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The newest club magazine details the evolution of the FC Bayern club logo, which prompted me to compare to the corresponding section on this site. It turns out that the logo evolution given here does not seem to be correct. I don't know where the attributed dates come from, but the source given is not it. If I remember correctly I started the crest section of the article and gave Die Bayern by Schulze-Marmeling as a reference. At that point it was more of a general outline of the logo evolution without pictures. 'Die Bayern' does not provide such a detailed overview anyway so the source given is not a source for the logos displayed.
Specifically the logo given for 1906-19 seems to have been in use from 1920 to 1924 and the various logo for 1954 to 1970 have never been official club logos. Maybe I should take another picture, but on the cut-off site from the club magazine there is a club magazine from 1954 on display that they describe as being the first to feature the then new logo. On the next page there are also two pictures of Bayern crests that players for the club would earn if they played a lot for the club. These crests would then be applied to their jerseys. The thing is, these crests look almost exactly like the club logos attributed to 1961-65 and 1965-70, so this is probably just wrong here.
I have no clue where the 1954-61 logo comes from, but it does not seem to have been an official logo at any point either.
Edit: The logo with the golden tone doesn't seem to have been official at any point either.
OdinFK ( talk) 10:04, 20 November 2019 (UTC)
Note, that Bayern did not use a logo, in this case the flag one, before 1901. In 1966 Bayern used as shirt badge an "honorary sign" from before 1925 (back then used for pins). Shirt badges can be different from logos, as can be seen prominently with the German national side, which does not carry the association logo on their chests. The green Logo was introduced when Bayern joined up with Jahn in 1919.
This Logo (http://www.dfs-wappen.de/media/verein/ger/bayern/muenchen/dfs_wl_d_muenchen_bayern[1901_1906].gif) has a strong enough resemblance to the one used from ca. 1902-06, and that one (http://www.dfs-wappen.de/media/verein/ger/bayern/muenchen/dfs_wl_d_muenchen_bayern_msc_fa[1906_1909].gif) was used during their union with Münchner SC (ca 1906-19), therefore the "S" in it. (Links have to be copied and pasted, because they hav square brackets in them)
What Marmeling is concerned, as much as I remember, he co-operates with the guys from DWS-Wappen; they however, as is apparent, can only draw, but have not much clue about history. They even carried for a long time the 1925-54 logo in blue (!!! - see version history here). Most Bayern logos have apparently been uploaded from DWS and have their generally misleading names. BTW, I proposed changes along these lines already around 22 December 2017. Oalexander ( talk) 04:07, 23 November 2019 (UTC)
At a cursory glance the kits as presented per today were incorrect for 1968/69 and 1972/73. The standard home-kit for 1968/69 can be seen here (scroll down). Easily recognizable the old stadium and players like Mucki Brenninger (left) and Werner Olk Between Bulle Roth (with the trophy) and Schwarzenbeck (to his right Gerd Müller). In the cup final Bayern played in all-red ( as can be gleaned from here). The standard home-kit from 1972/73 can be seen here. I personally do not have the skills to make the appropriate changes. Cheers, Oalexander ( talk) 01:38, 17 April 2020 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Not Moved - No Consensus Current name and proposed names are clearly covered in the article and dealt with ample redirects so readers are not being shorted here. Additionally, the current title is consistent with sports naming conventions and there are almost another dozen collateral articles using the current title convention re: FC Bayern Munich. Mike Cline ( talk) 12:43, 13 February 2022 (UTC)
FC Bayern Munich →
Bayern Munich – "FC Bayern Munich" is neither the
WP:COMMONNAME, which is
"Bayern Munich", nor the official English name which is
"FC Bayern München". As such, I propose moving this article to "Bayern Munich" as it best meets
WP:CRITERIA and
WP:NCST does not apply as there is ambiguity as to the official spelling of a club's name in English
, although if there is a consensus against that I would support "FC Bayern München" as an improvement over the current title.
