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At what age did he transition? I came to this article specifically for this information and it's not here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 181.119.30.12 ( talk) 21:05, 20 September 2016 (UTC)
It would be interesting to link this comment to a note about what he practices and where. While 'straight edge' is compatible, 'openly gay' might be restrictive to certain brands of Judaism. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.224.220.52 ( talk) 19:53, 6 November 2007 (UTC)
Source to explore: http://www.salon.com/entertainment/tv/int/2009/02/21/bruce_vilanch DocOfSoc ( talk) 11:37, 17 October 2010 (UTC) — DocOfSoc • Talk • 04:31, 22 March 2011 (UTC)
I removed a large amount of what I call "Fat and Fluff" from this article. Essentially, there was a lot of peacock terminology, a lot of what read like an advertisement, and a lot of unneccessary text that didn't really relate to the article's subject. There was also an overdoing of glowing adjectives that caused the article to not read very NPOV. I imagine these changes may anger some who have spent time on this page, and for that I apologize. But, I do hope that rather than reacting in anger and immediately reverting, the changes can be discussed here. Lhb1239 ( talk) 18:53, 4 May 2011 (UTC)
Requesting comments from other editors involved (and not involved) in editing this article and the recent changes made. Lhb1239 ( talk) 22:59, 4 May 2011 (UTC)
I think some is ok but Vilanch is known for - " as a writer for TV awards shows; he has co-written 21 Oscar broadcasts, as well as a featured writer for the Tonys, Grammys and Emmys and his four-year stint on Hollywood Squares, as both a performer and writer." Get Bruce is a documentary all about this - his best story in the film was that he got paid more to write for a Barbra Streisand impersonator than Babs herself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.139.12.85 ( talk) 00:19, 5 May 2011 (UTC)
I repeat, I will continue to source and replace comments you have removed, NONE of which are from personal knowledge. You have now progressed to reverting your own edits and reverting perfectly acceptable and sourced material. There is not an anti-semetic quality to anything except in your own mind, the comments were between two Jews. Why don't YOU look for a source before deleting, what a concept! I will stop here... — DocOfSoc • Talk • 08:23, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
You attitude is decidedly hostile, and I have no idea why. Yes, a couple of edits I made I redid. That's how it works here. Change is good and this article needs tons of change. One of the biggest changes it needs is the number of quoted statements it contains. And encyclopedia article doesn't contain as many quoted statements this article has and something needs to be dones about that. There is an anti-semetic quality to the statement about Streisand as well as a POV quality. You are essentially edit warring now. Because of that, I will go to the BLP noticeboard and get more editors to come here and comment. With the hostility you seem to be expressing in your edit summaries (flunking syntax? this isn't a classroom) as well as your comments here, I think it's the only way to go at this point. Lhb1239 ( talk) 15:41, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
A request for comment has been made here. Hopefully, getting others involved will help. Lhb1239 ( talk) 16:13, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
Lhb I am not hostile, that is a lack of Good Faith. I am extremely frustrated. As one of my esteemed Mentors has said, it takes two to edit war and I have been careful not to engage, you can't "essentially" edit war , you either are or are not. I am not. Calling my Jewish princess brb. — DocOfSoc • Talk • 20:01, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
Oh Hi! You are there! I was talking to one of my J.P. who laughed hysterically at the idea of my writing anything o anti-semetic. She suggested insert ANY other name where Barbra's is and you will see it is not a problem. OK, please remember I write often with tongue firmly tucked in cheek, which you would have no way of knowing. My students loved me and you have gotten the sarcastic teacher voice in my head and if that is offensive, I apologize. Yes, this is not a classroom, but it is a forum where English should be "spoken" properly. "Flunking syntax was meant to be funny and I wrote in my best "Funny Girl" voice. Sorry, inflection does not work here. I DO love too many quotes and will work on that. I am actually having a good time and invite you to join me in what is outside of Wiki, pretty hilarious. Good luck on the BLP board. Even I am surprised at how many people have never heard of one of the most prolific and hilarious men around the business. Does no one read the Oscar credits besides myself? I am going to take a breath and call another JP and we can continue what I believe will be a very productive "conversation." BRB — DocOfSoc • Talk • 21:01, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
Your not understanding my very nice and slightly amusing apology is incomprehensible to me. I tried. I was a little wordy. Maybe you should read it again, was trying to establish a common ground here. — DocOfSoc • Talk • 21:26, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
Forgive me if I'm not getting where you say you're trying to come from but from reading your edit summaries that were in my opinion kind of nasty and directed at me, I am not seeing the humor at all. I'm looking to improve the article and work cooperatively, you seem to want to sabotage most of the the content I have contributed so far. When you follow up my stated concerns that have only to do with the article with comments about "Jewish Princesses" and "I am actually having a good time and invite you to join me in what is outside of Wiki, pretty hilarious" -- well, none of those things have anything to do with the article and concerns about it brought forth by more than one editor. No, I don't get where you're coming from and don't find it anywhere near reaching a common ground because what you've said isn't related to the article and the problems it contains. Lhb1239 ( talk) 21:33, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
NOW you tell me there is a template for cities? Sheeesh! My ( talk page stalker)s do a really good job of that, do I have to? LOL TY Bbb for all your help. You are mildly awesome ;-) Namaste...
