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On 22 August 2022, it was proposed that this article be moved to Bania (community). The result of the discussion was no consensus. |
According to Various census of India the word Banya is derived from sanskrit banijya or trade; and as the name implies,lives solely for and by commerce.Banias hold a considerable area of land in the east of the provinces; but it is very rarely indeed that he follows any other than mercantile pursuits.The commercial enterprise and intelligence of the class is great ,and the dealings of some of the great banyas houses of Delhi, Bikaner and Marwar of of most extensive nature.However the banyas of the villages are mostly poor.
They r true citizens of nepal????? WTF! NPOV!!!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.125.25.208 ( talk) 04:00, 8 February 2012 (UTC)
Various census of India Page cxxviii
Just like Rajput and Maratthas are two distinct subcastes of Kshatriya; Baniya is a subcaste of Vaishya ; coming mostly from West India and descended probably from Baniya kings. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.225.244.114 ( talk) 16:03, 13 April 2011 (UTC)
An anon has added this (twice) because they think the Assamese Bania should not be confused with the caste referred to in this article. They are, apparently, a distinct community. This is entirely possible but, if so, they should have their own article and the confusion is averted by using one of the many {{ Other uses}} templates at the top of both articles. - Sitush ( talk) 17:10, 2 August 2020 (UTC)
Images like File:KITLV 87170 - William Johnson - Bania women in British India - Before 1860.jpeg were imperial tools of knowledge production, that borrowed from scientific racism and were often grossly inaccurate. TrangaBellam ( talk) 11:36, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
...imperial tools of knowledge production, that borrowed from scientific racism and were often grossly inaccurate. That would include many images and articles. - Fylindfotberserk ( talk) 12:25, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
...Early photographic projects in India took form within a much broader museological discourse which created parallel registers of images, artifacts and records of behavior...
...There were also many enthusiastic amateurs who took ethnology as their subject. The Indian Amateurs Photographic Album, which was issued in twenty-four parts between December 1856 and October 1858, contained a section on the Costumes and Characters of Western India. Many of these later appeared against montage landscapes in William Johnson’s The Oriental Races and Tribes,Residents and Visitors of Bombay: A Series of Photographs with Letterpress Descriptions (two volumes, 1863 and 1866)...
...Johnson’s anthropological quest for difference is made clear in the title he chose for the work. The volumes contained ‘numerous representatives of almost all the races and tribes of the Indian Continent and islands’ and he signaled that one of his concerns was with systems of identification that included physiognomy and, in the case of Hindus, bodily marks, and, among Parsis and Muslims, costume...Johnson also provides short notes on how best to recognize Christians, Bene Israel, Chinese, Malays, Arabs, Persians and Africans...
...The illustrations in this work showed exemplars or ‘types’ and the lengthy letter presses gave lists of identifying features, which included costume and material artifacts. Particular attention was devoted to markers of difference, to visible signs which could be tabulated against group identities. This quest for difference tended to make the women of a group of more interest, since their costume and material culture were identified as being more resistant to change...
...William Johnson had referred – in his Oriental Races and Tribes – to the distinct physiognomy of different groups. Such ideas concerning the readability of physiognomy derived in the short term from the work of Lavater...Lavater suggested that individuals’ moral beauty could be judged on the basis of external characteristics, what he called their ‘corporeal beauty’, and he ‘went back to the ancient search for occult analogies between physical characteristics, moral qualities and animal forms, attempting to reduce physiognomics to an exact science’...
— Pinney, Christopher (2013-06-01). Camera Indica: The Social Life of Indian Photographs. Reaktion Books. ISBN 978-1-78023-152-5.
