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Thanks for calling my attention to this. You're correct in your assumption that I'd be interested, but as I'm more of a track-and-structures person, I haven't noticed or studied this mechanism in any detail. Please share photos! Elizabeth Linden Rahway ( talk) 14:29, 5 December 2020 (UTC)
Hi Choess, over on /info/en/?search=Talk:High_Sheriff_of_Devon#New_style_or_old_style_years_before_1752? I am seeking some advice on dating issues - in particular around the use of old style or new style dates before 1752. I would welcome your thoughts over there if you have time to comment. NHSavage ( talk) 09:38, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
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The article Baldwin, Pennsylvania (disambiguation) has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:
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Hog Farm
Bacon 02:38, 8 January 2021 (UTC)
I'm relatively new to the plants wikiproject. It's possible I don't know what I'm doing, or that I do but people won't give me credit for knowing what I'm doing. Time will tell I guess. I've written a bunch of ideas down but I won't dump them all at once ... I'm trying to think of whether there's a compromise that will preserve most of the 4-page list and not require reviewers to cover the same ground again ... I can't afford to piss them off. Thinking. - Dank ( push to talk) 01:04, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- @ Dank: I still feel a bit muddled trying to understand the list criteria here. OK, so listing all plant genera, or even all vascular plant genera, with etymologies, is an enormous job, and it makes sense to bite off a smaller piece of work. But the way that list has been pared down is to make a somewhat arbitrary choice of source. It feels a bit like the list was constructed first to make it "FL-able", and only secondarily to answer a natural question from a reader. If the scope of the list were limited to cultivated plant genera, do you think that would be manageable? It sounds like Stearn attempts to be comprehensive, so further additions would probably be manageable, and "What are all the genera of plants in cultivation?" seems like a more natural question to ask than "What are all the genera of plants listed in Stearn's?" (By contrast, "What are all the genera of plants named after people?", which you're also working on answering, seems like a natural and reasonable question.)
- I'd be happy to act as a sounding board for further ideas. Extracting data from print sources and organizing it, as you're doing, is the lifeblood of Wikipedia, and we have far too few people doing that in comparison with other ancillary activities. I would hate to see you discouraged from doing so.
Choess (
talk) 02:39, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- That sounds very encouraging, and is largely in line with my thinking. It's late ... I'm going to beaver away at something gnomish and give you an answer tomorrow. - Dank ( push to talk) 02:55, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Suppose you could have any one sublist of genera you want, updated annually. Would it be "all genera in cultivation"? Something else? And if you know, where would we pull the list from? - Dank (
push to talk) 03:32, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Well, personally, I'd like a list of fern genera, but that's my personal itch and I'd be the one maintaining it anyway. (Still waiting for
Mineirella to hit IPNI, but I'm sure they're still recovering from the COVID furloughs.) That may not be the best one to suggest, in part because there are differences of opinion between POWO and much of the fern community. But "all genera in cultivation" sounds like a reasonable list, and maybe the current 4-part list could be transformed into that without losing too much of its current character.
- Looking at
pykew, it looks like a bot could poll POWO occasionally for names "added" since the last run, which presumably would generate a list of newly recognized genera, but I don't have the programming chops to implement that. I wonder if that would be a good addition to a Plants project page somewhere? Might encourage people to crank out stubs on genera as they're published/recognized.
Choess (
talk) 03:54, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- I'm not seeing a "cultivation" parameter at pykew ... do you know where i could get a list of genera that are in some sense in cultivation? - Dank (
push to talk) 03:59, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oh, sorry. My idea behind using pykew is that you'd be able to pull up new additions to the database–it would be a tool for keeping up with newly added genera of any sort. Is Stearn's meant to be comprehensive? That was why I suggested "in cultivation" as a criterion; it should track pretty closely with the existing lists, but it might accumulate some additional genera that were missed from things like the Fern Grower's Manual sitting next to me. Do you need an existing comprehensive source so that the list can pass FL without questions as to whether it is, in fact, complete? That might be troublesome.
