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Hello! I just want to thank you so much for taking the time to guide me through the GAN process for this article. I've contributed piecemeal to wikipedia over the years, but 2022 was the first time I've actually created and taken the time to edit, source and curate articles. It has been a labor of love, and the assistance of experienced editors has been beyond value. I speak very little German, so I have spent many hours sitting with a source on my screen or my knee, and a German dictionary or translation site on the other, piecing together sometimes garbled paragraphs. I hope that my responses to your posts on the review page are appropriate and correct, I wasn't sure how to let you know I'd read and edited accordingly. - Evansknight ( talk) 18:30, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Charles MacCarthy, 1st Viscount Muskerry you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Edwininlondon -- Edwininlondon ( talk) 09:22, 16 July 2022 (UTC)
The article Charles MacCarthy, 1st Viscount Muskerry you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Charles MacCarthy, 1st Viscount Muskerry for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Edwininlondon -- Edwininlondon ( talk) 21:02, 3 August 2022 (UTC)
Many thanks, Denisarona ( talk) 13:57, 13 August 2022 (UTC) |
Hi, thanks for the tip, have fixed the quotation errors. A curious question for you: I notuced that often you use e.g. 20 May 1689 ( with & n b s p ; ) instead of 20 May 1689. Is there a particular reason? Regards Denisarona ( talk) 08:37, 19 August 2022 (UTC)
Hi, I noticed your question about formatting a proposal for deletion (prod) on Dianaa's talk page. I think you'll find the tool WP:TWINKLE helpful. It adds a TW menu to the top of pages. In the menu, there are options for nominating for speedy deletion (CSD), prod, AFD, as well as to apply different tags or request page protection. For users, the menu lets you welcome or warn the user, or report them for vandalism, edit-warring, or sock-puppetry. Give it a try! Schazjmd (talk) 14:41, 25 August 2022 (UTC)
See the section WP:FREECOPYING in guideline WP:Plagarism. There is a absolutely no prohibition on using copying copyright expired text into a Wikipedia article, providing proper attribution is used. Indeed paraphrasing it is more likely to breach the WP:Plagarism guideline if the required attribution is not added.
The issue of citations to the secondary source is coverd by WP:SAYWHEREYOUREADIT.
"Since all editors freely license their work to the public, no editor owns an article and any contributions can and may be mercilessly edited and redistributed." ( WP:MERCILESS).
I hope that helps. Don't hesitate if you need more advise". -- PBS ( talk) 19:27, 3 September 2022 (UTC)
Ah you see the complexity. You have to understand that the WP:PLAGIARISM guideline evolved because editors like the late user:SlimVirgin were firmly against copying copyright expired text and other "free source text" into Wikipedia article. I and others thought it a very good way of getting high quality text into Wikipedia quickly. So the Plagiarism guideline is a compromise. It makes sure that any text copied in is highlighted as a copy. There are projects dedicated to this, and lots of such templates see examples in user:PBS/Notes#List of PD Templates
The two projects I have been most involved in are:
Basically the way it works is that if a lot of text is copied the it is usually best to place one attribution at the bottom and link it as I have done in Murrough O'Brien, 1st Earl of Inchiquin. The way to get around the problem you have described is like this:
Mary had a little lamb and every where Mary went it was sure to go.<ref>Chisholm 1911, p.35.</ref>
==References==
Attribution
- public domain: Chisholm, Hugh, ed. (1911). " Sheep". Encyclopædia Britannica. Vol. 18 (11th ed.). Cambridge University Press. p. 34.
This article incorporates text from a publication now in the
If someone adds in new text and a new fact
Mary had a little lamb,<ref name="Chisholm 1911, p.35">Chisholm 1911, p.35.</ref> it was blue,<ref>Smith 2010, p.100</ref> and every where Mary went it was sure to go.<ref name="Chisholm 1911, p.35"/>
==References==
- Smith, John, 2019, "A Modern guide to shepherding", Reliable Publisher....
Attribution
- public domain: Chisholm, Hugh, ed. (1911). " Sheep". Encyclopædia Britannica. Vol. 18 (11th ed.). Cambridge University Press. p. 34.
This article incorporates text from a publication now in the
This is no different from any other insertion. Often it is necessary to update the language in EB1911 and DNB even if the facts are right, because the 100+ year old Victorian/Edwardian text is rather old fashioned. It does not hurt to leave the Attribution in place, but it does hurt if it is removed when there is a high correlation with the original text. There is a tool to help decide when it is appropriate:
As you can see in Example 2 there is a match but it is decreasing as time goes by and the match is now only needed for a couple of paragraphs.
The DBN may be updated with information from the 21st century ODNB. Often all they did was copy the old article and amend it with modern facts, but occasionally they completely rewrote the original. It is however a very useful check to see if the information in the old DNB article is still up to date even if the style has dated.
-- PBS ( talk) 16:44, 5 September 2022 (UTC)
{{
Refbegin}}
it was never intended to be used with bullet pointed lists of refrences it was intended in the early days for roll your own lists of inline references. Using {{
Refbegin}}
on a list of bullet pointed refrences means that their size is deminished compared to the "External links" section, implying to the casual reader that external links are more notable than references!
{{
reflist}}
with no other other bullet pointed list, so the attribution prescript is placed in the inline reference. If I use short inline citations then I place the attribution at the bottom of bullet pointed list of long citations. Ocasionally the inline citations are a mixture of inline long citation first mention followed by inline short citations, in which case I would place the attribution prescript before the initial inline long citation. --
PBS (
talk) 08:52, 7 September 2022 (UTC)My mistake on sauces (spelling is not my strong point). AWB allows complicated regular expressions to be entered. The more section header options people use the more complicated the syntas can become and the easier it is to make a mistake. Not only do regular expressions work in AWB they can also e used in the search bar eg
{{search link|insource:/en.wikisource.org\/wiki\/Dictionary_of_National_Biography/}} — all the links not currently using the DNB template.
Don't worry about roll your own inline citations that was 15+ years ago, but using {{
Refbegin}}
infront of a bullet pointed long references is in my opinion silly as it causes "external links" to appear bigger and more important than "references".
As for WP:PLAGIARISM see the start of the two relevant paragraphs:
My emphasis. — PBS ( talk) 20:57, 9 September 2022 (UTC)
Military history reviewers' award | ||
On behalf of the Military History Project, I am proud to present the The Milhist reviewing award (1 stripe) for participating in 1 review between April and June 2022.
Peacemaker67 (
talk) via
MilHistBot (
talk) 07:16, 10 September 2022 (UTC) Keep track of upcoming reviews. Just copy and paste {{
WPMILHIST Review alerts}} to your user space
|
Done Regards Denisarona ( talk) 09:52, 11 September 2022 (UTC)
The Editor's Barnstar | |
For your work in improving articles on historical topics. Kj cheetham ( talk) 11:20, 18 September 2022 (UTC) |
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The first thing to understand is that while Wikipedia is not a battle ground the people who wrote that have obviously not read Clausewitz or understood his maxim "War is the continuation of policy with other means". To try to read the Wikipedia policies and guidelines as one does legislation will end in tears. It is more important to understand the whole and not the parts: think of the polices and guidelines as a Bible, rather than legislation. If you read the Bible literally and take passages that support your point of view it will end up with others doing the same to support their's. However if you can compromise with others, then it is usually possible to come up with wording that everyone can live with (or at least most can). As an example see how long and hard it was to get the sentence "Articles must also comply with the copyright policy. into the lead of WP:V because the opposition to its inclusion argued that Wikipedia:Copyrights is not one of the three core content policies. Once it was agreed to include it in the lead of WP:V lots of problems went away and the precise wording of the sentence really does not matter.
One has to understand that polices and guidelines evolved organically over time, and as you point out usually a compromise between different editors. Those editors often coalesce into temporary parties (alliances) as people come and go. This means that things are often contradictory because shifting as the sands it depends on which party at a particular time and place can command a consensus, or more often a non-consensus that prevents change to rationalise the polices and guidelines. This does not mean that Wikipedia is a battle ground just that like any organisation "office politics" is prevalent, although because is a charity, the politics are motivated by what editors believe are the best interests of the project rather than for personal gain, although obviously some editors can be vindictive and spiteful (which motivates their behaviour in any given dispute with them opposing an editor they dislike or hold a grudge rather than considering the issue with disinterest) -- just see the behaviour of some editors on the Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents . In some cases some editors are having a hard time in the real world, or are off their medicines, or have issues like autism, any of which can make them difficult to work with.
