacist terrorist". NightHeron ( talk) 19:56, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Comment Besides this and List of left-wing terrorist attacks, it may be worth noting that we also have List of Islamist terrorist attacks and List of foiled right-wing terrorist attacks (and maybe more). TompaDompa ( talk) 21:11, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Delete: per WP:POVFORK. Encyclopedic content on this subject should be covered at either List of terrorist incidents or Right-wing terrorism. –– FormalDude (talk) 21:17, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Comment: There are many lists in
Category:Terrorism-related lists. These should also be considered for AfD and/or checked for
WP:OR while we're at it. --
asilvering (
talk)
22:09, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- I should add, as I did at the left-wing list: please salt this article if it is deleted. The OR problems will reoccur if the article is recreated. -- asilvering ( talk) 03:30, 30 July 2023 (UTC)
- Delete: as per FormalDude and TheLonelyPather. Cambial — foliar❧ 23:10, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Delete as per nom, TheLonelyPather, Minoa. Panamitsu ( talk) 02:46, 30 July 2023 (UTC)
Note that
List of Islamist terrorist attacks also has a
discussion in Articles for Deletion.
- Delete Highly subjective metric for a list. Some clear, well-agreed upon (by RSes) examples can be included on Right-wing terrorism, but we shouldn't be trying to compile a list ourselves. -- Masem ( t) 13:50, 30 July 2023 (UTC)
Note that
List of thwarted Islamic terrorist attacks also has a
discussion in Articles for Deletion.
- Keep. The topic is notable and encyclopedic. However, strongly enforce WP:DUE on the page; as I have raised previously we have an issue with items being included in lists without meeting core policies of WP:OR or WP:NPOV. Correcting that broadly is a difficult task, but hopefully we can correct it here. BilledMammal ( talk) 01:01, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
- Comment: I think BilledMammal is right the topic is notable and encyclopedic. But I've also spent hours on this page removing entries and checking for sources in good faith. I can't bring myself to vote delete since I know the article is fixable, but at the same time I think it's important to note that the editors pointing out this page needs, if it is to exist, some editors willing to copyedit it regularly to remove OR and UNDUE content are correct. I'm uncomfortable voting delete on a page because I think it's unmanageable, but I'm also uncomfortable voting keep for the same reason.
TulsaPoliticsFan (
talk)
13:21, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
- Same, basically. I think they'd at the very least need extended-confirmed protection forever. -- asilvering ( talk) 21:25, 4 August 2023 (UTC)
- * Keep per BilledMammal and per my comment at the "left-wing terrorism" AfD — this is more clearly-defined and less-obvious POV or OR. — OwenBlacker (he/him; Talk) 16:37, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
- Delete and salt; BM's suggestion is appealing in theory, but in practice it will never work. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 ( talk) 16:46, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
- Delete Unlike "left-wing terrorism", this actually does exist, but IMO it is not important or useful to maintain lists of terrorist attacks broken down by supposed ideology. An all-encompassing list would be better. Zaathras ( talk) 00:17, 2 August 2023 (UTC)
- Delete per my comments at the "List of left-wing terrorist attacks" AfD. Same exact issues apply. On these topics, a list has no value compared to a proper conceptual article, setting aside the OR, its nature as a POV-fork, and other issues. DFlhb ( talk) 14:39, 4 August 2023 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. ✗ plicit 12:22, 5 August 2023 (UTC)
List of right-wing terrorist attacks
AfDs for this article:
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- List of right-wing terrorist attacks ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
This is a POV fork of List of terrorist incidents. Any content that isn't irredeemably biased belongs there along with all other terrorist incidents. This page should be deleted and set to redirect to List of terrorist incidents. AlanS talk 09:40, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Events, Politics, and Terrorism. AlanS talk 09:40, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. Shellwood ( talk) 10:34, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
Note that
List of left-wing terrorist attacks also has a
discussion in Articles for Deletion.
- Delete per WP:NOTDATABASE. By the way, I think a lot of OR is happening here. For example: this article lists several attack's motivation as "incel", but Incel is a general online subculture, and research claims that this subculture is "not particularly right-wing or white".
