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On June 3, 2018, Abe declared that Hidden Christian Sites in the Nagasaki Region "convey the “shape” of a faith that is unique to Japan and they are truly unparalleled worldwide as heritage of humankind." (source: japan.kantei.go.jp).
The current WP article has a brief concern on a bill to encourage nationalism and a "love for one's country and hometown" among the Japanese youth. Nothing is said on his engagement for the restoration of the freedom of religion after a plurisecular ban of Christianism. Philosopher81sp ( talk) 22:12, 28 August 2020 (UTC)
Hasn't it been English custom to write Japanese surnames after given names at least since post war times, though the Japanese do not follow this and have been trying to get it changed (surname before). And from what I can see we are following that standard here on enwiki as well (given name, surname/family name); why then were move discussions allowed to possibly create an exception here? Also, can someone point me to the guidelines for Japanese naming conventions on enwiki. Thanks. Gotitbro ( talk) 05:55, 30 August 2020 (UTC)
for that to changeyou mean the general policy of JTITLE, and not its application to this article, right? Hijiri 88 ( 聖 やや) 05:52, 15 October 2020 (UTC)
In diff 1003950766, 新世界へ removed the following sentence from the lead:
He is a member of Nippon Kaigi and holds negationist views on Japanese history, [1] including denying the role of government coercion in the recruitment of comfort women during World War II, [2] a position which has created tension with neighboring South Korea. [3] [4]
They gave the following edit summary:
removed relatively unimportant sentence in the lead that is covered in greater detail in the article body.
One problem with this edit, as I pointed out in my revert of 新世界へ's edit, is that it isn't a good editorial decision and the reasoning provided does not cohere with Wikipedia's editorial standards. Per WP:LEAD:
The lead should stand on its own as a concise overview of the article's topic. ... The lead section should briefly summarize the most important points covered in an article.
Per WP:CREATELEAD:
The primary purpose of a Wikipedia lead is not to summarize the topic, but to summarize the content of the article. ... If a topic deserves a heading, then it deserves short mention in the lead according to its real due weight.
Since the article has an 8-paragraph subsection which covers Abe's views on history, it makes sense for the lead to have a sentence on it too, as the lead is meant to reflect the article's contents. An 8-paragraph subsection cannot be hastily dismissed as a relatively unimportant sentence
in lieu of community consensus. Furthermore, the fact that the topic is covered in greater detail in the article body
is a reason to include the sentence rather than exclude it, since the very goal of the lead is to summarize content that is covered in greater detail in the article body
; thus, the reasoning provided by 新世界へ does not hold up and in fact works against their edit.
Another problem with the edit is that it affects the POV. A common criticism of Abe is criticism over his views on history, as reflected in the coverage given in the article itself. Thus, this type of sentence should not be unilaterally removed without adequate consensus.
In diff 1007787353, 新世界へ provides the following response to my objection based on WP:LEAD:
misinterpretation of WP:LEAD
新世界へ needs to elaborate on how I have misinterpreted WP:LEAD. Until then, their edits do not appear to be justified by good editorial judgment. -- Jancarcu ( talk) 19:42, 20 February 2021 (UTC)
References
To accurately reflect the Japanese spelling of the name, and to be consistent with other Japanese politicians on Wikipedia, we should move this page. Pages such as Aso taro's, sato eisaku's, and kono taro contain the accent mark (ō.)
I tried to fix this myself and failed, so I might have accidentally messed some stuff up (check my history) and i wanted to bring it to the talk page to discuss this instead of doing it myself. apologies again. CringeButSerious ( talk) 01:12, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
Of course at this moment this is not a pressing matter, but something I noted when looking at the article. The photograph of Abe at the head of the "Honors, awards and international recognition" section lists him as being alongside "Gurtnyyaz Nurlyyewic Hanmyradow"; this individual, per Google, is "rector of Rector of Turkmen State University named after Magtymguly", but is certainly not a notable enough individual to be listed merely by name. "Abe with the Rector of Turkmen State University" would be a better caption, giving as it does the relevant information. The fact that the evidently not particularly notable man's name is featured prominently in the lead at /info/en/?search=Turkmen_State_University almost makes this seem like a vanity edit. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.145.165.109 ( talk) 09:52, 8 July 2022 (UTC)
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect
Abe government and has thus listed it
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Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 July 8#Abe government until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.
TraderCharlotte (
talk)
21:21, 8 July 2022 (UTC)
Please clarify. 70.59.6.75 ( talk) 22:59, 8 July 2022 (UTC)
Personally, I'd characterize Abe's death as a murder, and I'd want us to say that here. I feel that calling this an assassination is somehow dignifying the murder/murderer, and taking into account too much the murderer's beliefs/policies. I can understand using the term "assassination" if you take down a brutal warlord, say, or a head of state who's leading a genocide or in some other way doing significant harm to the world (Trump or Putin, perhaps). But this was the senseless murder of a peaceful, cultured, positive, and intelligent person. Please let's not try to assign, or seem to be assigning, any sense to it. Just my 2c. 2601:600:8500:6A40:847F:75CE:2F25:7C61 ( talk) 00:38, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
Can't it be both? Assassination is a neutral word tbh Fourdots2 ( talk) 01:06, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
Eg: people sympathetic to her politics talked about 'the assassination of jo cox' when wanting to underline how serious it is Fourdots2 ( talk) 01:07, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
How does the word "Assassination" glorify the assassin? Octagon758 ( talk) 15:09, 17 September 2022 (UTC)
In the article, it says Yamagami is a "former Japanese Maritime Self Defense Force officer. The connected hyperlink leading to the shooter's details here state that Yamagami retired as a Quatermaster at the rank of Leading Seaman, which has a NATO equivalent of OR-4, and US equivalent of E-3.This would make him an enlisted man, not an officer. 173.184.10.198 ( talk) 02:50, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
"while, Abe argued that the conflict was caused by South Korea's failure to abide by the 1965 treaty."
