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Need to add: mass production of cylinders; early dubbing methods; "Gold molded" cylinders
-Recordings went from tinfoil to wax in 1888, older recordings are unplayable.
-Oldest preserved recordings and where to hear them. (A 1888-89 CD from TINFOIL, the Brahms cylinder on "About a hundred years", Nina Grieg from 1889 spread across two CD's from SIMAX, more?)
-A more realistic assessment of the sound quality of these things; the CD compilation "About a hundred years" features both wax and disc recordings, and I agree with their assessment that it was the invention of the shellac disc in 1899 that turned records into anything more than "a noisy toy". The wax rolls have virtually no bass; how would a phonograph needle record bass? Much easier on a disc, where the needle can move sideways. Juryen 23:12, 31 August 2006 (UTC)
I thought I would add my $.02: I am a collector of both disc and cylinder records, and have the old machines to play them on. This has been my observation: just about any commercially produced cylinder from 1902 to 1914 sounds quite a bit better than disc records made until about 1924, that being the year when they started being recorded electrically. I haven't ever heard any of the soft wax cylinders made prior to the gold molded ones, so i can't vouch for them, but I have heard the first generation Amberol cylinders (these are hard wax, 4 minute, played with a saphire and made from 1908-1912) and the celulloid Blue Ambrol cylinders (these are 4 minute also, blue and color, and should only be played with the correct diamond reproducers; made from 1913-1929, though, after about 1915 the masters were dubbed from diamond disc masters), and these, when compared to any disc record made before 1924, are really quite astounding. Although Edison did expiriment with electrically recorded cylinder records in the late 1920's, it was'n until commercially issued disc records were made that the tone and range of disc records really surpassed that of the mature cylinder format.-WK--- 139.78.96.87 21:27, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
Hi, I am working to encourage implementation of the goals of the Wikipedia:Verifiability policy. Part of that is to make sure articles cite their sources. This is particularly important for featured articles, since they are a prominent part of Wikipedia. The Fact and Reference Check Project has more information. If some of the external links are reliable sources and were used as references, they can be placed in a References section too. See the cite sources link for how to format them. Thank you, and please leave me a message when a few references have been added to the article. - Taxman 19:39, Apr 22, 2005 (UTC)
The following objections to this article should be adressed: No lead. No references. Not a FA standard, certainly. Some sections are just a single sentence. -- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 09:33, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
An editor named Jeremy left these on my talk page, but I really don't know enough about the subject to help so I thought I'd move this here. My only connection with this page was asking for references. - Taxman Talk 12:16, 5 April 2006 (UTC)
Would suggest that the specific names of each of the three commercially designed plug-in models be reinstated. Someone has edited these out. However, I have noted that information on each may be sourced in the external link to Christer Hemp's Phonograph Makers Pages. Many readers would be interested in these. Jeremy Sefton-Parke. kinopanorama AT msn.com
Refer to chapter on preservation of cylinders. See paragraph two. Also, link to Phonograph Maker's pages. Believe that paragraph two could be expanded by someone, such as myself, without being seen to promote any such product as a vanity entry. Please advise.-- Kinopanorama widescreen 01:31, 5 April 2006 (UTC)
I've added the earliest known recording on Wikimedia Commons for use primarly in the Israel in Egypt (oratorio) article. However, it may perhaps find use here too (it was after all made on a yellow paraffine phonograph cylinder), in that case feel free to add it. I have no more time for editing stuff right now myself. :-) The Commons resource name is Handel - Israel in Egypt, HWV 54 (excerpt).oga, and can be linked to via a template like this, for example:
There are alternative templates too; for more information, see this: Template:Audio. -- Northgrove 00:42, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
Hi, possibly an even earlier recording (1885) link to CNN article, I don't know how to get the sound from the slideshow video! http://edition.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/meast/11/11/mecca.hajj.snouck/index.html?iref=allsearch -- 195.188.107.145 ( talk) 18:07, 15 November 2010 (UTC)
Hi, I'm working on a dissertation that, among other things, examines the use of phonographs. I have been trying to determine if wax cylinders were ever reused for different recording purposes, and this article is the first instance that I have found that indicates that they were. Can anyone point me toward a published book or article in which I could verify this information? My committee is leery of Wikipedia, unfortunately. Please leave me a message if you have such a reference. Bc.rox.all 21:03, 25 October 2006 (UTC)
<undent> There may be little doubt that Edison would have done something like that, but without verification from a published source that's exactly what we call "original research" which can't be accepted in articles. I've commented out the more speculative part of the sentence, rephrasing it to refer to the shaving mechanism described above: could someone with the source to hand please add a citation to make it clear where this information has been published. . dave souza, talk 19:48, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
I removed this link as it seemed to be in poor taste. A man who has gone to great lengths to protect this historical record is misrepresented and ill served by being recognized for one accident rather than years of preservation work. 27 February 2007 76.178.159.67 15:57, 27 February 2007 (UTC)JRecord
I've never seen this discussed anywhere, but cylinder recordings, listened to "live" on a cylinder phonograph, have a distinctive quality to the sound that is not captured in transfer to modern media.
