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![]() | On 26 April 2024, it was proposed that this article be moved from Magnus III of Sweden to Magnus Ladulås. The result of the discussion was moved. |
Dan, Yes, it's nobility. Coshery though is a very uncommon word in English meaning feasting. Is this what was outlawed? And if so I confess I don't see an obvious connection to locking a barn. Can you help me out? <G> -- Someone else
Could someoone provide the source of the king's genealogy? -- User:Kt2
Literature assigns different numerals to this ruler. (They did not use official ordinals in his time in Scandinavia.) If he is called Magnus I, there is a clear risk of confusion with his "usurper" predecessor also named Magnus. Whereas Magnus III, also used of him, is not confusing with any other monarch. (The only confusing thing may be that in that case, his grandson Magnus, who here is IV, is in some sources referred to as Magnus II. But it's not III, it is only a numeral smaller than III which is not easy to understand when a successor is in question. But, in this system, he is anyway IV.) Nicknames and such are too difficult to have correctly here, and I do not recommend their use in article name. Marrtel 20:45, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
From an edit summary by User:Donkey99
Question: I have never before seen the theory that Magnus' nickname was derived from Ladislaus -- that theory sound like it originates with Monty Python or Spamalot -- I have not made an edit but I a —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jao ( talk • contribs) 08:33, August 23, 2007 (UTC).
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I rolled back 2 edits introducing fantasy images to the box. The contemporary bust is more useful than they. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 13:33, 5 May 2020 (UTC)
Which source establishes the regnal number III? I did not find it in any of the sources in the article that I could access. Swedish sources like the Riksarkiver, ne.se or Kungahuset do not give any regnal number. Swedish Wikipedia also does not use regnal numbers for medieval kings: sv:Lista över Sveriges regenter.
A pair of examples of English usage: Britannica calls him Magnus I. Cambridge History of Scandinavia call him Magnus Birgersson: [1] Based on Google Ngram, the most common name in English texts is Magnus Ladulås, but Magnus Birgersson is not uncommon either. (but of course Magnus I and Magnus III cannot be compared with due to Norwegian namesakes). Jähmefyysikko ( talk) 11:43, 25 April 2024 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved. ( closed by non-admin page mover) ASUKITE 15:29, 9 May 2024 (UTC)
Magnus III of Sweden → Magnus Ladulås – Move per WP:COMMONNAME. I have studied some sources above (see #Regnal number 2), and most of them call him Magnus Ladulås. Some use the name Magnus Birgersson, and none use Magnus III without putting the number in parentheses. Magnus III is neither a common name, nor an official one. Jähmefyysikko ( talk) 07:54, 26 April 2024 (UTC)
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Can anyone explain why this edit does not show? SergeWoodzing ( talk) 12:31, 10 May 2024 (UTC)
About these edits: [13]. The list of monarchs on the Royal Court website cannot really be be regarded as an official list of kings and queens of Sweden. The purpose of that list is merely to popularize the monarchy by introducing some of its history, and taking it as an official statement would be reading way too much into it. If the Royal Court really made a commitment to a specific interpretation of medieval history, they must have published it on some other place, not just on a lowly website. Besides, that list is not even online anymore (except on WayBackMachine).
There is another problem: In modern literature he may be referred to as either Magnus I or Magnus III. The Swedish Royal Court lists him as the third king named Magnus.
This is
WP:SYNTH, since there is an implied conclusion that the numeral III would be the correct one, but the source for the second sentence says nothing about regnal numbers.
I replaced the above with ...he may be referred to as either Magnus I, or Magnus III, depending on whether
Magnus Nielsen and
Magnus Henriksen are assigned numerals or not.
I think this makes the numbering transparent. Note that the difference between two counting systems is not fully explained by which Magnuses are considered proper kings, as there are
sources which include the above two Magnuses as Kings of Sweden, but only assign regnal numbers for Magnus Ladulås and Magnus Eriksson.
