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... this is the first time I recall hearing about the chinese restaurant bit, and this is fascinating to me. I mean, I was raised orthodox, you'd think my famliy'd care to instill some jewish culture in me instead of just reading and translating texts—well, if I'm finding my judaism on wikipedia, that's just one more reason to be here. theleekycauldron ( talk • contribs) ( they/she) 00:16, 18 December 2021 (UTC)
we'll probably be working on this article for quite a while after, but I think we might have a version that we could submit to DYK within a couple of days, yeah? to get it in the christmas sets—i'd be proud of it regardless of whether we're really done or not. no pressure if you don't want to do that, of course theleekycauldron ( talk • contribs) ( they/she) 01:43, 18 December 2021 (UTC)
> The Jewish holiday of Hanukkah, traditionally a minor one, is considered important in the modern United States because it occurs during the Christmas and holiday season; many American Jews view it as a Jewish counterpart to Christmas. Data suggest that Hanukkah's close temporal proximity to Christmas is what drives its modern popularity in the United States, and that American Jews may use Hanukkah to provide an alternative to Christmas for their children.
The cited reference is a study exploring the question if Chanukkah is responsive to Christmas. That is not the same as asking Jews if they view Chanukkah as a counterpart to Christmas. And the article does not conclude that "many American Jews view Chanukkah as a counterpart to Christmas".
As an example, an alternative to taking the bus is taking the train. Trains are not "counterparts" to buses, trains are alternatives. They are competition to buses. They do not have the same form, nor do they perform the same function.
https://web.stanford.edu/~leinav/pubs/EJ2010.pdf
> 4. Conclusions In this article we present evidence that is largely consistent with a story that the importance of Hanukkah among American Jews is driven by its proximity (in the time dimension) to Christmas, and that many American Jews use Hanukkah as a way to provide their children with an exciting alternative. Extrapolating this story out of the data, it may also explain why Hanukkah is such a popular and important holiday among Jews living in the US, even though it is a much less important Jewish holiday in Israel, where competition from Christmas is largely absent.
There is a solar system sized gap between "many believe" and "largely consistent with a story that"
I personally find this claim in the wiki grossly ignorant, offensive and a sign of terrible scholarship and editing, because the number one topic of discussion regarding Christmas and Jews amongst adult Jews is that Chanukkah is NOT a counterpart to Christmas at all. So if anyone at wiki wants to claim that, I think you need to post surveys of American Jews demonstrating that, and an article that discusses if Chanukkah is *response* to Christmas is a different study entirely.
Please change this. 107.3.134.101 ( talk) 04:13, 1 December 2022 (UTC)
I note none of the sources cited actually addresses this topic- the relationship betwen Jewish people and Christmas. So the the article seems to me be an original synthesis and reads like an original essay. I am concerned it is original research, and not encyclopedic Jagmanst ( talk) 04:52, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
The User:Tacyarg has deleted the South Park episode Mr. Hankey, the Christmas Poo from this article. That episode famously deals with Kyle's feeling of exclusion as a Jew at Christmastime. The User:Tacyarg has also plastered the following rather clueless message for me:
Could someone here please deal with this User? Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.61.114.134 ( talk) 16:44, 12 December 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
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... this is the first time I recall hearing about the chinese restaurant bit, and this is fascinating to me. I mean, I was raised orthodox, you'd think my famliy'd care to instill some jewish culture in me instead of just reading and translating texts—well, if I'm finding my judaism on wikipedia, that's just one more reason to be here. theleekycauldron ( talk • contribs) ( they/she) 00:16, 18 December 2021 (UTC)
we'll probably be working on this article for quite a while after, but I think we might have a version that we could submit to DYK within a couple of days, yeah? to get it in the christmas sets—i'd be proud of it regardless of whether we're really done or not. no pressure if you don't want to do that, of course theleekycauldron ( talk • contribs) ( they/she) 01:43, 18 December 2021 (UTC)
> The Jewish holiday of Hanukkah, traditionally a minor one, is considered important in the modern United States because it occurs during the Christmas and holiday season; many American Jews view it as a Jewish counterpart to Christmas. Data suggest that Hanukkah's close temporal proximity to Christmas is what drives its modern popularity in the United States, and that American Jews may use Hanukkah to provide an alternative to Christmas for their children.
The cited reference is a study exploring the question if Chanukkah is responsive to Christmas. That is not the same as asking Jews if they view Chanukkah as a counterpart to Christmas. And the article does not conclude that "many American Jews view Chanukkah as a counterpart to Christmas".
As an example, an alternative to taking the bus is taking the train. Trains are not "counterparts" to buses, trains are alternatives. They are competition to buses. They do not have the same form, nor do they perform the same function.
https://web.stanford.edu/~leinav/pubs/EJ2010.pdf
> 4. Conclusions In this article we present evidence that is largely consistent with a story that the importance of Hanukkah among American Jews is driven by its proximity (in the time dimension) to Christmas, and that many American Jews use Hanukkah as a way to provide their children with an exciting alternative. Extrapolating this story out of the data, it may also explain why Hanukkah is such a popular and important holiday among Jews living in the US, even though it is a much less important Jewish holiday in Israel, where competition from Christmas is largely absent.
There is a solar system sized gap between "many believe" and "largely consistent with a story that"
I personally find this claim in the wiki grossly ignorant, offensive and a sign of terrible scholarship and editing, because the number one topic of discussion regarding Christmas and Jews amongst adult Jews is that Chanukkah is NOT a counterpart to Christmas at all. So if anyone at wiki wants to claim that, I think you need to post surveys of American Jews demonstrating that, and an article that discusses if Chanukkah is *response* to Christmas is a different study entirely.
Please change this. 107.3.134.101 ( talk) 04:13, 1 December 2022 (UTC)
I note none of the sources cited actually addresses this topic- the relationship betwen Jewish people and Christmas. So the the article seems to me be an original synthesis and reads like an original essay. I am concerned it is original research, and not encyclopedic Jagmanst ( talk) 04:52, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
The User:Tacyarg has deleted the South Park episode Mr. Hankey, the Christmas Poo from this article. That episode famously deals with Kyle's feeling of exclusion as a Jew at Christmastime. The User:Tacyarg has also plastered the following rather clueless message for me:
Could someone here please deal with this User? Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.61.114.134 ( talk) 16:44, 12 December 2023 (UTC)