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![]() | This article contains a translation of 淵田美津雄 from ja.wikipedia. ( 48824147 et seq.) |
The reasons I placed caveats around Fuchida's statement that he attended the surrender ceremony on board U.S.S. Missouri are detailed below. Frankly, this is such a whopper I can't understand why someone else hasn't trashed it years ago. Please go here:
http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/events/wwii-pac/japansur/js-8.htm
The photos of the ceremony make two things abundantly clear:
1) This was a standing-room only party, and all the guests were either American crewman of the Missouri (on the turrets and in the superstructure), or else very important representatives from the Allied nations (on the quarterdeck). I see *no* Japanese uniforms in *any* of those photos--just white American sailor suits and guys wearing *our* officers' hats. All the spots in the rafters are taken by American sailors.
2) Pretty clearly, the *only* Japanese "invited" to this party were the eleven individuals who were required to be there. And from the faces of the Japanese delegation, they all look like they've just eaten toads. Ask yourself the following questions: why would a mid-level staff officer like Fuchida be present at these ceremonies, in *any* capacity whatsoever? Why? Why him, when the IJN has literally hundreds of Japanese *admirals* to choose from instead? And from the American perspective, why would Admiral Halsey (whose flagship this is) have even the *slightest* interest in giving up precious deck real-estate for some no-name guy like Fuchida? It doesn't make any sense. It simply doesn't pass the sniff test.
This is further supported by the description of the ceremony, which was (not surprisingly) very well documented. The Japanese party came on board for half an hour. There is no mention whatsoever of any group of supernumerary Japanese who were allowed to come aboard beforehand and were then escorted onto the ship's superstructure to witness the show. If there were, don't you think they would have been photographed as well? The ship was absolutely crawling with photographers--Fuchida couldn't have helped being photographed if he were there. No, it's quite clear that the Japanese came on as a single group, and from a single ship. They did their thing, and then were immediately escorted off the ship. Fuchida was never there. It's complete nonsense. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jparshall ( talk • contribs) 22:42, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
Oldbubblehead ( talk) 00:39, 18 June 2013 (UTC)
This "biography" of Fuchida is a Hagiography ! This is not history, in any sense. To take acritically the words of the late biographed don’t serves the purposes of Wikipedia. Fuchida is today regarded by serious historians in West and in Japan as a falsifier of events. So, it’s necessary to point legitimate sources, lest this text will fall in simple self-glorification of the late Mitsuo Fuchida. Worse : the conversion “Damascus Road” is cited as history (remember : Wikipedia is an Encyclopedia !), but is only the romanticized version from Fuchida. (from carlos.cleto,adv@uol.com.br) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.106.71.196 ( talk) 23:25, 20 December 2010 (UTC)
(outdent) IMO it has become clear that User:Theleopard's concerns are more about protecting Fuchida Mitsuo's reputation than WP:NPOV. I will restore the disputed section (in a toned-down form) per WP:BRD. TiC ( talk) 06:43, 11 December 2011 (UTC)
Parshall's claims were shown to be unfounded by a highly researched and footnoted article entitled "Jon Parshall's Whoppers Examined" - http://heynotsofast.wordpress.com. When fact-checked, virtually every claim Parshall makes is false. A friend sent me an e-mail with this and showed me the response of Don Goldstein, co-author of "Miracle at Midway" who also found the new article accurate. Wikipedia is not a place for speculation and Parshall's piece is not credible, therefore the last section was removed. Read the article thoroughly before future revisions. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Theleopard ( talk • contribs) 13:48, 13 March 2012 (UTC)
I'm just going to chime in here, since it's my work, and that of Anthony Tully, that's caused this interchange. First off, I'm not TitaniumCarbide. I sign all my posts jparshall. There are two points I'd like to raise. First, Theleopard, I'm fairly sure, is Martin Bennett, who (under his production company, Hungry Kitty) is working on selling a screenplay based on Mr. Fuchida's life and conversion to Christianity. Mr. Bennett has a financial interest in seeing his film project through to completion. This accounts for his rather heated reactions to any assertions that Fuchida's various WWII accounts are in any way flawed, because he feels that it undermines his ability to obtain funding for his movie project. As such, his comments clearly fail WP:NPOV. Mr. Bennett feels that he has a vested financial outcome in how Fuchida is portrayed, and admitted as much to me during a phone call he made to me on 14 March, 2012. He likewise admitted his frustration with how Mr. Fuchida is portrayed on Wikipedia, describing it as a game of "whackamole." The second point I'd raise is that, whether you agree with Tully and my conclusions regarding the veracity of Fuchida's various accounts, the fact that they are disputed is not in question. A dispute clearly exists. Therefore, it is right and proper for such a section to be present under Fuchida's entry in this encyclopedia. Removal is not congruent with either current scholarship on the matter, or Wikipedia's intent to provide NPOV on matters relating to its content. So, any attempts to remove it would be unfounded. Likewise, attempts to remove it for reasons of financial interest would not only be unfounded, but also unethical. In light of the attempts to expurgate this section from the record, I intend to monitor this page rather closely from now on. -jon parshall- Jparshall ( talk) 16:01, 26 March 2012 (UTC)
To Binksternet re: 12/4/12 addition to "controversy" - Parshall has 145 words and I edited my response to a concise 45. No need to chop further. There's much, much more I could have said but left it out. Parshall's section is much longer than it needs to be, but I'm trying to be fair. TMartinBennett ( talk) 23:37, 4 December 2012 (UTC)
At this point, this may be a time to accept a WP:RFC to elicit further comments and evaluation of the disputed statements. FWiW FWiW ( talk) 20:05, 5 December 2012 (UTC).
