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Is it really necessary to list all the previous orders of succession starting from Charles XIV John? A list like this doesn't exist on any of the other countries order of succession pages. So pointless. I'm removing it again. 213.67.244.185 18:09, 16 February 2007
Well, I give up. I just don't think it's necessary to list all these previous orders of succession. 213.67.244.185 18:26, 16 February 2007
Henning Elmberger (af ballongberget) 213.80.45.162 10:56, 19 April 2007
Had Bernadotte died after his adoption but before his succession, would Oskar be king or did he only become a dynast when his father became king? I'm wondering whether the list ought to be dated to the adoption rather than the succession. — Tamfang ( talk) 16:20, 2 May 2010 (UTC)
What is this? "Has been"? Is this a list of anyone who ever has been in the line of succession? How can that have an order, when different people have been in th eline of sucession at different times? That whole section makes no sense. -- OpenFuture ( talk) 10:51, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
OF's complaint, as I understand it, is that there can be no meaningful ranking between princes who were not in the queue at the same time, such as Gustaf (died September 1852) and Carl Oscar (born December 1852). Removing "in this order" papers over that issue, but then there's nothing to say that the list has a sequence. (Dates of birth are not enough: when the present king was born, he had two living uncles, but took precedence over both of them.) Also, changing "in the succession" to "heirs to the throne" can be misconstrued; the term 'heir' usually means the first in line, and only seven of them have ever been that. — When I collapsed the 43 lists of the old article, I arranged the result as a family tree; at any given date, the monarch is the first person in the list who is alive and not disqualified. — Tamfang ( talk) 19:50, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
Before 28 May 2008, there was a list for each time someone was born, disqualified or died. I collapsed them all into this (since deleted), which I repeat here in case anyone's interested and to explain what the above discussion is about. — Tamfang ( talk) 19:46, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
If you don't like the indentations ...
Name | Date added | Date removed | Father | Reason for removal |
---|---|---|---|---|
Prince Oscar, Duke of Södermanland | 26 September 1810 | 8 March 1844 | Charles XIV John | succession as Oscar I |
Prince Charles, Duke of Skåne | 3 May 1826 | 8 July 1859 | Oscar I | succession as Charles XV |
Prince Carl Oscar, Duke of Södermanland | 14 December 1852 | 13 March 1854 | Charles XV | death |
Prince Gustaf, Duke of Uppland | 18 June 1827 | 24 September 1852 | Oscar I | death |
Prince Oscar, Duke of Östergötland | 21 January 1829 | 18 September 1872 | Oscar I | succession as Oscar II |
Prince Gustaf, Duke of Värmland | 16 June 1858 | 8 December 1907 | Oscar II | succession as Gustaf V |
Prince Gustaf Adolf, Duke of Skåne | 11 November 1882 | 29 October 1950 | Gustaf V | succession as Gustaf VI Adolf |
Prince Gustaf Adolf, Duke of Västerbotten | 22 April 1906 | 26 January 1947 | Gustaf VI | death |
Prince Carl Gustaf, Duke of Jämtland | 30 April 1946 | 15 September 1973 | Gustaf Adolf of Västerbotten | succession as Carl XVI Gustaf |
Crown Princess Victoria, Duchess of Västergötland | 1 January 1980* | Carl XVI | ||
Prince Carl Philip, Duke of Värmland | 13 May 1979* | Carl XVI | ||
Princess Madeleine, Duchess of Hälsingland and Gästrikland | 10 June 1982 | Carl XVI | ||
Prince Sigvard, Duke of Uppland | 7 June 1907 | 8 March 1934 | Gustaf VI | disqualifying marriage |
Prince Bertil, Duke of Halland | 28 February 1912 | 5 January 1997 | Gustaf VI | death |
Prince Carl Johan, Duke of Dalarna | 31 October 1916 | 22 January 1946 | Gustaf VI | disqualifying marriage |
