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This is a messed-up, improperly plural, copy and paste move, with most of the history left behind at Pound-force per square inch. See the revision history. Gene Nygaard 02:28, 6 October 2007 (UTC)
Can someone source this "pound-force per square inch" business? Pounds are a unit of force. You wouldn't say "newton-force per square meter". The newton is a unit of force. "Force" is redundant. Who says "pound-force"? Robert K S ( talk) 17:12, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
In the english engineering system of units force and mass are both measured in lbs therefore pound-mass (lbm) and pound-force (lbf) are used to distinguish between the two. Also, a correction is required on this page. KSI is kilo pounds per square inch but KIP is kilo pounds.
I agree, the sentence about kip is wrong, additionally though, KSI is kip per square inch, a kip is a unit of force = 1000 lb. I think the terminology altogether should be clarified to kip per square inch, since a kip is much more common than is kilo-pound(I know kip is just an abbreviation for kilo-pound, but you rarely hear kilo-pound) 98.245.222.145 ( talk) 04:48, 12 April 2011 (UTC)
The article begins well enough describing PSI, but then in the Magnitude section it uses terms like psia, psid, and psig which are never defined... what are these??? Hydradix ( talk) 05:47, 13 August 2016 (UTC)
In the English speaking world, steam locomotive boiler pressures are normally expressed as x lb/in2. In Europe, they are normally expressed as x kg/cm2. Question is, how do you convert one to the other? Mjroots ( talk) 08:58, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
Enter "5 kg per square cm in psi" into google
Gauge pressure is not relative to a standard or fixed atmospheric condition. It is relative to the surrounding atmosphere. A gas cylinder with the same absolute pressure would have different gauge pressures at sea level than at a higher altitude since the corresponding atmospheric pressures would be different. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.49.102.50 ( talk) 12:37, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
user:217.207.165.251 asked
Firstly it's not possible to do exactly this. kg is a unit of mass (not weight), pressure requires units of force. These have long been confused, but the SI system tries to be a little stricter in their use. So the nearest SI equivalent to this would be kgf/cm2 using the kilogram-force unit (weight) rather than the kilogram.
Then there's already the convenient unit of the technical atmosphere, which is equal to 1 kgf/cm2 (it's also within a few % of the usual standard atmosphere). This is in the article's conversion table already, maybe it just needs some clearer captioning?
Hope this helps Andy Dingley ( talk) 11:24, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
I think that it would be a good idea to make clear whether the word "bike" in the sentence "Bike tire overpressure (common): Pg = 65 psi" refers to a motorcycle or a bicycle. 82.181.76.251 ( talk) 01:55, 3 September 2009 (UTC)
"1 psi equals 6,894.757 Pa," Is it 6,894757 Pa, or 6894.757 Pa? Bo Jacoby ( talk) 12:06, 19 July 2010 (UTC).
If 1 psi = 6.894757 kpa (or 6.895 * 103 pa), then it should not be shortened (as in the table) to 1 psi = 6.894 * 103 pa. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.244.145.229 ( talk) 17:16, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
Full SCBA Self Contained Breathing Apparatus for toxic atmospheres Full SCBA (Self Contained Breathing Apparatus) for toxic atmospheres
SCBA stands for self contained breathing apparatus so its saying the same thing twice like it is? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.198.1.161 ( talk) 05:21, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
The result of the proposal was not moved. -- BDD ( talk) 19:28, 28 December 2013 (UTC)
Pounds per square inch → Pound per square inch – Article title should be in singular form per WP:AT and WP:PLURAL. Quest for Truth ( talk) 19:40, 9 December 2013 (UTC)
*'''Support'''
or *'''Oppose'''
, then sign your comment with ~~~~
. Since
polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account
Wikipedia's policy on article titles.