Let me give you two examples. The first is WP:ATTRIBUTION which is a failed policy. A party of editors decided that they would stream line WP:V and WP:NPOV in a new policy called WP:ATTRIBUTION. They did not develop it in secret, but most editors did not know that they were doing it until they suddenly redirected the two polices to the new combined one. At first because they were a coherent party, and because they had invested a lot of time developing the new policy they were invested in it, they were able to show that they had a consensus for the change. It might have stuck. However when User:Jimbo Wales came out against the change a poll was held which showed there was no consensus for the change.
At the time although a very active content maker I had no idea about the poll, as I did not look at the various forum where this was discussed. However as a rule I am very against large changes to policies (and to a lesser extent guidelines) and prefer incremental changes, as I think that the former is very disruptive and particularly as large changes always have unforeseen consequences.
The second is the difference between the Article tiles policy and the WP:Manual of Style guideline, the AT policy is based on "follow the sources Luke" while the MOS tends to be prescriptive. Although 95% of the time these two methods tend to end up at the same place on a specific issue, there can be disagreement over the 5% of differences, often with those who like the prescriptive approach, trying to change the AT policy, (I am in the follow the sources party) and this difference has existed since at least 2006.
2005–2007 is an important period in the development of Wikipedia policies and guidelines. They came about because of the outside pressure by the press which at the time enjoyed finding silly things in Wikipedia and publishing how dumb the project was. This lead to SV's creation of the section] WP:BURDEN in verification policy on 30 August 2005 and a year later based on a proposal by Jimbo at Wikimania 2006 to the creation of Wikipedia:100,000 feature-quality articles (on 14 September 2006).
Most editors would like to think that their contributions will help others. To do this Wikipedia must appear in searches. At the time search engines did not automatically place Wikipedia at the top of close to the top of their searches. There was a danger that unless Wikipedia was viewed regularly then its profile would slip and it would become as irrelevant (see List of online encyclopedias). Suddenly things like "If you want to publish things on Wikipedia you must provide sources ... see this policy", started to appear more often than before in talk page discussions, and non-sourced text would be deleted based on policy. This meant that people who wanted to add content had to acquire a knowledge of the policies and guidelines. Of course the old maxim "The wonderful thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from" (attributed to various people) can just as well be amended to "The wonderful thing about policies and guidelines is that there are so many of them to choose from", but choose from them one is a must in talk page conversations about content on Wikipedia. This was not so in the very early days.
In-text and in-line have two distinct meaning in guidelines on Wikipedia. The WP:INTEXT section was introduced by SV, and while I did not and still do not agree with her completely about its use, but I think the meaning is clear. In-line is used to distinguish between citations within the text and those located as bullet points in the reference list in the references section at the bottom of the article. The term general-reference used to mean a reference that appeared at the bottom of the article in a bullet pointed list which might or might not also support in-line citations. This meant that its original meaning was shorthand for the references in the "bullet pointed list of references at the bottom of the article", which thanks to its now different meaning means that one has to use a phrase when before one used two words! Sigh I lost that particular debate!
You write "{{DNB|inline=1...}} seems to implement {{
Citation-attribution}}
." — Yes it does but only for {{
DNB}}
as does {{
EB1911}}
and so on {{
Citation-attribution}}
, like {{
Source-attribution}}
are for in-line and "bullet pointed list of references at the bottom of the article", are for books which do not have customised template.
You wrote A crucial question probably is in which case .. Just like WP:V seems to accept general references... — You are totally wrong about this. Apart from the example I gave you above see for examples
Alexander I of Russia (which uses {{
EB1911}}
and one of the examples in the guideline
Battle of Camp Hill which uses {{
Source-attribution}}
.
You wrote "It seems always to say "this but also that" due to the history of the finding a consensus ..." — this is true for most of the policies and guidelines, particularly common ground between them.
You wrote "It sometimes also uses terminology that is perhaps not common knowledge. I had difficulties to grasp that "inline" and "in-text" attribution" — I explained those two above, but this is always a problem of in-group slang/shorthand in any organisation. What annoys me is when people use short links without giving them eg ASSERT instead of ASSERT on their first use in a posting, on the assumption that everyone can knows and remember every acronym use in the Wikipedia policies and guidelines.
You wrote "The citations that also serve as inline attributions must be distinguishable from the ordinary ones" — I think this is where you have a major misunderstanding. It does no harm to the project to attribute text that is no longer needs attribution, it does harm not to. As you know may know "no editor owns an article and any contributions can and may be mercilessly edited" (
Wikipedia:Five pillars:
Wikipedia is free content that anyone can use, edit, and distribute). This means that with other contributions and style changes an article that starts of with text copied from a PD source will move further and further from that source, until it is no longer a copy in any meaningful way. When that point is reached is nuanced and an editorial decision, but eventually most articles will end up no longer needing attribution to a PD source, although the source may still be cited there is a tool that can help do this objectively
Earwig's Copyvio Detector one of a set of tools in the {{
DYK tools}}
box. As example of this is
Alfred the Great: All
First Revision as of 20:04, 27 October 2001, some
Revision as of 14:13, 3 January 2011, None [Current Revision as of 12:22, 16 September 2022]
You wrote The articles mentioned as examples do not seem to be particularly well-chosen. Do you think there would be a chance for straightening WP:PLAG out and make it a bit more prescriptive? As I chose them I think that they are well chosen, although when I chose them there was a limited pool to choose from :-). However I think that your misunderstanding of
WP:Plagiarism has more do with your observation than fact. As someone who has been working on the project for about 2 decades it is difficult for me to see the text through someone new to it. However changing things without an understanding often leads to unforeseen consequences. I suggest that you do not change anything until you have a better knowledge of the issue and have looked at
lots of links to the {{
DNB}}
and {{
EB1911}}
templates.
-- PBS ( talk) 14:24, 19 September 2022 (UTC)
{{
PD-notice}}
attributions from the citations verifying the verbatim borrows from the DNB. Is this somehow prescribed in the 2nd paragraph of the section "Where to place ..." of WP:PLAG? It says:If a significant proportion of the text is copied or closely paraphrased from a compatibly-licensed or public domain source, attribution is generally provided either through the use of an appropriate attribution template, or a general attribution template such as {{ source-attribution}}, or similar annotation, placed in a "References section" near the bottom of the page. In such cases consider adding the attribution statements at the end of the Reference section directly under a line consisting of "Attribution:" (Attribution:) in bold:[19]
{{
source-attribution}}
if there is no specific template for that reference. Appart from anything else many of the specific templates have maintenance categories attached. See for example
Category:Wikipedia articles incorporating text from the Dictionary of National Biography.; Attribution
'''Attribution:'''
If a significant proportion of the text is copied or closely paraphrased from a compatibly-licensed or public domain source, attribution is generally provided only at the end of of the "References section". No inline attribution is given in this case. The attribution at the end uses either a source-specific attribution template (e.g.