There are two characteristics in particular: there is an odd spatial quality to it, almost as if the sound were coming from inside one's head; and there is a bright, rather satisfying percussive quality in recordings of instruments such as banjos and xylophones. I assume that's exactly why these instruments are so common in the arrangements recorded on cylinders.
This quality is not replicated when the sound issuing from a cylinder phonographs are recorded with microphones and played back with modern equipment, nor when cylinders are played with modern cartridges and then reproduced electronically.
My theory is that the spatial quality has something to do with the way in which the wavefront from the horn is shaped and reaches the ears. I can't even guess at an explanation for the percussive quality; something about the way hill-and-dale recording captures loud transients, I expect, but I don't know why it doesn't reproduce well.
Cylinder recordings, played live, have a certain lively, danceable quality that's not well captured in rerecordings.
No, I am not suggesting that cylinder recordings are better than newer technologies--only that they have pleasant qualities that for some reason are lost when recorded and reproduced on modern equipment.
This is true of every recording of cylinders I've heard, including the excellent and admirable UCSD cylinder collection. Dpbsmith (talk) 02:16, 25 May 2008 (UTC)
I've added a couple new recordings from the very early days of the phonographic cylinder, about 16 years before the other example on this page. I hope noone minds. Shoemaker's Holiday ( talk) 03:22, 30 June 2008 (UTC)
..."not resolved until the advent of RIAA standards in the early 1940s..."
This seems unlikely as the RIAA wasn't founded until 1952 unless there is another RIAA
Cannonmc ( talk) 06:53, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
Andrew Liles' "Importunate Suggestions of Impropriety", Pipkin #15 came on wax cylinder, very rare and very limited (35 produced, 31 for sale). Won't mess with the article now, no time :) -andy 77.190.24.42 ( talk) 15:58, 4 February 2011 (UTC)
Under the "Hard plastic cylinders" section, mention really needs to be made to the Lambert company, which was producing celluloid cylinders by 1902. They certainly pre-date the Indestructible company. Should mention be made of the U.S. Phonograph company which had a unique process of wrapping pressed celluloid sheets around a core?
Also, shouldn't the 1902 molding (mass production) process be mentioned? This made a huge difference in the production capabilities of the cylinderrecord. There's a mention of "1902 Edison Records launched a line of improved hard wax cylinders marketed as "Edison Gold Moulded Records"." but no explanation of what this significant difference was. 78.26 ( talk) 21:47, 31 March 2011 (UTC)
. . Previous to December 1888, cylinders were made of a variety of natural waxes, even the base of the famous June 16th cylinders was octadecanoic acid, Ceresin, and Carnauba wax, and a few also had bees wax added .. I actually have duplicated for display at the Thomas Edison Historical Park in west Orange New Jersey 6 natural wax phonogram blanks, and they are on the oldest Edison wax cylinder phonographs at the museum, the Ezra T. Gilliland mode of 1887, and the precursor to the perfected machine made sometime in the spring of 1888. Starting in the fall of 1888 Jonas Aylsworth, Chemist started to work on metallic soaps #957 made in December of 1888 used an aluminum soap containing aluminum sodium hydroxide to harden and saponify the wax, the main ingredient is octadecanoic acid, an ingredient that is in pretty much all cylinder records that are considered “wax”. The first attempt to aid in the cutting action, as stearate of alumina is very hard. The compound did not cut very well and it needed to be softened, and this metallic soap was not successful. Oleic acid, red fatty oil, was added to the formulation to soften the wax, by May of 1888 the 957 records began to decompose, an oily film came to the surface of the record making them unusable. Jonas Aylsworth had visions of loosing his job. By 1889, ceresin was used to aid in cutting and moisture proofing the wax, and this laid the foundation of cylinder phonograph records until the advent of Amberol records. Collectors know this base wax, as brown wax. The brown wax base was used for most wax cylinders manufactured by Edison and Columbia. Molded records by Columbia contained the exact same ingredients as brown wax, except a colorant, and the percentages were changed to make the wax harder. Edison molded wax added other metallic salts of copper and zinc. Pine tar, carnauba and lampblack made the wax much harder. I had manufactured several thousand cylinders with similar materials by my own hand. [1] [2] -- Sborri ( talk) 06:27, 10 August 2012 (UTC)
References
{{
cite book}}
: Check date values in: |year=
(
help)CS1 maint: extra punctuation (
link)
{{
cite web}}
: Missing or empty |title=
(
help)
With this edit, IP .185 added claims that cylinder records "are again being manufactured. First, such claims would be ok in a news article, but are not appropriate for WP unless the article (or at least the section) is clearly marked as "current events" or similar, and dated.