Hello wikipedians,
I read in a day-by-day Advent pamphlet today that at the end of the war, Fuchida realized he was the last surviving officer of the attack on Pearl Harbor. Are there any other sources that corroborate this? It would be worth including in the article, if it were true. GrimmC ( talk) 17:31, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
Edit: This appears to be untrue, as Minoru Genda survived the end of the war. However, I'm curious now as to how many Japanese Pearl Harbor vets from the officer corps actually made it to the end of the war. GrimmC ( talk) 17:37, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
Zenji Abe, who was a lieutenant during the attack (a dive-bomber pilot), didn't die until April, 2007. I met him briefly at the 65th Pearl Harbor symposium in 2006. I do not know if Abe was the last Pearl Harbor aviation officer still surviving, however. Jparshall ( talk) 14:09, 9 June 2013 (UTC)
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Hi -
With reference to the Parshall-Bennet controversy, I think this needs linking:
http://www.combinedfleet.com/BennettRebuttal.htm
..It's Parshall's response to Bennet's attempt at defending Fuchida and is of very high quality.
It should probably go just after
"and that his charges are groundless and without credibility.[]"
simply as "Parshall's reply, however, makes detailed reference to IJN logbooks, which recorded carrier operations as they occurred, showing that they are inconsistent with Fuchida's account [link]"
And this should possibly be added:
http://www.combinedfleet.com/fuchida/ThreeMoreWhoppers.htm
as "Parshall also discusses other incidents where Fuchida is allegedly unreliable, leading to his being widely distrusted as a source by historians of the IJN [link]."
Umptious ( talk) 00:09, 16 December 2012 (UTC) Umptious ( talk) 00:09, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
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I request that the present section of text, shown below in red, be replaced by the suggested text shown under that in green:
Both of these sentences are based on the same reference: "Parshall's 'Whoppers' Examined", Naval War College Review. Winter 2013, volume 66, number 1, pages 110–125.