Not sure why this was chopped up/what it is supposed to mean, but it's incomplete in that graf and should probably be repaired by someone who is much more knowledgeable about this than I am! ɯɐɔ 💬 04:15, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
What are these "opposing forces" that are accusing him of being a fascist? Sources cited include an article Irish Times article that briefly mentions: "Protesters outside parliament said the law belonged to Japan’s militarist past and labelled it “fascist”". It also cites an article on the left-wing Jacobin magazine on Japan's remilitarization, and a blurb in Craig Mark's book that say "The return of a fascist Japan is certainly an exaggerated fear; but the restoration of a Japan that can again go to war is now looming ever closer under Prime Minister Shinzo Abe." without further context. None of the sources elaborate on who is calling him a "fascist", or accuse Abe himself of being a fascist. And if we go by what "protestors" accuse politicians of, no doubt literally every Western leader in the last 20 years have been accused of being a fascist and reactionary at some point. I believe that part of the article should be removed.
Edit: The user who added this paragraph, Storm598, is the topic of a section in the Administrators' noticeboard [1], and has been previously banned for their editing in the area of American politics. Meeepmep ( talk) 04:55, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
This section reads as a displaced criticism of Abe's comments of World War 2. It never touches on his actual political policies, philosophy, or working positions in respect to history. The section is clearly trying to convince the reader that Abe was an extremist and bad person. I think the section should be retitled as "controversial views on World War 2" or "controversial views of history." it should also be cleaned up to sound less like an indictment by a third party. -- IronMaidenRocks ( talk) 06:42, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
Abe was widely viewed as a right-wing nationalist.<ref name="Lucy Alexander"/><ref name="The New York Times">{{cite web |url=https://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/03/opinion/another-attempt-to-deny-japans-history.html |title=Another Attempt to Deny Japan's History|work=The New York Times|date=2 January 2013}}</ref><ref name="Justin McCurry"/> The British journalist [[Rupert Wingfield-Hayes]] of [[BBC]] described him as "far more right <!-- source does not use a hyphen -->wing than most of his predecessors".<ref name="Rupert Wingfield-Hayes">{{cite web|url=https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-20728387|title=Japan loses faith in traditional politics|author=Rupert Wingfield-Hayes|publisher=BBC|date=15 December 2012}}</ref>
I also mistakenly hit this as a minor edit because I was trying to figure out how to post through an "edit conflict." IronMaidenRocks ( talk) 07:27, 9 July 2022 (UTC)"His views also found support within far-right circles in United States; Breitbart News founder and former White House Chief Strategist and Senior Counselor Steve Bannon evaluted Abe as "a great hero to the grassroots, the populist, and the nationalist movement throughout the world" and referred him as the "Trump before Trump"."
This sentence should not be included in the Controversies section and is completely irrelevant to the rest of the section. In addition, this puts undue weight on what the American far-right and what Steve Bannon thinks of the subject. Selectively including sources and viewpoints like this arguably violates Wikipedia:NPOV. This should be removed. Meeepmep ( talk) 03:52, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
[2] This was interesting. It's the first article I've seen to name the Unification Church as the organization that the shooter was angry with. I'll leave it up to others how and whether to use this. 2602:24A:DE47:B8E0:1B43:29FD:A863:33CA ( talk) 06:17, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
"Jake Adelstein argued that Abe left behind an authoritarian legacy, with his populist actions throughout his tenure such as the intimidation of media that were critical of him that caused Japan's position on the Press Freedom Index to fall as low as 72nd, stroking anti-Korean sentiments, as well as the creation of a "Cabinet Personnel Bureau" to vet any civil service employees that may be critical of the ruling LDP government, among others."