BilledMammal (
talk)
07:12, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
ambiguity as to the official spelling of a club's name in English. BilledMammal ( talk) 00:48, 6 February 2022 (UTC)
significant differences between the German and English versions. However, your argument seems to be that Bayern München is wrong about their official English name for use outside of the United States, and I don't find that to be particularly convincing. BilledMammal ( talk) 05:26, 6 February 2022 (UTC)
snow close and topic ban?, if you believe this warrants a topic ban please take it to ANI - it is inappropriate to raise it here. BilledMammal ( talk) 07:21, 6 February 2022 (UTC)
ambiguity as to the official spelling of a club's name in English. BilledMammal ( talk) 04:03, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
ambiguity as to the official spelling of a club's name in English, and München (Munich), like Bayern (Bavaria), is a German name, not a German word. BilledMammal ( talk) 04:33, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
since most active members of WP:FOOTY disagree with that titlewhy does this matter? All that matters is whether the broader community agrees or disagrees with a title, per Wikipedia:LOCALCONSENSUS. BilledMammal ( talk) 09:29, 10 February 2022 (UTC)
09:04, 23 June 2006 SndrAndrss talk contribs block 30 bytes +30 moved Bayern Munich to FC Bayern Munich
which was followed by a series of apparently bold moves. Hopefully this RM will lead to stability whichever way it goes. Andrewa ( talk) 14:54, 12 February 2022 (UTC)
Hello page watchers. I'm going through the good article cleanup listing to reassess old GAs. This article is in need of a lick of paint to maintain its GA status,
Anybody here wants to pick it up? If not, I'll likely nominate for a WP:good article reassessment in a couple of weeks. —Femke 🐦 ( talk) 19:19, 22 February 2023 (UTC)
he was sacked 110.142.185.173 ( talk) 11:35, 1 April 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Changers556 ( talk) 23:26, 18 May 2024 (UTC)
I would like to change the head coach from Thomas Tuchel to Vacant with a citation from Fc Bayern’s website. I would like to do this in order to provide accurate information.
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
FC Bayern Munich article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives:
Index,
1,
2,
3,
4Auto-archiving period: 31 days
![]() |
While the biographies of living persons policy does not apply directly to the subject of this article, it may contain material that relates to living persons, such as friends and family of persons no longer living, or living persons involved in the subject matter. Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material about living persons must be removed immediately. If such material is re-inserted repeatedly, or if there are other concerns related to this policy, please see this noticeboard. |
![]() | This ![]() It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | FC Bayern Munich has been listed as one of the Sports and recreation good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() |
Daily pageviews of this article
A graph should have been displayed here but
graphs are temporarily disabled. Until they are enabled again, visit the interactive graph at
pageviews.wmcloud.org |
![]() | This article has previously been nominated to be moved.
Discussions:
|
The newest club magazine details the evolution of the FC Bayern club logo, which prompted me to compare to the corresponding section on this site. It turns out that the logo evolution given here does not seem to be correct. I don't know where the attributed dates come from, but the source given is not it. If I remember correctly I started the crest section of the article and gave Die Bayern by Schulze-Marmeling as a reference. At that point it was more of a general outline of the logo evolution without pictures. 'Die Bayern' does not provide such a detailed overview anyway so the source given is not a source for the logos displayed.
Specifically the logo given for 1906-19 seems to have been in use from 1920 to 1924 and the various logo for 1954 to 1970 have never been official club logos. Maybe I should take another picture, but on the cut-off site from the club magazine there is a club magazine from 1954 on display that they describe as being the first to feature the then new logo. On the next page there are also two pictures of Bayern crests that players for the club would earn if they played a lot for the club. These crests would then be applied to their jerseys. The thing is, these crests look almost exactly like the club logos attributed to 1961-65 and 1965-70, so this is probably just wrong here.
I have no clue where the 1954-61 logo comes from, but it does not seem to have been an official logo at any point either.
Edit: The logo with the golden tone doesn't seem to have been official at any point either.
OdinFK ( talk) 10:04, 20 November 2019 (UTC)
Note, that Bayern did not use a logo, in this case the flag one, before 1901. In 1966 Bayern used as shirt badge an "honorary sign" from before 1925 (back then used for pins). Shirt badges can be different from logos, as can be seen prominently with the German national side, which does not carry the association logo on their chests. The green Logo was introduced when Bayern joined up with Jahn in 1919.
