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I wouldn't call Harvest Moon or Animal Crossing god games; the player's control over those games is solely through their avatar, unlike The Sims (for example) where you can make changes to the world directly. N2 22:16, 29 May 2004 (UTC)
I added authors, publishers, systems, years for the major titles and separated the individual and the city/nation/world games. Anything look like it needs fixing after this revision? Coll7 07:04, 22 August 2005 (UTC)
A god game is a game where you play the role of a god, not a game where you control people. In a god game, you will have INDIRECT control over the livings while in a simulation or normal strategy game you will have DIRECT control over the livings. So black and white, populous, actraiser and the like are god games but civilisation, starcraft, age of empires and the like are not. Bragador 19:10, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
Well since we restarted a discussion about the game in private I figured we could do it here in public. You said a game could be self sustaining and turn-based and I see your point if you can chose to "pass your turn". But what do we do for games that force you to do one action/miracle per turn ? That's why I changed first critaria but it may not be correct yet. For turn-based games I have the sandbox of god in mind since I think nobody else made a turn-based "god game" so if you want to try it to know what I mean please go forth. It's only 6 megs I think and it's free. In this way you'll be able to judge if it is a god game or not in your opinion. Bragador 14:10, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
Well, I added a criteria explaining the whole thing. I think it's adequate. You can comment on it to see if we keep it that way or not. Also, I noticed one point is saying "Actions taken by the player tend to be interventions into that system, for instance in the form of miracles or invoking calamities, rather than necessary for the continual progress of the game". I think you forgot a word in the where I put the words in bold. I wasn't too sure what you wanted to say so I figured I could just point the mistake to you. Also, "rather than necessary for the continual progress of the game" mays be redundant. I wonder if it is really necessary to point it out or if we could just do with "Actions taken by the player tend to be interventions into that system, for instance in the form of miracles or invoking calamities". What do you think ? Bragador 14:21, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
Who is Bragador? Why does he keep bringing up Sandbox of God? I tried it out and besides Bragador's references to its references it's an extremely insignificant game. In fact the only siginificance is that it's made in Game Maker 6.1. It's not historically significant like Commander Keen or Space Goose, it's not commercially significant, it's not culturally significant. It's just a project someone on the Game Maker forums thought was cool and decided to dedicate an entire definition arugument on wikipedia to. It's a puzzle game at best, a god game by no means. To call it a god game would be calling Lemmings a god game. That it is turned based is true. That it is interactive is obvious. That it is a god game, or that it belongs on this page, not so much.
Unless someone gives me an extremely good reason, quoting wikipedia guidelines, I will strike all mentions of it from the article. And from that insiginificant sentence from the definition paragraph that seemed to have occupied all of you pretty nicely. Seeing it occupy an entry alongside Actraiser, B/W, and Populous is insulting to me as a gamer. Having it attached as a caveat in the definition paragraph is arrogance.
In fact reading the entire "definition" section on this talk page it seems Bradagor has been the one getting all of you to devote reams of text defining an otherwise blisteringly easily demarcated genre. Sandbox of God doesn't belong here, maybe on "List of independently developed games" or "List of Game Maker-based games" or "List of small puzzle games". Asdfff 14:42, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
I'll now be using Wikipedia:Trivia guidelines to recommend the removal of Sandbox of God mentions. Wikipedia is definitely not an indiscriminate colletion of information, and Sandbox is an insignificant game. By the same logic, I can make an ASCII non-realtime, modified variant of "Game of Life" demo and include it on this page, but it will neither help with the definition of a God Game nor be important enough to be included in the "list of". This isn't so much a ruling against knowledge as you've stated, as it is a rule against unimportant knowledge.
Not only that, but as a very basic wikipedia principle, wikipedia is not a publisher of original thought. I don't know where this guideline is located precisely but I've come across it more than a few times on other talk pages. Using Sandbox of God to branch off a _subset-of-1_ sub-definition of a long-existing genre is definitely not what Game Genre entry is for. If anything Sandbox of God belongs solely in "See Also" with all mentions of turn-based moved to the page for that game.
Wikipedia:No_original_research provides an overly detailed guideline for what I'm trying to state. Specifically, [do not] "[provide] new definitions of pre-existing terms" or "introduce an argument, without citing a reputable source for that argument, that purports to refute or support another idea, theory, argument, or position" and most importantly,
[Do not] "[introduce] an analysis or synthesis of established facts, ideas, opinions, or arguments in a way that builds a particular case favored by the editor, without attributing that analysis or synthesis to a reputable source".
As a last note, I unconditionally apologize for starting off and continuing the discussion overly zealous.
The reaction was solely to the gut feeling that some basic principle of wikipedia was unconciously being bent especially across multiple editors while whittling down and gluing on multiple definitions for an otherwise easily demarcated genre.
I feel my two points, backed up by official guidelines, are imperviously valid. I will wait for the appropriate interim for other editors of this entry to pitch in on this matter before reverting my edits.
