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In the introductory paragraph the sentence "The term Mormon, derived from the Book of Mormon..." is incomplete. Insert "is" as follows: "The term Mormon is derived from the Book of Mormon..."
67.2.34.14 ( talk) 21:12, 11 September 2011 (UTC)
Done Thank you for pointing that out. --
Adjwilley (
talk)
21:41, 11 September 2011 (UTC)
I think this article has a couple of structural problems, one of them being in the current section on Theological foundations. Currently, the section is made up of two subsections: "Relation to Christianity," and "Relation to Judaism." While these two subsections are informative and helpful, I think that the Foundations section as a whole needs to be expanded with more subsections outlining the basic beliefs in Mormonism. If you look at other Wikipedia religion articles (i.e. Buddhism, Christianity, Islam, Methodism, Anglicanism even Jehovah's Witnesses) they all have well-developed Belief sections, outlining the basic doctrines, beliefs, creeds, articles of faith, 5 pillars, you name it.
Specific changes I recommend within the Theological Foundations section:
If these changes were made, then instead of trying to haphazardly explain Mormon theology in relation to Christianity and Judaism, we can outline the main beliefs in an organized fashion, and then refer to them in the Christianity and Judaism sections. Thoughts? -- Adjwilley ( talk) 22:45, 18 August 2011 (UTC)
I would also like to add another section on "Relation to Islam" after the Relation to Christianity and Judaism sections. I have a draft here that I made mainly by copying and pasting from the article Mormonism and Islam. I think as long as we're comparing Mormonism to Christianity and Judaism, we might as well do Islam. I personally found the article quite interesting, and think a snippet of it would do well in an article on Mormonism. -- Adjwilley ( talk) 15:58, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
The new sections are not as polished as I would like them, but I plan to continue working on them, and I hope that now they're in the article, others will be able to fix my errors, and build off the general structure. There are still some scriptural sources, but I've tried to cut them down where I could, or at least expand them with secondary sources. -- Adjwilley ( talk) 17:48, 30 September 2011 (UTC)
"It differs from other Latter Day Saint movement traditions in that it also accepts the Pearl of Great Price as part of its canon, and it has a history of teaching eternal marriage, eternal progression, and plural marriage (although the LDS Church had abandoned the practice by the early 20th century)."
It is unclear as to what "It" is refering. But the statement seems to make a distiction based on the LDS movement not including the Pearl of Great Price in their canon of scripture. You can find that the predominent LDS movement, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints does indeed include this book in their online scripture set here: http://lds.org/scriptures/pgp?lang=eng And you will find it included in their distrbution center scriptures for purchase here: http://store.lds.org/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Category3_715839595_10557_23501_-1_N_image_0
602Michelle ( talk) 02:36, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
"It" is referring to the Theological Mormonism, specifically the word 'theology' in the previous sentence. It is an odd way to look at what most people generally see as only a religion, but can be a cultural or social thing as well. Some time ago, the lead sentences were changed a little and this broke the connection with this paragraph. The lead probably needs to be re-written to accomodate all this again. Looking through the history, the lead was changed several times in 2009, 2010, and 2011. So, good job on pointing this out. At this moment, I'm not able to take the time to fully rework the lead, but I hope this helps you understand why this situation developed. -- Avanu ( talk) 17:39, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
Procedural note; I'm removing the "edit semi-protected" template for now, pending consensus here Chzz ► 01:40, 17 September 2011 (UTC)
{{edit semi-protected}} The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints as an official church name was first given by revelation in 26 April 1838 to Joseph Smith (see Doctrine & Covenants 115:4) six years before his death.
24.22.245.193 ( talk) 05:35, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
Not done
There is a grammar error in the section on Restoration, the first paragraph, the last sentence. The word lead should be spelled led.
An explanation is probably not needed, but just in case: When the word spelled "lead" is pronounced to rhyme with "red" it is a noun that means the heavy metal or the substance used in pencils. If it's pronounced to rhyme with "seed" it is a verb that means to go ahead (lead the group) or bring into being (action A will lead to result B).
In the article the word means the past tense of the verb and should be spelled "led" so needs to be changed from "lead" to "led."
Examples: 1. Eating too much might lead to weight gain. The sentence meaning tells the reader it rhymes with "seed." 2. My overeating led to my weight gain. Rhymes with "red." 3. It has led to my brother's weight gain as well. 4. My mechanical pencil ran out of lead. The sentence meaning tells the reader it rhymes with "red." Thanks for maintaining this informative article. I certainly hope I've not made any grammar errors myself!
The section on Cosmology has the same error - ..."lead" by Lucifer... should be "...led by Lucifer..." 76.6.130.45 ( talk) 22:29, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Done
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In the paragraph dealing with ordinances, there is a rough comparison to sacraments that would be incorrect. Ordinances and sacraments are very different from one another and in a way oppose one another. There is no citation to this sentence either. With quick glances at any descriptions of ordinance and sacrament it is easy to distinguish the acute difference. I request completely deleting the sentence because of its inaccuracy, lack of citation, and irrelevance. May I also suggest that if this comparison is not removed to add links to the word sacrament and ordinance so there may be clarity to what those to things really are. Thanks.
SodakScallywag ( talk) 21:31, 9 November 2011 (UTC)
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This article may have been written with the intention of not being biased, but is, in the form of unclarity or incorrect information. I would like it to be clearer on the fact that Mormonism is not a religion. It is a derivative of the term 'Mormon,' which is a nickname given to members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. The article needs to be clearer on the views of polygamy in the modern LDS Church. I think this article has little relevancy, and that links to this page should be replaced with links to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints article. Thanks!
--Carson ( talk) 20:33, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
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The following paragraph is incorrect:
'''Mormonism is the religion practiced by Mormons, and is the predominant religious tradition of the Latter Day Saint movement. This movement was founded by Joseph Smith, Jr. beginning in the 1820s as a form of Christian primitivism. During the 1830s and 1840s, Mormonism gradually distinguished itself from traditional Protestantism. Mormonism today represents the new, non-Protestant faith taught by Smith in the 1840s. After Smith's death, most Mormons followed Brigham Young to the Rocky Mountains as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church). Other branches of Mormonism include Mormon fundamentalism, which seeks to maintain practices and doctrines such as polygamy that were discontinued by the LDS Church, and various other small independent denominations.
The above paragraph is fundamentally incorrect and should be corrected with the following information: The term "Mormon" and "Mormonism" is, and always has been, a nickname of the Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints. Joseph Smith, Jr, never founded a church, or a "movement," called the Mormon Church. He founded a Church called "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints." That name is, and always has been, the official name of the church.
To say the term, or nickname "Mormon," came from the book, "The Book of Mormon," is a fact. It really originated from persecuters of the Church in the early days, and the name sort of stuck. Many who are not familiar with The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints think that this is a new official name of the Church, due to the fact that many members often refer to The Church as the Mormon Church, or refer to themselves as Mormons. Recent efforts have been undertaken by the leaders of the church to refer to it by its official name, and discourage to use of the terms "Mormon, Mormonism, and The Mormon Church." Many mistakingly believe that this effort was a move to a new official name.
I am a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. My desire in having this page edited is to ensure whomever reads this is reading factual information, and not information by someone's opinion.
