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User:Telementor: I have removed the line that says: "For decades, he also taught the philosophy of Avicenna in Nishapur". Khayyam was known to dislike teaching. There are a few figures alleged to have studied with him ( Al-Khazini, Nizami Aruzi of Samarcand, and Ayn al-Quzat Hamadani). But it is purely conjectural if they had been pupils of his.
I've removed a passage claiming that Omar Khayyam's association with heliocentrism stemmed from a mistranslation of FItzgerald [1]. In reading the two citations, I found that one was simply text of the poetry (along with some general discussion of Fitzgerald's poetic liberties), while the other (Olson) was not about mistaken heliocentrism, but rather Fitzgerald's translation incorrectly alluding to zodiacal light with the phrase "false dawn" (a mistranslation of the Persian Sahari). Looking to the original edit [2], I found that the Olson source was simply used to substantiate the idea that Fitzgerald's translations were often anachronistic, and only later was the citation moved to support the statement as a whole. The claim that Omar Khayyam's association with heliocentrism stemmed from the quoted passage of poetry is not supported anywhere, and appears to have been supposition on the part of the original editor. Unfortunately, I did find a number of websites written since 2012 which now repeat the claim using similar language, so future editors should be wary of possible citogenesis. Darth Coracle ( talk) 23:05, 23 November 2021 (UTC)
I am struggling to find a way to rewrite the ethnicity into the first paragraph in Life section.
"Omar Khayyam was born in 1048 in Nishapur, of Persian ancestry. Nishapur, was a leading metropolis during medieval times under the Seljuq dynasty and had been a major center of the Zoroastrian religion, and it is likely that Khayyam's father was a Zoroastrian who had converted to Islam."
Thoughts?
I had thought about;
Thoughts? Kansas Bear ( talk) 02:46, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
I did a rewrite, still not happy with the flow or wording. Any ideas would be appreciated.
P.S. The IP owes me two six-packs of Guinness Foreign Extra Stout. -- Kansas Bear ( talk) 02:57, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
I am going to move some sentences around, so if I lose or misplace a reference or two, please add them back. Thanks. --
Kansas Bear (
talk) 03:02, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
b: a member of one of the peoples forming the modern Iranian nationality") MOS:FIRSTBIO clearly states that usually "nationality" should be mentioned. His religion is also of dispute so I changed it to Khorasani on the life section. Ehsanbasafa ( talk) 07:20, 11 July 2022 (UTC)
I see no reason to change the wording of the lead as it now stands.
As yet, I find no compelling reason to add anything else to the lead.-- Kansas Bear ( talk) 16:24, 8 December 2022 (UTC)
References
The name of Fārs is undoubtedly attested in Assyrian sources since the third millennium B.C.E. under the form Parahše. Originally, it was the "land of horses" of the Sumerians (Herzfeld, pp. 181-82, 184-86). The name was adopted by Iranian tribes which established themselves there in the 9th century B.C.E. in the west and southwest of Urmia lake. The Parsua (Pārsa) are mentioned there for the first time in 843 B.C.E., during the reign of Salmanassar III, and then, after they migrated to the southeast (Boehmer, pp. 193-97), the name was transferred, between 690 and 640, to a region previously called Anšan (q.v.) in Elamite sources (Herzfeld, pp. 169-71, 178-79, 186). From that moment the name acquired the connotation of an ethnic region, the land of the Persians, and the Persians soon thereafter founded the vast Achaemenid empire. A never-ending confusion thus set in between a narrow, limited, geographical usage of the term—Persia in the sense of the land where the aforesaid Persian tribes had shaped the core of their power—and a broader, more general usage of the term to designate the much larger area affected by the political and cultural radiance of the Achaemenids. The confusion between the two senses of the word was continuous, fueled by the Greeks who used the name Persai to designate the entire empire.
و أما أهل خوارزم، و إن کانوا غصنا ً من دوحة الفُرس (...). (Translation: "The people of Khwarizm, they are a branch of the Persian tree.")
We travelled on to Kabul, formerly a vast town, the site of which is now occupied by a village inhabited by a tribe of Persians called Afghans. They hold mountains and defiles and possess considerable strength, and are mostly highwaymen. Their principal mountain is called Kuh Sulayman. It is told that the prophet Sulayman [Solomon] ascended this mountain and having looked out over India, which was then covered with darkness, returned without entering it.
Subject's Nationality Should be cited in the lead. since it is directly relevant to subjects Notability. Removing Nationality from the lead and introduction section is pointless. Khayyam is famous because of his Persian Poetry. Thus he should be Introduced as a "Persian" or "Iranian" Poet. Removing His Nationality is meaningless and Unhelpful. However, the decision to remove his nationality from the lead is Racist and Anti-Iranian too. Researcher1988 ( talk) 14:31, 19 October 2023 (UTC)
References
The striking of our first Seljuk coins at Nishapur in 428 and 429/1037–8..
Omar Khayyam, Moezzi, and Anvari are among the best known poets who flourished in Seljuk times.
