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Beefart says: Hey dudes: If you are going to remove captions that you find "weird", please make sure that what you leave in place makes sense. Cape Point is "behind"? Behind what? The horizon? No, I don't think so. It is behind the photographer. It was behind the photographer when he took the picture. It is no longer behind him, coz afterwards he went home. That is what I said. The description was precise. You may not like it but unless you can improve on it, leave well alone.
I removed this text for now:
Now, I used to tell lots of people that I was from the San Francisco Bay, even though (1) I didn't live in the water, and (2) The San Francisco Bay is not an alternative name for Alameda, where I did live. So, can we find some reference to confirm that the Cape of Good Hope was specifically a name for the colony? Because I've only heard it referred to as the Cape Colony. — Johan the Ghost seance 00:41, 29 January 2006 (UTC)
Beefart says: A little learning is a dang'rous thing... I consider the removal of the text to be ill-informed. Why don't you start from first base and read what is written on the scan of the postage stamp? Does it say Union of South Africa? Does it say The Cape Colony? Does it say Denver, Colorado? No, Maude, it says "Cape of Good Hope". Now I wonder why that is? What the official name was is not germane. What was in common usage is germane. According to your logic, there cannot be any Dutch people, because there is no country called Dutchia..... There isn't even a place called Holland. It's official name is The Netherlands. But heaps of people from France go to Holland every week and don't notice the difference... I don't know whether there is a Golden Rule in Wikipedia that says "If it aint broke, don't fix it" but there ought to be... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Captainbeefart ( talk • contribs) .
Beefart pastes this after edit conflict:
Beefart adds: You wanted a reference? How about Darwin? Heard of him in California? NO? Look him up. He's at Google?
I found this in two minutes through Google. It is stating the Bleeding Obvious for anybody who knows anything about the Cape. What's your excuse? Darwin is talking about "The Cape of Good Hope", sensu lato. There is no granite at "The Cape of Good Hope", sensu stricto. (Trust me. I have a Ph.D. in geology from the University of Cape Town and I lived at "The Cape" for over thirty years). And no, I don't have a reference for that :) :) :) )... Green Point is 40km from the GOGH senso stricto. The "country" and "the district" that Darwin refers to in the text is given in the title of the chapter: "The Cape of Good Hope". The "interior parts" (of the Cape of Good Hope) are not specified by Darwin but the next nearest outcrop of granite is at Paarl, which is getting on for a 100km into the interior of the colony from the end of the Cape Peninsula. Cape of Good Hope, senso stricto, it aint...
If is isn't broke, don't fix it. If you haven't bothered to look up a reference, don't rubbish somebody else for the same crime. To quote John Cleese, "It's people like you wot cause unrest". Clean up your act and put the original text back, ...... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Captainbeefart ( talk • contribs) .
If this link springs back to life, we can put it back in:
— Johan the Ghost seance 17:00, 29 January 2006 (UTC)
I'd like to clarify the locations of Good Hope and Cape Point a little. Currently, this article says that Good Hope is "the south-west corner of the Cape Peninsula", at location 34°21′23″S 18°29′15″E / 34.35639°S 18.48750°E. Cape Point says it is 1km east.
hi:
That puts the two points 2.33 km (1.45 miles) apart.
Anyone care to check/comment on this? I'm trying to put together a detail map showing the exact layout. — Johan the Ghost seance 13:10, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
Please stop adding references to Gavin Menzies' 1421 hypothesis as if it was fact. These theories are totally disputed by mainstream historians; if they are going to be mentioned in the article at all, it needs to be done in a correctly balanced way (ie. mentioning that most people think he's wrong). See:
— Johan the Ghost seance 12:06, 25 February 2006 (UTC)
Hi, I don't know how to wikify this info, so if anyone else wants to do it then thanks! I have found a citation for the first paragraph ("Thus the rounding of the cape in 1488 was a major milestone in the attempts by the Portuguese to establish a sea route to the Far East.")
Bartolomeu Dias and the discovery of the South-east passage linking the Atlantic to the Indian Ocean (1488)
W.G.L. Randles
Lisboa : Instituto de Investigação Científica Tropical, 1988.
