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I think the Human rights watch article is being misquoted. following the link it mentions 140,000 but this could be during the prisoner's lifetime. Indeed elsewhere on their site they have this quote:
http://www.hrw.org/en/news/2007/12/15/us-federal-statistics-show-widespread-prison-rape
"Given a national prison population of 1,570,861, the BJS findings suggest that in one year alone more than 70,000 prisoners were sexually abused"
78.86.146.15 ( talk) 07:45, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
Not only that, but the author of this article is comparing a single study to a meta-analysis that includes that study. Why single out the first study at all? Also note that the first study is actually citing a different study done 5 years earlier! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.176.28.103 ( talk) 16:19, 10 February 2010 (UTC)
I was confused by this bit:
"More likely" than who or what? 174.111.242.35 ( talk) 02:17, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
Does anyone have any real proof that this has actually happened? It all sounds like anti-gay rhetoric to me.
Would it be considered inflammaory or advancing the neutrality of this article to include a point of view pertaining to the following:
“prisoners are convinced that prison rape is an integral part of the prison punishment system,” adding that inmates frequently contend that “…prison rape is sanctioned by prison authorities. They view it as the ultimate method of control and punishment” (1974, p. X). It is in this manner that the prison staff essentially serves to perpetuate and exacerbate the labeling process for “homosexuals” within the prison."
Source being: Weiss, C. & Friar, D. J. (1974). Terror in prisons: Homosexual rape and why society condones it. Indianapolis: Bobbs-Merril, Inc.
Excerpt obtained from: http://www.shsu.edu/~piic/summer2002/Hanser.htm
Reporduction permission unknown / unstated. Xiaou 23:45, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
The [un-named and un-verifiable] mother of a [un-named and un-verifiable] rape victim who committed suicide in prison testified in Congress that a [un-named and un-verifiable] prison warden told her before her son’s suicide that, “This happens to everbody. Learn to deal with it. It’s no big deal.”
Proof? Citation? This sounds like B.S. tripe to me. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.154.29.110 ( talk) 07:31, November 2, 2005 (UTC)
"Black-on-black rape is by far the most common aggressor/victim combination in that State." Citation? Proof? Statistics? 209.195.139.131 16:18, 19 January 2006 (UTC)
Do we really need an external link to a well-known hate group? Keep in mind that having it casts a different light on the race section in the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.158.102.180 ( talk) 16:40, June 8, 2006 (UTC)
"There appears to be significant variation in the rates of prison rape by race, as documented by Human Rights Watch [1]. Usually in US male prisons, perpetrators seem to be mostly African Americans. [[[see also down-low]]. Victims tend to be weak or isolated white men."
I don't see what the down-low has to do with prison rape. I see that this statement seems to suggest that only black men are on the down-low so I'm removing the link from this paragraph. While both topics may deal with sexual activity among memebers of the same sex, prison rape is a brutal crime that has to with particpation in sexual activity that is against the will of another, that can be perpetuated by a person of any racial group. Where as being on the down-low merely enatils secretly engaging in sexual activity with memebers of the same sex regardless of racial identity. Even though it is possible that there are prisoners on the down-low who may be involved in prison rape, neither activity precludes, nor requires the other. If anyone diagrees, I'm listening. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.135.35.20 ( talk • contribs) 14:52, July 30, 2006 (UTC)
That and it's incredibly biased (the part where the article states that comedians who joke about homosexuals enjoying rape are bigoted). Also, there are no citations and the entire artice seems to be based on original research/one persons opinion.
