- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. Liz Read! Talk! 04:17, 17 October 2023 (UTC)
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- Głusza, Wałcz County ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
On GMaps this locates to the driveway of a single property whose exact nature I can't make out, but it's obviously not a village/town/whatever. The first reference is to Registr TERYT, whose English language front page describes its mission in terms that show it is exactly analogous to GNIS; the other reference appears to be a statistical/geographical database of a sort familiar to those who have checked this kind of article before. I don't see how this is notable, and for those who might appeal to WP:GEOLAND, I don't see that "legally recognized" is satisfied; but if it be so, it's another example of how that has proven to be a bad standard. There appear to be a number of these, newly created, so we're going to be busy here. Mangoe ( talk) 04:11, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Geography and Poland. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 04:54, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
- Pinging expert @ Stok Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 05:42, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
- Best wait for the experts but here's my dwa groszy in the meantime - www.polskawliczbach.pl is apparently algorithmically-created content and anyway not a reliable source. Using my poor Polish (I lived there for four years but am far from fluent) I tried searching on the Teryt database linked to in the article but couldn't find a place called Głusza, though this is probably just my own failing. The location is, as Mangoe says, just someone's drive-way. I spot checked three of the article-creator's articles over on the NGEO talk-page and all three were problematic (two were about locations with nothing at them and sourcing which did not show that they had ever really been populated; the other was about a random embassy in Warsaw with no GNG pass). Leaning delete simply on this basis. FOARP ( talk) 13:34, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
- Having looked into this in more detail, I'm going to upgrade my !vote to strong delete. The place in question is an osada leśna (or "forest settlement") according to
this regulation on the names of cities and parts of cities, not a hamlet (which
in the relevant Polish law is referred to as a przysiółek -see Art.2(10)). A "settlement" in the relevent Polish law (Art.2(8) of the same act previously linked) is described as:
"osada - niewielką jednostkę osadniczą na terenie wiejskim o odmiennym (wyróżniającym się) charakterze zabudowy albo zamieszkaną przez ludność związaną z określonym miejscem lub rodzajem pracy, w szczególności: osadę młyńską, osadę leśną, osadę rybacką, osadę kolejową, osadę po byłym państwowym gospodarstwie rolnym; osada może być samodzielna lub może stanowić część innej jednostki osadniczej;"
- Or in machine translation:
"settlement - a small settlement unit in a rural area with a different (distinct) character of development or inhabited by people associated with a specific place or type of work, in particular: a mill settlement, a forest settlement, a fishing settlement, a railway settlement, a settlement of a former state farm; the settlement may be independent or may constitute part of another settlement unit;"
(emphasis added)
- From this you can see that the location need not actually be populated (emphasis on the "or inhabited" part of this) or independent, which is indeed what we see in multiple examples of these settlements for which there are now AFDs open - they can be forestry offices, farms, or even just empty locations, and can simply be parts of villages.
- GEOLAND gives a presumption of notability to legally-recognised populated places, but a place need only be
"a small settlement unit in a rural area with a different (distinct) character of development"
, and not necessarily inhabited, to receive the status of being a "osada leśna". FOARP ( talk) 12:08, 11 October 2023 (UTC)
- Having looked into this in more detail, I'm going to upgrade my !vote to strong delete. The place in question is an osada leśna (or "forest settlement") according to
this regulation on the names of cities and parts of cities, not a hamlet (which
in the relevant Polish law is referred to as a przysiółek -see Art.2(10)). A "settlement" in the relevent Polish law (Art.2(8) of the same act previously linked) is described as:
- Delete - per WP:GEOLAND Lightburst ( talk) 21:09, 11 October 2023 (UTC)
- Comment. Following pl:osada leśna interwiki leads me to hamlet (place), but that particular article on pl wiki has a pipe leadning to ... a wilderness hut. If it is a hamlet, it may meet GEOLAND, but if it is just a hut... ( TERYT confirms it is a hamlet). I'll start an AFD on pl wiki and ask for more feedback. PS. Done: pl:Wikipedia:Poczekalnia/artykuły/2023:10:17:Głusza (powiat wałecki) - let's wait a week or so and see if any useful arguments emerge there? -- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 03:01, 17 October 2023 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. Liz Read! Talk! 04:17, 17 October 2023 (UTC)