There will be some element of racism in practically everything the British (or Europeans) did in India. It is as if it is a brand new discovery! But we are not going to lose sleep over that. If there is something wrong with the specific image, please raise it. -- Kautilya3 ( talk) 23:28, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
User:TrangaBellam, you added to this article a note that says "It's doubtful if the converts self-identify as Baniya" and removed references from this article that supported the sentence in the lede. The source you used to support your unnecessary note says no such thing. Additionally, whether converts who are of Bania origin self-identify as such is of no consequence. I have noticed a pattern where you have
followed other editors, including myself to different articles in bad faith. I am certain that you are in violation of Wikipedia's policy of
sockpuppetry, evinced by your use of complex templates and citations that would normally take a new user months to learn, and think I have a good idea of who you are. If the disruption continues, I will not hesitate to escalate this. This is your first and only warning. Thanks,
Anupam
Talk
16:23, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
We want to add notble people / Personalies who belong to baniya community. Unitedbaniya51 ( talk) 02:12, 16 March 2021 (UTC)
@ Unitedbaniya51: Please discuss your issues (along with sources) here first instead of edit warring and adding unsourced content in the article? I told you multiple times, that the article requires scholarly WP:HISTRS compliant sources, that too post British era. That is no Wikipedia articles as sources, no Joshua Project, no news articles, no social media links. - Fylindfotberserk ( talk) 10:32, 31 March 2021 (UTC)
Gahoi is sub caste of baniya and many caste belong to baniya community. Fir ye 2 3 nam hi kyu likhe h . Kesa source chaiye apko. Kya hum bhawgan ko bulai batane k liye ki hun baniya h Unitedbaniya51 ( talk) 10:35, 31 March 2021 (UTC)
@ Unitedbaniya51: Joshua Project is not reliable. See better caste articles like Jat people. There the sources are WP:HISTRS complaint as far as ancestry is concerned. Look, I understand your frustration, there is a reason why Indian caste articles are have much less data since information in reliable sources are less. Please bring a good book source, post 1947 that is WP:HISTRS compliant, that says Gahoi are Bania. That's all. Oh.. and converse in English please. - Fylindfotberserk ( talk) 10:42, 31 March 2021 (UTC)
Gahoi samaj ki official site to h source Unitedbaniya51 ( talk) 12:00, 31 March 2021 (UTC)
This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Please include Halwai caste in this Baniya page, Halwai belongs to Vaishya Baniya Category yet they are not been mentioned here Medham99 ( talk) 02:38, 4 May 2021 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: no consensus. ( closed by non-admin page mover) — Ceso femmuin mbolgaig mbung, mello hi! ( 投稿) 22:04, 14 September 2022 (UTC)
Bania (caste) → Bania (community) – according to the 3rd line of the article. Ritez ( talk) 07:38, 22 August 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. – robertsky ( talk) 07:52, 29 August 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. — Ceso femmuin mbolgaig mbung, mello hi! ( 投稿) 18:32, 5 September 2022 (UTC)
Recently information sourced to Hardiman, David (1996). Feeding the Baniya: Peasants and Usurers in Western India . Oxford University Press. pp. 62–92 was removed [1] on the grounds of "vandalisation of page by user- Chariotrider555 by adding undebated and untrusthworthy information from apparently biased sources with a possible intention of maligning the community and to enforce and create stereotypes about an extremely large and diverse community." The information added does not constitute vandalism as it was added in good-faith to improve the article. I did not ask for consensus on the talk page as I was making a bold edit. The information is unlikely to be untrustworthy as it is reliably sourced to a book whose focus is the Baniya community, is written by a academically qualified historian, and published by an academic publisher. As the content was added in good-faith and reliably sourced, I believe it should be retained but would like to discuss if any changes should be made to improve it. User:Wikigeek365. Chariotrider555 ( talk) 02:04, 25 June 2023 (UTC)
@ MRRaja001: I don't think Madhya Pradesh should be added, since per the source [2], they are mostly from Rajasthan and Gujarat, that is migrants, not native, similar to West Bengal where most people belonging to the "Bania" caste are Marwadis. Though Bengal has its own vaish group called "Banik". - Fylindfotberserk ( talk) 09:52, 13 July 2023 (UTC)
Banias They form the wealthy and well-to-do section of the population and most of the trade and business is centralised in their hands. Maheshwaris, Agarwals Oswals etc., are some of their sub-sections.
{{
citation}}
: line feed character in |title=
at position 43 (
help)Banias They form the wealthy and well-to-do section of the population and most of the trade and business is centralised in their hands. Maheshwaris, Agarwals Oswals etc., are some of their sub-sections.
Banias They form the wealthy and well-to-do section of the population and most of the trade and business is centralised in their hands. Maheshwaris, Agarwals Oswals etc., are some of their sub-sections.
Baniyas population is about 6.86 percent of total population of Madhya Pradesh as per 1981 census. Looks like they're concentrated in many districts. - MRRaja001 ( talk) 10:37, 13 July 2023 (UTC)
lingayat vani caste is prominent in marathwada region of maharashtra. They were veershaiva Hindu by faith and were traders, zamindars and sometimes priest by profession. They usually kept weapons like swords and some are even believed to be warriors in nayaka- veerashaiva kingdoms.. [11] I think this should be added in the article. [12] [13] PerspicazHistorian ( talk) 18:11, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
The use of the contentious topics procedure has been authorised by the community for pages related to South Asian social groups, including this page. Editors who repeatedly or seriously fail to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process may be sanctioned. |
This article is rated Stub-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||
|
On 22 August 2022, it was proposed that this article be moved to Bania (community). The result of the discussion was no consensus. |
According to Various census of India the word Banya is derived from sanskrit banijya or trade; and as the name implies,lives solely for and by commerce.Banias hold a considerable area of land in the east of the provinces; but it is very rarely indeed that he follows any other than mercantile pursuits.The commercial enterprise and intelligence of the class is great ,and the dealings of some of the great banyas houses of Delhi, Bikaner and Marwar of of most extensive nature.However the banyas of the villages are mostly poor.