198.98.83.235 ( talk) 07:22, 16 January 2012 (UTC)
I have a concern with the recent good faith additions to the Lead. While I think the Lead should have a mention of other Latter Day Saint denominations (most notably the Community of Christ and Mormon Fundamentalism) I don't think it should have in-depth discussions of their theology, particularly since the CoC isn't considered part of Mormonism and has rejected the title Mormon. Before the recent additions, the Lead had a single link to the CoC in the 3rd paragraph. It now links in the 1st and 3rd paragraphs, with both paragraphs mentioning that the CoC's theology is Trinitarian. While I think such information is both interesting, accurate, and useful, I don't think it belongs in the Lead of Mormonism, epsecially since the Lead is supposed to summarize the article, and this information is not contained in the article body.
As a solution I propose either moving the recent additions to a footnote somewhere, or perhaps to a new subsection under Theological foundations near the "Relation to Christianity" subsection. (It might have a title like "Relation to other Latter Day Saint denominations" or something like that.) It could also be worked in as a paragraph under "Relation to Christianity" or "Theological divisions". Thoughts? ~ Adjwilley ( talk) 14:38, 9 April 2012 (UTC)
The introduction states "[Mormonism] differs from other Latter Day Saint movement traditions (such as the Community of Christ) in that it also accepts the Pearl of Great Price as part of its scriptural canon..." This implies that the Community of Christ is not Mormon, but the introduction there calls them so. Can someone resolve the contradiction? -- KnightMove ( talk) 09:37, 27 June 2012 (UTC)
1. As a former LDS, I think the article reads, on the whole, like a brochure a missionary would leave in one's door. It's mighty "glowy" in a lot of places.
2. I think a section comparing the Church to Scientology would be interesting and fruitful. From what I've read of Scientology, they have some very similar aspects that I'd like to read more about, outer space being a springboard.
Thanks, Wordreader ( talk) 03:19, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
Hi. So as you are an LDS member, please clarify/correct what is incorrect in the edit:
Mormon beliefs include the claim that the God the Father, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit are three separate beings not united under one monotheistic deity. In addition, Mormons believe that God the Father needed a physical body and is not made of spiritual substance in his own inherent divine nature. Furthermore, Mormon beliefs cite that souls who enter Heaven someday become deity-like, immortal and divine in equal footing with the Holy Trinity. Regarding soteriology, Mormon beliefs claim that the passion of Jesus Christ's crucifixion was not enough to merit redemption and salvation for humankind.
From what I understand from my teenage years, these beliefs were true and in-line accurate with my own Mormon Fellowship Group. Because the Patheos website is an impartial website on religious beliefs, and Mr. Ben Wotherington has spent a great deal of time researching and comparing Mormon beliefs along with other Abrahamic religions. Whatever is inaccurate, please point out so it can be fact-checked and revised as such. QvisDevs ( talk) 17:50, 31 August 2012 (UTC)
There are a lot of issues mixed into this one edit, so it's probably not a good idea to try to address them altogether. The precise details of where the inaccuracies were is a little complicated, but I can explain what they are if you would like. ~ Adjwilley ( talk) 18:04, 31 August 2012 (UTC)
LOL. Now you're just too chicken. I understand that you are this faith which I respect. But you should be proud of what you believe in, and cite them as such rather than disbanding my entire edit. I'm not going to force another edit on this, but its just FUNNY how you see it as trying to "nail Mormonism down"... because its not. If you're really PRO-Mormonism then be proud to state what those beliefs are, and correct them when they are problematic. I'm Catholic and many people disagree with the core beliefs of our faith, but we're not chicken about it... and they are laid out IN DETAIL on Wikipedia, and yes some of those Catholic sources come from Patheos website. You can have your article. QvisDevs ( talk) 18:12, 31 August 2012 (UTC)
Horseshit. Then explain what is wrong with the edit. You already said it is an "overstatement" to say that the three beings are separate, but according to Mormon beliefs. THEY ARE, according to them. Why do you make the case against them if that is what they believe? If that is not exactly what they believe then add a sentence to make it CLEAR. but do Explain? otherwise you're just reverting edits because you think its "trying to nail Mormonism down". seriously. Sure, its "easier" to just revert the edit rather than correct them. What does Wikipedia need you for then? WOW. QvisDevs ( talk) 18:35, 31 August 2012 (UTC)
Why doesn't the article mention the racial views of Mormonism. -- 41.151.213.189 ( talk) 14:32, 15 October 2012 (UTC)
While I frequently use Wikipedia, I have not done any editing or commenting before, so I apologize if this comment is in the wrong place.
I understand the concern that you do not want the topic of "Mormonism" to overlap other areas, but I do not see how a topic that is supposed to cover the beliefs of the LDS movement can not cover things such as the nature of man and God and the relationship between them. Leaving this to the "Mormonism vs Christianity" is not appropriate since this leads to a limited and disjointed presentation where items are discussed only in relation to Christianity. It would seem most appropriate for the "Mormonism" section to start with a brief overview of the LDS believes with pointers to more in depth sections. Then the "Mormonism vs Christianity" can contrast these with "traditional" or "unrestored" Christianity.
The bottom line is the I came to the article looking for a clear and concise overview of the beliefs of the LDS church and did not find much of real use to me.
Thank you for your efforts.
Joe Hendrickson — Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.76.32.167 ( talk • contribs) 17:34, 5 December 2007
This is not intended to be a debate on Are Mormons Christians? However, there seems to be a consensus to refer to Mormonism as a form of Restorationist Christianity or Nontrinitarian Christianity as opposed to Mainstream or Traditional Christianity. Therefore, for consistency, I recommend adding the Christianity series box to the page. Thoughts? If there are no disagreements (excepting unrelated "Mormons aren't Christians" claims), I will make the recommended change. Piguy ( talk) 02:47, 7 February 2013 (UTC)
What happened to the gold plates?? How could something so fundamental be forgotten about?
baden 41.74.221.96 ( talk) 04:38, 24 October 2012 (UTC)
How about summarizing the plates and linking to the Wikipedia article on "Golden Plates" as the source? Rjmail ( talk) 18:55, 9 April 2013 (UTC)
I'm really confused why there are two articles. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (LDS for short) is the name of this church. There is no church called "Mormonism". That is a formerly derogatory term given to the LDS people that eventually became slang terminology for the church. Nowadays it is not insulting to be called a mormon. However, having two different articles causes confusion for non-members (apparently a lot of the population believe the churches are different). I know it says in the article that it is the LDS church, but still having a separate article all on its own seems redundant and aids in the general confusion already abound.
Thank you for your consideration. D — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.106.18.70 ( talk) 20:54, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
Now before you remove this comment; allow me to explain this. Mormonism is a historical fact, you can't argue that Christ died for our sins, or that Joseph Smith restored the gospel. It is historical fact, now people have freedom of agency and they have the choice to be ignorant and deny the true fact that Jesus was the Christ and that Joseph Smith was the first prophet since Jesus Christ.
You may ask "How do I know for a fact that Jesus was the Christ?" Answer- You have to pray to Heavenly Father, in the name of Jesus Christ amen, with a sincere heart and a desire to feel the holy spirit and you will receive an answer.