Second, although references were given, there are problems with this material:
Accordingly I am abbreviating the claims to remove the implication of current production (while leaving the possibility open). I am also cutting back the scope of the claims to match the apparent significance of these companies, which is quite small. Jeh ( talk) 07:00, 20 October 2014 (UTC)
@ Jeh: The addition of info on Christopher David Heinmiller and his band Desert Sleep is totally unsourced, and neither the band, nor the individual, is noteworthy, much less this gimmicky recording. The info was originally added as User:HEINMILLER's sole edit. This is obviously the same person (which I had forgotten about when reverting the now-blocked IP). "The album combines modern and antique recording methods to create the sensation of authentic time travel in sound" is clearly not neutral language. This is not promoting the specific ebay sale, but it is still effectively promoting the band. There's no sources at all, much less WP:SECONDARY ones which would be needed for content like this. Recording new music on old equipment like this is not exactly common, but it's not so rare that it warrants a mention without even a single source. All things considered, although WP:BRD is a good essay, it's not a policy, and this seemed uncontroversial enough that I didn't feel it was needed to take this to talk. At the very least, a reliable source needs to be included, and the promotional language needs to be dealt with before this can be restored. Grayfell ( talk) 09:16, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
Would someone add the three modern makers of blank cylinders. I can't because I am one of them, but someone else could do this in the modern cylinder section. You can then edit them by visiting the sites and using the information contained. All three suppliers are used by the Edison National Historical Park, The North American Phonograph Company supplied special re-creations of 1888 formulations for the perfected, and pre-perfected phonographs on display in the music room.
Chuck Richards [
http://richardslaboratories.com/ Richards
Laboratories]
Paul Morris (U.K.) Who has made cylinders since the late 1970's.
The North American Phonograph Company
The North American Phonograph Company — Preceding unsigned comment added by Napc1888 ( talk • contribs) 03:24, 9 June 2016 (UTC)
the ref 1 no longer works:
The phonograph was invented by Thomas Edison on July 18, 1877. His first successful recording and reproduction of intelligible sounds, achieved early in the following December, used a thin sheet of tin foil wrapped around a hand-cranked grooved metal cylinder.[1]
Suggest to hyperlink instead to: https://www.loc.gov/collections/edison-company-motion-pictures-and-sound-recordings/articles-and-essays/history-of-edison-sound-recordings/history-of-the-cylinder-phonograph/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Chikyuu ( talk • contribs) 03:55, 11 July 2016 (UTC)
A quick read of the end section of the article appears to show an attempt to compare/contrast between cylinders and discs. However, it is written, at points, as if wax cylinders are the only cylindrical records (e.g. the mold problem). There were, as the article discusses earlier, other materials used. And, I would like to see a citation that all forms of wax cylinders suffer from the mold issue. Early playback equipment is also not the only other problem (aside from comparatively poor record materials). Earlier microphones may, for instance, have been worse. Recording techniques likely improved. If the end of the article is going to do a reasonably-thorough job of comparing later disc sound quality with cylindrical records' it needs to take all of the materials into account as well as these other matters — and do so clearly. It's also unclear as to why the end of the article needs this sort of compare/contrast when such comparison has an earlier section, if not more than one. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 107.77.193.114 ( talk) 05:10, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
I am moving the following uncited material here until it can be properly supported with inline citations of reliable, secondary sources, per WP:V, WP:CS, WP:IRS, WP:PSTS, WP:BLP, WP:NOR, et al. This diff shows where it was in the article. Nightscream ( talk) 19:03, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
Extended content
|
---|
|
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Phonograph cylinder article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
![]() | Phonograph cylinder is a former featured article. Please see the links under Article milestones below for its original nomination page (for older articles, check the nomination archive) and why it was removed. | ||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||
Current status: Former featured article |
![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||
|
Need to add: mass production of cylinders; early dubbing methods; "Gold molded" cylinders
-Recordings went from tinfoil to wax in 1888, older recordings are unplayable.