Prince Vilhelm, Duke of Södermanland | 17 June 1884 | 5 June 1965 | Gustaf VI | death |
Prince Lennart, Duke of Småland | 8 May 1909 | 11 March 1932 | Vilhelm of Södermanland | disqualifying marriage |
Prince Erik, Duke of Västmanland | 20 April 1889 | 20 September 1918 | Gustaf V | death |
Prince Oscar, Duke of Gotland | 15 November 1859 | 15 March 1888 | Oscar II | disqualifying marriage |
Prince Carl, Duke of Västergötland | 27 February 1861 | 24 October 1951 | Oscar II | death |
Prince Carl, Duke of Östergötland | 10 January 1911 | 6 July 1937 | Carl of Västergötland | disqualifying marriage |
Prince Eugén, Duke of Närke | 1 August 1865 | 17 August 1947 | Oscar II | death |
Prince August, Duke of Dalarna | 24 August 1831 | 4 March 1873 | Oscar I | death |
The table ought not to be sortable, as the order needs to be preserved. (Dates do NOT tell the whole story!) — Tamfang ( talk) 18:56, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
Name | Father | Birth | Removal | Death |
---|---|---|---|---|
Jean Baptiste Jules Bernadotte | Jean Henri Bernadotte | 26 January 1763 | 5 February 1818: succession as Charles XIV John | 8 March 1844 |
Prince Oscar, Duke of Södermanland | Charles XIV | 26 September 1810 | 8 March 1844: succession as Oscar I | 8 July 1859 |
Prince Charles, Duke of Skåne | Oscar I | 3 May 1826 | 8 July 1859: succession as Charles XV | 18 September 1872 |
Prince Carl Oscar, Duke of Södermanland | Charles XV | 14 December 1852 | 13 March 1854 | |
Prince Gustaf, Duke of Uppland | Oscar I | 18 June 1827 | 24 September 1852 | |
Prince Oscar, Duke of Östergötland | Oscar I | 21 January 1829 | 18 September 1872: succession as Oscar II | 8 December 1907 |
Prince Gustaf, Duke of Värmland | Oscar II | 16 June 1858 | 8 December 1907: succession as Gustaf V | 29 October 1950 |
Prince Gustaf Adolf, Duke of Skåne | Gustaf V | 11 November 1882 | 29 October 1950: succession as Gustaf VI Adolf | 15 September 1973 |
Prince Gustaf Adolf, Duke of Västerbotten | Gustaf VI | 22 April 1906 | 26 January 1947 | |
Prince Carl Gustaf, Duke of Jämtland | Gustaf Adolf of Västerbotten | 30 April 1946 | 15 September 1973: succession as Carl XVI Gustaf | |
Crown Princess Victoria, Duchess of Västergötland | Carl XVI | 14 July 1977 (became eligible 1 January 1980) | ||
Prince Carl Philip, Duke of Värmland | Carl XVI | 13 May 1979 | ||
Princess Madeleine, Duchess of Hälsingland and Gästrikland | Carl XVI | 10 June 1982 | ||
Prince Sigvard, Duke of Uppland | Gustaf VI | 7 June 1907 | 8 March 1934: disqualifying marriage | 4 February 2002 |
Prince Bertil, Duke of Halland | Gustaf VI | 28 February 1912 | 5 January 1997 | |
Prince Carl Johan, Duke of Dalarna | Gustaf VI | 31 October 1916 | 22 January 1946: disqualifying marriage | |
Prince Vilhelm, Duke of Södermanland | Gustaf VI | 17 June 1884 | 5 June 1965 | |
Prince Lennart, Duke of Småland | Vilhelm of Södermanland | 8 May 1909 | 11 March 1932: disqualifying marriage | 21 December 2004 |
Prince Erik, Duke of Västmanland | Gustaf V | 20 April 1889 | 20 September 1918 | |
Prince Oscar, Duke of Gotland | Oscar II | 15 November 1859 | 15 March 1888: disqualifying marriage | 4 October 1953 |
Prince Carl, Duke of Västergötland | Oscar II | 27 February 1861 | 24 October 1951 | |
Prince Carl, Duke of Östergötland | Carl of Västergötland | 10 January 1911 | 6 July 1937: disqualifying marriage | 23 July 2003 |
Prince Eugén, Duke of Närke | Oscar II | 1 August 1865 | 17 August 1947 | |
Prince August, Duke of Dalarna | Oscar I | 24 August 1831 | 4 March 1873 |
— Tamfang ( talk) 21:27, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
The Swedish crown princess is never called listed just as "The Crown Princess" but always "Crown Princess Victoria" or "Crown Princess Victoria, Duchess of Västergötland". I have recently corrected this once and will now do so again, asking cordially that this error not be repeated again. --
SergeWoodzing (
talk)
23:54, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