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- Głusza, Wałcz County ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
On GMaps this locates to the driveway of a single property whose exact nature I can't make out, but it's obviously not a village/town/whatever. The first reference is to Registr TERYT, whose English language front page describes its mission in terms that show it is exactly analogous to GNIS; the other reference appears to be a statistical/geographical database of a sort familiar to those who have checked this kind of article before. I don't see how this is notable, and for those who might appeal to WP:GEOLAND, I don't see that "legally recognized" is satisfied; but if it be so, it's another example of how that has proven to be a bad standard. There appear to be a number of these, newly created, so we're going to be busy here. Mangoe ( talk) 04:11, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Geography and Poland. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 04:54, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
- Pinging expert @ Stok Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 05:42, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
- Best wait for the experts but here's my dwa groszy in the meantime - www.polskawliczbach.pl is apparently algorithmically-created content and anyway not a reliable source. Using my poor Polish (I lived there for four years but am far from fluent) I tried searching on the Teryt database linked to in the article but couldn't find a place called Głusza, though this is probably just my own failing. The location is, as Mangoe says, just someone's drive-way. I spot checked three of the article-creator's articles over on the NGEO talk-page and all three were problematic (two were about locations with nothing at them and sourcing which did not show that they had ever really been populated; the other was about a random embassy in Warsaw with no GNG pass). Leaning delete simply on this basis. FOARP ( talk) 13:34, 10 October 2023 (UTC)
- Having looked into this in more detail, I'm going to upgrade my !vote to strong delete. The place in question is an osada leśna (or "forest settlement") according to
this regulation on the names of cities and parts of cities, not a hamlet (which
in the relevant Polish law is referred to as a przysiółek -see Art.2(10)). A "settlement" in the relevent Polish law (Art.2(8) of the same act previously linked) is described as:
"osada - niewielką jednostkę osadniczą na terenie wiejskim o odmiennym (wyróżniającym się) charakterze zabudowy albo zamieszkaną przez ludność związaną z określonym miejscem lub rodzajem pracy, w szczególności: osadę młyńską, osadę leśną, osadę rybacką, osadę kolejową, osadę po byłym państwowym gospodarstwie rolnym; osada może być samodzielna lub może stanowić część innej jednostki osadniczej;"
- Or in machine translation:
"settlement - a small settlement unit in a rural area with a different (distinct) character of development or inhabited by people associated with a specific place or type of work, in particular: a mill settlement, a forest settlement, a fishing settlement, a railway settlement, a settlement of a former state farm; the settlement may be independent or may constitute part of another settlement unit;"
(emphasis added)
- From this you can see that the location need not actually be populated (emphasis on the "or inhabited" part of this) or independent, which is indeed what we see in multiple examples of these settlements for which there are now AFDs open - they can be forestry offices, farms, or even just empty locations, and can simply be parts of villages.
- GEOLAND gives a presumption of notability to legally-recognised populated places, but a place need only be
"a small settlement unit in a rural area with a different (distinct) character of development"
, and not necessarily inhabited, to receive the status of being a "osada leśna". FOARP ( talk) 12:08, 11 October 2023 (UTC)
- Having looked into this in more detail, I'm going to upgrade my !vote to strong delete. The place in question is an osada leśna (or "forest settlement") according to
this regulation on the names of cities and parts of cities, not a hamlet (which
in the relevant Polish law is referred to as a przysiółek -see Art.2(10)). A "settlement" in the relevent Polish law (Art.2(8) of the same act previously linked) is described as:
- Delete - per WP:GEOLAND Lightburst ( talk) 21:09, 11 October 2023 (UTC)
- Comment. Following pl:osada leśna interwiki leads me to hamlet (place), but that particular article on pl wiki has a pipe leadning to ... a wilderness hut. If it is a hamlet, it may meet GEOLAND, but if it is just a hut... ( TERYT confirms it is a hamlet). I'll start an AFD on pl wiki and ask for more feedback. PS. Done: pl:Wikipedia:Poczekalnia/artykuły/2023:10:17:Głusza (powiat wałecki) - let's wait a week or so and see if any useful arguments emerge there? -- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 03:01, 17 October 2023 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.