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I changed the structure of the article, corrected some false statements and I added some info about the history and texts Hippocrates
The article is a bit strange now - did Dogen found the sect or not..? (the article isn't clear about it) Hippocrates
I am a Soto Zen Buddhist, have been for some time now. It is my religion... most of the people in my temple would answer the question "What is your religion?" with "Soto Zen." We've discussed this in dharma talks and group discussions at length. -Lisa Mann
Soto is (or was) one of the five sects of Zen-Buddhism not in Japan but in China. Two of the five are Soto and Rinzai. I don't know how to spell other three sects in English: Igyo, Un-mon, and Ho-gen, maybe. In Japan Soto and Rinzai (and Obaku) are the main zen sects, I believe. Miya 04:11, 23 Feb 2004 (UTC)
One might consider the appropriateness of refering to Soto as a 'style' of Zen, or one of the three major 'Schools' (see the Wikipedia Editing Talk for Zen) of Japanese Zen. It is also accurate to refere to Zen and/or Zen Buddhism as a 'practice' rather than a religion or a philosophy as this is around what Zen (and especially Soto) centers (sitting). This comment added 17 October 2005 by MatthewStevenCarlos
There is no soteriology. To be "saved" is to be saved "from" something or some fate. But since zen rejects dualities, there is nothing to be saved from. There is only acceptance and embrace and unity (all manifestations of the one reality). Hu 20:51, 2004 Nov 19 (UTC)
This article really could use some work. It spends far too much time explaining about funeral rites and not nearly enough covering the founder, Dogen, the history beyond China, and a basic breakdown of beliefs. It's amazing that the main temple or honzan is not even mentioned in the article. I realize Zen is all about not getting hung up on words and all, but really, it doesn't excuse the format of this article. Zen is not my forte, so I won't risk making things worse, but can someone who is familiar with Zen help flesh out other parts of this article.
Advice to people writing this article: don't get hung up on what Zen is or isn't. Just imagine what a good encyclopedia article looks like and go nuts.
Thanks!
Gassho, -- Ph0kin ( talk) 04:25, 7 May 2008 (UTC)
Oddly enough it seems I can't add the link to the japanese 曹洞宗 (Soutou lineage) page because it's already in use by en.wiki page "Caodong". Although the link between Soutou-shuu and Caodong makes sense, I think the japanese page should be linked to this one, since Caodong deals with the chinese segment of this lineage which is known mainly in its japanese incarnation. 95.232.229.178 ( talk) 20:44, 25 September 2014 (UTC)
I'm afraid there's not, since the japanese page has a special section about the chinese part of the lineage and they don't need another one. I think only en.wiki (maybe other western wikis too) has a specific page on chinese Caodong - which is perfectly understandable - but as I said, the japanese branch (spelled Sōtō) should be linked here and not with Caodong. Keep up the good work :) 95.232.229.178 ( talk) 19:44, 28 September 2014 (UTC)
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@ Justsitting: please read WP:GETTHEPOINT regarding your re-insertion of WP:UNDUE info on Jiyu-Kennett:
It had always been Koho Zenji’s sincere wish that Soto Zen Buddhism be successfully transmitted to the West by a Westerner. He worked very hard to make it possible for Rev. Master Jiyu-Kennett to train in Japan and went to great lengths to ensure Buddhism spread to the west appropriately, making a point to meet President Dwight D. Eisenhower and ask for and receive permission to spread Buddhism in the United States of America. (Source: Koho Zenji, Keido Chisan (2000). Soto Zen: An Introduction to the Thought of the Serene Reflection Meditation School of Buddhism. https://www.shastaabbey.org/pdf/bookSotoZen.pdf: Shasta Abbey Press. ISBN 0-930066-09-X.
{{ cite book}}
: External link in( help))
|location=
Please familiarize yourself with the basics of Wikipedia, before you continue editing. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 20:27, 20 June 2018 (UTC)
@
MichaelMaggs:
ye last time it took abt 2 months on the talk page and people still didn't respond until i started removing stuff..
"at the time" refers to the fact that the article is trying to equate soto to caodong, directly associate them or call it a continuation, trying to imply that shikantaza was a term also used before the formation of the soto school/before dogen. the line right before it basically says it was the japanese version of chinese caodong but nowhere in caodong do we find the word shikantaza or for ex. the description of meditation provided in the article, which was one of the other complaints.
the article even mentions the soto practices were based on generic buddhist meditations, types that were not only not mentioned, but often rejected when mentioned in the caodong texts.
can you just set it back
it's super annoying if people blindly and without the proper education and information edit pages or revert edits that cleans up the mistakes they should have been cleaning up and watching out for. it's also rude as hell. you could've just opened a talk page yourself and mention the list of issues and i would've explained it to you..
it's weird that i have to explain my edit on a talk page and you just get to do, edit and revert whatever here.. 62.145.195.100 ( talk) 09:35, 18 January 2024 (UTC)
shikantaza is not mentioned anywhere in caodong and the wording of the lead makes it seem like false equivalence.
