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Deaths of anti-vaccine advocates from COVID-19 article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
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While the biographies of living persons policy does not apply directly to the subject of this article, it may contain material that relates to living persons, such as friends and family of persons no longer living, or living persons involved in the subject matter. Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material about living persons must be removed immediately. If such material is re-inserted repeatedly, or if there are other concerns related to this policy, please see this noticeboard. |
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![]() | The
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The Reddit subreddit r/HermanCainAward is a fertile site for names. Of course only a fraction of those listed there are suitable for this page, but given how many are listed, it should help. rsjaffe 🗩 🖉 06:13, 9 December 2021 (UTC)
I have removed the following from the page for now because I do not find them to be noteworthy.
References
Cheers! BD2412 T 04:39, 5 January 2022 (UTC)
The following list has been compiled for this article. I am moving it here to discuss whether we should have such a list, and if so what the criteria for inclusion in the list should be.
Name | Age | Date of death | Description | References |
---|---|---|---|---|
Hans Kristian Gaarder | 60 | April 6, 2021 | Norwegian conspiracy theorist. | [1] |
Stephen Harmon | 34 | July 23, 2021 | American member of Hillsong megachurch, opposed vaccination. | [2] [3] |
Dick Farrel | 65 | August 4, 2021 | American conservative radio host and Newsmax TV anchor, claimed COVID-19 vaccines were poison. | [4] [5] [6] |
H. Scott Apley | 45 | August 4, 2021 | Dickinson, Texas, city council member; downplayed the COVID-19 pandemic and disparaged the efficacy of vaccines. | [7] [8] [9] |
Pressley Stutts | 64 | August 19, 2021 | South Carolina county Republican party leader, "felt people should not be pressured to get the vaccine and should not demand others get the shots". | [10] |
Phil Valentine | 61 | August 21, 2021 | American talk radio host. | [4] [5] |
Jimmy DeYoung Sr | 80/81 | August 23, 2021 | American Christian radio broadcaster. | [5] |
Marc Bernier | 65 | August 29, 2021 | American radio host, self-described "Mr. Anti-Vax". | [4] [5] [11] |
Bob Enyart | 62 | September 12, 2021 | American conservative radio host who "vocally refused to get vaccinated and actively spread false claims about the COVID-19 virus". | [12] [13] |
Hai Shaulian | 57 | September 13, 2021 | Israeli anti-vaccination activist. | [14] |
Johann Biacsics | 65 | November 10, 2021 | Austrian anti-vaccination campaigner who was regarded as a leader within the Austrian anti-vaccination movement. Refused medical treatment; discharged himself from hospital and returned home, where he used chlorine dioxide enemas in an unsuccessful attempt to treat his disease. |
[15] [16] [17] [18] [19] |
Rex Warwood | 80 | November 29, 2021 | New Zealand journalist. | [20] |
Marcus Lamb | 64 | November 30, 2021 | American televangelist. | [21] [22] |
William Hartmann | 63 | December 9, 2021 | Member of the Wayne County, Michigan, Board of Canvassers. | [23] |
Frédéric Sinistra | 41 | December 15, 2021 | Belgian kickboxing champion. Sinistra "refused to acknowledge he was severely ill and discharged himself early from the hospital". | [24] |
Doug Ericksen | 52 | December 17, 2021 | Washington politician; voiced opposition toward state measures aiming to reduce the spread of COVID-19 like masking, social distancing, and vaccine mandates. | [25] [26] |
Bernd Grimmer | 71 | December 18, 2021 | German politician. | [27] |
Robin Fransman | 53 | December 29, 2021 | Dutch economist "who preached against coronavirus lockdowns because of their high cost" and was described as a "vociferous coronavirus-vaccine opponent". | [28] |
Kelly Ernby | 46 | January 3, 2022 | Orange County, California, Deputy District Attorney. | [29] [30] [31] |
Doug Kuzma | 61 | January 7, 2022 | American anti-vaccine podcaster. | [32] |
Cirsten Weldon | unknown | January 6, 2022 | American QAnon advocate who referred to vaccine recipents as "idiots" and called for Anthony Fauci to be hanged. | [33] |
Kelly Canon | unknown | January 10, 2022 | American "grassroots organizer and vocal critic of vaccine requirements". | [34] |
References
Business Insider 9-14
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).Enyart
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).{{
cite web}}
: CS1 maint: url-status (
link)
CNN_2021-12-01
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).An anti-vaccine kickboxing champion has died from COVID-19 complications after he refused to acknowledge he was severely ill and discharged himself early from the hospital.