They r true citizens of nepal????? WTF! NPOV!!!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.125.25.208 ( talk) 04:00, 8 February 2012 (UTC)
Various census of India Page cxxviii
Just like Rajput and Maratthas are two distinct subcastes of Kshatriya; Baniya is a subcaste of Vaishya ; coming mostly from West India and descended probably from Baniya kings. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.225.244.114 ( talk) 16:03, 13 April 2011 (UTC)
An anon has added this (twice) because they think the Assamese Bania should not be confused with the caste referred to in this article. They are, apparently, a distinct community. This is entirely possible but, if so, they should have their own article and the confusion is averted by using one of the many {{ Other uses}} templates at the top of both articles. - Sitush ( talk) 17:10, 2 August 2020 (UTC)
Images like File:KITLV 87170 - William Johnson - Bania women in British India - Before 1860.jpeg were imperial tools of knowledge production, that borrowed from scientific racism and were often grossly inaccurate. TrangaBellam ( talk) 11:36, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
...imperial tools of knowledge production, that borrowed from scientific racism and were often grossly inaccurate. That would include many images and articles. - Fylindfotberserk ( talk) 12:25, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
...Early photographic projects in India took form within a much broader museological discourse which created parallel registers of images, artifacts and records of behavior...
...There were also many enthusiastic amateurs who took ethnology as their subject. The Indian Amateurs Photographic Album, which was issued in twenty-four parts between December 1856 and October 1858, contained a section on the Costumes and Characters of Western India. Many of these later appeared against montage landscapes in William Johnson’s The Oriental Races and Tribes,Residents and Visitors of Bombay: A Series of Photographs with Letterpress Descriptions (two volumes, 1863 and 1866)...
...Johnson’s anthropological quest for difference is made clear in the title he chose for the work. The volumes contained ‘numerous representatives of almost all the races and tribes of the Indian Continent and islands’ and he signaled that one of his concerns was with systems of identification that included physiognomy and, in the case of Hindus, bodily marks, and, among Parsis and Muslims, costume...Johnson also provides short notes on how best to recognize Christians, Bene Israel, Chinese, Malays, Arabs, Persians and Africans...
...The illustrations in this work showed exemplars or ‘types’ and the lengthy letter presses gave lists of identifying features, which included costume and material artifacts. Particular attention was devoted to markers of difference, to visible signs which could be tabulated against group identities. This quest for difference tended to make the women of a group of more interest, since their costume and material culture were identified as being more resistant to change...
...William Johnson had referred – in his Oriental Races and Tribes – to the distinct physiognomy of different groups. Such ideas concerning the readability of physiognomy derived in the short term from the work of Lavater...Lavater suggested that individuals’ moral beauty could be judged on the basis of external characteristics, what he called their ‘corporeal beauty’, and he ‘went back to the ancient search for occult analogies between physical characteristics, moral qualities and animal forms, attempting to reduce physiognomics to an exact science’...
— Pinney, Christopher (2013-06-01). Camera Indica: The Social Life of Indian Photographs. Reaktion Books. ISBN 978-1-78023-152-5.