No pun intended. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.235.65.190 ( talk) 08:07, August 22, 2006 (UTC)
This needs a complete re-write with sourced material. This is a lot of BS. Very bad article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Fourdee ( talk • contribs) 12:23, August 27, 2006
I took at stab at gutting out the unsubstantiatable or non-encyclopedic stuff from this article and re-ordering it a bit so that information falls under the heading it belongs. I actually ripped out all the race stuff because I figured it could be added back in more deliberately if references or anything like that were found. Eh, I dunno, revert me if you want. Or, use this as a starting block. What is there now and unreferenced I'm pretty sure could easily be, and I'll probably come back and do that tomorrow! -- joeOnSunset 06:18, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
Should there be a mention of Stephen Donaldson, since he spearheaded so much of the group? Rsm99833 06:24, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
It seems to me there is alot of overlap between prison sexuality and prison rape. They essentially are talking about the same thing. Shouldn't a merger be in order? Justinmeister 19:52, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
It was Donaldson's contention that the phrase "prison rape" was a bad construction meaning literally the rape of a prison. He recommended "prisoner rape" as the proper construction. Hence the article "prison rape" should redirect to "prisoner rape". Since there is a distinction between "prisoners" and the more general class of those in "custody" the question of whether "prisoner rape" should redirect to "custodial rape" reduces to whether those should be separate articles. Jim Bowery 06:57, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
Should there be something about prisoner rape in pop culture? I know that over the last ten or fifteen years the concept of rape has become one of the dominant themes in popular conceptions of prison life. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.218.221.152 ( talk) 22:26, April 25, 2007 (UTC)
Yes there should be. The information exists and it has been linked to the issue in other fora. -- Wonder J ( talk) 23:42, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
I've added the US-centric tag to the article because nearly the entire thing refers only to US examples, organisations, statistics, etc. Perhaps it is because of a lack of sufficient examples from other countries, but the article uses only the US Justice Department, only US figures, etc, as evidence of the wider "prison rape" (which I'd assume would happen nearly everywhere). Bronzey ( talk) 03:13, 12 January 2008 (UTC)
I propose that this article be moved to or a new article be created called Prison rape in the United States) or Prison rape (United States) incorporating relevant text from this article, and a new article be created here, utilizing, as much as possible, summary style. I have come across articles on the topic in Australia and the United Kingdom. I am not sure how exactly to structure it but I think the least biased way would be to use the country names as sections to refer to main articles such as Prison rape in the United Kingdom or Prison rape in Australia when they are needed. Subsections of specific national relevance could be included in the new Prison rape article as well as, eventually in the country main article. Thoughts?-- Aujourd'hui, maman est morte ( talk) 07:06, 8 June 2008 (UTC)
-- Aujourd'hui, maman est morte ( talk) 05:43, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
The result of the proposal was no consensus. In the meantime, I have done as 70.55.85.122 suggested and created Prison rape with the intro of this article. Continue as consensus so chooses. JPG-GR ( talk) 20:46, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
i think we should write the general "prison rape" article first, then deal with detailed region-specific forks as and where appropriate. This article may be hopelessly US-centric at the moment, but that's a reason for a {{ global}} tag and rewrites, not a narrowing of the article's whole focus to the over-represented area. tomasz. 09:08, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
I think that Prison rape should be moved to Prison Rape to make it capitalized. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.237.222.73 ( talk) 13:06, 15 June 2009 (UTC)
It seems there hasn't been much action on this for a while, but I think this entry sorely needs to be improved. I am going to work on a new version, if anyone else would like to help, that would be great.
Justdetention ( talk) 13:51, 26 April 2010 (UTC)
I think that there's still an ongoing debate about that subject, but I don't think that ALLWAYS (as the article implies) the rape in jail is for power and domination rather than sex, specially because of the severe limitation of the inmates for sexual partners and their sexual needs. Of course that the need for power and domination is also a factor but the only? or the main? I'm not sure of that and shut be references for that declaration. -- Lucifer2000 ( talk) 01:55, 23 May 2010 (UTC)
There is no prison rape in Scandinavia and perhaps not in continental Europe. This is probably related to the concept of homosexuality. In hyper Christian societies, like USA and El Salvador, the view of homosexuality seems to be related to the Biblical definition. Effeteness. If a masculine male rapes an effeminate male, only the effete male is gay. In Europe both are gay. Not that there is anything wrong with being gay. The idea to have sex with another male just never enters the mind of a straight European male. Not because they are more male or masculine. It is a cultural thing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.253.73.146 ( talk) 12:59, 8 October 2016 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Prison rape article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
![]() | The use of the contentious topics procedure has been authorised by the community for pages related to Uyghurs, Uyghur genocide, or topics that are related to Uyghurs or Uyghur genocide, including this page. Editors who repeatedly or seriously fail to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process may be sanctioned. |
![]() |
Wikipedia is not censored. Images or details contained within this article may be graphic or otherwise objectionable to some readers, to ensure a quality article and complete coverage of its subject matter. For more information, please refer to Wikipedia's content disclaimer regarding potentially objectionable content and options for not seeing an image. |
![]() | This ![]() It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||
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![]() | It is requested that an image or photograph of Prison rape be
included in this article to
improve its quality. Please replace this template with a more specific
media request template where possible.