Choess (
talk) 04:13, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Roughly speaking, my answer to that question is that the plants project can choose whatever criteria they want and whatever source they want, and I'll work with that. But see
User talk:PresN#Lists that change annually. What I'm looking for at the moment is to understand your idea of what "genera currently in cultivation" looks like, so I can compare it to the Stearn lists. Btw, I've decided: after the project has selected what new series of lists they want and that series has been promoted at FL, then you guys can do whatever you like with the Stearn list ... burn it to the ground, de-feature it, rename it, tweak it, or keep it as is, I don't care. (Added: I don't care because I think it's likely that if a new FL succeeds with heavy overlap with the Stearn list, then any confusion or conflict over the Stearn list is likely to be cleared up, and it probably won't matter what we do with it.) Also, I need to mention one constraint: some of what I'm doing with my current (probably four-part) list at FLC is done best if I do it from memory, so I have to at least finish writing those four lists before I can work on a new list. Won't take more than 3 weeks, I think, then I can work on something else, but they might not be promoted for 2 months (or never). - Dank (
push to talk) 15:25, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- I guess I thought "genera currently in cultivation" was sort of self-explanatory--if I had a list in hand, I'd put it in the article! I guess I'd say to make it manageable, accepted genera should be added to the list only when they come from some sort of tertiary reference or catalog of cultivated taxa like Stearn's. That would avoid getting entries shoved in on the basis of anecdote or one-off reports of cultivation. Hopefully that wouldn't add very much to the current lists but I don't know.
Choess (
talk) 02:17, 2 April 2021 (UTC)
- Okay, can you suggest a next step here? - Dank ( push to talk) 03:00, 2 April 2021 (UTC)
- I've asked for feedback in the current thread at WT:PLANTS#List of plant genus names. - Dank ( push to talk) 13:24, 2 April 2021 (UTC)
- I guess I thought "genera currently in cultivation" was sort of self-explanatory--if I had a list in hand, I'd put it in the article! I guess I'd say to make it manageable, accepted genera should be added to the list only when they come from some sort of tertiary reference or catalog of cultivated taxa like Stearn's. That would avoid getting entries shoved in on the basis of anecdote or one-off reports of cultivation. Hopefully that wouldn't add very much to the current lists but I don't know.
Choess (
talk) 02:17, 2 April 2021 (UTC)
- Roughly speaking, my answer to that question is that the plants project can choose whatever criteria they want and whatever source they want, and I'll work with that. But see
User talk:PresN#Lists that change annually. What I'm looking for at the moment is to understand your idea of what "genera currently in cultivation" looks like, so I can compare it to the Stearn lists. Btw, I've decided: after the project has selected what new series of lists they want and that series has been promoted at FL, then you guys can do whatever you like with the Stearn list ... burn it to the ground, de-feature it, rename it, tweak it, or keep it as is, I don't care. (Added: I don't care because I think it's likely that if a new FL succeeds with heavy overlap with the Stearn list, then any confusion or conflict over the Stearn list is likely to be cleared up, and it probably won't matter what we do with it.) Also, I need to mention one constraint: some of what I'm doing with my current (probably four-part) list at FLC is done best if I do it from memory, so I have to at least finish writing those four lists before I can work on a new list. Won't take more than 3 weeks, I think, then I can work on something else, but they might not be promoted for 2 months (or never). - Dank (
push to talk) 15:25, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oh, sorry. My idea behind using pykew is that you'd be able to pull up new additions to the database–it would be a tool for keeping up with newly added genera of any sort. Is Stearn's meant to be comprehensive? That was why I suggested "in cultivation" as a criterion; it should track pretty closely with the existing lists, but it might accumulate some additional genera that were missed from things like the Fern Grower's Manual sitting next to me. Do you need an existing comprehensive source so that the list can pass FL without questions as to whether it is, in fact, complete? That might be troublesome.
Choess (
talk) 04:13, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- My quick look at the APIs at Kew suggests the added and modified fields/properties are part of ipni API rather than powo API. I don't think this would help track changes to the POWO lists. — Jts1882 | talk 19:27, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- I'm not seeing a "cultivation" parameter at pykew ... do you know where i could get a list of genera that are in some sense in cultivation? - Dank (
push to talk) 03:59, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Looking at
pykew, it looks like a bot could poll POWO occasionally for names "added" since the last run, which presumably would generate a list of newly recognized genera, but I don't have the programming chops to implement that. I wonder if that would be a good addition to a Plants project page somewhere? Might encourage people to crank out stubs on genera as they're published/recognized.
Choess (
talk) 03:54, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Well, personally, I'd like a list of fern genera, but that's my personal itch and I'd be the one maintaining it anyway. (Still waiting for
Mineirella to hit IPNI, but I'm sure they're still recovering from the COVID furloughs.) That may not be the best one to suggest, in part because there are differences of opinion between POWO and much of the fern community. But "all genera in cultivation" sounds like a reasonable list, and maybe the current 4-part list could be transformed into that without losing too much of its current character.