Ok, how about Wikipedia:Ignore all rules? Starting the discussion appealing to a ruleset seems to be getting rather common around here, but let the record show that as long as people use psi, the article is correctly named and practical reasoning can prevail. I like to saw logs! ( talk) 05:44, 10 December 2013 (UTC)
I found a previous discussion at Wikipedia talk:Article titles/Archive 11#RfC: Should titles of article on units of the form "X per Y" be singular or plural?. -- Quest for Truth ( talk) 09:41, 10 December 2013 (UTC)
Expecting English (or American, or any of the other derivative languages) to be consistent ... not going to happen. There's a huge pile of rules, and "Be consistent" is not one of them. I understand the desire for consistency, but there is no Committee of Proper (no, Correct) English (no, American) to set such things. In a century or three, doubtless the rules will change. Again. As they have before. htom ( talk) 18:18, 10 December 2013 (UTC)
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Why is this article entitled in the plural? It should be the singular 'Pound per square inch', like all other articles on units (foot, not feet; pound, not pounds; kilogram, not kilograms; second, not seconds). Dondervogel 2 ( talk) 15:01, 31 December 2016 (UTC)
WP:PLURAL suggests no such thing. It actually states Measurements involving two or more units (such as pounds per square inch or miles per hour) should usually have the first word in the plural, which is quite correct. The name of the unit is not subject to WP naming conventions anyway, they are defined and exist in their own right. In the case of pounds per square inch or miles per hour the variable unit is always plural because the value will be a multiple or fraction of this unit and the fixed unit is singular because it is always unity. 'Foot pounds' is singular because the value is the product of the two units and neither is fixed. Pounds per squares inches, or square inches per pound (which I have never seen but is feasible) would indicate how many square inches supports one pound. I have been an engineer for forty years and I have never seen the expression pound per square inch and it only comes up in Google in connection with WP. Please, if you have no background in physics units maybe leave it people who actually use them. E x nihil ( talk) 01:23, 10 June 2017 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: not moved. Discussion continues at WT:PLURAL. ( closed by non-admin page mover) — Guan aco 07:09, 18 June 2017 (UTC)
Pounds per square inch →
Pound per square inch – Unit name should be singular, not plural, per
WP:PLURAL
Rracecarr (
talk)
17:31, 9 June 2017 (UTC)
References
The guideline now clearly states that the article title should be in the singular, not plural, ostensibly requiring a move to Pound per square inch. However, to avoid having to change the title twice, let's consider first whether the correct name should be Pound-force per square inch. My own preference is the latter, on the grounds that the psi is a unit of pressure (force per unit area), not mass per unit area. Thoughts anyone? Dondervogel 2 ( talk) 23:56, 4 July 2017 (UTC)
References
I looked at why the recently added convert gives a different value from that shown in the lead.
{{convert|1|psi|Pa|sigfig=7|abbr=on}}
→ 1 psi (6,894.757 Pa)Convert defines the relevant units as shown below. That is followed by some calculations showing why the lead was displaying wrong and inconsistent values.
1 lbf = 4.4482216152605 N 1 sqin = 0.00064516 m² 1 psi = 4.4482216152605/0.00064516 = 6894.75729317 Pa 4.4482/(0.0254*0.0254) ≈ 6894.7237894 → 6894.724 4.44822/(0.0254*0.0254) ≈ 6894.7547895 → 6894.755 4.448222/(0.0254*0.0254) ≈ 6894.7578895 → 6894.758 4.4482216/(0.0254*0.0254) ≈ 6894.7572695 → 6894.757
The correct value appears to be 6894.757, but achieving that requires 8 significant figures for the inputs, as shown in the last calculation. That seems excessive but it might be best, so I put it in the article. Johnuniq ( talk) 03:23, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved ( non-admin closure) ~~ CAPTAIN MEDUSA talk 11:08, 16 November 2019 (UTC)
Pound per square inch → Pounds per square inch – RV undiscussed move, against COMMONNAME Andy Dingley ( talk) 10:52, 16 November 2019 (UTC) Andy Dingley ( talk) 10:54, 16 November 2019 (UTC)
Just a note to record my strong objection to today's irrational move. This is the name of a unit of pressure. Like other units of pressure ( pascal, bar, atmosphere, millimetre of mercury, inch of mercury, torr, etc) the name of the article be singular. There is no *logical* reason to use the plural. Dondervogel 2 ( talk) 19:21, 16 November 2019 (UTC)
And the argument that external sources use "pounds" as the name of a unit is nonsensical. The unit (of mass) is the avoirdupois pound and that's what reliable sources call it, often abbreviated as just "pound", but always in the singular. Just like "metres" is the plural of the name "metre". A simple rule of English grammar. Dondervogel 2 ( talk) 00:02, 17 November 2019 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Moved per WP:PLURAL ( non-admin closure) ( t · c) buidhe 15:33, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
Pounds per square inch →
Pound per square inch – all titles use singular
151.231.196.178 (
talk) 21:47, 24 May 2021 (UTC) —Relisting. ~
Aseleste
(
t,
e |
c,
l)
15:11, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
It is usefull to know and i need to know It because i need to write something in my school project 109.166.138.207 ( talk) 20:10, 15 May 2022 (UTC)
Perhaps it's just an isolated incident, but the text in conversions is overlapped with source code. I'm not sure how to edit it. Edit: This also happened on the page for a Vacuum. I think it's something to do with my session. TophatGuy14 ( talk) 01:50, 29 June 2022 (UTC)
The redirect Ksi has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 October 15 § Ksi until a consensus is reached. Morbidthoughts ( talk) 02:21, 15 October 2023 (UTC)
This
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Daily pageviews of this article
A graph should have been displayed here but
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Reporting errors |
This is a messed-up, improperly plural, copy and paste move, with most of the history left behind at Pound-force per square inch. See the revision history. Gene Nygaard 02:28, 6 October 2007 (UTC)
Can someone source this "pound-force per square inch" business? Pounds are a unit of force. You wouldn't say "newton-force per square meter". The newton is a unit of force. "Force" is redundant. Who says "pound-force"? Robert K S ( talk) 17:12, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
In the english engineering system of units force and mass are both measured in lbs therefore pound-mass (lbm) and pound-force (lbf) are used to distinguish between the two. Also, a correction is required on this page. KSI is kilo pounds per square inch but KIP is kilo pounds.