This may result in too much weight on the discussion about the numerals in the introduction. Jähmefyysikko ( talk) 20:05, 10 May 2024 (UTC)
The Swedish Royal Court lists him as the third king named Magnus, and the first Magnus of the Folkunga dynasty.This too is editorial synthesis if combined with the earlier sentence. The reader is led to draw implications that are not explicitly stated in the source. Jähmefyysikko ( talk) 05:17, 13 May 2024 (UTC)
depending on whether Magnus Nielsen and Magnus Henriksen are assigned numerals or not, that is also SYNTH. I'd recommend simply adding the archived link as an additional citation after "Magnus III". (Also, I did not get what Jä's reasoning for questioning the archived source was. Aaron Liu ( talk) 19:58, 13 May 2024 (UTC)
he may be referred to as either Magnus I,[sources] or Magnus III,[sources incl. royal court] depending on whether Magnus Nielsen and Magnus Henriksen are assigned numerals or not.[citation neededAaron Liu ( talk) 11:27, 16 May 2024 (UTC)
Magnus Ladulås[Royal Court]. Jähmefyysikko ( talk) 07:19, 17 May 2024 (UTC)
In modern literature he may be referred to as either Magnus I or Magnus III. Historians A and B, who call him Magnus III, list Magnus Nilsson and Magnus Henriksson as Magnus I and II.
In modern literature he may be referred to as either Magnus I or Magnus III. Some historians have called him Magnus III in English, listed thus after Magnus (I) Nilsson and Magnus (II) Henriksson.
In modern literature he may be referred to as either Magnus I or Magnus III.by option 1, thanks. Aaron Liu ( talk) 14:38, 19 May 2024 (UTC)
I addressed a similar issue as above at Magnus IV of Sweden ( diff). In this case there are three possible ordinals: II, III and IV. The middle one, III, is quite rare in 20th and 21st century literature (it was more common in 19th century), but since there was a reasonable citation, I did not remove it. Note that I did not insert the Royal Court citation there. Feel free to add it if you think it belongs there. Jähmefyysikko ( talk) 20:32, 15 May 2024 (UTC)
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A graph should have been displayed here but
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![]() | On 26 April 2024, it was proposed that this article be moved from Magnus III of Sweden to Magnus Ladulås. The result of the discussion was moved. |
Dan, Yes, it's nobility. Coshery though is a very uncommon word in English meaning feasting. Is this what was outlawed? And if so I confess I don't see an obvious connection to locking a barn. Can you help me out? <G> -- Someone else
Could someoone provide the source of the king's genealogy? -- User:Kt2
Literature assigns different numerals to this ruler. (They did not use official ordinals in his time in Scandinavia.) If he is called Magnus I, there is a clear risk of confusion with his "usurper" predecessor also named Magnus. Whereas Magnus III, also used of him, is not confusing with any other monarch. (The only confusing thing may be that in that case, his grandson Magnus, who here is IV, is in some sources referred to as Magnus II. But it's not III, it is only a numeral smaller than III which is not easy to understand when a successor is in question. But, in this system, he is anyway IV.) Nicknames and such are too difficult to have correctly here, and I do not recommend their use in article name. Marrtel 20:45, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
From an edit summary by User:Donkey99
Question: I have never before seen the theory that Magnus' nickname was derived from Ladislaus -- that theory sound like it originates with Monty Python or Spamalot -- I have not made an edit but I a —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jao ( talk • contribs) 08:33, August 23, 2007 (UTC).
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Magnus III of Sweden. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 19:50, 12 January 2018 (UTC)
I rolled back 2 edits introducing fantasy images to the box. The contemporary bust is more useful than they. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 13:33, 5 May 2020 (UTC)
Which source establishes the regnal number III? I did not find it in any of the sources in the article that I could access. Swedish sources like the Riksarkiver, ne.se or Kungahuset do not give any regnal number. Swedish Wikipedia also does not use regnal numbers for medieval kings: sv:Lista över Sveriges regenter.