The reason I offer for this request is that Bennett is given far too much weight with regard to Parshall, who is the greater military authority. Bennett is a successful small businessman/entrepreneur who has turned to writing film scripts, especially one called Wounded Tiger featuring the story of Fuchida's life. Parshall is widely cited for his military histories. Bennett's paper turns on the argument that the reliability of four people must be compared: Parshall, Fuchida, Prange and Goldstein. Bennett says Parshall researched poorly, and he says Fuchida, Prange and Goldstein are upstanding and truthful men in comparison. There are many more details in Bennett's argument, but I do not wish to elaborate on them as the essence of Bennett's stance is one of authority; whose version is more probably correct. Another reason for not arguing Bennett's details is that Bennett would in that case get too much weight, violating WP:UNDUE. Binksternet ( talk) 22:35, 1 July 2013 (UTC)
Parshall has some substantial accolades. The Naval War College Review in its review of Shattered Sword states that the book is the new definitive study of the Battle of Midway. The book won the distinguished John Lyman prize for U.S. Naval History in 2005. Additionally, many well known naval historians, for example, Norman Polmar, have praised the book. Finally, Parshall is not alone in his assessment of Fuchida. Retired U.S. naval officer, Ph.D., and expert on naval operational analysis, Alan D. Zimm demolishes Fuchida's record in his 2011 book, Attack on Pearl Harbor: Strategy, Combat, Myths, Deceptions. It has been thirty one years since Prange's "Miracle at Midway" was published. I think Prange would be the first to admit that in that length of time new information and new approaches are bound to appear which change and challenge our previous assessments of the battle. Oldbubblehead ( talk) 04:36, 3 July 2013 (UTC)
Today I made a substantial revision to the Historical Controversy section. My intent was to re-frame the argument away from being between myself and Martin Bennett, and instead to expand the source material cited, and then create a more accurate, comprehensive, and roughly chronological view of the sources of criticisms regarding Fuchida. In so doing, I hoped to illustrate a couple points. First, I am hardly Fuchida's only critic. I wasn't even the first one: that was the Midway volume of the Japanese official war history series ("Senshi Sosho"), which was published in Japan in 1971. Second, the majority of the criticism leveled against Fuchida in the Western historical literature is aimed not at Midway, but rather at Pearl Harbor. I am only one of at least five different historians to have independently called into question Fuchida's statements regarding Pearl Harbor. By any measure, Alan Zimm's work is by far the most comprehensive, wide-ranging, and damaging in its criticisms of Fuchida's misstatements regarding that battle. Third, with respect to Midway, it is important to note that Dallas Isom independently came to the same conclusion that Anthony Tully and I did regarding the (un)readiness of the Japanese counterstrike before the American dive-bomber attack. This was re-confirmed by the eminent naval historian Craig Symond noting in his 2013 book that at the time of the attack, Akagi's strike aircraft were still in the hangars. In its totality, this section revision should also illustrate that Mr. Bennett's attempts to attack my scholarship are 1) misguided, and 2) bound to be ultimately fruitless. Trying to defend Fuchida's reputation is somewhat akin to fighting a hydra. I am hardly the the first, nor the only author to have pointed out Fuchida's misstatements. More have since arisen, and the process likely will continue as his statements continue to be examined. Any attempt to defend Fuchida's reputation, therefore, has to deal with the corpus of criticism, and its multitude of sources, in its entirety, not just attacking my writings alone. That's going to be a rather tall order, I'm afraid. Jparshall ( talk) 20:05, 8 October 2016 (UTC)
Alan Zimm published this month a new article in Naval History magazine, which digs into the supposed signal flare mishandling during the minutes immediately prior to the attack. In his article, Zimm states that there actually was no mishandling of the flares at all--that Fuchida intended to signal the "no surprise" version of the attack all along. Thus, "Fuchida was not telling the truth when he claimed that he intended to signal for a surprise attack. From the outset, he wanted to fire two flares, and did so just about as fast as possible."(p. 21 of Zimm 2016) Fuchida subsequently blamed the somewhat ragged tactical execution of the first-wave attack (which saw the Americans putting up much heavier AA fire, much earlier than the Japanese had anticipated) on "that blockhead" Lieutenant Commander Takahashi Kakuichi, the first wave dive bomber commander. Jparshall ( talk) 20:03, 30 October 2016 (UTC)