Hi, the main application of "Khayyam" refers to "Omar Khayyam". So I think "Omar" in the article name is redundant and we can move the article to "Khayyam". Please discuss. Thanks, Hooman Mallahzadeh ( talk) 17:05, 13 January 2024 (UTC)
This
level-4 vital article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on May 18, 2020, May 18, 2021, and May 18, 2023. |
This page has archives. Sections older than 60 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III when more than 4 sections are present. |
User:Telementor: I have removed the line that says: "For decades, he also taught the philosophy of Avicenna in Nishapur". Khayyam was known to dislike teaching. There are a few figures alleged to have studied with him ( Al-Khazini, Nizami Aruzi of Samarcand, and Ayn al-Quzat Hamadani). But it is purely conjectural if they had been pupils of his.
I've removed a passage claiming that Omar Khayyam's association with heliocentrism stemmed from a mistranslation of FItzgerald [1]. In reading the two citations, I found that one was simply text of the poetry (along with some general discussion of Fitzgerald's poetic liberties), while the other (Olson) was not about mistaken heliocentrism, but rather Fitzgerald's translation incorrectly alluding to zodiacal light with the phrase "false dawn" (a mistranslation of the Persian Sahari). Looking to the original edit [2], I found that the Olson source was simply used to substantiate the idea that Fitzgerald's translations were often anachronistic, and only later was the citation moved to support the statement as a whole. The claim that Omar Khayyam's association with heliocentrism stemmed from the quoted passage of poetry is not supported anywhere, and appears to have been supposition on the part of the original editor. Unfortunately, I did find a number of websites written since 2012 which now repeat the claim using similar language, so future editors should be wary of possible citogenesis. Darth Coracle ( talk) 23:05, 23 November 2021 (UTC)
I am struggling to find a way to rewrite the ethnicity into the first paragraph in Life section.
"Omar Khayyam was born in 1048 in Nishapur, of Persian ancestry. Nishapur, was a leading metropolis during medieval times under the Seljuq dynasty and had been a major center of the Zoroastrian religion, and it is likely that Khayyam's father was a Zoroastrian who had converted to Islam."
Thoughts?
I had thought about;
Thoughts? Kansas Bear ( talk) 02:46, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
I did a rewrite, still not happy with the flow or wording. Any ideas would be appreciated.
P.S. The IP owes me two six-packs of Guinness Foreign Extra Stout. -- Kansas Bear ( talk) 02:57, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
I am going to move some sentences around, so if I lose or misplace a reference or two, please add them back. Thanks. --
Kansas Bear (
talk) 03:02, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
b: a member of one of the peoples forming the modern Iranian nationality") MOS:FIRSTBIO clearly states that usually "nationality" should be mentioned. His religion is also of dispute so I changed it to Khorasani on the life section. Ehsanbasafa ( talk) 07:20, 11 July 2022 (UTC)
I see no reason to change the wording of the lead as it now stands.
As yet, I find no compelling reason to add anything else to the lead.-- Kansas Bear ( talk) 16:24, 8 December 2022 (UTC)
References
The name of Fārs is undoubtedly attested in Assyrian sources since the third millennium B.C.E. under the form Parahše. Originally, it was the "land of horses" of the Sumerians (Herzfeld, pp. 181-82, 184-86). The name was adopted by Iranian tribes which established themselves there in the 9th century B.C.E. in the west and southwest of Urmia lake. The Parsua (Pārsa) are mentioned there for the first time in 843 B.C.E., during the reign of Salmanassar III, and then, after they migrated to the southeast (Boehmer, pp. 193-97), the name was transferred, between 690 and 640, to a region previously called Anšan (q.v.) in Elamite sources (Herzfeld, pp. 169-71, 178-79, 186). From that moment the name acquired the connotation of an ethnic region, the land of the Persians, and the Persians soon thereafter founded the vast Achaemenid empire. A never-ending confusion thus set in between a narrow, limited, geographical usage of the term—Persia in the sense of the land where the aforesaid Persian tribes had shaped the core of their power—and a broader, more general usage of the term to designate the much larger area affected by the political and cultural radiance of the Achaemenids. The confusion between the two senses of the word was continuous, fueled by the Greeks who used the name Persai to designate the entire empire.
و أما أهل خوارزم، و إن کانوا غصنا ً من دوحة الفُرس (...). (Translation: "The people of Khwarizm, they are a branch of the Persian tree.")
We travelled on to Kabul, formerly a vast town, the site of which is now occupied by a village inhabited by a tribe of Persians called Afghans. They hold mountains and defiles and possess considerable strength, and are mostly highwaymen. Their principal mountain is called Kuh Sulayman. It is told that the prophet Sulayman [Solomon] ascended this mountain and having looked out over India, which was then covered with darkness, returned without entering it.
Subject's Nationality Should be cited in the lead. since it is directly relevant to subjects Notability. Removing Nationality from the lead and introduction section is pointless. Khayyam is famous because of his Persian Poetry. Thus he should be Introduced as a "Persian" or "Iranian" Poet. Removing His Nationality is meaningless and Unhelpful. However, the decision to remove his nationality from the lead is Racist and Anti-Iranian too. Researcher1988 ( talk) 14:31, 19 October 2023 (UTC)
References
The striking of our first Seljuk coins at Nishapur in 428 and 429/1037–8..
Omar Khayyam, Moezzi, and Anvari are among the best known poets who flourished in Seljuk times.
Hi, the main application of "Khayyam" refers to "Omar Khayyam". So I think "Omar" in the article name is redundant and we can move the article to "Khayyam". Please discuss. Thanks, Hooman Mallahzadeh ( talk) 17:05, 13 January 2024 (UTC)