Mormonism is regarded as an opinion by most people; when it is a historical fact. Example- Tectonic Plates ( Pangea theory) is technically a theory, but there is nothing wrong with it. This is a good example of Mormonism. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the faith, church, or the doctrine. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Checkb4uwreck ( talk • contribs) 22:37, 9 December 2012 (UTC)
Personal beliefs on Wikipedia are a little tricky. You are convinced that Mormonism is true, while the next person is convinced that it's false and another religion is true, while the next person is convinced that all religions are a joke. Rather than having editors duke it out and whoever has the strongest opinoin wins, Wikipedia deals with the problem in two ways. First, we have a strict policy that articles should have a neutral point of view. In the case of religions, this means that it won't say that they are either true or false. (This goes for all religions, not just Mormonism.) Using your example above, it is unacceptable for Wikipedia to say "Jesus is the Christ." It's just not neutral. Wikipedia, however, can say "Christians believe that Jesus is the Christ, or Messiah."
Second, instead of relying on personal opinions, Wikipedia demands that any controversial claim be backed by a WP:reliable source, preferably a secondary, peer reviewed source written by someone who is an expert on the subject. For something like Mormonism, this means you'd have to back up your changes with citations to people like Richard Bushman, Jan Shipps, Arnold Mauss, or Matthew Bowman, who have spent years studying Mormonism and have written books on the subject.
Lastly, if you would like to be making changes to the article, or believe that something is inaccurate, it would be very helpful if you could say what precisely is the problem. Instead of "The article is wrong and biased" something like "The article is incorrect when it says '...'." ~ Adjwilley ( talk) 13:42, 10 December 2012 (UTC)
You might want to read up on what a theory is before you throw around the phrase, "Only a theory." In the scientific sense it is an explanation for credible facts and evidence. You're using it the sense of a hypothesis (which is valid in our culture but misleading). Tectonic Plate Theory is an explanation for a huge amount of credible evidence and observable facts; moreover it is falsifiable. The strength of any theory is that it must be falsifiable, meaning there is a scenario in which, if certain facts and evidence are found to be true, the theory can indisputably be proven wrong. That may not sound impressive but a concept that is falsifiable is much more important than one that is only verifiable. The concept of God is verifiable; if he came down and showed himself and his power there would be little to disprove him. Conversely it is not falsifiable; according to the hypothesis or "belief" that God is real, one must simply have faith and believe with or without credible evidence. The lack of falsifiability is what makes God a hypothesis and Plate Tectonics a theory: If Plate Tectonics was wrong, it can be proven, it's validity is based on observable facts and evidence; if it is correct then a scenario in which facts and evidence prove it wrong simply will not ever happen. In science we do have to accept that any fact is only true while it's not being proven wrong, and that's okay; the quest for truth, insight and knowledge is more important than validating one's beliefs and hypotheses. 172.248.150.231 ( talk) 00:35, 5 December 2013 (UTC)
I'm having trouble understanding what the purpose is in having distinct articles for Mormonism and the Latter Day Saint movement. I had taken "Mormonism" to be a name for the religion of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, but I'm finding that it's also applied to other Latter Day Saint denominations. Is that usage correct? If so, what need is there for two separate articles? If not, wouldn't the Mormonism article be merged with the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints one? Slb1900 ( talk) 05:10, 25 March 2014 (UTC)
The section titled "Restoration" describes Peter, James, John, and John the Baptist as angels. I know virtually nothing about Mormonism, but those figures are usually identified as apostles and so I have edited the article to read "apostles" under the assumption that "angels" is a typo. If "angels" is actually the intended reading, feel free to revert. 163.11.145.139 ( talk) 18:49, 1 September 2014 (UTC)
For editing purposes (especially for statistics and social issues) you may be interested to know that I am keeping brief notes and putting them on my personal TALK page: User_talk:Charles_Edwin_Shipp#LDS_April_Conference.2C_world_broadcast.2C_April_4-5.2C_2015_.28Sat.2FSun.2C_10am.2F2pm_MT.29 -- Charles Edwin Shipp ( talk) 02:34, 5 April 2015 (UTC) -- PS: I'll add official references later.
Mormans believe that the Book of Morman (written by a MAN) is on the same level as the Bible (written by GOD), whereas Christians believe the Bible is on its own pedastool, alone in power. Therefore, since these two beliefs contradict, Mormans are, in fact, NOT Christians. Unlike the Part of a Series on Christianity, I do intend for this to be a debate on Are Mormons Christians?" <ref>The Holy Bible by God</ref> <ref>The Book of Morman by SRD (Some Random Dude)</ref> — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.94.252.244 ( talk • contribs)
Members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints are Christians, FYI, Charles Edwin Shipp ( talk) 20:53, 11 March 2014 (UTC) Thanks for noticing.
Some mention of EMS should be given in this article about mind control techniques https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7vOgHqE_P4 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.49.157.227 ( talk) 19:34, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
The external link http://www.religionnewsblog.com/maintenance.php (about the 2007 poll) is not working at the moment (web site is in maintenance) . But I've found http://www.pewforum.org/2007/09/26/public-expresses-mixed-views-of-islam-mormonism/ , and also http://www.pewforum.org/2012/01/12/mormons-in-america-mormon-moment/ about a newer 2011 poll. -- 5.170.60.170 ( talk) 14:37, 12 September 2015 (UTC)
Since this topic can get heated fast, let me quickly give a more detailed explanation than what could fit in the the edit summary. My reading of the Pew survey puts the number of Mormons who self-identify as Christian much higher than 66%. Specifically in the cited source, sixth paragraph: "Mormons are nearly unanimous in describing Mormonism as a Christian religion, with 97% expressing this point of view." Maybe the other editor is looking at something else and I'm missing where the 1-in-3 not self-identifying as Christian shows up.