As written the article states, "Fuchida remained over the target in order to assess damage and to observe the second wave attack. He returned to his carrier after the second wave successfully completed its mission. With great pride, he announced that the U.S. battleship fleet had been destroyed; USS Arizona, Oklahoma, West Virginia, California and Nevada were sunk." This is incorrect. Fuchida initially reported two battleships sunk and four battleships with severe damage. Nagumo's preliminary action report by radio estimated four battleships sunk, two battleships with heavy damage, and two battleships with small damage. The Pearl Harbor battle damage assessment which Fuchida presented to the Emperor was as follows (battleships only): Minor damage: Pennsylvania; Moderate damage: Nevada, California; Serious damage: Arizona, Maryland; Sunk: Oklahoma, West Virginia, Tennessee. (source: Prange, Dillon and Goldstein as reported in Zimm). Oldbubblehead ( talk) 07:52, 4 July 2013 (UTC)
Due to some editors bent on a lopsided "Controversy" section, I am posting here for those interested in balance to read my contributions that are being constantly deleted. I DO NOT endorse statements on the Fuchda page attributed to me and cannot correct the error without engaging in an edit war. Here is my counterpoint paragraph that belongs in the Controversy section that Parshall and others are trying to suppress:
Next is the reference to the four articles that appeared in the U.S. Naval War College review that are also being cut off by Parshall and others, even though two of the articles were penned by Parshall himself. These are highly academic articles completely worthy of a Wikipedia entry. Binksternet is mistaken when he considers an article in the "Letters" section of the NWCR to be unvetted like a "Dear Abbey" letter. Both Parshall's and my rebuttal articles could have appeared in any number of sections in the NWCR and are vetted and appropriately edited for source material and accuracy. I had to demonstrate written references for all quotes. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Theleopard ( talk • contribs)
1. “Reflecting on Fuchida, or ‘A Tale of Three Whoppers,’” Jonathan Parshall, 2010, Spring, Naval War College Review, Vol. 63, No.2, pp. 127-138. https://www.usnwc.edu/getattachment/612aa0c4-47a1-4107-afbb-17fa992adf59/Reflecting-on-Fuchida,-or--A-Tale-of-Three-Whopper.aspx
2. “Parshall’s ‘Whoppers’ Examined,” Martin Bennett, 2013, Winter, Naval War College Review, Vol. 66, No. 1, pp. 110-125. https://www.usnwc.edu/getattachment/292914a3-bbf7-4418-bc52-2b482f6466db/Book-Reviews.aspx
3. “In My View” section, “Fuchida’s Whoppers,” Jonathan Parshall, 2013, Spring, Naval War College Review, Vol. 66, No.2, pp. 136-138. https://www.usnwc.edu/getattachment/04286a6c-c1a5-46d1-b82d-56a59cefe6d2/Download-the-entire-issue-in-pdf-for-your-e-reader.aspx
4. “In My View” section, “Fireside Chats and Chasing Rabbits,” Martin Bennett, 2013, Summer, Naval War College Review, Vol. 66, No.3, pp. 155-157. https://www.usnwc.edu/getattachment/87757f16-a19f-45d2-a606-057a6999d699/Download-the-entire-issue-in-pdf-for-your-e-reader.aspx
References
Should we say T. Martin Bennett is a writer? He is not known for his writing. Should we say he's a screenwriter? Such a calling is relevant to this biography but difficult attach to Bennett unless he has already seen some success as a screenwriter. Should we call him an entrepreneur or successful small businessman? That would be a summary of the sort of prior career Bennett had as described in December 2008 Stars & Stripes. Thoughts? Binksternet ( talk) 22:04, 12 July 2013 (UTC)
My recent copy edits were made with the intention of improving the flow of the writing. If any of them resulted in a change in meaning, then the originals can simply be copied and pasted back in with no damage done. Sincerely, GeorgeLouis ( talk) 05:17, 13 July 2013 (UTC)
User:Binksternet, the guidelines for WP:COI are quite clear and have to do with editorial, not with the simple addition of reference material into the bibliography. My published work, "Wounded Tiger," is endorsed by many including one of the premier historians in the world on Mitsuo Fuchida and Pearl Harbor, Dr. Donald Goldstein. Listing a legitimate relevant work by the author is no violation of COI. Deleting the reference amounts to harassment, forcing me to get someone else to do it. I asked you to relist it personally, but you have declined. It is the most simple and logical way for a book to be listed. Please refrain from deleting legitimate works. TMartinBennett ( talk) 23:20, 27 March 2014 (UTC)
The link in #22 is dead, but the Daily Mail has a good photo of Fuchida's map: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2541293/Chilling-diagram-damage-Pearl-Harbor-drawn-Lieutenant-Commander-led-mission-sells-427-000-auction.html as well as other good pix, so a worthy reference to replace #22. Plus, the map was big: "The map is incredibly accurate in terms of the positions of the 60 ships and Lt Cmdr Fushida was about 80 per cent correct in his results... He gave the document, that measures 2ft 7in by 23ins, to the historian Gordon Prange when he was interviewed by him in 1947."
I came to wikipedia after seeing a photograph captioned "the first plane drops the first bomb on pearl harbor" attributed to Fuchida: http://www.usncva.org/clog/pearlharbor-pix.html (linked to from paragraph four photo credit in article here: http://www.usncva.org/clog/pearl1.shtml)
That photo coincidentally makes a circle back to the similar Pearl Harbor photograph included at bottom of the Daily Mail article, both apparently taken very close together.
Interesting to compare, best wishes to all. Hope this is useful to an editor.