Asdfff 09:59, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
I think they're should be stated what game is widely recieved as tyhe pinnacle of this genre. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.35.163.82 ( talk • contribs) 01:23, 2 September 2006
Would Terranigma be considered a God game? You don't have direct control over people and their lives, but you do resurrect the continents, the plants, the animals, and the people. I wasn't sure, so I thought I'd ask. - Platypus Man | Talk 05:00, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
Removed links in "examples of god games" that were just advertising. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ketsa ( talk • contribs) 20:11, 26 December 2006
Anything sourced about the origins of this genre of game? I recall reading an article on Lionhead's website a couple of years ago in which Peter Molyneux (Populous creator) mentioned the influence of German board games on the concept for Populous but I can offer no citable references. -- JamesTheNumberless 17:47, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
Arguments about what is and is not a god game dominate the article. This isn't how it should be. We should stick to a simple explanation and discuss the implications based on that. As-is, it's just a list of different sub-genres. I'm reorganising the article to encourage future growth. Chris Cunningham 19:29, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
I probably should have asked before "fixing" the spelling in one section, but shouldn't the "g" in god game be lower-case, unless specifically referring to the Judeo-Christian God? To say "a God" is never proper - it's either "God" or "a god" - which is what started me down the "fix" path (I might have over-done it.) Thoughts? Ben Hocking ( talk| contribs) 16:15, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
I think that Dwarf Fortress is worth a mention of a god-game, because you can generate the world before play. 203.214.65.222 ( talk) 02:08, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
Has something happened since the last time I read anything concerning the God sim genre? Everyone contributing to this article seems to have unilaterally adopted the term God Game. This must be a recent(ish) term, as I am a fairly regular RTS / God Sim player for the past decade or so who has never encountered it before. Additionally, I was moderately surprised to see no one else raising this point.
When exactly was this genre renamed from sim to game, and by whom? I'd be just as perplexed if everyone started talking about Flight Games all of a sudden! Please, please tell me it is not because of a daft affection for the (admittedly handy) alliteration, satisfying though it undoubtedly is to write GG and have everyone know what you are referring to. Blitterbug ( talk) 18:43, 21 March 2010 (UTC)
Is "mass game" in fact a common alternative term for "god game"? I note that on google "god game" seems to return much more relevant stuff than "mass game". Also, there is no redirect from Mass game to God game again suggesting dubiousness of "mass game" term. 76.119.30.87 ( talk) 17:33, 3 December 2014 (UTC)
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I wouldn't call Harvest Moon or Animal Crossing god games; the player's control over those games is solely through their avatar, unlike The Sims (for example) where you can make changes to the world directly. N2 22:16, 29 May 2004 (UTC)
I added authors, publishers, systems, years for the major titles and separated the individual and the city/nation/world games. Anything look like it needs fixing after this revision? Coll7 07:04, 22 August 2005 (UTC)
A god game is a game where you play the role of a god, not a game where you control people. In a god game, you will have INDIRECT control over the livings while in a simulation or normal strategy game you will have DIRECT control over the livings. So black and white, populous, actraiser and the like are god games but civilisation, starcraft, age of empires and the like are not. Bragador 19:10, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
Well since we restarted a discussion about the game in private I figured we could do it here in public. You said a game could be self sustaining and turn-based and I see your point if you can chose to "pass your turn". But what do we do for games that force you to do one action/miracle per turn ? That's why I changed first critaria but it may not be correct yet. For turn-based games I have the sandbox of god in mind since I think nobody else made a turn-based "god game" so if you want to try it to know what I mean please go forth. It's only 6 megs I think and it's free. In this way you'll be able to judge if it is a god game or not in your opinion. Bragador 14:10, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
Well, I added a criteria explaining the whole thing. I think it's adequate. You can comment on it to see if we keep it that way or not. Also, I noticed one point is saying "Actions taken by the player tend to be interventions into that system, for instance in the form of miracles or invoking calamities, rather than necessary for the continual progress of the game". I think you forgot a word in the where I put the words in bold. I wasn't too sure what you wanted to say so I figured I could just point the mistake to you. Also, "rather than necessary for the continual progress of the game" mays be redundant. I wonder if it is really necessary to point it out or if we could just do with "Actions taken by the player tend to be interventions into that system, for instance in the form of miracles or invoking calamities". What do you think ? Bragador 14:21, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
Who is Bragador? Why does he keep bringing up Sandbox of God? I tried it out and besides Bragador's references to its references it's an extremely insignificant game. In fact the only siginificance is that it's made in Game Maker 6.1. It's not historically significant like Commander Keen or Space Goose, it's not commercially significant, it's not culturally significant. It's just a project someone on the Game Maker forums thought was cool and decided to dedicate an entire definition arugument on wikipedia to. It's a puzzle game at best, a god game by no means. To call it a god game would be calling Lemmings a god game. That it is turned based is true. That it is interactive is obvious. That it is a god game, or that it belongs on this page, not so much.