As for the dictionary definitions, they are notoriously difficult because they're designed to be short so the effective bandwidth is severely limited. The second and third sources (sorry, got the order wrong in the edit summary - the dictionary.com and oxford dictionary sources) use wording that IMO is less restrictive of how they define Christianity. Specifically, dictionary.com states "the Christian religion, including the Catholic, Protestant, and Eastern Orthodox churches." and the oxford dictionary states "Christianity is ... mainly divided between the Roman Catholic, Protestant, and Eastern Orthodox Churches" (emphasis mine in both quotes). The emphasized phrasing I read to mean that the following list not exhaustive and leaves the definition open to Christian groups that don't fit nicely into that categorization. The Merriam Webster definition is less vague, not totally definitive IMO, but less vague. However, if you look at its entry for Mormon it states "a member of a Christian church that was founded by Joseph Smith...", which contradicts the strict interpretation of its Christianity entry. -- FyzixFighter ( talk) 04:07, 6 February 2016 (UTC)
@ Trinacrialucente: So much for WP:BRD I guess? -- FyzixFighter ( talk) 04:14, 6 February 2016 (UTC)
As for the McConkie reference, I cringe somewhat when when use his book to make generalized statement on LDS theology and belief. I feel that the edit has OR, POV, and UNDUE issues. It is a single LDS apostle making a statement in a book that the LDS Church never endorsed in the first place. It's also not a view that is unique to the LDS Church - many Protestant churches have taught the same thing about the Catholic Church. IMO the edit just doesn't fit at that location in a summary style subsection. Any third opinions out there? -- FyzixFighter ( talk) 14:15, 6 February 2016 (UTC)
This has been addressed in the past, but in defence of the church my edits long ago were reverted. The current type says "The faith drew its first converts while Smith was dictating the text of the Book of Mormon from golden plates"
The problem is that the church says differently "Gold Plates Plates made of gold upon which the ancient American prophet Mormon abridged the record of his people" LDS.org
Since the Utah LDS church refers to them as 'gold', it seems presumptuous of us to correct the church and use the term 'golden'. -- Gunnerclark ( talk) 20:50, 29 May 2016 (UTC)
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Please update references to "the LDS Church" to "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" according to the official Style Guide of the Church (see https://www.mormonnewsroom.org/style-guide). Msheets1 ( talk) 06:26, 15 April 2019 (UTC)
Came here to see the number of Mormons in the world, did the same thing I do when I check a wiki article for similar information and took a quick look to the right and saw there was no infobox. WHAT IS THE DEAL WITH THIS? I know there's a number of editors who have an irrational hatred of infoboxes for some insane reason, but non-infobox articles are usually limited to articles most people don't care about, or a collection of articles of historical figures that these nutbag infobox-hating editors have gotten there claws on and clamp down on like a vice. There's no excuse for an article as big as this to have the same problem. FIX IT. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:56A:7178:C500:BDE8:E4A1:261D:189A ( talk) 09:55, 3 January 2020 (UTC)
Nevermind I just saw the article of "Mormons", which has the info. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:56A:7178:C500:BDE8:E4A1:261D:189A ( talk) 10:02, 3 January 2020 (UTC)
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Request that the authors meet the official style guide for using the name of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (see https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.org/style-guide). Carrollewis ( talk) 15:55, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
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The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints does not want to be identified as "Mormonism," a pejorative term that does not emphasize the name of Jesus Christ, an integral part of the faith. Although many people still identify the Church as "Mormonism," a minor but significant change should be made on the page "Category:Nontrinitarian denominations." In the section entitled "Subcategories," the Church is correctly listed as "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints," but in the section below that, "Pages in category "Nontrinitarian denominations," the name is confusingly still listed as "Mormonism." I suggest that the name should be changed from "Mormonism" to "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (Mormonism)." Such a change may require changes to the page entitled "Mormonism," which is itself antiquated and should be edited. Ctblack ( talk) 15:03, 8 August 2020 (UTC)
A Request for Move on a relate article is backlogged and needs more participation. The proposal is to move Mormonism and Christianity → Mormonism and Nicene Christianity.
Please consider joining the discussion to help build consensus for or against the proposed move. If you are an uninvolved admin, please consider closing the RM. Thanks. JaredHWood 💬 06:57, 5 February 2021 (UTC)
As a new reader of this article (who is not Mormon / LDS) the term "mystery cult" (in spite of the reliable source and the divergent meanings of the term "cult") appears to be an NPOV violation. Assuming the historian is using "cult" in the non-pejorative sense, the negative connotations among many other readers should still be taken into account. Negativity bias also shows that small negative associations can have outsized impact. Note that this WP article is the top result for "Mormonism" in Google for me, and likely other readers as well.
I have a lot of problems with that sentence. It looks like it was added by User:Ph03n1x77 in a bold rewrite of the Lead in January [4] along with a lot of other problematic changes that went unnoticed. For instance [5] seems to be deleting a lot of sourced material and scrubbing the article of the word "Mormon", introducing weird constructions like "The displaced Mormons fled to Illinois" --> "The displaced church fled to Illinois". (I'm imagining a church version of Baba Yaga's house.) But getting back to the "mystery cult" quote, I think it's problematic to have that extended quote by Sydney E. Ahlstrom taking up valuable real estate in the 2nd paragraph of the Lead. Especially when it's not in the body of the article. And especially because it's not adding a lot of value. You don't start writing an encyclopedia article with "Ho hum we're not really sure if [subject] is this or that or something else, maybe it's all of them." You say concisely what it is. I think some manual rollbacking is needed. ~ Awilley ( talk) 05:39, 9 June 2021 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The Church has recently put out a statement asking to be referred to as its full name- The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints- instead of the nickname "Mormons" or "Mormonism". In relation to this article, their style guide says: "The term "Mormonism" is inaccurate and should not be used. When describing the combination of doctrine, culture and lifestyle unique to The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, the term "the restored gospel of Jesus Christ" is accurate and preferred." [6] Would it be okay to proceed with a name change, or would an RfC be required? Audrey ( talk) 01:06, 24 September 2018 (UTC)
Hello. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (LDS Church) has its own Wikipedia page. The LDS Church is actually one of many sects under the larger umbrella of Mormonism, so Mormonism isn’t a specific church, it’s a theology. Both topics are distinctive enough and notable enough in their own right to merit separate articles on Wikipedia. I hope this helps you understand. Mrbeastmodeallday ( talk) 12:32, 6 April 2019 (UTC)
Not sure I support this page move. What's the justification/reasoning behind it? @ Johnpacklambert. –– 𝗙𝗼𝗿𝗺𝗮𝗹𝗗𝘂𝗱𝗲 talk 18:54, 23 August 2021 (UTC)
The word depreciated has two meanings:
The first is accurate, the second is not. I suggest redoing this edit with a more accurate word like "relinquish" which means voluntarily cease to keep or claim; give up. I also do not think it's necessary to remove all the mentions of Mormon throughout this article. –– 𝗙𝗼𝗿𝗺𝗮𝗹𝗗𝘂𝗱𝗲 talk 19:37, 23 August 2021 (UTC)
I think I pinged everyone, but in case others are watching who haven't contributed: Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#Topic_Ban_for_Johnpacklambert. I'm not watching this page, so please ping me if needed. Star Mississippi 16:00, 25 August 2021 (UTC)
I agree with those that have stated that the title and the word "Mormon" are inaccurate. The official name is the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. Any personal opinions cannot change that. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 144.38.62.90 ( talk) 18:25, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 22 August 2022 and 7 December 2022. Further details are available
on the course page. Student editor(s):
Abby Crandall (
article contribs).
— Assignment last updated by Abby Crandall ( talk) 00:47, 15 September 2022 (UTC)
It's known as "further revelation" from what I know 71.223.22.101 ( talk) 16:42, 15 January 2023 (UTC)
Said something about this in the denominations page but could someone include some of the reasons why certain churches gave up some of the teachings that joseph smith wrote, or the doctrine and covenants? If there is any mention of a offshoot of the church of jesus christ of latter day saints in any way, before it was fully named it or not, we should include the reasons for holding on to the book of mormon but not all the Doctrines from the man who wrote it. 2600:8800:8B92:F600:1482:9D61:1826:ABB3 ( talk) 01:54, 19 April 2023 (UTC)
The `the` in `The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints` must be capitolized, per [12] https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/legal/terms-of-use under Trademarks. Minecraftchest1 ( talk) 12:55, 14 October 2023 (UTC)
hi! Members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints do not practice polygamy/plural marriage at all . :) 107.77.229.202 ( talk) 00:32, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
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Archive 1 | ← | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | Archive 6 | Archive 7 |
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In the introductory paragraph the sentence "The term Mormon, derived from the Book of Mormon..." is incomplete. Insert "is" as follows: "The term Mormon is derived from the Book of Mormon..."