The Free Image Search Tool or Openverse Creative Commons Search may be able to locate suitable images on Flickr and other web sites. |
I think the Human rights watch article is being misquoted. following the link it mentions 140,000 but this could be during the prisoner's lifetime. Indeed elsewhere on their site they have this quote:
http://www.hrw.org/en/news/2007/12/15/us-federal-statistics-show-widespread-prison-rape
"Given a national prison population of 1,570,861, the BJS findings suggest that in one year alone more than 70,000 prisoners were sexually abused"
78.86.146.15 ( talk) 07:45, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
Not only that, but the author of this article is comparing a single study to a meta-analysis that includes that study. Why single out the first study at all? Also note that the first study is actually citing a different study done 5 years earlier! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.176.28.103 ( talk) 16:19, 10 February 2010 (UTC)
I was confused by this bit:
"More likely" than who or what? 174.111.242.35 ( talk) 02:17, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
Does anyone have any real proof that this has actually happened? It all sounds like anti-gay rhetoric to me.
Would it be considered inflammaory or advancing the neutrality of this article to include a point of view pertaining to the following:
“prisoners are convinced that prison rape is an integral part of the prison punishment system,” adding that inmates frequently contend that “…prison rape is sanctioned by prison authorities. They view it as the ultimate method of control and punishment” (1974, p. X). It is in this manner that the prison staff essentially serves to perpetuate and exacerbate the labeling process for “homosexuals” within the prison."
Source being: Weiss, C. & Friar, D. J. (1974). Terror in prisons: Homosexual rape and why society condones it. Indianapolis: Bobbs-Merril, Inc.
Excerpt obtained from: http://www.shsu.edu/~piic/summer2002/Hanser.htm
Reporduction permission unknown / unstated. Xiaou 23:45, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
The [un-named and un-verifiable] mother of a [un-named and un-verifiable] rape victim who committed suicide in prison testified in Congress that a [un-named and un-verifiable] prison warden told her before her son’s suicide that, “This happens to everbody. Learn to deal with it. It’s no big deal.”
Proof? Citation? This sounds like B.S. tripe to me. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.154.29.110 ( talk) 07:31, November 2, 2005 (UTC)
"Black-on-black rape is by far the most common aggressor/victim combination in that State." Citation? Proof? Statistics? 209.195.139.131 16:18, 19 January 2006 (UTC)
Do we really need an external link to a well-known hate group? Keep in mind that having it casts a different light on the race section in the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.158.102.180 ( talk) 16:40, June 8, 2006 (UTC)
"There appears to be significant variation in the rates of prison rape by race, as documented by Human Rights Watch [1]. Usually in US male prisons, perpetrators seem to be mostly African Americans. [[[see also down-low]]. Victims tend to be weak or isolated white men."
I don't see what the down-low has to do with prison rape. I see that this statement seems to suggest that only black men are on the down-low so I'm removing the link from this paragraph. While both topics may deal with sexual activity among memebers of the same sex, prison rape is a brutal crime that has to with particpation in sexual activity that is against the will of another, that can be perpetuated by a person of any racial group. Where as being on the down-low merely enatils secretly engaging in sexual activity with memebers of the same sex regardless of racial identity. Even though it is possible that there are prisoners on the down-low who may be involved in prison rape, neither activity precludes, nor requires the other. If anyone diagrees, I'm listening. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.135.35.20 ( talk • contribs) 14:52, July 30, 2006 (UTC)
That and it's incredibly biased (the part where the article states that comedians who joke about homosexuals enjoying rape are bigoted). Also, there are no citations and the entire artice seems to be based on original research/one persons opinion.