Série separatas / Centro de Estudos de História e Cartografia Antiga, 0870-6735 ; 188
Selected quotes from the article:
"The voyage of Bartolomeu Dias, which established the southern limit of the African continent, thus proving that a navigable passage from the Atlantic to the Indian Ocean existed, began with his departure from Lisbon in August 1487 and ended with his return in December 1488"--p.3
"The historian João de Barros was later, in 1552, to set out the new configuration of the African continent contrasting it with the representation given it by Ptolemy. Beyond the region of Agisymba, the southern limit known to Ptolemy, wrote Barros, lies another land unknown in his day, of which the coastline is now well explored. It starts at the Prassum Promontorium in 15 1/2 degrees Lat. S., called by the inhabitants Mozambique. Its western limit, unknown to Ptolemy lies in 50 Lat. S. in the land of the Pangelungos, that is, near the mouth of the Congo. Between these two limits, to the east and to the west, lies the great and famous Cape of Good Hope, for thousands of years unknown to the world."--p.12
Thanks Gemma (gemma.wright@mhs.ox.ac.uk)
Hi im just here to ask but why did bartolomeu name is discovery The Cape Of Good Hope????=\ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.185.210.107 ( talk) 22:56, 24 March 2008 (UTC)
See the first paragraph under "European exploration". Dias named it the Cape of Storms, but King John II renamed it Cape of Good Hope, because there was now a passage to the East. Prisoner of Zenda ( talk) 10:20, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
I don't know whether the reference to deer on the peninsula is correct or not, but unless someone can confirm this with great confidence, I mean to remove it. If someone really can affirm it, then ok, but then please mention that they are not indigenous, and if you have the info, please say something about their origin. JonRichfield ( talk) 16:45, 5 July 2013 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: page moved speedy close. Anthony Appleyard ( talk) 16:47, 23 June 2015 (UTC)
Cape of Good Hope (landmark) → Cape of Good Hope – There is no reason to designate this article as Cape of Good Hope (landmark) as there is no other article identified as Cape of Good Hope Liz Read! Talk! 15:32, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
About the now speedily closed #Requested move 22 June 2015:
Anymouse argued for a "Speedy procedural REVERT per WP:BRD" on the grounds of WP:PRIMARYTOPIC, a point already made by В²C, and taken by me after sleeping on it. But why criticise me (twice) for moving the article without discussion while in the same breath referring to WP:BRD? Since when is discussion necessary before making any edit or move?
From WP:BRD-NOT: "No edit, regardless of how large it is, requires any prior discussion."
Just saying... André Kritzinger ( talk) 00:16, 24 June 2015 (UTC)
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Cheers.— cyberbot II Talk to my owner:Online 16:42, 27 February 2016 (UTC)
This section refers to Cape Point a little east of CoGH - but CP isn't shown on the map of the Cape Peninsula. Perhaps it could be? Prisoner of Zenda ( talk) 10:12, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
I have removed the section under history. It makes sweeping claims not found in any of the academic histories of South Africa and has several other problems:
I dislike rolling back large chunks of content like when it appears to have been made in good faith. But it contains sweeping claims that contradict the standard texts of South African history, irrelevant information, sources that can't be checked, and original research, which means that this content is not suitable for Wikipedia. I have removed the entire section. Francoisdjvr ( talk)
This article is written in South African English, which has its own spelling conventions (colour, realise, analyse) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus. |
This
level-5 vital article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on April 6, 2004 and January 19, 2010. |
This article links to one or more target anchors that no longer exist.
Please help fix the broken anchors. You can remove this template after fixing the problems. |
Reporting errors |
Beefart says: Hey dudes: If you are going to remove captions that you find "weird", please make sure that what you leave in place makes sense. Cape Point is "behind"? Behind what? The horizon? No, I don't think so. It is behind the photographer. It was behind the photographer when he took the picture. It is no longer behind him, coz afterwards he went home. That is what I said. The description was precise. You may not like it but unless you can improve on it, leave well alone.
I removed this text for now:
Now, I used to tell lots of people that I was from the San Francisco Bay, even though (1) I didn't live in the water, and (2) The San Francisco Bay is not an alternative name for Alameda, where I did live. So, can we find some reference to confirm that the Cape of Good Hope was specifically a name for the colony? Because I've only heard it referred to as the Cape Colony. — Johan the Ghost seance 00:41, 29 January 2006 (UTC)
Beefart says: A little learning is a dang'rous thing... I consider the removal of the text to be ill-informed. Why don't you start from first base and read what is written on the scan of the postage stamp? Does it say Union of South Africa? Does it say The Cape Colony? Does it say Denver, Colorado? No, Maude, it says "Cape of Good Hope". Now I wonder why that is? What the official name was is not germane. What was in common usage is germane. According to your logic, there cannot be any Dutch people, because there is no country called Dutchia..... There isn't even a place called Holland. It's official name is The Netherlands. But heaps of people from France go to Holland every week and don't notice the difference... I don't know whether there is a Golden Rule in Wikipedia that says "If it aint broke, don't fix it" but there ought to be... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Captainbeefart ( talk • contribs) .
Beefart pastes this after edit conflict:
Beefart adds: You wanted a reference? How about Darwin? Heard of him in California? NO? Look him up. He's at Google?
I found this in two minutes through Google. It is stating the Bleeding Obvious for anybody who knows anything about the Cape. What's your excuse? Darwin is talking about "The Cape of Good Hope", sensu lato. There is no granite at "The Cape of Good Hope", sensu stricto. (Trust me. I have a Ph.D. in geology from the University of Cape Town and I lived at "The Cape" for over thirty years). And no, I don't have a reference for that :) :) :) )... Green Point is 40km from the GOGH senso stricto. The "country" and "the district" that Darwin refers to in the text is given in the title of the chapter: "The Cape of Good Hope". The "interior parts" (of the Cape of Good Hope) are not specified by Darwin but the next nearest outcrop of granite is at Paarl, which is getting on for a 100km into the interior of the colony from the end of the Cape Peninsula. Cape of Good Hope, senso stricto, it aint...