108.193.227.112 ( talk) 20:47, 6 July 2015 (UTC)
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Where is Mitsuo Fuchida's Burial? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Akhtar Hussain Samoo ( talk • contribs) 10:15, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
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![]() | This article contains a translation of 淵田美津雄 from ja.wikipedia. ( 48824147 et seq.) |
The reasons I placed caveats around Fuchida's statement that he attended the surrender ceremony on board U.S.S. Missouri are detailed below. Frankly, this is such a whopper I can't understand why someone else hasn't trashed it years ago. Please go here:
http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/events/wwii-pac/japansur/js-8.htm
The photos of the ceremony make two things abundantly clear:
1) This was a standing-room only party, and all the guests were either American crewman of the Missouri (on the turrets and in the superstructure), or else very important representatives from the Allied nations (on the quarterdeck). I see *no* Japanese uniforms in *any* of those photos--just white American sailor suits and guys wearing *our* officers' hats. All the spots in the rafters are taken by American sailors.
2) Pretty clearly, the *only* Japanese "invited" to this party were the eleven individuals who were required to be there. And from the faces of the Japanese delegation, they all look like they've just eaten toads. Ask yourself the following questions: why would a mid-level staff officer like Fuchida be present at these ceremonies, in *any* capacity whatsoever? Why? Why him, when the IJN has literally hundreds of Japanese *admirals* to choose from instead? And from the American perspective, why would Admiral Halsey (whose flagship this is) have even the *slightest* interest in giving up precious deck real-estate for some no-name guy like Fuchida? It doesn't make any sense. It simply doesn't pass the sniff test.
This is further supported by the description of the ceremony, which was (not surprisingly) very well documented. The Japanese party came on board for half an hour. There is no mention whatsoever of any group of supernumerary Japanese who were allowed to come aboard beforehand and were then escorted onto the ship's superstructure to witness the show. If there were, don't you think they would have been photographed as well? The ship was absolutely crawling with photographers--Fuchida couldn't have helped being photographed if he were there. No, it's quite clear that the Japanese came on as a single group, and from a single ship. They did their thing, and then were immediately escorted off the ship. Fuchida was never there. It's complete nonsense. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jparshall ( talk • contribs) 22:42, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
Oldbubblehead ( talk) 00:39, 18 June 2013 (UTC)
This "biography" of Fuchida is a Hagiography ! This is not history, in any sense. To take acritically the words of the late biographed don’t serves the purposes of Wikipedia. Fuchida is today regarded by serious historians in West and in Japan as a falsifier of events. So, it’s necessary to point legitimate sources, lest this text will fall in simple self-glorification of the late Mitsuo Fuchida. Worse : the conversion “Damascus Road” is cited as history (remember : Wikipedia is an Encyclopedia !), but is only the romanticized version from Fuchida. (from carlos.cleto,adv@uol.com.br) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.106.71.196 ( talk) 23:25, 20 December 2010 (UTC)
(outdent) IMO it has become clear that User:Theleopard's concerns are more about protecting Fuchida Mitsuo's reputation than WP:NPOV. I will restore the disputed section (in a toned-down form) per WP:BRD. TiC ( talk) 06:43, 11 December 2011 (UTC)
Parshall's claims were shown to be unfounded by a highly researched and footnoted article entitled "Jon Parshall's Whoppers Examined" - http://heynotsofast.wordpress.com. When fact-checked, virtually every claim Parshall makes is false. A friend sent me an e-mail with this and showed me the response of Don Goldstein, co-author of "Miracle at Midway" who also found the new article accurate. Wikipedia is not a place for speculation and Parshall's piece is not credible, therefore the last section was removed. Read the article thoroughly before future revisions. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Theleopard ( talk • contribs) 13:48, 13 March 2012 (UTC)
I'm just going to chime in here, since it's my work, and that of Anthony Tully, that's caused this interchange. First off, I'm not TitaniumCarbide. I sign all my posts jparshall. There are two points I'd like to raise. First, Theleopard, I'm fairly sure, is Martin Bennett, who (under his production company, Hungry Kitty) is working on selling a screenplay based on Mr. Fuchida's life and conversion to Christianity. Mr. Bennett has a financial interest in seeing his film project through to completion. This accounts for his rather heated reactions to any assertions that Fuchida's various WWII accounts are in any way flawed, because he feels that it undermines his ability to obtain funding for his movie project. As such, his comments clearly fail WP:NPOV. Mr. Bennett feels that he has a vested financial outcome in how Fuchida is portrayed, and admitted as much to me during a phone call he made to me on 14 March, 2012. He likewise admitted his frustration with how Mr. Fuchida is portrayed on Wikipedia, describing it as a game of "whackamole." The second point I'd raise is that, whether you agree with Tully and my conclusions regarding the veracity of Fuchida's various accounts, the fact that they are disputed is not in question. A dispute clearly exists. Therefore, it is right and proper for such a section to be present under Fuchida's entry in this encyclopedia. Removal is not congruent with either current scholarship on the matter, or Wikipedia's intent to provide NPOV on matters relating to its content. So, any attempts to remove it would be unfounded. Likewise, attempts to remove it for reasons of financial interest would not only be unfounded, but also unethical. In light of the attempts to expurgate this section from the record, I intend to monitor this page rather closely from now on. -jon parshall- Jparshall ( talk) 16:01, 26 March 2012 (UTC)
To Binksternet re: 12/4/12 addition to "controversy" - Parshall has 145 words and I edited my response to a concise 45. No need to chop further. There's much, much more I could have said but left it out. Parshall's section is much longer than it needs to be, but I'm trying to be fair. TMartinBennett ( talk) 23:37, 4 December 2012 (UTC)
At this point, this may be a time to accept a WP:RFC to elicit further comments and evaluation of the disputed statements. FWiW FWiW ( talk) 20:05, 5 December 2012 (UTC).