Hello Choess,
I noticed you have added material about Otto Kuntze's rejection of the name Banksia to five articles. There are 181 articles about Banksia species and 70 or so about their subspecies. I was wondering if you intended to add the same information to all 250-odd of those articles or if not, on what basis did you choose the five (so far)? Gderrin ( talk) 21:27, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
@ Gderrin: I was originally doing a little FAR-inspired cleanup on Banksia aemula, and noticed that section was somewhat thinly sourced. I dug up the references and did some wordsmithing ("challenged" made it sound like a judicial duel to me) and wound up with what you see. I copied it to a few articles at the head of the alphabet and then paused, realizing I should get the wording just right before deploying it in bulk. Let me think a little about the wording and I'll drop a notice on the WikiProject Banksia page. I think there will be about 47 pages where this applies (including the page on the genus). Choess ( talk) 21:47, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Thanks for your quick response! My feeling is that adding information about the name of a genus to every species in that genus is not really appropriate, especially since in this case, about half of the species (95?) of Banksia were previously dryandras until 2007. Seems a bit like "padding" in an exam response - making an answer look impressive because it's long. Gderrin ( talk) 22:15, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
Choess, Casliber suggested I ask you if you would be willing to do the GAN review for Symphyotrichum lateriflorum. I tagged you in the talk page. I am readily available to interact during the review process, and look forward to input. -- Eewilson ( talk) 03:22, 8 April 2021 (UTC)
Have a very happy first edit anniversary!
From the Birthday Committee, CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 14:45, 22 April 2021 (UTC)
Hi Choess. I hope you are doing well and staying safe during these times! Apologize to bother and posting a random request. I have just started to work on a stub ( Fontainea Venosa)and had added some sections. I am trying my best to get the article to B class hopefully. Knowing your expertise, I would love if you can help me to review and left a comment on what I can do to improve my edits. I hope that this is okay, but no pressure if you are busy. That is completely fine and understandable :) Hope to hear from you soon. The article is Fontainea Venosa
Thank you so much :) Sparklingkull ( talk) 04:08, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
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 | Happy First Edit Day! Hi Choess! On behalf of the Birthday Committee, I'd like to wish you a very happy 17th anniversary of the day you made your first edit and became a Wikipedian! Chris Troutman ( talk) 19:39, 22 April 2022 (UTC) |
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I have nominated Adiantum viridimontanum to be today's featured article on an unspecified date. As the article's FAC nominator, you are invited to its TFA nomination page to comment on its suitability. Thanks and happy editing. Z1720 ( talk) 19:25, 16 August 2022 (UTC)
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Nomination of Sebastian Browne, 12th Marquess of Sligo for deletion
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Pilaz ( talk) 00:22, 6 September 2022 (UTC)
Dear Choess. Long not heard from you. I hope you are fine and still enjoying Wikipedia. I am looking at the article Donogh O'Brien, 4th Earl of Thomond I find that it was you who added, on 29 July 2010 [1], the mention "descended by acceleraton" to the 2nd row (the one for Baron Ibrickan) of the succession box. It is the only mention of this acceleration in the article. On what did you base it? Best regards, Johannes Schade ( talk) 15:12, 6 September 2022 (UTC)
Adiantum viridimontanum scheduled for TFA
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Thank you today for the article, introduced (in 2011): "I am nominating this for featured article because I feel that it completely and accurately discusses this rare fern. I am confident that I have addressed all relevant literature. The article was recently passed as a good article by Ucucha, who opined that it might well go forward to FAC. Most sources are peer-reviewed botanical literature, as well as an information sheet published by a reputable botanical organization. The photograph of A. viridimontanum was taken by me at one of the sites described by Zika & Dann (1985), so I'm fairly confident it has the correct species."! - I like to have the pictured DYK on the same page ;) -- Gerda Arendt ( talk) 08:05, 13 October 2022 (UTC)
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Hi Choess, I am not so much into the latin language and the scientific classification terms and I believe most aren't either. There is no explanation to the latin scientific terms and I believe a tag is needed. What kind of tag would you suggest? Lead to short ok for you?
Paradise Chronicle ( talk) 04:43, 26 April 2023 (UTC)
- @ Paradise Chronicle: While I do not think these stubs are very useful, I don't think they need to be tagged as anything other than stubs (which implies that they need to be expanded). I have seen many of them created by others and do not remember seeing them get tagged as "Technical", "Lead too short", etc., so I think most people are not very much bothered by them. When I look at Oxyrhopus erdisii, I do not necessarily know how to interpret the Latin name and all the information in the taxobox, but I know that is there because of the requirements of binominal nomenclature and Linnaean taxonomy. Reading on I learn that it is a snake and it comes from Peru. That is not very much, but the article is after all a stub.
