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The format of this version of the family tree here was modified from a "pedigree" chart in Ackroyd's translation of Tokushi Yoron (p.298); however, Ackroyd only included 14 shoguns -- not 15. This causes me to recognize a plausible problem having to do with the inclusion of Ashikaga Yoshiteru's brother, Ashikaga Yoshiaki. Which is the better choice?
This seemed like the reasonable place to raise this modest question about the template? -- Tenmei ( talk) 13:27, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
Please explain the specific reasons for the changes you have made. For example, please clarify how the dotted-lines should be construed in this revised family tree.
See also User talk:星光下的人#Explaining changes. -- Tenmei ( talk) 14:30, 27 June 2011 (UTC)
Please identify the reliable source which is the basis for your edits? -- Tenmei ( talk) 01:03, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
星光下的人 -- Perhaps you misunderstand my question. I was not asking about your intent. Instead, shouldn't we work together to mitigate the ways in which a reader is likely to struggle with this graphic?
For example, Shogun Yoshimasa was succeeded by Shogun Yoshihisa (Yoshimasa's natural son), then by Shogun Yoshitane (Yoshimasa's first adopted son), and then by Shogun Yoshizumi (Yoshimasa's second adopted son). The Ashikaga relationships are not easy or obvious. What level of detail is better or best? -- Tenmei ( talk) 04:34, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
2. For example, Yoshinori and his progeny are moved left slightly in order to clarify the fraternal relationship with Yoshimochi. Similarly, Yoshimi was moved up in order to clarify the fraternal relationship with Yoshikatsu, Masatomo and Yoshimasa. Do you see how moving Yoshiteru right clarifies his relationship with his brother Yoshiaki?
3. Also, please notice how the sequence of shogunal succession is made easier to grasp quickly. The superscript numbers also suggest other places in the family tree which need to be made more "readable". Do you follow my reasoning here? -- Tenmei ( talk) 14:51, 29 June 2011 (UTC)
No, let's review -- you asked me here to explain in different words. I did as you asked here and here, but you do not acknowledge my cooperation. Not good. In an effort to improve our ability to work together, you can see that I have numbered the paragraphs above. Perhaps this may make it easier for us to focus on specifics. If you are not specific, I can't respond in a constructive way. -- Tenmei ( talk) 05:11, 30 June 2011 (UTC)
This template does not require a rating on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||
|
The format of this version of the family tree here was modified from a "pedigree" chart in Ackroyd's translation of Tokushi Yoron (p.298); however, Ackroyd only included 14 shoguns -- not 15. This causes me to recognize a plausible problem having to do with the inclusion of Ashikaga Yoshiteru's brother, Ashikaga Yoshiaki. Which is the better choice?
This seemed like the reasonable place to raise this modest question about the template? -- Tenmei ( talk) 13:27, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
Please explain the specific reasons for the changes you have made. For example, please clarify how the dotted-lines should be construed in this revised family tree.
See also User talk:星光下的人#Explaining changes. -- Tenmei ( talk) 14:30, 27 June 2011 (UTC)
Please identify the reliable source which is the basis for your edits? -- Tenmei ( talk) 01:03, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
星光下的人 -- Perhaps you misunderstand my question. I was not asking about your intent. Instead, shouldn't we work together to mitigate the ways in which a reader is likely to struggle with this graphic?
For example, Shogun Yoshimasa was succeeded by Shogun Yoshihisa (Yoshimasa's natural son), then by Shogun Yoshitane (Yoshimasa's first adopted son), and then by Shogun Yoshizumi (Yoshimasa's second adopted son). The Ashikaga relationships are not easy or obvious. What level of detail is better or best? -- Tenmei ( talk) 04:34, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
2. For example, Yoshinori and his progeny are moved left slightly in order to clarify the fraternal relationship with Yoshimochi. Similarly, Yoshimi was moved up in order to clarify the fraternal relationship with Yoshikatsu, Masatomo and Yoshimasa. Do you see how moving Yoshiteru right clarifies his relationship with his brother Yoshiaki?
3. Also, please notice how the sequence of shogunal succession is made easier to grasp quickly. The superscript numbers also suggest other places in the family tree which need to be made more "readable". Do you follow my reasoning here? -- Tenmei ( talk) 14:51, 29 June 2011 (UTC)
No, let's review -- you asked me here to explain in different words. I did as you asked here and here, but you do not acknowledge my cooperation. Not good. In an effort to improve our ability to work together, you can see that I have numbered the paragraphs above. Perhaps this may make it easier for us to focus on specifics. If you are not specific, I can't respond in a constructive way. -- Tenmei ( talk) 05:11, 30 June 2011 (UTC)