No pun intended. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.235.65.190 ( talk) 08:07, August 22, 2006 (UTC)
This needs a complete re-write with sourced material. This is a lot of BS. Very bad article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Fourdee ( talk • contribs) 12:23, August 27, 2006
I took at stab at gutting out the unsubstantiatable or non-encyclopedic stuff from this article and re-ordering it a bit so that information falls under the heading it belongs. I actually ripped out all the race stuff because I figured it could be added back in more deliberately if references or anything like that were found. Eh, I dunno, revert me if you want. Or, use this as a starting block. What is there now and unreferenced I'm pretty sure could easily be, and I'll probably come back and do that tomorrow! -- joeOnSunset 06:18, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
Should there be a mention of Stephen Donaldson, since he spearheaded so much of the group? Rsm99833 06:24, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
It seems to me there is alot of overlap between prison sexuality and prison rape. They essentially are talking about the same thing. Shouldn't a merger be in order? Justinmeister 19:52, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
It was Donaldson's contention that the phrase "prison rape" was a bad construction meaning literally the rape of a prison. He recommended "prisoner rape" as the proper construction. Hence the article "prison rape" should redirect to "prisoner rape". Since there is a distinction between "prisoners" and the more general class of those in "custody" the question of whether "prisoner rape" should redirect to "custodial rape" reduces to whether those should be separate articles. Jim Bowery 06:57, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
Should there be something about prisoner rape in pop culture? I know that over the last ten or fifteen years the concept of rape has become one of the dominant themes in popular conceptions of prison life. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.218.221.152 ( talk) 22:26, April 25, 2007 (UTC)
Yes there should be. The information exists and it has been linked to the issue in other fora. -- Wonder J ( talk) 23:42, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
I've added the US-centric tag to the article because nearly the entire thing refers only to US examples, organisations, statistics, etc. Perhaps it is because of a lack of sufficient examples from other countries, but the article uses only the US Justice Department, only US figures, etc, as evidence of the wider "prison rape" (which I'd assume would happen nearly everywhere). Bronzey ( talk) 03:13, 12 January 2008 (UTC)
I propose that this article be moved to or a new article be created called Prison rape in the United States) or Prison rape (United States) incorporating relevant text from this article, and a new article be created here, utilizing, as much as possible, summary style. I have come across articles on the topic in Australia and the United Kingdom. I am not sure how exactly to structure it but I think the least biased way would be to use the country names as sections to refer to main articles such as Prison rape in the United Kingdom or Prison rape in Australia when they are needed. Subsections of specific national relevance could be included in the new Prison rape article as well as, eventually in the country main article. Thoughts?-- Aujourd'hui, maman est morte ( talk) 07:06, 8 June 2008 (UTC)
-- Aujourd'hui, maman est morte ( talk) 05:43, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
The result of the proposal was no consensus. In the meantime, I have done as 70.55.85.122 suggested and created Prison rape with the intro of this article. Continue as consensus so chooses. JPG-GR ( talk) 20:46, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
i think we should write the general "prison rape" article first, then deal with detailed region-specific forks as and where appropriate. This article may be hopelessly US-centric at the moment, but that's a reason for a {{ global}} tag and rewrites, not a narrowing of the article's whole focus to the over-represented area. tomasz. 09:08, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
I think that Prison rape should be moved to Prison Rape to make it capitalized. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.237.222.73 ( talk) 13:06, 15 June 2009 (UTC)
It seems there hasn't been much action on this for a while, but I think this entry sorely needs to be improved. I am going to work on a new version, if anyone else would like to help, that would be great.
Justdetention ( talk) 13:51, 26 April 2010 (UTC)
I think that there's still an ongoing debate about that subject, but I don't think that ALLWAYS (as the article implies) the rape in jail is for power and domination rather than sex, specially because of the severe limitation of the inmates for sexual partners and their sexual needs. Of course that the need for power and domination is also a factor but the only? or the main? I'm not sure of that and shut be references for that declaration. -- Lucifer2000 ( talk) 01:55, 23 May 2010 (UTC)
There is no prison rape in Scandinavia and perhaps not in continental Europe. This is probably related to the concept of homosexuality. In hyper Christian societies, like USA and El Salvador, the view of homosexuality seems to be related to the Biblical definition. Effeteness. If a masculine male rapes an effeminate male, only the effete male is gay. In Europe both are gay. Not that there is anything wrong with being gay. The idea to have sex with another male just never enters the mind of a straight European male. Not because they are more male or masculine. It is a cultural thing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.253.73.146 ( talk) 12:59, 8 October 2016 (UTC)