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Does a referendum conducted by expats or descendants of a region's citizens living abroad but not locals merit inclusion here? If Cuban- or Haitian-Americans had a vote on their ancestral countries becoming part of the United States, would it qualify for inclusion here like the Moldova referendum on maintaining independence in 1994? If it wouldn't, I can't think of a reason the Punjab referendum, which is not being organized by or planned to be held within Punjab, should be included here. It keeps being added and deleted without discussion, and I'd like discussion here. Astrofreak92 ( talk) 15:15, 14 December 2016 (UTC)
Actually, there is nothing in this page that says that those referendum can't be listed: the title section only says "scheduled", and the page show also unofficial referendum. In my opinion, they should be listed, maybe separate from the official ones, because they de facto exist, and they eventually will end up on the list anyway. I think we could also add the proposed ones (in yet another list). Ekø ( talk) 10:32, 6 October 2020 (UTC)
The precedent all over the table is to use the flag the territory had at the time of the referendum, and only use a flag that was made later when the independence was approved. Cf Djibouti for example. For this reason, we use the dual flag of New Caledonia for the 2018 and 2020 referendums that ended in votes against independence.-- Aréat ( talk) 06:29, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
In both exemple of West Papua and Kurdistan, one can see the "proposed state"'s flag is absent from the infobox of the referendum articles we're linking toward. Again, those are quite strictly maintained, and I've always seen used in election infoboxes the flag of the country/territory at the exact time an election or referendum took place. Considering the whole argument here stem from the use of "Proposed state" in the column, it seem to me it would be far simpler to have it changed to "Territory up for independence", and the "Former country" to "Country the territory is or was part of" (it's not former for the dozens of referendum which resulted in no independence, after all). Rather than deeply change the page with removal of dozens of flags, or the removal of all of them-- Aréat ( talk) 23:17, 10 November 2020 (UTC)
Proposed state | Date | Current state | Recognition | Notes |
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![]() |
? [1] [2] | ![]() |
No | Announced by the premier of the Malaita Province on September 1, 2020, due to the government's recent decision to recognize the People's Republic of China as opposed to the Republic of China. [1] [2] [3] [4] However, the National Government of the Solomon Islands declared this referendum illegal a few days later, under the Provincial Act [of] 1997. [5] |
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? | ![]() (de facto) |
Yes | Referendum on independence, as proposed by MINURSO, could be held some day. |
![]() |
19 October 2023 [6] | ![]() |
? | Prime Minister Nicola Sturgeon announced on March 13, 2017, her will to call for a new referendum on independence. [7] |
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2021 | ![]() |
? | Separatist government led by the Inuit Ataqatigiit party has repeatedly expressed the need for full political independence from Denmark. Some activists pointed to 2021 (the 300th anniversary of Danish rule) as the potential date of independence. |
![]() |
2022 | ![]() |
Yes | As stipulated in the Noumea agreement, if a third of the members of the Congress of New Caledonia demand it after the victory of the "no" in the second referendum of 2020, a third referendum, within two years and relating to the same question will be arranged within eighteen months of this request. Congress has yet to vote to pass it. |
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2025 [8] | ![]() |
? |
Is it a good idea?— Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.192.68.53 ( talk) 08:07, 22 January 2021 (UTC)
References
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The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion:
You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 19:23, 20 March 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 23:10, 20 March 2022 (UTC)
@ Beshogur: There is no reliable source supporting the claim that the picture really shows the Donbass referendum. In the case of most pics on WP, this is no problem. But here we are talking about a highly controversial action in the middle of a war. The picture has a message, the message of a high participation in a well organized referendum. And that message is POV. Rsk6400 ( talk) 05:08, 21 September 2022 (UTC)
All material in Wikipedia mainspace, including everything in articles, lists, and captions, must be verifiable. All quotations, and any material whose verifiability has been challenged or is likely to be challenged, must include an inline citation to a reliable source that directly supports the material.(from WP:V). An editor's testimony doesn't qualify as WP:RS, as I'm sure you know. Rsk6400 ( talk) 12:37, 22 September 2022 (UTC)
The picture has a message, the message of a high participation in a well organized referendum. And that message is POVIsn't a valid reason either. Butko can show that these pictures were taken at that time, and ballot papers are present. What do you mean with "the message"? Beshogur ( talk) 13:38, 22 September 2022 (UTC)
My attempt at dispute resolution Failed due to an editor refusing to participate in any constructive discussion.
(
WP:Dispute_resolution_noticeboard/Archive_222#Independence_referendum). Since you said, Well I'm not saying this should stay here
, I'll now try to implement one of the attempts at compromise I made there. If you revert again, I'll have to start an RfC with a question like "Are EXIF-data sufficient to ensure verifiability of photographs illustrating a highly controversial subject ?"