either remove the last part of the first paragraph or rewrite it in a way it doesn't imply an equivalence between soto and chinese caodong, between shikantaza and caodong, because there isn't a single caodong text anywhere talking about shikantaza. 62.145.197.22 ( talk) 13:23, 20 January 2024 (UTC)
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I changed the structure of the article, corrected some false statements and I added some info about the history and texts Hippocrates
The article is a bit strange now - did Dogen found the sect or not..? (the article isn't clear about it) Hippocrates
I am a Soto Zen Buddhist, have been for some time now. It is my religion... most of the people in my temple would answer the question "What is your religion?" with "Soto Zen." We've discussed this in dharma talks and group discussions at length. -Lisa Mann
Soto is (or was) one of the five sects of Zen-Buddhism not in Japan but in China. Two of the five are Soto and Rinzai. I don't know how to spell other three sects in English: Igyo, Un-mon, and Ho-gen, maybe. In Japan Soto and Rinzai (and Obaku) are the main zen sects, I believe. Miya 04:11, 23 Feb 2004 (UTC)
One might consider the appropriateness of refering to Soto as a 'style' of Zen, or one of the three major 'Schools' (see the Wikipedia Editing Talk for Zen) of Japanese Zen. It is also accurate to refere to Zen and/or Zen Buddhism as a 'practice' rather than a religion or a philosophy as this is around what Zen (and especially Soto) centers (sitting). This comment added 17 October 2005 by MatthewStevenCarlos
There is no soteriology. To be "saved" is to be saved "from" something or some fate. But since zen rejects dualities, there is nothing to be saved from. There is only acceptance and embrace and unity (all manifestations of the one reality). Hu 20:51, 2004 Nov 19 (UTC)
This article really could use some work. It spends far too much time explaining about funeral rites and not nearly enough covering the founder, Dogen, the history beyond China, and a basic breakdown of beliefs. It's amazing that the main temple or honzan is not even mentioned in the article. I realize Zen is all about not getting hung up on words and all, but really, it doesn't excuse the format of this article. Zen is not my forte, so I won't risk making things worse, but can someone who is familiar with Zen help flesh out other parts of this article.
Advice to people writing this article: don't get hung up on what Zen is or isn't. Just imagine what a good encyclopedia article looks like and go nuts.
Thanks!
Gassho, -- Ph0kin ( talk) 04:25, 7 May 2008 (UTC)
Oddly enough it seems I can't add the link to the japanese 曹洞宗 (Soutou lineage) page because it's already in use by en.wiki page "Caodong". Although the link between Soutou-shuu and Caodong makes sense, I think the japanese page should be linked to this one, since Caodong deals with the chinese segment of this lineage which is known mainly in its japanese incarnation. 95.232.229.178 ( talk) 20:44, 25 September 2014 (UTC)
I'm afraid there's not, since the japanese page has a special section about the chinese part of the lineage and they don't need another one. I think only en.wiki (maybe other western wikis too) has a specific page on chinese Caodong - which is perfectly understandable - but as I said, the japanese branch (spelled Sōtō) should be linked here and not with Caodong. Keep up the good work :) 95.232.229.178 ( talk) 19:44, 28 September 2014 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Sōtō. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{
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).
An editor has reviewed this edit and fixed any errors that were found.
Cheers.— cyberbot II Talk to my owner:Online 02:38, 5 April 2016 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 3 external links on Sōtō. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
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(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 12:49, 7 December 2017 (UTC)
@ Justsitting: please read WP:GETTHEPOINT regarding your re-insertion of WP:UNDUE info on Jiyu-Kennett:
It had always been Koho Zenji’s sincere wish that Soto Zen Buddhism be successfully transmitted to the West by a Westerner. He worked very hard to make it possible for Rev. Master Jiyu-Kennett to train in Japan and went to great lengths to ensure Buddhism spread to the west appropriately, making a point to meet President Dwight D. Eisenhower and ask for and receive permission to spread Buddhism in the United States of America. (Source: Koho Zenji, Keido Chisan (2000). Soto Zen: An Introduction to the Thought of the Serene Reflection Meditation School of Buddhism. https://www.shastaabbey.org/pdf/bookSotoZen.pdf: Shasta Abbey Press. ISBN 0-930066-09-X.
{{ cite book}}
: External link in( help))
|location=
Please familiarize yourself with the basics of Wikipedia, before you continue editing. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 20:27, 20 June 2018 (UTC)
@
MichaelMaggs:
ye last time it took abt 2 months on the talk page and people still didn't respond until i started removing stuff..
"at the time" refers to the fact that the article is trying to equate soto to caodong, directly associate them or call it a continuation, trying to imply that shikantaza was a term also used before the formation of the soto school/before dogen. the line right before it basically says it was the japanese version of chinese caodong but nowhere in caodong do we find the word shikantaza or for ex. the description of meditation provided in the article, which was one of the other complaints.
the article even mentions the soto practices were based on generic buddhist meditations, types that were not only not mentioned, but often rejected when mentioned in the caodong texts.
can you just set it back
it's super annoying if people blindly and without the proper education and information edit pages or revert edits that cleans up the mistakes they should have been cleaning up and watching out for. it's also rude as hell. you could've just opened a talk page yourself and mention the list of issues and i would've explained it to you..
it's weird that i have to explain my edit on a talk page and you just get to do, edit and revert whatever here.. 62.145.195.100 ( talk) 09:35, 18 January 2024 (UTC)
shikantaza is not mentioned anywhere in caodong and the wording of the lead makes it seem like false equivalence.
either remove the last part of the first paragraph or rewrite it in a way it doesn't imply an equivalence between soto and chinese caodong, between shikantaza and caodong, because there isn't a single caodong text anywhere talking about shikantaza. 62.145.197.22 ( talk) 13:23, 20 January 2024 (UTC)