Jake Adelstein is a journalist most notable because of his work on the Japanese Mafia, not for his political analyses. This sentence puts undue prominence on his article on the tabloid Daily Beast and is irrelevant to the rest of the section. If you wish to add something about Abe's creation of the Cabinet Personnel Bureau, Press Freedom and authoritarianism in Japan, it should be in it's own section, properly referenced. Relying purely on a single quote of Adelstein without any further context or elaboration arguably violates Wikipedia:NPOV's section on weight and undue weight. Meeepmep ( talk) 12:46, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
I wouldn't read anything into the POTUS calling Abe a beacon of democracy: in fact, saying that it means anything sounds almost tendentious in its own right. The US has taken sides in many different conflicts and in retrospect it hasn't always been on the "good" side (think of arming Bin Laden in the 1980s, plus the familiar string of Central American dictators, etc). Whichever side it is currently on always gets described as a beacon of democracy. I haven't seen the Daily Beast article but e.g. here is an AP article describing him as a polarizing figure. Here is one associating him with historical revisionism. This describes his long and (because it was very unpopular with the Japanese public) ultimately unsuccessful effort to change the Japanese constitution to allow expanding Japan's military (he gets called a militarist for that, though I don't know enough to say that it makes him one). Note: those links are from here, which I don't claim is neutral, but it appears to express a significant viewpoint (one that is part of mainstream informed dialogue), and those internal links I gave meet Wikipedia's overrated notion of RS as far as I can tell. The parts about the Cold War are also consistent with that part of US domestic history, such as the McCarthy witch hunts. So that take on Abe is to my mind unquestionably part of the NPOV. (I have no idea what it would even mean to claim that it is objectively right or wrong, so I don't claim either of those). 2602:24A:DE47:B8E0:1B43:29FD:A863:33CA ( talk) 02:50, 11 July 2022 (UTC)
No I find your claim about US media to be a non-sequitur. US media tends to repeat whatever the US foreign policy establishment (aka the Blob) tells it (e.g.: Abe is a beacon of democracy). That is part of why the media is so distrusted nowadays. [3] When something against the current slips through, you have to pay attention to it (consider it to be part of the NPOV). That is, the different MSM outlets normally can't be considered independent of each other, besides having a COI due to their reliance on access journalism.
Ok, that does sound like ragging, sorry. But tbh, blogs are usually more informative than news outlets for stuff like this, though if you want links from news outlets, you just got a bunch of them. 2602:24A:DE47:B8E0:1B43:29FD:A863:33CA ( talk) 08:20, 11 July 2022 (UTC)
Not sure if publicity photos of Abe shaking hands with Korea leaders is appropriate in the section mainly dealing with him offending Korean leaders. It could be taken as implicitly counter acting the impact of the claims in that section. Of those two photos, I think the one from 2015 seems appropriate, but having two similar photos, especially for negotiations that were to some extent botched, seems excessive. Also, not sure why the section below it just has a photo of Abe on the campaign trail in 2012. I don't think we should go as far as to include photos of controversies, like the 731 plane, but I'm not convinced of the relevancy of these photos. -- IronMaidenRocks ( talk) 08:23, 11 July 2022 (UTC)
Given Abe's impact on Japan and status as a domestically polarizing figure, I feel it's appropriate to include 1-2 sentences at the end of the lead summing up his legacy. I think the two setences at the end of Margaret Thatcher's lead could serve as a good example.
I'm thinking something like:
"A polarizing figure in Japanese politics, Abe's supporters praised him as a patriot who worked to strengthen Japan's security and international stature, while his opponents denounced him as an ultranationalist whose policies and historically revisionist views threatened Japanese pacifism. Commentators have suggested that his legacy pushed Japan towards more proactive security policies and defense spending."
Possible sources to use:
Basil the Bat Lord ( talk) 11:57, 13 July 2022 (UTC)
I think Basil's version well written, but it would be more accurate to add controversies on his views on feminism/gender. While some Westerneres praise Abe as a "he for she", and yes he would have see women as competitive workforce. But on the other side, as an ultraright, he has been critisized rather an oppresser of women's rights: he was anyway a champion of patriarchy, trying to revive Japanese traditional male primogeniture family system which was abolished after WW2. This aspect seems to be ignored by foreign media I'm afraid. -- Aphaia ( talk) 19:04, 15 July 2022 (UTC)
References
I am Japanese and would like to add his honours. But, my editing was banned. Instead of me, please add this page.
* [[File:Medal_of_the_Oriental_Republic_of_Uruguay_-_ribbon_bar.gif|30px|border]] Grand Officer of the [[medal of the Oriental Republic of Uruguay]], 2018.<ref>{{cite web |title=Tabaré Vázquez condecoró a Shinzō Abe con la medalla de la República Oriental del Uruguay |url=https://www.gub.uy/presidencia/comunicacion/noticias/tabare-vazquez-condecoro-shinzo-abe-medalla-republica-oriental-del-uruguay |website=gub.uy |access-date=17 July 2022 |url-status=live }}</ref> (Uruguay) * [[File:National Order of Merit (Paraguay) - ribbon bar.png|30px|border]] Grand Cross of the [[National Order of Merit (Paraguay)|National Order of Merit]], 2018. <ref>{{cite web |title=パラグァイ=国家功労大十字章を受勲=総理、日系社会代表者と懇談 |url=https://www.nikkeyshimbun.jp/2018/181205-72colonia.html |website=nikkeyshimbun.jp |access-date=5 December 2018 |archive-date=17 July 2022 |archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20201129223750/https://www.nikkeyshimbun.jp/2018/181205-72colonia.html |url-status=live }}</ref>(Paraguay) Ooyamanobutatu ( talk) 03:52, 17 July 2022 (UTC)
Here's my contention with this sentence in the lead. The lead should be a summary of the article but the body of the article does not use the word 'ultranationalist' once, instead, this sentence is backed by two cites that seem to be taken from a Google search with the terms "Shinzo Abe ultranationalist". Neither articles are arguments as to why Abe fits the "ultranationalist" description: the NPR article is a report of his death, and briefly recounts his bio. The word 'ultranationalist' was used once in the article before being retracted less than a day later, it did not denounce him as an ultranationalist; The New Statesman source is an article that recounts the broader history of conservatism in Japan and Abe premiership, the word ultranationalist is used twice in the article, neither times it was used to describe Abe himself. The first use was to describe Abe's "“beautiful Japan” project", not Abe himself. The only time ultranationalist is used in the body is this: "Outside the country (and to the chagrin of ultranationalists), Akihito made a point of recognizing Japanese wartime aggression with a remorse that was more authentic than Abe’s pro forma apologies.", not referring to Abe himself. The article calls Abe a "strongman", "a strategic conservative", "the heir to two powerful political dynasties", the article is critical of him, but it certainly did not denounce him as an ultranationalist. Ultranationalism as defined by wikipedia is "an extreme form of nationalism in which a country asserts or maintains detrimental hegemony, supremacy, or other forms of control over other nations (usually through violent coercion) to pursue its specific interests. Ultranationalist entities have been associated with the engagement of political violence even during peacetime.", it does not simply mean someone who is very nationalist, it has a very specific meaning in political science.