{{ DNB}}
, or the general attribution template (i.e.{{ Source-attribution}}
). The attribution template should appear under a line "Attribution:" (Attribution:) in bold:[19]
Guild of Copy Editors October 2022 Newsletter
Hello and welcome to our latest newsletter, a quarterly digest of Guild activities since June. Don't forget you can unsubscribe at any time; see below. Drive: Of the 22 editors who signed up for our July Backlog Elimination Drive, 18 copy-edited, between them, 116 articles. Barnstars awarded are noted here. Blitz: Participants in our August Copy Editing Blitz copy-edited 51,074 words in 17 articles. Of the 15 editors who signed up, 11 claimed at least one copy-edit. Barnstars awarded are noted here. Drive: Forty-one editors took part in our September Backlog Elimination Drive; between them they copy-edited 199 articles. Barnstars awards are noted here. Blitz: Our October Copy Editing Blitz begins on 16 October at 00:01 (UTC) and will end on 22 October at 23:59 (UTC). Barnstars awarded will be posted here. Progress report: As of 19:57, 12 October 2022 (UTC), GOCE copyeditors have processed 303 requests for copy edit – including withdrawn and declined ones – since 1 January. At the time of writing, there are 77 requests awaiting attention and the backlog of tagged articles stands at 1,759. We always need more active, skilled copyeditors – particularly for requests – so please get involved if you can. Election news: In our mid-year election, serving coordinators Baffle gab1978, Dhtwiki, Miniapolis, Reidgreg and Tenryuu were returned for another term, and were joined by new coordinator Zippybonzo. No lead coordinator was elected for this half-year. Jonesey95, a long-serving coordinator and lead, was elected as coordinator emeritus; we thank them for their service. Thank you to everyone who took part. Our next election of coordinators takes place throughout December. If you'd like to help out at the GOCE, please consider nominating yourself or other suitable editors (with their permission, of course!). It's your Guild, after all! Thank you all again for your participation; we wouldn't be able to achieve what we have without you! Cheers from your GOCE coordinators Baffle gab1978, Dhtwiki, Miniapolis, Reidgreg, Tenryuu and Zippybonzo. To discontinue receiving GOCE newsletters, please remove your name from
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Baffle☿gab 03:07, 14 October 2022 (UTC)
I was just going off the links in the articles when I edited that, but since you linked a pedigree. It says in the article his father is Henry MacShane O'Neill. Is this a different man than the Henry (d. 1608) in your pedigree? If so maybe the link to him should be killed in the article to clear up the confusion. The confusion that Shane O'Neill is an ancestor of the Kinard O'Neills. You are a good editor, you don't need to defer to me. You have a source! User:SKIBLY101 ( talk) 19:31, 24 October 2022 (UTC)
The year 1911a and 1911b seemed to be working ok, I guess you worked it out. However thanks for the changes in how the date and year are handled in
CS1, use the |date=
parameter rather than |year=
so the template displays the long citation with the appended date letter eg date=1911a
. --
PBS (
talk) 13:20, 25 October 2022 (UTC)
Hi Johannes, thanks for your message. I have reversed the date changes, as you suggested (was working too fast and missed their location). The change I made to the Theobald Dillon article was for the use of the Passive in this context. if you want, you can change it back. Again, many thanks for your kind comments. Denisarona ( talk) 09:30, 24 November 2022 (UTC)
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Guild of Copy Editors December 2022 Newsletter
Hello and welcome to our latest newsletter, a quarterly digest of Guild activities since October. Don't forget you can unsubscribe at any time; see below. Blitz: Our October Copy Editing Blitz focused on July and August 2022 request months; and articles tagged for c/e in December 2021 and January 2022. Seventeen of those who signed up claimed at least one copy-edit, and between them copy-edited forty-six articles. Barnstars awarded are here. Drive: In the November Backlog Elimination Drive, thirty editors signed up, twenty-two of whom claimed at least one copy-edit. Both target months—December 2021 and January 2022—were cleared, and February was added to the target months. Sixteen requests were copy-edited and 239 articles were removed from the backlog. Barnstars awarded are here. Blitz: Our seven-day-long December 2022 Copy Editing Blitz begins on 17 December at 00:01 (UTC)*. It will focus on articles tagged for copy-edit in February 2022, and pending requests from September and October. Barnstars awarded will be available here. Progress report: As of 22:40, 8 December 2022, GOCE copyeditors have processed 357 requests since 1 January, there were seventy-four requests outstanding and the backlog stands at 1,791 articles. We always need skilled copy-editors; please help out if you can. Election news: Nomination of candidates for the GOCE's Election of Coordinators for the first half of 2023 is open and continues until 23:59 on 15 December. Voting begins at 00:01 on 16 December and closes at 23:59 on 31 December. All editors in good standing (not under ArbCom or community sanctions) are eligible and self-nominations are welcomed. Coordinators serve a six-month term that ends at 23:59 on June 30. If you've thought about helping out at the Guild, please nominate yourself or any editor you consider suitable—with their permission, of course!. It's your Guild and it doesn't coordinate itself. Thank you all again for your participation; we wouldn't be able to achieve what we have without you! Cheers and best seasonal wishes from your GOCE coordinators, Baffle gab1978, Dhtwiki, Miniapolis, Tenryuu, and Zippybonzo. *All times and dates on this newsletter are UTC.
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Sent by Baffle gab1978 via MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 00:26, 9 December 2022 (UTC)
The GOCE December 2022 newsletter, as sent on 9 December, contains an erroneous start date for our December Blitz. The Blitz will start on 11 December rather than on 17 December, as stated in the newsletter. I'm sorry for the mistake and for disrupting your talk page; thanks for your understanding. Sent by Baffle gab1978 via MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 21:30, 9 December 2022 (UTC)
Hi Johannes, the reason I change is that spelt is more common in British English, whereas the alternative spelled is more typical in American English (according to Oxford and Longman dictionaries). The articles where I change are British-based English articles. Regards Denisarona ( talk) 12:20, 27 December 2022 (UTC)
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Thank you for your diligent work on Irish history Gaelicbow ( talk) 13:22, 8 January 2023 (UTC) |
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Sent by Baffle gab1978 using MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 00:30, 6 February 2023 (UTC)
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Hi - you made a complex edit of the article, but I'm wondering if you accidentally cut the mention of O'Hurlihy. Shtove ( talk) 11:24, 22 February 2023 (UTC)
Hello, @ Johannes Schade, this is a message concerning an article you edited recently. After performing the move of MacCarthy Mor dynasty to MacCarthy dynasty and Mac Carthaigh Riabhach to MacCarthy Reagh, I encountered a problem moving McCarthy of Muskerry to MacCarthy of Muskerry. You can view more details here.
After researching what happened through the segmented history, it appears the article originally MacCarthy of Muskerry, but was moved to Mac Carthaigh Múscraige and moved to McCarthy of Muskerry by a user that was likely unaware of the implications of the title when moving the article back as per WP:UE. BurgeoningContracting ( talk) 03:43, 7 March 2023 (UTC)
Guild of Copy Editors March 2023 Newsletter
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Hello Johannes,
Thank you for undertaking the above. I will of course abide by your comments unless there is something or other that you have missed. As to the modest number of edits I have on the clock, I'm fairly sure that quite a number more were made before I created my account. There was also a period of some years when I wasn't active on Wikipedia at all. Anyhow, you've likely worked out that I am from broadly the same part of the world where you presently live. Regards Billsmith60 ( talk) 19:13, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
Hello Johannes, unfortunately an edit conflict occurred a few minutes ago when I was adding my observations to the two assessments you made yesterday (the Talk page, that is, not the article which has been updated). This caused the loss of everything I wrote in response to you. If I had copied the code first, I might have been able to salvage my comments, but the code changed to the latest version after your edit. Anyhow, I'll charge on and make today's changes as soon as possible (b tomorrow early afternoon) and will make all observations to you at the one time. All the best Billsmith60 ( talk) 13:11, 21 April 2023 (UTC)
Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Antoine Hamilton you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by ChristieBot, on behalf of Mike Christie -- Mike Christie ( talk) 14:02, 20 April 2023 (UTC)
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Hi Johannes Schade, do you remember we crossed paths editing Murrough O'Brien, 1st Earl of Inchiquin some time ago. I would now ask you for some help. I am not sure if you're interested in the O'Neill dynasty, but I've encountered a disruptive editor ('Queenmedb99') vandalising/edit warring two pages: McAleer and Branches of the Cenel nEoghain, with uncited nonsense relating to DNA, and I was wondering if you could lend a hand or help monitor those pages.
Thanks, Gaelicbow ( talk) 11:31, 9 May 2023 (UTC)
Hello Johannes, I just wanted to let you know that I've recently published an article on Alfred Verdross, where I applied most of the things you taught me during your outstanding review of my article on Hugo Krabbe. For me that experience was very useful and I am sure that the task of the next reviewer (I intend to nominate also Verdross for GA or FA) will be much lighter than yours because of what I learnt from you. Thanks, Gitz ( talk) ( contribs) 14:34, 12 May 2023 (UTC)
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Guild of Copy Editors June 2023 Newsletter
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Sent by Baffle gab1978 using MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 03:38, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
Hi, you have introduced a number of reference errors into James Hamilton (English army officer):
If you could fix these it would be appreciated. DuncanHill ( talk) 07:57, 17 June 2023 (UTC)
The article Antoine Hamilton you nominated as a good article has failed ; see Talk:Antoine Hamilton for reasons why the nomination failed. If or when these points have been taken care of, you may apply for a new nomination of the article. Message delivered by ChristieBot, on behalf of Mike Christie -- Mike Christie ( talk) 15:43, 30 June 2023 (UTC)
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It's been quite a while since we corresponded, so probably you will guess that I'm looking for a little help. I've been working on John Ogilby to get it up to GA standard but I approach it from an interest in cartography rather than as a historian. Given how long the queue for GA evaluation is, I would like to be sure that I don't fall at the first fence with silly errors. So if you can spare the time, please, could you give it a read over and point to any elements that need more work?