LA Times 1-10-22
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).For the record, I do not think it should be limited to subjects with a Wikipedia article, but should include those who fall below general encyclopedic notability, but are still noteworthy in context for their political office, or degree of involvement in antivaccine activities. BD2412 T 01:44, 11 January 2022 (UTC)
I believe these two articles are important to mention in the wiki article:
-- Softlavender ( talk) 07:21, 11 January 2022 (UTC)
While it may make sense to mention specific names in context of the larger topic, I don't think a list of names (even in paragraph form) is needed. Per BLP I would see this as a case of doing harm. Yes, the same facts exist in other articles but compiling them into a list here looks too much like the lists this article is reporting upon. Springee ( talk) 19:55, 11 January 2022 (UTC)
I share the view expressed by User:Drmies. Also, there is no policy-based reason for leaving out the names. Just word things with care and sensitivity. There are situations where family members and friends have shared their opinions, and that can also be included. -- Valjean ( talk) 02:34, 12 January 2022 (UTC)
The paragraph with the names conspicuously missing reads pretty awkwardly to me. I do agree that prose is preferable to a list, though. My vote would be to include names, but to have a high standard for inclusion: (a) only people with a public profile (no private individuals who voiced their anti-vaccine stance privately); (b) only notable people (as in WP:N, which would usually mean they have an article or would qualify for one), although they don't have to be notable for anti-vaccine advocacy; (c) must have a citation for their death from covid/covid-related complications; and (d) must have at least one citation which covers in nontrivial detail their anti-vaccine activism from before they died. — Rhododendrites talk \\ 20:49, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
I added a top template but after a concern by Valjean on my talk page it may indeed be better to just leave a note here.
— Paleo Neonate – 02:20, 14 January 2022 (UTC)
The science reference desk would be a better place to discuss the topic, since this talk page is not a forum. If you have reliable sources to propose, you are welcome to do so in a new thread. Thanks, — Paleo Neonate – 05:53, 16 January 2022 (UTC) |
---|
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
The Vaccinnated can still catch the virus and spread it around the same as the unvaccinated. Vaccines do NOT make anyone immune. They simply help by building up an army of to fight against the virus once it enters. The spread of the virus is by everyone everyday. Being vaccinated does mean you somehow kill the virus upon coming in to contact with it. No the vaccinated spread the virus around exactly like everyone else with their hands. Also the unvaccinated can't spread what they don't have. Unvaccinated doesn't mean they are the walking dead. I know because everyone in my house caught the virus. It was tough and for me lasted 6 months. None of us had a vaccination but we all survived. But now we don't need a vaccination because actually having previously caught the virus we have antibodies to fight it if we catch it again. Exactly the same as vaccinated. My point is the vaccine isn't a Forcefield that blocks the virus. No the vaccinated can still catch the virus just like everyone else. But you'll have antibodies ready to help you fight it is the difference. But doesn't mean you'll survive it. And regardless of vaccinnation EVERYONE goes about there days spreading all kinds of bacteria and viruses everywhere. Spanish flu is still being spread. Black plague is still being spread and so many more. Not to mention the Flu. No mandate on the Flu and we know it kills millions every year. It's a rapid mutator and will never be gone. Same with Corona it will live on forever. ABerCull ( talk) 23:08, 15 January 2022 (UTC)
|
@ Valjean, Drmies, DMacks, Hob Gadling, Rsjaffe, Dunutubble, Clarityfiend, Bluerasberry, Peterkingiron, Mvqr, Laurel Lodged, and Headphase: Just a head's up that there is now a WP:FRINGE discussion on whether this article should exist, with vague talk of an AfD. It is apparent that some editors weighing in on that discussion have not actually read the article, as they seem to think it contains a list and is "celebrating" the deaths. BD2412 T 18:03, 16 January 2022 (UTC)
I split the award from the text at Controversial Reddit communities. See Talk:Herman Cain Award for details. Bluerasberry (talk) 01:10, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
The Bogdanoff brothers were prominent antivaxxers that died of covid. They were very famous in France, perhaps it's worth mentioning here. Tercer ( talk) 10:30, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
This was recently removed so it reminded me of its likely purpose: WP:SIGNIFICANCE as the article was also likely to get deleted. Unlike list-style articles (see previous discussions), it had to focus on the mediatization. — Paleo Neonate – 04:32, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
How about we document those as well? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.232.246.22 ( talk) 16:53, 18 September 2022 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Deaths of anti-vaccine advocates from COVID-19 article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
While the biographies of living persons policy does not apply directly to the subject of this article, it may contain material that relates to living persons, such as friends and family of persons no longer living, or living persons involved in the subject matter. Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material about living persons must be removed immediately. If such material is re-inserted repeatedly, or if there are other concerns related to this policy, please see this noticeboard. |
![]() | This page is not a forum for general discussion about COVID-19. Any such comments may be removed or refactored. Please limit discussion to improvement of this article. You may wish to ask factual questions about COVID-19 at the Reference desk. |
![]() | The
contentious topics procedure applies to this page. This page is related to
COVID-19, broadly construed, which has been
designated as a contentious topic. Editors who repeatedly or seriously fail to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process may be blocked or restricted by an administrator. Editors are advised to familiarise themselves with the contentious topics procedures before editing this page. |
The Reddit subreddit r/HermanCainAward is a fertile site for names. Of course only a fraction of those listed there are suitable for this page, but given how many are listed, it should help. rsjaffe 🗩 🖉 06:13, 9 December 2021 (UTC)
I have removed the following from the page for now because I do not find them to be noteworthy.