- Out of curiosity, do you feel that an article like
methyl isoeugenol also needs tagging of this kind? I am trying to understand why you want to tag stubs about species especially. If I knew how you felt about other articles that are technical and not very informative to most readers, I might understand better.
Choess (
talk) 05:21, 26 April 2023 (UTC)
- Well, bothered is now a big word. But I see the stub can be expanded, I believe very few people recommend reading a wikipedia article after having read a stub like this. And the chance it gets expanded rises if tagged. Then a project that focuses on expansion (of lead, of body etc.) can consider it. For many fields Wikipedia has become the reference per se, the first to be consulted and the first recommended one if you look for it online which most people do now. Also, if you check the source, you'll see that there is a lot of (also interesting) information more to be added. For any backlog drive for expansion the stub would be an easy prey. At least National Geographic and Yale University are two wls that could be added to the article. The article could be better integrated within wikipedia. The same I have observed also in other species stubs.
- And concerning your creation, I also believe some sort of tag would help. It says even less to me than the one on the snake.:)
Paradise Chronicle (
talk) 07:29, 27 April 2023 (UTC)
- @ Paradise Chronicle: I'm sorry, that wasn't meant to be a trap! I had that as an example of a relatively technical article, and I forgot that I wrote it, probably to fill a redlink years ago. My overall point was that articles on very narrow, specialized subjects are often rather technical, because only people with some background will want to look up that specific subject. Wikipedia:Writing better articles#Provide context for the reader suggests this (in my opinion): "An article entitled 'Use of chromatic scales in early Baroque music' is likely to be read by musicians, and technical details and terms are appropriate, linking to articles explaining the technical terms. On the other hand, an article entitled 'Baroque music' is likely to be read by laypersons who want a brief and plainly written overview, with links to available detailed information." To give other examples, when I look at Esculenta's articles (which I don't believe were created by AI, although I haven't dug extremely deeply to check), I think they tell you more or less all there is to know about that species of lichen—and yet I would have to get out my big lichen book and look up a certain amount of vocabulary to get a good picture in my mind of what the article is talking about. Math articles are similar (to me): some of them are not really comprehensible to me, but there is not much that can be done for the lay reader without repeating a textbook's worth of background in each article. For stubs like the snake and the chemical, they might be more accessible if someone expanded them and wrote a good lead, but by definition stubs are waiting to be expanded just like that. I don't think adding another tag would make the stubs get expanded faster; everyone knows that there are many, many stubs that need to get expanded, but doing that is a lot of work and few people are capable of doing it for any one subject area.
- To give another example from my writing, I do like to produce full articles rather than stubs when I write about species. Argyrochosma jonesii is a recent one. It probably cannot be expanded much further at all. For someone who is not obsessed about ferns, much of the article is probably not very understandable: hopefully the lead is useful, and for this one I could get photos, which (even to me) are much more explanatory. But for someone familiar with ferns, I think the article is very useful, because they can read it carefully and distinguish it from similar species.