It seems to me that 'The Crown Princess' refers to a position rather than a specific person. If referring to the current holder of the position, whoever that may be then 'The Crown Princess' might be in order but if we are specifying an individual person then I believe that we must say 'Crown Princess Victoria'. Does this help? Martin Hogbin ( talk) 11:47, 9 September 2013 (UTC)
I see no consensus here to support the coninued listing of Victoria simply as "The Crown Princess", which I still contend, in this particular case, is a Wikipedia invention. I do see 3 to 1 against using that invention. --- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 02:55, 12 September 2013 (UTC)
Editors, please note: There has in fact not been one single reference given here that shows Victoria on any list anywhere given as just "The Crown Princess". The claims made that such links and references have been given are all incorrect - every single one of them. They all show that she - obviously, sometimes! - is named as "the Crown Princess" in text, but never once on any list. My complaint here was and is still that she should not be on a list in this article either, named in such a format. Thus I am reverting this again to remove the Wikipedia invention in this article. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 00:51, 18 September 2013 (UTC)
PS the latest version, before I just corrected this again now, was even worse "The Crown Princess, Duchess of Västergötland". Totally unheard of anywhere. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 00:56, 18 September 2013 (UTC)
I have tried to correct a Wikipedia invention in this article where Crown Princess Victoria now is listed as "The Crown Princess, Duchess of Västergötland". (See previous section!) It is unheard of to list her that way. One editor, who invented this, keeps reverting my correction - last with this edit Summary: You've already been asked by two users not to disrupt. I am asking you again. Please don't. The evidence is there, and it was deemed sufficient by three people. Please do not edit against the consensus, as that's clearly disruptive.
The issue has now changed from whether or not it is appropriate to list Victoria merely as The Crown Princess" or (even more far-fetched) as "The Crown Princess, Duchess of Västergötland", to whether or not it has been shown at all that she is listed thus elsewhere. My standpoint is this:
I am now reverting this again until a specific link has been provided to show her mentioned on a list anywhere else as "The Crown Princess" or (even more far-fetched) as "The Crown Princess, Duchess of Västergötland". -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 16:44, 18 September 2013 (UTC)
Since no link, reference of otherwise applicable info has been given yet which shows Victoria elsewhere on any kind of list while called "The Crown Princess" or "The Crown Princess, Duchess of Västergötland", I am asking again that such info be specifically provided here. References in Swedish, in that case, need to show her on such a list as "Kronprinsessan" or "Kronprinsessan, hertiginnan av Västergötland" without her name Victoria mentioned. I am convinced that no such list (other than the Wikipedia invention here) exists. That's why I am unwilling to let the invention stand. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 15:03, 22 September 2013 (UTC)
The Swedish Act of Succession says (Art.1) that all legitimate (male or female) descendants of King Carl XVI Gustaf are in the line of succession to the throne. However, the criteria for exclusion from the line of succession mentioned in the article, i.e. marrying without the government's consent or becoming the sovereign ruler of a foreign country without the King's consent, strictly speaking apply only to a "prince or princess of the Royal House of Sweden". Similarly, again taking the text of the act literally, the exclusion of individuals who do not profess the Lutheran faith applies only to a "member of the Royal Family".