In addition, it is exceedingly easy for a person to add labels to Abe, considering the massive amount of literature written about him. For example, this article is a critique of his feminist policy [4], and this one calls him a liberal internationalist [5], this one calls him a defensive realist and liberal [6], this one calls him a neo-liberal [7] and this one says that his party "has often championed socialist causes to win over more liberal-minded voters" [8]. Now, should I add to the lead that in addition to being an ultranationalist, he is described as a feminist, socialist, liberal and neo-liberal?
Wouldn't "his opponents accused his nationalistic policies and negationist views on history of threatening Japanese pacifism and damaging relations with its neighbors" be a much more neutral sentence that encapsulates the mainstream critiques against him? Instead of battering the reader with labels like "ultranationalist" so they form a preconceived notion of Abe.
Meeepmep ( talk) 12:43, 17 July 2022 (UTC)
References
Even though he was out of office, Abe was still highly influential in the governing Liberal Democratic Party and headed its largest faction, Seiwakai, but his ultra-nationalist views made him a divisive figure to many.
But many in South Korea did not consider Japan's remorse as sufficiently sincere, especially as the ultranationalist former Prime Minister Shinzo Abe, who was assassinated last year, and his allies sought to whitewash Japan's colonial abuses, even suggesting there was no evidence to indicate Japanese authorities coerced Korean women into sexual slavery.
Found a couple errors at the end of the Assassination Section:
"In response to the shooting and his subsequent death, numerous present and former world leaders expressed their sympathies and support for Abe. Japanese Prime Minister balmed police for the killing of SHinzo Abe His body was returned to Tokyo the day after his assassination and his funeral was held on 12 July 2022."
"balmed" was probably intended to be "blamed", and "SHinzo Abe His" should probably be "Shinzo Abe. His". MusiqueLegacy ( talk) 20:27, 19 July 2022 (UTC)
Please make major changes to the article to reflect a more neutral Japanese view. Thank you. It is important that English readers understand. 121.82.160.137 ( talk) 12:12, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
Sometimes Shinzō with the barred oh, and sometimes Abe Shinzo without. Which is correct? Why is the article inconsistent? -- Mikeblas ( talk) 02:21, 5 August 2022 (UTC)
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I opt for changing the subtitle "Retirement and assassination" to just "assassination." This is because there is only about two sentences related to his retirement in this section, with most of it detailing the assassination. This small part on retirement should be moved up to the part about his resignation instead, as its more related, and isn't large enough to justify a big subtitle. Furthermore, the assassination was a significant historical event that deserves its own section for ease of reading/navigability. I struggled to find the part about his assassination for a minute because of this. Cameron gv ( talk) 21:17, 31 May 2023 (UTC)
The article has an incorrect description of Abe's fatal wound. Abe was not struck in the heart. The second round hit a major artery near Abe's collar bone, and he bled to death. There was no immediate nor direct injury to his heart from the bullet. The Japanese Wikipedia article reads as follows (translated): "According to Abe's autopsy results announced by the Nara Prefectural Police Investigation, one gunshot wound was confirmed on the left shoulder and two oval gunshot wounds on the right anterior neck. According to the results of the judicial autopsy published by the Criminal Bureau of the National Police Agency, the cause of death was blood loss due to left and right subclavian artery injury due to a left upper arm shooting wound." -- Westwind273 ( talk) 04:36, 13 July 2023 (UTC)
This statement doesn't seem to survive the sources used. Of the three sources used, only one source uses the term "nationalist" and it's a low quality blog-like source. I'll be removing any mention of "Nationalist" from the article. Ergzay ( talk) 07:08, 16 July 2023 (UTC)
In the family section, there are two pictures of young Abe with his family which share a caption text area. On my typical browser (Brave), the caption text renders in a way that makes it really confusing to read because on a glance it looks like there is one caption when really there are two separate captions. Other browsers render the text with a more clear distinction, but I think it would be best to separate the pictures for clarity. Reqdream ( talk) 23:20, 17 September 2023 (UTC)
The article incorrectly states that Abe was struck in the heart by the assassin. That is incorrect. Abe was struck in a major artery underneath his collarbone, and he bled to death from that artery. His heart was not struck. Refer to the separate Wikipedia article "Assassination of Shinzo Abe". Unless there is objection, I will update this article. Westwind273 ( talk) 16:55, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
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On June 3, 2018, Abe declared that Hidden Christian Sites in the Nagasaki Region "convey the “shape” of a faith that is unique to Japan and they are truly unparalleled worldwide as heritage of humankind." (source: japan.kantei.go.jp).