- In general, I think all of us will find stubs in unfamiliar subject areas more confusing and uninformative than stubs in familiar subject areas, but I'm not sure additional tagging helps with the underlying problem (we need many editors who understand subjects well enough to write informative articles). Choess ( talk) 13:38, 29 April 2023 (UTC)
Just wanted to note I saw all the recent botany stub sorting you did and appreciate that. Steven Walling • talk 04:45, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
Nomination of List of eldest sons of earls in the peerages of Britain and Ireland for deletion
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GoldenBootWizard276 ( talk) 06:01, 7 November 2023 (UTC)
Ten years ago, you were found precious. That's what you are, always. -- Gerda Arendt ( talk) 08:43, 27 November 2023 (UTC)
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| Happy First Edit Day! Hi Choess! On behalf of the Birthday Committee, I'd like to wish you a very happy anniversary of the day you made your first edit and became a Wikipedian! The Herald (Benison) ( talk) 02:35, 22 April 2024 (UTC) |
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Thanks for calling my attention to this. You're correct in your assumption that I'd be interested, but as I'm more of a track-and-structures person, I haven't noticed or studied this mechanism in any detail. Please share photos! Elizabeth Linden Rahway ( talk) 14:29, 5 December 2020 (UTC)
Hi Choess, over on /info/en/?search=Talk:High_Sheriff_of_Devon#New_style_or_old_style_years_before_1752? I am seeking some advice on dating issues - in particular around the use of old style or new style dates before 1752. I would welcome your thoughts over there if you have time to comment. NHSavage ( talk) 09:38, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
Your submission at Articles for creation: Metasequoia heerii has been accepted
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Calliopejen1 ( talk) 22:23, 30 December 2020 (UTC)|
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The article Baldwin, Pennsylvania (disambiguation) has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:
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Hog Farm
Bacon 02:38, 8 January 2021 (UTC)
I'm relatively new to the plants wikiproject. It's possible I don't know what I'm doing, or that I do but people won't give me credit for knowing what I'm doing. Time will tell I guess. I've written a bunch of ideas down but I won't dump them all at once ... I'm trying to think of whether there's a compromise that will preserve most of the 4-page list and not require reviewers to cover the same ground again ... I can't afford to piss them off. Thinking. - Dank ( push to talk) 01:04, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- @ Dank: I still feel a bit muddled trying to understand the list criteria here. OK, so listing all plant genera, or even all vascular plant genera, with etymologies, is an enormous job, and it makes sense to bite off a smaller piece of work. But the way that list has been pared down is to make a somewhat arbitrary choice of source. It feels a bit like the list was constructed first to make it "FL-able", and only secondarily to answer a natural question from a reader. If the scope of the list were limited to cultivated plant genera, do you think that would be manageable? It sounds like Stearn attempts to be comprehensive, so further additions would probably be manageable, and "What are all the genera of plants in cultivation?" seems like a more natural question to ask than "What are all the genera of plants listed in Stearn's?" (By contrast, "What are all the genera of plants named after people?", which you're also working on answering, seems like a natural and reasonable question.)
- I'd be happy to act as a sounding board for further ideas. Extracting data from print sources and organizing it, as you're doing, is the lifeblood of Wikipedia, and we have far too few people doing that in comparison with other ancillary activities. I would hate to see you discouraged from doing so.
Choess (
talk) 02:39, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- That sounds very encouraging, and is largely in line with my thinking. It's late ... I'm going to beaver away at something gnomish and give you an answer tomorrow. - Dank ( push to talk) 02:55, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Suppose you could have any one sublist of genera you want, updated annually. Would it be "all genera in cultivation"? Something else? And if you know, where would we pull the list from? - Dank (
push to talk) 03:32, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Well, personally, I'd like a list of fern genera, but that's my personal itch and I'd be the one maintaining it anyway. (Still waiting for
Mineirella to hit IPNI, but I'm sure they're still recovering from the COVID furloughs.) That may not be the best one to suggest, in part because there are differences of opinion between POWO and much of the fern community. But "all genera in cultivation" sounds like a reasonable list, and maybe the current 4-part list could be transformed into that without losing too much of its current character.
- Looking at
pykew, it looks like a bot could poll POWO occasionally for names "added" since the last run, which presumably would generate a list of newly recognized genera, but I don't have the programming chops to implement that. I wonder if that would be a good addition to a Plants project page somewhere? Might encourage people to crank out stubs on genera as they're published/recognized.
Choess (
talk) 03:54, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- I'm not seeing a "cultivation" parameter at pykew ... do you know where i could get a list of genera that are in some sense in cultivation? - Dank (
push to talk) 03:59, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oh, sorry. My idea behind using pykew is that you'd be able to pull up new additions to the database–it would be a tool for keeping up with newly added genera of any sort. Is Stearn's meant to be comprehensive? That was why I suggested "in cultivation" as a criterion; it should track pretty closely with the existing lists, but it might accumulate some additional genera that were missed from things like the Fern Grower's Manual sitting next to me. Do you need an existing comprehensive source so that the list can pass FL without questions as to whether it is, in fact, complete? That might be troublesome.