Hello wikipedians,
I read in a day-by-day Advent pamphlet today that at the end of the war, Fuchida realized he was the last surviving officer of the attack on Pearl Harbor. Are there any other sources that corroborate this? It would be worth including in the article, if it were true. GrimmC ( talk) 17:31, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
Edit: This appears to be untrue, as Minoru Genda survived the end of the war. However, I'm curious now as to how many Japanese Pearl Harbor vets from the officer corps actually made it to the end of the war. GrimmC ( talk) 17:37, 7 December 2011 (UTC)
Zenji Abe, who was a lieutenant during the attack (a dive-bomber pilot), didn't die until April, 2007. I met him briefly at the 65th Pearl Harbor symposium in 2006. I do not know if Abe was the last Pearl Harbor aviation officer still surviving, however. Jparshall ( talk) 14:09, 9 June 2013 (UTC)
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Hi -
With reference to the Parshall-Bennet controversy, I think this needs linking:
http://www.combinedfleet.com/BennettRebuttal.htm
..It's Parshall's response to Bennet's attempt at defending Fuchida and is of very high quality.
It should probably go just after
"and that his charges are groundless and without credibility.[]"
simply as "Parshall's reply, however, makes detailed reference to IJN logbooks, which recorded carrier operations as they occurred, showing that they are inconsistent with Fuchida's account [link]"
And this should possibly be added:
http://www.combinedfleet.com/fuchida/ThreeMoreWhoppers.htm
as "Parshall also discusses other incidents where Fuchida is allegedly unreliable, leading to his being widely distrusted as a source by historians of the IJN [link]."
Umptious ( talk) 00:09, 16 December 2012 (UTC) Umptious ( talk) 00:09, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
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I request that the present section of text, shown below in red, be replaced by the suggested text shown under that in green:
Both of these sentences are based on the same reference: "Parshall's 'Whoppers' Examined", Naval War College Review. Winter 2013, volume 66, number 1, pages 110–125.