References
Cheers! BD2412 T 04:39, 5 January 2022 (UTC)
The following list has been compiled for this article. I am moving it here to discuss whether we should have such a list, and if so what the criteria for inclusion in the list should be.
Name | Age | Date of death | Description | References |
---|---|---|---|---|
Hans Kristian Gaarder | 60 | April 6, 2021 | Norwegian conspiracy theorist. | [1] |
Stephen Harmon | 34 | July 23, 2021 | American member of Hillsong megachurch, opposed vaccination. | [2] [3] |
Dick Farrel | 65 | August 4, 2021 | American conservative radio host and Newsmax TV anchor, claimed COVID-19 vaccines were poison. | [4] [5] [6] |
H. Scott Apley | 45 | August 4, 2021 | Dickinson, Texas, city council member; downplayed the COVID-19 pandemic and disparaged the efficacy of vaccines. | [7] [8] [9] |
Pressley Stutts | 64 | August 19, 2021 | South Carolina county Republican party leader, "felt people should not be pressured to get the vaccine and should not demand others get the shots". | [10] |
Phil Valentine | 61 | August 21, 2021 | American talk radio host. | [4] [5] |
Jimmy DeYoung Sr | 80/81 | August 23, 2021 | American Christian radio broadcaster. | [5] |
Marc Bernier | 65 | August 29, 2021 | American radio host, self-described "Mr. Anti-Vax". | [4] [5] [11] |
Bob Enyart | 62 | September 12, 2021 | American conservative radio host who "vocally refused to get vaccinated and actively spread false claims about the COVID-19 virus". | [12] [13] |
Hai Shaulian | 57 | September 13, 2021 | Israeli anti-vaccination activist. | [14] |
Johann Biacsics | 65 | November 10, 2021 | Austrian anti-vaccination campaigner who was regarded as a leader within the Austrian anti-vaccination movement. Refused medical treatment; discharged himself from hospital and returned home, where he used chlorine dioxide enemas in an unsuccessful attempt to treat his disease. |
[15] [16] [17] [18] [19] |
Rex Warwood | 80 | November 29, 2021 | New Zealand journalist. | [20] |
Marcus Lamb | 64 | November 30, 2021 | American televangelist. | [21] [22] |
William Hartmann | 63 | December 9, 2021 | Member of the Wayne County, Michigan, Board of Canvassers. | [23] |
Frédéric Sinistra | 41 | December 15, 2021 | Belgian kickboxing champion. Sinistra "refused to acknowledge he was severely ill and discharged himself early from the hospital". | [24] |
Doug Ericksen | 52 | December 17, 2021 | Washington politician; voiced opposition toward state measures aiming to reduce the spread of COVID-19 like masking, social distancing, and vaccine mandates. | [25] [26] |
Bernd Grimmer | 71 | December 18, 2021 | German politician. | [27] |
Robin Fransman | 53 | December 29, 2021 | Dutch economist "who preached against coronavirus lockdowns because of their high cost" and was described as a "vociferous coronavirus-vaccine opponent". | [28] |
Kelly Ernby | 46 | January 3, 2022 | Orange County, California, Deputy District Attorney. | [29] [30] [31] |
Doug Kuzma | 61 | January 7, 2022 | American anti-vaccine podcaster. | [32] |
Cirsten Weldon | unknown | January 6, 2022 | American QAnon advocate who referred to vaccine recipents as "idiots" and called for Anthony Fauci to be hanged. | [33] |
Kelly Canon | unknown | January 10, 2022 | American "grassroots organizer and vocal critic of vaccine requirements". | [34] |
References
Business Insider 9-14
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).Enyart
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).{{
cite web}}
: CS1 maint: url-status (
link)
CNN_2021-12-01
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).An anti-vaccine kickboxing champion has died from COVID-19 complications after he refused to acknowledge he was severely ill and discharged himself early from the hospital.