As of today, that distinction is moot since all people currently in the line of succession happen to be also princes or princesses of Sweden and members of the Royal Family. However, in the future, unless we assume that all descendants of King Carl XVI Gustaf are ad infinitum automatically members of the Royal House or Royal Family (which would be absurd), a situation will arise when there might be people in the line of succession who might not be princes/princesses of Sweden. It will be unclear then if those people can be non-Lutherans for example and still be in the line of succession.
That unsolved legal question might actually come up earlier than previously thought when Princess Madeleine gives birth to her first child. If the child becomes an HRH as the Royal House appears to be indicating now, then I assume Art.4 of the Act of Succession applies and the child forfeits his/her succession rights if he/she is not brought up in the Lutheran faith and in Sweden, which is also a controversial point based on the text of law only, but apparently is the understanding of the King's attorney. However, if the child is not created a prince/princess of Sweden and remains untitled like his/her father, does Art.4 cease to apply ? 161.24.19.112 ( talk) 20:49, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
I have taken the listing off of the WP:3O page because a 3O was already provided. I suggest you post a WP:RFC on the question and advertise same on the Sweden and Royalty Project talk pages. – S. Rich ( talk) 02:05, 14 October 2013 (UTC) PS: In the meantime, I've added this article to my watchlist. I'll opine when I see the RfC. Thanks. 02:16, 14 October 2013 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Has a reference been given to refute a claim that a Wikipedia invention has been added to a list in the article or has no such reference been given? Since I have seen no link, reference of otherwise applicable info yet which clearly shows that Victoria appears elsewhere on any kind of list in any language called only "The Crown Princess" or "The Crown Princess, Duchess of Västergötland", I am asking again that such info be specifically provided here. References in Swedish, in that case, need to show her on such a list as "Kronprinsessan" or "Kronprinsessan, hertiginnan av Västergötland" without her name Victoria mentioned in the primary listing. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 12:43, 23 October 2013 (UTC)
The name and titles of Princess Leonore has been published and referenced. She does not yet have a biography page on the royalcourt.se web page, but her position in the order of succession is not determined by any text on that web site. It is determined by the Act of Succession. This says in Article 1:
The right of succession to the throne of Sweden is vested in the male and female descendants of King Carl XVI Gustaf, Crown Prince Johan Baptist Julii, later King Karl XIV Johan’s, issue in direct line of descent. In this connection, older siblings and their descendants have precedence over younger siblings and their descendants.
That Princess Leonore as Princess Madeleine's first borne child comes after her in the order of succession is quite clear. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.72.127.173 ( talk) 17:44, 26 February 2014 (UTC)
This keeps getting removed and rightly so for 2 reasons (1) there is WP:Undue weight given to the that recent history as opposed to history from 1809 or even further back for that matter, and (2) the English used is so substandard that it would need lots of work to correct. I am removing it again now and asking that it not be added again, especally not with all kinds of grammatical errors. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 14:56, 15 July 2014 (UTC)
What happens when the current King and Crown Princess Victoria should both die? And at what age would Princess Estelle assume the crown?