No obligation: if you can't afford the time then I'll ask elsewhere but I think it is in your period of historical interest? (1600-1676, including Ireland around 1641).
Best wishes. (The artist formerly known as user:John Maynard Friedman.) 𝕁𝕄𝔽 ( talk) 20:03, 12 August 2023 (UTC)
The August 2023 Good Article Nominations Backlog Drive is at the halfway mark, and has seen incredible progress, dropping the backlog from 638 to 359 unreviewed articles -- a 43.7% reduction in only fifteen days! But we still have over two weeks to go, and there are plenty of articles left to review:
And remember: if you've done reviews, you should log them at the backlog drive page for points, so they can be tracked towards your awards at the end.
Thanks for signing up for the drive, and I hope to see you reviewing! Vaticidal prophet 02:01, 15 August 2023 (UTC)
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Thank you for your patience regarding Rachel Yakar. In the meantime - see my story - Berit Lindholm died, and now also Robert Hale. I keep hoping that there will be a break eventually! -- Gerda Arendt ( talk) 19:26, 29 August 2023 (UTC)
After Lindholm became GA, and I updated Hale as far as I could I finally turned to Yakar again, translating the Diapason article completely. I took one sentence, but otherwise found that it would loose in translation, for example the one-word charactisations for roles such Fiordiligi. The detail about Poppea sounds better in French, and seems a bit undue weight. So, please check again. -- Gerda Arendt ( talk) 15:28, 4 September 2023 (UTC)
Guild of Copy Editors September 2023 Newsletter
Hello and welcome to the September 2023 newsletter, a quarterly digest of Guild activities since June. Don't forget you can unsubscribe at any time; see below. David Thomsen: Prolific Wikipedian and Guild member David Thomsen ( Dthomsen8) died in November 2022. He was a regular copy editor who took part in many of our Drives and Blitzes. An obituary was published in the mid-July issue of The Signpost. Tributes can be left on David's talk page. Election news: In our mid-year Election of Coordinators, Dhtwiki was chosen as lead coordinator, Miniapolis and Zippybonzo continue as assistant coordinators, and Baffle gab1978 stepped down from the role. If you're interested in helping out at the GOCE, please consider nominating yourself for our next election in December; it's your WikiProject and it doesn't organize itself! June Blitz: Of the 17 editors who signed up for our June Copy Editing Blitz, 12 copy-edited at least one article. 70,035 words comprising 26 articles were copy-edited. Barnstars awarded are here. July Drive: 34 of the 51 editors who took part in our July Backlog Elimination Drive copy-edited at least one article. They edited 276 articles and 683,633 words between them. Barnstars awarded are here. August Blitz: In our August Copy Editing Blitz, 13 of the 16 editors who signed up worked on at least one article. Between them, they copy-edited 79,608 words comprising 57 articles. Barnstars awarded are available here. September Drive: Sign up here for our month-long September Backlog Elimination Drive, which is now underway. Barnstars awarded will be posted here. Progress report: As of 14:29, 9 September 2023 (UTC), GOCE copy editors have processed 245 requests since 1 January. The backlog of tagged articles stands at 2,066. Thank you all again for your participation; we wouldn't be able to achieve what we have without you! Cheers from your GOCE coordinators, Dhtwiki, Miniapolis and Zippybonzo. To discontinue receiving GOCE newsletters, please remove your name from
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Thank you for continuing the review. I hope you are well enough for such stress, and hope for good recovery! -- Gerda Arendt ( talk) 21:01, 23 September 2023 (UTC)
Hello Johannes, I hope you are well. I recently, by chance, came across your draft article for the Memoirs of Count Gramont. Do you have any intention of publishing the article at any stage? I think it would be valuable! A few weeks ago I started working on my own one, but it is not nearly as advanced or comprehensive as yours. KerryCommon ( talk) 18:14, 25 September 2023 (UTC)
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Guild of Copy Editors December 2023 Newsletter
Hello, and welcome to the December 2023 newsletter, a quarterly digest of Guild activities since September. Don't forget that you can unsubscribe at any time; see below. Election news: The Guild needs coordinators! If you'd like to help out, you may nominate yourself or any suitable editor—with their permission—for the Election of Coordinators for the first half of 2024. Nominations will close at 23:59 on 15 December (UTC). Voting begins immediately after the close of nominations and closes at 23:59 on 31 December. All editors in good standing (not under current sanctions) are eligible, and self-nominations are welcome. Coordinators normally serve a six-month term that ends at 23:59 on 30 June. Drive: Of the 69 editors who signed up for the September Backlog Elimination Drive, 40 copy-edited at least one article. Between them, they copy-edited 661,214 words in 290 articles. Barnstars awarded are listed here. Blitz: Of the 22 editors who signed up for the October Copy Editing Blitz, 13 copy-edited at least one article. Between them, they copy-edited 109,327 words in 52 articles. Barnstars awarded are listed here. Drive: During the November Backlog Elimination Drive, 38 of the 58 editors who signed up copy-edited at least one article. Between them, they copy-edited 458,620 words in 234 articles. Barnstars awarded are listed here. Blitz: Our December Copy Editing Blitz will run from 10 to 16 December. Barnstars awarded will be posted here. Progress report: As of 20:33, 10 December 2023 (UTC), GOCE copyeditors have processed 344 requests since 1 January, and the backlog stands at 2,191 articles. Other news: Our Annual Report for 2023 is planned for release in the new year. Thank you all again for your participation; we wouldn't be able to achieve what we have without you! Cheers from your GOCE coordinators Dhtwiki, Miniapolis and Zippybonzo. To discontinue receiving GOCE newsletters, please remove your name from
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Message sent by Baffle gab1978 using MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 20:53, 10 December 2023 (UTC)
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Wishing you and yours a Happy New Year, from the horse and bishop person. May the year ahead be productive and distraction-free and may Janus light your way. Ealdgyth ( talk) 14:37, 31 December 2023 (UTC) |
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Guild of Copy Editors April 2024 Newsletter
Hello and welcome to the April 2024 newsletter, a quarterly digest of Guild activities since December. Don't forget you can unsubscribe at any time; see below. We extend a warm welcome to all of our new members. We wish you all happy copy-editing. Election results: In our December 2023 coordinator election, Zippybonzo stepped down as coordinator; we thank them for their service. Incumbents Dhtwiki and Miniapolis were reelected coordinators, and Wracking was newly elected coordinator, to serve through 30 June. Nominations for our mid-year Election of Coordinators will open on 1 June (UTC). Drive: 46 editors signed up for our January Backlog Elimination Drive, 32 of whom claimed at least one copy-edit. Between them, they copy-edited 289 articles totaling 626,729 words. Barnstars awarded are here. Blitz: 23 editors signed up for our February Copy Editing Blitz. 18 claimed at least one copy-edit and between them, they copy-edited 100,293 words in 32 articles. Barnstars awarded are here. Drive: 53 editors signed up for our March Backlog Elimination Drive, 34 of whom claimed at least one copy-edit. Between them, they copy-edited 300 articles totaling 587,828 words. Barnstars awarded are here. Blitz: Sign up for our April Copy Editing Blitz, which runs from 14 to 20 April. Barnstars will be awarded here. Progress report: As of 23:17, 11 April 2024 (UTC), GOCE copyeditors have processed 109 requests since 1 January 2024, and the backlog stands at 2,480 articles. Thank you all again for your participation; we wouldn't be able to achieve what we have without you! Cheers from Baffle gab1978 and your GOCE coordinators Dhtwiki, Miniapolis and Wracking. To discontinue receiving GOCE newsletters, please remove your name from
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Hello! I just want to thank you so much for taking the time to guide me through the GAN process for this article. I've contributed piecemeal to wikipedia over the years, but 2022 was the first time I've actually created and taken the time to edit, source and curate articles. It has been a labor of love, and the assistance of experienced editors has been beyond value. I speak very little German, so I have spent many hours sitting with a source on my screen or my knee, and a German dictionary or translation site on the other, piecing together sometimes garbled paragraphs. I hope that my responses to your posts on the review page are appropriate and correct, I wasn't sure how to let you know I'd read and edited accordingly. - Evansknight ( talk) 18:30, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Charles MacCarthy, 1st Viscount Muskerry you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Edwininlondon -- Edwininlondon ( talk) 09:22, 16 July 2022 (UTC)
The article Charles MacCarthy, 1st Viscount Muskerry you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Charles MacCarthy, 1st Viscount Muskerry for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Edwininlondon -- Edwininlondon ( talk) 21:02, 3 August 2022 (UTC)
Many thanks, Denisarona ( talk) 13:57, 13 August 2022 (UTC) |
Hi, thanks for the tip, have fixed the quotation errors. A curious question for you: I notuced that often you use e.g. 20 May 1689 ( with & n b s p ; ) instead of 20 May 1689. Is there a particular reason? Regards Denisarona ( talk) 08:37, 19 August 2022 (UTC)
Hi, I noticed your question about formatting a proposal for deletion (prod) on Dianaa's talk page. I think you'll find the tool WP:TWINKLE helpful. It adds a TW menu to the top of pages. In the menu, there are options for nominating for speedy deletion (CSD), prod, AFD, as well as to apply different tags or request page protection. For users, the menu lets you welcome or warn the user, or report them for vandalism, edit-warring, or sock-puppetry. Give it a try! Schazjmd (talk) 14:41, 25 August 2022 (UTC)
See the section WP:FREECOPYING in guideline WP:Plagarism. There is a absolutely no prohibition on using copying copyright expired text into a Wikipedia article, providing proper attribution is used. Indeed paraphrasing it is more likely to breach the WP:Plagarism guideline if the required attribution is not added.