The current WP article has a brief concern on a bill to encourage nationalism and a "love for one's country and hometown" among the Japanese youth. Nothing is said on his engagement for the restoration of the freedom of religion after a plurisecular ban of Christianism. Philosopher81sp ( talk) 22:12, 28 August 2020 (UTC)
Hasn't it been English custom to write Japanese surnames after given names at least since post war times, though the Japanese do not follow this and have been trying to get it changed (surname before). And from what I can see we are following that standard here on enwiki as well (given name, surname/family name); why then were move discussions allowed to possibly create an exception here? Also, can someone point me to the guidelines for Japanese naming conventions on enwiki. Thanks. Gotitbro ( talk) 05:55, 30 August 2020 (UTC)
for that to changeyou mean the general policy of JTITLE, and not its application to this article, right? Hijiri 88 ( 聖 やや) 05:52, 15 October 2020 (UTC)
In diff 1003950766, 新世界へ removed the following sentence from the lead:
He is a member of Nippon Kaigi and holds negationist views on Japanese history, [1] including denying the role of government coercion in the recruitment of comfort women during World War II, [2] a position which has created tension with neighboring South Korea. [3] [4]
They gave the following edit summary:
removed relatively unimportant sentence in the lead that is covered in greater detail in the article body.
One problem with this edit, as I pointed out in my revert of 新世界へ's edit, is that it isn't a good editorial decision and the reasoning provided does not cohere with Wikipedia's editorial standards. Per WP:LEAD:
The lead should stand on its own as a concise overview of the article's topic. ... The lead section should briefly summarize the most important points covered in an article.
Per WP:CREATELEAD:
The primary purpose of a Wikipedia lead is not to summarize the topic, but to summarize the content of the article. ... If a topic deserves a heading, then it deserves short mention in the lead according to its real due weight.
Since the article has an 8-paragraph subsection which covers Abe's views on history, it makes sense for the lead to have a sentence on it too, as the lead is meant to reflect the article's contents. An 8-paragraph subsection cannot be hastily dismissed as a relatively unimportant sentence
in lieu of community consensus. Furthermore, the fact that the topic is covered in greater detail in the article body
is a reason to include the sentence rather than exclude it, since the very goal of the lead is to summarize content that is covered in greater detail in the article body
; thus, the reasoning provided by 新世界へ does not hold up and in fact works against their edit.
Another problem with the edit is that it affects the POV. A common criticism of Abe is criticism over his views on history, as reflected in the coverage given in the article itself. Thus, this type of sentence should not be unilaterally removed without adequate consensus.
In diff 1007787353, 新世界へ provides the following response to my objection based on WP:LEAD:
misinterpretation of WP:LEAD
新世界へ needs to elaborate on how I have misinterpreted WP:LEAD. Until then, their edits do not appear to be justified by good editorial judgment. -- Jancarcu ( talk) 19:42, 20 February 2021 (UTC)
References
To accurately reflect the Japanese spelling of the name, and to be consistent with other Japanese politicians on Wikipedia, we should move this page. Pages such as Aso taro's, sato eisaku's, and kono taro contain the accent mark (ō.)
I tried to fix this myself and failed, so I might have accidentally messed some stuff up (check my history) and i wanted to bring it to the talk page to discuss this instead of doing it myself. apologies again. CringeButSerious ( talk) 01:12, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
Of course at this moment this is not a pressing matter, but something I noted when looking at the article. The photograph of Abe at the head of the "Honors, awards and international recognition" section lists him as being alongside "Gurtnyyaz Nurlyyewic Hanmyradow"; this individual, per Google, is "rector of Rector of Turkmen State University named after Magtymguly", but is certainly not a notable enough individual to be listed merely by name. "Abe with the Rector of Turkmen State University" would be a better caption, giving as it does the relevant information. The fact that the evidently not particularly notable man's name is featured prominently in the lead at /info/en/?search=Turkmen_State_University almost makes this seem like a vanity edit. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.145.165.109 ( talk) 09:52, 8 July 2022 (UTC)
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect
Abe government and has thus listed it
for discussion. This discussion will occur at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 July 8#Abe government until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.
TraderCharlotte (
talk)
21:21, 8 July 2022 (UTC)
Please clarify. 70.59.6.75 ( talk) 22:59, 8 July 2022 (UTC)
Personally, I'd characterize Abe's death as a murder, and I'd want us to say that here. I feel that calling this an assassination is somehow dignifying the murder/murderer, and taking into account too much the murderer's beliefs/policies. I can understand using the term "assassination" if you take down a brutal warlord, say, or a head of state who's leading a genocide or in some other way doing significant harm to the world (Trump or Putin, perhaps). But this was the senseless murder of a peaceful, cultured, positive, and intelligent person. Please let's not try to assign, or seem to be assigning, any sense to it. Just my 2c. 2601:600:8500:6A40:847F:75CE:2F25:7C61 ( talk) 00:38, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
Can't it be both? Assassination is a neutral word tbh Fourdots2 ( talk) 01:06, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
Eg: people sympathetic to her politics talked about 'the assassination of jo cox' when wanting to underline how serious it is Fourdots2 ( talk) 01:07, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
How does the word "Assassination" glorify the assassin? Octagon758 ( talk) 15:09, 17 September 2022 (UTC)
In the article, it says Yamagami is a "former Japanese Maritime Self Defense Force officer. The connected hyperlink leading to the shooter's details here state that Yamagami retired as a Quatermaster at the rank of Leading Seaman, which has a NATO equivalent of OR-4, and US equivalent of E-3.This would make him an enlisted man, not an officer. 173.184.10.198 ( talk) 02:50, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
"while, Abe argued that the conflict was caused by South Korea's failure to abide by the 1965 treaty."