-Oldest preserved recordings and where to hear them. (A 1888-89 CD from TINFOIL, the Brahms cylinder on "About a hundred years", Nina Grieg from 1889 spread across two CD's from SIMAX, more?)
-A more realistic assessment of the sound quality of these things; the CD compilation "About a hundred years" features both wax and disc recordings, and I agree with their assessment that it was the invention of the shellac disc in 1899 that turned records into anything more than "a noisy toy". The wax rolls have virtually no bass; how would a phonograph needle record bass? Much easier on a disc, where the needle can move sideways. Juryen 23:12, 31 August 2006 (UTC)
I thought I would add my $.02: I am a collector of both disc and cylinder records, and have the old machines to play them on. This has been my observation: just about any commercially produced cylinder from 1902 to 1914 sounds quite a bit better than disc records made until about 1924, that being the year when they started being recorded electrically. I haven't ever heard any of the soft wax cylinders made prior to the gold molded ones, so i can't vouch for them, but I have heard the first generation Amberol cylinders (these are hard wax, 4 minute, played with a saphire and made from 1908-1912) and the celulloid Blue Ambrol cylinders (these are 4 minute also, blue and color, and should only be played with the correct diamond reproducers; made from 1913-1929, though, after about 1915 the masters were dubbed from diamond disc masters), and these, when compared to any disc record made before 1924, are really quite astounding. Although Edison did expiriment with electrically recorded cylinder records in the late 1920's, it was'n until commercially issued disc records were made that the tone and range of disc records really surpassed that of the mature cylinder format.-WK--- 139.78.96.87 21:27, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
Hi, I am working to encourage implementation of the goals of the Wikipedia:Verifiability policy. Part of that is to make sure articles cite their sources. This is particularly important for featured articles, since they are a prominent part of Wikipedia. The Fact and Reference Check Project has more information. If some of the external links are reliable sources and were used as references, they can be placed in a References section too. See the cite sources link for how to format them. Thank you, and please leave me a message when a few references have been added to the article. - Taxman 19:39, Apr 22, 2005 (UTC)
The following objections to this article should be adressed: No lead. No references. Not a FA standard, certainly. Some sections are just a single sentence. -- Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 09:33, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
An editor named Jeremy left these on my talk page, but I really don't know enough about the subject to help so I thought I'd move this here. My only connection with this page was asking for references. - Taxman Talk 12:16, 5 April 2006 (UTC)
Would suggest that the specific names of each of the three commercially designed plug-in models be reinstated. Someone has edited these out. However, I have noted that information on each may be sourced in the external link to Christer Hemp's Phonograph Makers Pages. Many readers would be interested in these. Jeremy Sefton-Parke. kinopanorama AT msn.com
Refer to chapter on preservation of cylinders. See paragraph two. Also, link to Phonograph Maker's pages. Believe that paragraph two could be expanded by someone, such as myself, without being seen to promote any such product as a vanity entry. Please advise.-- Kinopanorama widescreen 01:31, 5 April 2006 (UTC)
I've added the earliest known recording on Wikimedia Commons for use primarly in the Israel in Egypt (oratorio) article. However, it may perhaps find use here too (it was after all made on a yellow paraffine phonograph cylinder), in that case feel free to add it. I have no more time for editing stuff right now myself. :-) The Commons resource name is Handel - Israel in Egypt, HWV 54 (excerpt).oga, and can be linked to via a template like this, for example:
There are alternative templates too; for more information, see this: Template:Audio. -- Northgrove 00:42, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
Hi, possibly an even earlier recording (1885) link to CNN article, I don't know how to get the sound from the slideshow video! http://edition.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/meast/11/11/mecca.hajj.snouck/index.html?iref=allsearch -- 195.188.107.145 ( talk) 18:07, 15 November 2010 (UTC)
Hi, I'm working on a dissertation that, among other things, examines the use of phonographs. I have been trying to determine if wax cylinders were ever reused for different recording purposes, and this article is the first instance that I have found that indicates that they were. Can anyone point me toward a published book or article in which I could verify this information? My committee is leery of Wikipedia, unfortunately. Please leave me a message if you have such a reference. Bc.rox.all 21:03, 25 October 2006 (UTC)
<undent> There may be little doubt that Edison would have done something like that, but without verification from a published source that's exactly what we call "original research" which can't be accepted in articles. I've commented out the more speculative part of the sentence, rephrasing it to refer to the shaving mechanism described above: could someone with the source to hand please add a citation to make it clear where this information has been published. . dave souza, talk 19:48, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
I removed this link as it seemed to be in poor taste. A man who has gone to great lengths to protect this historical record is misrepresented and ill served by being recognized for one accident rather than years of preservation work. 27 February 2007 76.178.159.67 15:57, 27 February 2007 (UTC)JRecord
I've never seen this discussed anywhere, but cylinder recordings, listened to "live" on a cylinder phonograph, have a distinctive quality to the sound that is not captured in transfer to modern media.