This Logo (http://www.dfs-wappen.de/media/verein/ger/bayern/muenchen/dfs_wl_d_muenchen_bayern[1901_1906].gif) has a strong enough resemblance to the one used from ca. 1902-06, and that one (http://www.dfs-wappen.de/media/verein/ger/bayern/muenchen/dfs_wl_d_muenchen_bayern_msc_fa[1906_1909].gif) was used during their union with Münchner SC (ca 1906-19), therefore the "S" in it. (Links have to be copied and pasted, because they hav square brackets in them)
What Marmeling is concerned, as much as I remember, he co-operates with the guys from DWS-Wappen; they however, as is apparent, can only draw, but have not much clue about history. They even carried for a long time the 1925-54 logo in blue (!!! - see version history here). Most Bayern logos have apparently been uploaded from DWS and have their generally misleading names. BTW, I proposed changes along these lines already around 22 December 2017. Oalexander ( talk) 04:07, 23 November 2019 (UTC)
At a cursory glance the kits as presented per today were incorrect for 1968/69 and 1972/73. The standard home-kit for 1968/69 can be seen here (scroll down). Easily recognizable the old stadium and players like Mucki Brenninger (left) and Werner Olk Between Bulle Roth (with the trophy) and Schwarzenbeck (to his right Gerd Müller). In the cup final Bayern played in all-red ( as can be gleaned from here). The standard home-kit from 1972/73 can be seen here. I personally do not have the skills to make the appropriate changes. Cheers, Oalexander ( talk) 01:38, 17 April 2020 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Not Moved - No Consensus Current name and proposed names are clearly covered in the article and dealt with ample redirects so readers are not being shorted here. Additionally, the current title is consistent with sports naming conventions and there are almost another dozen collateral articles using the current title convention re: FC Bayern Munich. Mike Cline ( talk) 12:43, 13 February 2022 (UTC)
FC Bayern Munich →
Bayern Munich – "FC Bayern Munich" is neither the
WP:COMMONNAME, which is
"Bayern Munich", nor the official English name which is
"FC Bayern München". As such, I propose moving this article to "Bayern Munich" as it best meets
WP:CRITERIA and
WP:NCST does not apply as there is ambiguity as to the official spelling of a club's name in English
, although if there is a consensus against that I would support "FC Bayern München" as an improvement over the current title.
BilledMammal (
talk)
07:12, 5 February 2022 (UTC)
ambiguity as to the official spelling of a club's name in English. BilledMammal ( talk) 00:48, 6 February 2022 (UTC)
significant differences between the German and English versions. However, your argument seems to be that Bayern München is wrong about their official English name for use outside of the United States, and I don't find that to be particularly convincing. BilledMammal ( talk) 05:26, 6 February 2022 (UTC)
snow close and topic ban?, if you believe this warrants a topic ban please take it to ANI - it is inappropriate to raise it here. BilledMammal ( talk) 07:21, 6 February 2022 (UTC)
ambiguity as to the official spelling of a club's name in English. BilledMammal ( talk) 04:03, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
ambiguity as to the official spelling of a club's name in English, and München (Munich), like Bayern (Bavaria), is a German name, not a German word. BilledMammal ( talk) 04:33, 7 February 2022 (UTC)
since most active members of WP:FOOTY disagree with that titlewhy does this matter? All that matters is whether the broader community agrees or disagrees with a title, per Wikipedia:LOCALCONSENSUS. BilledMammal ( talk) 09:29, 10 February 2022 (UTC)
09:04, 23 June 2006 SndrAndrss talk contribs block 30 bytes +30 moved Bayern Munich to FC Bayern Munich
which was followed by a series of apparently bold moves. Hopefully this RM will lead to stability whichever way it goes. Andrewa ( talk) 14:54, 12 February 2022 (UTC)
Hello page watchers. I'm going through the good article cleanup listing to reassess old GAs. This article is in need of a lick of paint to maintain its GA status,
Anybody here wants to pick it up? If not, I'll likely nominate for a WP:good article reassessment in a couple of weeks. —Femke 🐦 ( talk) 19:19, 22 February 2023 (UTC)
he was sacked 110.142.185.173 ( talk) 11:35, 1 April 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Changers556 ( talk) 23:26, 18 May 2024 (UTC)
I would like to change the head coach from Thomas Tuchel to Vacant with a citation from Fc Bayern’s website. I would like to do this in order to provide accurate information.