There will be some element of racism in practically everything the British (or Europeans) did in India. It is as if it is a brand new discovery! But we are not going to lose sleep over that. If there is something wrong with the specific image, please raise it. -- Kautilya3 ( talk) 23:28, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
User:TrangaBellam, you added to this article a note that says "It's doubtful if the converts self-identify as Baniya" and removed references from this article that supported the sentence in the lede. The source you used to support your unnecessary note says no such thing. Additionally, whether converts who are of Bania origin self-identify as such is of no consequence. I have noticed a pattern where you have
followed other editors, including myself to different articles in bad faith. I am certain that you are in violation of Wikipedia's policy of
sockpuppetry, evinced by your use of complex templates and citations that would normally take a new user months to learn, and think I have a good idea of who you are. If the disruption continues, I will not hesitate to escalate this. This is your first and only warning. Thanks,
Anupam
Talk
16:23, 28 December 2020 (UTC)
We want to add notble people / Personalies who belong to baniya community. Unitedbaniya51 ( talk) 02:12, 16 March 2021 (UTC)
@ Unitedbaniya51: Please discuss your issues (along with sources) here first instead of edit warring and adding unsourced content in the article? I told you multiple times, that the article requires scholarly WP:HISTRS compliant sources, that too post British era. That is no Wikipedia articles as sources, no Joshua Project, no news articles, no social media links. - Fylindfotberserk ( talk) 10:32, 31 March 2021 (UTC)
Gahoi is sub caste of baniya and many caste belong to baniya community. Fir ye 2 3 nam hi kyu likhe h . Kesa source chaiye apko. Kya hum bhawgan ko bulai batane k liye ki hun baniya h Unitedbaniya51 ( talk) 10:35, 31 March 2021 (UTC)
@ Unitedbaniya51: Joshua Project is not reliable. See better caste articles like Jat people. There the sources are WP:HISTRS complaint as far as ancestry is concerned. Look, I understand your frustration, there is a reason why Indian caste articles are have much less data since information in reliable sources are less. Please bring a good book source, post 1947 that is WP:HISTRS compliant, that says Gahoi are Bania. That's all. Oh.. and converse in English please. - Fylindfotberserk ( talk) 10:42, 31 March 2021 (UTC)
Gahoi samaj ki official site to h source Unitedbaniya51 ( talk) 12:00, 31 March 2021 (UTC)
This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Please include Halwai caste in this Baniya page, Halwai belongs to Vaishya Baniya Category yet they are not been mentioned here Medham99 ( talk) 02:38, 4 May 2021 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: no consensus. ( closed by non-admin page mover) — Ceso femmuin mbolgaig mbung, mello hi! ( 投稿) 22:04, 14 September 2022 (UTC)
Bania (caste) → Bania (community) – according to the 3rd line of the article. Ritez ( talk) 07:38, 22 August 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. – robertsky ( talk) 07:52, 29 August 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. — Ceso femmuin mbolgaig mbung, mello hi! ( 投稿) 18:32, 5 September 2022 (UTC)
Recently information sourced to Hardiman, David (1996). Feeding the Baniya: Peasants and Usurers in Western India . Oxford University Press. pp. 62–92 was removed [1] on the grounds of "vandalisation of page by user- Chariotrider555 by adding undebated and untrusthworthy information from apparently biased sources with a possible intention of maligning the community and to enforce and create stereotypes about an extremely large and diverse community." The information added does not constitute vandalism as it was added in good-faith to improve the article. I did not ask for consensus on the talk page as I was making a bold edit. The information is unlikely to be untrustworthy as it is reliably sourced to a book whose focus is the Baniya community, is written by a academically qualified historian, and published by an academic publisher. As the content was added in good-faith and reliably sourced, I believe it should be retained but would like to discuss if any changes should be made to improve it. User:Wikigeek365. Chariotrider555 ( talk) 02:04, 25 June 2023 (UTC)
@ MRRaja001: I don't think Madhya Pradesh should be added, since per the source [2], they are mostly from Rajasthan and Gujarat, that is migrants, not native, similar to West Bengal where most people belonging to the "Bania" caste are Marwadis. Though Bengal has its own vaish group called "Banik". - Fylindfotberserk ( talk) 09:52, 13 July 2023 (UTC)
Banias They form the wealthy and well-to-do section of the population and most of the trade and business is centralised in their hands. Maheshwaris, Agarwals Oswals etc., are some of their sub-sections.
{{
citation}}
: line feed character in |title=
at position 43 (
help)Banias They form the wealthy and well-to-do section of the population and most of the trade and business is centralised in their hands. Maheshwaris, Agarwals Oswals etc., are some of their sub-sections.
Banias They form the wealthy and well-to-do section of the population and most of the trade and business is centralised in their hands. Maheshwaris, Agarwals Oswals etc., are some of their sub-sections.
Baniyas population is about 6.86 percent of total population of Madhya Pradesh as per 1981 census. Looks like they're concentrated in many districts. - MRRaja001 ( talk) 10:37, 13 July 2023 (UTC)
lingayat vani caste is prominent in marathwada region of maharashtra. They were veershaiva Hindu by faith and were traders, zamindars and sometimes priest by profession. They usually kept weapons like swords and some are even believed to be warriors in nayaka- veerashaiva kingdoms.. [11] I think this should be added in the article. [12] [13] PerspicazHistorian ( talk) 18:11, 29 June 2024 (UTC)