There are two characteristics in particular: there is an odd spatial quality to it, almost as if the sound were coming from inside one's head; and there is a bright, rather satisfying percussive quality in recordings of instruments such as banjos and xylophones. I assume that's exactly why these instruments are so common in the arrangements recorded on cylinders.
This quality is not replicated when the sound issuing from a cylinder phonographs are recorded with microphones and played back with modern equipment, nor when cylinders are played with modern cartridges and then reproduced electronically.
My theory is that the spatial quality has something to do with the way in which the wavefront from the horn is shaped and reaches the ears. I can't even guess at an explanation for the percussive quality; something about the way hill-and-dale recording captures loud transients, I expect, but I don't know why it doesn't reproduce well.
Cylinder recordings, played live, have a certain lively, danceable quality that's not well captured in rerecordings.
No, I am not suggesting that cylinder recordings are better than newer technologies--only that they have pleasant qualities that for some reason are lost when recorded and reproduced on modern equipment.
This is true of every recording of cylinders I've heard, including the excellent and admirable UCSD cylinder collection. Dpbsmith (talk) 02:16, 25 May 2008 (UTC)
I've added a couple new recordings from the very early days of the phonographic cylinder, about 16 years before the other example on this page. I hope noone minds. Shoemaker's Holiday ( talk) 03:22, 30 June 2008 (UTC)
..."not resolved until the advent of RIAA standards in the early 1940s..."
This seems unlikely as the RIAA wasn't founded until 1952 unless there is another RIAA
Cannonmc ( talk) 06:53, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
Andrew Liles' "Importunate Suggestions of Impropriety", Pipkin #15 came on wax cylinder, very rare and very limited (35 produced, 31 for sale). Won't mess with the article now, no time :) -andy 77.190.24.42 ( talk) 15:58, 4 February 2011 (UTC)
Under the "Hard plastic cylinders" section, mention really needs to be made to the Lambert company, which was producing celluloid cylinders by 1902. They certainly pre-date the Indestructible company. Should mention be made of the U.S. Phonograph company which had a unique process of wrapping pressed celluloid sheets around a core?
Also, shouldn't the 1902 molding (mass production) process be mentioned? This made a huge difference in the production capabilities of the cylinderrecord. There's a mention of "1902 Edison Records launched a line of improved hard wax cylinders marketed as "Edison Gold Moulded Records"." but no explanation of what this significant difference was. 78.26 ( talk) 21:47, 31 March 2011 (UTC)
. . Previous to December 1888, cylinders were made of a variety of natural waxes, even the base of the famous June 16th cylinders was octadecanoic acid, Ceresin, and Carnauba wax, and a few also had bees wax added .. I actually have duplicated for display at the Thomas Edison Historical Park in west Orange New Jersey 6 natural wax phonogram blanks, and they are on the oldest Edison wax cylinder phonographs at the museum, the Ezra T. Gilliland mode of 1887, and the precursor to the perfected machine made sometime in the spring of 1888. Starting in the fall of 1888 Jonas Aylsworth, Chemist started to work on metallic soaps #957 made in December of 1888 used an aluminum soap containing aluminum sodium hydroxide to harden and saponify the wax, the main ingredient is octadecanoic acid, an ingredient that is in pretty much all cylinder records that are considered “wax”. The first attempt to aid in the cutting action, as stearate of alumina is very hard. The compound did not cut very well and it needed to be softened, and this metallic soap was not successful. Oleic acid, red fatty oil, was added to the formulation to soften the wax, by May of 1888 the 957 records began to decompose, an oily film came to the surface of the record making them unusable. Jonas Aylsworth had visions of loosing his job. By 1889, ceresin was used to aid in cutting and moisture proofing the wax, and this laid the foundation of cylinder phonograph records until the advent of Amberol records. Collectors know this base wax, as brown wax. The brown wax base was used for most wax cylinders manufactured by Edison and Columbia. Molded records by Columbia contained the exact same ingredients as brown wax, except a colorant, and the percentages were changed to make the wax harder. Edison molded wax added other metallic salts of copper and zinc. Pine tar, carnauba and lampblack made the wax much harder. I had manufactured several thousand cylinders with similar materials by my own hand. [1] [2] -- Sborri ( talk) 06:27, 10 August 2012 (UTC)
References
{{
cite book}}
: Check date values in: |year=
(
help)CS1 maint: extra punctuation (
link)
{{
cite web}}
: Missing or empty |title=
(
help)
With this edit, IP .185 added claims that cylinder records "are again being manufactured. First, such claims would be ok in a news article, but are not appropriate for WP unless the article (or at least the section) is clearly marked as "current events" or similar, and dated.