An administrative government ("förmyndarregering") would be appointed. Estelle would assume full regnal duties on her 18th birthday. -- Marbe166 ( talk) 16:32, 29 January 2016 (UTC)
The first reference link doesn't work. I assume it was functional but has changed. There's this but it's in swedish. Anyone know where an english copy of the act of succession can be gotten? Of course we can in the meantime use a swedish link. — Preceding unsigned comment added by EpicR ( talk • contribs) 21:00, 6 September 2016 (UTC)
This article is a little unclear as where the succession goes beyond the immediate Royal Family. Is the succession limited by law to the current King's descendants, is it the case that every other sibling, uncle/aunt, cousin etc either had no children or were removed for "unequal marriages" or is there an heir beyond the immediate family in case of a King Ralph style tragedy? Timrollpickering ( talk) 13:38, 22 April 2024 (UTC)
This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
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Is it really necessary to list all the previous orders of succession starting from Charles XIV John? A list like this doesn't exist on any of the other countries order of succession pages. So pointless. I'm removing it again. 213.67.244.185 18:09, 16 February 2007
Well, I give up. I just don't think it's necessary to list all these previous orders of succession. 213.67.244.185 18:26, 16 February 2007
Henning Elmberger (af ballongberget) 213.80.45.162 10:56, 19 April 2007
Had Bernadotte died after his adoption but before his succession, would Oskar be king or did he only become a dynast when his father became king? I'm wondering whether the list ought to be dated to the adoption rather than the succession. — Tamfang ( talk) 16:20, 2 May 2010 (UTC)
What is this? "Has been"? Is this a list of anyone who ever has been in the line of succession? How can that have an order, when different people have been in th eline of sucession at different times? That whole section makes no sense. -- OpenFuture ( talk) 10:51, 2 June 2010 (UTC)
OF's complaint, as I understand it, is that there can be no meaningful ranking between princes who were not in the queue at the same time, such as Gustaf (died September 1852) and Carl Oscar (born December 1852). Removing "in this order" papers over that issue, but then there's nothing to say that the list has a sequence. (Dates of birth are not enough: when the present king was born, he had two living uncles, but took precedence over both of them.) Also, changing "in the succession" to "heirs to the throne" can be misconstrued; the term 'heir' usually means the first in line, and only seven of them have ever been that. — When I collapsed the 43 lists of the old article, I arranged the result as a family tree; at any given date, the monarch is the first person in the list who is alive and not disqualified. — Tamfang ( talk) 19:50, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
Before 28 May 2008, there was a list for each time someone was born, disqualified or died. I collapsed them all into this (since deleted), which I repeat here in case anyone's interested and to explain what the above discussion is about. — Tamfang ( talk) 19:46, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
If you don't like the indentations ...
Name | Date added | Date removed | Father | Reason for removal |
---|---|---|---|---|
Prince Oscar, Duke of Södermanland | 26 September 1810 | 8 March 1844 | Charles XIV John | succession as Oscar I |
Prince Charles, Duke of Skåne | 3 May 1826 | 8 July 1859 | Oscar I | succession as Charles XV |
Prince Carl Oscar, Duke of Södermanland | 14 December 1852 | 13 March 1854 | Charles XV | death |
Prince Gustaf, Duke of Uppland | 18 June 1827 | 24 September 1852 | Oscar I | death |
Prince Oscar, Duke of Östergötland | 21 January 1829 | 18 September 1872 | Oscar I | succession as Oscar II |
Prince Gustaf, Duke of Värmland | 16 June 1858 | 8 December 1907 | Oscar II | succession as Gustaf V |
Prince Gustaf Adolf, Duke of Skåne | 11 November 1882 | 29 October 1950 | Gustaf V | succession as Gustaf VI Adolf |
Prince Gustaf Adolf, Duke of Västerbotten | 22 April 1906 | 26 January 1947 | Gustaf VI | death |