The lead has the following sentence: "He is a six-time Emmy Award-winner known to industry professionals in Hollywood and New York as 'the fat guy who writes everyone's jokes.'" The source cited is a website called FamousWhy, which, in my view, is not a reliable source. As far as I can tell, it's like a blog, to which anyone can post a question, and it's not clear who responds to them. The quote, in particular, in the WP article is extreme - it's one person's opinion on the FamousWhy website - whoever that person is - and we certainly can't say "known to industry professionals in Hollywood and New York."
I intend to remove the sentence unless there's a consensus to keep it, or unless someone can provide a reliable source in support of it.-- Bbb23 ( talk) 15:15, 8 May 2011 (UTC)
The beginning of the Career section used to say: "Vilanch has been described by radio host Ronn Owens during an interview on San Francisco's KGO as "exhuberently gay". Vilanch refers to his trademark hairstyle as "a platinum version of Alfred Hitchcock; 'Fried blonde,' I call it." He is known for wearing "wildly diverse" eyeglasses and his collection of double entendres-themed t-shirts." I removed the Owens sentence because the reference was unverifiable (no date of the show or anything to be able to verify Owens said it). I removed one source that doesn't work anymore (just has the opening paragraph and the "read more" gets a not found). That meant I took out the eyeglasses part because it was unsourced, which has left us with: "Vilanch refers to his hairstyle as "a platinum version of Alfred Hitchcock; 'Fried blonde'" and is known for his collection of double entendres-themed T-shirts."
My belief is this is trivia and doesn't belong in the article. Unless there is consensus to retain it, I will remove it entirely.-- Bbb23 ( talk) 17:48, 8 May 2011 (UTC)
I wrote this before your bombastic edit conflict above. Put away your ax. It cuts out the meat of every item! Obvious or not, his hair, glasses and t-shirts are his "trademarks." BTW, "Hollywood Squares was most of a generation ago, so there are millions of people who have not seen Bruce, much less heard of him. Because he is such an unknown celebrity, a bit of trivia gives insight to whom and what he is. Having brought this article from a stub some time ago, I am a bit disconcerted by the sudden onslaught of long winded criticism. Comparing entertainers with world leaders is ludicrous, but without entertainment and humor this world would be a sorry place, much like admins and editors with no sense of humor. Because most of his writing is behind the scenes, Bruce will never be revered as is Will Rogers but nonetheless his humor is valuable for this time as Rogers' was when the world was a miserable place, much like it is now...