Choess (
talk) 04:13, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Roughly speaking, my answer to that question is that the plants project can choose whatever criteria they want and whatever source they want, and I'll work with that. But see
User talk:PresN#Lists that change annually. What I'm looking for at the moment is to understand your idea of what "genera currently in cultivation" looks like, so I can compare it to the Stearn lists. Btw, I've decided: after the project has selected what new series of lists they want and that series has been promoted at FL, then you guys can do whatever you like with the Stearn list ... burn it to the ground, de-feature it, rename it, tweak it, or keep it as is, I don't care. (Added: I don't care because I think it's likely that if a new FL succeeds with heavy overlap with the Stearn list, then any confusion or conflict over the Stearn list is likely to be cleared up, and it probably won't matter what we do with it.) Also, I need to mention one constraint: some of what I'm doing with my current (probably four-part) list at FLC is done best if I do it from memory, so I have to at least finish writing those four lists before I can work on a new list. Won't take more than 3 weeks, I think, then I can work on something else, but they might not be promoted for 2 months (or never). - Dank (
push to talk) 15:25, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- I guess I thought "genera currently in cultivation" was sort of self-explanatory--if I had a list in hand, I'd put it in the article! I guess I'd say to make it manageable, accepted genera should be added to the list only when they come from some sort of tertiary reference or catalog of cultivated taxa like Stearn's. That would avoid getting entries shoved in on the basis of anecdote or one-off reports of cultivation. Hopefully that wouldn't add very much to the current lists but I don't know.
Choess (
talk) 02:17, 2 April 2021 (UTC)
- Okay, can you suggest a next step here? - Dank ( push to talk) 03:00, 2 April 2021 (UTC)
- I've asked for feedback in the current thread at WT:PLANTS#List of plant genus names. - Dank ( push to talk) 13:24, 2 April 2021 (UTC)
- I guess I thought "genera currently in cultivation" was sort of self-explanatory--if I had a list in hand, I'd put it in the article! I guess I'd say to make it manageable, accepted genera should be added to the list only when they come from some sort of tertiary reference or catalog of cultivated taxa like Stearn's. That would avoid getting entries shoved in on the basis of anecdote or one-off reports of cultivation. Hopefully that wouldn't add very much to the current lists but I don't know.
Choess (
talk) 02:17, 2 April 2021 (UTC)
- Roughly speaking, my answer to that question is that the plants project can choose whatever criteria they want and whatever source they want, and I'll work with that. But see
User talk:PresN#Lists that change annually. What I'm looking for at the moment is to understand your idea of what "genera currently in cultivation" looks like, so I can compare it to the Stearn lists. Btw, I've decided: after the project has selected what new series of lists they want and that series has been promoted at FL, then you guys can do whatever you like with the Stearn list ... burn it to the ground, de-feature it, rename it, tweak it, or keep it as is, I don't care. (Added: I don't care because I think it's likely that if a new FL succeeds with heavy overlap with the Stearn list, then any confusion or conflict over the Stearn list is likely to be cleared up, and it probably won't matter what we do with it.) Also, I need to mention one constraint: some of what I'm doing with my current (probably four-part) list at FLC is done best if I do it from memory, so I have to at least finish writing those four lists before I can work on a new list. Won't take more than 3 weeks, I think, then I can work on something else, but they might not be promoted for 2 months (or never). - Dank (
push to talk) 15:25, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Oh, sorry. My idea behind using pykew is that you'd be able to pull up new additions to the database–it would be a tool for keeping up with newly added genera of any sort. Is Stearn's meant to be comprehensive? That was why I suggested "in cultivation" as a criterion; it should track pretty closely with the existing lists, but it might accumulate some additional genera that were missed from things like the Fern Grower's Manual sitting next to me. Do you need an existing comprehensive source so that the list can pass FL without questions as to whether it is, in fact, complete? That might be troublesome.
Choess (
talk) 04:13, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- My quick look at the APIs at Kew suggests the added and modified fields/properties are part of ipni API rather than powo API. I don't think this would help track changes to the POWO lists. — Jts1882 | talk 19:27, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- I'm not seeing a "cultivation" parameter at pykew ... do you know where i could get a list of genera that are in some sense in cultivation? - Dank (
push to talk) 03:59, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Looking at
pykew, it looks like a bot could poll POWO occasionally for names "added" since the last run, which presumably would generate a list of newly recognized genera, but I don't have the programming chops to implement that. I wonder if that would be a good addition to a Plants project page somewhere? Might encourage people to crank out stubs on genera as they're published/recognized.
Choess (
talk) 03:54, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Well, personally, I'd like a list of fern genera, but that's my personal itch and I'd be the one maintaining it anyway. (Still waiting for
Mineirella to hit IPNI, but I'm sure they're still recovering from the COVID furloughs.) That may not be the best one to suggest, in part because there are differences of opinion between POWO and much of the fern community. But "all genera in cultivation" sounds like a reasonable list, and maybe the current 4-part list could be transformed into that without losing too much of its current character.