67.2.34.14 ( talk) 21:12, 11 September 2011 (UTC)
Done Thank you for pointing that out. --
Adjwilley (
talk)
21:41, 11 September 2011 (UTC)
I think this article has a couple of structural problems, one of them being in the current section on Theological foundations. Currently, the section is made up of two subsections: "Relation to Christianity," and "Relation to Judaism." While these two subsections are informative and helpful, I think that the Foundations section as a whole needs to be expanded with more subsections outlining the basic beliefs in Mormonism. If you look at other Wikipedia religion articles (i.e. Buddhism, Christianity, Islam, Methodism, Anglicanism even Jehovah's Witnesses) they all have well-developed Belief sections, outlining the basic doctrines, beliefs, creeds, articles of faith, 5 pillars, you name it.
Specific changes I recommend within the Theological Foundations section:
If these changes were made, then instead of trying to haphazardly explain Mormon theology in relation to Christianity and Judaism, we can outline the main beliefs in an organized fashion, and then refer to them in the Christianity and Judaism sections. Thoughts? -- Adjwilley ( talk) 22:45, 18 August 2011 (UTC)
I would also like to add another section on "Relation to Islam" after the Relation to Christianity and Judaism sections. I have a draft here that I made mainly by copying and pasting from the article Mormonism and Islam. I think as long as we're comparing Mormonism to Christianity and Judaism, we might as well do Islam. I personally found the article quite interesting, and think a snippet of it would do well in an article on Mormonism. -- Adjwilley ( talk) 15:58, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
The new sections are not as polished as I would like them, but I plan to continue working on them, and I hope that now they're in the article, others will be able to fix my errors, and build off the general structure. There are still some scriptural sources, but I've tried to cut them down where I could, or at least expand them with secondary sources. -- Adjwilley ( talk) 17:48, 30 September 2011 (UTC)
"It differs from other Latter Day Saint movement traditions in that it also accepts the Pearl of Great Price as part of its canon, and it has a history of teaching eternal marriage, eternal progression, and plural marriage (although the LDS Church had abandoned the practice by the early 20th century)."
It is unclear as to what "It" is refering. But the statement seems to make a distiction based on the LDS movement not including the Pearl of Great Price in their canon of scripture. You can find that the predominent LDS movement, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints does indeed include this book in their online scripture set here: http://lds.org/scriptures/pgp?lang=eng And you will find it included in their distrbution center scriptures for purchase here: http://store.lds.org/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Category3_715839595_10557_23501_-1_N_image_0
602Michelle ( talk) 02:36, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
"It" is referring to the Theological Mormonism, specifically the word 'theology' in the previous sentence. It is an odd way to look at what most people generally see as only a religion, but can be a cultural or social thing as well. Some time ago, the lead sentences were changed a little and this broke the connection with this paragraph. The lead probably needs to be re-written to accomodate all this again. Looking through the history, the lead was changed several times in 2009, 2010, and 2011. So, good job on pointing this out. At this moment, I'm not able to take the time to fully rework the lead, but I hope this helps you understand why this situation developed. -- Avanu ( talk) 17:39, 27 August 2011 (UTC)
Procedural note; I'm removing the "edit semi-protected" template for now, pending consensus here Chzz ► 01:40, 17 September 2011 (UTC)
{{edit semi-protected}} The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints as an official church name was first given by revelation in 26 April 1838 to Joseph Smith (see Doctrine & Covenants 115:4) six years before his death.
24.22.245.193 ( talk) 05:35, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
Not done
There is a grammar error in the section on Restoration, the first paragraph, the last sentence. The word lead should be spelled led.
An explanation is probably not needed, but just in case: When the word spelled "lead" is pronounced to rhyme with "red" it is a noun that means the heavy metal or the substance used in pencils. If it's pronounced to rhyme with "seed" it is a verb that means to go ahead (lead the group) or bring into being (action A will lead to result B).
In the article the word means the past tense of the verb and should be spelled "led" so needs to be changed from "lead" to "led."
Examples: 1. Eating too much might lead to weight gain. The sentence meaning tells the reader it rhymes with "seed." 2. My overeating led to my weight gain. Rhymes with "red." 3. It has led to my brother's weight gain as well. 4. My mechanical pencil ran out of lead. The sentence meaning tells the reader it rhymes with "red." Thanks for maintaining this informative article. I certainly hope I've not made any grammar errors myself!
The section on Cosmology has the same error - ..."lead" by Lucifer... should be "...led by Lucifer..." 76.6.130.45 ( talk) 22:29, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
Done
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In the paragraph dealing with ordinances, there is a rough comparison to sacraments that would be incorrect. Ordinances and sacraments are very different from one another and in a way oppose one another. There is no citation to this sentence either. With quick glances at any descriptions of ordinance and sacrament it is easy to distinguish the acute difference. I request completely deleting the sentence because of its inaccuracy, lack of citation, and irrelevance. May I also suggest that if this comparison is not removed to add links to the word sacrament and ordinance so there may be clarity to what those to things really are. Thanks.
SodakScallywag ( talk) 21:31, 9 November 2011 (UTC)
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This article may have been written with the intention of not being biased, but is, in the form of unclarity or incorrect information. I would like it to be clearer on the fact that Mormonism is not a religion. It is a derivative of the term 'Mormon,' which is a nickname given to members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. The article needs to be clearer on the views of polygamy in the modern LDS Church. I think this article has little relevancy, and that links to this page should be replaced with links to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints article. Thanks!
--Carson ( talk) 20:33, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
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The following paragraph is incorrect:
'''Mormonism is the religion practiced by Mormons, and is the predominant religious tradition of the Latter Day Saint movement. This movement was founded by Joseph Smith, Jr. beginning in the 1820s as a form of Christian primitivism. During the 1830s and 1840s, Mormonism gradually distinguished itself from traditional Protestantism. Mormonism today represents the new, non-Protestant faith taught by Smith in the 1840s. After Smith's death, most Mormons followed Brigham Young to the Rocky Mountains as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church). Other branches of Mormonism include Mormon fundamentalism, which seeks to maintain practices and doctrines such as polygamy that were discontinued by the LDS Church, and various other small independent denominations.
The above paragraph is fundamentally incorrect and should be corrected with the following information: The term "Mormon" and "Mormonism" is, and always has been, a nickname of the Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints. Joseph Smith, Jr, never founded a church, or a "movement," called the Mormon Church. He founded a Church called "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints." That name is, and always has been, the official name of the church.
To say the term, or nickname "Mormon," came from the book, "The Book of Mormon," is a fact. It really originated from persecuters of the Church in the early days, and the name sort of stuck. Many who are not familiar with The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints think that this is a new official name of the Church, due to the fact that many members often refer to The Church as the Mormon Church, or refer to themselves as Mormons. Recent efforts have been undertaken by the leaders of the church to refer to it by its official name, and discourage to use of the terms "Mormon, Mormonism, and The Mormon Church." Many mistakingly believe that this effort was a move to a new official name.
I am a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. My desire in having this page edited is to ensure whomever reads this is reading factual information, and not information by someone's opinion.