The issue of citations to the secondary source is coverd by WP:SAYWHEREYOUREADIT.
"Since all editors freely license their work to the public, no editor owns an article and any contributions can and may be mercilessly edited and redistributed." ( WP:MERCILESS).
I hope that helps. Don't hesitate if you need more advise". -- PBS ( talk) 19:27, 3 September 2022 (UTC)
Ah you see the complexity. You have to understand that the WP:PLAGIARISM guideline evolved because editors like the late user:SlimVirgin were firmly against copying copyright expired text and other "free source text" into Wikipedia article. I and others thought it a very good way of getting high quality text into Wikipedia quickly. So the Plagiarism guideline is a compromise. It makes sure that any text copied in is highlighted as a copy. There are projects dedicated to this, and lots of such templates see examples in user:PBS/Notes#List of PD Templates
The two projects I have been most involved in are:
Basically the way it works is that if a lot of text is copied the it is usually best to place one attribution at the bottom and link it as I have done in Murrough O'Brien, 1st Earl of Inchiquin. The way to get around the problem you have described is like this:
Mary had a little lamb and every where Mary went it was sure to go.<ref>Chisholm 1911, p.35.</ref>
==References==
Attribution
- public domain: Chisholm, Hugh, ed. (1911). " Sheep". Encyclopædia Britannica. Vol. 18 (11th ed.). Cambridge University Press. p. 34.
This article incorporates text from a publication now in the
If someone adds in new text and a new fact
Mary had a little lamb,<ref name="Chisholm 1911, p.35">Chisholm 1911, p.35.</ref> it was blue,<ref>Smith 2010, p.100</ref> and every where Mary went it was sure to go.<ref name="Chisholm 1911, p.35"/>
==References==
- Smith, John, 2019, "A Modern guide to shepherding", Reliable Publisher....
Attribution
- public domain: Chisholm, Hugh, ed. (1911). " Sheep". Encyclopædia Britannica. Vol. 18 (11th ed.). Cambridge University Press. p. 34.
This article incorporates text from a publication now in the
This is no different from any other insertion. Often it is necessary to update the language in EB1911 and DNB even if the facts are right, because the 100+ year old Victorian/Edwardian text is rather old fashioned. It does not hurt to leave the Attribution in place, but it does hurt if it is removed when there is a high correlation with the original text. There is a tool to help decide when it is appropriate:
As you can see in Example 2 there is a match but it is decreasing as time goes by and the match is now only needed for a couple of paragraphs.
The DBN may be updated with information from the 21st century ODNB. Often all they did was copy the old article and amend it with modern facts, but occasionally they completely rewrote the original. It is however a very useful check to see if the information in the old DNB article is still up to date even if the style has dated.
-- PBS ( talk) 16:44, 5 September 2022 (UTC)
{{
Refbegin}}
it was never intended to be used with bullet pointed lists of refrences it was intended in the early days for roll your own lists of inline references. Using {{
Refbegin}}
on a list of bullet pointed refrences means that their size is deminished compared to the "External links" section, implying to the casual reader that external links are more notable than references!
{{
reflist}}
with no other other bullet pointed list, so the attribution prescript is placed in the inline reference. If I use short inline citations then I place the attribution at the bottom of bullet pointed list of long citations. Ocasionally the inline citations are a mixture of inline long citation first mention followed by inline short citations, in which case I would place the attribution prescript before the initial inline long citation. --
PBS (
talk) 08:52, 7 September 2022 (UTC)My mistake on sauces (spelling is not my strong point). AWB allows complicated regular expressions to be entered. The more section header options people use the more complicated the syntas can become and the easier it is to make a mistake. Not only do regular expressions work in AWB they can also e used in the search bar eg
{{search link|insource:/en.wikisource.org\/wiki\/Dictionary_of_National_Biography/}} — all the links not currently using the DNB template.
Don't worry about roll your own inline citations that was 15+ years ago, but using {{
Refbegin}}
infront of a bullet pointed long references is in my opinion silly as it causes "external links" to appear bigger and more important than "references".
As for WP:PLAGIARISM see the start of the two relevant paragraphs:
My emphasis. — PBS ( talk) 20:57, 9 September 2022 (UTC)
Military history reviewers' award | ||
On behalf of the Military History Project, I am proud to present the The Milhist reviewing award (1 stripe) for participating in 1 review between April and June 2022.
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Done Regards Denisarona ( talk) 09:52, 11 September 2022 (UTC)
The Editor's Barnstar | |
For your work in improving articles on historical topics. Kj cheetham ( talk) 11:20, 18 September 2022 (UTC) |
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The first thing to understand is that while Wikipedia is not a battle ground the people who wrote that have obviously not read Clausewitz or understood his maxim "War is the continuation of policy with other means". To try to read the Wikipedia policies and guidelines as one does legislation will end in tears. It is more important to understand the whole and not the parts: think of the polices and guidelines as a Bible, rather than legislation. If you read the Bible literally and take passages that support your point of view it will end up with others doing the same to support their's. However if you can compromise with others, then it is usually possible to come up with wording that everyone can live with (or at least most can). As an example see how long and hard it was to get the sentence "Articles must also comply with the copyright policy. into the lead of WP:V because the opposition to its inclusion argued that Wikipedia:Copyrights is not one of the three core content policies. Once it was agreed to include it in the lead of WP:V lots of problems went away and the precise wording of the sentence really does not matter.
One has to understand that polices and guidelines evolved organically over time, and as you point out usually a compromise between different editors. Those editors often coalesce into temporary parties (alliances) as people come and go. This means that things are often contradictory because shifting as the sands it depends on which party at a particular time and place can command a consensus, or more often a non-consensus that prevents change to rationalise the polices and guidelines. This does not mean that Wikipedia is a battle ground just that like any organisation "office politics" is prevalent, although because is a charity, the politics are motivated by what editors believe are the best interests of the project rather than for personal gain, although obviously some editors can be vindictive and spiteful (which motivates their behaviour in any given dispute with them opposing an editor they dislike or hold a grudge rather than considering the issue with disinterest) -- just see the behaviour of some editors on the Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents . In some cases some editors are having a hard time in the real world, or are off their medicines, or have issues like autism, any of which can make them difficult to work with.
Let me give you two examples. The first is WP:ATTRIBUTION which is a failed policy. A party of editors decided that they would stream line WP:V and WP:NPOV in a new policy called WP:ATTRIBUTION. They did not develop it in secret, but most editors did not know that they were doing it until they suddenly redirected the two polices to the new combined one. At first because they were a coherent party, and because they had invested a lot of time developing the new policy they were invested in it, they were able to show that they had a consensus for the change. It might have stuck. However when User:Jimbo Wales came out against the change a poll was held which showed there was no consensus for the change.
At the time although a very active content maker I had no idea about the poll, as I did not look at the various forum where this was discussed. However as a rule I am very against large changes to policies (and to a lesser extent guidelines) and prefer incremental changes, as I think that the former is very disruptive and particularly as large changes always have unforeseen consequences.