Not sure why this was chopped up/what it is supposed to mean, but it's incomplete in that graf and should probably be repaired by someone who is much more knowledgeable about this than I am! ɯɐɔ 💬 04:15, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
What are these "opposing forces" that are accusing him of being a fascist? Sources cited include an article Irish Times article that briefly mentions: "Protesters outside parliament said the law belonged to Japan’s militarist past and labelled it “fascist”". It also cites an article on the left-wing Jacobin magazine on Japan's remilitarization, and a blurb in Craig Mark's book that say "The return of a fascist Japan is certainly an exaggerated fear; but the restoration of a Japan that can again go to war is now looming ever closer under Prime Minister Shinzo Abe." without further context. None of the sources elaborate on who is calling him a "fascist", or accuse Abe himself of being a fascist. And if we go by what "protestors" accuse politicians of, no doubt literally every Western leader in the last 20 years have been accused of being a fascist and reactionary at some point. I believe that part of the article should be removed.
Edit: The user who added this paragraph, Storm598, is the topic of a section in the Administrators' noticeboard [1], and has been previously banned for their editing in the area of American politics. Meeepmep ( talk) 04:55, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
This section reads as a displaced criticism of Abe's comments of World War 2. It never touches on his actual political policies, philosophy, or working positions in respect to history. The section is clearly trying to convince the reader that Abe was an extremist and bad person. I think the section should be retitled as "controversial views on World War 2" or "controversial views of history." it should also be cleaned up to sound less like an indictment by a third party. -- IronMaidenRocks ( talk) 06:42, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
Abe was widely viewed as a right-wing nationalist.<ref name="Lucy Alexander"/><ref name="The New York Times">{{cite web |url=https://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/03/opinion/another-attempt-to-deny-japans-history.html |title=Another Attempt to Deny Japan's History|work=The New York Times|date=2 January 2013}}</ref><ref name="Justin McCurry"/> The British journalist [[Rupert Wingfield-Hayes]] of [[BBC]] described him as "far more right <!-- source does not use a hyphen -->wing than most of his predecessors".<ref name="Rupert Wingfield-Hayes">{{cite web|url=https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-20728387|title=Japan loses faith in traditional politics|author=Rupert Wingfield-Hayes|publisher=BBC|date=15 December 2012}}</ref>
I also mistakenly hit this as a minor edit because I was trying to figure out how to post through an "edit conflict." IronMaidenRocks ( talk) 07:27, 9 July 2022 (UTC)"His views also found support within far-right circles in United States; Breitbart News founder and former White House Chief Strategist and Senior Counselor Steve Bannon evaluted Abe as "a great hero to the grassroots, the populist, and the nationalist movement throughout the world" and referred him as the "Trump before Trump"."
This sentence should not be included in the Controversies section and is completely irrelevant to the rest of the section. In addition, this puts undue weight on what the American far-right and what Steve Bannon thinks of the subject. Selectively including sources and viewpoints like this arguably violates Wikipedia:NPOV. This should be removed. Meeepmep ( talk) 03:52, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
[2] This was interesting. It's the first article I've seen to name the Unification Church as the organization that the shooter was angry with. I'll leave it up to others how and whether to use this. 2602:24A:DE47:B8E0:1B43:29FD:A863:33CA ( talk) 06:17, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
"Jake Adelstein argued that Abe left behind an authoritarian legacy, with his populist actions throughout his tenure such as the intimidation of media that were critical of him that caused Japan's position on the Press Freedom Index to fall as low as 72nd, stroking anti-Korean sentiments, as well as the creation of a "Cabinet Personnel Bureau" to vet any civil service employees that may be critical of the ruling LDP government, among others."