198.98.83.235 ( talk) 07:22, 16 January 2012 (UTC)
I have a concern with the recent good faith additions to the Lead. While I think the Lead should have a mention of other Latter Day Saint denominations (most notably the Community of Christ and Mormon Fundamentalism) I don't think it should have in-depth discussions of their theology, particularly since the CoC isn't considered part of Mormonism and has rejected the title Mormon. Before the recent additions, the Lead had a single link to the CoC in the 3rd paragraph. It now links in the 1st and 3rd paragraphs, with both paragraphs mentioning that the CoC's theology is Trinitarian. While I think such information is both interesting, accurate, and useful, I don't think it belongs in the Lead of Mormonism, epsecially since the Lead is supposed to summarize the article, and this information is not contained in the article body.
As a solution I propose either moving the recent additions to a footnote somewhere, or perhaps to a new subsection under Theological foundations near the "Relation to Christianity" subsection. (It might have a title like "Relation to other Latter Day Saint denominations" or something like that.) It could also be worked in as a paragraph under "Relation to Christianity" or "Theological divisions". Thoughts? ~ Adjwilley ( talk) 14:38, 9 April 2012 (UTC)
The introduction states "[Mormonism] differs from other Latter Day Saint movement traditions (such as the Community of Christ) in that it also accepts the Pearl of Great Price as part of its scriptural canon..." This implies that the Community of Christ is not Mormon, but the introduction there calls them so. Can someone resolve the contradiction? -- KnightMove ( talk) 09:37, 27 June 2012 (UTC)
1. As a former LDS, I think the article reads, on the whole, like a brochure a missionary would leave in one's door. It's mighty "glowy" in a lot of places.
2. I think a section comparing the Church to Scientology would be interesting and fruitful. From what I've read of Scientology, they have some very similar aspects that I'd like to read more about, outer space being a springboard.
Thanks, Wordreader ( talk) 03:19, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
Hi. So as you are an LDS member, please clarify/correct what is incorrect in the edit:
Mormon beliefs include the claim that the God the Father, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit are three separate beings not united under one monotheistic deity. In addition, Mormons believe that God the Father needed a physical body and is not made of spiritual substance in his own inherent divine nature. Furthermore, Mormon beliefs cite that souls who enter Heaven someday become deity-like, immortal and divine in equal footing with the Holy Trinity. Regarding soteriology, Mormon beliefs claim that the passion of Jesus Christ's crucifixion was not enough to merit redemption and salvation for humankind.
From what I understand from my teenage years, these beliefs were true and in-line accurate with my own Mormon Fellowship Group. Because the Patheos website is an impartial website on religious beliefs, and Mr. Ben Wotherington has spent a great deal of time researching and comparing Mormon beliefs along with other Abrahamic religions. Whatever is inaccurate, please point out so it can be fact-checked and revised as such. QvisDevs ( talk) 17:50, 31 August 2012 (UTC)
There are a lot of issues mixed into this one edit, so it's probably not a good idea to try to address them altogether. The precise details of where the inaccuracies were is a little complicated, but I can explain what they are if you would like. ~ Adjwilley ( talk) 18:04, 31 August 2012 (UTC)
LOL. Now you're just too chicken. I understand that you are this faith which I respect. But you should be proud of what you believe in, and cite them as such rather than disbanding my entire edit. I'm not going to force another edit on this, but its just FUNNY how you see it as trying to "nail Mormonism down"... because its not. If you're really PRO-Mormonism then be proud to state what those beliefs are, and correct them when they are problematic. I'm Catholic and many people disagree with the core beliefs of our faith, but we're not chicken about it... and they are laid out IN DETAIL on Wikipedia, and yes some of those Catholic sources come from Patheos website. You can have your article. QvisDevs ( talk) 18:12, 31 August 2012 (UTC)
Horseshit. Then explain what is wrong with the edit. You already said it is an "overstatement" to say that the three beings are separate, but according to Mormon beliefs. THEY ARE, according to them. Why do you make the case against them if that is what they believe? If that is not exactly what they believe then add a sentence to make it CLEAR. but do Explain? otherwise you're just reverting edits because you think its "trying to nail Mormonism down". seriously. Sure, its "easier" to just revert the edit rather than correct them. What does Wikipedia need you for then? WOW. QvisDevs ( talk) 18:35, 31 August 2012 (UTC)
Why doesn't the article mention the racial views of Mormonism. -- 41.151.213.189 ( talk) 14:32, 15 October 2012 (UTC)
While I frequently use Wikipedia, I have not done any editing or commenting before, so I apologize if this comment is in the wrong place.
I understand the concern that you do not want the topic of "Mormonism" to overlap other areas, but I do not see how a topic that is supposed to cover the beliefs of the LDS movement can not cover things such as the nature of man and God and the relationship between them. Leaving this to the "Mormonism vs Christianity" is not appropriate since this leads to a limited and disjointed presentation where items are discussed only in relation to Christianity. It would seem most appropriate for the "Mormonism" section to start with a brief overview of the LDS believes with pointers to more in depth sections. Then the "Mormonism vs Christianity" can contrast these with "traditional" or "unrestored" Christianity.
The bottom line is the I came to the article looking for a clear and concise overview of the beliefs of the LDS church and did not find much of real use to me.
Thank you for your efforts.
Joe Hendrickson — Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.76.32.167 ( talk • contribs) 17:34, 5 December 2007
This is not intended to be a debate on Are Mormons Christians? However, there seems to be a consensus to refer to Mormonism as a form of Restorationist Christianity or Nontrinitarian Christianity as opposed to Mainstream or Traditional Christianity. Therefore, for consistency, I recommend adding the Christianity series box to the page. Thoughts? If there are no disagreements (excepting unrelated "Mormons aren't Christians" claims), I will make the recommended change. Piguy ( talk) 02:47, 7 February 2013 (UTC)
What happened to the gold plates?? How could something so fundamental be forgotten about?
baden 41.74.221.96 ( talk) 04:38, 24 October 2012 (UTC)
How about summarizing the plates and linking to the Wikipedia article on "Golden Plates" as the source? Rjmail ( talk) 18:55, 9 April 2013 (UTC)
I'm really confused why there are two articles. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (LDS for short) is the name of this church. There is no church called "Mormonism". That is a formerly derogatory term given to the LDS people that eventually became slang terminology for the church. Nowadays it is not insulting to be called a mormon. However, having two different articles causes confusion for non-members (apparently a lot of the population believe the churches are different). I know it says in the article that it is the LDS church, but still having a separate article all on its own seems redundant and aids in the general confusion already abound.
Thank you for your consideration. D — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.106.18.70 ( talk) 20:54, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
Now before you remove this comment; allow me to explain this. Mormonism is a historical fact, you can't argue that Christ died for our sins, or that Joseph Smith restored the gospel. It is historical fact, now people have freedom of agency and they have the choice to be ignorant and deny the true fact that Jesus was the Christ and that Joseph Smith was the first prophet since Jesus Christ.
You may ask "How do I know for a fact that Jesus was the Christ?" Answer- You have to pray to Heavenly Father, in the name of Jesus Christ amen, with a sincere heart and a desire to feel the holy spirit and you will receive an answer.