The second is the difference between the Article tiles policy and the WP:Manual of Style guideline, the AT policy is based on "follow the sources Luke" while the MOS tends to be prescriptive. Although 95% of the time these two methods tend to end up at the same place on a specific issue, there can be disagreement over the 5% of differences, often with those who like the prescriptive approach, trying to change the AT policy, (I am in the follow the sources party) and this difference has existed since at least 2006.
2005–2007 is an important period in the development of Wikipedia policies and guidelines. They came about because of the outside pressure by the press which at the time enjoyed finding silly things in Wikipedia and publishing how dumb the project was. This lead to SV's creation of the section] WP:BURDEN in verification policy on 30 August 2005 and a year later based on a proposal by Jimbo at Wikimania 2006 to the creation of Wikipedia:100,000 feature-quality articles (on 14 September 2006).
Most editors would like to think that their contributions will help others. To do this Wikipedia must appear in searches. At the time search engines did not automatically place Wikipedia at the top of close to the top of their searches. There was a danger that unless Wikipedia was viewed regularly then its profile would slip and it would become as irrelevant (see List of online encyclopedias). Suddenly things like "If you want to publish things on Wikipedia you must provide sources ... see this policy", started to appear more often than before in talk page discussions, and non-sourced text would be deleted based on policy. This meant that people who wanted to add content had to acquire a knowledge of the policies and guidelines. Of course the old maxim "The wonderful thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from" (attributed to various people) can just as well be amended to "The wonderful thing about policies and guidelines is that there are so many of them to choose from", but choose from them one is a must in talk page conversations about content on Wikipedia. This was not so in the very early days.
In-text and in-line have two distinct meaning in guidelines on Wikipedia. The WP:INTEXT section was introduced by SV, and while I did not and still do not agree with her completely about its use, but I think the meaning is clear. In-line is used to distinguish between citations within the text and those located as bullet points in the reference list in the references section at the bottom of the article. The term general-reference used to mean a reference that appeared at the bottom of the article in a bullet pointed list which might or might not also support in-line citations. This meant that its original meaning was shorthand for the references in the "bullet pointed list of references at the bottom of the article", which thanks to its now different meaning means that one has to use a phrase when before one used two words! Sigh I lost that particular debate!
You write "{{DNB|inline=1...}} seems to implement {{
Citation-attribution}}
." — Yes it does but only for {{
DNB}}
as does {{
EB1911}}
and so on {{
Citation-attribution}}
, like {{
Source-attribution}}
are for in-line and "bullet pointed list of references at the bottom of the article", are for books which do not have customised template.
You wrote A crucial question probably is in which case .. Just like WP:V seems to accept general references... — You are totally wrong about this. Apart from the example I gave you above see for examples
Alexander I of Russia (which uses {{
EB1911}}
and one of the examples in the guideline
Battle of Camp Hill which uses {{
Source-attribution}}
.
You wrote "It seems always to say "this but also that" due to the history of the finding a consensus ..." — this is true for most of the policies and guidelines, particularly common ground between them.
You wrote "It sometimes also uses terminology that is perhaps not common knowledge. I had difficulties to grasp that "inline" and "in-text" attribution" — I explained those two above, but this is always a problem of in-group slang/shorthand in any organisation. What annoys me is when people use short links without giving them eg ASSERT instead of ASSERT on their first use in a posting, on the assumption that everyone can knows and remember every acronym use in the Wikipedia policies and guidelines.
You wrote "The citations that also serve as inline attributions must be distinguishable from the ordinary ones" — I think this is where you have a major misunderstanding. It does no harm to the project to attribute text that is no longer needs attribution, it does harm not to. As you know may know "no editor owns an article and any contributions can and may be mercilessly edited" (
Wikipedia:Five pillars:
Wikipedia is free content that anyone can use, edit, and distribute). This means that with other contributions and style changes an article that starts of with text copied from a PD source will move further and further from that source, until it is no longer a copy in any meaningful way. When that point is reached is nuanced and an editorial decision, but eventually most articles will end up no longer needing attribution to a PD source, although the source may still be cited there is a tool that can help do this objectively
Earwig's Copyvio Detector one of a set of tools in the {{
DYK tools}}
box. As example of this is
Alfred the Great: All
First Revision as of 20:04, 27 October 2001, some
Revision as of 14:13, 3 January 2011, None [Current Revision as of 12:22, 16 September 2022]
You wrote The articles mentioned as examples do not seem to be particularly well-chosen. Do you think there would be a chance for straightening WP:PLAG out and make it a bit more prescriptive? As I chose them I think that they are well chosen, although when I chose them there was a limited pool to choose from :-). However I think that your misunderstanding of
WP:Plagiarism has more do with your observation than fact. As someone who has been working on the project for about 2 decades it is difficult for me to see the text through someone new to it. However changing things without an understanding often leads to unforeseen consequences. I suggest that you do not change anything until you have a better knowledge of the issue and have looked at
lots of links to the {{
DNB}}
and {{
EB1911}}
templates.
-- PBS ( talk) 14:24, 19 September 2022 (UTC)
{{
PD-notice}}
attributions from the citations verifying the verbatim borrows from the DNB. Is this somehow prescribed in the 2nd paragraph of the section "Where to place ..." of WP:PLAG? It says:If a significant proportion of the text is copied or closely paraphrased from a compatibly-licensed or public domain source, attribution is generally provided either through the use of an appropriate attribution template, or a general attribution template such as {{ source-attribution}}, or similar annotation, placed in a "References section" near the bottom of the page. In such cases consider adding the attribution statements at the end of the Reference section directly under a line consisting of "Attribution:" (Attribution:) in bold:[19]
{{
source-attribution}}
if there is no specific template for that reference. Appart from anything else many of the specific templates have maintenance categories attached. See for example
Category:Wikipedia articles incorporating text from the Dictionary of National Biography.; Attribution
'''Attribution:'''
If a significant proportion of the text is copied or closely paraphrased from a compatibly-licensed or public domain source, attribution is generally provided only at the end of of the "References section". No inline attribution is given in this case. The attribution at the end uses either a source-specific attribution template (e.g.