Jake Adelstein is a journalist most notable because of his work on the Japanese Mafia, not for his political analyses. This sentence puts undue prominence on his article on the tabloid Daily Beast and is irrelevant to the rest of the section. If you wish to add something about Abe's creation of the Cabinet Personnel Bureau, Press Freedom and authoritarianism in Japan, it should be in it's own section, properly referenced. Relying purely on a single quote of Adelstein without any further context or elaboration arguably violates Wikipedia:NPOV's section on weight and undue weight. Meeepmep ( talk) 12:46, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
I wouldn't read anything into the POTUS calling Abe a beacon of democracy: in fact, saying that it means anything sounds almost tendentious in its own right. The US has taken sides in many different conflicts and in retrospect it hasn't always been on the "good" side (think of arming Bin Laden in the 1980s, plus the familiar string of Central American dictators, etc). Whichever side it is currently on always gets described as a beacon of democracy. I haven't seen the Daily Beast article but e.g. here is an AP article describing him as a polarizing figure. Here is one associating him with historical revisionism. This describes his long and (because it was very unpopular with the Japanese public) ultimately unsuccessful effort to change the Japanese constitution to allow expanding Japan's military (he gets called a militarist for that, though I don't know enough to say that it makes him one). Note: those links are from here, which I don't claim is neutral, but it appears to express a significant viewpoint (one that is part of mainstream informed dialogue), and those internal links I gave meet Wikipedia's overrated notion of RS as far as I can tell. The parts about the Cold War are also consistent with that part of US domestic history, such as the McCarthy witch hunts. So that take on Abe is to my mind unquestionably part of the NPOV. (I have no idea what it would even mean to claim that it is objectively right or wrong, so I don't claim either of those). 2602:24A:DE47:B8E0:1B43:29FD:A863:33CA ( talk) 02:50, 11 July 2022 (UTC)
No I find your claim about US media to be a non-sequitur. US media tends to repeat whatever the US foreign policy establishment (aka the Blob) tells it (e.g.: Abe is a beacon of democracy). That is part of why the media is so distrusted nowadays. [3] When something against the current slips through, you have to pay attention to it (consider it to be part of the NPOV). That is, the different MSM outlets normally can't be considered independent of each other, besides having a COI due to their reliance on access journalism.
Ok, that does sound like ragging, sorry. But tbh, blogs are usually more informative than news outlets for stuff like this, though if you want links from news outlets, you just got a bunch of them. 2602:24A:DE47:B8E0:1B43:29FD:A863:33CA ( talk) 08:20, 11 July 2022 (UTC)
Not sure if publicity photos of Abe shaking hands with Korea leaders is appropriate in the section mainly dealing with him offending Korean leaders. It could be taken as implicitly counter acting the impact of the claims in that section. Of those two photos, I think the one from 2015 seems appropriate, but having two similar photos, especially for negotiations that were to some extent botched, seems excessive. Also, not sure why the section below it just has a photo of Abe on the campaign trail in 2012. I don't think we should go as far as to include photos of controversies, like the 731 plane, but I'm not convinced of the relevancy of these photos. -- IronMaidenRocks ( talk) 08:23, 11 July 2022 (UTC)
Given Abe's impact on Japan and status as a domestically polarizing figure, I feel it's appropriate to include 1-2 sentences at the end of the lead summing up his legacy. I think the two setences at the end of Margaret Thatcher's lead could serve as a good example.
I'm thinking something like:
"A polarizing figure in Japanese politics, Abe's supporters praised him as a patriot who worked to strengthen Japan's security and international stature, while his opponents denounced him as an ultranationalist whose policies and historically revisionist views threatened Japanese pacifism. Commentators have suggested that his legacy pushed Japan towards more proactive security policies and defense spending."
Possible sources to use:
Basil the Bat Lord ( talk) 11:57, 13 July 2022 (UTC)
I think Basil's version well written, but it would be more accurate to add controversies on his views on feminism/gender. While some Westerneres praise Abe as a "he for she", and yes he would have see women as competitive workforce. But on the other side, as an ultraright, he has been critisized rather an oppresser of women's rights: he was anyway a champion of patriarchy, trying to revive Japanese traditional male primogeniture family system which was abolished after WW2. This aspect seems to be ignored by foreign media I'm afraid. -- Aphaia ( talk) 19:04, 15 July 2022 (UTC)
References
I am Japanese and would like to add his honours. But, my editing was banned. Instead of me, please add this page.
* [[File:Medal_of_the_Oriental_Republic_of_Uruguay_-_ribbon_bar.gif|30px|border]] Grand Officer of the [[medal of the Oriental Republic of Uruguay]], 2018.<ref>{{cite web |title=Tabaré Vázquez condecoró a Shinzō Abe con la medalla de la República Oriental del Uruguay |url=https://www.gub.uy/presidencia/comunicacion/noticias/tabare-vazquez-condecoro-shinzo-abe-medalla-republica-oriental-del-uruguay |website=gub.uy |access-date=17 July 2022 |url-status=live }}</ref> (Uruguay) * [[File:National Order of Merit (Paraguay) - ribbon bar.png|30px|border]] Grand Cross of the [[National Order of Merit (Paraguay)|National Order of Merit]], 2018. <ref>{{cite web |title=パラグァイ=国家功労大十字章を受勲=総理、日系社会代表者と懇談 |url=https://www.nikkeyshimbun.jp/2018/181205-72colonia.html |website=nikkeyshimbun.jp |access-date=5 December 2018 |archive-date=17 July 2022 |archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20201129223750/https://www.nikkeyshimbun.jp/2018/181205-72colonia.html |url-status=live }}</ref>(Paraguay) Ooyamanobutatu ( talk) 03:52, 17 July 2022 (UTC)
Here's my contention with this sentence in the lead. The lead should be a summary of the article but the body of the article does not use the word 'ultranationalist' once, instead, this sentence is backed by two cites that seem to be taken from a Google search with the terms "Shinzo Abe ultranationalist". Neither articles are arguments as to why Abe fits the "ultranationalist" description: the NPR article is a report of his death, and briefly recounts his bio. The word 'ultranationalist' was used once in the article before being retracted less than a day later, it did not denounce him as an ultranationalist; The New Statesman source is an article that recounts the broader history of conservatism in Japan and Abe premiership, the word ultranationalist is used twice in the article, neither times it was used to describe Abe himself. The first use was to describe Abe's "“beautiful Japan” project", not Abe himself. The only time ultranationalist is used in the body is this: "Outside the country (and to the chagrin of ultranationalists), Akihito made a point of recognizing Japanese wartime aggression with a remorse that was more authentic than Abe’s pro forma apologies.", not referring to Abe himself. The article calls Abe a "strongman", "a strategic conservative", "the heir to two powerful political dynasties", the article is critical of him, but it certainly did not denounce him as an ultranationalist. Ultranationalism as defined by wikipedia is "an extreme form of nationalism in which a country asserts or maintains detrimental hegemony, supremacy, or other forms of control over other nations (usually through violent coercion) to pursue its specific interests. Ultranationalist entities have been associated with the engagement of political violence even during peacetime.", it does not simply mean someone who is very nationalist, it has a very specific meaning in political science.