- I think, for this subject, at most a category is needed, instead of an explicit list like this. To quote User:TFD from the AfD of List of left-wing terrorist attacks, "list articles of this type quickly become exercises in original research." -- TheLonelyPather ( talk) 11:51, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Comment: I have observed a recent flurry of editing activity that seems to indicate how hard it is for editors to come to a consensus on what amounts to a right-wing terrorist attack. While right-wing terrorism is a serious matter, especially after the Capitol and Brazilian Congress attacks, I agree that neither articles have a solid criteria, resulting in a lot of OR and tit-for-tat POV activity, as we have seen with List of left-wing terrorist attacks ( AfD discussion). -- Minoa ( talk) 12:21, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Delete If this information was actually valid, it could be included in a column at List of terrorist incidents. Dream Focus 16:25, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Delete I've basically posted the same thing at the other AfD, but it applies here as well. This and the other article suffer from over inclusion based on poor grounds. This is just going to be a massive time sink to maintain against POV editing. As Dream Focus says anything useful can be included in List of terrorist incidents. -- LCU ActivelyDisinterested ∆ transmissions∆ ° co-ords° 18:57, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Delete for the same reason that I gave in the current AfD for the article List of left-wing terrorist attacks. Namely, mainstream sources do not normally use the joint term "right-wing terrorist", probably because the term "right wing" is ambiguous and means different things to different people and in different countries. Instead they generally use a more precise term to modify "terrorist", such as "Palestinian terrorist" or "eco-terrorist" or "white-supremacist terrorist". NightHeron ( talk) 19:56, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Comment Besides this and List of left-wing terrorist attacks, it may be worth noting that we also have List of Islamist terrorist attacks and List of foiled right-wing terrorist attacks (and maybe more). TompaDompa ( talk) 21:11, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Delete: per WP:POVFORK. Encyclopedic content on this subject should be covered at either List of terrorist incidents or Right-wing terrorism. –– FormalDude (talk) 21:17, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Comment: There are many lists in
Category:Terrorism-related lists. These should also be considered for AfD and/or checked for
WP:OR while we're at it. --
asilvering (
talk)
22:09, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- I should add, as I did at the left-wing list: please salt this article if it is deleted. The OR problems will reoccur if the article is recreated. -- asilvering ( talk) 03:30, 30 July 2023 (UTC)
- Delete: as per FormalDude and TheLonelyPather. Cambial — foliar❧ 23:10, 29 July 2023 (UTC)
- Delete as per nom, TheLonelyPather, Minoa. Panamitsu ( talk) 02:46, 30 July 2023 (UTC)
Note that
List of Islamist terrorist attacks also has a
discussion in Articles for Deletion.
- Delete Highly subjective metric for a list. Some clear, well-agreed upon (by RSes) examples can be included on Right-wing terrorism, but we shouldn't be trying to compile a list ourselves. -- Masem ( t) 13:50, 30 July 2023 (UTC)
Note that
List of thwarted Islamic terrorist attacks also has a
discussion in Articles for Deletion.
- Keep. The topic is notable and encyclopedic. However, strongly enforce WP:DUE on the page; as I have raised previously we have an issue with items being included in lists without meeting core policies of WP:OR or WP:NPOV. Correcting that broadly is a difficult task, but hopefully we can correct it here. BilledMammal ( talk) 01:01, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
- Comment: I think BilledMammal is right the topic is notable and encyclopedic. But I've also spent hours on this page removing entries and checking for sources in good faith. I can't bring myself to vote delete since I know the article is fixable, but at the same time I think it's important to note that the editors pointing out this page needs, if it is to exist, some editors willing to copyedit it regularly to remove OR and UNDUE content are correct. I'm uncomfortable voting delete on a page because I think it's unmanageable, but I'm also uncomfortable voting keep for the same reason.
TulsaPoliticsFan (
talk)
13:21, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
- Same, basically. I think they'd at the very least need extended-confirmed protection forever. -- asilvering ( talk) 21:25, 4 August 2023 (UTC)
- * Keep per BilledMammal and per my comment at the "left-wing terrorism" AfD — this is more clearly-defined and less-obvious POV or OR. — OwenBlacker (he/him; Talk) 16:37, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
- Delete and salt; BM's suggestion is appealing in theory, but in practice it will never work. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 ( talk) 16:46, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
- Delete Unlike "left-wing terrorism", this actually does exist, but IMO it is not important or useful to maintain lists of terrorist attacks broken down by supposed ideology. An all-encompassing list would be better. Zaathras ( talk) 00:17, 2 August 2023 (UTC)
- Delete per my comments at the "List of left-wing terrorist attacks" AfD. Same exact issues apply. On these topics, a list has no value compared to a proper conceptual article, setting aside the OR, its nature as a POV-fork, and other issues. DFlhb ( talk) 14:39, 4 August 2023 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.