{{ DNB}}
, or the general attribution template (i.e.{{ Source-attribution}}
). The attribution template should appear under a line "Attribution:" (Attribution:) in bold:[19]
Guild of Copy Editors October 2022 Newsletter
Hello and welcome to our latest newsletter, a quarterly digest of Guild activities since June. Don't forget you can unsubscribe at any time; see below. Drive: Of the 22 editors who signed up for our July Backlog Elimination Drive, 18 copy-edited, between them, 116 articles. Barnstars awarded are noted here. Blitz: Participants in our August Copy Editing Blitz copy-edited 51,074 words in 17 articles. Of the 15 editors who signed up, 11 claimed at least one copy-edit. Barnstars awarded are noted here. Drive: Forty-one editors took part in our September Backlog Elimination Drive; between them they copy-edited 199 articles. Barnstars awards are noted here. Blitz: Our October Copy Editing Blitz begins on 16 October at 00:01 (UTC) and will end on 22 October at 23:59 (UTC). Barnstars awarded will be posted here. Progress report: As of 19:57, 12 October 2022 (UTC), GOCE copyeditors have processed 303 requests for copy edit – including withdrawn and declined ones – since 1 January. At the time of writing, there are 77 requests awaiting attention and the backlog of tagged articles stands at 1,759. We always need more active, skilled copyeditors – particularly for requests – so please get involved if you can. Election news: In our mid-year election, serving coordinators Baffle gab1978, Dhtwiki, Miniapolis, Reidgreg and Tenryuu were returned for another term, and were joined by new coordinator Zippybonzo. No lead coordinator was elected for this half-year. Jonesey95, a long-serving coordinator and lead, was elected as coordinator emeritus; we thank them for their service. Thank you to everyone who took part. Our next election of coordinators takes place throughout December. If you'd like to help out at the GOCE, please consider nominating yourself or other suitable editors (with their permission, of course!). It's your Guild, after all! Thank you all again for your participation; we wouldn't be able to achieve what we have without you! Cheers from your GOCE coordinators Baffle gab1978, Dhtwiki, Miniapolis, Reidgreg, Tenryuu and Zippybonzo. To discontinue receiving GOCE newsletters, please remove your name from
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Baffle☿gab 03:07, 14 October 2022 (UTC)
I was just going off the links in the articles when I edited that, but since you linked a pedigree. It says in the article his father is Henry MacShane O'Neill. Is this a different man than the Henry (d. 1608) in your pedigree? If so maybe the link to him should be killed in the article to clear up the confusion. The confusion that Shane O'Neill is an ancestor of the Kinard O'Neills. You are a good editor, you don't need to defer to me. You have a source! User:SKIBLY101 ( talk) 19:31, 24 October 2022 (UTC)
The year 1911a and 1911b seemed to be working ok, I guess you worked it out. However thanks for the changes in how the date and year are handled in
CS1, use the |date=
parameter rather than |year=
so the template displays the long citation with the appended date letter eg date=1911a
. --
PBS (
talk) 13:20, 25 October 2022 (UTC)
Hi Johannes, thanks for your message. I have reversed the date changes, as you suggested (was working too fast and missed their location). The change I made to the Theobald Dillon article was for the use of the Passive in this context. if you want, you can change it back. Again, many thanks for your kind comments. Denisarona ( talk) 09:30, 24 November 2022 (UTC)
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Guild of Copy Editors December 2022 Newsletter
Hello and welcome to our latest newsletter, a quarterly digest of Guild activities since October. Don't forget you can unsubscribe at any time; see below. Blitz: Our October Copy Editing Blitz focused on July and August 2022 request months; and articles tagged for c/e in December 2021 and January 2022. Seventeen of those who signed up claimed at least one copy-edit, and between them copy-edited forty-six articles. Barnstars awarded are here. Drive: In the November Backlog Elimination Drive, thirty editors signed up, twenty-two of whom claimed at least one copy-edit. Both target months—December 2021 and January 2022—were cleared, and February was added to the target months. Sixteen requests were copy-edited and 239 articles were removed from the backlog. Barnstars awarded are here. Blitz: Our seven-day-long December 2022 Copy Editing Blitz begins on 17 December at 00:01 (UTC)*. It will focus on articles tagged for copy-edit in February 2022, and pending requests from September and October. Barnstars awarded will be available here. Progress report: As of 22:40, 8 December 2022, GOCE copyeditors have processed 357 requests since 1 January, there were seventy-four requests outstanding and the backlog stands at 1,791 articles. We always need skilled copy-editors; please help out if you can. Election news: Nomination of candidates for the GOCE's Election of Coordinators for the first half of 2023 is open and continues until 23:59 on 15 December. Voting begins at 00:01 on 16 December and closes at 23:59 on 31 December. All editors in good standing (not under ArbCom or community sanctions) are eligible and self-nominations are welcomed. Coordinators serve a six-month term that ends at 23:59 on June 30. If you've thought about helping out at the Guild, please nominate yourself or any editor you consider suitable—with their permission, of course!. It's your Guild and it doesn't coordinate itself. Thank you all again for your participation; we wouldn't be able to achieve what we have without you! Cheers and best seasonal wishes from your GOCE coordinators, Baffle gab1978, Dhtwiki, Miniapolis, Tenryuu, and Zippybonzo. *All times and dates on this newsletter are UTC.
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Sent by Baffle gab1978 via MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 00:26, 9 December 2022 (UTC)
The GOCE December 2022 newsletter, as sent on 9 December, contains an erroneous start date for our December Blitz. The Blitz will start on 11 December rather than on 17 December, as stated in the newsletter. I'm sorry for the mistake and for disrupting your talk page; thanks for your understanding. Sent by Baffle gab1978 via MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 21:30, 9 December 2022 (UTC)
Hi Johannes, the reason I change is that spelt is more common in British English, whereas the alternative spelled is more typical in American English (according to Oxford and Longman dictionaries). The articles where I change are British-based English articles. Regards Denisarona ( talk) 12:20, 27 December 2022 (UTC)
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Thank you for your diligent work on Irish history Gaelicbow ( talk) 13:22, 8 January 2023 (UTC) |
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Sent by Baffle gab1978 using MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 00:30, 6 February 2023 (UTC)
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Thank you for your marvellous contributions while reviewing the Lucien Brouha bio. You unearthed many very useful sources and triple-checked every little detail. The article is much better as a result. That was a tremendous effort that went above and beyond! Schwede 66 00:48, 8 February 2023 (UTC) |
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Hi - you made a complex edit of the article, but I'm wondering if you accidentally cut the mention of O'Hurlihy. Shtove ( talk) 11:24, 22 February 2023 (UTC)
Hello, @ Johannes Schade, this is a message concerning an article you edited recently. After performing the move of MacCarthy Mor dynasty to MacCarthy dynasty and Mac Carthaigh Riabhach to MacCarthy Reagh, I encountered a problem moving McCarthy of Muskerry to MacCarthy of Muskerry. You can view more details here.
After researching what happened through the segmented history, it appears the article originally MacCarthy of Muskerry, but was moved to Mac Carthaigh Múscraige and moved to McCarthy of Muskerry by a user that was likely unaware of the implications of the title when moving the article back as per WP:UE. BurgeoningContracting ( talk) 03:43, 7 March 2023 (UTC)
Guild of Copy Editors March 2023 Newsletter
Election results: In our December 2022 coordinator election, Reidgreg and Tenryuu stepped down as coordinators; we thank them for their service. Incumbents Baffle gab1978, Dhtwiki, Miniapolis and Zippybonzo were returned as coordinators until 1 July. For the second time, no lead coordinator was chosen. Nominations for our mid-year Election of Coordinators open on 1 June (UTC). Drive: 21 editors signed up for our January Backlog Elimination Drive, 14 of whom claimed at least one copy-edit. Between them, they copy-edited 170 articles totaling 389,737 words. Barnstars awarded are here. Blitz: Our February Copy Editing Blitz focused on October and November 2022 requests, and the March and April 2022 backlogs. Of the 14 editors who signed up, nine claimed at least one copy-edit; and between them, they copy-edited 39,150 words in 22 articles. Barnstars awarded are here. Drive: Sign up now for our month-long March Backlog Elimination Drive. Barnstars awarded will be posted here after the drive closes. Progress report: As of 12:08, 19 March 2023 (UTC), GOCE copyeditors have processed 73 requests since 1 January 2023, all but five of them from 2022, and the backlog stands at 1,872 articles. Thank you all again for your participation; we wouldn't be able to achieve what we have without you! Cheers from your GOCE coordinators Baffle gab1978, Dhtwiki, Miniapolis and Zippybonzo. To discontinue receiving GOCE newsletters, please remove your name from
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Hello Johannes,
Thank you for undertaking the above. I will of course abide by your comments unless there is something or other that you have missed. As to the modest number of edits I have on the clock, I'm fairly sure that quite a number more were made before I created my account. There was also a period of some years when I wasn't active on Wikipedia at all. Anyhow, you've likely worked out that I am from broadly the same part of the world where you presently live. Regards Billsmith60 ( talk) 19:13, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
Hello Johannes, unfortunately an edit conflict occurred a few minutes ago when I was adding my observations to the two assessments you made yesterday (the Talk page, that is, not the article which has been updated). This caused the loss of everything I wrote in response to you. If I had copied the code first, I might have been able to salvage my comments, but the code changed to the latest version after your edit. Anyhow, I'll charge on and make today's changes as soon as possible (b tomorrow early afternoon) and will make all observations to you at the one time. All the best Billsmith60 ( talk) 13:11, 21 April 2023 (UTC)
Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Antoine Hamilton you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by ChristieBot, on behalf of Mike Christie -- Mike Christie ( talk) 14:02, 20 April 2023 (UTC)
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Hi Johannes Schade, do you remember we crossed paths editing Murrough O'Brien, 1st Earl of Inchiquin some time ago. I would now ask you for some help. I am not sure if you're interested in the O'Neill dynasty, but I've encountered a disruptive editor ('Queenmedb99') vandalising/edit warring two pages: McAleer and Branches of the Cenel nEoghain, with uncited nonsense relating to DNA, and I was wondering if you could lend a hand or help monitor those pages.