The reason I offer for this request is that Bennett is given far too much weight with regard to Parshall, who is the greater military authority. Bennett is a successful small businessman/entrepreneur who has turned to writing film scripts, especially one called Wounded Tiger featuring the story of Fuchida's life. Parshall is widely cited for his military histories. Bennett's paper turns on the argument that the reliability of four people must be compared: Parshall, Fuchida, Prange and Goldstein. Bennett says Parshall researched poorly, and he says Fuchida, Prange and Goldstein are upstanding and truthful men in comparison. There are many more details in Bennett's argument, but I do not wish to elaborate on them as the essence of Bennett's stance is one of authority; whose version is more probably correct. Another reason for not arguing Bennett's details is that Bennett would in that case get too much weight, violating WP:UNDUE. Binksternet ( talk) 22:35, 1 July 2013 (UTC)
Parshall has some substantial accolades. The Naval War College Review in its review of Shattered Sword states that the book is the new definitive study of the Battle of Midway. The book won the distinguished John Lyman prize for U.S. Naval History in 2005. Additionally, many well known naval historians, for example, Norman Polmar, have praised the book. Finally, Parshall is not alone in his assessment of Fuchida. Retired U.S. naval officer, Ph.D., and expert on naval operational analysis, Alan D. Zimm demolishes Fuchida's record in his 2011 book, Attack on Pearl Harbor: Strategy, Combat, Myths, Deceptions. It has been thirty one years since Prange's "Miracle at Midway" was published. I think Prange would be the first to admit that in that length of time new information and new approaches are bound to appear which change and challenge our previous assessments of the battle. Oldbubblehead ( talk) 04:36, 3 July 2013 (UTC)
Today I made a substantial revision to the Historical Controversy section. My intent was to re-frame the argument away from being between myself and Martin Bennett, and instead to expand the source material cited, and then create a more accurate, comprehensive, and roughly chronological view of the sources of criticisms regarding Fuchida. In so doing, I hoped to illustrate a couple points. First, I am hardly Fuchida's only critic. I wasn't even the first one: that was the Midway volume of the Japanese official war history series ("Senshi Sosho"), which was published in Japan in 1971. Second, the majority of the criticism leveled against Fuchida in the Western historical literature is aimed not at Midway, but rather at Pearl Harbor. I am only one of at least five different historians to have independently called into question Fuchida's statements regarding Pearl Harbor. By any measure, Alan Zimm's work is by far the most comprehensive, wide-ranging, and damaging in its criticisms of Fuchida's misstatements regarding that battle. Third, with respect to Midway, it is important to note that Dallas Isom independently came to the same conclusion that Anthony Tully and I did regarding the (un)readiness of the Japanese counterstrike before the American dive-bomber attack. This was re-confirmed by the eminent naval historian Craig Symond noting in his 2013 book that at the time of the attack, Akagi's strike aircraft were still in the hangars. In its totality, this section revision should also illustrate that Mr. Bennett's attempts to attack my scholarship are 1) misguided, and 2) bound to be ultimately fruitless. Trying to defend Fuchida's reputation is somewhat akin to fighting a hydra. I am hardly the the first, nor the only author to have pointed out Fuchida's misstatements. More have since arisen, and the process likely will continue as his statements continue to be examined. Any attempt to defend Fuchida's reputation, therefore, has to deal with the corpus of criticism, and its multitude of sources, in its entirety, not just attacking my writings alone. That's going to be a rather tall order, I'm afraid. Jparshall ( talk) 20:05, 8 October 2016 (UTC)
Alan Zimm published this month a new article in Naval History magazine, which digs into the supposed signal flare mishandling during the minutes immediately prior to the attack. In his article, Zimm states that there actually was no mishandling of the flares at all--that Fuchida intended to signal the "no surprise" version of the attack all along. Thus, "Fuchida was not telling the truth when he claimed that he intended to signal for a surprise attack. From the outset, he wanted to fire two flares, and did so just about as fast as possible."(p. 21 of Zimm 2016) Fuchida subsequently blamed the somewhat ragged tactical execution of the first-wave attack (which saw the Americans putting up much heavier AA fire, much earlier than the Japanese had anticipated) on "that blockhead" Lieutenant Commander Takahashi Kakuichi, the first wave dive bomber commander. Jparshall ( talk) 20:03, 30 October 2016 (UTC)
As written the article states, "Fuchida remained over the target in order to assess damage and to observe the second wave attack. He returned to his carrier after the second wave successfully completed its mission. With great pride, he announced that the U.S. battleship fleet had been destroyed; USS Arizona, Oklahoma, West Virginia, California and Nevada were sunk." This is incorrect. Fuchida initially reported two battleships sunk and four battleships with severe damage. Nagumo's preliminary action report by radio estimated four battleships sunk, two battleships with heavy damage, and two battleships with small damage. The Pearl Harbor battle damage assessment which Fuchida presented to the Emperor was as follows (battleships only): Minor damage: Pennsylvania; Moderate damage: Nevada, California; Serious damage: Arizona, Maryland; Sunk: Oklahoma, West Virginia, Tennessee. (source: Prange, Dillon and Goldstein as reported in Zimm). Oldbubblehead ( talk) 07:52, 4 July 2013 (UTC)