Hello Choess,
I noticed you have added material about Otto Kuntze's rejection of the name Banksia to five articles. There are 181 articles about Banksia species and 70 or so about their subspecies. I was wondering if you intended to add the same information to all 250-odd of those articles or if not, on what basis did you choose the five (so far)? Gderrin ( talk) 21:27, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
@ Gderrin: I was originally doing a little FAR-inspired cleanup on Banksia aemula, and noticed that section was somewhat thinly sourced. I dug up the references and did some wordsmithing ("challenged" made it sound like a judicial duel to me) and wound up with what you see. I copied it to a few articles at the head of the alphabet and then paused, realizing I should get the wording just right before deploying it in bulk. Let me think a little about the wording and I'll drop a notice on the WikiProject Banksia page. I think there will be about 47 pages where this applies (including the page on the genus). Choess ( talk) 21:47, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
- Thanks for your quick response! My feeling is that adding information about the name of a genus to every species in that genus is not really appropriate, especially since in this case, about half of the species (95?) of Banksia were previously dryandras until 2007. Seems a bit like "padding" in an exam response - making an answer look impressive because it's long. Gderrin ( talk) 22:15, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
Choess, Casliber suggested I ask you if you would be willing to do the GAN review for Symphyotrichum lateriflorum. I tagged you in the talk page. I am readily available to interact during the review process, and look forward to input. -- Eewilson ( talk) 03:22, 8 April 2021 (UTC)
Have a very happy first edit anniversary!
From the Birthday Committee, CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 14:45, 22 April 2021 (UTC)
Hi Choess. I hope you are doing well and staying safe during these times! Apologize to bother and posting a random request. I have just started to work on a stub ( Fontainea Venosa)and had added some sections. I am trying my best to get the article to B class hopefully. Knowing your expertise, I would love if you can help me to review and left a comment on what I can do to improve my edits. I hope that this is okay, but no pressure if you are busy. That is completely fine and understandable :) Hope to hear from you soon. The article is Fontainea Venosa
Thank you so much :) Sparklingkull ( talk) 04:08, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
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I have nominated Adiantum viridimontanum to be today's featured article on an unspecified date. As the article's FAC nominator, you are invited to its TFA nomination page to comment on its suitability. Thanks and happy editing. Z1720 ( talk) 19:25, 16 August 2022 (UTC)
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Nomination of Sebastian Browne, 12th Marquess of Sligo for deletion
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Pilaz ( talk) 00:22, 6 September 2022 (UTC)
Dear Choess. Long not heard from you. I hope you are fine and still enjoying Wikipedia. I am looking at the article Donogh O'Brien, 4th Earl of Thomond I find that it was you who added, on 29 July 2010 [1], the mention "descended by acceleraton" to the 2nd row (the one for Baron Ibrickan) of the succession box. It is the only mention of this acceleration in the article. On what did you base it? Best regards, Johannes Schade ( talk) 15:12, 6 September 2022 (UTC)
Adiantum viridimontanum scheduled for TFA
This is to let you know that the Adiantum viridimontanum article has been scheduled as today's featured article for October 13, 2022. Please check the article needs no amendments. If you're interested in editing the main page text, you're welcome to do so at Wikipedia:Today's featured article/October 13, 2022, but note that a coordinator will trim the lead to around 1000 characters anyway, so you aren't obliged to do so.
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We suggest that you watchlist Wikipedia:Main Page/Errors from the day before this appears on Main Page. Thanks! Jimfbleak - talk to me? 12:49, 10 September 2022 (UTC)
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Thank you today for the article, introduced (in 2011): "I am nominating this for featured article because I feel that it completely and accurately discusses this rare fern. I am confident that I have addressed all relevant literature. The article was recently passed as a good article by Ucucha, who opined that it might well go forward to FAC. Most sources are peer-reviewed botanical literature, as well as an information sheet published by a reputable botanical organization. The photograph of A. viridimontanum was taken by me at one of the sites described by Zika & Dann (1985), so I'm fairly confident it has the correct species."! - I like to have the pictured DYK on the same page ;) -- Gerda Arendt ( talk) 08:05, 13 October 2022 (UTC)
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Hi Choess, I am not so much into the latin language and the scientific classification terms and I believe most aren't either. There is no explanation to the latin scientific terms and I believe a tag is needed. What kind of tag would you suggest? Lead to short ok for you?