Nevermind:
Doc, I'm not sure where you stand on all this based on the quotes that were laid out by Lhb AND are still left in the article. Please just address those, or if you object to the quotes I actually removed, address those too - and easy on the exclamation points. :-) And phrases like "get over it", even if something has been discussed before (and I'm not going to look) are not constructive. Please.-- Bbb23 ( talk) 23:34, 8 May 2011 (UTC)
The high fees quote goes with the Streisand quote, and as we have seen Bbb has no problem with the Midler quote. And may I remind you that Bruce's whole schtick is about these people. Without these famous people there is not much to write about Bruce. He puts words in their mouths so in a funny sense, he IS them. And Lhb. under what name did you previously use in Wiki? The aroma of Sockpuppet is wafting through this discussion. — DocOfSoc • Talk • 01:22, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
Doc, I reverted your reinsertion of the sought-after language. Bios are not reliable sources for opinions about the subject. They may be reliable for facts about the person's history. Also, the assertion is very strong, which makes it even more important that it be backed up by a reliable source.-- Bbb23 ( talk) 04:16, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
"Some of the stuff you complain about is no longer in the article. I reworded the scene stealing stuff. I reworded the DRA stuff. I don't see anything wrong with the Midler quote.--Bbb23 (talk) 21:03, 7 May 2011 (UTC) OK...i still luv ya... Out looking for sources BRB — DocOfSoc • Talk • 23:50, 8 May 2011 (UTC)
I'm thinking you're not getting the point, here. Trivia in Wikipedia isn't well-thought of regardless of how many references you have. Lhb1239 ( talk) 00:22, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
Still thinking there are too many direct quotes in the article. Please look at WP:QUOTEFARM. Lhb1239 ( talk) 01:49, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
He was not the center square for 4 years on hollywood squares. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.27.77.205 ( talk) 23:12, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
Is this a test? LOL You asked for cites that were already cited earlier in the article! I will find the rest... who was it that said : "We are not amused"? Fortunately, it was not me. — DocOfSoc • Talk • 03:01, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
Edits have been made to this article that have been sorely needed for months. References have been removed when discovered they were from unreliable sources, posed possible copyright infringement problems, non-existent, dead-links, and just not related at all to the text they were attached to. Cite needed tags were placed as appropriate and some text was removed completely. Some text was removed per previous discussion and informal consensus back in May. Also, as it occurred previously, I'm sure these recent edits will make some other editor(s) upset -- that is not my intent -- but the article really needed work and clean-up. Comments and polite AGF discussion on these edits are welcomed. Lhb1239 ( talk) 02:01, 9 August 2011 (UTC)
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This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
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At what age did he transition? I came to this article specifically for this information and it's not here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 181.119.30.12 ( talk) 21:05, 20 September 2016 (UTC)
It would be interesting to link this comment to a note about what he practices and where. While 'straight edge' is compatible, 'openly gay' might be restrictive to certain brands of Judaism. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.224.220.52 ( talk) 19:53, 6 November 2007 (UTC)
Source to explore: http://www.salon.com/entertainment/tv/int/2009/02/21/bruce_vilanch DocOfSoc ( talk) 11:37, 17 October 2010 (UTC) — DocOfSoc • Talk • 04:31, 22 March 2011 (UTC)
I removed a large amount of what I call "Fat and Fluff" from this article. Essentially, there was a lot of peacock terminology, a lot of what read like an advertisement, and a lot of unneccessary text that didn't really relate to the article's subject. There was also an overdoing of glowing adjectives that caused the article to not read very NPOV. I imagine these changes may anger some who have spent time on this page, and for that I apologize. But, I do hope that rather than reacting in anger and immediately reverting, the changes can be discussed here. Lhb1239 ( talk) 18:53, 4 May 2011 (UTC)
Requesting comments from other editors involved (and not involved) in editing this article and the recent changes made. Lhb1239 ( talk) 22:59, 4 May 2011 (UTC)
I think some is ok but Vilanch is known for - " as a writer for TV awards shows; he has co-written 21 Oscar broadcasts, as well as a featured writer for the Tonys, Grammys and Emmys and his four-year stint on Hollywood Squares, as both a performer and writer." Get Bruce is a documentary all about this - his best story in the film was that he got paid more to write for a Barbra Streisand impersonator than Babs herself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.139.12.85 ( talk) 00:19, 5 May 2011 (UTC)