A pair of examples of English usage: Britannica calls him Magnus I. Cambridge History of Scandinavia call him Magnus Birgersson: [1] Based on Google Ngram, the most common name in English texts is Magnus Ladulås, but Magnus Birgersson is not uncommon either. (but of course Magnus I and Magnus III cannot be compared with due to Norwegian namesakes). Jähmefyysikko ( talk) 11:43, 25 April 2024 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved. ( closed by non-admin page mover) ASUKITE 15:29, 9 May 2024 (UTC)
Magnus III of Sweden → Magnus Ladulås – Move per WP:COMMONNAME. I have studied some sources above (see #Regnal number 2), and most of them call him Magnus Ladulås. Some use the name Magnus Birgersson, and none use Magnus III without putting the number in parentheses. Magnus III is neither a common name, nor an official one. Jähmefyysikko ( talk) 07:54, 26 April 2024 (UTC)
![]() | This help request has been answered. If you need more help, you can , contact the responding user(s) directly on their user talk page, or consider visiting the Teahouse. |
Can anyone explain why this edit does not show? SergeWoodzing ( talk) 12:31, 10 May 2024 (UTC)
About these edits: [13]. The list of monarchs on the Royal Court website cannot really be be regarded as an official list of kings and queens of Sweden. The purpose of that list is merely to popularize the monarchy by introducing some of its history, and taking it as an official statement would be reading way too much into it. If the Royal Court really made a commitment to a specific interpretation of medieval history, they must have published it on some other place, not just on a lowly website. Besides, that list is not even online anymore (except on WayBackMachine).
There is another problem: In modern literature he may be referred to as either Magnus I or Magnus III. The Swedish Royal Court lists him as the third king named Magnus.
This is
WP:SYNTH, since there is an implied conclusion that the numeral III would be the correct one, but the source for the second sentence says nothing about regnal numbers.
I replaced the above with ...he may be referred to as either Magnus I, or Magnus III, depending on whether
Magnus Nielsen and
Magnus Henriksen are assigned numerals or not.
I think this makes the numbering transparent. Note that the difference between two counting systems is not fully explained by which Magnuses are considered proper kings, as there are
sources which include the above two Magnuses as Kings of Sweden, but only assign regnal numbers for Magnus Ladulås and Magnus Eriksson.
This may result in too much weight on the discussion about the numerals in the introduction. Jähmefyysikko ( talk) 20:05, 10 May 2024 (UTC)
The Swedish Royal Court lists him as the third king named Magnus, and the first Magnus of the Folkunga dynasty.This too is editorial synthesis if combined with the earlier sentence. The reader is led to draw implications that are not explicitly stated in the source. Jähmefyysikko ( talk) 05:17, 13 May 2024 (UTC)
depending on whether Magnus Nielsen and Magnus Henriksen are assigned numerals or not, that is also SYNTH. I'd recommend simply adding the archived link as an additional citation after "Magnus III". (Also, I did not get what Jä's reasoning for questioning the archived source was. Aaron Liu ( talk) 19:58, 13 May 2024 (UTC)
he may be referred to as either Magnus I,[sources] or Magnus III,[sources incl. royal court] depending on whether Magnus Nielsen and Magnus Henriksen are assigned numerals or not.[citation neededAaron Liu ( talk) 11:27, 16 May 2024 (UTC)
Magnus Ladulås[Royal Court]. Jähmefyysikko ( talk) 07:19, 17 May 2024 (UTC)
In modern literature he may be referred to as either Magnus I or Magnus III. Historians A and B, who call him Magnus III, list Magnus Nilsson and Magnus Henriksson as Magnus I and II.
In modern literature he may be referred to as either Magnus I or Magnus III. Some historians have called him Magnus III in English, listed thus after Magnus (I) Nilsson and Magnus (II) Henriksson.
In modern literature he may be referred to as either Magnus I or Magnus III.by option 1, thanks. Aaron Liu ( talk) 14:38, 19 May 2024 (UTC)
I addressed a similar issue as above at Magnus IV of Sweden ( diff). In this case there are three possible ordinals: II, III and IV. The middle one, III, is quite rare in 20th and 21st century literature (it was more common in 19th century), but since there was a reasonable citation, I did not remove it. Note that I did not insert the Royal Court citation there. Feel free to add it if you think it belongs there. Jähmefyysikko ( talk) 20:32, 15 May 2024 (UTC)