Prince Carl Gustaf, Duke of Jämtland | 30 April 1946 | 15 September 1973 | Gustaf Adolf of Västerbotten | succession as Carl XVI Gustaf |
Crown Princess Victoria, Duchess of Västergötland | 1 January 1980* | Carl XVI | ||
Prince Carl Philip, Duke of Värmland | 13 May 1979* | Carl XVI | ||
Princess Madeleine, Duchess of Hälsingland and Gästrikland | 10 June 1982 | Carl XVI | ||
Prince Sigvard, Duke of Uppland | 7 June 1907 | 8 March 1934 | Gustaf VI | disqualifying marriage |
Prince Bertil, Duke of Halland | 28 February 1912 | 5 January 1997 | Gustaf VI | death |
Prince Carl Johan, Duke of Dalarna | 31 October 1916 | 22 January 1946 | Gustaf VI | disqualifying marriage |
Prince Vilhelm, Duke of Södermanland | 17 June 1884 | 5 June 1965 | Gustaf VI | death |
Prince Lennart, Duke of Småland | 8 May 1909 | 11 March 1932 | Vilhelm of Södermanland | disqualifying marriage |
Prince Erik, Duke of Västmanland | 20 April 1889 | 20 September 1918 | Gustaf V | death |
Prince Oscar, Duke of Gotland | 15 November 1859 | 15 March 1888 | Oscar II | disqualifying marriage |
Prince Carl, Duke of Västergötland | 27 February 1861 | 24 October 1951 | Oscar II | death |
Prince Carl, Duke of Östergötland | 10 January 1911 | 6 July 1937 | Carl of Västergötland | disqualifying marriage |
Prince Eugén, Duke of Närke | 1 August 1865 | 17 August 1947 | Oscar II | death |
Prince August, Duke of Dalarna | 24 August 1831 | 4 March 1873 | Oscar I | death |
The table ought not to be sortable, as the order needs to be preserved. (Dates do NOT tell the whole story!) — Tamfang ( talk) 18:56, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
Name | Father | Birth | Removal | Death |
---|---|---|---|---|
Jean Baptiste Jules Bernadotte | Jean Henri Bernadotte | 26 January 1763 | 5 February 1818: succession as Charles XIV John | 8 March 1844 |
Prince Oscar, Duke of Södermanland | Charles XIV | 26 September 1810 | 8 March 1844: succession as Oscar I | 8 July 1859 |
Prince Charles, Duke of Skåne | Oscar I | 3 May 1826 | 8 July 1859: succession as Charles XV | 18 September 1872 |
Prince Carl Oscar, Duke of Södermanland | Charles XV | 14 December 1852 | 13 March 1854 | |
Prince Gustaf, Duke of Uppland | Oscar I | 18 June 1827 | 24 September 1852 | |
Prince Oscar, Duke of Östergötland | Oscar I | 21 January 1829 | 18 September 1872: succession as Oscar II | 8 December 1907 |
Prince Gustaf, Duke of Värmland | Oscar II | 16 June 1858 | 8 December 1907: succession as Gustaf V | 29 October 1950 |
Prince Gustaf Adolf, Duke of Skåne | Gustaf V | 11 November 1882 | 29 October 1950: succession as Gustaf VI Adolf | 15 September 1973 |
Prince Gustaf Adolf, Duke of Västerbotten | Gustaf VI | 22 April 1906 | 26 January 1947 | |
Prince Carl Gustaf, Duke of Jämtland | Gustaf Adolf of Västerbotten | 30 April 1946 | 15 September 1973: succession as Carl XVI Gustaf | |
Crown Princess Victoria, Duchess of Västergötland | Carl XVI | 14 July 1977 (became eligible 1 January 1980) | ||
Prince Carl Philip, Duke of Värmland | Carl XVI | 13 May 1979 | ||
Princess Madeleine, Duchess of Hälsingland and Gästrikland | Carl XVI | 10 June 1982 | ||
Prince Sigvard, Duke of Uppland | Gustaf VI | 7 June 1907 | 8 March 1934: disqualifying marriage | 4 February 2002 |
Prince Bertil, Duke of Halland | Gustaf VI | 28 February 1912 | 5 January 1997 | |
Prince Carl Johan, Duke of Dalarna | Gustaf VI | 31 October 1916 | 22 January 1946: disqualifying marriage | |
Prince Vilhelm, Duke of Södermanland | Gustaf VI | 17 June 1884 | 5 June 1965 | |
Prince Lennart, Duke of Småland | Vilhelm of Södermanland | 8 May 1909 | 11 March 1932: disqualifying marriage | 21 December 2004 |
Prince Erik, Duke of Västmanland | Gustaf V | 20 April 1889 | 20 September 1918 | |
Prince Oscar, Duke of Gotland | Oscar II | 15 November 1859 | 15 March 1888: disqualifying marriage | 4 October 1953 |
Prince Carl, Duke of Västergötland | Oscar II | 27 February 1861 | 24 October 1951 | |
Prince Carl, Duke of Östergötland | Carl of Västergötland | 10 January 1911 | 6 July 1937: disqualifying marriage | 23 July 2003 |
Prince Eugén, Duke of Närke | Oscar II | 1 August 1865 | 17 August 1947 | |
Prince August, Duke of Dalarna | Oscar I | 24 August 1831 | 4 March 1873 |
— Tamfang ( talk) 21:27, 3 June 2010 (UTC)