Second, although references were given, there are problems with this material:
Accordingly I am abbreviating the claims to remove the implication of current production (while leaving the possibility open). I am also cutting back the scope of the claims to match the apparent significance of these companies, which is quite small. Jeh ( talk) 07:00, 20 October 2014 (UTC)
@ Jeh: The addition of info on Christopher David Heinmiller and his band Desert Sleep is totally unsourced, and neither the band, nor the individual, is noteworthy, much less this gimmicky recording. The info was originally added as User:HEINMILLER's sole edit. This is obviously the same person (which I had forgotten about when reverting the now-blocked IP). "The album combines modern and antique recording methods to create the sensation of authentic time travel in sound" is clearly not neutral language. This is not promoting the specific ebay sale, but it is still effectively promoting the band. There's no sources at all, much less WP:SECONDARY ones which would be needed for content like this. Recording new music on old equipment like this is not exactly common, but it's not so rare that it warrants a mention without even a single source. All things considered, although WP:BRD is a good essay, it's not a policy, and this seemed uncontroversial enough that I didn't feel it was needed to take this to talk. At the very least, a reliable source needs to be included, and the promotional language needs to be dealt with before this can be restored. Grayfell ( talk) 09:16, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
Would someone add the three modern makers of blank cylinders. I can't because I am one of them, but someone else could do this in the modern cylinder section. You can then edit them by visiting the sites and using the information contained. All three suppliers are used by the Edison National Historical Park, The North American Phonograph Company supplied special re-creations of 1888 formulations for the perfected, and pre-perfected phonographs on display in the music room.
Chuck Richards [
http://richardslaboratories.com/ Richards
Laboratories]
Paul Morris (U.K.) Who has made cylinders since the late 1970's.
The North American Phonograph Company
The North American Phonograph Company — Preceding unsigned comment added by Napc1888 ( talk • contribs) 03:24, 9 June 2016 (UTC)
the ref 1 no longer works:
The phonograph was invented by Thomas Edison on July 18, 1877. His first successful recording and reproduction of intelligible sounds, achieved early in the following December, used a thin sheet of tin foil wrapped around a hand-cranked grooved metal cylinder.[1]
Suggest to hyperlink instead to: https://www.loc.gov/collections/edison-company-motion-pictures-and-sound-recordings/articles-and-essays/history-of-edison-sound-recordings/history-of-the-cylinder-phonograph/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Chikyuu ( talk • contribs) 03:55, 11 July 2016 (UTC)
A quick read of the end section of the article appears to show an attempt to compare/contrast between cylinders and discs. However, it is written, at points, as if wax cylinders are the only cylindrical records (e.g. the mold problem). There were, as the article discusses earlier, other materials used. And, I would like to see a citation that all forms of wax cylinders suffer from the mold issue. Early playback equipment is also not the only other problem (aside from comparatively poor record materials). Earlier microphones may, for instance, have been worse. Recording techniques likely improved. If the end of the article is going to do a reasonably-thorough job of comparing later disc sound quality with cylindrical records' it needs to take all of the materials into account as well as these other matters — and do so clearly. It's also unclear as to why the end of the article needs this sort of compare/contrast when such comparison has an earlier section, if not more than one. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 107.77.193.114 ( talk) 05:10, 20 August 2019 (UTC)
I am moving the following uncited material here until it can be properly supported with inline citations of reliable, secondary sources, per WP:V, WP:CS, WP:IRS, WP:PSTS, WP:BLP, WP:NOR, et al. This diff shows where it was in the article. Nightscream ( talk) 19:03, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
Extended content
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