I agree, the sentence about kip is wrong, additionally though, KSI is kip per square inch, a kip is a unit of force = 1000 lb. I think the terminology altogether should be clarified to kip per square inch, since a kip is much more common than is kilo-pound(I know kip is just an abbreviation for kilo-pound, but you rarely hear kilo-pound) 98.245.222.145 ( talk) 04:48, 12 April 2011 (UTC)
The article begins well enough describing PSI, but then in the Magnitude section it uses terms like psia, psid, and psig which are never defined... what are these??? Hydradix ( talk) 05:47, 13 August 2016 (UTC)
In the English speaking world, steam locomotive boiler pressures are normally expressed as x lb/in2. In Europe, they are normally expressed as x kg/cm2. Question is, how do you convert one to the other? Mjroots ( talk) 08:58, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
Enter "5 kg per square cm in psi" into google
Gauge pressure is not relative to a standard or fixed atmospheric condition. It is relative to the surrounding atmosphere. A gas cylinder with the same absolute pressure would have different gauge pressures at sea level than at a higher altitude since the corresponding atmospheric pressures would be different. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.49.102.50 ( talk) 12:37, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
user:217.207.165.251 asked
Firstly it's not possible to do exactly this. kg is a unit of mass (not weight), pressure requires units of force. These have long been confused, but the SI system tries to be a little stricter in their use. So the nearest SI equivalent to this would be kgf/cm2 using the kilogram-force unit (weight) rather than the kilogram.
Then there's already the convenient unit of the technical atmosphere, which is equal to 1 kgf/cm2 (it's also within a few % of the usual standard atmosphere). This is in the article's conversion table already, maybe it just needs some clearer captioning?
Hope this helps Andy Dingley ( talk) 11:24, 3 July 2009 (UTC)
I think that it would be a good idea to make clear whether the word "bike" in the sentence "Bike tire overpressure (common): Pg = 65 psi" refers to a motorcycle or a bicycle. 82.181.76.251 ( talk) 01:55, 3 September 2009 (UTC)
"1 psi equals 6,894.757 Pa," Is it 6,894757 Pa, or 6894.757 Pa? Bo Jacoby ( talk) 12:06, 19 July 2010 (UTC).
If 1 psi = 6.894757 kpa (or 6.895 * 103 pa), then it should not be shortened (as in the table) to 1 psi = 6.894 * 103 pa. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.244.145.229 ( talk) 17:16, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
Full SCBA Self Contained Breathing Apparatus for toxic atmospheres Full SCBA (Self Contained Breathing Apparatus) for toxic atmospheres
SCBA stands for self contained breathing apparatus so its saying the same thing twice like it is? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.198.1.161 ( talk) 05:21, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
The result of the proposal was not moved. -- BDD ( talk) 19:28, 28 December 2013 (UTC)
Pounds per square inch → Pound per square inch – Article title should be in singular form per WP:AT and WP:PLURAL. Quest for Truth ( talk) 19:40, 9 December 2013 (UTC)
*'''Support'''
or *'''Oppose'''
, then sign your comment with ~~~~
. Since
polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account
Wikipedia's policy on article titles.
Ok, how about Wikipedia:Ignore all rules? Starting the discussion appealing to a ruleset seems to be getting rather common around here, but let the record show that as long as people use psi, the article is correctly named and practical reasoning can prevail. I like to saw logs! ( talk) 05:44, 10 December 2013 (UTC)
I found a previous discussion at Wikipedia talk:Article titles/Archive 11#RfC: Should titles of article on units of the form "X per Y" be singular or plural?. -- Quest for Truth ( talk) 09:41, 10 December 2013 (UTC)
Expecting English (or American, or any of the other derivative languages) to be consistent ... not going to happen. There's a huge pile of rules, and "Be consistent" is not one of them. I understand the desire for consistency, but there is no Committee of Proper (no, Correct) English (no, American) to set such things. In a century or three, doubtless the rules will change. Again. As they have before. htom ( talk) 18:18, 10 December 2013 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to one external link on
Pounds per square inch. Please take a moment to review
my edit. If necessary, add {{
cbignore}}
after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{
nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}}
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.