Paradise Chronicle ( talk) 04:43, 26 April 2023 (UTC)
- @ Paradise Chronicle: While I do not think these stubs are very useful, I don't think they need to be tagged as anything other than stubs (which implies that they need to be expanded). I have seen many of them created by others and do not remember seeing them get tagged as "Technical", "Lead too short", etc., so I think most people are not very much bothered by them. When I look at Oxyrhopus erdisii, I do not necessarily know how to interpret the Latin name and all the information in the taxobox, but I know that is there because of the requirements of binominal nomenclature and Linnaean taxonomy. Reading on I learn that it is a snake and it comes from Peru. That is not very much, but the article is after all a stub.
- Out of curiosity, do you feel that an article like
methyl isoeugenol also needs tagging of this kind? I am trying to understand why you want to tag stubs about species especially. If I knew how you felt about other articles that are technical and not very informative to most readers, I might understand better.
Choess (
talk) 05:21, 26 April 2023 (UTC)
- Well, bothered is now a big word. But I see the stub can be expanded, I believe very few people recommend reading a wikipedia article after having read a stub like this. And the chance it gets expanded rises if tagged. Then a project that focuses on expansion (of lead, of body etc.) can consider it. For many fields Wikipedia has become the reference per se, the first to be consulted and the first recommended one if you look for it online which most people do now. Also, if you check the source, you'll see that there is a lot of (also interesting) information more to be added. For any backlog drive for expansion the stub would be an easy prey. At least National Geographic and Yale University are two wls that could be added to the article. The article could be better integrated within wikipedia. The same I have observed also in other species stubs.
- And concerning your creation, I also believe some sort of tag would help. It says even less to me than the one on the snake.:)
Paradise Chronicle (
talk) 07:29, 27 April 2023 (UTC)
- @ Paradise Chronicle: I'm sorry, that wasn't meant to be a trap! I had that as an example of a relatively technical article, and I forgot that I wrote it, probably to fill a redlink years ago. My overall point was that articles on very narrow, specialized subjects are often rather technical, because only people with some background will want to look up that specific subject. Wikipedia:Writing better articles#Provide context for the reader suggests this (in my opinion): "An article entitled 'Use of chromatic scales in early Baroque music' is likely to be read by musicians, and technical details and terms are appropriate, linking to articles explaining the technical terms. On the other hand, an article entitled 'Baroque music' is likely to be read by laypersons who want a brief and plainly written overview, with links to available detailed information." To give other examples, when I look at Esculenta's articles (which I don't believe were created by AI, although I haven't dug extremely deeply to check), I think they tell you more or less all there is to know about that species of lichen—and yet I would have to get out my big lichen book and look up a certain amount of vocabulary to get a good picture in my mind of what the article is talking about. Math articles are similar (to me): some of them are not really comprehensible to me, but there is not much that can be done for the lay reader without repeating a textbook's worth of background in each article. For stubs like the snake and the chemical, they might be more accessible if someone expanded them and wrote a good lead, but by definition stubs are waiting to be expanded just like that. I don't think adding another tag would make the stubs get expanded faster; everyone knows that there are many, many stubs that need to get expanded, but doing that is a lot of work and few people are capable of doing it for any one subject area.
- To give another example from my writing, I do like to produce full articles rather than stubs when I write about species. Argyrochosma jonesii is a recent one. It probably cannot be expanded much further at all. For someone who is not obsessed about ferns, much of the article is probably not very understandable: hopefully the lead is useful, and for this one I could get photos, which (even to me) are much more explanatory. But for someone familiar with ferns, I think the article is very useful, because they can read it carefully and distinguish it from similar species.
- In general, I think all of us will find stubs in unfamiliar subject areas more confusing and uninformative than stubs in familiar subject areas, but I'm not sure additional tagging helps with the underlying problem (we need many editors who understand subjects well enough to write informative articles). Choess ( talk) 13:38, 29 April 2023 (UTC)
Just wanted to note I saw all the recent botany stub sorting you did and appreciate that. Steven Walling • talk 04:45, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
Nomination of List of eldest sons of earls in the peerages of Britain and Ireland for deletion
The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of eldest sons of earls in the peerages of Britain and Ireland until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.
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GoldenBootWizard276 ( talk) 06:01, 7 November 2023 (UTC)
Ten years ago, you were found precious. That's what you are, always. -- Gerda Arendt ( talk) 08:43, 27 November 2023 (UTC)
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| Happy First Edit Day! Hi Choess! On behalf of the Birthday Committee, I'd like to wish you a very happy anniversary of the day you made your first edit and became a Wikipedian! The Herald (Benison) ( talk) 02:35, 22 April 2024 (UTC) |
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