Due to some editors bent on a lopsided "Controversy" section, I am posting here for those interested in balance to read my contributions that are being constantly deleted. I DO NOT endorse statements on the Fuchda page attributed to me and cannot correct the error without engaging in an edit war. Here is my counterpoint paragraph that belongs in the Controversy section that Parshall and others are trying to suppress:
Next is the reference to the four articles that appeared in the U.S. Naval War College review that are also being cut off by Parshall and others, even though two of the articles were penned by Parshall himself. These are highly academic articles completely worthy of a Wikipedia entry. Binksternet is mistaken when he considers an article in the "Letters" section of the NWCR to be unvetted like a "Dear Abbey" letter. Both Parshall's and my rebuttal articles could have appeared in any number of sections in the NWCR and are vetted and appropriately edited for source material and accuracy. I had to demonstrate written references for all quotes. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Theleopard ( talk • contribs)
1. “Reflecting on Fuchida, or ‘A Tale of Three Whoppers,’” Jonathan Parshall, 2010, Spring, Naval War College Review, Vol. 63, No.2, pp. 127-138. https://www.usnwc.edu/getattachment/612aa0c4-47a1-4107-afbb-17fa992adf59/Reflecting-on-Fuchida,-or--A-Tale-of-Three-Whopper.aspx
2. “Parshall’s ‘Whoppers’ Examined,” Martin Bennett, 2013, Winter, Naval War College Review, Vol. 66, No. 1, pp. 110-125. https://www.usnwc.edu/getattachment/292914a3-bbf7-4418-bc52-2b482f6466db/Book-Reviews.aspx
3. “In My View” section, “Fuchida’s Whoppers,” Jonathan Parshall, 2013, Spring, Naval War College Review, Vol. 66, No.2, pp. 136-138. https://www.usnwc.edu/getattachment/04286a6c-c1a5-46d1-b82d-56a59cefe6d2/Download-the-entire-issue-in-pdf-for-your-e-reader.aspx
4. “In My View” section, “Fireside Chats and Chasing Rabbits,” Martin Bennett, 2013, Summer, Naval War College Review, Vol. 66, No.3, pp. 155-157. https://www.usnwc.edu/getattachment/87757f16-a19f-45d2-a606-057a6999d699/Download-the-entire-issue-in-pdf-for-your-e-reader.aspx
References
Should we say T. Martin Bennett is a writer? He is not known for his writing. Should we say he's a screenwriter? Such a calling is relevant to this biography but difficult attach to Bennett unless he has already seen some success as a screenwriter. Should we call him an entrepreneur or successful small businessman? That would be a summary of the sort of prior career Bennett had as described in December 2008 Stars & Stripes. Thoughts? Binksternet ( talk) 22:04, 12 July 2013 (UTC)
My recent copy edits were made with the intention of improving the flow of the writing. If any of them resulted in a change in meaning, then the originals can simply be copied and pasted back in with no damage done. Sincerely, GeorgeLouis ( talk) 05:17, 13 July 2013 (UTC)
User:Binksternet, the guidelines for WP:COI are quite clear and have to do with editorial, not with the simple addition of reference material into the bibliography. My published work, "Wounded Tiger," is endorsed by many including one of the premier historians in the world on Mitsuo Fuchida and Pearl Harbor, Dr. Donald Goldstein. Listing a legitimate relevant work by the author is no violation of COI. Deleting the reference amounts to harassment, forcing me to get someone else to do it. I asked you to relist it personally, but you have declined. It is the most simple and logical way for a book to be listed. Please refrain from deleting legitimate works. TMartinBennett ( talk) 23:20, 27 March 2014 (UTC)
The link in #22 is dead, but the Daily Mail has a good photo of Fuchida's map: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2541293/Chilling-diagram-damage-Pearl-Harbor-drawn-Lieutenant-Commander-led-mission-sells-427-000-auction.html as well as other good pix, so a worthy reference to replace #22. Plus, the map was big: "The map is incredibly accurate in terms of the positions of the 60 ships and Lt Cmdr Fushida was about 80 per cent correct in his results... He gave the document, that measures 2ft 7in by 23ins, to the historian Gordon Prange when he was interviewed by him in 1947."
I came to wikipedia after seeing a photograph captioned "the first plane drops the first bomb on pearl harbor" attributed to Fuchida: http://www.usncva.org/clog/pearlharbor-pix.html (linked to from paragraph four photo credit in article here: http://www.usncva.org/clog/pearl1.shtml)
That photo coincidentally makes a circle back to the similar Pearl Harbor photograph included at bottom of the Daily Mail article, both apparently taken very close together.
Interesting to compare, best wishes to all. Hope this is useful to an editor.
108.193.227.112 ( talk) 20:47, 6 July 2015 (UTC)
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Where is Mitsuo Fuchida's Burial? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Akhtar Hussain Samoo ( talk • contribs) 10:15, 11 February 2018 (UTC)