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(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— cyberbot II Talk to my owner:Online 19:03, 24 February 2016 (UTC)
Why is this article entitled in the plural? It should be the singular 'Pound per square inch', like all other articles on units (foot, not feet; pound, not pounds; kilogram, not kilograms; second, not seconds). Dondervogel 2 ( talk) 15:01, 31 December 2016 (UTC)
WP:PLURAL suggests no such thing. It actually states Measurements involving two or more units (such as pounds per square inch or miles per hour) should usually have the first word in the plural, which is quite correct. The name of the unit is not subject to WP naming conventions anyway, they are defined and exist in their own right. In the case of pounds per square inch or miles per hour the variable unit is always plural because the value will be a multiple or fraction of this unit and the fixed unit is singular because it is always unity. 'Foot pounds' is singular because the value is the product of the two units and neither is fixed. Pounds per squares inches, or square inches per pound (which I have never seen but is feasible) would indicate how many square inches supports one pound. I have been an engineer for forty years and I have never seen the expression pound per square inch and it only comes up in Google in connection with WP. Please, if you have no background in physics units maybe leave it people who actually use them. E x nihil ( talk) 01:23, 10 June 2017 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: not moved. Discussion continues at WT:PLURAL. ( closed by non-admin page mover) — Guan aco 07:09, 18 June 2017 (UTC)
Pounds per square inch →
Pound per square inch – Unit name should be singular, not plural, per
WP:PLURAL
Rracecarr (
talk)
17:31, 9 June 2017 (UTC)
References
The guideline now clearly states that the article title should be in the singular, not plural, ostensibly requiring a move to Pound per square inch. However, to avoid having to change the title twice, let's consider first whether the correct name should be Pound-force per square inch. My own preference is the latter, on the grounds that the psi is a unit of pressure (force per unit area), not mass per unit area. Thoughts anyone? Dondervogel 2 ( talk) 23:56, 4 July 2017 (UTC)
References
I looked at why the recently added convert gives a different value from that shown in the lead.
{{convert|1|psi|Pa|sigfig=7|abbr=on}}
→ 1 psi (6,894.757 Pa)Convert defines the relevant units as shown below. That is followed by some calculations showing why the lead was displaying wrong and inconsistent values.
1 lbf = 4.4482216152605 N 1 sqin = 0.00064516 m² 1 psi = 4.4482216152605/0.00064516 = 6894.75729317 Pa 4.4482/(0.0254*0.0254) ≈ 6894.7237894 → 6894.724 4.44822/(0.0254*0.0254) ≈ 6894.7547895 → 6894.755 4.448222/(0.0254*0.0254) ≈ 6894.7578895 → 6894.758 4.4482216/(0.0254*0.0254) ≈ 6894.7572695 → 6894.757
The correct value appears to be 6894.757, but achieving that requires 8 significant figures for the inputs, as shown in the last calculation. That seems excessive but it might be best, so I put it in the article. Johnuniq ( talk) 03:23, 4 October 2017 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved ( non-admin closure) ~~ CAPTAIN MEDUSA talk 11:08, 16 November 2019 (UTC)
Pound per square inch → Pounds per square inch – RV undiscussed move, against COMMONNAME Andy Dingley ( talk) 10:52, 16 November 2019 (UTC) Andy Dingley ( talk) 10:54, 16 November 2019 (UTC)
Just a note to record my strong objection to today's irrational move. This is the name of a unit of pressure. Like other units of pressure ( pascal, bar, atmosphere, millimetre of mercury, inch of mercury, torr, etc) the name of the article be singular. There is no *logical* reason to use the plural. Dondervogel 2 ( talk) 19:21, 16 November 2019 (UTC)
And the argument that external sources use "pounds" as the name of a unit is nonsensical. The unit (of mass) is the avoirdupois pound and that's what reliable sources call it, often abbreviated as just "pound", but always in the singular. Just like "metres" is the plural of the name "metre". A simple rule of English grammar. Dondervogel 2 ( talk) 00:02, 17 November 2019 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Moved per WP:PLURAL ( non-admin closure) ( t · c) buidhe 15:33, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
Pounds per square inch →
Pound per square inch – all titles use singular
151.231.196.178 (
talk) 21:47, 24 May 2021 (UTC) —Relisting. ~
Aseleste
(
t,
e |
c,
l)
15:11, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
It is usefull to know and i need to know It because i need to write something in my school project 109.166.138.207 ( talk) 20:10, 15 May 2022 (UTC)
Perhaps it's just an isolated incident, but the text in conversions is overlapped with source code. I'm not sure how to edit it. Edit: This also happened on the page for a Vacuum. I think it's something to do with my session. TophatGuy14 ( talk) 01:50, 29 June 2022 (UTC)
The redirect Ksi has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 October 15 § Ksi until a consensus is reached. Morbidthoughts ( talk) 02:21, 15 October 2023 (UTC)