In addition, it is exceedingly easy for a person to add labels to Abe, considering the massive amount of literature written about him. For example, this article is a critique of his feminist policy [4], and this one calls him a liberal internationalist [5], this one calls him a defensive realist and liberal [6], this one calls him a neo-liberal [7] and this one says that his party "has often championed socialist causes to win over more liberal-minded voters" [8]. Now, should I add to the lead that in addition to being an ultranationalist, he is described as a feminist, socialist, liberal and neo-liberal?
Wouldn't "his opponents accused his nationalistic policies and negationist views on history of threatening Japanese pacifism and damaging relations with its neighbors" be a much more neutral sentence that encapsulates the mainstream critiques against him? Instead of battering the reader with labels like "ultranationalist" so they form a preconceived notion of Abe.
Meeepmep ( talk) 12:43, 17 July 2022 (UTC)
References
Even though he was out of office, Abe was still highly influential in the governing Liberal Democratic Party and headed its largest faction, Seiwakai, but his ultra-nationalist views made him a divisive figure to many.
But many in South Korea did not consider Japan's remorse as sufficiently sincere, especially as the ultranationalist former Prime Minister Shinzo Abe, who was assassinated last year, and his allies sought to whitewash Japan's colonial abuses, even suggesting there was no evidence to indicate Japanese authorities coerced Korean women into sexual slavery.
Found a couple errors at the end of the Assassination Section:
"In response to the shooting and his subsequent death, numerous present and former world leaders expressed their sympathies and support for Abe. Japanese Prime Minister balmed police for the killing of SHinzo Abe His body was returned to Tokyo the day after his assassination and his funeral was held on 12 July 2022."
"balmed" was probably intended to be "blamed", and "SHinzo Abe His" should probably be "Shinzo Abe. His". MusiqueLegacy ( talk) 20:27, 19 July 2022 (UTC)
Please make major changes to the article to reflect a more neutral Japanese view. Thank you. It is important that English readers understand. 121.82.160.137 ( talk) 12:12, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
Sometimes Shinzō with the barred oh, and sometimes Abe Shinzo without. Which is correct? Why is the article inconsistent? -- Mikeblas ( talk) 02:21, 5 August 2022 (UTC)
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I opt for changing the subtitle "Retirement and assassination" to just "assassination." This is because there is only about two sentences related to his retirement in this section, with most of it detailing the assassination. This small part on retirement should be moved up to the part about his resignation instead, as its more related, and isn't large enough to justify a big subtitle. Furthermore, the assassination was a significant historical event that deserves its own section for ease of reading/navigability. I struggled to find the part about his assassination for a minute because of this. Cameron gv ( talk) 21:17, 31 May 2023 (UTC)
The article has an incorrect description of Abe's fatal wound. Abe was not struck in the heart. The second round hit a major artery near Abe's collar bone, and he bled to death. There was no immediate nor direct injury to his heart from the bullet. The Japanese Wikipedia article reads as follows (translated): "According to Abe's autopsy results announced by the Nara Prefectural Police Investigation, one gunshot wound was confirmed on the left shoulder and two oval gunshot wounds on the right anterior neck. According to the results of the judicial autopsy published by the Criminal Bureau of the National Police Agency, the cause of death was blood loss due to left and right subclavian artery injury due to a left upper arm shooting wound." -- Westwind273 ( talk) 04:36, 13 July 2023 (UTC)
This statement doesn't seem to survive the sources used. Of the three sources used, only one source uses the term "nationalist" and it's a low quality blog-like source. I'll be removing any mention of "Nationalist" from the article. Ergzay ( talk) 07:08, 16 July 2023 (UTC)
In the family section, there are two pictures of young Abe with his family which share a caption text area. On my typical browser (Brave), the caption text renders in a way that makes it really confusing to read because on a glance it looks like there is one caption when really there are two separate captions. Other browsers render the text with a more clear distinction, but I think it would be best to separate the pictures for clarity. Reqdream ( talk) 23:20, 17 September 2023 (UTC)
The article incorrectly states that Abe was struck in the heart by the assassin. That is incorrect. Abe was struck in a major artery underneath his collarbone, and he bled to death from that artery. His heart was not struck. Refer to the separate Wikipedia article "Assassination of Shinzo Abe". Unless there is objection, I will update this article. Westwind273 ( talk) 16:55, 2 June 2024 (UTC)