Mormonism is regarded as an opinion by most people; when it is a historical fact. Example- Tectonic Plates ( Pangea theory) is technically a theory, but there is nothing wrong with it. This is a good example of Mormonism. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the faith, church, or the doctrine. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Checkb4uwreck ( talk • contribs) 22:37, 9 December 2012 (UTC)
Personal beliefs on Wikipedia are a little tricky. You are convinced that Mormonism is true, while the next person is convinced that it's false and another religion is true, while the next person is convinced that all religions are a joke. Rather than having editors duke it out and whoever has the strongest opinoin wins, Wikipedia deals with the problem in two ways. First, we have a strict policy that articles should have a neutral point of view. In the case of religions, this means that it won't say that they are either true or false. (This goes for all religions, not just Mormonism.) Using your example above, it is unacceptable for Wikipedia to say "Jesus is the Christ." It's just not neutral. Wikipedia, however, can say "Christians believe that Jesus is the Christ, or Messiah."
Second, instead of relying on personal opinions, Wikipedia demands that any controversial claim be backed by a WP:reliable source, preferably a secondary, peer reviewed source written by someone who is an expert on the subject. For something like Mormonism, this means you'd have to back up your changes with citations to people like Richard Bushman, Jan Shipps, Arnold Mauss, or Matthew Bowman, who have spent years studying Mormonism and have written books on the subject.
Lastly, if you would like to be making changes to the article, or believe that something is inaccurate, it would be very helpful if you could say what precisely is the problem. Instead of "The article is wrong and biased" something like "The article is incorrect when it says '...'." ~ Adjwilley ( talk) 13:42, 10 December 2012 (UTC)
You might want to read up on what a theory is before you throw around the phrase, "Only a theory." In the scientific sense it is an explanation for credible facts and evidence. You're using it the sense of a hypothesis (which is valid in our culture but misleading). Tectonic Plate Theory is an explanation for a huge amount of credible evidence and observable facts; moreover it is falsifiable. The strength of any theory is that it must be falsifiable, meaning there is a scenario in which, if certain facts and evidence are found to be true, the theory can indisputably be proven wrong. That may not sound impressive but a concept that is falsifiable is much more important than one that is only verifiable. The concept of God is verifiable; if he came down and showed himself and his power there would be little to disprove him. Conversely it is not falsifiable; according to the hypothesis or "belief" that God is real, one must simply have faith and believe with or without credible evidence. The lack of falsifiability is what makes God a hypothesis and Plate Tectonics a theory: If Plate Tectonics was wrong, it can be proven, it's validity is based on observable facts and evidence; if it is correct then a scenario in which facts and evidence prove it wrong simply will not ever happen. In science we do have to accept that any fact is only true while it's not being proven wrong, and that's okay; the quest for truth, insight and knowledge is more important than validating one's beliefs and hypotheses. 172.248.150.231 ( talk) 00:35, 5 December 2013 (UTC)
I'm having trouble understanding what the purpose is in having distinct articles for Mormonism and the Latter Day Saint movement. I had taken "Mormonism" to be a name for the religion of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, but I'm finding that it's also applied to other Latter Day Saint denominations. Is that usage correct? If so, what need is there for two separate articles? If not, wouldn't the Mormonism article be merged with the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints one? Slb1900 ( talk) 05:10, 25 March 2014 (UTC)
The section titled "Restoration" describes Peter, James, John, and John the Baptist as angels. I know virtually nothing about Mormonism, but those figures are usually identified as apostles and so I have edited the article to read "apostles" under the assumption that "angels" is a typo. If "angels" is actually the intended reading, feel free to revert. 163.11.145.139 ( talk) 18:49, 1 September 2014 (UTC)
For editing purposes (especially for statistics and social issues) you may be interested to know that I am keeping brief notes and putting them on my personal TALK page: User_talk:Charles_Edwin_Shipp#LDS_April_Conference.2C_world_broadcast.2C_April_4-5.2C_2015_.28Sat.2FSun.2C_10am.2F2pm_MT.29 -- Charles Edwin Shipp ( talk) 02:34, 5 April 2015 (UTC) -- PS: I'll add official references later.
Mormans believe that the Book of Morman (written by a MAN) is on the same level as the Bible (written by GOD), whereas Christians believe the Bible is on its own pedastool, alone in power. Therefore, since these two beliefs contradict, Mormans are, in fact, NOT Christians. Unlike the Part of a Series on Christianity, I do intend for this to be a debate on Are Mormons Christians?" <ref>The Holy Bible by God</ref> <ref>The Book of Morman by SRD (Some Random Dude)</ref> — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.94.252.244 ( talk • contribs)
Members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints are Christians, FYI, Charles Edwin Shipp ( talk) 20:53, 11 March 2014 (UTC) Thanks for noticing.
Some mention of EMS should be given in this article about mind control techniques https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7vOgHqE_P4 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.49.157.227 ( talk) 19:34, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
The external link http://www.religionnewsblog.com/maintenance.php (about the 2007 poll) is not working at the moment (web site is in maintenance) . But I've found http://www.pewforum.org/2007/09/26/public-expresses-mixed-views-of-islam-mormonism/ , and also http://www.pewforum.org/2012/01/12/mormons-in-america-mormon-moment/ about a newer 2011 poll. -- 5.170.60.170 ( talk) 14:37, 12 September 2015 (UTC)
Since this topic can get heated fast, let me quickly give a more detailed explanation than what could fit in the the edit summary. My reading of the Pew survey puts the number of Mormons who self-identify as Christian much higher than 66%. Specifically in the cited source, sixth paragraph: "Mormons are nearly unanimous in describing Mormonism as a Christian religion, with 97% expressing this point of view." Maybe the other editor is looking at something else and I'm missing where the 1-in-3 not self-identifying as Christian shows up.