The Swedish crown princess is never called listed just as "The Crown Princess" but always "Crown Princess Victoria" or "Crown Princess Victoria, Duchess of Västergötland". I have recently corrected this once and will now do so again, asking cordially that this error not be repeated again. --
SergeWoodzing (
talk)
23:54, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
It seems to me that 'The Crown Princess' refers to a position rather than a specific person. If referring to the current holder of the position, whoever that may be then 'The Crown Princess' might be in order but if we are specifying an individual person then I believe that we must say 'Crown Princess Victoria'. Does this help? Martin Hogbin ( talk) 11:47, 9 September 2013 (UTC)
I see no consensus here to support the coninued listing of Victoria simply as "The Crown Princess", which I still contend, in this particular case, is a Wikipedia invention. I do see 3 to 1 against using that invention. --- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 02:55, 12 September 2013 (UTC)
Editors, please note: There has in fact not been one single reference given here that shows Victoria on any list anywhere given as just "The Crown Princess". The claims made that such links and references have been given are all incorrect - every single one of them. They all show that she - obviously, sometimes! - is named as "the Crown Princess" in text, but never once on any list. My complaint here was and is still that she should not be on a list in this article either, named in such a format. Thus I am reverting this again to remove the Wikipedia invention in this article. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 00:51, 18 September 2013 (UTC)
PS the latest version, before I just corrected this again now, was even worse "The Crown Princess, Duchess of Västergötland". Totally unheard of anywhere. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 00:56, 18 September 2013 (UTC)
I have tried to correct a Wikipedia invention in this article where Crown Princess Victoria now is listed as "The Crown Princess, Duchess of Västergötland". (See previous section!) It is unheard of to list her that way. One editor, who invented this, keeps reverting my correction - last with this edit Summary: You've already been asked by two users not to disrupt. I am asking you again. Please don't. The evidence is there, and it was deemed sufficient by three people. Please do not edit against the consensus, as that's clearly disruptive.
The issue has now changed from whether or not it is appropriate to list Victoria merely as The Crown Princess" or (even more far-fetched) as "The Crown Princess, Duchess of Västergötland", to whether or not it has been shown at all that she is listed thus elsewhere. My standpoint is this:
I am now reverting this again until a specific link has been provided to show her mentioned on a list anywhere else as "The Crown Princess" or (even more far-fetched) as "The Crown Princess, Duchess of Västergötland". -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 16:44, 18 September 2013 (UTC)
Since no link, reference of otherwise applicable info has been given yet which shows Victoria elsewhere on any kind of list while called "The Crown Princess" or "The Crown Princess, Duchess of Västergötland", I am asking again that such info be specifically provided here. References in Swedish, in that case, need to show her on such a list as "Kronprinsessan" or "Kronprinsessan, hertiginnan av Västergötland" without her name Victoria mentioned. I am convinced that no such list (other than the Wikipedia invention here) exists. That's why I am unwilling to let the invention stand. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 15:03, 22 September 2013 (UTC)
The Swedish Act of Succession says (Art.1) that all legitimate (male or female) descendants of King Carl XVI Gustaf are in the line of succession to the throne. However, the criteria for exclusion from the line of succession mentioned in the article, i.e. marrying without the government's consent or becoming the sovereign ruler of a foreign country without the King's consent, strictly speaking apply only to a "prince or princess of the Royal House of Sweden". Similarly, again taking the text of the act literally, the exclusion of individuals who do not profess the Lutheran faith applies only to a "member of the Royal Family".