I repeat, I will continue to source and replace comments you have removed, NONE of which are from personal knowledge. You have now progressed to reverting your own edits and reverting perfectly acceptable and sourced material. There is not an anti-semetic quality to anything except in your own mind, the comments were between two Jews. Why don't YOU look for a source before deleting, what a concept! I will stop here... — DocOfSoc • Talk • 08:23, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
You attitude is decidedly hostile, and I have no idea why. Yes, a couple of edits I made I redid. That's how it works here. Change is good and this article needs tons of change. One of the biggest changes it needs is the number of quoted statements it contains. And encyclopedia article doesn't contain as many quoted statements this article has and something needs to be dones about that. There is an anti-semetic quality to the statement about Streisand as well as a POV quality. You are essentially edit warring now. Because of that, I will go to the BLP noticeboard and get more editors to come here and comment. With the hostility you seem to be expressing in your edit summaries (flunking syntax? this isn't a classroom) as well as your comments here, I think it's the only way to go at this point. Lhb1239 ( talk) 15:41, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
A request for comment has been made here. Hopefully, getting others involved will help. Lhb1239 ( talk) 16:13, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
Lhb I am not hostile, that is a lack of Good Faith. I am extremely frustrated. As one of my esteemed Mentors has said, it takes two to edit war and I have been careful not to engage, you can't "essentially" edit war , you either are or are not. I am not. Calling my Jewish princess brb. — DocOfSoc • Talk • 20:01, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
Oh Hi! You are there! I was talking to one of my J.P. who laughed hysterically at the idea of my writing anything o anti-semetic. She suggested insert ANY other name where Barbra's is and you will see it is not a problem. OK, please remember I write often with tongue firmly tucked in cheek, which you would have no way of knowing. My students loved me and you have gotten the sarcastic teacher voice in my head and if that is offensive, I apologize. Yes, this is not a classroom, but it is a forum where English should be "spoken" properly. "Flunking syntax was meant to be funny and I wrote in my best "Funny Girl" voice. Sorry, inflection does not work here. I DO love too many quotes and will work on that. I am actually having a good time and invite you to join me in what is outside of Wiki, pretty hilarious. Good luck on the BLP board. Even I am surprised at how many people have never heard of one of the most prolific and hilarious men around the business. Does no one read the Oscar credits besides myself? I am going to take a breath and call another JP and we can continue what I believe will be a very productive "conversation." BRB — DocOfSoc • Talk • 21:01, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
Your not understanding my very nice and slightly amusing apology is incomprehensible to me. I tried. I was a little wordy. Maybe you should read it again, was trying to establish a common ground here. — DocOfSoc • Talk • 21:26, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
Forgive me if I'm not getting where you say you're trying to come from but from reading your edit summaries that were in my opinion kind of nasty and directed at me, I am not seeing the humor at all. I'm looking to improve the article and work cooperatively, you seem to want to sabotage most of the the content I have contributed so far. When you follow up my stated concerns that have only to do with the article with comments about "Jewish Princesses" and "I am actually having a good time and invite you to join me in what is outside of Wiki, pretty hilarious" -- well, none of those things have anything to do with the article and concerns about it brought forth by more than one editor. No, I don't get where you're coming from and don't find it anywhere near reaching a common ground because what you've said isn't related to the article and the problems it contains. Lhb1239 ( talk) 21:33, 7 May 2011 (UTC)
NOW you tell me there is a template for cities? Sheeesh! My ( talk page stalker)s do a really good job of that, do I have to? LOL TY Bbb for all your help. You are mildly awesome ;-) Namaste...
The lead has the following sentence: "He is a six-time Emmy Award-winner known to industry professionals in Hollywood and New York as 'the fat guy who writes everyone's jokes.'" The source cited is a website called FamousWhy, which, in my view, is not a reliable source. As far as I can tell, it's like a blog, to which anyone can post a question, and it's not clear who responds to them. The quote, in particular, in the WP article is extreme - it's one person's opinion on the FamousWhy website - whoever that person is - and we certainly can't say "known to industry professionals in Hollywood and New York."