LA Times 1-10-22
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).For the record, I do not think it should be limited to subjects with a Wikipedia article, but should include those who fall below general encyclopedic notability, but are still noteworthy in context for their political office, or degree of involvement in antivaccine activities. BD2412 T 01:44, 11 January 2022 (UTC)
I believe these two articles are important to mention in the wiki article:
-- Softlavender ( talk) 07:21, 11 January 2022 (UTC)
While it may make sense to mention specific names in context of the larger topic, I don't think a list of names (even in paragraph form) is needed. Per BLP I would see this as a case of doing harm. Yes, the same facts exist in other articles but compiling them into a list here looks too much like the lists this article is reporting upon. Springee ( talk) 19:55, 11 January 2022 (UTC)
I share the view expressed by User:Drmies. Also, there is no policy-based reason for leaving out the names. Just word things with care and sensitivity. There are situations where family members and friends have shared their opinions, and that can also be included. -- Valjean ( talk) 02:34, 12 January 2022 (UTC)
The paragraph with the names conspicuously missing reads pretty awkwardly to me. I do agree that prose is preferable to a list, though. My vote would be to include names, but to have a high standard for inclusion: (a) only people with a public profile (no private individuals who voiced their anti-vaccine stance privately); (b) only notable people (as in WP:N, which would usually mean they have an article or would qualify for one), although they don't have to be notable for anti-vaccine advocacy; (c) must have a citation for their death from covid/covid-related complications; and (d) must have at least one citation which covers in nontrivial detail their anti-vaccine activism from before they died. — Rhododendrites talk \\ 20:49, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
I added a top template but after a concern by Valjean on my talk page it may indeed be better to just leave a note here.
— Paleo Neonate – 02:20, 14 January 2022 (UTC)
The science reference desk would be a better place to discuss the topic, since this talk page is not a forum. If you have reliable sources to propose, you are welcome to do so in a new thread. Thanks, — Paleo Neonate – 05:53, 16 January 2022 (UTC) |
---|
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
The Vaccinnated can still catch the virus and spread it around the same as the unvaccinated. Vaccines do NOT make anyone immune. They simply help by building up an army of to fight against the virus once it enters. The spread of the virus is by everyone everyday. Being vaccinated does mean you somehow kill the virus upon coming in to contact with it. No the vaccinated spread the virus around exactly like everyone else with their hands. Also the unvaccinated can't spread what they don't have. Unvaccinated doesn't mean they are the walking dead. I know because everyone in my house caught the virus. It was tough and for me lasted 6 months. None of us had a vaccination but we all survived. But now we don't need a vaccination because actually having previously caught the virus we have antibodies to fight it if we catch it again. Exactly the same as vaccinated. My point is the vaccine isn't a Forcefield that blocks the virus. No the vaccinated can still catch the virus just like everyone else. But you'll have antibodies ready to help you fight it is the difference. But doesn't mean you'll survive it. And regardless of vaccinnation EVERYONE goes about there days spreading all kinds of bacteria and viruses everywhere. Spanish flu is still being spread. Black plague is still being spread and so many more. Not to mention the Flu. No mandate on the Flu and we know it kills millions every year. It's a rapid mutator and will never be gone. Same with Corona it will live on forever. ABerCull ( talk) 23:08, 15 January 2022 (UTC)
|
@ Valjean, Drmies, DMacks, Hob Gadling, Rsjaffe, Dunutubble, Clarityfiend, Bluerasberry, Peterkingiron, Mvqr, Laurel Lodged, and Headphase: Just a head's up that there is now a WP:FRINGE discussion on whether this article should exist, with vague talk of an AfD. It is apparent that some editors weighing in on that discussion have not actually read the article, as they seem to think it contains a list and is "celebrating" the deaths. BD2412 T 18:03, 16 January 2022 (UTC)
I split the award from the text at Controversial Reddit communities. See Talk:Herman Cain Award for details. Bluerasberry (talk) 01:10, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
The Bogdanoff brothers were prominent antivaxxers that died of covid. They were very famous in France, perhaps it's worth mentioning here. Tercer ( talk) 10:30, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
This was recently removed so it reminded me of its likely purpose: WP:SIGNIFICANCE as the article was also likely to get deleted. Unlike list-style articles (see previous discussions), it had to focus on the mediatization. — Paleo Neonate – 04:32, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
How about we document those as well? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.232.246.22 ( talk) 16:53, 18 September 2022 (UTC)