As for the dictionary definitions, they are notoriously difficult because they're designed to be short so the effective bandwidth is severely limited. The second and third sources (sorry, got the order wrong in the edit summary - the dictionary.com and oxford dictionary sources) use wording that IMO is less restrictive of how they define Christianity. Specifically, dictionary.com states "the Christian religion, including the Catholic, Protestant, and Eastern Orthodox churches." and the oxford dictionary states "Christianity is ... mainly divided between the Roman Catholic, Protestant, and Eastern Orthodox Churches" (emphasis mine in both quotes). The emphasized phrasing I read to mean that the following list not exhaustive and leaves the definition open to Christian groups that don't fit nicely into that categorization. The Merriam Webster definition is less vague, not totally definitive IMO, but less vague. However, if you look at its entry for Mormon it states "a member of a Christian church that was founded by Joseph Smith...", which contradicts the strict interpretation of its Christianity entry. -- FyzixFighter ( talk) 04:07, 6 February 2016 (UTC)
@ Trinacrialucente: So much for WP:BRD I guess? -- FyzixFighter ( talk) 04:14, 6 February 2016 (UTC)
As for the McConkie reference, I cringe somewhat when when use his book to make generalized statement on LDS theology and belief. I feel that the edit has OR, POV, and UNDUE issues. It is a single LDS apostle making a statement in a book that the LDS Church never endorsed in the first place. It's also not a view that is unique to the LDS Church - many Protestant churches have taught the same thing about the Catholic Church. IMO the edit just doesn't fit at that location in a summary style subsection. Any third opinions out there? -- FyzixFighter ( talk) 14:15, 6 February 2016 (UTC)
This has been addressed in the past, but in defence of the church my edits long ago were reverted. The current type says "The faith drew its first converts while Smith was dictating the text of the Book of Mormon from golden plates"
The problem is that the church says differently "Gold Plates Plates made of gold upon which the ancient American prophet Mormon abridged the record of his people" LDS.org
Since the Utah LDS church refers to them as 'gold', it seems presumptuous of us to correct the church and use the term 'golden'. -- Gunnerclark ( talk) 20:50, 29 May 2016 (UTC)
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Please update references to "the LDS Church" to "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" according to the official Style Guide of the Church (see https://www.mormonnewsroom.org/style-guide). Msheets1 ( talk) 06:26, 15 April 2019 (UTC)
Came here to see the number of Mormons in the world, did the same thing I do when I check a wiki article for similar information and took a quick look to the right and saw there was no infobox. WHAT IS THE DEAL WITH THIS? I know there's a number of editors who have an irrational hatred of infoboxes for some insane reason, but non-infobox articles are usually limited to articles most people don't care about, or a collection of articles of historical figures that these nutbag infobox-hating editors have gotten there claws on and clamp down on like a vice. There's no excuse for an article as big as this to have the same problem. FIX IT. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:56A:7178:C500:BDE8:E4A1:261D:189A ( talk) 09:55, 3 January 2020 (UTC)
Nevermind I just saw the article of "Mormons", which has the info. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:56A:7178:C500:BDE8:E4A1:261D:189A ( talk) 10:02, 3 January 2020 (UTC)
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Request that the authors meet the official style guide for using the name of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (see https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.org/style-guide). Carrollewis ( talk) 15:55, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
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The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints does not want to be identified as "Mormonism," a pejorative term that does not emphasize the name of Jesus Christ, an integral part of the faith. Although many people still identify the Church as "Mormonism," a minor but significant change should be made on the page "Category:Nontrinitarian denominations." In the section entitled "Subcategories," the Church is correctly listed as "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints," but in the section below that, "Pages in category "Nontrinitarian denominations," the name is confusingly still listed as "Mormonism." I suggest that the name should be changed from "Mormonism" to "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (Mormonism)." Such a change may require changes to the page entitled "Mormonism," which is itself antiquated and should be edited. Ctblack ( talk) 15:03, 8 August 2020 (UTC)
A Request for Move on a relate article is backlogged and needs more participation. The proposal is to move Mormonism and Christianity → Mormonism and Nicene Christianity.
Please consider joining the discussion to help build consensus for or against the proposed move. If you are an uninvolved admin, please consider closing the RM. Thanks. JaredHWood 💬 06:57, 5 February 2021 (UTC)
As a new reader of this article (who is not Mormon / LDS) the term "mystery cult" (in spite of the reliable source and the divergent meanings of the term "cult") appears to be an NPOV violation. Assuming the historian is using "cult" in the non-pejorative sense, the negative connotations among many other readers should still be taken into account. Negativity bias also shows that small negative associations can have outsized impact. Note that this WP article is the top result for "Mormonism" in Google for me, and likely other readers as well.
I have a lot of problems with that sentence. It looks like it was added by User:Ph03n1x77 in a bold rewrite of the Lead in January [4] along with a lot of other problematic changes that went unnoticed. For instance [5] seems to be deleting a lot of sourced material and scrubbing the article of the word "Mormon", introducing weird constructions like "The displaced Mormons fled to Illinois" --> "The displaced church fled to Illinois". (I'm imagining a church version of Baba Yaga's house.) But getting back to the "mystery cult" quote, I think it's problematic to have that extended quote by Sydney E. Ahlstrom taking up valuable real estate in the 2nd paragraph of the Lead. Especially when it's not in the body of the article. And especially because it's not adding a lot of value. You don't start writing an encyclopedia article with "Ho hum we're not really sure if [subject] is this or that or something else, maybe it's all of them." You say concisely what it is. I think some manual rollbacking is needed. ~ Awilley ( talk) 05:39, 9 June 2021 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The Church has recently put out a statement asking to be referred to as its full name- The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints- instead of the nickname "Mormons" or "Mormonism". In relation to this article, their style guide says: "The term "Mormonism" is inaccurate and should not be used. When describing the combination of doctrine, culture and lifestyle unique to The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, the term "the restored gospel of Jesus Christ" is accurate and preferred." [6] Would it be okay to proceed with a name change, or would an RfC be required? Audrey ( talk) 01:06, 24 September 2018 (UTC)
Hello. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (LDS Church) has its own Wikipedia page. The LDS Church is actually one of many sects under the larger umbrella of Mormonism, so Mormonism isn’t a specific church, it’s a theology. Both topics are distinctive enough and notable enough in their own right to merit separate articles on Wikipedia. I hope this helps you understand. Mrbeastmodeallday ( talk) 12:32, 6 April 2019 (UTC)
Not sure I support this page move. What's the justification/reasoning behind it? @ Johnpacklambert. –– 𝗙𝗼𝗿𝗺𝗮𝗹𝗗𝘂𝗱𝗲 talk 18:54, 23 August 2021 (UTC)
The word depreciated has two meanings:
The first is accurate, the second is not. I suggest redoing this edit with a more accurate word like "relinquish" which means voluntarily cease to keep or claim; give up. I also do not think it's necessary to remove all the mentions of Mormon throughout this article. –– 𝗙𝗼𝗿𝗺𝗮𝗹𝗗𝘂𝗱𝗲 talk 19:37, 23 August 2021 (UTC)
I think I pinged everyone, but in case others are watching who haven't contributed: Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#Topic_Ban_for_Johnpacklambert. I'm not watching this page, so please ping me if needed. Star Mississippi 16:00, 25 August 2021 (UTC)
I agree with those that have stated that the title and the word "Mormon" are inaccurate. The official name is the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. Any personal opinions cannot change that. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 144.38.62.90 ( talk) 18:25, 15 February 2022 (UTC)
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 22 August 2022 and 7 December 2022. Further details are available
on the course page. Student editor(s):
Abby Crandall (
article contribs).
— Assignment last updated by Abby Crandall ( talk) 00:47, 15 September 2022 (UTC)
It's known as "further revelation" from what I know 71.223.22.101 ( talk) 16:42, 15 January 2023 (UTC)
Said something about this in the denominations page but could someone include some of the reasons why certain churches gave up some of the teachings that joseph smith wrote, or the doctrine and covenants? If there is any mention of a offshoot of the church of jesus christ of latter day saints in any way, before it was fully named it or not, we should include the reasons for holding on to the book of mormon but not all the Doctrines from the man who wrote it. 2600:8800:8B92:F600:1482:9D61:1826:ABB3 ( talk) 01:54, 19 April 2023 (UTC)
The `the` in `The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints` must be capitolized, per [12] https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/legal/terms-of-use under Trademarks. Minecraftchest1 ( talk) 12:55, 14 October 2023 (UTC)
hi! Members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints do not practice polygamy/plural marriage at all . :) 107.77.229.202 ( talk) 00:32, 29 October 2023 (UTC)