As of today, that distinction is moot since all people currently in the line of succession happen to be also princes or princesses of Sweden and members of the Royal Family. However, in the future, unless we assume that all descendants of King Carl XVI Gustaf are ad infinitum automatically members of the Royal House or Royal Family (which would be absurd), a situation will arise when there might be people in the line of succession who might not be princes/princesses of Sweden. It will be unclear then if those people can be non-Lutherans for example and still be in the line of succession.
That unsolved legal question might actually come up earlier than previously thought when Princess Madeleine gives birth to her first child. If the child becomes an HRH as the Royal House appears to be indicating now, then I assume Art.4 of the Act of Succession applies and the child forfeits his/her succession rights if he/she is not brought up in the Lutheran faith and in Sweden, which is also a controversial point based on the text of law only, but apparently is the understanding of the King's attorney. However, if the child is not created a prince/princess of Sweden and remains untitled like his/her father, does Art.4 cease to apply ? 161.24.19.112 ( talk) 20:49, 3 October 2013 (UTC)
I have taken the listing off of the WP:3O page because a 3O was already provided. I suggest you post a WP:RFC on the question and advertise same on the Sweden and Royalty Project talk pages. – S. Rich ( talk) 02:05, 14 October 2013 (UTC) PS: In the meantime, I've added this article to my watchlist. I'll opine when I see the RfC. Thanks. 02:16, 14 October 2013 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Has a reference been given to refute a claim that a Wikipedia invention has been added to a list in the article or has no such reference been given? Since I have seen no link, reference of otherwise applicable info yet which clearly shows that Victoria appears elsewhere on any kind of list in any language called only "The Crown Princess" or "The Crown Princess, Duchess of Västergötland", I am asking again that such info be specifically provided here. References in Swedish, in that case, need to show her on such a list as "Kronprinsessan" or "Kronprinsessan, hertiginnan av Västergötland" without her name Victoria mentioned in the primary listing. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 12:43, 23 October 2013 (UTC)
The name and titles of Princess Leonore has been published and referenced. She does not yet have a biography page on the royalcourt.se web page, but her position in the order of succession is not determined by any text on that web site. It is determined by the Act of Succession. This says in Article 1:
The right of succession to the throne of Sweden is vested in the male and female descendants of King Carl XVI Gustaf, Crown Prince Johan Baptist Julii, later King Karl XIV Johan’s, issue in direct line of descent. In this connection, older siblings and their descendants have precedence over younger siblings and their descendants.
That Princess Leonore as Princess Madeleine's first borne child comes after her in the order of succession is quite clear. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.72.127.173 ( talk) 17:44, 26 February 2014 (UTC)
This keeps getting removed and rightly so for 2 reasons (1) there is WP:Undue weight given to the that recent history as opposed to history from 1809 or even further back for that matter, and (2) the English used is so substandard that it would need lots of work to correct. I am removing it again now and asking that it not be added again, especally not with all kinds of grammatical errors. -- SergeWoodzing ( talk) 14:56, 15 July 2014 (UTC)
What happens when the current King and Crown Princess Victoria should both die? And at what age would Princess Estelle assume the crown?
An administrative government ("förmyndarregering") would be appointed. Estelle would assume full regnal duties on her 18th birthday. -- Marbe166 ( talk) 16:32, 29 January 2016 (UTC)
The first reference link doesn't work. I assume it was functional but has changed. There's this but it's in swedish. Anyone know where an english copy of the act of succession can be gotten? Of course we can in the meantime use a swedish link. — Preceding unsigned comment added by EpicR ( talk • contribs) 21:00, 6 September 2016 (UTC)
This article is a little unclear as where the succession goes beyond the immediate Royal Family. Is the succession limited by law to the current King's descendants, is it the case that every other sibling, uncle/aunt, cousin etc either had no children or were removed for "unequal marriages" or is there an heir beyond the immediate family in case of a King Ralph style tragedy? Timrollpickering ( talk) 13:38, 22 April 2024 (UTC)