If is isn't broke, don't fix it. If you haven't bothered to look up a reference, don't rubbish somebody else for the same crime. To quote John Cleese, "It's people like you wot cause unrest". Clean up your act and put the original text back, ...... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Captainbeefart ( talk • contribs) .
If this link springs back to life, we can put it back in:
— Johan the Ghost seance 17:00, 29 January 2006 (UTC)
I'd like to clarify the locations of Good Hope and Cape Point a little. Currently, this article says that Good Hope is "the south-west corner of the Cape Peninsula", at location 34°21′23″S 18°29′15″E / 34.35639°S 18.48750°E. Cape Point says it is 1km east.
hi:
That puts the two points 2.33 km (1.45 miles) apart.
Anyone care to check/comment on this? I'm trying to put together a detail map showing the exact layout. — Johan the Ghost seance 13:10, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
Please stop adding references to Gavin Menzies' 1421 hypothesis as if it was fact. These theories are totally disputed by mainstream historians; if they are going to be mentioned in the article at all, it needs to be done in a correctly balanced way (ie. mentioning that most people think he's wrong). See:
— Johan the Ghost seance 12:06, 25 February 2006 (UTC)
Hi, I don't know how to wikify this info, so if anyone else wants to do it then thanks! I have found a citation for the first paragraph ("Thus the rounding of the cape in 1488 was a major milestone in the attempts by the Portuguese to establish a sea route to the Far East.")
Bartolomeu Dias and the discovery of the South-east passage linking the Atlantic to the Indian Ocean (1488)
W.G.L. Randles
Lisboa : Instituto de Investigação Científica Tropical, 1988.
Série separatas / Centro de Estudos de História e Cartografia Antiga, 0870-6735 ; 188
Selected quotes from the article:
"The voyage of Bartolomeu Dias, which established the southern limit of the African continent, thus proving that a navigable passage from the Atlantic to the Indian Ocean existed, began with his departure from Lisbon in August 1487 and ended with his return in December 1488"--p.3
"The historian João de Barros was later, in 1552, to set out the new configuration of the African continent contrasting it with the representation given it by Ptolemy. Beyond the region of Agisymba, the southern limit known to Ptolemy, wrote Barros, lies another land unknown in his day, of which the coastline is now well explored. It starts at the Prassum Promontorium in 15 1/2 degrees Lat. S., called by the inhabitants Mozambique. Its western limit, unknown to Ptolemy lies in 50 Lat. S. in the land of the Pangelungos, that is, near the mouth of the Congo. Between these two limits, to the east and to the west, lies the great and famous Cape of Good Hope, for thousands of years unknown to the world."--p.12
Thanks Gemma (gemma.wright@mhs.ox.ac.uk)
Hi im just here to ask but why did bartolomeu name is discovery The Cape Of Good Hope????=\ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.185.210.107 ( talk) 22:56, 24 March 2008 (UTC)
See the first paragraph under "European exploration". Dias named it the Cape of Storms, but King John II renamed it Cape of Good Hope, because there was now a passage to the East. Prisoner of Zenda ( talk) 10:20, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
I don't know whether the reference to deer on the peninsula is correct or not, but unless someone can confirm this with great confidence, I mean to remove it. If someone really can affirm it, then ok, but then please mention that they are not indigenous, and if you have the info, please say something about their origin. JonRichfield ( talk) 16:45, 5 July 2013 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: page moved speedy close. Anthony Appleyard ( talk) 16:47, 23 June 2015 (UTC)
Cape of Good Hope (landmark) → Cape of Good Hope – There is no reason to designate this article as Cape of Good Hope (landmark) as there is no other article identified as Cape of Good Hope Liz Read! Talk! 15:32, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
About the now speedily closed #Requested move 22 June 2015:
Anymouse argued for a "Speedy procedural REVERT per WP:BRD" on the grounds of WP:PRIMARYTOPIC, a point already made by В²C, and taken by me after sleeping on it. But why criticise me (twice) for moving the article without discussion while in the same breath referring to WP:BRD? Since when is discussion necessary before making any edit or move?
From WP:BRD-NOT: "No edit, regardless of how large it is, requires any prior discussion."
Just saying... André Kritzinger ( talk) 00:16, 24 June 2015 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to 2 external links on
Cape of Good Hope. Please take a moment to review
my edit. If necessary, add {{
cbignore}}
after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{
nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}}
to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— cyberbot II Talk to my owner:Online 16:42, 27 February 2016 (UTC)
This section refers to Cape Point a little east of CoGH - but CP isn't shown on the map of the Cape Peninsula. Perhaps it could be? Prisoner of Zenda ( talk) 10:12, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
I have removed the section under history. It makes sweeping claims not found in any of the academic histories of South Africa and has several other problems:
I dislike rolling back large chunks of content like when it appears to have been made in good faith. But it contains sweeping claims that contradict the standard texts of South African history, irrelevant information, sources that can't be checked, and original research, which means that this content is not suitable for Wikipedia. I have removed the entire section. Francoisdjvr ( talk)