Thanks, Gaelicbow ( talk) 11:31, 9 May 2023 (UTC)
Hello Johannes, I just wanted to let you know that I've recently published an article on Alfred Verdross, where I applied most of the things you taught me during your outstanding review of my article on Hugo Krabbe. For me that experience was very useful and I am sure that the task of the next reviewer (I intend to nominate also Verdross for GA or FA) will be much lighter than yours because of what I learnt from you. Thanks, Gitz ( talk) ( contribs) 14:34, 12 May 2023 (UTC)
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Guild of Copy Editors June 2023 Newsletter
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Sent by Baffle gab1978 using MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 03:38, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
Hi, you have introduced a number of reference errors into James Hamilton (English army officer):
If you could fix these it would be appreciated. DuncanHill ( talk) 07:57, 17 June 2023 (UTC)
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It's been quite a while since we corresponded, so probably you will guess that I'm looking for a little help. I've been working on John Ogilby to get it up to GA standard but I approach it from an interest in cartography rather than as a historian. Given how long the queue for GA evaluation is, I would like to be sure that I don't fall at the first fence with silly errors. So if you can spare the time, please, could you give it a read over and point to any elements that need more work?
No obligation: if you can't afford the time then I'll ask elsewhere but I think it is in your period of historical interest? (1600-1676, including Ireland around 1641).
Best wishes. (The artist formerly known as user:John Maynard Friedman.) 𝕁𝕄𝔽 ( talk) 20:03, 12 August 2023 (UTC)
The August 2023 Good Article Nominations Backlog Drive is at the halfway mark, and has seen incredible progress, dropping the backlog from 638 to 359 unreviewed articles -- a 43.7% reduction in only fifteen days! But we still have over two weeks to go, and there are plenty of articles left to review:
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my story today |
Thank you for your patience regarding Rachel Yakar. In the meantime - see my story - Berit Lindholm died, and now also Robert Hale. I keep hoping that there will be a break eventually! -- Gerda Arendt ( talk) 19:26, 29 August 2023 (UTC)
After Lindholm became GA, and I updated Hale as far as I could I finally turned to Yakar again, translating the Diapason article completely. I took one sentence, but otherwise found that it would loose in translation, for example the one-word charactisations for roles such Fiordiligi. The detail about Poppea sounds better in French, and seems a bit undue weight. So, please check again. -- Gerda Arendt ( talk) 15:28, 4 September 2023 (UTC)
Guild of Copy Editors September 2023 Newsletter
Hello and welcome to the September 2023 newsletter, a quarterly digest of Guild activities since June. Don't forget you can unsubscribe at any time; see below. David Thomsen: Prolific Wikipedian and Guild member David Thomsen ( Dthomsen8) died in November 2022. He was a regular copy editor who took part in many of our Drives and Blitzes. An obituary was published in the mid-July issue of The Signpost. Tributes can be left on David's talk page. Election news: In our mid-year Election of Coordinators, Dhtwiki was chosen as lead coordinator, Miniapolis and Zippybonzo continue as assistant coordinators, and Baffle gab1978 stepped down from the role. If you're interested in helping out at the GOCE, please consider nominating yourself for our next election in December; it's your WikiProject and it doesn't organize itself! June Blitz: Of the 17 editors who signed up for our June Copy Editing Blitz, 12 copy-edited at least one article. 70,035 words comprising 26 articles were copy-edited. Barnstars awarded are here. July Drive: 34 of the 51 editors who took part in our July Backlog Elimination Drive copy-edited at least one article. They edited 276 articles and 683,633 words between them. Barnstars awarded are here. August Blitz: In our August Copy Editing Blitz, 13 of the 16 editors who signed up worked on at least one article. Between them, they copy-edited 79,608 words comprising 57 articles. Barnstars awarded are available here. September Drive: Sign up here for our month-long September Backlog Elimination Drive, which is now underway. Barnstars awarded will be posted here. Progress report: As of 14:29, 9 September 2023 (UTC), GOCE copy editors have processed 245 requests since 1 January. The backlog of tagged articles stands at 2,066. Thank you all again for your participation; we wouldn't be able to achieve what we have without you! Cheers from your GOCE coordinators, Dhtwiki, Miniapolis and Zippybonzo. To discontinue receiving GOCE newsletters, please remove your name from
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MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 13:55, 10 September 2023 (UTC)
my story today |
---|
Thank you for continuing the review. I hope you are well enough for such stress, and hope for good recovery! -- Gerda Arendt ( talk) 21:01, 23 September 2023 (UTC)
Hello Johannes, I hope you are well. I recently, by chance, came across your draft article for the Memoirs of Count Gramont. Do you have any intention of publishing the article at any stage? I think it would be valuable! A few weeks ago I started working on my own one, but it is not nearly as advanced or comprehensive as yours. KerryCommon ( talk) 18:14, 25 September 2023 (UTC)
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Guild of Copy Editors December 2023 Newsletter
Hello, and welcome to the December 2023 newsletter, a quarterly digest of Guild activities since September. Don't forget that you can unsubscribe at any time; see below. Election news: The Guild needs coordinators! If you'd like to help out, you may nominate yourself or any suitable editor—with their permission—for the Election of Coordinators for the first half of 2024. Nominations will close at 23:59 on 15 December (UTC). Voting begins immediately after the close of nominations and closes at 23:59 on 31 December. All editors in good standing (not under current sanctions) are eligible, and self-nominations are welcome. Coordinators normally serve a six-month term that ends at 23:59 on 30 June. Drive: Of the 69 editors who signed up for the September Backlog Elimination Drive, 40 copy-edited at least one article. Between them, they copy-edited 661,214 words in 290 articles. Barnstars awarded are listed here. Blitz: Of the 22 editors who signed up for the October Copy Editing Blitz, 13 copy-edited at least one article. Between them, they copy-edited 109,327 words in 52 articles. Barnstars awarded are listed here. Drive: During the November Backlog Elimination Drive, 38 of the 58 editors who signed up copy-edited at least one article. Between them, they copy-edited 458,620 words in 234 articles. Barnstars awarded are listed here. Blitz: Our December Copy Editing Blitz will run from 10 to 16 December. Barnstars awarded will be posted here. Progress report: As of 20:33, 10 December 2023 (UTC), GOCE copyeditors have processed 344 requests since 1 January, and the backlog stands at 2,191 articles. Other news: Our Annual Report for 2023 is planned for release in the new year. Thank you all again for your participation; we wouldn't be able to achieve what we have without you! Cheers from your GOCE coordinators Dhtwiki, Miniapolis and Zippybonzo. To discontinue receiving GOCE newsletters, please remove your name from
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Message sent by Baffle gab1978 using MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 20:53, 10 December 2023 (UTC)
Happy New Year! | ||
Wishing you and yours a Happy New Year, from the horse and bishop person. May the year ahead be productive and distraction-free and may Janus light your way. Ealdgyth ( talk) 14:37, 31 December 2023 (UTC) |
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Guild of Copy Editors 2023 Annual Report
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Thanks for all the feedback at H:SFN. Always good to get a broader perspective and I imagine it took some time to provide the really detailed explanations. Regards, Rjjiii ( talk) 20:40, 5 April 2024 (UTC) |
Guild of Copy Editors April 2024 Newsletter
Hello and welcome to the April 2024 newsletter, a quarterly digest of Guild activities since December. Don't forget you can unsubscribe at any time; see below. We extend a warm welcome to all of our new members. We wish you all happy copy-editing. Election results: In our December 2023 coordinator election, Zippybonzo stepped down as coordinator; we thank them for their service. Incumbents Dhtwiki and Miniapolis were reelected coordinators, and Wracking was newly elected coordinator, to serve through 30 June. Nominations for our mid-year Election of Coordinators will open on 1 June (UTC). Drive: 46 editors signed up for our January Backlog Elimination Drive, 32 of whom claimed at least one copy-edit. Between them, they copy-edited 289 articles totaling 626,729 words. Barnstars awarded are here. Blitz: 23 editors signed up for our February Copy Editing Blitz. 18 claimed at least one copy-edit and between them, they copy-edited 100,293 words in 32 articles. Barnstars awarded are here. Drive: 53 editors signed up for our March Backlog Elimination Drive, 34 of whom claimed at least one copy-edit. Between them, they copy-edited 300 articles totaling 587,828 words. Barnstars awarded are here. Blitz: Sign up for our April Copy Editing Blitz, which runs from 14 to 20 April. Barnstars will be awarded here. Progress report: As of 23:17, 11 April 2024 (UTC), GOCE copyeditors have processed 109 requests since 1 January 2024, and the backlog stands at 2,480 articles. Thank you all again for your participation; we wouldn't be able to achieve what we have without you! Cheers from Baffle gab1978 and your GOCE coordinators Dhtwiki, Miniapolis and Wracking. To discontinue receiving GOCE newsletters, please remove your name from
our mailing list.
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