Unless someone gives me an extremely good reason, quoting wikipedia guidelines, I will strike all mentions of it from the article. And from that insiginificant sentence from the definition paragraph that seemed to have occupied all of you pretty nicely. Seeing it occupy an entry alongside Actraiser, B/W, and Populous is insulting to me as a gamer. Having it attached as a caveat in the definition paragraph is arrogance.
In fact reading the entire "definition" section on this talk page it seems Bradagor has been the one getting all of you to devote reams of text defining an otherwise blisteringly easily demarcated genre. Sandbox of God doesn't belong here, maybe on "List of independently developed games" or "List of Game Maker-based games" or "List of small puzzle games". Asdfff 14:42, 3 April 2006 (UTC)
I'll now be using Wikipedia:Trivia guidelines to recommend the removal of Sandbox of God mentions. Wikipedia is definitely not an indiscriminate colletion of information, and Sandbox is an insignificant game. By the same logic, I can make an ASCII non-realtime, modified variant of "Game of Life" demo and include it on this page, but it will neither help with the definition of a God Game nor be important enough to be included in the "list of". This isn't so much a ruling against knowledge as you've stated, as it is a rule against unimportant knowledge.
Not only that, but as a very basic wikipedia principle, wikipedia is not a publisher of original thought. I don't know where this guideline is located precisely but I've come across it more than a few times on other talk pages. Using Sandbox of God to branch off a _subset-of-1_ sub-definition of a long-existing genre is definitely not what Game Genre entry is for. If anything Sandbox of God belongs solely in "See Also" with all mentions of turn-based moved to the page for that game.
Wikipedia:No_original_research provides an overly detailed guideline for what I'm trying to state. Specifically, [do not] "[provide] new definitions of pre-existing terms" or "introduce an argument, without citing a reputable source for that argument, that purports to refute or support another idea, theory, argument, or position" and most importantly,
[Do not] "[introduce] an analysis or synthesis of established facts, ideas, opinions, or arguments in a way that builds a particular case favored by the editor, without attributing that analysis or synthesis to a reputable source".
As a last note, I unconditionally apologize for starting off and continuing the discussion overly zealous.
The reaction was solely to the gut feeling that some basic principle of wikipedia was unconciously being bent especially across multiple editors while whittling down and gluing on multiple definitions for an otherwise easily demarcated genre.
I feel my two points, backed up by official guidelines, are imperviously valid. I will wait for the appropriate interim for other editors of this entry to pitch in on this matter before reverting my edits.
Asdfff 09:59, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
I think they're should be stated what game is widely recieved as tyhe pinnacle of this genre. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.35.163.82 ( talk • contribs) 01:23, 2 September 2006
Would Terranigma be considered a God game? You don't have direct control over people and their lives, but you do resurrect the continents, the plants, the animals, and the people. I wasn't sure, so I thought I'd ask. - Platypus Man | Talk 05:00, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
Removed links in "examples of god games" that were just advertising. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ketsa ( talk • contribs) 20:11, 26 December 2006
Anything sourced about the origins of this genre of game? I recall reading an article on Lionhead's website a couple of years ago in which Peter Molyneux (Populous creator) mentioned the influence of German board games on the concept for Populous but I can offer no citable references. -- JamesTheNumberless 17:47, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
Arguments about what is and is not a god game dominate the article. This isn't how it should be. We should stick to a simple explanation and discuss the implications based on that. As-is, it's just a list of different sub-genres. I'm reorganising the article to encourage future growth. Chris Cunningham 19:29, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
I probably should have asked before "fixing" the spelling in one section, but shouldn't the "g" in god game be lower-case, unless specifically referring to the Judeo-Christian God? To say "a God" is never proper - it's either "God" or "a god" - which is what started me down the "fix" path (I might have over-done it.) Thoughts? Ben Hocking ( talk| contribs) 16:15, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
I think that Dwarf Fortress is worth a mention of a god-game, because you can generate the world before play. 203.214.65.222 ( talk) 02:08, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
Has something happened since the last time I read anything concerning the God sim genre? Everyone contributing to this article seems to have unilaterally adopted the term God Game. This must be a recent(ish) term, as I am a fairly regular RTS / God Sim player for the past decade or so who has never encountered it before. Additionally, I was moderately surprised to see no one else raising this point.
When exactly was this genre renamed from sim to game, and by whom? I'd be just as perplexed if everyone started talking about Flight Games all of a sudden! Please, please tell me it is not because of a daft affection for the (admittedly handy) alliteration, satisfying though it undoubtedly is to write GG and have everyone know what you are referring to. Blitterbug ( talk) 18:43, 21 March 2010 (UTC)
Is "mass game" in fact a common alternative term for "god game"? I note that on google "god game" seems to return much more relevant stuff than "mass game". Also, there is no redirect from Mass game to God game again suggesting dubiousness of "mass game" term. 76.119.30.87 ( talk) 17:33, 3 December 2014 (UTC)
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The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 07:34, 30 June 2021 (UTC)