I intend to remove the sentence unless there's a consensus to keep it, or unless someone can provide a reliable source in support of it.-- Bbb23 ( talk) 15:15, 8 May 2011 (UTC)
The beginning of the Career section used to say: "Vilanch has been described by radio host Ronn Owens during an interview on San Francisco's KGO as "exhuberently gay". Vilanch refers to his trademark hairstyle as "a platinum version of Alfred Hitchcock; 'Fried blonde,' I call it." He is known for wearing "wildly diverse" eyeglasses and his collection of double entendres-themed t-shirts." I removed the Owens sentence because the reference was unverifiable (no date of the show or anything to be able to verify Owens said it). I removed one source that doesn't work anymore (just has the opening paragraph and the "read more" gets a not found). That meant I took out the eyeglasses part because it was unsourced, which has left us with: "Vilanch refers to his hairstyle as "a platinum version of Alfred Hitchcock; 'Fried blonde'" and is known for his collection of double entendres-themed T-shirts."
My belief is this is trivia and doesn't belong in the article. Unless there is consensus to retain it, I will remove it entirely.-- Bbb23 ( talk) 17:48, 8 May 2011 (UTC)
I wrote this before your bombastic edit conflict above. Put away your ax. It cuts out the meat of every item! Obvious or not, his hair, glasses and t-shirts are his "trademarks." BTW, "Hollywood Squares was most of a generation ago, so there are millions of people who have not seen Bruce, much less heard of him. Because he is such an unknown celebrity, a bit of trivia gives insight to whom and what he is. Having brought this article from a stub some time ago, I am a bit disconcerted by the sudden onslaught of long winded criticism. Comparing entertainers with world leaders is ludicrous, but without entertainment and humor this world would be a sorry place, much like admins and editors with no sense of humor. Because most of his writing is behind the scenes, Bruce will never be revered as is Will Rogers but nonetheless his humor is valuable for this time as Rogers' was when the world was a miserable place, much like it is now...
Nevermind:
Doc, I'm not sure where you stand on all this based on the quotes that were laid out by Lhb AND are still left in the article. Please just address those, or if you object to the quotes I actually removed, address those too - and easy on the exclamation points. :-) And phrases like "get over it", even if something has been discussed before (and I'm not going to look) are not constructive. Please.-- Bbb23 ( talk) 23:34, 8 May 2011 (UTC)
The high fees quote goes with the Streisand quote, and as we have seen Bbb has no problem with the Midler quote. And may I remind you that Bruce's whole schtick is about these people. Without these famous people there is not much to write about Bruce. He puts words in their mouths so in a funny sense, he IS them. And Lhb. under what name did you previously use in Wiki? The aroma of Sockpuppet is wafting through this discussion. — DocOfSoc • Talk • 01:22, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
Doc, I reverted your reinsertion of the sought-after language. Bios are not reliable sources for opinions about the subject. They may be reliable for facts about the person's history. Also, the assertion is very strong, which makes it even more important that it be backed up by a reliable source.-- Bbb23 ( talk) 04:16, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
"Some of the stuff you complain about is no longer in the article. I reworded the scene stealing stuff. I reworded the DRA stuff. I don't see anything wrong with the Midler quote.--Bbb23 (talk) 21:03, 7 May 2011 (UTC) OK...i still luv ya... Out looking for sources BRB — DocOfSoc • Talk • 23:50, 8 May 2011 (UTC)
I'm thinking you're not getting the point, here. Trivia in Wikipedia isn't well-thought of regardless of how many references you have. Lhb1239 ( talk) 00:22, 9 May 2011 (UTC)
Still thinking there are too many direct quotes in the article. Please look at WP:QUOTEFARM. Lhb1239 ( talk) 01:49, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
He was not the center square for 4 years on hollywood squares. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.27.77.205 ( talk) 23:12, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
Is this a test? LOL You asked for cites that were already cited earlier in the article! I will find the rest... who was it that said : "We are not amused"? Fortunately, it was not me. — DocOfSoc • Talk • 03:01, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
Edits have been made to this article that have been sorely needed for months. References have been removed when discovered they were from unreliable sources, posed possible copyright infringement problems, non-existent, dead-links, and just not related at all to the text they were attached to. Cite needed tags were placed as appropriate and some text was removed completely. Some text was removed per previous discussion and informal consensus back in May. Also, as it occurred previously, I'm sure these recent edits will make some other editor(s) upset -- that is not my intent -- but the article really needed work and clean-up. Comments and polite AGF discussion on these edits are welcomed. Lhb1239 ( talk) 02:01, 9 August 2011 (UTC)
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