- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. ✗ plicit 14:37, 14 August 2022 (UTC)
Enrique Barza
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- Enrique Barza ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
According to the article and its sports-reference source ( here), Barza participated in the Olympics twice, in 1968 with Men's Foil Individual fencing and in 1972 with Men's Sabre Individual fencing. However, when I access the full results on Olympics' official website, I can't find Barza among the participants ( 1968 and 1972). The only mention of Barza is over at IMDb (unreliable per WP:IMDB) stating that he appeared in a film called "Munich 1972: Games of the XX Olympiad" as the Peruvian flagbear, and corroborating the article's other facts, such as Barza's birthday. As all claims of the article are either unverifiable or sourced to an unreliable source, I propose deleting this page so that we can remove the claims, deletion being the only way to do so as the claims has stayed roughly the same since its creation. Thank you. NotReallyMoniak ( talk) 16:15, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
- Comment: Barza's surname is also spelt "Barúa". However, I cannot find a Barua at the Olympic website either. Thanks. NotReallyMoniak ( talk) 16:15, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
- Comment: The Olympics website does not directly bring you to the fencing article. Instead, choose "Fencing" from the list of sport, then the event from the drop-down menu on its right. Separately, a Google search does not turn up any Barza or Barua results unrelated to Wikipedia. NotReallyMoniak ( talk) 16:22, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
- Comment. Here he is on the Olympics website. Seems clear that his name is Barúa or Barúa Lecaros, and Barza was/is an error. It should be noted that sports-reference, Olympedia and the Olympics website are not intellectually independent. Update: I've updated the prose and added the one non-db source I could find with anything substantial; it supports his flag-bearing and competing in the foil and sabre, and also identifies him as an alférez (ensign) in the armed services at the time. I'm inclined to believe more sources may exist for him. wjemather please leave a message... 18:57, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Sportspeople and Peru. Shellwood ( talk) 16:33, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Olympics-related deletion discussions. wjemather please leave a message... 16:35, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
- Comment The article should be moved to Enrique Barúa, which appears to be his correct name/surname. As Wjemather noted above, there is a direct link to his profile at the IOC website.-- Darwinek ( talk) 17:16, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
- Delete. I generally treat the sports databases as inferior sources, somewhat acceptable. When they don't even have the name right, forget it. And the only other thing we have is an offline peruvian report. It may be local, or it may well be a valid WP:SECONDARY, reliable source, but either way it's not enough to prove notability under WP:GNG, nor any other guideline I can think of. Jacona ( talk) 13:16, 4 August 2022 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 21:37, 9 August 2022 (UTC)
- Delete, simply existing on a sports DB is not enough, they aim for all possible inclusivity. Not seeing enough to meet general notability standards. Hey man im josh ( talk) 22:52, 9 August 2022 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. ✗ plicit 14:37, 14 August 2022 (UTC)
Enrique Barza
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- Enrique Barza ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
According to the article and its sports-reference source ( here), Barza participated in the Olympics twice, in 1968 with Men's Foil Individual fencing and in 1972 with Men's Sabre Individual fencing. However, when I access the full results on Olympics' official website, I can't find Barza among the participants ( 1968 and 1972). The only mention of Barza is over at IMDb (unreliable per WP:IMDB) stating that he appeared in a film called "Munich 1972: Games of the XX Olympiad" as the Peruvian flagbear, and corroborating the article's other facts, such as Barza's birthday. As all claims of the article are either unverifiable or sourced to an unreliable source, I propose deleting this page so that we can remove the claims, deletion being the only way to do so as the claims has stayed roughly the same since its creation. Thank you. NotReallyMoniak ( talk) 16:15, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
- Comment: Barza's surname is also spelt "Barúa". However, I cannot find a Barua at the Olympic website either. Thanks. NotReallyMoniak ( talk) 16:15, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
- Comment: The Olympics website does not directly bring you to the fencing article. Instead, choose "Fencing" from the list of sport, then the event from the drop-down menu on its right. Separately, a Google search does not turn up any Barza or Barua results unrelated to Wikipedia. NotReallyMoniak ( talk) 16:22, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
- Comment. Here he is on the Olympics website. Seems clear that his name is Barúa or Barúa Lecaros, and Barza was/is an error. It should be noted that sports-reference, Olympedia and the Olympics website are not intellectually independent. Update: I've updated the prose and added the one non-db source I could find with anything substantial; it supports his flag-bearing and competing in the foil and sabre, and also identifies him as an alférez (ensign) in the armed services at the time. I'm inclined to believe more sources may exist for him. wjemather please leave a message... 18:57, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Sportspeople and Peru. Shellwood ( talk) 16:33, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Olympics-related deletion discussions. wjemather please leave a message... 16:35, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
- Comment The article should be moved to Enrique Barúa, which appears to be his correct name/surname. As Wjemather noted above, there is a direct link to his profile at the IOC website.-- Darwinek ( talk) 17:16, 2 August 2022 (UTC)
- Delete. I generally treat the sports databases as inferior sources, somewhat acceptable. When they don't even have the name right, forget it. And the only other thing we have is an offline peruvian report. It may be local, or it may well be a valid WP:SECONDARY, reliable source, but either way it's not enough to prove notability under WP:GNG, nor any other guideline I can think of. Jacona ( talk) 13:16, 4 August 2022 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 21:37, 9 August 2022 (UTC)
- Delete, simply existing on a sports DB is not enough, they aim for all possible inclusivity. Not seeing enough to meet general notability standards. Hey man im josh ( talk) 22:52, 9 August 2022 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.