Rsk6400 (
talk)
07:33, 10 October 2022 (UTC)
"Referendums" on the independence of five Russian regions were held online by a Ukrainian politician. [1] Should these be added to the list? Nonsense referendums, of course, but there is already a precedent of unofficial and/or online referendums on the list. ProjectHorizons ( talk) 23:41, 4 March 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This ![]() It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||
|
|
|
Does a referendum conducted by expats or descendants of a region's citizens living abroad but not locals merit inclusion here? If Cuban- or Haitian-Americans had a vote on their ancestral countries becoming part of the United States, would it qualify for inclusion here like the Moldova referendum on maintaining independence in 1994? If it wouldn't, I can't think of a reason the Punjab referendum, which is not being organized by or planned to be held within Punjab, should be included here. It keeps being added and deleted without discussion, and I'd like discussion here. Astrofreak92 ( talk) 15:15, 14 December 2016 (UTC)
Actually, there is nothing in this page that says that those referendum can't be listed: the title section only says "scheduled", and the page show also unofficial referendum. In my opinion, they should be listed, maybe separate from the official ones, because they de facto exist, and they eventually will end up on the list anyway. I think we could also add the proposed ones (in yet another list). Ekø ( talk) 10:32, 6 October 2020 (UTC)
The precedent all over the table is to use the flag the territory had at the time of the referendum, and only use a flag that was made later when the independence was approved. Cf Djibouti for example. For this reason, we use the dual flag of New Caledonia for the 2018 and 2020 referendums that ended in votes against independence.-- Aréat ( talk) 06:29, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
In both exemple of West Papua and Kurdistan, one can see the "proposed state"'s flag is absent from the infobox of the referendum articles we're linking toward. Again, those are quite strictly maintained, and I've always seen used in election infoboxes the flag of the country/territory at the exact time an election or referendum took place. Considering the whole argument here stem from the use of "Proposed state" in the column, it seem to me it would be far simpler to have it changed to "Territory up for independence", and the "Former country" to "Country the territory is or was part of" (it's not former for the dozens of referendum which resulted in no independence, after all). Rather than deeply change the page with removal of dozens of flags, or the removal of all of them-- Aréat ( talk) 23:17, 10 November 2020 (UTC)
Proposed state | Date | Current state | Recognition | Notes |
---|---|---|---|---|
![]() |
? [1] [2] | ![]() |
No | Announced by the premier of the Malaita Province on September 1, 2020, due to the government's recent decision to recognize the People's Republic of China as opposed to the Republic of China. [1] [2] [3] [4] However, the National Government of the Solomon Islands declared this referendum illegal a few days later, under the Provincial Act [of] 1997. [5] |
![]() |
? | ![]() (de facto) |
Yes | Referendum on independence, as proposed by MINURSO, could be held some day. |
![]() |
19 October 2023 [6] | ![]() |
? | Prime Minister Nicola Sturgeon announced on March 13, 2017, her will to call for a new referendum on independence. [7] |
![]() |
2021 | ![]() |
? | Separatist government led by the Inuit Ataqatigiit party has repeatedly expressed the need for full political independence from Denmark. Some activists pointed to 2021 (the 300th anniversary of Danish rule) as the potential date of independence. |
![]() |
2022 | ![]() |
Yes | As stipulated in the Noumea agreement, if a third of the members of the Congress of New Caledonia demand it after the victory of the "no" in the second referendum of 2020, a third referendum, within two years and relating to the same question will be arranged within eighteen months of this request. Congress has yet to vote to pass it. |
![]() |
2025 [8] | ![]() |
? |
Is it a good idea?— Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.192.68.53 ( talk) 08:07, 22 January 2021 (UTC)
References
{{
cite news}}
: CS1 maint: url-status (
link)
{{
cite news}}
: CS1 maint: url-status (
link)
{{
cite news}}
: CS1 maint: url-status (
link)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion:
You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 19:23, 20 March 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 23:10, 20 March 2022 (UTC)
@ Beshogur: There is no reliable source supporting the claim that the picture really shows the Donbass referendum. In the case of most pics on WP, this is no problem. But here we are talking about a highly controversial action in the middle of a war. The picture has a message, the message of a high participation in a well organized referendum. And that message is POV. Rsk6400 ( talk) 05:08, 21 September 2022 (UTC)
All material in Wikipedia mainspace, including everything in articles, lists, and captions, must be verifiable. All quotations, and any material whose verifiability has been challenged or is likely to be challenged, must include an inline citation to a reliable source that directly supports the material.(from WP:V). An editor's testimony doesn't qualify as WP:RS, as I'm sure you know. Rsk6400 ( talk) 12:37, 22 September 2022 (UTC)
The picture has a message, the message of a high participation in a well organized referendum. And that message is POVIsn't a valid reason either. Butko can show that these pictures were taken at that time, and ballot papers are present. What do you mean with "the message"? Beshogur ( talk) 13:38, 22 September 2022 (UTC)
My attempt at dispute resolution Failed due to an editor refusing to participate in any constructive discussion.
(
WP:Dispute_resolution_noticeboard/Archive_222#Independence_referendum). Since you said, Well I'm not saying this should stay here
, I'll now try to implement one of the attempts at compromise I made there. If you revert again, I'll have to start an RfC with a question like "Are EXIF-data sufficient to ensure verifiability of photographs illustrating a highly controversial subject ?"
Rsk6400 (
talk)
07:33, 10 October 2022 (UTC)
"Referendums" on the independence of five Russian regions were held online by a Ukrainian politician. [1] Should these be added to the list? Nonsense referendums, of course, but there is already a precedent of unofficial and/or online referendums on the list. ProjectHorizons ( talk) 23:41, 4 March 2023 (UTC)